Pharyngula

It is absurd!!! That's actually what I'm trying to show in my blog 'Blogging the NT'(http://bloggingthent.blogspot.com) ...

Posted by: Daldianus | January 20, 2008 4:57 PM

hey, where'd the link go?

http://thegodofbiscuitsgospel.blogspot.com/2007/11/this-is-just-begging-for-eddie-izzard.html

Posted by: MAJeff | January 20, 2008 5:02 PM

Thank God, who was James Mason, for Eddie Izzard.

Posted by: Matt Heath | January 20, 2008 5:07 PM

Gotta love Eddie. Great James Mason voice btw.

Best God in a film?

Hands down; Ralph Richardson in 'Time Bandits'. Bumbling, twinkly, forgetful, a 'little slap-dash but heart in the right place' kind of fellow. Inspired.

Posted by: AllanW | January 20, 2008 5:13 PM

You gonna make me delurk for this one, aincha?

Nah, the Bible's other true value is that it allows all of you to feel so SUPERIOR. And what would you do without that? ;)

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 5:21 PM

Jeff, it's the elitism and constant stench of superiority that is offensive. I'm a lefty. If you're a right-winger, then it makes sense you think you have the right to diss people for whatever reason (religious belief or lack of it included), since you feel you are superior and it's therefore justified. Otherwise, I don't get it.

The content of the video doesn't offend me, I watch South Park, et al.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 5:53 PM

And Jeff, yeah, it may be ridiculous... but not nearly as ridiculous as obsessing over something I claim I don't believe in, as you do.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 5:55 PM

Just so much comedy potential.

Ricky Gervais enjoys it too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaEj3g5GOYA&feature=related

Posted by: John Waterman | January 20, 2008 5:56 PM

Oops, I mean thanks *TO* GrrlScientist. I was giving the credit, not impersonating.

Posted by: Cath | January 20, 2008 5:57 PM

"People Who Don't Want Their Beliefs Laughed at Shouldn't Have Such Funny Beliefs"

GrrlScientist, you mean like believing in spelling words all cutesy and hip and trendy like "Grrrl"? Good point. I'll make a point not to laugh, but usually I do.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:00 PM

OMFG, Daisy is a Paul-bot!!! Hey, Daisy, after Paul loses the primary, draft him for an independent run! The right needs its Nader.

Posted by: Moses | January 20, 2008 6:10 PM

Somebody doesn't know how to read. I voted strategically for Ron Paul. As stated previously, I'm a lefty.

Moses, I hope your "science" isn't like your reading comprehension.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:13 PM

Jim, are you saying all religion inevitably leads to these things? Can you prove this hypothesize?

Because I think that is an emotional appeal, as groundless as saying "All atheists are immoral/amoral," blah blah blah...

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:16 PM

Allan, I don't feel persecuted at all. Are you kidding? I live in SOUTH CAROLINA! I wouldn't mind yall winning a few, (or a LOT!), in this neck of the woods. I just don't think your superior attitude is the way to accomplish that.

I've just put up with Mike Huckabee, et al. babbling away that the elites would like to silence believers and all that populist stuff right out of WHAT'S THE MATTER WITH KANSAS. Then I come here and I see people, yes, bragging about how smart they are and how dumb the believers are. Just what he said. ugh.

I don't think that's the way to go about it, which is why I brought up the matter of false consciousness, and another possible approach.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:22 PM

Let's think about a class analysis, and draw an analogy from it.

There are two major classes in society, let's call them faith-heads and free-thinkers. The faith-heads are the dominant class, indeed the prominence of the belief in belief, the continual offense taken when the "common sense" of the existence of god is questioned or ridiculed, points to the hegemonic position that the ruling class's ideas enjoy. Indeed when we note that this "common sense" obscures the nature of reality and justify the maintenance of a system of oppression toward free-thinkers, indeed when we utilize one of the tools of the oppressed class, the tool of ridicule, well, people get very fussy indeed.

Finally, on a different note. This is not the only thing many of us do with our lives. The so-called "obsession" is one interest among many for a lot of us. It just so happens that this site has developed a public surrounding that issue in particular, and many of us who gather here like to talk about that. I do a lot of shit outside the virtual world, and it covers a lot of different fields of social and political action. Don't assume this is the only thing any of us do.

Posted by: MAJeff | January 20, 2008 6:30 PM

Allen, well thanks for understanding. Too many Republicans will do it to you. If you haven't read WHAT'S THE MATTER WITH KANSAS, check it out. One of it's themes is about the popular perception among poor/working class people that "the elites" are atheist and/or secular, and how the Republicans have successfully capitalized on that.

Jeff, your analysis/analogy may be the most amazing hyper-educated-upper-class-American-white-man statement I've heard all day, since Huckabee and company left town. Hope you don't mind if I quote you?

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:42 PM

Raven, I know all that, thanks. You didn't have to type all that.

Seriously though, I am probably one of only a few people here who has actually received *real threats* from fundies. I think it's possible they hate (people they regard as) heretics more than they hate you, but I won't argue the point.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:47 PM

Um, I think so. Gramsci was a very short but handsome Italian dude who wrote letters from jail, and Karl Marx was the perpetually unemployed son of a clergyman whose wife mostly supported him, right?

(See--why do you have to be so condescending? That's what I'm talking about!)

Your analogy ignores the actual oppressed people of the world, you know, in places like Mauritius and Uganda...and well, I momentarily found it amazing. Gramsci, indeed.

As I said, may I quote you?

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 6:52 PM

As I said, may I quote you?

Glad you enjoyed. I was laughing the entire time I wrote it. But there is something underneath it. Belief is special. Leave it alone. Shut up atheists. Again and again and again....

And I know about class and being poor. I can feel the boston winter through my walls. Fuck off.

Posted by: MAJeff | January 20, 2008 6:59 PM

well off

You know shit.

Posted by: MAJeff | January 20, 2008 7:01 PM

Ohhh, Mr Logician, you just failed the Turing Test. I wondered when the southern stuff would start. Can't you do any better than that? Inbred? Wow, how original. That is the FIRST TIME I've ever heard any southern-inbreeding jokes in the whole ten years I've been online!

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 7:07 PM

And you, Daisy Mae, failed the truth test.

Feeling a bit insecure over your own stupidity? Have to snark at those who are obviously your betters? Poor, persecuted Daisy Mae, so put upon by the 'fundies' she has to hassle grad students in Minnesota.

You're just another jack-off troll, so full of shit you have to spew north to get enough breathing room. None of your pronouncements are true. They ring just off center enough to reveal you as just another moron trying to best your betters.

Feel a little put out by your elitist betters? You should, dumbass.

Posted by: Logician | January 20, 2008 7:16 PM

"If you are truly stupid enough to believe in that poorly plagarized piece of shit you call the bible,"

It's spelled "plagiarized"... and I may be stupid, but I do know how to use spellcheck.

When I referred to the elitists, I referred to the EDUCATED people here. Obviously, not a 14-year-old who can't spell and still resorts to southern jokes. Exempt yourself, okay?

Why am I supposed to honor grad students in Minnesota, because they are all above-average? Huh? What are you talking about?

Is this what passes for "logicians" around here?

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 7:23 PM

Jeff, so your analogy was not made in (pardon expression) good faith? What did you mean then, when you said atheists were oppressed?

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 7:25 PM

Side musing:
What is it about academia that brings the rabid froth to the mouths of people like Daisy, anyway? Full-time, I make significantly less than most of my students will right after they graduate, and less than over half of them do now while they're in school (we have lots of nontrads on my campus). People like MAJeff who adjunct make less money than people who work at McDonald's. I know high school teachers who still qualified for food stamps while employed full-time as teachers. Where on earth does the idea of a well-off academician come from?

Posted by: Carlie | January 20, 2008 7:31 PM

Hey, Daisy Mae, stop trolling, you're make-up is cracking and you're disappointing your brother.

If you are truly as persecuted as you claim, which we all know is bullshit, give us some examples. And don't pull that "I'll be found out!" shit. If you won't give any examples, which we also know you can't, we'll know you're full of shit, (a foregone conclusion, but hey, since you're playing the pathetic inbred victim, we'll let you drown yourself in your own shit).

In case your trainer/handler hasn't noticed, this comment section was about Eddie Izzard, not about inbred hillbillies, so why not go back to making babies with your brother, eh?

Posted by: Logician | January 20, 2008 7:32 PM

Um, excuse me, but I only 'bitched and moaned' when Jeff said my reports of threats against me were bullshit. I assure you, they are not.

I did not say they were bullshit. I said that I, too, had received them.

Posted by: MAJeff | January 20, 2008 7:34 PM

Carlie, just curious, who are "people like Daisy"? Is this just a polite way to call me inbred, or what?

I'm rabid? I guess you missed Logician, then?

(So, is he a regular? Is he the resident pit bull? Is that why everything he says is okay with all of you?)

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 7:40 PM

Wow. Quite a bit of fun watching a mere Eddie Izzard clip go that far afield.

Daisy, I have yet to see anyone here acting "SUPERIOR," so please feel free to point them out to me. Yes, I do indeed see a lot of people pointing out stupidity, just like everywhere else in the world - if that's supposed to be your act of superiority, well, then, guilty as charged, along with 99.999% of the human population, and some of the robots. You've got your work cut out for you.

If you think that the respectful, let-me-help-you-see-the-flaws-in-the-logic approach is the proper way, you've missed a few thousand years of human history where this simply does not work. If the vast majority of humans could handle rationality, we wouldn't have any of those things we call stupid in the first place.

And yet, right here in the land of the smug & superior, you have people engaging you in honest discussion. I haven't seen anyone call you stupid. Or evil, heathen, satanist, misled, forsaken, or self-righteous, smug, superior, and all the others that you see should an atheist dare talk sense on a loving, kindly, we-are-all-brothers crisschin blog. 'Cause we persecute them so badly, doncha know.

So, what is the level of stupidity one has to reach before the political-correctness police will allow you to recognize it as stupid? Or are you going to argue that it serves some purpose to treat nonsense as sense? Because surely then the stupid will see for themselves how stupid they're being... wait...

And for someone who claims to have been threatened by a fundie for your views, you seem to find it horribly oppressive to be forced to read a few remarks on a blog. What, does someone have you strapped into some kind of Clockwork Orange blog-washing rig? Does your mouse-clicking finger have a boo-boo?

But hey, you've already demonstrated all I need to see, with your lovely, insightful, and respectful analysis of, "hyper-educated-upper-class-American-white-man." Thanks for your guidance on behavior! Always refreshing to see someone willing to drag us out of the muck we get ourselves into. Please, show us more light from the ways of the non-superior!

;-)

Posted by: Just Al | January 20, 2008 7:46 PM

Holy shit, Daisy! Do you have a persecution complex, or what? Please tell me anything in my post that even insinuated that I was trying to slur your ethnicity, regional background, or family history.

It was somewhat of a circular reference - I was asking a question regarding people who have the mistaken belief that academics are financially well-off, and using you as example A since you had just brought it up. The implied descriptive finish to the sentence "...of people like Daisy" was "who make comments like that regarding how well-off academics are". I didn't think it was necessary to be so wordy, because it should have been apparent in context what I meant, but I guess I need to spell it out for you explicitly so that you don't get the wrong idea, because you're one of those people who see secret insults wherever you look.

Posted by: Carlie | January 20, 2008 7:48 PM

[Cue the frothing rant now, which may have already begun]

Meanwhile, back on something even remotely resembling the original blog post, that is simply the best imitation of a giraffe I've ever seen.

Okay, I suspect it's the only imitation of a giraffe I've ever seen, but still...

Posted by: Just Al | January 20, 2008 7:54 PM

Just Al, are you being funny?

"And yet, right here in the land of the smug & superior, you have people engaging you in honest discussion. I haven't seen anyone call you stupid."

I guess you don't count "shit-kicking moron," "jack-off troll," "try to rise above the shit pit of your surroundings," being called a liar and the injunction to take my inbred ass back to Dogpatch?

Are you reading the same thread I am?

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 7:55 PM

Jeff, in that case, my apologies.

I want to accept it, but I'm hesitant. And I'll tell you why.

There are very many people here who have themselves escaped from the very traditions you're fighting. I didn't come from Southern Baptist, but from Christian Reformed (my sister--a Methodist minister--calls them Dutch Southern Baptists; all the rules but none of the emotions). So, a lot of us are coming from a position of having thrown off all the nonsense, and honestly, you need to understand how liberatory this shit can be (aside from, the very silly, very funny things we come up with based on these stories--even if they weren't blasphemous, you've got some people who are creative with language and just have fun...these things meld together).

You may feel out of place (I head this far too much) because the fundies aren't the type of christian you want to be, but we nasty atheists don't seem to want you either.

We all have and continue to work with religious people on a regular basis--in our work lives, in our political lives, in our volunteer lives, in our family lives. Many of us keep our mouths shut most of the time, politely smiling while thinking, "Oy, not again."

Then, when we get a space where we can, 1) say what we really think; 2) have fun with it, and when that space consistently gets invaded by people complaining about us doing it, we get fussy. Particularly when you make such assumptions about things. Yeah, I teach college and am working on a PhD. Economic conditions (housing costs, health care costs--particularly mental health and dental care, but even having to pay for a dislocated elbow out of pocket or emergency dental care to fill a hole in my tooth--twice in two years in the same tooth--loan debt, etc) are well known to me. When people start going off on my class politics...I've probably spent an equal amount of time as a secretary as a teacher. I've been evicted because the wiring in the illegal apartment I was living in (again, only rent i could afford) went haywire. Yeah, I teach and I speak like an academic. I'm living far from well. And that also drove me over the edge. You've got a lot of people here, from a lot of backgrounds. Some of us are academics. Some of use are not. We occupy a lot of socio-economic locations. But, again, we have to shut up about one of the reasons we come together in this particular discursive space.

Posted by: MAJeff | January 20, 2008 7:59 PM

Oooo, quoting a singing slut, now? Aren't we ever just the surprise?

A sexist pig, also! Aren't we ever just the surprise! Yes, I can readily see how ENLIGHTENED you are, all right!

I guess you'd probably fit in real well with the Bob Jones crowd--they call her a slut, too! Can't tell you apart without a scorecard! (Doesn't that embarrass you at all?)

Actually, no. Again, Daisy Mae, you had ANOTHER chance to SHOW us the EVIDENCE of your persecution (not simply obliquely hint at)and you instead quote a singer PROUD to be an ignorant bitch.

Get the hell out of here, you trolling liar.

Now come on, no matter how smart you are, you couldn't have read my whole St Stephen thread THAT FAST!

Carlie, and you really think I'm the frothing one here? Really?

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 8:04 PM

Ich, I was quoting what one of your comrades refers to as a "singing slut"... I'm learning all about how smart the atheists are, how enlightened, how morally superior, etc.

Seriously, is sexist language like that acceptable here? I see that bigoted language based on origin and ethnicity is. What else is allowed? Anything goes?

See, maybe that is what people are afraid of, Social Darwinism, not just Darwinism. This is what I heard the GOP saying all week.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 8:08 PM

Anything goes?

yup.

you started it, now finish it.

your armor doesn't appear to be all that thin to me, though it is camouflaged a bit.

Posted by: Ichthyic | January 20, 2008 8:14 PM

Jeff, absolutely true, no question, that an atheist could never be elected here, as Romney also didn't make a dent. I think it would be regarded as the same. (Well, should say, they simply couldn't be "out" as an atheist. I'm sure there have been a few we didn't know about.)

Carlie and Jeff, there are different types of elites. People who have a lot of money and property think they are superior for these reasons, while people who are good-looking or athletic think they are superior for THOSE reason. Etc. And people who are well educated believe THAT makes them superior. Education is the arena that children are exposed to first, and would be the reason that Huckabee & Co. would consider well-educated academics the "elite"--they appear to control the educational framework and curriculum. Whether they really do, as you point out, is a good question.

They have obviously convinced the Baptists, since a huge number (locally) homeschool or send their kids to the junior Bob Jones (or affiliated) schools.

Posted by: Daisy | January 20, 2008 8:23 PM

they appear to control the educational framework and curriculum. Whether they really do, as you point out, is a good question.

do you personally think well educated people shouldn't control the educational framework?

Posted by: Ichthyic | January 20, 2008 8:34 PM

Actually, Daisy Mae, I find I must apologize.

You are not a xian troll, I was wrong about that. After reading your blog, I find that no, you're not a xian, just a wasted old hippie who doesn't know WHAT the shit she believes: "On drugs, herbs, antidepressants, addiction, mothers and other things..."

Nothing to be proud of, in any case. For those of us smart enough NOT to burn ourselves out with drugs, yes, we DO find fundies funny, and drugged out feel-good nipple-rubbing herbalists even funnier. Like, wow, babe, did you REALLY see the WHOLE universe?

After 47 years of dealing with you idiots who thought doing drugs would give you an 'edge' and people stupid enough to believe in an invisible sky god I've lost any patience with handling you with anything but disgust.

Do you REALLY think quoting a nasty ole piece of trailer trash makes you BETTER than those who haven't burned their bodies out with drugs?

Posted by: Logician | January 20, 2008 8:37 PM

I guess you don't count "shit-kicking moron," "jack-off troll," "try to rise above the shit pit of your surroundings," being called a liar and the injunction to take my inbred ass back to Dogpatch?

Are you reading the same thread I am?

Well, considering that roughly 18 posts were made while I typed mine, most of them yours, no, I'm not reading the same thread you are. But then again, you've done nothing in any of them to contradict the point I made in mine about your exemplary behavior. Um, this is you, right?

Jeff, excuse me, you knock it off. You are educated, well off and work safely in a fucking IVORY TOWER. Are they coming after your job? No. Do they have the power to get you fired? No. Do they control the political climate and the city counsel, senate, congress, state and county government where you LIVE? No. Have they gotten you audited? Have they gotten you fired? Have they gotten you evicted? Have they slashed your tires? If not, STFU. I DO know what I am talking about, sir. I am talking about co-workers and my LIVELIHOOD. I am a WORKING CLASS PERSON and I can't just point and jeer at the fundies, they CONTROL a great deal of my families' resources. I have to work with them and live next to them. They are my BOSSES. Are they yours?

As for "I want the atheists to shut up"--oh cut the victimization narrative, Mr Spoiled College Professor. Want some cheese with that whine?

I think I made a point in my post about how stupid something has to be to permit being called stupid. Was this supposed to be an example?

So, is that your only answer to mine? Or would you like to address how you came in here to show us all how to behave?

Oh, wait, I'm sorry - you said no such thing. You only wanted us not to behave that way. But it's okay for you, it seems. It sure is convincing to me.

Like I said, thanks for the input. But in the interests of saying something positive, I will admit that your posts are entertaining in the amount of hypocrisy and total lack of focus, more than most of the posters here. You have indeed separated yourself from the crowd!

Posted by: Just Al | January 20, 2008 10:00 PM