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PZ Myers is a biologist and associate professor at the University of Minnesota, Morris.
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The Rev. Lovejoy, Msgr. Kenneth Daly, and Rabbi Krustofsky, on their joint radio show:
Announcer: And our first caller is from Shelbyville Heights.
Caller: Yes, hi. With all the suffering and injustice in the world, do you ever wonder if God really exists?
Rev. L: No.
Msgr. D: [Irish accent] Not for a second.
Rabbi K: Not at all.
Announcer: Great, good conversation there. Our next call…
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Evolution of sensory signaling
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« Thoughts on a Creation Science Presentation | Main | Scienceblogs conquers all »
Category: Entertainment • Godlessness
Posted on: October 8, 2007 12:59 PM, by PZ Myers
Thank you, Dr House. "Rational arguments don't usually work for religious people otherwise there would be no religious people." Also good: "It's not about fun, it's about the truth."
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Comments
Ahhh, loved that line. I lol'd!
Of course, my clueless-about-my-lack-of-god-belief wife probably wondered why I was laughing.
Posted by: PragmaticChris | October 8, 2007 1:16 PM
Interesting...
...although I don't know what show that's from and the clip had no context. :(
Posted by: Maronan | October 8, 2007 1:33 PM
Gregory House M.D. is the absolute genius. One simply doesn't get any cooler than House.
Posted by: Rudd-O | October 8, 2007 1:39 PM
Maronan: A woman on track to become an astronaut experiences synesthesia while 'flying' in a flight simulator. She comes to House with $40,000 in cash because she wants her problem fixed but cannot afford any record of her condition or treatment. The hospital won't do anything without fully documenting it, so House has to improvise and do tests without using any of the usual test equipment.
Sorry you missed the show. I don't think there has ever been an episode worth missing.
Posted by: CRM-114 | October 8, 2007 1:43 PM
Maronan,
The clip was from the October 2 episode of "House" (I think; my TiVo may have me confused) and the patient was an astronaut candidate who suffered severe synesthesia (sensory processing mixup) in a flight simulator and later a heart attack. The African American resident, a Mormon, was competing for a staff position on Dr. House's new team and was initially reluctant to participate in an alcohol consumption test that was intended to indirectly help diagnose the patient's problems without leaving a medical-record paper trail visible to NASA's snoops.
Posted by: Jeff D | October 8, 2007 1:44 PM
This is basically the same as the old line,
"You cannot reason someone out of a position they were not reasoned into"
Posted by: Pablo | October 8, 2007 2:54 PM
ROFLMAO...
Posted by: Brain Hertz | October 8, 2007 4:08 PM
Definitly loved that line. House is awesome. I wonder when they're actually going to have a case of Lupus on the show?
Posted by: G | October 8, 2007 5:04 PM
"...a finite, unmysterious universe..."
That makes it sound as though the universe was the size of my appartment.
Posted by: Luis | October 8, 2007 5:08 PM
If it were an infinite, unmysterious universe the size of Luis's apartment, think of how little it would cost per square foot.
Posted by: fardels bear | October 8, 2007 5:30 PM
Has PZ been reading my blog? Great line. As for actually having Lupus, that would be too easy, it's the 2nd or 3rd thing they try every episode.
Posted by: Dan Cardinale | October 8, 2007 5:45 PM
My favorite was
Posted by: John Marley | October 8, 2007 8:46 PM
Posted by: John Marley | October 8, 2007 8:48 PM
Quote mining a fictional TV show; how low can you go?
Posted by: Branko Collin | October 8, 2007 9:06 PM
Is it quote mining if the meaning isn't corrupted?
How low can you go? How about this: Quote mining real people, both living and dead, with the intent of distorting the original meaning of their words as part of an ongoing campaign of disinformation waged to undermine science in the name of superstition.
Posted by: Kseniya | October 8, 2007 9:30 PM
Posted by: Thanny | October 8, 2007 9:37 PM
Ah, but the meaning of the show (not that of House, the character) is to be ultimately undecided on the question of religion. House represents just one of the positions in that debate.
Posted by: Branko Collin | October 8, 2007 10:16 PM
Branko:
... believing a provably false book, living your life as if it were true and pushing it on other people?
Posted by: Troff | October 8, 2007 10:24 PM
Er, with that second sentence in #17 I was talking about dr. House, the character.
Posted by: Branko Collin | October 8, 2007 10:34 PM
@ Branko
1) How is quoting a fictional character, leaving the meaning of their statement intact, to show that you agree with that character, quote mining?
2) #17: Ah, but the meaning of the show (not that of House, the character) is to be ultimately undecided on the question of religion.
Even if this were relevant (which it's not, see (1) above), I don't think it's true. Would the show constantly show House as winning all his contests with God if that were the case? There hasn't been a miracle yet.
Posted by: Jake | October 8, 2007 11:41 PM
Posted by: Dan Cardinale | October 9, 2007 12:05 AM
I'm glad you came across this episode. I love the dialog. The first time I heard it was on set. I was one of the many people you see walking back and forth in the background (thus the term background actor). Alas, the clip didn't run far enough, because when he walked out of that room, I made my cross right in front of him.
Posted by: Phillip Moon | October 9, 2007 12:40 AM
Posted by: Alex, FCD | October 9, 2007 1:48 AM
@ Bruno
You can't quote mine if you're not making an argument. A quote mine might go something like "A character on House said 'The LDS church doesn't attempt to control every aspect of our lives. When the situation is unclear, we're encouraged to make our own decisions.', therefore, House is Mormon propaganda." This is post is more along the lines of "That sure was a cool line, eh? Ha ha, what a great show."
Posted by: Alex, FCD | October 9, 2007 1:53 AM
Nope Alex FCD, Dan is right. It was his emergency Vicodin stash.
Posted by: Jake | October 9, 2007 7:46 AM
I wish House wasn't so cranky though - much as I find that entertaining, it doesn't help the general negative image of atheists as cranky and unable to see happiness/goodness in life.
I took one of those online quizzes once that would tell you whether you were an atheist based on your responses to questions...The last question asked "Do you truly love your family, your friends, and/or a significant other?" - if you answered "yes" to this question and some others, your result would be decidedly not atheist, because apparently "You care far too much about things to believe that the universe is meaningless.
If you think you are an atheist, then you need to stop caring so much. Otherwise, look for another reason for the existence of the universe." I think what we need now is a cheerful, mushy, positive atheist character to counter these stereotypes.
Posted by: grey | October 9, 2007 8:47 AM
ok, i know it's just a silly TV show and should not be taken too seriously, but how exactly did they twist synesthesia into a problem that would need fixing? synaesthetes i know manage to live with it just fine, no negative effects at all evident.
Posted by: Nomen Nescio | October 9, 2007 9:11 AM
No, it just means those atheists have a more realistic basis for caring about things (and/or are more in touch with the nature of the reality of it for all people) than the idiot theist who wrote the quiz based on a fantasy view has.
Posted by: SEF | October 9, 2007 9:54 AM
Troff, you've lost me there. What exactly were you responding to?
Jake, it is the show that is being quote-mined, not the character. I am unable to follow your claim -- that it is not the show that is being quote-mined because if it were the character that was being quote-mined, it would not be quote-mining. Could you try again?
"Would the show constantly show House as winning all his contests with God?"
House is a drug addict. Does the fact that the hero of the show is a drug addict somehow glorify drug abuse? Or could it be that House is a flawed hero? Really, if American believers thought House was a show promoting the atheist agenda, whatever that may be, the show would have been pulled during the first season. House is popular on both sides of the fence just like Mr. Deity is, because the makers of both shows keep things nice and ambiguous.
I haven't watched enough of the show to know what the score is, but I do know that one of the characters keeps track, and that in one episode the score was declared a draw so far.
"You can't quote mine if you're not making an argument."
Axil, you don't need to make an argument if the quote happens to fit nicely in your continuous background narrative. A creationist could do the same; just post a quote out of context. Knowing his audience he would be confident in them reaching all the wrong conclusions, even without him encouraging them.
Posted by: Branko Collin | October 9, 2007 10:27 AM
I take House's crankiness as pure exasperation with all the drivel he deals with day in and day out. Imagine making people feel better every day and a fictional superbeing gets credit for a miracle.
I'd be cranky too.
Posted by: Steve_C | October 9, 2007 10:39 AM
Okay, I gave him three strikes.
Branko, you're a moron. You don't even watch the show, but you're gonna argue with people who do about what it's about? Please be elsewhere now.
Posted by: Jake | October 9, 2007 12:18 PM
It's not (merely) because of the imaginary-superbeing-getting-the-credit angle. It's because to him, as a genius type, he's surrounded by morons. The superintelligent have to be super-tolerant just to appear to be tolerant at all. Neurotypicals don't have it so tough because most people they meet are nearly the same as them, with just a few noticeably more stupid and a few significantly more intelligent.
Of course it's mostly because he's a fictional character. So they can write him any way they want.
Posted by: SEF | October 9, 2007 12:21 PM
"You don't even watch the show"
You lie: I do watch the show.
Posted by: Branko Collin | October 9, 2007 1:04 PM
This is the part in your previous post where you reveal in (at least) two separate ways that you don't watch it enough to have a valid opinion on its content:
Posted by: SEF | October 9, 2007 7:00 PM
"If it wasn't for competition we'd still be single-celled organisms."
Nice one, House.
Of course, he was wrong to rubbish the dying man's beliefs. It wasn't about truth, it was about allowing him to make what he felt was the best of what little time he had left.
And if there is nothing else - which I also believe - then what does it matter what we do here? Even if you take the altruistic view that it is good for us to contribute to the betterment of the human race, none of us will be around to see it - even if it happens - ever.
The only reason no to stick a switcblade in a power socket is that this is all we get. Seems a bit silly to cut it short without a very good reason.
Posted by: Ian H Spedding FCD | October 9, 2007 10:21 PM