Pharyngula

What a fucktard. I'm so damn sick of the "math is hard" approach taken towards girls. But then, I was consistently pushed ahead in math classes as a teen and NEVER told it was supposed to be "hard". In the 70s, girls could do ANYTHING.

Hey, they still can. Don't ever let the fgucktards tell you any different.

Posted by: donna | February 16, 2006 11:14 PM

The "writing is the highest form of reasoning" line is so typical.
Cohen is such a moron he probably believes that Einstein couldn't do algebra either.
I'll stop here. There's just nothing to say to someone dense as a stone.

Posted by: marky | February 16, 2006 11:22 PM

This quote from Cohen really caught my attention:

The proof of this, Gabriela, is all the people in my high school who were whizzes at math but did not know a thing about history and could not write a readable English sentence.

I've got to call BS on that one. Does anyone here remember people in high school who were good at math but couldn't write?

When I was in high school 7-10 years ago, the people good in math and writing and history were all the same group of nerds who went on to good colleges. I don't remember a single one who did well in math and poorly in other subjects.

I think Cohen's trying to pretend that, because he doesn't possess their aptitude, they must not possess his. Otherwise they'd just be flat-out superior to him, and of course we can't have that! Every inept one-trick pony has to trot out this argument at one time or another.

Posted by: Troutnut | February 16, 2006 11:25 PM

Wow.

I'm not sure what else I can say… Wow.

Cohen's a hell of a typist, but not much of a writer.

Wow.

I can't imagine not having some understanding of algebra; Cohen's a marvel.

Posted by: Lettuce | February 16, 2006 11:30 PM

Maybe if Dickie could put two and two together, he could have figured out that the Iraq war was pre-orchestrated, and that the evidence for it was false. He doesn't seem to have mastered his history courses, either.

Posted by: larry | February 16, 2006 11:33 PM

What a dickwad. And I know he's a dickwad because I know what he's saying is absolutely, one-hundred percent false based on personal experience. I pretty much goofed off in high-school and did not pay attention in math class. I had the "math is hard and I'll never use it" attitude, which prevented me from making an honest effort at learning it at all. After I graduated I ended up playing a game of "catch-up" with mathematics, teachings it to myself with academic textbooks. It worked out in the end, but in retrospect I do wish that I had made more of an effort in high school, as I could've saved myself a lot of trouble.

Posted by: Carlo DiPietro | February 16, 2006 11:38 PM

Man. What gets to me is that I had mastered (well, basic, but still) algebra at the age of TEN...

... and the principle from algebra I use most often? The concept of ABSTRACT THOUGHT.

Is it strictly reasoning? Maybe not. But it sure as hell is the ability to deal with a concept without knowing everything there is to know about it.

Posted by: Michael Ralston | February 16, 2006 11:42 PM

The girl flunked algebra SIX TIMES. She wasn't going to be a scientist, a technician, a teacher, or an accountant in any case. And because of state requirements, she quit school altogether. But who cares, right? If you can't do math, then fuck you and who cares.

In any case, Cohen's sympathy for her hardly qualifies as some bullshit "math is hard" approach to girls. Did you (the genius behind that comment) even bother to READ the original article?

Since I finished up with calculus ten years ago, I've had absolutely no occasion or desire to use algebra, GREs excepted. I guess that makes me a talking sheep.

Posted by: !!! | February 16, 2006 11:46 PM

I am completely tone-deaf when it comes to math, but that's something I regret, not something I'm proud of. I'm also totally tone-deaf to poetry (hmmm... could there be a connection?)... but you only have to listen to someone like Richard Feynman explain what math means to them to realize that you are missing out on something big, perhaps more so than a literally tone-deaf person does with regard to music.

Posted by: craig | February 16, 2006 11:49 PM

Sorry, but I think all of you should invest a bit more time in the humanities. If you did, you wouldn't be half as upset about this as you appear to be.

Talk about intolerance. The comments on this post win the cake. If this is the best an affection for Algebra can produce take it away already -- it begins to fester.

(And yes, boys and girls, this is a LIBERAL talking to you.)

Posted by: trueLiberal | February 16, 2006 11:51 PM

!!!, a proper resonse to someone who has tried at something and failed repeatedly and will likely never succeed might be "well, that's OK, you have other strengths..."

It's not a proper response to say to that person and tens of thousands of other impressionable young readers "Good for you! Anyone who is good at that stuff is a LOSER! A Geek! A Nerd!"

Posted by: craig | February 16, 2006 11:54 PM

Knowing algebra, I immediately see the discontinuous functions (mostly linear) that apply to the taxes I did this week. Deductions and all that. Yes, I used a computer to do them but knowing in the abstract what the functions were doing let me know how to plan ahead to maximize certain savings, something the software did a poor job at, and it is the highly praised market leader. I have zero training in accounting or tax law. It just clicked.

But bah, abstraction is useless I guess.

Posted by: loser | February 16, 2006 11:56 PM

why does anyone care if you are a self-described "liberal" or not?

Posted by: kathleen | February 16, 2006 11:58 PM

As a first approximation, Algebra is simply the arithmetic manifestation of the Fourteenth Amendment; it is the notion that equal things should be treated equally.

I would be leery of anyone who could cavalierly dismiss either.

Posted by: Ray Radlein | February 16, 2006 11:59 PM

All of you self-righteous math whizzes may mock this sentiment

I thought the subject in question was elementary algebra? I don't think anyone has a problem with Cohen feeling sorry for the girl, but that doesn't justify the fountain of bull that was the rest of his column.

Posted by: Rick @ shrimp and grits | February 17, 2006 12:02 AM

The "algebra vs. the humanities" thing is false, anyway. I'm a humanities person, and in fact, I use algebra fairly regularly to figure things out.

Having said that, sure: if someone has repeatedly failed a subject and just cannot deal with it, yes--one reassures them that thay are not, therefore, doomed to a life of failure. On the other hand, I can't help but wonder if the poor girl in question might not benefit from a compassionate, skilled, and gentle teacher. I say this as someone who has taught adults with a long history of failure behind them how to read (and write).

Posted by: bitchphd | February 17, 2006 12:03 AM

A few of the careers that will be off-limits:

Market research;
Banking;
Surveying;
Architecture;
Industrial design;
Medicine;
Veterinary medicine;
Dentistry;
Machining;
Electronics;
Shipping/Maritime (beyond Able-Bodied Seaman)
Engineering;
Meteorology;
Aviation (beyond flight attendant);
Computer science;
Any career path requiring enrollment at Annapolis, West Point, or the Air Force Academy;
Any career path requiring enrollment in an MBA program that is not a complete joke;
Any [successful] career path that requires making projections about future expenditures of of capital;
Any career path that requires you to interact with, and be taken seriously by, people in any of the above careers.

Richard Cohen: too stupid to fart and chew gum at the same time.

Posted by: Alexey Merz | February 17, 2006 12:07 AM

It's intolerance to say that algebra really does do good things?
If so, then the Democratic "leaders" actions make a lot more sense - they're perfectly tolerant... including being tolerant of actions that are incompetant, immoral, or flat-out evil.

Posted by: Michael Ralston | February 17, 2006 12:09 AM

So Cohen's argument seems to be "Algebra shouldn't be required for graduation from high school." I assume he's talking here about basic algebra, a class my brother and I passed in eigth grade and my sister passed in seventh. He's arguing that since not getting a high school diploma is bad, we should give diplomas to even those who don't pass algebra.

I feel that the same argument could be made about any class in high school. I don't use history in my everyday life, why not get rid of it? English? Nothing in my profession requires analysis of symbolism in literature, so why bother there? And on and on. At some point, we need to address the fact that a high school diploma should be indicitive of more than the ability to show up at 8:30 every morning. One of the many skills I'd hope students have learned is basic algebra - maybe they don't have to solve quadratic equations in their heads, but most students can use calculators in their classes these days anyway. If someone can't be bothered to put in the extra work required to pass a class they're struggling in, should they really get a diploma?

Posted by: Andrew | February 17, 2006 12:10 AM

It's not compassionate at all to lie to her about this, nor is it ridiculous that a high-school should demand at least a passing knowledge of Algebra to issue a degree, nor are either of things a requirement for a full life, whatever the heck that means.

Posted by: Boronx | February 17, 2006 12:15 AM

Hi, law student here. Guess what, math comes up...EVEN IN LAW SCHOOL. It turns out that you should have the basic reasoning abilities of a chimp if you want to do...y'know...anything. Seriously 2x + 3 = 9. If you have never had to use that level of reasoning...then you, my friend, are a monkey wrench. Not the mechanics, or contractors who use monkey wrenches and math in their jobs, but the actual tool itself. Hey, Richard Cohen is a tool...who knew?

Posted by: justin | February 17, 2006 12:25 AM

I was a lousy math student. I'm a good writer, but math (and, sorry to say, languages) was not my forte. But it's ridiculous to make a blanket statement urging others to drop it like a hot potato. This guy is just trying to push people's buttons. Well, here's one for ya, Richard-- you're retarted.

PS - That "trueLiberal" guy is a toady conservative troll. I've seen him on other boards.

Posted by: Shemp | February 17, 2006 12:30 AM

What is the Value of Newspapers?

Gabrielle, I understand that in your school, you are made to read the newspaper. And section A too, not just the TV listings.

Here's the thing, Gabriela: You will never need to read a newspaper. I have never once needed to read one and never once even rued that I haven't. You will never need to know -- never mind want to know -- what the dimwits on Capitol Hill do to make laws -- or something like that. Most of the important news can now be read on a computer or a fashion magazine.

Gabriela, sooner or later someone's going to tell you that newspapers teach reasoning, and foster a deeper understanding of the news. This is a lie propagated by, among others, hack newspaper writers. Newspaper writing, and especially op-eds, are the lowest form of reasoning. This is a fact. The proof of this, Gabriela, is all the people who work at newspapers and get paid to blather on without any resemblence to reality or facts, and except for George Will, can not write a readable English sentence.

Look, Gabriela, I am not anti-newspaper. It has its uses, I suppose. Fish need wrappers and puppies need to learn not to piss on the rug.

Maybe students should even be compelled to take the newspaper (maybe for a school fund drive to buy the school more VCRs), but you shouldn't have to read it. There are those of you, and Gabriela you are one, who know what it is like to stare at a newspaper opinion page until you have eyeballed a hole in the page and not understand a thing you're seeing .

I can cite George W., whose last name will not be mentioned, who never read a newspaper but when called to the board in geography class, located the Sahara Desert right where the Gobi usually is. He was off by a whole continent, but they elected him President anyway.

There are those of us who know the sweat, the panic, the trembling, cold fear that comes from reading Krauthammer, Coulter, or The Family Circus. It is like being summoned to your own execution.

I have lived a pretty full life since school and never, ever read -- or wanted to read -- a newspaper. I was lucky, though. I had graduated from high school and gone on to college. It's different for you, Gabriela. Reading newspapers ruined many a day for me. Now it could ruin your life.

I'm sure there's something about newspapers that you might be missing, but it's not worth the hard intellectual work and frustration. Plus your hands get inky, and well, that's unattractive on a lady. Don't you worry your pretty little head.

Posted by: Siamang | February 17, 2006 12:36 AM

There is not one columnist worth reading in the WP op-ed page. Their editorial page is now neocon. They have wall to wall neocon columnists with idiots like Richard Cohen for "balance".

Posted by: Nan | February 17, 2006 12:43 AM

My algebra teacher in seventh grade only paid attention to the boys and even though we were the chosen few to take it a year early, some of us girls had trouble. I was one of them and I remain to this day deeply angry about being deprived of this very important and necessary step to higher education and higher thinking. It is necessary for both.

Posted by: Cass | February 17, 2006 12:46 AM

I, too, am one of the many who have used algebra in the womanly art of cooking. In addition, figuring out how to cut a flounce not only requires algebra, but geometry!

That aside, Cohen fucked up here by aiming all wrong. His beef is not with algebra, but with the LA school system. This girl took algebra six times, and they couldn't figure out a way to teach her? Did they not try using its real-life applications, like cooking? I mean, that's pretty basic: 2 x 1 tsp. = X.

In addition, have they eliminated music education? Because musical training is a huge boon to the math-averse in helping them grasp mathematical concepts. A dotted-eighth and sixteenth-note pickup or a triplet...those are fractions in action. And music theory, hoo! I had to write in four voices and incorporate a given chord progression with no voices crossing. I did it all on paper, because we had no piano at home. And it always struck me how similar it was to quadratic equations.

Apparently there are studies that prove kids with musical training tend to do better in math. It certainly played out in my family. I was no math wiz, but I did better than my brother, who wasn't a musician.

Posted by: hamletta | February 17, 2006 12:52 AM

My coment above shouldn't be construed to cast aspersions on people with legitimate learning disabilities, but to say that you'll never use algebra is absurd. People with learning disabilties should get extra help in school so that they can learn the basics, like math, that will make them successful. And, incidentally, I was a double major: Physical Anthropology (science) and Classics (humanities)...guess what, they can inform each other. I would hope that a columnist at the WaPo would know that, but then again I hope I'll one day have a solid gold toilet.
(cleary, though, I was not a spelling major, my bad).

Posted by: justin | February 17, 2006 12:53 AM

Okay, so Cohen says he lives a rich and fulfilled life without math. Good for him. He feels sorry for a student who can't pass even elementary algebra. Sure, we all do. He then tells her algebra is worthless. Idiot. He's using her educational travail as an excuse to trash math. Sure, she's never going to become a scientist or engineering, but that's no reason to tell her "There, there, sweetie, it's all nonsense anyway. Forget numbers; only words count." Yeah, it's the poets that keep our modern society ticking along. Cohen is making a fool of himself. Especially with that unpersuasive anecdote that purports to demonstrate that math proficiency is the death knell of literacy. I'm a math teacher and my colleagues and I are plenty literate, so there!

Posted by: Zeno | February 17, 2006 1:04 AM

Well, I use algebra quite frequently, just as part of a rich understanding of the world around me. I think a person who advises kids to ignore math is just as bad as someone who buys them alcohol or cigarettes. He or she is diminishing young people's prospects for future appreciation of, and pleasure in, life's mysteries.

Posted by: Ralph | February 17, 2006 1:15 AM

Although Cohen seems to be unhinged due to a traumatic experience in Algebra, I think it's ok if some people are allowed to graduate without passing Algebra. If this girl tried six times and couln't make it, one has to look at the totality of her skills, and as a special case allow her to graduate if she has adequate knowledge of other subjects. What harm will come if that happens? To whom?

Posted by: anonymous | February 17, 2006 1:23 AM

in my book, a kid who goes back and re-takes a subject they've flunked six times, without going out behind the gym and smoking a joint, or hanging out across the street from school with the heshers, is already six times more of a success than many adults. the most important lesson in life, bar none, is getting back up again. math or no math.

i was one of the "bad in math" kids. but my school and my teachers put in the effort and helped me get through. i'm now using math in studying certain elements of computer programming so i can get a better job than the one i had before.

i had a chemistry teacher who passed me by giving me a D- on a final exam i should have gotten an F on, because i wrote a poem on the back of the test about how science isn't everything. he told me this: "it was refreshing having a student who, while intelligent, wasn't bent on discovering the next element" - a salty remark directed towards the obnoxious over-achieving kids in the front of the class.

i think he also gave me a that D- because he was a fan of my band, and came and saw us play in the local nightclubs.

Posted by: r@d@r | February 17, 2006 1:34 AM

It's always nice to see someone so fundamentally useless to society grant the rest of us permission not to think.

I'll grant Cohen this, though: he does have the only job that I can think of that doesn't require math. Or any actual higher thought processes at all, for that matter. Being a pretentious, self-serving twat is easy; in order to operate a fryalator effectively, you at least have to know not to stick your body parts into the boiling oil.

Posted by: Dan | February 17, 2006 1:57 AM

Bible-thumpers, Marxists, "feminist mystics", eco-terrorists, and many, many other groups share this intense hatred of man's principle means of survival: his intellect.

Now, may we please put to rest the canard that anti-intellectualism is somehow the exclusive province of the right wing?

-jcr

Posted by: John C. Randolph | February 17, 2006 2:31 AM