Ed Brayton is a journalist, commentator and speaker. He is the co-founder and president of 
Here is a compelling argument about the one aspect of Michelle Obama's speech that really did stand out. It's from one of Andrew Sullivan's readers:
I am a 36 year old African American woman. I have two girls ages 10 and 8. The country does not get the full import of this moment. My daughters and I sat together along with my husband to watch Michelle Obama tonight. Mr. Sullivan, we were all in tears. This is a day that cannot be fully described. This country has systematically oppressed Black women for centuries. My ancestors were slaves and my great, great, great, grandmothers raped and treated as property. My daughters have very few Black women to look up to in popular culture as role models. They do not feel seen, they are not held up as the standards of American beauty. We shed tears tonight as a family because Michelle (with her elegance and grace) is holding all of us up with her. You don't understand the burden that she bears.
This was the one part of Michelle's speech that did get to me the other night. The tales of wonderful and hard working parents instilling "American values" on their children don't move me; I've simply heard it too many times, and what politician doesn't tell the same story? But when she noted the crossroads of two important anniversaries -- women getting the right to vote 80 years ago and Martin Luther King Jr delivering his "I have a dream" speech 45 years to the day before her husband accepts the nomination on Thursday -- that was powerful.
The reader aimed her words at Sullivan but they could have been aimed at me as well. And she's right, I can't possibly understand how this feels to her; I'm a white, straight, middle class male with all the attendant privileges that come with that. But I can still recognize the importance of Obama's nomination in general, the change it both symbolizes and promises. And as someone who cannot listen to that King speech without tears, I'm not immune to having my emotions moved -- they just aren't moved by canned stories. But that part of her speech was not canned, nor was it a platitude. That part was personal and unique; what other possible first lady could be a symbol of the importance of those two events the way Michelle Obama most certainly is?
As I've said many times, the dominant theme in American history to me is the story of progress toward making the promises of the Declaration of Independence a reality for those who were initially denied the freedom and equality that document so eloquently called for. Martin Luther King brilliantly employed the language of the Declaration, calling it a promissory note that was now due. The progress toward that reality has been slow and halting. It has cost the blood of a great many brave people to extend those promises where they should have applied right from the start -- first for women, then for blacks and now, inevitably, for gays and lesbians as well. And I do understand, as best I can at least, the power of both Obamas as symbols of that progress and what it represents for so many.
Politics
Comments
"I'm a white, straight, middle class male with all the attendant privileges that come with that."
Begs two questions, not just for Ed, but for the readership:
1. What are the privileges? (I think I'm missing out)
2. Are you willing to give them up to "make more room at the table" for those who don't have as many as you?
****
A young reporter named Russert (the late Tim Russert's son?) did a short bit on youth and the significance of a woman and a not 100% white American making it this far in the electoral process was not really that big a deal, because they have grown up living, schooling and working in racially and gender(ly) diverse environments.
I'm happy for the woman and her daughters described above. I look forward to the day when it's a non-issue, which, of course, requires more instances of the Hillary and Barrack kind.
Posted by: Spike | August 27, 2008 9:38 AM
I, too, have a bit of a problem with the "white privilege" concept. I think it's a bit overused, and I can honestly say I didn't experience much privilege as a kid.
But the reality that there is in fact some real degree of white privilege was brought home to me very forcefully one night in San Francisco. Coming home to my apartment late one night, I realized I'd forgotten my keys. My friend--a black Jamaican-American--was with me, and I asked him to boost me up to the window so I could slide it open and get inside. He jumped back as though I'd slapped him and looked at me in shock. That may be ok for you, he said, but I can't do that.
What struck me was that there was no pause as he considered this, it was a purely instinctive, visceral, response, which told me he wasn't putting on a pose of victimization. He did in fact live in a different world than me. I lived in a world where I assumed I could explain my actions to the police without too much trouble, while he lived in a world where he assumed the police wouldn't bother to listen to his explanations.
I had another friend in San Francisco, an African-American woman, whose parents lived in a nice neighborhood in Denver (her father was retired from the Air Force). More than once when visiting them, while she was driving home late at night from a friend's house, she was stopped by police asking her what she was doing in that neighborhood.
And I knew a Latina in L.A. who had been stopped by the cops and told to "go back to your own neighborhood."
So while I think the white privilege bit is often overstated (I've been hassled by the police, too, because they tend to be assholes), there is a real foundation for it (I've only been hassled because cops are assholes, not because of my whiteness).
Posted by: James Hanley | August 27, 2008 9:53 AM
Spike - I think that when Ed refers to 'priviliges' he means that straight, white, middle class males (and I include myself in this category) have the 'privilege' of not facing prejudice and discrimination in the way that people who are not all of those things often do.
Following on from that, there's nothing to 'give up', no room needed to made at the table. The goal is equality of oppurtunity, equality of pay, equality in the eyes of the law. That is all.
That's my take on it anyway...
Posted by: CommiusRex | August 27, 2008 9:53 AM
I kind of agree with Spike here but maybe it's just because of where I live. I personally don't remember ever seeing any special privileges given to me during my life because I'm white and male. However, I'm from an area that has a decent amount of minority representation and I'm also not even middle class. Overall in the country, yes, there's probably some privilege but not everyone receives it.
Posted by: llDayo | August 27, 2008 9:55 AM
I do have to disagree with the claim of the commentor on Sullivan's blog that black women aren't held up as standards of beauty, however. There have been 3 black Miss Americas, and of course there are such beauties as Vivica Fox, Halle Berry, Jada Pinkett Smith, etc. And as a college prof, I see beautiful young African-American ladies in my class every year, even though my college is rather overwhelmingly white.
It's been said that the Irish became Americans by producing football stars and beautiful girls. I think the same is true for African-Americans. It's a rather ridiculous route to social acceptance, but since humanity really does seem to be that shallow, I guess it's the best we can do.
Posted by: James Hanley | August 27, 2008 10:01 AM
No white privilege? This white-guy self pity gets so old. Let's put it this way, at the very least, you don't start out with a deficit you have to overcome because of your name or your skin color. In the past the same might have been true if you were Irish or Jewish and some of it still remains too, but not to the degree that's true for a black person. I, personally, think that there's more to it than that.. that there are some palpable advantages to being a white guy in America.
Posted by: Ben | August 27, 2008 10:18 AM
I agree with Ben - Ed may have phrased it poorly in calling the difference "privilege," but the point is still valid. White, straight, middle-class males miss a LOT of conscious and unconscious discrimination, leaving us effectively privileged compared to any other class of people.
In 20 years in the Army, I hadn't realized how bad it still is - though the military is far from perfect, for the most part one can succeed regardless of race or background. Then I retired to small-town southern Georgia...where jobs, residences, and even school sports and cheerleading are sharply segregated. Despite Michelle Obama's example, we've still got a long way to go.
Posted by: BobApril | August 27, 2008 10:35 AM
Given the fact that the mainstream press was allowed to treat Hillary Clinton very poorly because she was a woman, and this seems to be well accepted behavior, I'm not sure women have all that much to celebrate.
Posted by: JED | August 27, 2008 10:36 AM
I would like to add my bit to James Hanley's above. I live in a very racially mixed neighborhood where, for the most part, people get along OK, but it's still been very eye-opening. One of my black neighbors and I have become pretty good friends. He is a college-educated, successful professional who rose from a modest background (not dirt-poor, but modest) through smarts and hard work (and a hand up from the GI bill for college).
He told me has lost track of the times he has been stopped by cops for no apparent reason but that he was black (the infamous "DWB"). In my entire life, even when I was a long-haired teenager driving a VW in the 60s, I have never been stopped even once by cops without cause (and that only rarely, as I have always been a careful driver). On every such occasion I was treated with respect and courtesy, called "sir" and "Mr.", even if they did give me a ticket.
My friend works with computers and has had various jobs in the field, including project management with multimillion dollar budgets and a dozen or so people reporting to him. He's very good at what he does, absolutely trustworthy, and never gives a job less than his considerable best.
Earlier on in his career he installed, repaired and trouble-shooted large computer installations, travelling quite a bit to smaller towns. He said that often, when he showed up to a place he hadn't been before, they basically refused to believe that he was who he said he was until they called his company. Now, he would show up in suit and tie, with a company ID, a work order, and, depending on the job, all kinds of hardware and tools. I should also say that he speaks perfectly grammatical, standard middle-class English. Then, even once they figured out he actually was the computer guy, they would often be suspicious and double- or triple-check his work. A white guy with appropriate ID and a work order would simply be trusted, and he would be assumed competent until proven otherwise.
As a white guy, I've simply never had to put up with this kind of nonsense, and can't really imagine what it's like. On the contrary, I lived and worked in Latin American for six years and, perversely, my gringo status there had the opposite effect: it was assumed that the foreigner brought in was superior to the local product.
Posted by: MS | August 27, 2008 10:43 AM
As a 30-something white male who attended a public school that still had segregated dances (guess who's dances were better funded...), who was routinely paid more and got more favorable scheduling in my teenage jobs than my black and female coworkers who were in the same position, and who didn't get conspicuously tailed every time I went into the local music/video store, I would like to tell those who are wondering what these "white privileges" are to look into the situation a little more. The differences were much less obvious once I left my small home town, but I don't pretend that everything was right with the world just because I moved to a more civilized area.
Posted by: Shygetz | August 27, 2008 10:45 AM
I have to laugh at the white guys claiming they didn't get any "privileges." Do you not see the irony in your statements?
Privilege doesn't mean money or material goods. It's about opportunity and access and perception. The fact that there are still white folks claiming that they didn't have any privileges is a problem. We ain't post-racial yet, dearies. Not with attitudes like that.
Posted by: Kirs | August 27, 2008 10:54 AM
Privileges of being white? Here's a funny example from (white) comedian Roger Hailes:
http://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?videoId=173794&title=roger-hailes-my-whiteness
Posted by: Dan | August 27, 2008 10:56 AM
Let me explain the privilege concept here.
If you are white and male, there are scads of things you don't have to worry about. That's the privilege denied to black and latin men.
For example, if I say to a cop "A white guy just robbed me and killed my wife as we were carjacked," even the poorest white neighborhoods aren't going to have cops all over the place rounding people up. But the reverse isn't true at all-- when Charles Stuart claimed the exact same thing in Boston black men were pulled off the street right and left. Yet his description of the suspect (which was a lie) was just as vague.
If you are white, nobody asks if you got the job on your merits. If you aren't, you either got it because of affirmative action and you don't really deserve it or you are some kind of aberration-- classic heads-I-win-tails-you-lose
If you are white and male, nobody stops you at the airport for extra screening every goddamned time. Store cops don't follow you around. Calling the cops is a good idea when your house gets robbed.
As to beauty standards, note that the most famous black models all have straightened hair, tend to be lighter-skinned, and have euro-centric features. I'm looking at you, Tyra. That's just a start. Note that models on the runways are almost all exclusively white, with the exceptions so notable because they are rare.
White privilege has nothing to do with your personal take on non-whites. Ed, myself, or anyone here didn't ask for it. But it's still there.
It's also systemic. When people say "hey, there are black cops too" it doesn't address the underlying issues (though it helps). That's because the discrimination -- and attendant white privilege -- is built into the rules. It;s like the old saying about software -- "It's a feature, not a bug." So if the "rules" about what makes a guy a suspicious person all focus on what he wears, and it happens to be stuff that black and latin guys wear a lot, then even though the rule is "race-neutral" it really isn't. A black cop ends up following the rule, though, because his job requires it.
That's an oversimplified example, but that kind of stuff happens. In fact, a real-life example is literacy tests. They are race-neutral, in the sense that a few poor whites were also prevented from voting in the South. But the overwhelming effect was to disenfranchise black people. And it worked, as it was intended to.
irish people got to be socially constructed as white (as did Jews and Italians) because they could do a couple of things. First, they "pass." You don't know someone is Irish or Jewish unless you ask. Second, Catholics are a large enough segment of the population that they were able to gain some political power though the ballot box. Third, there's been a lot of economic success, partially predicated on the first two bits. It's much harder to paint someone as "the other" when they look like you. Absent some other palpable difference (like, or example, if there was a huge region of the country where 80% of the people still spoke Gaelic) it becomes easy for white ethnics to get their foot in the door.
But that success has been harder to translate for non-whites. They can't "pass" and they came from places with cultures that were more different, i.e. Asians of various ethnicities. I mean, there were laws passed in Colorado specifically targeting Asians and preventing them from owning land or marrying white people. Irish and Italian people never had to deal with that kind of stuff.
Irish and Italian people were never targeted the way black folks were. for example, no irish neighborhood has ever been burned to the ground, it's people murdered, and all signs of it deliberately erased. That's happened to at least two black townships I can think of, one in Florida and one in Missouri. (see dneiwert.blgspot.com). And no white guy ever went to jail. it was a set of American pogroms.
Privilege exists. And until the basic rights we take for granted can be taken for granted by everybody all those rights are just extended privileges.
Posted by: Jesse | August 27, 2008 11:02 AM
Sorry, dneiwert.blogspot.com -- Orcinus -- has a whole chapter on the incidents I reference.
Posted by: Jesse | August 27, 2008 11:03 AM
I'm a white Jewish American. My ancestors were slaves, too.
Slavery was wrong. People were terribly mistreated. But at least in this country, slavery hasn't existed for almost 150 years.
It's time for all of us to get over it.
Posted by: Miles | August 27, 2008 11:10 AM
Use whatever words you want but remember that the goal is not to "remove" this privilege by having white people treated as shabbily as others, but to expand it until everyone has it.
That being said - Colbert cracked me up when he said "I don't see race. People tell me I'm white and I believe them because police call me 'sir'". I always get called "sir" by the police and have never been searched even when they had just cause.
Posted by: libarbarian | August 27, 2008 11:12 AM
llDayo:
As the examples posted since you wrote that have illustrated, it's something you don't notice because it's automatic. You don't notice not getting stopped by the police for looking out of place in certain neighborhoods, not being followed by a security guard as you browse a high-end department store, not seeing women clutch their purses a bit tighter as you approach and so forth.
In 1990, Dianne Feinstein ran unsuccessfully for Governor of California, and pledged that she was going to try to make 25% of her appointments women and minorities. The hue and cry was instantaneous, and definitely contributed to her defeat. However, a little basic arithmetic tells us that she was guaranteeing that at least 75% of her appointments were going to be white males. See how this works?
Posted by: Pieter B | August 27, 2008 11:16 AM
Slavery was wrong. People were terribly mistreated. But at least in this country, slavery hasn't existed for almost 150 years.
It's time for all of us to get over it.
As soon as the racists and misogynists get over it, I will get over it. As soon as "equal pay for equal work" is a reality backed up by the statistics, I will get over it. As soon as equal justice is a reality backed up by the statistics, I will get over it.
Until then, you can keep calling the farts "air fresheners" all you want, they still stink.
Posted by: Shygetz | August 27, 2008 11:16 AM
This classic Eddie Murphy skit from Saturday Night Live is directly relevant to this discussion (you might have to watch a commercial first):
http://www.hulu.com/watch/10356/saturday-night-live-white-like-me
Posted by: Dave K | August 27, 2008 11:18 AM
When I started working in an engineering office for GE in 1971, out of about a dozen of us, one was African-American, and one, the secretary, was female. No other engineering office in the plant had any engineers who were not white men in it. Over the next 15 years, my boss (still the best manager I have ever had), hired another African-American man, a Taiwanese-American man, a Chinese-American woman, four white women (all the preceeding were engineers or technicians), and a white male secretary. I don't recall any other African-American engineers in any other offices in our department during that time, and few women engineers.
It just now occurs to me that that office was not very prestigious, and may have been considered a ghetto of sorts, but we got a lot of good work done, and several of our members went on to win engineering awards or earn promotions to middle management.
Probably due to the greater sample size, by far the worst (least productive) engineers I have encountered have all been white men. I have seen nothing to justify why so many of them got hired, and so few women or members of minorities. (If one manager was able to find good non-white-male engineers, why not all the others?)
My anecdotal experience tells me that I won the Cosmic Lottery (Earth edition) by being born a white, male citizen of the U.S.A.
Posted by: JimV | August 27, 2008 12:32 PM
Let me explain what I meant when I said that I was born with all the privileges that come with being a straight white middle class male...
Most of the de jure privileges have gone away (though not all of them, of course; if I had a love of my life I could marry her without any problem and the same is not true for my gay friends). For the most part, blacks and gays and women are not actively discriminated against as a matter of law - we don't have whites only drinking fountains, that sort of thing. And no, no one takes white guys aside and gives us our first million bucks to get started. But I am privileged in a thousand different ways merely by virtue of not being a member of a group that has traditionally been discriminated against.
No one ever looks at the behavior of, say, Jeffrey Dahmer and thinks that his behavior represents all white men. Unfortunately, people do look at any bad behavior by any gay person and think that it must represent gay people. They really do think that all gay people act like flamboyant drag queens in a pride parade. People really do think that black thugs in TV and movies represent all black people. I'll never get pulled over for "driving while white" but that happens to black people every day (I was riding with a black comedian to a show once in the aptly named city of Grand Blanc -- big white -- when we got pulled over because he had a burned out license plate light on his car. Never would have happened if I had been driving my car). American society has made enormous progress, but I can still recognize that I am fortunate merely by being born white, straight and male not to have to face a great many challenges.
Posted by: Ed Brayton | August 27, 2008 1:09 PM
Yikes! You are 30 and you had segregated school dances? I'm 40 and we hoped to Prince. slow danced to Journey, geek grooved to Devo, and freaked to Newcleus. We even had a white guy and a black guy rap to Divine Sounds "What People do for Money". That song spoke to us in H-town in the early 80s. Rust belters kept moving in even as oil prices fell and the S&L crisis hit.
However, my HS had been officially integrated in 1941 when it opened and was further integrated when the kids from a nearby Freedman's town were bussed in shortly after the Brown decision. We did have "The Strange Demise of Jim Crow" here.
But yes, there are advantages to being white. Dealing with local govt is much faster as a white person and I must point out that between Baltimore and Houston almost every mid level civic official you'll deal with is African-American. Only time whiteness worked against me is when I lived on the somewhat whiter end of Houstons 3rd Ward and commuted accross the 3rd to my job. White folks there are presumed to be up to no good. Got stopped once on a phony violation and once the cop saw my address was really only three blocks up, he apologized and said e might have been mistaken about the red light.
Posted by: Bacopa | August 27, 2008 1:12 PM
DakeK - "Perhaps you can explain it to me since, apparently, the rest of the world is not good enough to receive content for Hulu. Those pig ignorant, toffy nosed, malevolent perverts in US can stream data, but the rest of us will just have to wait until those spotty faced nerds deign to raise their lardy arses from their crummy cheap, leatherette sofas and let the majority see Eddie's hilarious ranting for ourselves. Talk about the privileged few - right that it! Don't say I've not warned you. You utter, utter, utter BASTARDS!!" [shakes fist at screen impotently and stalks off to find a sapling to give my computer a damn good thrashing &etc.]
Ahhh, MUCH better now - DJ
Posted by: DingoJack | August 27, 2008 1:12 PM
True story -
Two friends of a flatmate of mine got to talking about getting hassled.
One explained the same cops stopped him every night for trying to cross the same park late at night. They always asked for ID, they always asked why he was crossing the park, they always asked where he had been, they always asked him to turn out his pockets. He always had the same answers: "Here's my ID, I'm going home and it's across the park, I'm a night filler a the local supermarket (you've probably have asked me where the tinned peas are), and no, I'm not turning out my pockets unless you've got a warrant." He usually spent a couple of hours in the cells, till someone could go down and get him out. "Wow", said the other, "That's never happened to me."
Yep, you guessed it the first was a rumpled, greasy long haired Irishman, the other a neat, buzz cut Black Aussie#. How the cops (and the rest of us) stereotype differs, but if you're on the bottom (like an Aboriginal for example) you really, really get hassled all the time. If the Irishman had been an Aboriginal he wouldn't have got a "Don't do it again, smart-arse! Now piss off." he would have got 30 days for the unholy trinity* and a good kicking. -DJ
# His birth mother was a Aussie nurse, his birth dad a 'black' Vietnam Veteran. He was adopted by a nice middle-class Jewish professional couple. Go figure.
* 'Drunk and disorderly', 'resisting arrest', 'offensive behaviour'. Or if not even vaguely drunk or stoned, replace the first with 'loitering with intent' or 'Vagrancy' or some other bullshit charge.
Posted by: DIngoJack | August 27, 2008 1:44 PM
"Privileged" is obviously relative and a matter of degree.
Relative to my economic peers, other white kids who lived in toney suburbs were somewhat privileged; relative to black kids who lived in much poorer, segregated neighborhoods and went to segregated schools, even less affluent white kids were considerably privileged; and relative to Calcutta street beggars, we were all privileged to varying degrees.
Presumably, Mr. Brayton had in mind the second comparison. Although being young in an era of less extreme race prejudice (and probably not in the South), he presumably was less privileged relative to blacks than were my pre-60s white contemporaries and I.
- Charles
Posted by: ctw | August 27, 2008 1:53 PM
1956, visiting Roseville Kentucky as a white teen from Chicago, I intercepted 4 white guys trying to drag a black teen off the streets. I stopped them, later at a skating rink, I was attacked by many (I was unconcious very quickly) and spent 3 days in a hospital coma, Why, because I helped a "nigger" (in Louiville, far away, a black guy raped a white woman, they were just "getting even")
I guess I was given preferential treatment, I wasn't killed!
Posted by: richCares | August 27, 2008 1:56 PM
Wow - lots of interesting stories that people on the right (sorry, but it's true for many, though not all) don't want to hear. I would also add that discrimination is not always "by cop". It's harder to get a bank loan if you're black, harder to get a job, and harder to rent an apartment, and so on.
It's not that you can never do these things if you're black, it's that on average, if you are black, all other things being equal, you will succeed less often that white people attempting the same thing. And it's been measured. Studies have been done that show black families got refused more often or paid higher interest rates when applying for bank loans, and when experiments are done where they send black and white people with the same backgrounds to apply for the same apartments, loans, job, etc, black people are turned down more often than the whites.
Of course, death row is one of the most egregious examples of racism left in this country. If you are accused of a capital crime as a black person you are still much more likely be convicted and go to your death than if you are white (up to four times more likely even after all other deciding factors are removed). It's somewhat shocking that this is still happening, given the public outcry from some quarters, but I suspect it's the general (cowardly) skittishness of politicians who don't want to be accused of being soft on crime that is stifling effort to end this discrimination. After all, who wants to be seen helping murderers escaping death row?
Posted by: tacitus | August 27, 2008 3:15 PM
Just because you don't understand or notice what your privileges are doesn't mean they don't exist. I think the discussion might go better if people acknowledged that these privileges just might be so taken for granted, like gravity you just don't notice. I think also, it would be good to consider the question - dispassionately and to note for yourself that you are not being 'accused'....which seems to be where a lot (not all) of white guys are 'coming from'....There is a defensiveness evident even before people get into the discussion. It's a shame. The question is worthy of serious consideration, but it rarely gets it's due.
For a really good talk on the subect:
youtube.com/watch?v=_UJlNRODZHA
Posted by: Cityzenjane | August 27, 2008 3:35 PM
Ildayo -
However, I'm from an area that has a decent amount of minority representation and I'm also not even middle class.
Not sure if your in the same situation as me, but even if you aren't the other end has it's excuse as well.
Personally, I am a poor white guy, living in an ethnically diverse neighborhood. I am not middle class and don't get the attendant privileges. Only I do, when I pay attention.
I actually got stopped by our local gang taskforce on a routine interview - mostly because I was out at 2:30 a.m. (had to make a run for formula after the tin got spilled). I was pretty pissed, mainly because I have a lot of interaction with our community policing program and know most of the cops in our area. I got indignant, rather than belligerent, but I still got kind of pissy about it. It was when I took offense to the question; "how long have you stayed there?" and rather huffily responded that I have lived there for a year and could I possibly get on with getting the formula for my rather hungry infant?" that he just let it go. But even from the outset, he treated me differently than he treats one of my neighbors, whom he has stopped several times. My neighbor happens to be black, with a Hispanic wife. He gets stopped and it always starts with him getting yelled at and with the cops pushing him to turn out his pockets, which he always does because "it's just easier."
Posted by: DuWayne | August 27, 2008 3:38 PM
Oi, and if you live at the other end of the spectrum, it's a different reason. I work as a handyman/remodeler. I am really good at many aspects of home repair and remodeling and manage to get jobs in some of the most expensive neighborhoods in Portland. In those neighborhoods, the cops know better than to play those kind of games, because if they did the wealthy neighbors would be up in arms and have the sort of weight behind them that means if they complain, it is more likely to effect the officer's career, than if someone from my neighborhood were to do the same.
Posted by: DuWayne | August 27, 2008 3:43 PM
In the nineties, I owned a house that I rented out in East Texas. I got a call from a very nice young woman in response to my ad in the paper. She and her husband were both employed, had good references, one child, no pets. At the end of our conversation, she said, "There's one more thing I have to tell you. We're black."
I said, "Well, okay. When do you want to see the house?"
They were great renters; stayed with us for three years. It still pisses me off that she had to tell me she was black; she didn't want her daughter to be hurt if we all showed up at the house and I made some specious excuse not to rent to them. It had happened before, you see.
Don't kid yourself about this, folks. Such things still happen. Racism is not dead, it's just covered up a little more.
Nobody has to give up any "privileges" to kill racism and sexism. Unless, of course, you LIKE being an asshole and enjoy having special treatment you didn't earn and don't deserve. In that case, too friggin' bad. I'm not going to weep for you.
Posted by: Leigh Williams | August 27, 2008 3:48 PM
How anyone can say there is no such thing as white privilege is beyond me... There is copious documentation on this.
More pernicious than white privilege is class privilege. When I worked at minimum wage jobs, all my black co-workers used to say that if you really wanted to succeed as a criminal, wear a suit. And, it's true. White-collar crime dwarfs blue-collar crime in terms of the monetary damage it causes, yet it seems to be a truism that the more you steal, the more lenient your sentence. Poor whites receive harsher sentences than more affluent whites for the same crimes and poor blacks receive the harshest sentences of all.
On a positive note, I found Michelle Obama to be quite attractive - graceful, elegant, and pretty damn good-looking. Of course, I'm not 25 and my standards have changed over time, so your mileage may vary. America would be well-served by having her as its First Lady.
Posted by: Mike Austin | August 27, 2008 4:06 PM
And what percentage of a man's salary do women earn today? I think we're back up to about 70 cents on the dollar*. You don't want male privilege? Take a 30% pay-cut and figure out what luxuries you'd have to give up with that (luxuries like owning a car, living somewhere that's not transit accessible, going on vacations, putting aside savings for rainy-days... and that's if you're in a 'professional' field... good luck if you're entry-level or minimum wage, you likely won't be able to afford your housing)
Another example of male priviledge? When's the last time you were terrified because a large woman was walking behind you down a poorly lit street coming home from work in the evenings. When's the last time you stopped to tie your shoe or rummage in your purse, waiting for them to pass so that they couldn't follow you home (or kept walking and took an extra 20 minutes walking around the block so they wouldn't know where you lived... just as a precaution)? When's the last time you were told that someone who looked like you was assaulted and killed and that you had better double-check your doors because it'd be your fault if you were next?
sadly, minority women have all the problems of race and all the problems of gender heaped on them together, and the only answer some have (see above) is that there is no real white/male privilege anymore and that people should just 'get over it'.
*and I have been paid less than equivalent male counter-parts who are at the same job-title and responsibility level as I am and am sterile, so don't tell me it's because I'm going to go off and have babies to take up my raise-earning years!
Posted by: kodiak | August 27, 2008 4:06 PM
This is also a good take on what is unseen by most who enjoy white privilege...
http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~mcisaac/emc598ge/Unpacking.html#daily
If you don't see it there is a really good chance that you are not actively observing and your blind spots and a healthy dose of idealism and wishful thinking are involved.
Posted by: CityzenJane | August 27, 2008 4:09 PM
Don't kid yourself about this, folks. Such things still happen. Racism is not dead, it's just covered up a little more.
Don't kid yourself on that, dude. It's not even covered up. It doesn't have to be, when we have a Republican noise machine calling black people "racist" when they point out that racism exists.
Posted by: Raging Bee | August 27, 2008 4:13 PM
What Bee said.
Posted by: Josh | August 27, 2008 4:19 PM
There was a thread at the solidly-rightwing lucianne.com (run by the mother of "The Doughy Pantload" and a good place to see authentic low-brow conservatives speak their minds) about the "uniqueness" of black names.
Of course people were mocking names they thought were stupid, but what blew my mind was how many people said, without any apparent embarassment, things to the effect of "Well, feel free to name your kid whatever you want but don't expect him/her to get hired".
What does a persons name tell you about them, their experience, qualifications, work-ethic, or anything else that matters? Why on earth would you reject someone for a job for having a funny name or even hold the bar higher? Would they feel the same way about funny/odd/out-of-style "white" names like Ingrid or Gertrude? I didn't think so.
The simplest explanation was that it was the unambiguous "blackness" that they were responding too. They were simply saying "I wouldn't hire someone with a black name".
It was really sad.
Posted by: libarbarian | August 27, 2008 4:55 PM
Another example of male priviledge? When's the last time you were terrified because a large woman was walking behind you down a poorly lit street coming home from work in the evenings.
Do you have any idea how many times I've had a woman keep looking at me suspiciously out of the corner of her eye as she walked simply because circumstances put me a few paces (or yards) behind her?
A few times I've actually said something to the effect of "You don't have to worry, I'm one of the good guys" or words to that effect. Mostly I just slow my steps and increase the distance until I see her relax a bit.
Posted by: libarbarian | August 27, 2008 5:10 PM
It's terribly interesting to read all these stories -- thanks to all.
Something that hasn't been mentioned here, but I can't help but see all around me, is the influence of class. I know it's a 4-letter word in America...
In addition to the large effect of racial discrimination, there's also a significant effect of non-whites being more likely to be lower class. For example, the average black family has a net worth of something like one tenth (!) that of whites[1]. It seems that despite the efforts of restoration, MLK's 'check' has quite literally bounced.
My understanding is that there are some upper class blacks, but that social mobility is simply not good enough to erase centuries of oppression.
So one 'privilege' of being white is that you're much more likely to be better off (in terms of family). And this fact has an invisible systemic component, quite separate from personal experiences and interactions.
Is this not seen as a genuine problem?
[1] I wish I remembered more stats on this topic -- if someone knows the details...?
Posted by: Dan | August 27, 2008 7:32 PM
"Mostly I just slow my steps and increase the distance until I see her relax a bit."
That's what I do.
Having grown up with a father who would be considered racist by today's standards, but, as the actor who played the role described Archie Bunker, was just "ignorant of a few things," I still feel the need to be as circumspect as possible, because I do not know if I might accidently say something that would offend an African-American with whom I'm having a conversation (I never feel this way around other "minorities").
I admit that I haven't been paying attention. I'm the fish in the bowl of water who doesn't know that it's water. All of the "minority" people I know are at least as accomplished as I am and most are more succesful (by their standards) than I. That's why I asked the question. Thank you for the information to help me become less obtuse.
My second question was based on the expression of "making more room at the table," which is related to "giving them a bigger piece of the pie." My first response is, "Make a bigger table/pie." My second response is, "Let me show you how." Again, that is because of the folks I hang around with. All are bootstrappers of one sort or another, and we are all flabbergasted by the notion that others often hold that opportunites for accumulation of wealth (which is most often the root of the discussion about "privilege") is a zero sum game.
Posted by: Spike | August 27, 2008 7:46 PM
White privileged males = it will ALWAYS be assumed you were hired at whatever job you have on your merits. If you are minority or woman, it will be assumed you were "affirmative action" hire and you will have to prove yourself over and over. Just look at some comments here in past few months, where one commenter said Obama was affirmative action entry to Harvard and he didn't want to have anyone for president who got ahead on basis of affirmative action. Didn't even know that Obama was at Harvard Law, that he was editor of Harvard Law Review, and that he graduated magnum cum. All he saw was a black man and assumed he got where he was because of affirmative action. That's one thing Ed means by white privilege.
Posted by: BC | August 27, 2008 8:20 PM
"and now, inevitably, for gays and lesbians as well"
And don't forget atheists (or just "non-religious" if that's different)... But sadly from the DNC experience, it seems they still want to ignore this part of the population.
Posted by: Gerald | August 27, 2008 8:50 PM
@Dan--
Class is usually part of the analysis that most people of color do. It just gets ignored by the mostly white media. Martin Luther King himself was very vocal on the subject towards the end of his life.
THe thing is, look at class and racism the same way you would look at the question, "would you rather be beheaded or poisoned to death?"
Class and race intersect and reinforce each other. That's because societies are systems, and you can't always see the system. Remember the analogy I drew with software? You use a computer all the time and don't see the system software running unless it breaks.
Spike -- all you have to do is treat people with respect, and remember the maxim: Assume makes an Ass out of u and me.
Posted by: Jesse | August 27, 2008 9:26 PM
As another sort-of example, (and something I posted about at recently, in an NPR piece about the 1968 Democratic conevntion this week, one academic interviewed said 1968 was the year America became a movement society, the year we learned protest could affect government, when we pioneered new techniques such as sit-ins and large demonstrations.
I thought, does that fuck really think blacks weren't doing all that in Alabama in the '50s and '60s? So I looked him up. Sure enough, he's white. I suspect no black academic would so easily forget.
Posted by: James Hanley | August 27, 2008 9:29 PM
What the fuck??? Setting aside complete neglect of the Civil Rights movement for a moment, that's just historically pig-ignorant. Which institution(s) is this "academic" associated with?
Posted by: Sadie Morrison | August 27, 2008 10:52 PM
Class? What do you folks mean by that? Dictionary definitions are fine, but no one lives in a dictionary. What do -you- mean when you use the word "class"?
To me, it is more than just what someone's income level is. To me, the term "class" implies an inevitability of outcome, as in, your father and mother earned wages in the lower 2nd quartile BECAUSE they did not have, nor wanted a college education AND they live in a neighborhood with others who share the same wages AND the same attitude towards education AND they have the same interests regarding entertainment, politics, material goods, spirituality, AND they expect their children to live in exactly the same way AND everyone around them reminds them every day in overt and covert ways that this is all they should ever expect AND that they have no right to attempt to change.
"You should be happy as a Gamma!"
"Oh, I am. I would never want to be a Beta. That's not the life for me."
Income level is not class, by itself. Statistical distribution curves are not class, by themselves. For example: "Given a random population of first generation Ethiopians in the greater Seattle area, the likelihood that a working-age person is employed by a parking services company is 50%." Please remember, statistics show correlation, not causation.
To sum up then, to me, "class" requires an expectation of inevitability, lack of choice and pressure from outside and inside the class to stay in that class, and these things have to be institutionalized throughout the society.
Yes? No? Maybe?
Posted by: Spike | August 28, 2008 11:12 AM
For anyone outside the US who can't view the Hulu clip I posted a link to:
In it, Eddie Murphy gets a makeup artist to make him look like a stereotypical white businessman in a suit, and then he goes out into the world. In voiceover, he says that he never realized before how many privileges white people have when black people are not around. He goes into a convenience store and tries to buy a newspaper, but the clerk gives him his money back and says, "Take it. Just take it. There's nobody else around." He's riding on a bus, and when the only black person gets off the bus, the driver turns on music, a waitress starts serving everybody cocktails, and everybody starts dancing. He goes into a bank, where a black loan officer is about to deny him a $50,000 loan because "you have no collateral, no documentation, no ID -- Mr. White, I'm sorry, but this is a bank, not a charity." A white loan officer overhears and tells the black guy to go on break and that he'll take over, whereupon he tears up the forms and tells Eddie, "We don't need all these forms, do we? Here, have all the money you want."
Posted by: DaveK | August 28, 2008 12:38 PM
"...one academic interviewed said 1968 was the year America became a movement society, the year we learned protest could affect government, when we pioneered new techniques such as sit-ins and large demonstrations..."
"I thought, does that fuck really think blacks weren't doing all that in Alabama in the '50s and '60s?"
and hey lookee over here, you just did the same thing... 'cause exactly when was the sufferage movement again? late 1800's early 1900's? In fact many of the non-violent forms of protest we associate with other movements* were used earlier by various female sufferage movements.
So thanks and all but if he only realized in the 60s that protesting against the government through non-violent means worked he hadn't been paying attention to his history books or his grandparents. Which I guess is part of white male privilege. We aren't calling all white academic males asses because this particular one is showing his ignorance...
*prison hunger strikes were used by suffragettes and also used to great effect by Gandhi, and while there is a difference between chaining yourself to the gates of parliament and 'sitting in' a politician's office there are also similarities
Posted by: kodiak | August 28, 2008 12:39 PM
Hmmm - don't think I was too clear. When I was in High School we had to read a book called "The Outsiders" by S E Hinton (you all probably read it). One of the memorable bits was the bit when the desperately unhappy Cherry (a popular rich girl) explains to Ponyboy (poor white trash) an important concept: she said, "Things ate tough all over." I had never considered that. Troubles are different, less important or life threatening even, but just as real. Lots of bad stuff happens even in the nicest families, don't forget it. The problem IS NOT white males are privileged, it's that there are UNDERPRIVLEGED, period. Over the last 30 years the per capita wealth of the top 1% of the American population has exploded to the detriment of the other 99%.
If I had a dog in this race (and I don't) I would vote for Senator Obama for two reasons, one, having a black man in the Whitehouse sends a powerful message: 'if he can so can I' (I hope he says "here are all the niggers in my cabinet. Nigger, nigger nigger"), two, Senator Obama's tax plan is to raise the real incomes of the poorest 4/5 of Americans by raising taxes on the top 1/5. Bring back equality to America, Senator, don't wimp out.
Thank you for reading my rant (if you did) -DJ
Posted by: DingoJack | August 28, 2008 12:56 PM
Spike,
Yes, I completely agree. I only gave the example net worth (and not even income) because that's all I could remember. Fatalism is partly implied by the fact that social mobility is weak.
At some level, class can be 'just' a set of correlations, but it's so hard to define or measure, that it's not necessarily helpful.
However, don't you think an important step is to be aware of it? And be aware of it in the complex sense that you mean, lest everything be blamed on class, which is not terribly helpful either...
I guess systemic problems are hard to diagnose and treat.
Posted by: Dan | August 28, 2008 1:39 PM
Talk about white privilege! I can remember things from "long ago": when I was growing up, blacks were not "allowed" in certain parts of supposedly "liberal" Seattle. You never, for instance, saw any of them at the local zoo, though ther weren't any laws on the books that said they couldn't go there, as there were in the South. Some things began to change about the time I went to college, but for a long time women had very few opportunities to do many of the things men routinely did. When I was in middle school, there was a long period when various careers, via "educational films" were trotted past me and my schoolmates. There were "careers" for women, e.g. secretaries, nurses, teachers. And that was it. Oh, and I had a science teacher in this same school, tell me and my classmates, that Marie Curie, who discovered radium, just discovered it by "luck", not "smarts"(women just weren't as smart or taleneted as men in science, was the subtext). And when I was in college, a (male) professor told me he didn't allow women on archaeological expeditions. Really. I could have complained by that time, but I was just too flabbergasted by this to protest. I had always been treated as a person who could, and should go after whatever career I chose to pursue. Unfortunately there was too much of this in my time, both directed at "minorities", and at women. It negatively affectede not just me, but millions of my fellow Americans. And it was partly for this reason that I found Michelle Obama's speech on Monday, so very, very moving. I saw the someone I might have been, with the slightest encouragement(and perhaps a somewhat different cast of personality)
Anne G
Posted by: Anne Gilbert | August 28, 2008 7:37 PM
I think calling the phenomena you describe "privileges" is a mistake. One reason many white people don't feel they are "privileged" is that these aren't privileges. It simply is not a privilege to not have your rights violated. Acts of police thuggery, as many of the anecdotes relate are violations of civil rights and basic human decency. They need to be singled out as such, as Ed has done in many previous posts, and they need to be stopped. By using common frames like "white privilege" you portray rights as something extra rather than a given. Moreover, privileges, at least in concept are more easily revoked than rights - e.g., driving is a privilege; writing to one's elected representative to enact traffic legislation is a right. To fight against the injustices many of you have described requires that they be recognized as injustices, rather than as a lack of privileges. Otherwise, it seems too much like you want to force empathy by taking away privileges (that are actually rights) rather than force society to respect the rights equally for everyone.
The benefits afforded to the wealthy are more deserving of the word "privileges". As an earlier poster mentioned, class privileges are definitely real and problematic. John McCain's wealthy pharm-junkie wife Cindy is a perfect example of wealth shielding a criminal from justice. Just imagine what would've happened to her had she been an average white guy, let alone a young poor black man. Wealth is granted so much deference in this world that I am astonished that Paris Hilton was even arrested.
Posted by: c-serpent | August 28, 2008 7:57 PM
"No white privilege? This white-guy self pity gets so old. Let's put it this way, at the very least, you don't start out with a deficit you have to overcome because of your name or your skin color. In the past the same might have been true if you were Irish or Jewish and some of it still remains too, but not to the degree that's true for a black person."
Fuck you. I grew up in southwest Texas, in a town that was roughly 80% Hispanic, and yes, run by the Hispanics, and I certainly had a deficit I had to overcome due to skin color. Not only did I have to put up with constant death threats and bullying (everything from 'worthless piece of gringo' to 'el diablo') on a daily basis for being guilty of being white, I had virtually no fucking opportunity on the job market since my last name was a 'white name'. Neither did anyone else - it was the same in most every business in town, one or two token white people working there (if any), and the rest were made up of Hispanics. This resulted in one hell of a shitty job market since the token jobs stayed filled since people knew that if they lost that job they weren't likely to get another one, so they had to keep that job until they could afford to move (at least) 80 miles away to a big city with some job opportunities. It was the same fucking story with every other town in a 50 mile radius, if not worse (e.g. death threats turning to violent action if people didn't get out of town). Racism and privilege aren't white-exclusive traits, nor is a lack of privilege an exclusively non-white trait. It's time that we wake up and realize that this shit is a multi-way street.
Posted by: Thomas M. | August 28, 2008 9:42 PM
Say what?
Posted by: tincture | August 28, 2008 11:58 PM
Tincture - HE SAYS JEWS WERE SLAVES TOO. ☺
I think he is referring to biblical stories of the ancient Judeans being slaves in Egypt and Babylon. However I believe there is no evidence that this actually occurred (absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, however). I find the fact that it was an unnamed Pharaoh who (supposedly) enslaved the Jews just a tad suspicious. Could it be a 'just-so' story constructed centuries later, I wonder to justify historic events?
Miles, all I'm saying is "It ain't necessarily so." -DJ
Posted by: DingoJack | August 29, 2008 12:34 AM
I am getting a little nuseated at all the tears and pitty partying about Obama and Mischele and the black people neing slaves etc in the United States of America. Also the black women who are not the beauty queens. Let me tell you, I am white, and I am not a beauty queen. I am not ugly, but not real prety, so we are even there. I have belly fat and other things, but that does not make me stupid or unpatriotic. I do not know if any of my ancesters were raped, but more than likely someone was. I have Indian in my line of realatives, and my daughter was sexually asulted when she was 10 from a good friend of my husband and myself that we had known since young. Also my precious little 3 yr old son sexually asulted by a neighbor boy. I was sexually assulted by my babysitter, and when I was 3 yrs old by a neighbor, an older girl, and a little boy when I was 5yrs old. (he later was a coach for one of the (big teams ). My father died when I was 3yrs old and my sister was 1 month.For 11 yrs, I have been taking care of daughter and child. when a lot of people are having fun in their retirement. I have been spending my hard earned money on my kids and grand kids. So, grow up! Quit listening to people like Obama and take care of yourself...he did, did'nt he? He makesyou think the government needs to be taking care of your needs, then in next breath, brags that he took care of his. Listen to what he is saying. First, nothing comes free. If the government is giving it to you, someone pays for it. YOU, OR SOME OTHER PERSON. And when you take from the rich to give from the poor and they did not want to give it, it is robbing. Like DO YOU REMEMBER ROBiN HOOD? Anyway that is downright stealing. Do you ever go to a Federally or government facility? It is a mess. They usually act llike they do not like you and you do not get good treatment. Think what Government health care will be like. And we will be paying with taxes. The middle class will be hit, Usually the lazy and people who do not work gets by with freebies, and we pay. Wake up and smell the coffee. Would you like to be sent back to Africa? I think not, and I do not even know you. I do not want to be sent back to England, or to the Indian Reservation. Lets get real. U.S of America is a wonderful place and it is being ruined by bad guys. Obama has been accused of being friends with people who a Marx bellivers. His minister for 20 yrs, is one. The bunch he belongs to (the minister) is a marxist bunch. Would you hang around with them and a Terrious person if you were not one of them? Wake up and smell the coffee. Thank you. God bless you with wisdom and open ears and eyes. Do not be fooled by the beautiful face and smile. He plans to change things, but not a good change. Please think about it. Think how good you have had it here in this wsonder country. Thank God, and do not let the left confuse you into plunging this into a Marxist country. Please. May God, the Almighty bless you and our country. NeeNee P.S. What are you people still whinning about your ancesters being slaves? We white people had nothing to do with that, we wern't even born yet. That is the stupidest thinking and whinning I have ever heard. Get real. Now you may think I am a racest, there you go. I am not, but I am a realist, Christain, and a human being who loves others, and uses my head for more things than a hat rack. The persons I have gotten hard on, I still love you. NeeNee
Posted by: Marsha Hare | August 29, 2008 2:57 AM
I am sick and tired about using the old excuse of what the black people's ancestors went through. What about the white people's ancestors who came to this country originally to start America. They shed blood, sweat, and tears and many, many hardships to build this country to what it is today. It wasn't easy just to exist. They worked hard to invent and build the conveniences that we enjoy today. Who invented and made these conveniences? The white people. Who came to this country to enjoy these conveniences? The black people, who now want privileges given to them, not earn them. Yes, they were brought to this country as slaves, sold by their own people too, and lived better in this country than the country they came from. And the crime rate and rapes in this country are mostly blacks. If we have a black president, it will get worse. Let them work to get what they want, which there are quite a lot of black people with respectable jobs and reputations. They will gain my trust through repect = giving and getting.
Posted by: Barb | August 29, 2008 6:39 AM
I think this is a very important point actually. I heard that one of Obama's first policy decisions will be to encourage young black men to go out and rape lots of women. I mean, we can educate them and everything, but more than anything else a black man wants to stuff his salami inside some slack-flapped white whore, and pump 'til he goes blue in the face.
All this talk about equality is just opression against white folks because everyone knows how onerous it is for nice, white, pure-bred Americans to treat black people (or brown people, or yeller people) with even a modicum of respect. In fact, there is nothing more oppressive than applying for a job and knowing that the other candidates will be evaluated mostly in terms of their intellectual merits, rather than just not getting the job because they're niggers, which is how god ordained the world to work.
Everyone knows that god, although he is infallible, largely made brown people as a mistake, and that hymn 'all things bright and beautiful' was just censored to exclude the verse:
"All things bright an beautiful,
all niggers, spics and wops,
all things wise and wonderful,
the white man is the tops."
The sooner those damn brown and yellow and dusky fuckers learn how hard it is to be a white person in this country what with all those gypsy types just eyeing up our obese, pastry-skinned women, desperate for a moment to strike, and pummel their man meat into the ugliest, most diseased, bloated body they have ever laid their greasy little claws on, the sooner we can all grow up as a nation.
Why can't these black folks realise that it is a privilege to have the police checking up on everything they do just because they're black. They're probably the safest people in the United States and how much gratitude do they show> None at all. We should have taken our goddam slaves from China, at least they've got manners over there.
Posted by: Matthew | August 29, 2008 9:19 AM
P.S. For anyone in even the slightest doubt, that last post can be more simply paraphrased as:
"Marsha and Barb, not only are you fucking idiots, but you are a couple of the most demoralisingly stereotypical idiots I have ever encountered. Every patriotic American reading this should be fucking ashamed of you because it is cretins like you that make your country a laughing stock, despite the excellent work of the sort of people who read and comment on this site to mitigate the damage that you do. You are both fucking embarrassments. Now crawl back to your caves and contract an incurable disease so we can all be rid of your sort as soon as biologically possible."
Posted by: Matthew | August 29, 2008 9:24 AM
Barb writes:
And don't forget to mention how ungrateful they were when they got free transportation here, too. Do they not know how much white people pay for a trans-atlantic voyage on Norwegian Cruise Lines? SRSLY.
Posted by: carlsonjok | August 29, 2008 9:46 AM
Barb,
You sound like a caricature of yourself. Can you possibly be serious, or are we missing the satire?
Same goes for Marsha.
Posted by: Dan | August 30, 2008 9:00 AM