Pharyngula

The snakes are probably a confirming sign

Sorry, California. After the plague of migratory, mammal-eating pythons, we now have independent testimony that God doesn’t like you.

God is disgusted with California legislators – at least some of them, according to an evangelical chaplain who ruffled feathers this week in the same Capitol where he leads Bible studies for lawmakers.

No, I don’t accept his personal claims about the desires of the Great Cosmic Poobah, but the evidence from the situation that 1) this bozo gets paid $120,000/year to evangelize to politicians, and 2) weepy-eyed politicians are stumbling all over themselves to reassure the electorate that God does too like them. You lose whether this god exists or not.

Comments

  1. #1 Glen Davidson
    February 27, 2008

    Nah, that was me. I sent them, I don’t like Californians.

    I told you I’d get you, didn’t I?

    Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

    And Ha!

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  2. #2 Arcturus
    February 27, 2008

    What an idiot … Drolling-eeerrrr

    “What the fellowship group offers is Jesus of Nazareth, a good moral teacher who loves everyone without distinction,” Drollinger wrote on his Web site. “This is a deadly lie.

    “There is no true fellowship without first being reconciled to God,” he wrote, defining reconciliation as “repentance from sin and faith in God through the work of Jesus Christ the Messiah.”

  3. #3 Brian
    February 27, 2008

    My Darwin, the comments are intriguing. Plenty of folks slavering for the tribulation and the ETERNAL DAMNATION OF ALL YOU SINENRS WHO REJECT THE GOD OF LOVE LOVE LOVE, I TELL YOU LOVE. Oops.

  4. #4 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    Look for BlindedByScience’s comment.

    That’d be me.

  5. #5 LARA
    February 27, 2008

    Stop picking at the crazy people and eventually they will go away. They can’t help it that they are stupid and occur large numbers. Apparently human evolution seems to select for it.

  6. #6 Arcturus
    February 27, 2008

    Can’t they pray from a distance. They say it works that way too.

    It seems more that they are there to keep the legislators on a leash. From what the constitution is saying, the “capitol ministries” seem to be wasting their time. And that’s because religion shouldn’t play any role in the government, so the Jesus message is useless in that context. But of course, there is no true separation of church and state …

    It would be interesting to have some science study for the legislators. Many seem to lack understanding of basic science. You don’t want to be ruled by ignorants, do you?

    ————————–
    From their website:

    The vision of Capitol Ministries:

    The motto of Capitol Ministries is delivering the gospel to every state legislator, in every state capitol, every year. Reaching elected officials and leading them toward maturity in Christ are our primary focuses.

    Within America, we are continuing our effort to establish full-time ministries in all 50 state capitols. And in the future, we hope to impact both federal legislators in Washington D.C. and locally elected officials in city and county governments across the nation.

    In addition, we are praying that the Lord will open doors of ministry to us in the capitols of foreign nations. So, as we continue to plant new ministries in America’s state capitols, we are simultaneously working on strategies that will significantly expand our horizons.

    Lord willing, Capitol Ministries will someday reach every elected official in every nation of the world at every level of government with the uncompromised, saving message of Jesus Christ. That is our dream that is too big for us to fully grasp; but it is not too big for God to accomplish! We pray the Lord will use Capitol Ministries to reach as many political leaders with the gospel as possible, at home and abroad, in 2008 and beyond.

    In God’s heart, there is a special place for political leaders and there should be in ours too; we need your partnership in reaching them.

  7. #7 CalGeorge
    February 27, 2008

    120K a year.

    To lie to people.

    FUCK!

    Here he is on video:

    http://www.dts.edu/media/play/?MediaItemID=a2122df1-640d-46ad-9412-d6f4a30b8c7a

  8. #8 CalGeorge
    February 27, 2008

    Hardcore fucktard.

    He wants to “moralize” political leaders in all 50 states.

  9. #9 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    And, CalGeorge, it’s tax-free.

    I only point that out so I can hear you say the f-word again. Please don’t disappoint me.

  10. #10 Janine
    February 27, 2008

    Just more fun and games when some people follow through the implications of living in an one god universe. Consider this the reason why I laugh at those who try to be ecumenical, they are not taking their own faiths seriously. And why the Abrahamic religions will always be at each other throats. In the end, there can be only one. How Highlander.

  11. #11 CalGeorge
    February 27, 2008

    He feels he has a biblical mandate to evangelize political types to get them to vote “biblically”.

    He calls it “churning out the fruit.”

    This guy is a fucking menace to society.

  12. #12 CalGeorge
    February 27, 2008

    They have ministries in 21 state capitols already!

    FUCK!

  13. #13 abu el banat
    February 27, 2008

    Nobody knows my name….

    Abu el banat….father of many daughters.

    Four to be exact,

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02uMEQyMiy0

  14. #14 Vitis01
    February 27, 2008

    I can see the US picking up the “God is disgusted by tolerance” meme the same way they have embraced the “Intelligence is arrogance” meme.

  15. #15 CalGeorge
    February 27, 2008

    Listening to the video:

    Once they get 30 capitols, they’re going to “make a move on D.C.” and then go international.

    “I’ve had a legislator in California who’s been part of my staff ministry … and he won election in Fresno … and two years ago became the minority leader of the Assembly, which meant that he had a lot of power, one of the most five [five most] powerful people in the State.”

  16. #16 Dan
    February 27, 2008

    Schwarzenegger actually kicked him out of his wing of the Capitol a few years ago for that anti-Catholic rant.

    As someone around the Capitol, I always look forward (in a perverse way, I guess) to reading his topics for his Wednesday speeches. Both major Rep leaders are regular attendees.

  17. #17 Phil
    February 27, 2008

    This bombastic moron published this “woe-is-me” diatribe about how his ministry evolved around Sacramento insiders yesterday. Notice how he decries “sharing-your-thoughts” against his position as the arbiter of truth. Sorry I don’t have a link and have to post the whole thing here in text.

    Last week I delivered a special study in the California Capitol titled “A Chaplain’s Biggest Nightmare.” The study deals with a subject about which I am very passionate, that is “chaplains” or “ministers” in the political arena who shrink from declaring the truth that salvation is in Christ alone (John 14:6). This topic is not only biblically objective, in that God holds His ministers to a higher standard, but it is also subjectively real to me. Let me explain.

    When I started to minister in Sacramento more than 10 years ago, it was because I was invited to facilitate the legislators’ weekly fellowship meeting. I replaced a kind gentleman named Richard Cherry who had faithfully served in the same capacity for many years. He planned to retire and asked me to replace him.

    After a year of service, I began to summarize in writing the thoughts expressed by the legislators in their weekly, one-hour gathering regarding a particular passage of Scripture. I added additional insights from Bible commentaries to my summaries and then handed them out several days after the group discussion.

    After serving in this capacity for a year or so, one of the legislators, Assembly Member Steve Baldwin, proffered a question to the whole group. He asked something to the effect of the following: “Since Ralph seems to study out what we are discussing and provide us with accurate and informed insights into Bible passages, what do you all think about having him simply teach the group?” All of the responses that morning were positive, so I began to regularly teach the weekly study.

    About a year later, two members of the Legislators’ Bible study (as it was renamed) became increasingly disgruntled with having a Bible teacher and sought to revert to the old “fellowship only” format. They called for a meeting with all 19 regular participants in the group to vote on the matter.

    I will never forget the dinner we had in the back room of the Hungry Hunter restaurant. Although only one of the two disgruntled legislators showed up, the one who did proposed that I “facilitate” rather than “teach” the group. Nevertheless, the legislators present overwhelmingly (17 ayes to 1 no) voted to keep the group as a genuine Bible study – with a Bible teacher.

    The legislator who was the lone “no” vote was shocked, and our relationship was never the same. Soon thereafter, he and the other disgruntled legislator started their own group, going back to a subjective “share-your-thoughts” format. In the years to come, they aggressively and successfully recruited legislators from our established Bible study to join their “fellowship” group.

    Although they initially pledged not to compete with our Wednesday morning time slot, they soon scheduled their fellowship group in direct conflict with our study, claiming that I was the one “dividing” Christian community in the Capitol. The fact is that they were the dividers. When they subsequently termed out of office, they asked another legislator, who still serves in the Assembly, to lead their fellowship group.

    Unfortunately, when I visit various legislators whom I am attempting to lead to Christ, I am often faced with the reality that they are quite comfortable with the “spiritual” experience they are having in the fellowship group.

    For instance, in the past several weeks I have visited with a Jewish legislator, a Catholic legislator and a liberal Protestant legislator – all of whom reject the Jesus of Scripture and are proud of their syncretism. The fellowship group makes everyone feel okay, no matter what spiritual direction they are coming from.

    They are made to feel okay about their rejection of salvation in Christ alone. It is apparent too that these lost (spiritually speaking) legislators have been made to feel superior to me in their progressive religious tolerance. All this to say: There are woeful alternatives to the gravity of the Word of God in the Capitol.

    The leading legislator and his associates continue to mislead and provide an “alternative” spiritual experience in the California Capitol. Although they are pleasant men in their personal demeanor, their group is more than disgusting to our Lord and Savior.

    What the fellowship group offers is Jesus of Nazareth, a good moral teacher who loves everyone without distinction. This is a deadly lie. There is no true fellowship without first being reconciled to God (i.e. repentance from sin and faith in God through the work of Jesus Christ the Messiah). Then, and only then, can people experience fellowship with God and the blessing of fellowship one to another that is satisfying and God-glorifying.

    Read or listen to last week’s Bible study. It will provide you with many additional insights into this serious and sobering subject.

  18. #18 True Bob
    February 27, 2008

    So he has about a half dozen CA state legislators to influence. $20K per. shitfuckdamn

  19. #19 Arcturus
    February 27, 2008

    Isn’t this a blatant trampling of the separation of church and state?

    I can understand legislators going to church in their free time, but being indoctrinated right there in the Capitol seems extreme.

  20. #20 Doug
    February 27, 2008

    Now I know why churches are tax-exempt, it’s a tax break for hiring retards. Is there any other profession in the world where you can make hundreds of thousands of dollars without an education, no job skills and be considered completely qualified at the age of six like these kids?

    http://www.thoughttheater.com/2008/02/bbc_baby_bible_bashers_a_look_at_child_evangelists.php

  21. #21 Richard Eis
    February 27, 2008

    He’s just a prawn of the Dark Clan.

    Divide and Conquer.

  22. #22 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    #18: Ironically, he probably doesn’t even influence 6 legislators. Anyone who attends his meetings are extremely predisposed to agree with him. Basically, $120,000 tax-free to preach to the choir.

    Dammit, I wanna be a pastor. Looks as though he puts maybe 8 hours a week into his “job,” which amounts to keeping myths alive. Because it’s the moral thing to do.

    That’s your cue, CalGeorge.

    I want to see some familiar names on posts about that story at SacBee, people. I’m thinking CalGeorge might have his comment removed if he’s not careful, though…

  23. #23 Leon
    February 27, 2008

    It’s sad to see this going on here in my own state–California, of all places. It’s all happening five blocks from where I work, too…

  24. #24 Brownian, OM
    February 27, 2008

    Drollinger, in his Capitol Bible session last week, indicated that he is prepared to suffer for proclaiming what he views as God’s truth.

    Excellent! So he wishes to be a martyr, does he? I wonder how he’d prefer to go: via old-school crucifixion like the martyrs of old, or a slow death through starvation and disease, like the thousands of kids in third world countries his salary could save.

    Who wants to bet his version of ‘suffering’ doesn’t include giving up his cushy job and outrageous salary?

  25. #25 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    Leon, I feel even more indignant, because it’s happening a mere FOUR blocks from where I work.

  26. #26 Carlie
    February 27, 2008

    Doug, that kind of thing makes me incapable of saying anything other than fuckfuckfuckfuckfuckfuckfuck. That’s emotional child abuse and then some.

  27. #27 Bob L
    February 27, 2008

    Fresno and minority leader. Sounds like he is pandering to the hard right freakfest of the Republican party. Is he getting state funds to do this crap?

  28. #28 Holbach
    February 27, 2008

    Deranged drooling Drollinger; he looks like a freaking
    insane evangelist with that shit visage. I would like to
    read that one of those Burmese pythons grabbed him and was
    squeezing the crap out of him and he is yelling for his
    god to save him. That wonderful intelligent designed
    constrictor then slowly swallows the retard and there is
    one less insane fanatic. Where the hell was his god? The
    python should not be faulted for ignoring a strength
    that failed to materialized.

  29. #29 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    Phil,

    That was a blog entry…

    http://www.capmin.org/Resources/BlogItem.aspx?ItemID=45

    Folks, I believe you know what to do.

  30. #30 TedM
    February 27, 2008

    As another California resident: we have a budget problem this year, and I see a way to save $120K. Also, why is the state employing an out and out bigot? If this person is so driven, he can do this pro-bono. The more fundemental the more the money, I guess.
    Time to send some communications to our state reps.

  31. #31 Sastra
    February 27, 2008

    “The fellowship group makes everyone feel okay, no matter what spiritual direction they are coming from.”

    As long as they are coming from a “spiritual” direction, of course, and believe in God or a transcendent Higher Power/ Consciousness. Which leaves out … probably most of the readers of this particular blog, who are apparently not “okay,” even in the Everyone Welcome Ecumenical Group. And we notice that.

    When conservative Christians knock against the “God loves everyone without distinction” meme they help to promote a secular culture. You can’t make everyone happy (but the atheists) when you promote One Nation Under God. You get arguments about God, and what sorts of people are included in His Nation.

    So best to find a solution which leaves out the whole All Faiths United in Citizenship idea, keep the moral and political issues on common earthy ground — and oh, looks like now the atheists are included, too. Huh. Oh well.

    “People coming together united by a common faith in God, however you understand God” is only warm and fuzzy and inclusive if you believe in God. Frankly, I like to see them at each other’s throats now and then — or else they’re too likely to be brought together by the happy-clappy ecumenical game called “Let’s Go After The Atheists.”

  32. #32 Sastra
    February 27, 2008

    Ted M #30 wrote:

    Also, why is the state employing an out and out bigot?

    It’s not; read again. From the article:

    Drollinger, who has conducted Capitol Bible sessions for more than a decade, receives no compensation from the state. He is paid $120,000 annually by the nonprofit Capitol Ministries for evangelizing to politicians nationwide, records show.

  33. #33 Brownian, OM
    February 27, 2008

    How long before this gets removed?

    Brownian at 12:49 PM PST Wednesday, February 27, 2008 said:

    Well, Drollinger is half-right…

    He’s right that this hand-holding hippy-dippy group would be an abomination in the eyes of god, but it’s completely laughable that he thinks that his friend Jesus is watching from on high. There is only one true tripartite god, and He is Triglav. It is fortunate that He is veiled, for He is so Holy He cannot witness the evil deeds of men, and He would surely cry to witness these idol-worshippers with their crosses and trinkets. For those of you who doubt the infinite wisdom and justice of Triglav, fear not; you’ll learn the unpleasant truth soon enough.

  34. #34 Phil
    February 27, 2008

    Thanks MikeM.

    I saw in on the Morning Report…didn’t know it was a blog entry. PZ feel free to delete my lengthy post to clean up the thread if you want.

  35. #35 sublunary
    February 27, 2008

    to TedM @30

    The article says “Drollinger, who has conducted Capitol Bible sessions for more than a decade, receives no compensation from the state. He is paid $120,000 annually by the nonprofit Capitol Ministries for evangelizing to politicians nationwide, records show.”

    So thankfully he isn’t sapping state money. Though this does get rid of one arguing point when you start to bug those state reps.

    I wonder if my state has one of these Ministries… I hope not.

  36. #36 sublunary
    February 27, 2008

    Ah, beaten to the Post button by Sastra. Sorry for making a repeat point..

  37. #37 inkadu
    February 27, 2008

    Richard Ellis:

    He’s just a prawn of the Dark Clan Clam.

    Fixed.

  38. #38 WRMartin
    February 27, 2008

    I wonder if we can make it to heaven if we all hated everything exactly the way Ralphie wants?

    Holbach,
    Be sure to offer your version of a prayer if that python ever does get Ralph in his coils. Not offering any actual assistance is the ‘christianist way’, after all. Offering to pray is also the most excellent turn-around for those occasions when the faithful attempt to pester us for monetary assistance with their ‘missions trip’ fund raising. It can be short, simple, and to the point: “Please, for the love of science, go away.”

  39. #39 inkadu
    February 27, 2008

    I notice a lot of comments in the articleare, “He’s just saying what’s in the bible.” I can’t say as I can argue with them. But all religious moderates can do is wring their hands and say, “Oh my!” because they can’t speak against the bible.

  40. #40 Dan
    February 27, 2008

    I don’t think there will ever be a day where religion doesn’t disgust me in one way or another.

  41. #41 WRMartin
    February 27, 2008

    inkadu:
    The best response for “He’s just saying what’s in the bible.” and its friend, “But the bible says…” is:
    The bible says a lot of things.
    Then walk away! ;)

  42. #42 Phil
    February 27, 2008

    Good grief, PZ. You’re state Capitol Ministries director is from none other than Morris, MN.

    http://www.capmin.org/Ministries/Minnesota/Biography.aspx

  43. #43 David Marjanovi?, OM
    February 27, 2008

    Stop picking at the crazy people and eventually they will go away.

    We tried. For decades. They didn’t.

    Plan B: Laugh at them. Loudly. In public.

    claiming that I was the one “dividing” Christian community in the Capitol. The fact is that they were the dividers.

    “Mum! He’s quarrelling!!!”

    – Regular complaint by my sister about one of her brothers.

    Isn’t this a blatant trampling of the separation of church and state?

    Sure. But, hey, it’s America.

  44. #44 David Marjanovi?, OM
    February 27, 2008

    Stop picking at the crazy people and eventually they will go away.

    We tried. For decades. They didn’t.

    Plan B: Laugh at them. Loudly. In public.

    claiming that I was the one “dividing” Christian community in the Capitol. The fact is that they were the dividers.

    “Mum! He’s quarrelling!!!”

    – Regular complaint by my sister about one of her brothers.

    Isn’t this a blatant trampling of the separation of church and state?

    Sure. But, hey, it’s America.

  45. #45 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    Brownian, it didn’t take long for your comment to be removed.

    Which is sad, because it was fucking hilarious.

  46. #46 Ray M
    February 27, 2008

    MikeM: Brownian’s comment is still there. Perhaps you were looking at the blog comments, rather than the article comments (which is where Brownian posted).

  47. #47 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    Yes, I looked at the capmin blog, which would have been a far more entertaining place to put it.

    Do it, Brownian. Do it!!

  48. #48 Pierce R. Butler
    February 27, 2008

    Schwarzenegger actually kicked him out of his wing of the Capitol a few years ago for that anti-Catholic rant.

    I can only hope that (a) this describes the process literally and (b) observers recorded on video. Finally a Schwarzenegger action sequence worth watching!

  49. #49 LARA
    February 27, 2008

    David M. I know you’re right, but please forgive me for my delusions. You see I’m really depressed as of late as I recently discovered that my cells no longer believe in my existence. In fact, I don’t think they are aware of much anything at all.

  50. #50 Vitis01
    February 27, 2008

    That Capitol Ministries Blog is ripe for a treatment. When will The Be-Tentacled One give us the order to swarm??

  51. #51 MikeM
    February 27, 2008

    You know, I may have kicked this one to death by now, but just check out some of Drollinger’s other writings.

    Nine things to hate on Valentine’s Day:

    http://www.capmin.org/Resources/BlogItem.aspx?ListType=0&ItemID=33

    What kind of a sick puppy looks for things to hate on Valentine’s Day??

    I feel great about this, because I now think this ministry will face a legal challenge. How is is legal to hold these meetings on State property? And, can I attend and ask questions?

  52. #52 Ray M
    February 27, 2008

    Now, I’m just an engineer, but I think I’m reasonably proficient at maths nonetheless. In the “Valentine’s Day list of things to hate”, he says:

    There are six things which the LORD hates, yes, seven which are an abomination to Him

    OK – six, seven, whatever – but then our gifted one goes on to list NINE things that god hates.

    I guess the ability to count accurately past five is not a requirement for entry into heaven… no wonder we’re all doomed.

  53. #53 aporeticus
    February 27, 2008

    Sounds like the FFRF needs to sue somebody.

  54. #54 MAJeff
    February 27, 2008

    What kind of a sick puppy looks for things to hate on Valentine’s Day??

    As a single person, I took as my motto that old song, Love the One You’re With

    Better than being bitter.

  55. #55 MikeM
    February 28, 2008

    Okay, now they are coming after me personally.

    http://www.capmin.org/Resources/BlogItem.aspx?ListType=0&ItemID=45

    This. Is. War.

    I can’t speak for PZ, but I give you all permission to unload.

  56. #56 Sam
    February 28, 2008

    MikeM: Thanks to the power of the intertubes (as actual bibles burn my fingers), I unloaded some pithy Jeebus at ‘em.

  57. #57 Michelle
    February 28, 2008

    $120k a YEAR?! Hey, I thought that Jesus said rich people can’t go to heaven?!

    Before preaching others, preach yourself to obey your lord and savior.

  58. #58 TedM
    February 28, 2008

    Sastra #32
    Thank you for the clarification. What, become fully informed before shooting off my keyboard?

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