…and this is a 
No way to run a bookstore
Category: Books
Posted on: January 17, 2008 11:58 AM, by PZ Myers
I love bookstores — I like the ones that have huge stacks of strange used books where you can find surprises, and I also like the big online stores where I can order anything I want. My kids are all the same way; when we make trips into the big city, the whole mess of us usually end up spending hours in places like Cummings or Uncle Hugo's. But I finally found a bookstore with no redeeming values at all, one I will never patronize.
It's called Abunga, and their motto is "Empowering Decency as your Family Friendly Bookstore". What that means is that they allow bookstore members to vote against books, and if enough people reject a book, the store removes it from its database. This makes no sense to me. There are a lot of books that I deplore, and the way I cope with them is that I don't buy them. I don't go to the manager and tell them that no one else should be allowed to buy them.
So of course one set of books already banned is Pullman's His Dark Materials. Looking around the site, it seems that they're mainly pushing is religious pablum, naturally enough.
It seems a small thing, but that's what you get when you give a religious cult majority rule — it's not an opportunity for them to relax and enjoy their culture, but a reason to suppress minority views.
Comments
let's freep 'em and get "Mere Christianity" pulled :)
Posted by: MAJeff | January 17, 2008 12:02 PM
And speaking of bookstores, if you're in the Boston area, the remainders room at New England Mobile Book Fair is so fucking much fun.
Posted by: MAJeff | January 17, 2008 12:04 PM
Damn, the very existence of that site angers me.
Yeah, we should definitely wage a Pharyngula campaign. We should agree on a list of books, starting with the bible, and get them all blocked.
Posted by: Ric | January 17, 2008 12:04 PM
Who cares? It's not like anyone who gives a toss about books or learning new things is likely to shop at such a place anyhow...
Posted by: DaveX | January 17, 2008 12:07 PM
It shouldn't be very hard, Ric -- I don't see what's "decent" about brutal infanticide, rapes and attempts at cannibalism.
Posted by: Chaz | January 17, 2008 12:11 PM
"Currently over 65,000 books have been blocked on Abunga.com to guard you family. Help us create a safer site for you and your family by blocking titles you find that aren't family friendly."
Seriously! They boast about it!
Posted by: Donalbain | January 17, 2008 12:16 PM
I guess when the devil's always out to get you, the world can be a scary place, and things like ideas even scarier.
what a miserable existence that was.
Posted by: MAJeff | January 17, 2008 12:18 PM
What a stunning and simple concept and yet it is one that seems to be completely too complex for many to follow.
Don't like men touching other men? Well then if you are a man... don't touch one. Don't like what that artist took a picture of... well, then don't look at it. Don't like the fact that alcohol makes you drunk... then don't drink it.
Holy shit. Revolutionary.
/pffft
Posted by: Rev. BigDumbChimp | January 17, 2008 12:18 PM
Hey, maybe we can get the list of books that got voted out, and start a "banned bookstore" specifically to carry them! Heck, even just having a "banned books list" on, say, Amazon would be good. I understand that an attempt to ban a book is usually good for sales, we should help these books take full advantage of the effect.
Posted by: tceisele | January 17, 2008 12:19 PM
Let's go!
I've just blocked 'The Dawkins Delusion' - not that there's anything wrong with it much, but just because it was something they would presumably approve of...I thought trying to get the Bible banned by them was a bit much for a first step.
Interstingly, they had lots of different versions of 'The God Delusion' available on the website.
Posted by: Penny | January 17, 2008 12:20 PM
So, someone should just write a script and block every book in their database.
Nothing to sell, out of business, problem solved.
Posted by: Robert Thille | January 17, 2008 12:21 PM
I love it as a working example of a Christian theocracy in microcosm. Anyone can point to Abungu's book list (and banned list) as a preview of American society as run by a government unfettered by the pesky Establishment clause.
Posted by: Navin | January 17, 2008 12:22 PM
Banning books? Bunch of amateurs. Real fanatics burn books.
I always find it amusing when the Xian cultists get together for a good old fashioned book burning. Nothing sums them up better than that. So far anyway. At least they have stopped burning people alive.
They don't seem to do that much anymore. I haven't heard of a book burning since the Harry Potter ones. The War against the War on Xmas and the War Against Halloween have also died down too.
Could it be the fundies have lost their zeal for looking dumb? Naw, impossible.
Posted by: raven | January 17, 2008 12:22 PM
Out of curiosity, I went to see if Abunga sells books by Nietzsche, Hume, and Spinoza -- all of whom have done far more harm to organized religion that Pullman ever has, or could. Sure enough, Abunga sells all of them. One possibility is that the "family friendly" customers who petitioned Abunga to remove Pullman were reacting to what they've been told to react to, and don't understand the history of religion or of secularism. Another possibility is that Abunga well understands that it can't operate as a respectable bookstore without offering such texts, whereas Pullman is expendable.
Posted by: Carl Sachs | January 17, 2008 12:25 PM
I have no problem going there and clicking on books to "ban". They are inviting it and I don't see anything about who's decency.
I set up an account did a search for Intelligent design, Dembski, Behe, a few others and clicked an a ..."few".
Posted by: Rev. BigDumbChimp | January 17, 2008 12:33 PM
I found this book, it's got the worst stuff you've ever seen in it...
It's got incest, masturbation, prostitution, slavery, violence. Cities are destroyed, families are torn apart, people worship at false idols.
I certainly don't think we should allow children to read this filth.
Posted by: dcb | January 17, 2008 12:41 PM
Seeing as how this is a post about bookstores and mentions the Golden Compass, I'm going to do a bit of blogwhoring. The last time I went to my local Books A Million, all the Phillip Pullman books had these little cardboard inserts from Living Waters Ministries (the one run by Ray Comfort, of banana fame). There were a few different inserts, but one I thought was particularly dishonest, since it was disguised to look like something the publishers might have included as a bonus. It even advertised a website, goldencoNNpass.com. Anyway, I scanned the inserts and posted them on my blog. So, if you want to see them, follow the link below. If you click on the images in the link, it will bring up a bigger image that shows the back of the inserts, too.
http://www.jefflewis.net/blog/2008/01/golden_compass_a_surprise_at_t_1.html
Posted by: Fatboy | January 17, 2008 12:42 PM
I dunno...just to play devil's advocate for a minute here, it seems like the blocking feature is just a gimmick to appeal to their target audience, not some nefarious plot to crush free speech. This is the sort of Focus-on-the-Family-esque hokey crap that plays real well among the credulous faithful.
"Hey! Here's a site where I can act out on all my fears, like that one where big bad Pullman's coming for my kids' souls! I think I'll buy from them."
As a microcosm of theocracy, yes, it is appalling, but it's more a real-world example of effective xian marketing.
Posted by: jonno | January 17, 2008 12:45 PM
Well, the first version of this got held up for moderation. Let's see if it works if I get rid of one of the web addresses.
Seeing as how this is a post about bookstores and mentions the Golden Compass, I'm going to do a bit of blogwhoring. The last time I went to my local Books A Million, all the Phillip Pullman books had these little cardboard inserts from Living Waters Ministries (the one run by Ray Comfort, of banana fame). There were a few different inserts, but one I thought was particularly dishonest, since it was disguised to look like something the publishers might have included as a bonus. It even advertised a website, goldencoNNpass dot com. Anyway, I scanned the inserts and posted them on my blog. So, if you want to see them, follow the link below. If you click on the images in the link, it will bring up a bigger image that shows the back of the inserts, too.
http://www.jefflewis.net/blog/2008/01/golden_compass_a_surprise_at_t_1.html
Posted by: Fatboy | January 17, 2008 12:45 PM
I note Behe, Dembski and BillO among the recent bannees. I guess you guys have been busy...?
Posted by: wjv | January 17, 2008 12:47 PM
Regarding #9... my university library celebrates banned books. Seriously. They have a permanent place set up displaying banned books and encouraging people to read them. I love my library. *grins*
Posted by: Seamyst | January 17, 2008 12:48 PM
Well, the first two versions of this got held up for moderation, so lets's see if it works if I rename the link. I apologize if this gets triple posted.
Seeing as how this is a post about bookstores and mentions the Golden Compass, I'm going to do a bit of blogwhoring. The last time I went to my local Books A Million, all the Phillip Pullman books had these little cardboard inserts from Living Waters Ministries (the one run by Ray Comfort, of banana fame). There were a few different inserts, but there was one I thought was particularly dishonest, since it was disguised to look like something the publishers might have included as a bonus. It even advertised a website, goldencoNNpass. Anyway, I scanned the inserts and posted them on my blog. So, if you want to see them, follow the link below. If you click on the images in the link, it will bring up a bigger image that shows the back of the inserts, too.
Blog Entry on Golden Compass
Posted by: Fatboy | January 17, 2008 12:49 PM
I despise this idea of "family friendly" anything. The real world is not "family friendly." Everyone is supposed to tiptoe around children and young adults as if any wrong word or idea would absolutely destroy their lives. Me, I liked growing up without a lot of censorship: reading & watching pretty much whatever I wanted as a kid and being befuddled by sex and violence and other adult pleasures. That stuff rattled around in my head until I was old enough to figure it out on my own. That's called growing up & joining the real world. These people want to keep their children mentally infantilized, but it'll backfire. The kids will end up in the real world confused & scared because mommy & daddy shielded them from ever having to grow up, & then we'll more kids shooting up church parking lots. Sucks, don't it? A s Malcolm X said, the chickens come home to roost.
Posted by: Will E. | January 17, 2008 12:49 PM
I agree we should join Abunga and block all Creation Science books.
Posted by: locksmyth | January 17, 2008 12:50 PM
Some strange twist of fate pointed me to this.
Out of stock, though. Can't be from too many people buying it.
Posted by: Kyle | January 17, 2008 12:54 PM
whoever just banned the CS Lewis stuff, I tip my hat to you - that was a nice touch.
Posted by: tai haku | January 17, 2008 12:55 PM
I signed up and blocked all of Behe's and Dembski's (un)intelligent designs. However, it seems that this problem is only on the other side of the puddle. We havent seen this level of public censure in Europe since the 'Life Of Brian'.
Infact in the last couple of days there has been plenty of good news in the UK.
1) The blasphemy laws are being repealed.
2) The Lords are pushing for more regulation of woo to ensure that woo doesnt interfere with patient health (Though I rather see it abolished)
3) Research institutions in the UK have been given permission to create human-animal embryos.
Go blighty go!
Posted by: N 'Man O' Rage' R | January 17, 2008 12:57 PM
I like the fact that you can "report non family products"
I strongly urge all members of Pharyngula's Army to go over to that book store site and report random books as "non family products"
Posted by: Greg Laden | January 17, 2008 1:03 PM
More blocks, I say. We need to disabuse everyone of this notion that "family" is synonymous with "Christian".
Posted by: Rey Fox | January 17, 2008 1:08 PM
I stand by my comment above, but now I'm having way too much fun with this. I've even been congratulated for my efforts!
Thank you
You have blocked 35 books.
You're helping make this site even safer for your family and ours
Does anyone else predict that some major changes to the blocking feature will be made by the site admins after the Pharyngu-swarm is detected? Either that, or they'll run out of books entirely.
Posted by: jonno | January 17, 2008 1:10 PM
I always felt "family friendly" was the conservative version of "politically correct" except without the blatant "we must protect The Children" con.
Posted by: Alverant | January 17, 2008 1:12 PM
Ahem. My first thought about their invitation for people to demand they blackball certain books:
Tight-assed conservatives, this is your chance to cow Abunga.
Posted by: Hank Fox | January 17, 2008 1:14 PM
I used to be a book seller (still am in a way) and among all my great antiquarian books I ended up with a ton of religious and new-age types of books... I even had a holocaust-denier book... and I still sold them.
I even talked myself out of my temptation to look down on those who bought them, I figured that they might be buying them for opposition research. Just because you read Mein Kampf doesn't make you a neo-nazi.
Posted by: craig | January 17, 2008 1:16 PM
"I despise this idea of "family friendly" anything. The real world is not "family friendly." "
T-shirt slogan idea: "Censorship is not family friendly."
Posted by: craig | January 17, 2008 1:19 PM
oops, italics tag didn't take, that was a quote.
Posted by: craig | January 17, 2008 1:20 PM
We need to disabuse everyone of this notion that "family" is synonymous with "Christian".
Considering that they use the term to mean a patriarchal, male-dominated, one-man, one-woman and their spawn type family, they can have the term, as far as I'm concerned. They can own that model of family, and it can go away anytime it likes. Yes, by their standards, I'm genuinely "anti-family," since I'd prefer to see "families" as being intentional groupings of people, possibly including children and biological relations, dedicated to each other's mutual welfare, rather than an odd fusion of biological determinism and hereditary social obligation.
I can't say I'm particularly outraged by this Azunga thing. If fundies didn't have something or someone to hate, they'd be completely at loose ends.
(Yoo hoo, funnymentalists! I really am a hairy-legged atheist feminist. Booga booga!)
Posted by: Interrobang | January 17, 2008 1:22 PM
*Waves bye bye to all of Ray Comforts books*
Posted by: Mercurious | January 17, 2008 1:22 PM
Don't forget the "Purpose Driven Life" pablum and the "Left Behind" series, folks!
Posted by: The Mad Patriot | January 17, 2008 1:27 PM
Just a thought, kids:
Suppose at some later point, Ann Coulter gets hold of this site's database, and crows:
"See! See! When it came to banning books, it wasn't the conservative Christians who tried to ban the most! It was evolutionists and atheists!!"
Don't get too happy about this. It could turn out, inadvertently, to be a trap.
Posted by: Hank Fox | January 17, 2008 1:28 PM
I don't know of a more genuinely family-unfriendly force in the US than the Republican party.
Posted by: Steve LaBonne | January 17, 2008 1:32 PM
Oh, thanks for reminding me - let's block Ann Coulter, too!
Posted by: The Mad Patriot | January 17, 2008 1:36 PM
>>Just because you read Mein Kampf doesn't make you a neo-nazi.
Hear, hear! I've gotten so many weird looks at bookstores and libraries when buying/checking out books like 'Mein Kampf' or 'Anatomy of the Auschwitz Death Camp.' I hate the feeling that I need to explain myself to them! As soon as I say, "It's research for a novel" they lighten up, but sheesh!
Posted by: mooglar | January 17, 2008 1:36 PM
I posted a link to Abunga on reddit:
http://reddit.com/info/65s14/comments/
If you're into shits & giggles, go upmod my reddit post. If you think Pharyngula can do make a mess of Abunga's database, wait till the redditors get hold of it.
(After all, they named Mr. Splashy Pants.)
Posted by: wjv | January 17, 2008 1:37 PM
To me it looks like the perfect way to run that particular 'bookstore.' When the hypothetical inventory gets low enough (down to only one book, which all their targeted customers already own), they're out of business.
Posted by: Nan | January 17, 2008 1:41 PM
Hey, banning Xtian books on that site is kind of fun. Bye bye Ann Coulter, you stupid scrotum. :)
Posted by: Ric | January 17, 2008 1:48 PM
Do they sell versions of the Bible? Let's go big and block the Bible.
Posted by: FishyFred | January 17, 2008 1:52 PM
I say again:
Bad idea, "blocking" books.
Bad idea.
Posted by: Hank Fox | January 17, 2008 1:54 PM
Hey, Pullman on CD is still allowed. Is there less danger of catching the atheism that way?
But it's great that Abunga is providing this service, since now I can be reasonably sure that any books in their database are all safe and appropriate family entertainment, right?
Posted by: windy | January 17, 2008 1:59 PM
Hank Fox, we're damned if we do and damned if we don't so we might as well have some giggles while we can :) Then again, there is no way the bible can be considered family friendly, at least not if you actually read it, so we are doing them a favour and only 'thinking of the children'.
Posted by: John Phillips, FCD | January 17, 2008 2:11 PM
I have a suspicion this thing is going to backfire. One of the christians who scan this blog is going to tip them off, and the whole thing will blow up and atheists in general and PZ in particular is going to take the fire.
That said, good work so far. You guys are nuts. Banned O'Reilly, Hannity, Behe, Wells, Dembski, Bibles, Left Behind, etc etc etc, are currently outpacing banned Jerry Garcia and Golden Compass by about 11 to 1.
Posted by: JakeS | January 17, 2008 2:11 PM
Yeah, I tried to ban CS Lewis but I couldn't find any of his books. You guys rock. It's getting to the point where there isn't much left to ban that I'd want to ban. :)
Posted by: Ric | January 17, 2008 2:15 PM
raven writes:
Banning books? Bunch of amateurs. Real fanatics burn books.
Bad for carbon emissions. Nowadays proper thing is to compost them, I suppose.
Posted by: Marcus Ranum | January 17, 2008 2:24 PM
Empowered Decency Indeed!
Posted by: RMH | January 17, 2008 2:26 PM
MAJeff:
Jeff, isn't that the place over on Needham Street in Newton? My mom used to take me there when I was a kid (before we moved outside 128 when I was eleven) on those days when we had money to spend on books. I loved that place. I also loved the new public library the city put up there on Walnut (?) Street. (Walnut and Lowell?) Well, whatever - it was a 5 or 10 minute walk from our house. :-)
Posted by: Kseniya | January 17, 2008 2:31 PM
LMFAO @ the category: censorship
http://abunga.com/?d=category&category=POL039000
Posted by: Kyle | January 17, 2008 2:34 PM
Jeff, isn't that the place over on Needham Street in Newton?
Yeah. The overall organization of the place takes some getting used to. The remainders room is so much fun, though. Now that I don't have a car, it's no longer convenient to get to, but when I did, I would make a straight line for that back room and skip all the regular priced stuff.
The basement of the Harvard Book Store in Harvard Square on Mass Ave is fun, as is MacIntyre and Moore in Davis Square (which is close to where I teach, and therefore the most convenient for me).
In Minneapolis I would always hit (and still do if I can) Magers and Quinn in Uptown.
Posted by: MAJeff | January 17, 2008 2:35 PM
To all those who are concerned about this backfiring please note the reason folks here are doing this. It's a protest, not a book burning.
Speaking as a librarian who deals with the demands for book bannings from enthusiastic christians I find this entirely appropriate. My typical response to a demand for removal of a book is to order anther copy.
Posted by: Hypatia | January 17, 2008 2:36 PM
It's got a pretty impressive set of offerings, really. I wonder if they're just floating atop Amazon or some other bookstore. For example, I quickly located some of my literary favorites like
The 120 Days of Sodom, by the Marquis De Sade
Fanny Hill, by John Cleland
les Fleurs du Mal, by Baudelaire
Missing, presumed banned:
Story of O, by Pauline Reage
The Claiming of Sleeping Beauty, Roquelaure (Rice)
Why I am not a Christian, Betrand Russell
...
Posted by: Marcus Ranum | January 17, 2008 2:36 PM
I'm pretty sure they're just reselling and marking up for their "service"
Posted by: Kyle | January 17, 2008 2:38 PM
For those commenters who think this is a bad idea: I disagree.
See, it's not the big scary atheists that are banning the books in that store, it's still the operators of the store actually doing the blocking/banning.
This little exercise should just be an exercise in the problem with letting a bunch of people decide to censor stuff. Because when it comes right down to it, everything is offensive to at least a small group of people. If you let that type of thinking run your life, you get exactly what you deserve.
See, the big scary evil atheist, well....secular, bookstores will still carry the buybull, O-Liar, Coultergeist, et. al. Those of us who believe in the precepts of freedom of speech and print will continue to make money since 'we' don't censor even the dipshits that support censorship.
I'm pretty sure most fundibots are immune to the irony of this position, but I say, keep it up, get them to ban every book they carry.
Cheers.
Posted by: Fastlane | January 17, 2008 2:38 PM
Okay banning books you don't agree with is stupid but banning The Official Scrabble Players Dictionary. How exactly could that offend someone?
Posted by: uselessstwit | January 17, 2008 2:39 PM
How exactly could that offend someone?
Game of chance? (depends on which letters you draw?)
Posted by: MAJeff | January 17, 2008 2:41 PM
Al's breakfast..... that brings back some good memories.
Posted by: Russell | January 17, 2008 2:42 PM
Left Behind has now been, um, left behind. :)
Posted by: s1mplex | January 17, 2008 2:43 PM
Exactly. All we are doing is using their site in the way that all those god-fearers are. Nowhere do they proclaim their site to be "Christian", just "family". Well, maybe there are some differing ideas of what should be considered "family-friendly".
Sort of like that presidential poll the other day. If they put it on the internet, they can't control who votes in it. Same applies here, only more so. Although it would be hilarious if they decided to screen potential members with some sort of ideological test.
Posted by: Rey Fox | January 17, 2008 2:44 PM
Hypatia, good point. I don't feel so edgy about it now.
It IS a protest, a little bit of push-back against the ages of conservative and Christian book-banning from school and public LIBRARIES.
And since this is not a public library, but a private business which INVITES people to "block" books, maybe it's not as bad as I first thought.
And I'll bet everyone here would vehemently protest the REAL removal of books from public access.
I might fantasize about setting fire to Bill O'Reilly's falafel collection, and then dousing the flames with George Bush's drool, but books ... no way.
Posted by: Hank Fox | January 17, 2008 2:47 PM
With enough accounts, and enough diapprovals, they won't have a bookstore... Mwa ha ha ha ha ha HA HA HA HA!!!!
Posted by: Moses | January 17, 2008 2:47 PM
Marcus @ 54: Damn, you're one kinky dude.
Posted by: Ric | January 17, 2008 2:47 PM
"Avenue Victor Hugo" was a great Boston used book store.
Too bad they closed their store front and went totally online.
Posted by: spurge | January 17, 2008 2:48 PM
Do I understand how the site works?
Just one request for bananation will remove the ability to buy a book?
With no over site?
WTF is wrong with them?
Posted by: spurge | January 17, 2008 2:50 PM
Hank, if there was any actual banning or burning going on, I'd be right there with you, but I think Fastlane (#56) got it exactly right. The fact that the lesson (what can happen when a precedent for banning is set and your point of view subsequenty slips into minority standing) will be lost on them, but what the hell. At least there'll be a lesson to point out. Maybe someone will get it.
Posted by: Kseniya | January 17, 2008 2:52 PM
Do you think we just doubled the number of books banned?
Posted by: Mercurious | January 17, 2008 2:54 PM
Wait a second, I just went to the site and got these back as results:
http://abunga.com/?d=search&keywords=His+Dark+Materials
am I missing something? Or is their filter really that bad?
Posted by: G | January 17, 2008 2:57 PM
I cooled down too once I realized that all books there, regardless of their content, are eventually being banned, and that it was a protest of the system. It's not the counter-banning fiasco (where we would lose the moral ground) that I was worried about. I am still concerned that fundies are going to be hollering that PZ unleashed his barbarian hordes out to ban bibles, but on the other hand they hate atheists anyway for just existing. Screw them.
Posted by: JakeS | January 17, 2008 2:58 PM
Major hysterical laughter!!!!! They sell child porn!!!
Ok... well, maybe not exactly, but..
"David Hamilton, 25 years of an artist" has a lot of nice family friendly photos of underaged girls...
And they have a great selection of Jock Sturges's books of family friendly nudity. "Radiant Identities" and "The Last Days of Summer"
I just ordered a copy through them of "La Danse" by Hamilton... I need to see if it's got lots of naked little ballerinas in it so I can decide whether or not to ban it. I love doing research!!!! And I added a Jock Sturges book, too. And a copy of De Sade - why not? Let's see how long it takes to arrive.
Posted by: Marcus Ranum | January 17, 2008 2:58 PM
Dirty words:
Penis
Anal
Sex
Priest
Choir
Boy
Catholic
League
Bill
Donahoe
Posted by: Moses | January 17, 2008 3:00 PM
If you block a book it just never appears on that individual customer's account.
It takes an unspecified number of blocks for total removal.
Posted by: Don | January 17, 2008 3:02 PM
I'm imagining a rolling counter on the Abunga home page, counting up from 65,000 in real time ... kind of like the inverse of when the bad guy in the Western shoots up the place and then decrements the "Population" count on the sign outside the town ...
Posted by: Kampar | January 17, 2008 3:02 PM
ric @#64
My problem, if it is one, is that I am insatiably curious instantly if someone tells me something is off-limits. I grew up in an academic family and had pretty much unfettered access to any book I could lift. And, I kept hearing about "banned books" and such and would immediately go check to see whether they were especially cool, or something.
I read Joinville's journals of the crusades the same summer I read Justine and I can tell you which one did me more psychological violence. But I bet you can guess.
Posted by: Marcus Ranum | January 17, 2008 3:06 PM
ric @#64
Marcus @ 54: Damn, you're one kinky dude.
...I do admit, though, that Betrand Russell is mighty steamy.
Posted by: Marcus Ranum | January 17, 2008 3:10 PM
We have an interesting problem in Canada when the 'Chapters' range of book stores make choices on which books to carry. It's their choice, I suppose, but since they're basically the only suppliers of books any more, it approaches censorship.
You see the same thing with the purchasing power of WalMart and its (not so) indirect effect on video games and movies. Things simply don't get produced if the publishers primary distribution channel won't carry them.
The claim that "we don't stop other stores from carry the product" is really starting to fall apart.
Posted by: Frac | January 17, 2008 3:17 PM
Frac,
With the huge increase in internet sales that will become less and less of a problem. Someone somewhere WILL sell it. It wouldn't surprise me much though if the "parent" company of the seller would actually be one who wouldn't want it in their main.
Posted by: Mercurious | January 17, 2008 3:28 PM
From the site:
We remove broad classifications of illicit materials by the information classifications set by the publisher. Currently, over 65,000 books are eliminated from our available inventory to protect your family.
I think I'm missing something here. With other online booksellers, is there any way for a book to arrive at your home other than you (or the other responsible adult with a credit card) actually purchasing it?
Or is the protection here simply about not even hearing the names of "those" books?
(What gets me is this ... why don't they just simply come out and say they're a Christian bookstore? A simple glance at their featured books confirms that.)
Posted by: Rick at shrimp and grits | January 17, 2008 3:32 PM
Hey, O/T but important:
Minnesota Department of Education deep-sixes ID/Creationism or any attempt at same or similar.
Posted by: Phoenix Woman | January 17, 2008 3:34 PM
Now it looks like some of Ken Hamm's books have been blocked. Rats.
Posted by: Ipecac | January 17, 2008 3:34 PM
I'm still waiting for the hails of hearty laughter over Comment # 29.
I thought it was my best in days.
Posted by: Hank Fox | January 17, 2008 3:35 PM
Libraries and librarians are the other favorite target of fundies. They like to try to get books banned and librarians fired. As another poster said, unless these people have someone to hate, they are lost.
Our public library periodically displays the latest in banned books with the slogan, Read a Banned Book Today!
I haven't seen any fundie Xians standing around performing exorcisms but who knows, maybe they come in the morning.
Posted by: raven | January 17, 2008 3:37 PM
I wouldn't be shocked to hear that this group randomly goes through and "unbans" whatever books they like. I mean hey, if you're enough of a control freak to set up an abomination like this, you can't be too far from other acts of hypocrisy and shamelessness.
Nevertheless, best to err on the side of caution and ban with abandon.
Posted by: Michael X | January 17, 2008 3:37 PM
Frac, let me introduce you to this wonderful thing called the Intarwebs. Seriously, my spouse and I purchase books all the time, but we only occasionally rely on brick-and-mortar Chapters in T.O. to get them. With the Canadian and US Amazon, Chapters online, and websites like Powells and Alibris, if a book is available anywhere, you can pretty much buy it and get it sent to you in Canada.
Posted by: Tulse | January 17, 2008 3:38 PM
A bookstore whose customers vote to ban books? That's outrageous! I vote we ban their website from the internet.
Posted by: Epistaxis | January 17, 2008 3:38 PM
rick and shrimp and grits writes:
why don't they just simply come out and say they're a Christian bookstore?
I'm not so sure they are... They sell HR Giger's "Necronomicon" Vol I and II. I think they may be Cthulhu cultists. I wish there was a way to propose it as a feature. I has some great stuff.
And if you search for "spaghetti" you'll find a book with a rather provocative cover illustration...
http://abunga.com/?d=product&productid=9781425947309
If that's not the FSM right on the cover, I'm Yog-Sothoth.
Posted by: Marcus Ranum | January 17, 2008 3:43 PM
I just registered as Beelze Bub and blocked the bible and ID books, Dembski in particular. If we all do similar, we could make a big difference.
And yes, I'm aware of the irony and internal contradiction, but I just couldn't resist.
Posted by: Paul | January 17, 2008 3:45 PM
Marcus@ 75
Who am I kidding? I've read all those too. :)
Posted by: Ric | January 17, 2008 3:57 PM
"it's not an opportunity for them to relax and enjoy their culture, but a reason to suppress minority views."
Sadly,