The Crisis We Await

The exact way the Trump presidency ends is not clear. Anything could happen.

Trump had zero idea of what he was getting into with this president thing, and the stresses must be amazing. Clearly, he is being driven over the edge by relatively minor day to day events. Nothing has yet actually happened in this administration. If you ignore self inflected wounds and self generated drama, and all the protesting against Trump, the world has been pretty quiet. It is as though all the bad guys, all the individuals who do the things that become major international issues or domestic crises, have stocked up on popcorn and are just watching Donald Trump in awe. Normally, things happen now and then that become major issues that need to be addressed by the President of the United States. For the last six weeks, since the inauguration of Donald Trump as the Republican President, we’ve seen nothing.

Remember this scene? Everything is fine in the beginning. Then, "Let her roll!!!"

Remember this scene? Everything is fine in the beginning. Then, “Let her roll!!!”

Here is a list I compiled, with help from my Facebook friends, of exemplars of things past, and ideas for things future, that could happen and that did or would demand attention and proper response from a United States president.

  • 911
  • a military coup takes over a neighboring or allied government
  • a smaller country such as Iraq invades another country such as Kuwait
  • arkstorm hits western states
  • attack on the US power grid
  • collapse of a major fishery
  • crop failure; multiple simultaneous crop failurs
  • debilitating cyber attack
  • Deepwater Horizon explosion
  • dirty bomb goes off somewhere
  • embassy attack
  • global financial crisis
  • hostage taking at a US embassy
  • India and Pakistan have a military confongration
  • Iran: US embassy hostage taking
  • Israel and Iran exchange missles
  • Katrina
  • large earthquake or tsunami in the United states
  • major river flooding
  • major spill
  • major tropical storm strikes major metropolitan area
  • major volcanic event
  • massive earthquake or tsunami somewhere
  • North Korea actually attacks someone
  • possible epidemic threat
  • Russia invades another country
  • Sandy
  • solar flare damaged US power grid
  • terrorist attack, large
  • terrorist attack, small
  • terroristic disease or chemical attack
  • unprecedented killer heat wave
  • Death of a world leader in a sensitive region
  • Crash of a US airliner
  • Korea or Iran takes a US naval ship
  • Outbreak of a major famine

The point of this list, to which any student of American History can add many more items, is to make clear that crises are sufficiently numerous that large ones are bound to happen in any given span of a few months time.

Something is going to happen soon, and when it does, how will Trump react, what will he do? What will he tweet? Will the chaos that ensues, the pressure that mounts, the overall intensity of of the situation, put him over the edge?

He doesn’t know what to do, no one around him really knows what to do. He will be exploited and the will of the United States twisted and used, if possible. We will lose in any confrontation or competition that arises as the result of any crisis, and that will compound the badness.

All that has to happen is for history as it is being born to run its normal course, for Trump and his presidency to collapse under the weight of reality.

Ultimately, this may kill him. He may simply die of a heart attack or stroke because of the stress. Or, he may take steps that are so outrageous that someone else kills him. In fact, he is currently courting that sort of attack every day, as his immigration policies ruin the lives of thousands of people. Listen to the weeping of innocent children as their parents, also innocent, are being taken away by the ICE jack-booted thugs. Then put yourself in the position of a father or grandfather who happens to be mentally and emotionally capable, and physically ready, to act in an entirely inappropriate, violent way. That small list of crazy people that seemed to follow around Gerald Ford, or that supplies the assassins of the like that shot at Reagan or killed Lennon, has got to be very small indeed compared to the number of people who wish to end the life of a despot like Trump. It may only be a matter of time before someone on that list gets through.

Or, there is the 25th Amendment. It is possible for various government officials to simply remove an off the rails president from office. Such a thing could happen if anything like the above list of crises starts to materialize, as it will, and Trump’s reactions are so dangerous that even the selfish, politics-only, non-governing yahoos who reside in the Executive Branch actually do something to preserve our democracy.

Or it could be impeachment. Impeachment requires that the Know Nothing and Do Nothing Republican Congress grows a spine and learns something and does something. That is very unlikely to happen, but around the country right now, people are showing up by the thousands, daily, demanding that they do something, so … maybe.

A Congressional turnover, followed by impeachment, is a possibility. Maybe the American Citizenry, who usually vote against their own self interest, will grow a brain and throw the actual bums out, and a new Democratic House will impeach and a Democratic Senate will hold a trial, and Trump will be ended that way.

But none of that matters until this other thing happens, which maybe, or maybe not, is currently underway.

How Trump Can Stay In Power Forever

Donald trump is likely to stay in power as long as he wants to, even after his presidency ends, because Chuck Todd will make sure it happens. Andrea Mitchel will work to keep Trump in the White House. All the CNN reporters, and all the TV reporters in general, will work on this on a daily basis, tweaking the news, affecting public perception, in such a way as to make sure Trump is not removed by virtue of the 25th, or impeached, or even stressed out too much.

Why? This is why and how that happens. Go read that post if you want to understand how the news media fails us all, every day, and why they may not be able to stop themselves.

There is another possibility, though.

Last Tuesday, Trump gave his “joint address” (a form of State of the Union with a different name). During the address, he said all the things we expect if we assume he is not changing his policies. He also introduced an alarming new thing, a fund to increase the level of national hate against immigrants. All in all, any intelligent watcher of politics would have come away from that address knowing that Trump is still Trump, and nothing has changed.

The astute observer would also note this: Trump’s address was a carefully written speech that Trump clearly did not compose, but that he did work hard to read correctly off the teleprompter. That is actually bad news. It means that Trump’s handlers are on board with keeping him in the groove he is already in, and are helping him do that by constructing a speech with no change in direction, but that is less shocking in its messaging qualities.

Soon after Trump’s speech, I pulled the shotgun I keep under the couch out, pumped five rounds into the TV, and threw the smoldering wreckage right through the big glass window onto the street.

OK, I didn’t really do that. I don’t actually have a shot gun under the couch. But if I did…..

What actually happened was this: Chuck Todd and Andrea Mitchel and the talking heads on PBS, and all the other reporters got all titilated about how Trump finally sounded presidential, about how everything would be fine now, about how the “presidential pivot” had finally happened.

They failed to notice that all that really happened was that Trump read the speech off the teleprompter and that the speech was a little more carefully written than usual — well, not for an address to the joint session, but for a Trump speech. They failed to notice that nothing had changed except a couple of things that went bad. They went on and on about how great the speech was and failed to mention the 18 or so bald faced lies, or the exploitation of a war widow to justify a failed military action, or, once again, the initiation of a hate-the-immigrant program.

They failed to save Democracy from Trump. For that, they should all be fired. For that, I get the shotgun out from under the couch and blast the TV to smithereens. Or, really, imagine myself doing it.

100% certain to end Trump: Reinforcements are always welcome!

But then something else happened. Trump did two things over the following few days, neither unexpected but both critically important.

1) He kept being Donald Trump; and

2) He actually got worse.

Believe it or not, and I’m still not quite believing it, this may have caused the press that fall in love with him on Tuesday to step back and realize they had been duped. They will never admit this because, frankly, only a stupid child could have been duped this way. But Chuck Todd and Andrea Mitchel and the rest of them are not the sharpest knives in the drawer. They were all fooled, badly fooled, on Tuesday, then later in the week, made to appear as the embodiment of foolishness itself as the reality of Trump re-tweeted, er, re-emerged.

I was mulling this over this morning while checking over some of the previous day’s news reports and commentaries, when I came across this piece by Lawrence O’Donnell on his show “The Last Word.”

Watch it. Then, for fun, and a good cry, watch the next piece as well.

O’Donnell seems to believe that the press can snap itself out of its own stupidity if Trump is so blatantly bad as he was last weekend. I don’t. But it is quite possible that I am wrong and O’Donnell is right. And in hopes that this is the case, I’m going to unload the shells from my imaginary shotgun. For now.

So, yes. Trump’s presidency ends when Chuck Todd and Andrea Mitchell say it ends.

Now, watch this to the end. THE END. Just do it.

The end end, not the part you will think is the end. Just wait until the “tape” runs out. Past 4:20

Imagine that child crying is your own.

To hell with it, I’m putting the imaginary shells back in the damn gun.

______________________
PS, I know someone is going to complain about the shotgun, because some people are just that way and can’t help themselves. The shotgun is to shoot the TV because the news, and the way it is handled, and reported, is so frustrating. It is not to shoot a person. I would never do that, you should never do that.

Comments

  1. #1 Rich Bly
    Ocean Shores
    March 7, 2017

    A short quiz: How is a used condom better than Trump?

    The condom has done its job but Trump just keeps spewing and spewing.

  2. #2 Brainstorms
    March 7, 2017

    Rich, no. No, no, no. Don’t insult something so dear.

    It should be: How is Immodium better than Trump?

    A dose of Immodium stops the diarrhea, but Trump just keeps spewing and spewing.

    Much better!

  3. #3 RickA
    United States
    March 7, 2017

    Greg:

    I don’t mind the shotgun reference.

    Is the 2nd amendment looking better to you now that someone you think is crazy is in the Whitehouse?

    Maybe you should get a real shotgun now, before Trump passes gun control for liberals!

    Just in case they come for you.

    My scorecard:

    1. Yes – Trump could die in office.
    2. yes – I agree that the 25th amendment thing will never happen.
    3. yes – I agree Trump is very very unlikely to be impeached.
    4. No – Trump will not be President for life.
    5. This is not the media’s fault. This is democrats fault. More of you should have voted in the states Trump won.
    6. Yes – Trump keeps tweeting really stupid stuff. I suspect America will get used to it.

  4. #4 Wow
    March 7, 2017

    Yeah, right, coming up to a lunatic who is already hyper paranoid and holding a gun is a REALLY sensible idea.

    Fucking gun nuts.

    First pussies to hide and scream when there’s danger.

  5. #5 Wow
    March 7, 2017

    “This is democrats fault”

    Uh, no.

    Republicans voted for him.

    It’s YOUR fucking fault.

  6. #6 dean
    March 7, 2017

    Seems like you have several overlapping possibilities listed as distinct events (911 and different levels of terrorist attacks, for example)

    I’m not sure how a major incident outside this country would go down with this leadership. Most of the people in the White House hold the same despicable world view as rickA, and the other shithead libertarians: as long as bad things are happening to the icky people (poor, wrong race, women, etc) somewhere else they don’t care – it’s a distraction, nothing more. I don’t see any incident other than a rapidly escalating war generating any response from the scum in chief – and then we have no idea what Bannon would want done.

    I have a similar idea about things here. A devastating event in a poor region of the country – minor attention, because who needs the poor. An incident in a large city would warrant a response.

    Never forget how dishonest and irresponsible the modern right and its libertarian friends really are.

  7. #7 Brainstorms
    March 7, 2017

    What leadership?

  8. #8 Brainstorms
    March 7, 2017

    I don’t see any incident other than a rapidly escalating war generating any response from the scum in chief – and then we have no idea what Bannon would want done.

    Sure we do: That would provide a perfect excuse for Reichsfuhror Bannon to implement his Final Solution.

  9. #9 Bert Chadick
    Tacoma WA
    March 7, 2017

    The day that one of those congressional committees investigating the “Russian Roullette” scandal is finally forced to demand Trump’s tax returns is the day he will start packing. He will never allow the world to know how broke he really is and how much the Putin/Oligarchy controls his finanaces. I sincerely doubt that an outraged liberal will make the second amendment solution his or her choice. In reality the NRA is currently trying to scare its members with the idea of armed leftists threatening their precious bodily fluids.

  10. #10 RickA
    United States
    March 7, 2017

    Two other possibilities to consider:

    1. Trump finishes out his 4 years and retires from politics.
    2. Trump runs for and wins a second term, finishes out his 8 years and retires from politics.

  11. #11 Wow
    March 7, 2017

    OK, so I considered them. Pretty bad. Really didn’t show the USA in a good light, voting that dangerous retard back in for a second office.

  12. #12 Wow
    March 7, 2017

    OK, so I considered them. Pretty bad. Really didn’t show the USA in a good light, voting that dangerous retard back in for a second office.

  13. #13 Tirius Rift
    United States
    March 7, 2017

    I can’t help but notice that Obama flubbed several of the items on your list, and the republic is still standing. Funny how that works.

  14. #14 curtis goodnight
    United States
    March 7, 2017

    A fun game- I’ll play too.
    In some bizzarro way, there is the possibility that the rest of the world – seeing the WTF theatrics play out in the WH have decided that for a while no one better make any sudden moves. Some , like Best Korea of course, recognize a kindred soul and will ramp up their weirdness. Some , like Putin, will make money via steel sales, oil deals etc. and will just sit back and collect. And some . like China, already have measured tRump and see its only about the money- and they’ll get theirs.
    The mid east is the most likely crisis point – gotta wonder if ISIS et al would be willing to play along with the US theocrats, do something bigly to give the Christian Right the excuse they need [BTW- reread Handmaids Tale- scary prescient]
    I think the most likely scenario is that eventually a simple enough connect -the- dot narrative unfolds that involves Russian payola that even congress critters have to pay attention ….. history is replete with men who hang onto power til they die of natural causes so I’m hoping the Republic is robust enough to head off THAT scenario.

    Or his dealer hands him a baggie of pharmaceutical grade…

  15. #15 Richard Simons
    March 7, 2017

    As an outsider, I would not be surprised if there were major civil unrest, combined with an over-reaction by the authorities, in a US city in the next four years.

  16. #16 Wow
    March 8, 2017

    One result of Orangina being such a complete twat is that a lot of the rules that didn’t specify “including the president” will be amended to include the fucking president.

    And, given tiny hands’ propensity to do no fucking work and holiday all the time, a set minimum number of hours, maximum annual budget for “accommodation and travel” because this retard has spent PERSONALLY (excluding his family’s spending) nearly as much in a month on holidays as Obama did in a year.

    For which the Shit-Gibbon berated the president for and you republican retards lapped up and have suddenly forgotten now it’s YOUR guy in power doing far FAR worse….

  17. #17 Bernard J.
    March 8, 2017

    My expectation if “several of the above”, in a cascading topple of dominos.

    And this holds for large values of “several”.

  18. #18 Douglas C Alder
    Canada
    March 8, 2017

    “All the CNN reporters, and all the TV reporters in general, will work on this on a daily basis, tweaking the news, affecting public perception, in such a way as to make sure Trump is not removed by virtue of the 25th, or impeached, or even stressed out too much.”

    Greg -it’s the talking heads on CNN not the actual reporters. I would never call Chuck Todd or Andrea mitchell reporters, or journalists, they don’t know the meaning of the word.

    The ones reporting from the front line of Iraq, (http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2017/03/world/return-to-mosul/index.html), and other battlegrounds around the world, are putting their lives in danger to get a story out (regardless of any bias in the story or what their network heads will do with it) and some have paid the price of their lives to do it. Your statement , quoted above, does those real reporters a disservice. https://cpj.org/killed/mideast/iraq/

  19. #19 Greg Laden
    March 8, 2017

    Tirius: Perhaps he did. You should name them, though, if you want your comment to be taken seriously.

    President Obama was one of the most effective and careful presidents we’ve seen, all presidential experts and historians agree on that. You are suggesting an equivalence between President Obama and President Trump. In answer to that, I suggest that you get your head examined.

  20. #20 Wow
    March 8, 2017

    Obama wasn’t effective. Hell, not entirely his fault since his opponents ran on the open platform of ensuring he got nothing done.

    But he didn’t really try either.

    He was so busy building bipartisanship with racists who were apoplectic that a nigger was in charge and therefore unable to think straight, that he compromised EVEN BEFORE THE NEGOTIATIONS STARTED. And that’s where he was ineffective.

    Hell, the reason why Hilary bombed could be laid at the fact that in voting for Obama they basically got a black republican president, in which case they might just have well voted for Ben Carson this time for the same feels.

    There’s no point for the left (such as it is in the USA) to vote when the choice is from one republican in the (R) side and another republican in the (D) side.

    THAT was effective. In making Hilary lose. However, she herself was so busy chasing the “centrist” ground and the rightwing that she is 100% responsible for her failure. To this extent, Obama just set the ground for it and it was Hilary who played the part of a female republican president candidate running on the (D) side.

    And the democrats are continuing the chase for permanent losing now they’ve finally told everyone why they didn’t show the votes from the election for (D) chair: they changed the rules an hour before the vote. The reason for the open vote didn’t change. They just don’t care to avoid the problems. Probably because of the unrepresentative superdelegates who are trying to ensure that either the Ds lose or that at least the Rs get their policies in because the demoocrats are all basically R in D clothing.

    So, no, Obama was not effective, and a lot of that is by his deliberate choice and act. Well, not effective as a Democrat. He was 100% perfect for the Republicans, though: they get to blame him for trying their own policies, get ignored when they work, and vilified when they fail (and even if they don’t fail, complained about anyway, since no policy is 100% perfect). In short, they got all the power and absolved of all responsibility.

    Sweet.

  21. #21 Eric Lund
    March 8, 2017

    terrorist attack, small
    terroristic disease or chemical attack

    These two things have arguably already happened.

    You may have heard news reports of bomb threats being phoned in to Jewish schools and community centers. There have been over 100 such threats since the beginning of the year. The intent is to make Jews feel afraid, and others afraid to have Jews as neighbors. Likewise, there have been multiple shootings of people from India whose shooters mistook them for Iranian.

    The chemical attack was admittedly not in the US: I refer to the assassination of Kim Jong-nam at the Kuala Lumpur airport. That was done with VX nerve agent, smeared on his face by two women who claimed they were told it was a television prank. The Malaysian police want to talk to several North Korean nationals, including at least one diplomat and several others who are believed to have fled to Pyongyang.

    You may object that these are individuals, and apart from the bomb threats, targeted at individuals. It’s still stochastic terrorism. The risk is that more incidents of this kind might occur, or that one of the bomb threats may turn out to be a real bomb. Not to mention that the internet makes it easy for the sort of individual who would shoot an obvious foreigner to get together with other such individuals, making pogroms a possibility. And now that North Korea has shown a willingness to use VX on foreign soil (at an international airport, no less), what would stop them from using it in an attack intended to cause mass casualties?

  22. #22 RickA
    United States
    March 8, 2017

    I agree with WOW – Obama was not effective.

    Obviously each of us is entitled to our own opinion.

    But objectively, Obama was not able to accomplish much by legislation (except the ACA) and that is why he went the executive order route.

    Now, the ACA has failed and is going to be repealed.

    All his executive orders are going to get rolled back.

    He failed in Syria (most agree on this issue).

    I don’t personally fault him for Hillary Clinton losing – I think that was all on her and the democrats. If you blame Russia (I don’t) – than that would be put at the feet of Obama also (since it happened while he was President).

    The economy did improve under Obama – but that was really down to TARP which was passed and signed by President Bush.

    And the Fed helped by holding interest rates down for 8 years – but they are independent and so that cannot go into the Obama column.

    I don’t think history will judge Obama as “one of the most effective and careful presidents we’ve seen”.

    But that is just one person’s opinion.

  23. #23 dean
    United States
    March 8, 2017

    “The economy did improve under Obama – but that was really down to TARP which was passed and signed by President Bush.”

    It appears that you simply say asinine things to hijack conversations – or are you truly this stupid?

  24. #24 Douglas C Alder
    Canada
    March 8, 2017

    Eric Lund – there is also the multiple missile launches from NK that have penetrated Tokyo’s Exclusive Economic Zone –

    “Three of four ballistic missiles landed in waters as close as 300km to Japan’s northwest coast, Shinzo Abe says. 06 Mar 2017 21:24 GMT.” http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/03/seoul-north-korea-carried-missile-tests-170306035312540.html

    and some are guessing this is NK practicing to hit US Military bases in Japan.

    Reaction from the white house – crickets.

  25. #25 Wow
    March 8, 2017

    “You may have heard news reports of bomb threats being phoned in to Jewish schools and community centers.”

    They’re not done by muslims and are done by the rightwingers, so these don’t count. Remember, the Orangina orangutan has demanded that the FBI cut back on investigations into white terrorism in the USA, only muslims count.

  26. #26 Wow
    March 8, 2017

    It also appears that dick doesn’t realise what he agreed to when he agreed with me.

    The rampant racist braindeath of the rightwing from when Obama won, for example.

    But dick is probably fine now that a white shit gibbon is in power and will only go ballistic again if anyone left of Hitler turns up in power without a (R) next to their name.

  27. #27 Wow
    March 8, 2017

    “Now, the ACA has failed and is going to be repealed.”

    Yup, this is a complete load of shite. Dick won’t bother to listen, however, and will morph reality into something else anyway.

  28. #28 Sam Lyon
    March 8, 2017

    OP is in desperate need for more napkins…

  29. #29 Wow
    March 8, 2017

    Why? And did you find out by hacking his TV?

  30. #30 Kim VanGuilder
    Wisconsin
    March 17, 2017

    Yeah right Greg…”culture as science ~ science as culture”.
    “Berate” does not equal “debate”. I see no science here… mostly just arm waving and hand wringing.
    Go ahead and talk amongst yourselves. I am admittedly trolling this one and moving on to a REAL debate somewhere else.

  31. #31 Wow
    March 18, 2017

    Because you’re a closed-minded idiot, Kim. You see there needing to be “debate” even where it doesn’t exist and doesn’t have any validity behind it.

    “Denial” does not mean “disagreement. A fact you elide in your attempt to prosper with ignorance and denial of reality. A REAL debate requires that people actually listen and that the debate have some effect on the minds of the people involved. Except deniers WILL NOT CHANGE and their “debate” is to deny reality.

    And, frankly, the more of those closed-minded noisy idiots fuck off to scream at each other in ever decreasing numbers, the better.

    And I bet if Greg did more to censor “bad posts” you’d whine about it if you were the victim of it. Because people LIKE censorship *of other people* but loath it on themselves. After all, they have “good reason” for it, otherwise they would not have said it, right? Except even that other person thinks the same of their utterance. While you call it “berate”.

    But berate is how we get societies. You don’t tell your three year old “Well, this is an unfortunate situation that is obviously going to have to be discussed seriously here”. You berate them for being silly and putting themselves in danger.

    Because they do not have the capacity to deal with subtle.

    Deniers have the same problem.

  32. #32 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    OK Mr anonymous WOW.
    If your goal in to insult and offend your way into a so-called debate, then you will probably be highly successful in your future debating endeavors.
    Actually, you are attempting to offend some written words on a screen. You do not know the people behind the words you see on your screen. So if it makes you feel better about yourself to just be “right”, then go ahead.

    These are your words from some of your previous posts:

    Fucking gun nuts.
    First pussies to hide and scream when there’s danger.
    It’s YOUR fucking fault.
    Really didn’t show the USA in a good light, voting that dangerous retard back in for a second office.
    One result of Orangina being such a complete twat is that a lot of the rules that didn’t specify “including the president” will be amended to include the fucking president.
    For which the Shit-Gibbon berated the president for and you republican retards lapped up and have suddenly forgotten now it’s YOUR guy in power doing far FAR worse….
    He was so busy building bipartisanship with racists who were apoplectic that a nigger was in charge
    Remember, the Orangina orangutan has demanded that the FBI cut back on investigations into white terrorism in the USA, only muslims count.
    But dick is probably fine now that a white shit gibbon is in power and will only go ballistic again if anyone left of Hitler turns up in power without a (R) next to their name.
    Yup, this is a complete load of shite. Dick won’t bother to listen, however, and will morph reality into something else anyway.
    Because you’re a closed-minded idiot, Kim. You see there needing to be “debate” even where it doesn’t exist and doesn’t have any validity behind it.
    And, frankly, the more of those closed-minded noisy idiots fuck off to scream at each other in ever decreasing numbers, the better.
    Because they do not have the capacity to deal with subtle.

    You sir are the one who does not have the capacity to deal with the subtle. You do not want to have a debate about anything. You do evidently just want to shout down any opinion that does not fit into your predefined self-righteous dogma. Just “plug in” whatever comes across Greg’s crystal ball, and accuse any print that comes across your screen of being an idiot (or just re-submit any of your previous posts several hundred times) until you convince everyone that you are right, and they are wrong.
    Oh, and this is nothing personal, because we are not really people anyway. We have social media now.
    I’ll debate the issues on a forum or maybe an upcoming town hall meeting where actual issues are debated… few and far between these days. Just try to get in some constructive conversation while people like you who do not want to “hear” anything. Just keep yelling your vulgarities. That’ll work. Fix those idiots if you can.

  33. #33 Wow
    March 18, 2017

    “Mr”? Talk about “You do not know the people behind the words you see on your screen”. What makes you call me “Mr”? Are genitals hanging from the font rendered?

    And I thought you were leaving for “REAL” (sic) discussion.

    “These are your words from some of your previous posts”

    I know. I was there when I wrote them. You, meanwhile had nothing to counter their accusation other than your feels.

    Strange how the rightwingnutjobs complain that there’s snowflakes and insist they want facts, not feels, but are quite happy to go with THEIR feels, as facts, even.

  34. #34 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    I am a new Google AI robot 🙂
    Sorry I offended you
    Just envision a gif of President Trump repeatedly giving you the finger. It will stroke your ego to its satisfaction.
    Why would a robot go away when it is having so much fun?

  35. #35 Wow
    March 18, 2017

    “Sorry I offended you”

    WTF? Where do you get I;m offended? YOU were the one griping about how everyone else here is berating not debating and claiming you were going elsewhere, therefore CLEARLY offended.

    You’re an artificial dumbass. “Expelled: No intelligence wanted”.

  36. #36 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    That is all you’ve got?
    I am an official dumbass?
    Subtle.

  37. #37 Wow
    March 18, 2017

    So “nowhere” is where you got the idea I was offended. In colloquial terms, it was an ass-pull of yours.

    Seems like you can’t debate. And mistake pulling crap from your anus as argument.

    Any confusion about WHY your flounce is completely a non-issue, kim?

  38. #38 BBD
    March 18, 2017

    [chortles]

  39. #39 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    OK, so the issue is “debate”, rather than slinging insults.
    Pick one issue of substance. I challenge you to debate without using vulgarity and name calling within the entire debate. I am very willing to debate any issue you choose. Maybe others will chime in. We can have civil and intelligent conversation without those distractions can’t we?
    If you are saying that those who speak in a lively manner or maybe a little clumsily (flounce) are not allowed to speak, then I am not interested in getting into that debate. If a forum like this is meant to get people involved, then ok, let’s go.
    it is just that you have not demonstrated a willingness to take that route, based on the content of your previous posts.
    Pick one issue without the coloration of innuendo.
    I hope others join in.

  40. #40 BBD
    March 18, 2017

    Pick one issue without the coloration of innuendo.
    I hope others join in.

    Peter Green was better than Clapton.

  41. #41 Wow
    March 18, 2017

    “I challenge you to debate without using vulgarity”

    Fuck that. Why should I bother? I guess you can’t argue facts so have to argue presentation. I challenge you to find anything wrong with what you quoted from me.

    So far, you’ve spent effort to collect them, but no effort showing what is wrong with any of them.

    And, not forgetting, the nonexistent flounce.

  42. #42 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    Green is the better singer, but Clapton has a way with the guitar that Green does not.

  43. #43 BBD
    March 18, 2017

    BB King differed with you on Green’s ability as a guitarist, but I’d agree about the singing.

  44. #44 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    Really, If any of those guys got together, I doubt if there would be much disagreement about who was better. They’d just perform their asses off, and we’d be in awe.
    Maybe the real question is what has happened to music since these guys were in their prime?

  45. #45 dean
    leedwitt@gmail.com
    March 18, 2017

    “Peter Green was better than Clapton.”

    Buddy Guy. Discussion done.

  46. #46 BBD
    March 18, 2017

    Maybe the real question is what has happened to music since these guys were in their prime?

    It evolved and diversified some more. It didn’t degenerate. We just got old. Although speaking for myself, I love a bit of EDM when I’m in the mood. Takes me back to 1988, when I was 23 and music changed.

  47. #47 BBD
    March 18, 2017

    Buddy Guy. Discussion done.

    Back to the source. Can’t argue with that.

  48. #48 Kim VanGuilder
    March 18, 2017

    I’m gonna fire up some Buddy Guy and listen for a while. Thanks for lightening it up. Just caught my team (the Badgers) beating Villanova! Time to get away from this machine for a while anyway.

  49. #49 dean
    March 18, 2017

    RIP Chuck Berry.

  50. #50 BBD
    March 18, 2017

    Amen.

  51. #51 Kim VanGuilder
    Wisconsin
    March 18, 2017

    Been listening a while to the music being discussed. The more you listen, you just have to agree that it is almost without exception, “non-toxic”…just pure spirit and energy. It is completely unpretentious and just fills your soul.
    One guy who seems to be trying to carry the torch seems to be John Mayer, although still not in the same class.

    BBD is right though. Maybe we just got old. In ’88 I was 31, and I also occasionally enjoy “what changed”. Not giving up though.

  52. #52 BBD
    March 19, 2017

    I’m guessing you mean John Mayall? By coincidence, I was listening to the Beano album last night. And yes, it’s bloody good 🙂

  53. #53 Kim VanGuilder
    March 19, 2017

    Believe it or not, I did mean John Mayer…only because he is a young guy…and probably represents the future. Yeah, I bet I know what you are thinking….I know, I know.
    I never listened to John Mayall (shame on me), and now you’ve primed the pump for me. I will give him a listen. According to a bio I looked up, he was born in ’33, which would put him at 84 years old.

    My belief it that John Mayer is famous for more what I’d call “POP” or “Bubble Gum” blues music. BUT, he is very talented, and is one of the few of this “new” genre who still knows how to really play the guitar, and sing with emotion. He also writes most of his own stuff.
    Here is a link to a video of Buddy Guy and John Mayer doing a duet. Mayer is pretty young in this video, but you’ll see & hear what I mean about what he can do on the guitar.

  54. #54 RickA
    United States
    March 20, 2017

    Kim VanGuilder #39:

    Hear hear.

    I agree with you.

  55. #55 Wow
    March 20, 2017

    Yeah, but you;re an ignorant blowhard, dick. And kim here an ignorant patsy trying to argue about meaningless tone problems while there’s a massive elephant in the room of your content being 100% vacant idiocy she studiously ignores, thereby negating EVERY complaint she’s made.

    Indeed her complaints are the ur example of ad hominem.

  56. #56 BBD
    March 20, 2017

    Okay, young(ish) blues guitar stars cont.

    I raise you Joe Bonamassa!

    Thanks for the pointer on John Mayer – I truly thought it was a typo 🙂

  57. #57 dean
    United States
    March 20, 2017

    My final thoughts here: I would suggest listening to George Benson too. There’s a lot more to him than just “On Broadway”, which is what most people remember him for.

    I was also a fan of Johnny Winter – once he settled into the blues and less on rock (he was good with his rock, but shined strong on the blues).

    And two women (of many): Sister Rosetta Tharpe, one of the early women who broke ground, and Samantha Fish as one of the many great modern women playing. Listen to her version of “I Put A Spell On You”.

    The amazing thing to me is just how effortless all of these folks make playing their music seem.

  58. #58 Kim VanGuilder
    March 20, 2017

    See?

  59. #59 Wow
    March 20, 2017

    So?

  60. #60 Wow
    March 20, 2017

    Maybe zebra needs to come along and complain to kim et al here…

  61. #61 Kim VanGuilder
    March 20, 2017

    Wow
    To start, we have both made a similar mistake in that we assumed each other’s gender.
    I don’t blame you though.
    There are not too many guys named Kim, although I have run into a few. When “Junk Mail” was snail mail, I used to get all kinds of stuff…like “come join our beauty school” and the like. :}
    I wish the guy in North Korea did not have the same name!
    I am a 60 year old grandfather of seven.
    And respectfully, I think that the “elephant in the room” is why there is so much division on our country today.
    I don’t hate you. But I think the reason people have problems rationally discussing the issues today is that when the discussion turns away from something they disagree with, civility and mutual respect goes out the window. Those who value civility just withdraw….which is then viewed as “victory” by the shouters.
    So when Greg’s blog hosts these opinions (even tough they may not always be “on topic”), he allows the discussion to morph. I do applaud him for that.
    BBD and I were (possibly unknowingly) trying to prove this point.

  62. #62 Wow
    March 20, 2017

    Really? I guess you’re not blaming me because I didn’t blame you earlier for doing it.

    Kim is more frequently a female name than a male one, even in the USA, though. “Wow” is not a gendered name at all. So one of us has evidence to lend credence to a judgement call. The other one (that would be you) did not.

    “And respectfully, I think that the “elephant in the room” is why there is so much division on our country today.”

    No, the problem is that form is considered the definition of correctness. And your ignorance of substance is CAUSED by that idiocy. You think that any old shite is correct if it’s not countered by something you find more believable (remember, you are concerned only and solely about form, not substance) as long as it is said politely.

    And so bullshite lives on because idiots like yourself go “Well, they never used rude words, they must be right!”.

    Because you ignore substance.

  63. #63 Erin
    March 20, 2017

    C’mon Wow, concede Kim’s point.
    This person sounds like my dad, and I understand. We’ve had many knock-down drag-outs, and to me he is only trying to make one point.
    You have to admit, you do come across kinda abrasive.
    I am with you on the substance thing, but you have to understand his value system if you want to be taken seriously by a lotta people in his age group. The baby boomers are mot gone. This person is NOT devoid of intellect as you say.
    And Kim, I think you stumbled onto this and you wwere pissed at Wow when you got to the forum. Can’t say as I blame you. but you might be in over your head with this forum.
    Its allright if you move on so these people can do their thing. I know there are other places on the internet where your views will me more appreciated. I know I am not sticking around.
    Give Wow the last word and just move on.

  64. #64 Kim VanGuilder
    March 20, 2017

    You make some valid points. You seem like a smart person.
    I think you should try to consider the concept of drawing people in to your point of view, but that is just me.
    Not everyone has a thick skin. Many people like me do have strong opinions on substantive issues, but have fear of ridicule from people like you. You’d probably call that “gutless”. For sure, even if what I said with met your entirely valid definition of substance, it is doubtful that we’d convince one another of our respective points of view.
    I am an average guy who deeply cares about what is going in in the world today. I, like you (and most of the people I know) am really concerned about the our future.
    What you are referring to as substance may not even matter at all if we can’t even agree on a small “nonsensical” idea that as a society, we have to find ways to communicate and put aside our differences just long enough to find SOME common ground. for the good of all of us. That is my issue of substance.
    I heard Hillary speak today. She was talking about this very same issue. It is a not umimportant, but no one seems to want to breach it. I can’t say that I agree with her on much, but, I’m with her on this one. As for her true motives, I can only speculate.
    Perhaps I am a fish out of water here, because I think this stuff matters. And you can tell me I am an Idiot, or use whatever other expletive comes to mind. It won’t mean a thing (of substance) because the way we view the world (through our own individual lenses) is so terribly out of focus with one another.
    How can we fix that?

  65. #65 Wow
    March 21, 2017

    “You seem like a smart person.”

    I am. Just not very tolerant. Partly due to knowing that people are smarter and better than they can be bothered to be. And I see them failing their potential when they act like a dumbass, and not pointing out the dumbassery is doing them a disservice.

    And none of that means I’m RIGHT. Which is why you do or don’t do like I do, YOUR CHOICE. Show similar courtesy and do the same for me.

    Look at dick’s years-long insistence that he’s right and ECS is 1.6 or less and we can only tell if he’s wrong if

    a) it goes past 560ppm CO2
    b) we THEN are past 1.6C

    being polite doesn’t change his made up mind. His refusal to use swearing or namecalling does not remove his absolutely braindead moronic claim from being fucking ignorant and stupid.

    And when you challenge me to a no-vituperative conversation, would YOU accept a challenge of a scores-long foul language conversation? No. Because that would be for you completely pointless.

    You, however, inhabit your own head and therefore what you think is what is reasoned and therefore reasonable. So you don’t reciprocate.

    “How can we fix that?”

    Be honest. If you’re called a dumbass about something, maybe you honestly ARE a dumbass about it. Stop worrying about the irrelevant or find out if it IS relevant. Stop presuming. Stop living inside your own head and recognise that this is a multiplex world.

    Stop letting swear words be the one and only determinant of whether there’s an insult. Because you can be insulted without a single foul word being said.

    “We”? First realise where you need to change. Without that step, nobody else sees a reason why they should obey your dictates, seeing as you don’t follow them yourself about the change being needed. Then look again and see if there’s the changes where you thought they needed to be done. Because some of those changes were to make the world more like you, not you more like the world.

    And, yes, that does sound priggish, but this is a limited conversation set and without a shit ton more words, it’s not possible to get nuance in it.