Ed Brayton is a freelance writer and speaker. He is the co-founder and president of Michigan Citizens for Science and co-founder of The Panda's Thumb. He has written for such publications as The Bard, Skeptic and Reports of the National Center for Science Education, spoken in front of many organizations and conferences, and appeared on nationally syndicated radio shows and on C-SPAN. Ed is also a Fellow with the Center for Independent Media.(static)
Ed Brayton also blogs at Positive Liberty and The Panda's Thumb
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Posted on: March 25, 2008 9:09 AM, by Ed Brayton
The Uniting American Families Act would give same-sex couples the same emigration rights that married straight couples have, getting green cards and so forth. Naturally, the anti-gay crowd is against it. And you're gonna love what the Family Research Council has to say about it. Video below the fold:
How about we export bigots instead? Send them to Saudi Arabia or Iran. They'll be much happier there.
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Comments
We're importing homosexuality? (Is that under a special clause of NAFTA?)
Posted by: Umlud | March 25, 2008 9:33 AM
um...wow...
at the risk of being repetitive, the stupid, it burns.
Posted by: CanadianChick | March 25, 2008 9:34 AM
Let me be the first to say that I would love to see a trade imbalance with China on this one:
We export our bigots and import their gays. (What about the gay bigots? We'll have to think about that...)
Posted by: Umlud | March 25, 2008 9:35 AM
with the u.s. dollar being so weak right now, it's probably more cost effective to import them!
Posted by: coreydbarbarian | March 25, 2008 9:36 AM
The problem is, export to WHERE? Madagascar? Shall we provide pink triangles to go? We know where that leads...And, oh yes, what about bisexuals? Export them too? Is there a percentage quota, i.e., at least 3/5th "gayness" qualifies for immediate exportation?
Final question: where does Ed find these people? Does he have spies everywhere combing the depths of stupidity, in every wretched trash bin of (usually) American culture? I really think Ed is secretly paying these people to embarrass themselves. [/sarcasm]
Posted by: ebina2 | March 25, 2008 9:46 AM
"The problem is, export to WHERE?"
The same place the slaves went during the civil war, the same place early feminists went, the same place Vietnam pacifists went, the same place, indeed, where liberals went after 2004: Canada.
Although I deplore bigotry in all its forms, I do appreciate the positive effect that American bigotry has had on Canadian culture via the continual injection of intelligent and talented African Americans, women, conscientious objectors, political and social liberals and, now, homosexuals.
Posted by: Jason Failes | March 25, 2008 9:57 AM
ebina2, remember, it's not gay if the balls don't touch and/or there is no eye contact. So they could use that for a definition. :p
Posted by: Andrew | March 25, 2008 10:01 AM
Good morning, Jason Failes.
Please stop teasing me. I would love to live in Canada. I prefer cooler climes, and heads.
Posted by: trog69 | March 25, 2008 10:07 AM
Good morning, Jason Failes.
Please stop teasing me. I would love to live in Canada. I prefer cooler climes, and heads. I'm not gay so, what excuse works the best? I'm retired, so I have a pension and SS, thus no worry about me taking work away from the locals! Plus I quit drinking, so you won't hear ME disparaging your beers!
Posted by: trog69 | March 25, 2008 10:10 AM
I recently read an article (can't recall where) saying that homosexuals were relocating in significant numbers to Massachusetts, where they can marry and enjoy the same family lives as everyone else. The point of the article was that Massachusetts is experiencing a real increase in educated, talented people who will positively impact the state's economy and productivity. States that are hostile to equal rights for homosexuals will be the losers, not surprisingly.
I'm just wondering: is anyone aware of any study(ies) having been done of this demographic shift, and the impact it has had in Massachusetts? I'm sure someone, somewhere, has done this or is doing it and I'd like to see the data.
Posted by: Dan | March 25, 2008 10:18 AM
Jason, maybe Canadian culture has marginally benefited, but seriously, who cares about that when no Canadian team has won the Stanley Cup since 1993? (And that was a Montreal). Don Cherry in those suits? Oh my gosh! Say no more, nudge nudge.
Posted by: ebina2 | March 25, 2008 10:25 AM
What station was that? Perhaps someone could complain to them about calling the FRC "pro-family"; that is just accepting their propaganda.
Posted by: G. Shelley | March 25, 2008 10:41 AM
NAFTA: 'Nother afternoon fucking that ass
Posted by: Brandon | March 25, 2008 11:42 AM
Interesting choice of words. He says he would rather export gays than import gays, instead of saying he would rather do "poof" magic Jesus prayer conversion anointing wtf ever spells on gays than import gays. Gee I wonder why.
Posted by: 386sx | March 25, 2008 11:45 AM
Naturally, the anti-gay crowd is against it.
So why don't they just go and "anoint" the borders or something? That "anointing" thing works pretty good don't it? Yahh..
Posted by: 386sx | March 25, 2008 11:52 AM
You know damn well where the anti-gay bigots want the Big Evil Gays (c) exported to: the middle of the Pacific Ocean. These people won't be happy until everyone is a True Believer like them and the non-believers are trampled under foot.
Posted by: Bouj | March 25, 2008 12:28 PM
trog69, just saying you want to live in Canada is enough, I'm sure, for many to accuse you of high treason and to start small fund raisers to purchase you your plane ticket to the old YYZ (Toronto). In the end, however, you don't need an excuse, just the patience for lots and lots of paperwork, even if you marry a Canadian, lots and lots of paperwork.
ebina2, Don Cherry is actually a federally-funded tolerance exercise: If you can learn to tolerate him, you can learn to tolerate people of all races, genders, religions, political affiliations, sexualities, musical tastes, and whatever other dimensions of human diversity I've forgotten to mention.
Cheers, and of course, Go Leafs Go.
Posted by: Jason Failes | March 25, 2008 1:29 PM
At least Don Cherry is supportive of gays.
Posted by: Priya Lynn | March 25, 2008 2:21 PM
Emigration rights? Wouldn't that be immigration rights instead?
Posted by: JuliaL | March 25, 2008 2:28 PM
Um, Ed, I think you mean "immigration," rather than "emigration." You don't need a green card to leave the country.
Posted by: JakeR | March 25, 2008 2:31 PM
What are gay's going for in the international market? If we implemented the gay agenda and started manufacturing gays in schools could we close the trade gap? Queers, America's greatest renewable resource!
Posted by: Abby Normal | March 25, 2008 2:42 PM
THIS IS FREAKING CRAZY MAN. I CANNOT BELIEVE THIS. WHO HEADS THIS THING? ANYONE KNOW?
I think this is even considered a mainstream organization in Evangelical circles. The guys that get up on rocks and yell fags go to hell and go protest funerals are considered nut jobs even by most Evangelicals. Exposing them is a waste of time. It is these guys you have to get more moderate Christians to go after.
I think I might start a blog denouncing this crap. No wonder no one takes the ID people at their word when they say they just want to do Science. Please do not lump me in with this crap.
Posted by: King of Ireland | March 25, 2008 2:57 PM
Just some food for thought about anyone who really wants to defang these guys. You have to know the Bible to do it. Whether you believe in it or not the people you can reach will not take you serious if you do not know the Bible. The leaders of the movement would be good to reach but usually are the most arrogant and dogmatic. But as Ed has posted, they do recant at times like Frankie Shaffer did. But the battle is for the followers. They are like the Creationist post people. Indoctrinated to the core. They have been told all they believe their wholes lives.
Much more important to what I just said is reaching the younger generation that has been converted to Christianity but did not grow up in it. I was that person. These people are usually open minded. I am not giving advice about how to ruin someone's faith but they do need to be challenged to see if what they believe holds up. The more challenged the more the dumb ass assumptions about what the faith says fall away. Get the kids and this crap dies with the Old generation.
With that said, it would be very important how you word this whole ID or creationist debate. I am not saying back down from your views but there is a way to word things that is honest but not imflamatory. I think the whole idea of what Ed is trying to do with this site is to expose crap like this. It is a good goal that I support. I do not agree at times with the rhetoric but I am not God so he can do what he wants. I also think the vast majority here are goo people who have been hurt by this crap or know of others who have been.
You have a friend in me. I do not expect you all to trust me based on videos like this. I do not trust too many people that call themselves Christian either. But there are people out there who are fed up with this stuff and would join you in putting an end to their influence without violating free speech. I am one of them.
Posted by: King of Ireland | March 25, 2008 3:09 PM
Funny, I would have thought that diversity within a culture would help stabilise the economy/society. Since you aren't relying on one segment for balance. But then i'm a flaming homo apparently, so what do i know.
Oh, you're all pretty much welcome in Europe. Though you may have to save up first, after what your religious nutjob leader did to your economy n all.
Posted by: Richard Eis | March 25, 2008 6:40 PM
King of Ireland wrote:
Having just survived a recent holiday attack from my increasingly insanely Catholic sister about this, I will agree with you.
Know what worked? Ken Miller. I literally had to pacify her with the prospect of a Catholic evolutionist. I had to touch her arm and earnestly say things like "He doesn't hate god. He loves god."
I did everything but wave it like around like a raw steak.
I know that sounds crass, but the whole exercise amounted to me assuring her that Catholic evolutionists existed, and and saying "Don't worry. He knows his stuff. He's written textbooks. He loves biology and evolution and science and can still manage to love god."
I left her house more depressed, and with less faith in humanity than I, an ueber-bitchy, cynical, amoral atheist whore, ever had before.
They are Catholics. The kind of people who shouldn't have any overt theological reason to reject evolution. And yet they do for the simple reason that isn't as Jesus-y as they'd like. So in order to convince them I had to essentially wave a theist book at them the way you'd wave a steak at a Doberman guard dog. To you that might make sense but to me it's just utterly depressing.
Posted by: Leni | March 25, 2008 9:50 PM
Ten bucks says that guy is busted at a glory hole inside a gay movie theatre next week.
Otherwise, what an incredible fascist. Hitler would be proud of him.
Posted by: CHV | March 25, 2008 9:52 PM
It's revealing how Sprigg uses the word "export," (as in "exporting commodites") instead of "deport" (as in "deporting people"). With his word choice, he seems to be indicating that he doesn't think gays and lesbians should even be classified as people.
Posted by: daniel rotter | March 25, 2008 10:39 PM
Leni,
Your story reminds me a lot of how I sometimes have to interact with certain members of my family (who are fundamentalist Christians, not Catholics, so many of their views are even more outrageous). Sometimes they'll get all a-twitter over whatever the Satanic flavor of the month is, and I find myself quoting the Bible and using all the god-bothering language that, as an atheist, I just can't stand. Of course I don't do the arm-touching and mushy stuff (here in Oklahoma a man who did that would immediately be suspected of homosexuality, the only thing worse than evolution), but in essence it's similar to your experience: Constant reassurance that God-belief X need not entail rejection of Proven Fact Y.
I'd wager that simple fact about my upbringing is why I often don't see eye-to-eye with the people who claim that outspoken atheism is "intolerant" or "militant", and that atheists should refrain from direct criticism of religion. I've usually noticed that people who make such claims grew up in liberal areas in families of reasonably open-minded people. I don't think they have any clue how frustrating and disheartening it is to have to pretend to be a Christian just to avoid rejection by your own family.
Posted by: Wes | March 26, 2008 8:36 AM
Wes stated:
"don't think they have any clue how frustrating and disheartening it is to have to pretend to be a Christian just to avoid rejection by your own family."
I do understand in the opposite way. I am a converted Christian from a atheist family. But you are right I do not understand the people in these conservative towns that well. It is different than where I am from. I never could see how people said it was 33% born again people in this country until I met people from towns where it was the tradition. That is all it is usually. I imagine it must be hard to live with that.
But my point was not with family so much as with the public in general here. I think Ed is right about more moderate Christians winning over other Christians. I also think people like Ed could do it too. He has to some degree with me. My point about the Bible was not to get peopel to fake being something they are not. It is pointing out the passages of the book they are using that conflicts with what they are teaching. It is using there own book to prove them wrong. You do not have to believe in it to do it.
When I have had discussions with people from other religions and cultures they receive what I am saying better when I understand their culture and books. It is a bridge. I think the same could and is being down with modern Islam. I read a good op-ed piece in the Washington Post today about Harvard and Islam. It talks about assimilation and the whole church and state thing.
This attitude displayed with the statement this guy made is pretty prevelant if under ground at times in much of Evangelical Christianity. It has and continues to disgust me. I denounce it. It makes me pretty unpopular in certain circles. I got up in a staff meeting at the mission agency base I was apart of and stated the Religious Right has got to shut up and told them why. I was asked to leave a month later. I understand persecution from Evangelical Christians.
Posted by: King of Ireland | March 26, 2008 11:55 AM