This is just one of dozens of responses to common climate change denial arguments, which can all be found at How to Talk to a Climate Sceptic.
Objection:
Climate has always changed, why are we worried now and why does it have to be humans fault?
Answer:
Yes, climate has varied in the past and it has varied for many different reasons, some better understood than others. The present day climate change is very well understood and is different. Simply noting that something happened before without humans does not in any logical way show that humans are not causing it today.
For example, we see in ice core records from Antarctica and Greenland that the world cycled in and out of glacial periods over 120Kyr cycles. The cause for that climate cycle's timing is fairly well understood to be the results of changes in the orbit of the Earth, though the mechanism behind the resulting response has not been conclusively established. These orbital cycles are regular and predictable and they are definitely not the cause of today's warming. The other important difference between the glacial-interglacial cycles and today is the rapidity of the current change. The rate of warming is on the order of 10 times faster today than seen in the ice cores.
Such rapid warming on a global scale is very rare in the geological record, and while it may not be unprecedented, there is very strong evidence that whenever such a change has happened, whatever the cause, it was a catastrophic event for the biosphere.
This is just one of dozens of responses to common climate change denial arguments, which can all be found at How to Talk to a Climate Sceptic.
"Climate is Always Changing" was first published here, where you can still find the original comment thread. This updated version is also posted on the Grist website, where additional comments can be found, though the author, Coby Beck, does not monitor or respond there.
Environment
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Oh happy day!
Here's a link from Australia's ABC News website. (which I read every day)
Breathe easy everyone! We have fixed the hole in the ozone layer! It's taken 22 years since the Montreal Protocol, but thankfully, the banning of CFCs has caused it to get smaller! Now it's only the size of Antarctica! (tiny really)
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/09/23/2694400.htm
Watch out though! It seems there's another evil gas that's sure to kill us all. A link on the same page says that Nitrous Oxide may have an even worse effect on the ozone layer!
Humanity, take action!
We can fix all these problems. This story proves it!
But seriously folks, this is an article that is a great example of the AGW movement's propaganda.
It's an article that basically says nothing either way, but "introduces" or emphasises" the idea that human
Action(!) can fix the earth's troubles. We have a lot to fear, but we CAN save the world by implementing such "measures" as Emmissions Trading Schemes.
Posted by: Michael | September 25, 2009 2:01 PM
I'm glad you find science so humorous. Life must be a hoot on the flat earth ...
Posted by: dhogaza | September 25, 2009 3:54 PM
Doh!Gaza, How can that article be science and the stuff that I, and other filthy Deniers like me have posted, not be??!!
Did you click on the link/s?
Did you read the articles?
Posted by: Michael | September 25, 2009 4:03 PM
Let's not forget, if I can state the bleedin' obvious that we are here to debate ANTHROPOGENIC climate change/warming.
Not one of us filthy deniers, here or anywhere, are denying climate change.
NOT ONE!! Nor, are we denying that the earth can warm or cool.
That is part of the reason why I posted a fair while ago, that this blog should be titled correctly instead of misleadingly, insinuating that a "denier" is too stupid to read warming trend graphs, and satelite data.
Coby, I know you're busy with kids 'n stuff, but I'd appreciate (being a stickler) you changing the title of this blog to "How To Talk To a Human Induced Climate Change Skeptic" or even "How To Talk To An AGW Denier".
We deniers (speaking for myself mostly) are not "evil capitalists" looking for a short term dollar at the expense of the entire earth.
We are simply people who don't believe the propaganda fed to us by the mainstream media, and want to know the real story of something.
I was a believer after I first saw Al Gore's movie, but then I started to question his "facts" and the more I questioned, the more I learnt.
That's the crux of it.
As usual, I await the usual cherry-picked abusive response from those opposed.
Posted by: Michael | September 26, 2009 6:01 AM
michael? you say all you want to know is "the real story" ? seriously? ok. here ya go: we live inside a bubble suspended in a vaccuum and we are pumping the bubble full of poison gases from the inside... and you want to defend your "right" to do so? why? if not for a "short term dollar at the expense of the entire earth", then.. why?
though you may think that you are valiantly battling the evil "propaganda" giant the truth is all you are really doing is defending your "right" to pollute the air. AGW advocates call for actions to be taken to reduce emissions. why is that such an evil thing? why do you insist on attacking is so fervently? please respond. i must know why you bother to argue such a degenerative view. i rarely pipe up on this type of thing but your above comments are so ludicrous that i was truly inspired...
Posted by: solar | October 20, 2009 3:47 PM
Hi Solar,
When I say the "real" story, I mean that I like to get as much information on a given topic as I can find, and try to work it out for myself.
I consider myself to be an environmentalist.
I have posted here previously that I strongly believe in reducing and limiting pollution.
If you have been to somewhere like Hong Kong and seen the air so thick with Anthropogenic Pollution that one may look directly at the sun at two in the afternoon, then you understand where I'm coming from.
I live in Brisbane, Australia and regularly travel to the World Heritage Listed, Fraser Island.
It it a "pristine" sand island which is littered with plastic bottles, bags, cans and various other waste!
From the reading I've done so far, I simply cannot agree that one element, namely Carbon, and the human release of it, is alone responsible for the apparent warming, or for that matter Climate Change in general.
I have been involved in the Solar Electricity industry here in Australia, and for a country with more sunlight that most others, our governments simply haven't embraced it at all.
At least the AGW movement has increased research funding in Photovoltaics!
The reason I think it's so urgent and important to get the Climate Change debate right is that Australia's Federal Government is trying to introduce an emissions trading scheme that will have no influence whatsoever on the climate of the earth, and begin to destroy the industry and jobs of Australia and it's neighbours.
When all this first became a big issue, after the release of An Inconvenient Truth, I was a believer and would tell anyone who would listen that we are in trouble, and they should see that movie.
I read as much as I can of both sides of the debate and so far, I have been convinced by the "skeptical" rather than the "belevers".
I hope I am making sense. I'm writing this in between taking business phone calls and replying to emails.
Usually, I have found that posts such as mine are responded to with abuse and "cherry-picked" criticism.
I guess we shall see.
I'd like to know what you think.
Posted by: Michael | October 21, 2009 10:33 PM