Now on ScienceBlogs: Gun Control, The Military, and Nidal Hasan

Seed Media Group

Dispatches from the Culture Wars

Thoughts From the Interface of Science, Religion, Law and Culture

Profile

brayton_headshot_wre_1443.jpg Ed Brayton is a journalist, commentator and speaker. He is the co-founder and president of Michigan Citizens for Science and co-founder of The Panda's Thumb. He has written for such publications as The Bard, Skeptic and Reports of the National Center for Science Education, spoken in front of many organizations and conferences, and appeared on nationally syndicated radio shows and on C-SPAN. Ed is also a Fellow with the Center for Independent Media and the host of Declaring Independence, a one hour weekly political talk show on WPRR in Grand Rapids, Michigan.(static)

Search

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

Blogroll


Science Blogs Legal Blogs Political Blogs Random Smart and Interesting People Evolution Resources

Archives

Other Information

Ed Brayton also blogs at Positive Liberty and The Panda's Thumb



Ed Brayton is a participant in the Center for Independent Media New Journalism Program. However, all of the statements, opinions, policies, and views expressed on this site are solely Ed Brayton's. This web site is not a production of the Center, and the Center does not support or endorse any of the contents on this site.

Ed's Audio and Video

Declaring Independence podcast feed

YearlyKos 2007

Video of speech on Dover and the Future of the Anti-Evolution Movement

Audio of Greg Raymer Interview

E-mail Policy

Any and all emails that I receive may be reprinted, in part or in full, on this blog with attribution. If this is not acceptable to you, do not send me e-mail - especially if you're going to end up being embarrassed when it's printed publicly for all to see.

Read the Bills Act Coalition

My Ecosystem Details



My Amazon.com Wish List

« Desert Island Jazz | Main | The Real Immigration Problem »

Saudi Family Sues a Ghost

Posted on: July 18, 2009 10:32 AM, by Ed Brayton

CNN reports on a rather interesting lawsuit in Saudi Arabia:

family in Saudi Arabia has taken a genie to court, alleging theft and harassment, according to local media.

The lawsuit filed in Shariah court accuses the genie of leaving them threatening voicemails, stealing their cell phones and hurling rocks at them when they leave their house at night, said Al-Watan newspaper.

An investigation was under way, local court officials said.

Ah yes, an investigation, that's exactly what is needed. Who ya gonna call?

"We have to verify the truthfulness of this case despite the difficulty of doing so," Sheikh Amr Al Salmi, the head of the court, told Al-Watan. "What makes this case and complaint more interesting is that it wasn't filed by just one person. Every member of the family is part of this case."

No, what makes the case and complaint more interesting is that it's filed against a non-existent being. I can't wait to see a ruling in Ali Baba v Boogey Man.

Share this: Stumbleupon Reddit Email + More

Comments

1

I suspect Major Nelson is behind this somehow.

Posted by: kehrsam | July 18, 2009 11:00 AM

2

Belief in genies is, oddly enough, quite common in the Arabian peninsula, and I've known a few born there that will swear that they are real. The belief is actually something like that of European witchcraft and familiars in that genies are typically thought of as agents of a human "sorcerer" or some such. Perhaps this is preliminary to a suit against a personal enemy?

Posted by: Julian | July 18, 2009 11:28 AM

3

I suspect, like Julian, that this is going to go towards somebody the family doesn't like - the "threatening voicemails" leads me to think that they have a particular person in mind (this assumes that they have evidence of the voicemails and are not just going to say "trust us, they were there.")

Posted by: Badger3k | July 18, 2009 11:34 AM

4

"Genie" (djinn) /= ghost.

But how did they serve the papers?

Posted by: Pierce R. Butler | July 18, 2009 11:40 AM

5

To be fair here, how many people in europe and america belive in angels, demons or ghosts? Or God for that matter.

Posted by: Ramel | July 18, 2009 11:42 AM

6

If there is physical evidence such as voicemails, there is
a person (not a genie) behind this. I would tend to look inside the family for the culprit (or one of the culprits).

Posted by: Erp | July 18, 2009 11:56 AM

7
"Genie" (djinn) /= ghost.

But how did they serve the papers?

By publication, presumably.

Posted by: kehrsam | July 18, 2009 12:33 PM

8

The lawsuit filed in Shariah court accuses the genie of leaving them threatening voicemails, stealing their cell phones and hurling rocks at them when they leave their house at night

Couldn't someone who has a vendetta against this family do this sort of harassment themselves? Rather than waste their three wishes on it?

Posted by: joz | July 18, 2009 1:30 PM

9

If Saudi Arabia didn't have gobs of oil you'd have a country of poverty stricken nomadic herders living like they did 100 years ago.

Posted by: soboco | July 18, 2009 1:48 PM

10

I agree with ERP. It smells like an inside (the family) job. Maybe a young man deemed unsuitable for marriage to a daughter.

Posted by: MikeMa | July 18, 2009 2:26 PM

11

Belief in djinns has become pretty widespread across Northern Africa too. It spread with Islam but it meshed pretty well with pre-existing beliefs in spirits that possessed people, including the idea that they were responsible for mental illness. Treatment for mental illness still involves rituals to cast out the evil djinns possessing the mental patient. The details can be pretty horrendous.

http://drvitelli.typepad.com/providentia/2007/11/casting-out-the.html

Posted by: Romeo Vitelli | July 18, 2009 2:44 PM

12
Couldn't someone who has a vendetta against this family do this sort of harassment themselves? Rather than waste their three wishes on it?

LOL. Maybe I'm just overtired but I can't stop laughing about this.

And now they're going to have to waste another wish to make sure the sharia court rules in the djinn's favor.

Posted by: Leni | July 18, 2009 2:54 PM

13

Ed, surely you are making this up. Who could want to sue this guy?

Posted by: Isis the Scientist | July 18, 2009 3:39 PM

14

Isis, Jafar was a genie too in the second movie.

Posted by: Brandon | July 18, 2009 4:00 PM

15

Does anyone know if Scooby Doo was ever translated into Arabic? I think this may be a job for a certain set of meddling kids and their dog.

Posted by: Technogeek | July 18, 2009 4:19 PM

16
If Saudi Arabia didn't have gobs of oil you'd have a country of poverty stricken nomadic herders living like they did 100 years ago.

Maybe you would- certainly it would kill an awful lot of historical capital flow. Or maybe you wouldn't, since you're proposing an alternate history with a radically different Middle East where the West hasn't been fucking the political order to achieve stable energy flows. Maybe Alternate Arabia had its democratic revolution in Alternate 1962 and is a stable secular republic in Alternate 2009.

Now, given how utterly fruitless considering this imaginary world is, I have to wonder why you bothered making that statement. I certainly hope it wasn't an assertion that Saudi Arabia's fate is built right into its people decades in advance, barring Western intervention. Because that would sound pretty racist.

Posted by: Nentuaby | July 18, 2009 7:12 PM

17

the source where the news has been referenced to (Al-Watan Newspaper) has issued a public apology based on a letter sent by the judge from the same court mentioned in the original article. It was unprofessional conduct by the reporter, and the newspaper has admitted that. There was no case in the first place. All wires and news agency are copying from each other but no one has published the correction yet.
the letter of the judge and the apology can be found though:
http://www.alwatan.com.sa/news/newsdetail.asp?issueno=3212&id=110269&groupID=0
unfortunately its in Arabic.
best regards for all

Posted by: Sal | July 18, 2009 10:29 PM

18
Isis, Jafar was a genie too in the second movie.

WAIT!!! What the balls?!? There was a second movie AND Jafar was a genie? I am apparently totally out of the loop....

What is this mysterious movie called?

Posted by: Isis the Scientist | July 18, 2009 11:19 PM

19

Isis @ 18:

The second movie was The Return of Jafar, the 1994 direct-to-video sequel to Aladdin.

Posted by: Togusa | July 19, 2009 12:15 AM

20

There were three movies and a TV series. All of which are worth watching.

Posted by: Brandon | July 19, 2009 1:39 AM

21

Pierce R. Butler posted (#4):

"Genie" (djinn) /= ghost.
But how did they serve the papers?

To which kehrsam (#7) sensibly replied:

By publication, presumably.

This leads me to ask who actually penned the papers? Did they hire...
a ghost writer! [rim-shot] - ;) DJ

Posted by: DIngoJack | July 19, 2009 2:28 AM

22

Actually, Jafar became a genie at the end of the first movie. That's how they stopped him - because genies are slaves.

Posted by: djinn | July 19, 2009 2:57 AM

23

Ramel:

To be fair here, how many people in europe and america belive in angels, demons or ghosts? Or God for that matter.

This is a fair comparison, I believe that djinni are mentioned in the Koran. Of course, its not that often that people try to sue angels, demons or ghosts.

Posted by: James K | July 19, 2009 3:00 AM

24

Damn demons are always stuffing up my life, too. Like how I locked my keys in the trunk of my car earlier today. Totally djinn. They made me remember to grab the Michael Jackson CD but forget the keys when I closed the trunk. I could hear them laughing all the way back into my apartment where I had to break in to call AAA.
And don't get me started on my ex-landlady. She was the genie queen. Always appearing in my flat without asking. Leaving little telltale djinn-sign everywhere.

Posted by: Scrabcake | July 19, 2009 4:36 AM

25

Scrabcake - Sounds like you need something to help you relax.
How about a nice djinn & tonic. :) - DJ

Posted by: DingoJack | July 19, 2009 4:54 AM

26

Nentuaby said: "Now, given how utterly fruitless considering this imaginary world is, I have to wonder why you bothered making that statement. I certainly hope it wasn't an assertion that Saudi Arabia's fate is built right into its people decades in advance, barring Western intervention. Because that would sound pretty racist."

Yeah, I was basing this on an assumption that all other things remained the same. All other things being equal, Saudi Arabia would be back water shit hole. However, in the absence of oil Saudi may very well have taken a different direction and become a progressive secular country. That said, the west has had a hand in "fucking the political order" (your words) in many parts of the world in the last couple hundred years, and the response hasn't always been to become an oppressive theocracy. That argument is a a little thin.

Posted by: soboco | July 19, 2009 3:33 PM

27

Or maybe you wouldn't, since you're proposing an alternate history with a radically different Middle East where the West hasn't been fucking the political order to achieve stable energy flows.

Yeah, right -- like the Mideast's political "order" was just fine and dandy before the West got involved? Gimme a break. The Ottoman Empire was on the decline for centuries beforehand, and regressive intolerant versions of Islam were impeding their progress while the West forged ahead both technologicallly and politically. That's why the Middle East was so vulnerable to Western interference in the first place.

Posted by: Raging Bee | July 20, 2009 9:34 AM

28

Sal: Thanks for the correction. So far I find no update or correction to the CNN article. Apparently no one there wants to admit that djinns don't exist; and no one here wants to admit that a secular court stood up to superstitious horseshit. Wouldn't want to set a dangerous precedent, would we?

Posted by: Raging Bee | July 20, 2009 9:41 AM

29

I guess CNN can be forgiven for not keeping up on the djinn story, when...

GIANT JELLYFISH ARE INVADING JAPAN ONE-ELEVENTY-ONE!!!11!!!!

Posted by: Raging Bee | July 20, 2009 10:05 AM

30

Bee - On Noes! What ever with we do? Shall we call Gozilla, Mothra or Gamera?
On second thoughts perhaps we should just djinn and bear it. ;p - DJ

Posted by: DingoJAck | July 20, 2009 10:21 AM

31

I dunno, maybe give the jellyfish some djinn and hope they pass out before they do any damage?

Certainly Mothra won't do any good -- all he'd do is try to fly into the Sun. And who/what the Hell is Gamera? Maybe I should have asked someone at Otakon this weekend...

Posted by: Raging Bee | July 20, 2009 10:32 AM

32

Bee - Why not play a couple of games of djinn rummy against the gient jellyfish and bore them to death! - DJ

Posted by: Djinn-goJack | July 20, 2009 10:44 AM

33

IAmNotALawyer suspect a US court would probably dismiss such a case due to lack of ability to serve process. Cf. Mayo v. Satan and Chambers v. God. (Interestingly, the net effect of the latter appears that the state of Nebraska legally recognizes God's personhood currently, but denies his omniscience.)

US law is ridiculous, but at least judges make some efforts to limit the degree of ridiculous.

Posted by: abb3w | July 20, 2009 12:36 PM

34

Sal: There was no case in the first place. [...] unfortunately its in Arabic.

Google automatic translation.

Posted by: abb3w | July 20, 2009 12:42 PM

35

Because it would bore me to death first.

Posted by: Raging Bee | July 20, 2009 3:20 PM

36

abb3w - You mean there really is a man who sued God? Really? LOL! - DJ

Posted by: DingoJack | July 20, 2009 3:30 PM

37

However, in the absence of oil Saudi may very well have taken a different direction and become a progressive secular country. That said, the west has had a hand in "fucking the political order" (your words) in many parts of the world in the last couple hundred years, and the response hasn't always been to become an oppressive theocracy. That argument is a a little thin.

Choose any Muslim dominated culture without oil, Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt, Pakistan, Sudan ... not much different.

Posted by: jay | July 21, 2009 2:04 PM

Post a Comment

(Email is required for authentication purposes only. On some blogs, comments are moderated for spam, so your comment may not appear immediately.)





ScienceBlogs

Search ScienceBlogs:

Go to:

Advertisement
Enter to win a free copy of The Monty Hall Problem
Visit the Collective Imagination blog
Advertisement

© 2006-2009 Seed Media Group LLC. ScienceBlogs is a registered trademark of Seed Media Group. All rights reserved.

Sites by Seed Media Group: Seed Media Group | ScienceBlogs | SEEDMAGAZINE.COM