Pharyngula

It’s criminal to ruin the brains of children.

He definitely has some talent, though. Should I adopt his rhetorical style for my classes?

Comments

  1. #1 Joao
    April 28, 2008

    This is not a single case. There’s another quite similar in Brazil (with a little girl) and there are some videos in youtube as well.
    These videos were used here in Spain sometime ago as a demonstration of child abuse by religious fanatics.
    Shame on their parents!

  2. #2 PeteK
    April 28, 2008

    This little monkey exemplifies the anti-science that put me off theology. Your rhetoric wouldn’t be so robotic, PZ 8-)

  3. #3 RamblinDude
    April 28, 2008

    Why he’s such a good little preacher, you don’t really need the subtitles.

  4. #4 Inky
    April 28, 2008

    I’m sorry. But I think he’d make a great soccer commenter.

  5. #5 Mark
    April 28, 2008

    With all the crazy movements I was expecting him to end with “And you’ll be living in a van down by the river”

  6. #6 Greta Christina
    April 28, 2008

    I especially love the part about “God’s warmth and personal love for humanity and his sympathy for creatures, specially men.”

    Yes. The warmth, love and sympathy that causes him to drown us, starve us, give us cancer and birth defects. What a swell guy.

    Well, I should clarify. I love it, if by “love” you mean “am filled with the urge to cry until I vomit.”

  7. #7 Jason Failes
    April 28, 2008

    At least his age excuses him for having only a Grade 2 education in science…if he takes Grade 3, however, I’m sure that the Answers in Genesis people will reject him as a part of that snobby “academic elite”…

  8. #8 Theodore
    April 28, 2008

    Like a well-trained preacher, he contradicts himself. He first chastises scientists for saying life came from “nothing”. Later he says life came from “dust”. Obi-Wan has trained him well.

  9. #9 Exitus
    April 28, 2008

    #3-

    It would certainly make about as much sense without the subtitles.

    How and why can all those people sit (and probably pay) to see such a thing. I would wager quite a bit that the kid only understands about one in four words of that little speech. Sickening.

  10. #10 H.H.
    April 28, 2008

    It’s the hall packed with cheering adults that sickens me. So unthinking. So devoid of reason and the capacity for rational thought. So convinced that their ignorance is a cause for celebration. Such a waste.

  11. #11 Brownian, OM
    April 28, 2008

    I would wager quite a bit that the kid only understands about one in four words of that little speech.

    So, Exitus, are you saying that his typical audience member understands more than one word in four, or less? Without further study, I think it could go either way.

  12. #12 Raynfala
    April 28, 2008

    Awww… lookit the little parrot. Can he say “Polly desea un saltine”, too?

    Sheesh…

  13. #13 Alex G.
    April 28, 2008

    This is proof that not only can you be born mentally retarded, you can be raised mentally retarded as well.

  14. #14 Jritter
    April 28, 2008

    Why is it more appealing to come from dust than nothing? I guess you could call it a step up.

  15. #15 Mus
    April 28, 2008

    >>“they believe this because a few little men, liars, “all-knowing” and fallacy inventors say it.”

    Says the little, “all-knowing”, fallacy repeater man. At least you can’t really call him a liar… yet…

  16. #16 bernarda
    April 28, 2008

    I think I have already reported on Marjoe Gortner, but here is the documentary he made about his experiences as a child preacher.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSdI8ag1k0A

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6O0p4ZDnDoQ

  17. #17 Exitus
    April 28, 2008

    I agree with you there Brownian. I am forced to assume that whoever actually wrote the speech understands it, or at least is good a picking suitable words out of the dictionary. The audience however? Hmnn…

    Is it ethical to experiment on Christians?

  18. #18 MS
    April 28, 2008

    Marjoe made his movie in vain, it would seem.

  19. #19 Brownian, OM
    April 28, 2008

    Is it ethical to experiment on Christians?

    God does it all the time. What was the Book of Job if not a single subject longitudinal study?

  20. #20 Lorax
    April 28, 2008

    I hate to make fun of a little kid, but watch the video with the sound off. The antics of this kid when he is shouting I am not a monkey….I am reminded of The Simpson’s episode parodying a creation-evolution trial and Homer’s antics trying to open a recalcitrant beer.

  21. #21 ThirdMonkey
    April 28, 2008

    *sigh* So much confusion. Don’t these people even read their own book?
    Chapters 1 and 2 of Genesis are two completely different and contradictory creation myths.
    In Chapter 1 mankind is made in God’s image as the final piece of creation.
    In Chapter 2 Adam is made from mud (and not necessarily in God’s image) before the plants and the rest of the animals (with Eve being the final piece of creation).
    However, the fundies regularly confuse the two stories or choose whichever best suits their needs at the time.
    Ben Stein has shown distain for the idea that Man is just “lucky mud”. But Chapter 2 says that Man is just that.
    They say that man was made in the image of the Gods (in Chapter 1 “Let’s make him in our image, our likeness”) but that is arguably contradicted in Chapter 2.
    I’m so confused…

  22. #22 Joe
    April 28, 2008

    I don’t know what’s scarier about that video: the bat-shit crazy kid, or the fact that there’s a room of a 1,000 people all hanging on his every word

  23. #23 Exitus
    April 28, 2008

    Good point. And of course, if God does it it must be ethical.

    Hang on while I go and find my christian house-mate…

  24. #24 LightningRose
    April 28, 2008

    O.M. Brown #19,

    The Book of Job chronicles a bet bet between Yahweh and Lucifer. Since a bet is pointless if the outcome is known to both parties, this proves that Yaweh is not omnipotent.

  25. #25 Corey
    April 28, 2008

    “Some modern theologians and scientists have tried to destroy God’s warmth and personal love for humanity.”

    Really, the theologians are the bad guys too? I sincerely hope they are, because if they lose their delusions, the flock will have little choice but to follow suit. (wishful thinking).

  26. #26 Kitty
    April 28, 2008

    10 days ago BBC Radio 4 aired a documentary about 3 of your very own child evangelists – Torey Fountain, Jared Sawyer and Akiane Kramarik.
    I’ve obviously lead a real ivory tower existence as this was my first exposure to this horror.
    This is child indoctrination on a par with the Muslim fundamentalist schools.
    Do we expect these little (Christian) soldiers to fight the god (sic) fight equally as fervently? Or is this just another manifestation of the lunatic fringe?

  27. #27 Hattie
    April 28, 2008

    A quick note: I’m glad you are taking this on. Scientists like my husband just like to do science, and many other scientists are the same. They tend to be independent and don’t care much what ignorant people think about them and what they do. To them it is self evident that science is fun and useful and occasionally thrilling. People of the touchy-feely sort may be repelled by what they think is the cold and heartless scientific mind. This is due to lack of exposure to science. And as Freud pointed out, we have such a long period of dependency in our infancy and childhood that we continue to look for security in the form of a higher power who will protect us. Scientific facts may seem chilling to those who can’t sense the wonder of it all.
    I am now involving myself with outreach; I’m a retired teacher with a strong amateur interest in science.

  28. #28 frog
    April 28, 2008

    I can’t find at the RAE “zardillente”, “sardillente”, “zardiente” or “sardiente”. Is that a Biblical term that’s been dropped from the language? Or is the kid mangling words he doesn’t understand? I’ve never read the Bible in Spanish, so I’m guessing here – it probably is translated to a Spanish as absurd as the English version.

  29. #29 Etha Williams
    April 28, 2008

    @#24 LightningRose –

    O.M. Brown #19,

    The Book of Job chronicles a bet bet between Yahweh and Lucifer. Since a bet is pointless if the outcome is known to both parties, this proves that Yaweh is not omnipotent.

    No, actually it chronicles a bet/argument between Yahweh and *Satan*. Satan (Hebrew for “the adversary”, often read as God’s prosecuting attorney) is a distinct entity from Lucifer (the fallen prince of dawn of Isaiah 14:12). Only in Xian thought were Satan and Lucifer (and diabolos, and the leviathan, and the serpen of Genesis, etc) conflated into one entity representing the antithesis of God.

  30. #30 azqaz
    April 28, 2008

    To those making the connection between being created from nothing and being created from dust, please remember, it’s gods dust. That makes all the difference. ;)

  31. #31 Etha Williams
    April 28, 2008

    In re: my #29 –

    This has some hilarious consequences for Xian attempts to interpret the Book of Job…really…appropriating an entity from another religion to suit your own purposes is one thing, but then trying to go and apply your redefinition of that entity to the version found in the original texts is absolutely ridiculous. If mainstream Xians only knew the history and context of their own scripture, they’d have a lot less difficulty with this one….

  32. #32 Duncan
    April 28, 2008

    So man was created in God’s image.

    What was God using His penis for before creating man?

  33. #33 amk
    April 28, 2008

    So man was created in God’s image.

    At my Anglican school we were taught that “made in God’s image” meant we, like God, have an innate knowledge of right and wrong, not any physical similarity. If true, this would mean atheists know right from wrong too.

    No, I don’t know how this was reconciled with the story of the fruit of the tree of knowledge.

  34. #34 Dennis N
    April 28, 2008

    However, even taking the story of Job in its own context does not bode well for God. It tells of God being tempted by Satan into a bet, whereas elsewhere in the Bible it proclaims God cannot be tempted; temptation is a fault of men. It is a very despicable story on many, many levels. Its blatant contradiction of other passages is probably the least of those levels.

  35. #35 Etha Williams
    April 28, 2008

    @#34 Dennis N –

    Oh believe me…I am no great fan of the morality of the Book of Job…but I think it’s important to take it in its own context, because otherwise criticism of it becomes fairly meaningless.

  36. #36 DaveX
    April 28, 2008

    “…and if you elect me Mayor of Munchkin City, I promise a Lolly in every Pop!”

  37. #37 Seth
    April 28, 2008

    Someone should probably mention to the kid that he wasn’t ‘created by god in his mom’s belly’ so much as a hot load of haploid cells that got together.

    Sigh. And I had such high hopes for the future.

  38. #38 Hector Avalos
    April 28, 2008

    I used to be a child evangelist and faith healer,
    and look where I ended up: An atheist biblical scholar
    fighting Intelligent Design. So who knows where that
    kid will be in 10-20 years?

  39. #39 bio teacher
    April 28, 2008

    re #28

    Ardiente = burning

  40. #40 Emmet Caulfield
    April 28, 2008

    This is revolting — same as the Baby Bible Bashers documentary. I just don’t understand how adults can think that brainwashing children is OK: I’ve seen kids parroting secular/atheist ideas too and I find it every bit as repugnant. The adults involved in this obviously have a very different sense of morality (as regards indoctrinating children) to mine. Notwithstanding their claims of superior morals, I’m pretty sure my “atheist morality” in this respect is a helluva lot better than theirs.

  41. #41 Brownian, OM
    April 28, 2008

    Etha, you are as erudite as always, but you’re missing the point: the Book of Job chronicles the world’s first documented Stanford Prison/Milgram-type psychology experiment.

    Though widely recounted anecdotally, like the Stanford experiment, the results from the work God and Satan’s with subject J. are non-significant and otherwise inconclusive due to a lack of replication. (God, Satan, et al. ~600-500 BCE). Further rumours of academic impropriety including inclusion of Sumerian data without attribution will not be discussed here.

    Nonetheless, the book remains a seminal work in the field of psychology, and at the least suggests there is much to be done to examine the role of privilege/disavantage in determining levels of faith. Further, the existence of an ideal test group in the God-fearing republican elite practically demands the attention of actively researching social psychologists.

  42. #42 Brian
    April 28, 2008

    Sorry for the off-topic post, but our local paper did a horrible front-page write-up of Expelled. Like, embarrassingly bad. Here’s the link to the story, feel free to write the author and set him straight. http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080428/NEWS10/804280334

  43. #43 Brownian, OM
    April 28, 2008

    I used to be a child evangelist and faith healer, and look where I ended up: An atheist biblical scholar fighting Intelligent Design. So who knows where that kid will be in 10-20 years?

    Good point, Dr. Avalos.

  44. #44 idahogie
    April 28, 2008

    I think it’s funny that an 8-year-old can so easily and competently explain Creationism. Sure says something about the intellectual complexity of the concept.

  45. #45 NP
    April 28, 2008

    Cute kid, but he’s a brat for speaking out against stork theory. >:(

  46. #46 bernarda
    April 28, 2008

    #32, Gawd is a big Jerk-off except for the time he got Mary.

  47. #47 Brian X
    April 28, 2008

    I wonder if this kid knows he’s a freak show. Up there, ranting and raving in a tone I can only describe as (Godwin help me) Hitlerian, talking about things he hasn’t been in school long enough to understand… I hear kids like this and feel sorry for them, playing at being adults either because they’re forced to be or (even worse) because they try to be, because they think it makes them feel better about themselves.

    Though not to the extent of this kid, I was one of the latter. I raised a few hackles, and one neighborhood grandmother came to outright hate me because she thought I was a snotty little prick, but I was an outsider in school and had very little shot at a normal childhood anyway. I’d love to be able to meet myself a quarter century ago and explain a few things… and I see this kid and wish I could do the same.

  48. #48 Sastra
    April 28, 2008

    Kitty #26 wrote:

    Or is this just another manifestation of the lunatic fringe?

    Not so much the lunatic fringe, I think, as the natural consequence of the common belief that “knowledge of God” is instilled through The Holy Spirit. Religious enthusiasts are very invested in the idea that there is a mysterious kind of faith that has direct access to truth — and this faith is not gained through reason, or education, or experience. You’re born into the world having it — and the world then does it best to knock it out of you.

    Thus, this love affair with the ideal of the uncorrupted child — who, like in the poem by Wordsworth, is born “trailing clouds of glory” and still REMEMBERS GOD. The people in the audience are watching this strange, trained, precocious little boy and they actually interpret his antics as unrehearsed, spontaneous eruptions of the pure kind of faith they want to return to.

    This is a popular theme in America — that children are in many ways wiser than we are. They are not self-conscious and proud, so the Holy Spirit is closer to them, and speaks through them. “Except ye become as a little child, you may not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.” The child Jesus confounds the elders in the temple.

    You don’t need no fancy book-larnin’. Looka this kid. Smarter than scientists, he is. All you have to do is trust God, just like a baby.

    They view this sort of thing as a powerful argument that they’re right. How could an atheist account for this marvel? It’s a visible manifestation of their romance going on in their heads.

  49. #49 George Picoulas
    April 28, 2008

    Of course, PZ, you should adopt this style. I have for my classes and it is known to wake up many a students.

    I feel sad really… for this kid and all others in Jesus camp!

  50. #50 Lago
    April 28, 2008

    “He definitely has some talent, though. Should I adopt his rhetorical style for my classes?”

    And I thought you didn’t want to be like Hitler?

  51. #51 Geoff
    April 28, 2008

    and a Spanish Peter Popoff is born.

    (sigh)

  52. #52 bernarda
    April 28, 2008

    Another sort of lunacy.

    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/04/26/BUCN10C1KR.DTL

    “Rocky Twyman has a radical solution for surging gasoline prices: prayer.

    Twyman – a community organizer, church choir director and public relations consultant from the Washington, D.C., suburbs – staged a pray-in at a San Francisco Chevron station on Friday, asking God for cheaper gas. He did the same thing in the nation’s Capitol on Wednesday, with volunteers from a soup kitchen joining in. Today he will lead members of an Oakland church in prayer.

    Yes, it’s come to that.

    “God is the only one we can turn to at this point,” said Twyman, 59. “Our leaders don’t seem to be able to do anything about it. The prices keep soaring and soaring.”"

    As singer Roy Zimmerman said, satire is becoming easier and easier.

  53. #53 SteveM
    April 28, 2008

    At my Anglican school we were taught that “made in God’s image” meant we, like God, have an innate knowledge of right and wrong, not any physical similarity. If true, this would mean atheists know right from wrong too.
    No, I don’t know how this was reconciled with the story of the fruit of the tree of knowledge.

    Yes, because it was the tree of “The Knowledge of Good and Evil”, not just “knowledge” in general. So I do wonder how they reconcile that with man being created with an innate knowledge of right and wrong.

    As for atheists, anyone who believes the story of the Garden and Man’s fall, should believe that all men received the knowledge of good and evil. Atheism is a seperate choice to not believe in God. What I’m trying to say is that your statement “if true even atheist know right from wrong”, doesn’t depend on the meaning of “in god’s image” since in any case all men received that knowledge from adam’s eating of the fruit.

  54. #54 kcrady
    April 28, 2008

    This looks depressingly like footage from a sequel to The Boys From Brazil. Soon, his evil makers will teach him German…

    One of the things I noticed was that the boy did not believe in the Stork Theory of reproduction, when he is clearly of an age to be told that by his parents. His theory is that “God made him in his mother’s tummy.” Which means:

    A) He thinks his dad is God

    B) He thinks God is his dad, i.e. he’s the next Jesus Christ

    or

    C) He has been taught a basic version of “the facts of life,” i.e., about sex.

    Now, these are the sort of people who invent the Stork Theory and the Cabbage Patch Theory as a way to fend off “Mommy, where do babies come from?” without having to tell their small children the naughty, sinful facts about sexual reproduction (aka, the system God “intelligently designed”–which he also finds repugnant and “sinful”).

    As I recall from watching as much of “Baby Bible Bashers” as I could stand before clicking away, there’s a clip of this boy, or another one of comparable young age, railing against the wickedness of homosexuality. Wouldn’t his parents have to *teach* him what homosexuality *is* before they can whip him up to fervor against it?

    Wouldn’t that, even to a fundie, qualify as child abuse? I remember fundamentalists being angered by books like Heather Has Two Mommies for that very reason–they taught young children about homosexuality. Or is it alright to teach little kids about homosexuality, as long as you also program the kids to preach against it?

    What’s most frightening about this is that it isn’t just some isolated example, like the Phelps clan programming their kids to hold up “God Hates Fags” signs. In the video, there’s a lare community of people cheering it on, obviously just as brainwashed as the child. It’s like a real-life Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

    I wonder what the reactions would be (on both “sides” of the theism/atheism divide) if it was a video of a little boy or girl giving a lecture on theoretical physics or cephalopods?

  55. #55 Dustin doesn't take your orders.
    April 28, 2008

    See? This is what happens when creationists ignore the warnings of the ancients and face the spice agony while pregnant.

  56. #56 mbzm
    April 28, 2008

    My thoughts on seeing the video (yes, I’m bad) were that this kid was protesting too much that he didn’t come from monkeys. He started looking more and more like a monkey to me, jumping around and beating his chest (guess that would be a guerrilla, but whatever).

  57. #57 Kaddath
    April 28, 2008

    Listening to rants in my native language seems to turn my stomach even more than listening them in English!

    That said you have to feel bad for the little guy… if only he saw that video he’d see how he actually jumps up and down like a monkey… but fails to realize it’s chimpanzees that our our cousins!

    He also sounds like a very annoying soccer announcer back when I was a kid, so maybe he still has a future once he realizes he’s been had by his parents!

  58. #58 Bobby
    April 28, 2008

    kcrady said:
    “Or is it alright to teach little kids about homosexuality, as long as you also program the kids to preach against it?”

    Yes. That’s exactly the point. *sigh*

  59. #59 chriss
    April 28, 2008

    In regards to your question on adopting this rhetorical style…by all means!! I can see it now…you…pacing back and forth furiously…dropping to one knee…punching the air to emphasize a point…the growing glow in your students faces as their minds fill with knowledge…truth…until they can’t contain themselves…YES!!…they stand…they applaud…they turn their faces to the heavens…they hold up their hands…but you…you are relentless…ARISE CEPHALOPHILES!!!!

    Two things though…you’ll have to learn to speak in all caps and…I always pictured you as a bit taller.

  60. #60 LightningRose
    April 28, 2008

    Etha #29,

    I stand corrected. Thank you for the explanation, I see I need to do a bit more research.

  61. #61 Alicia P
    April 28, 2008

    ThirdMonkey, I recommend “101 Myths of the Bible” by Gary Greenberg

    It lays out the fallacies in an order that helps put arguments in perspective.

  62. #62 Robin Zebrowski
    April 28, 2008

    Can I just point out that I’d like to nominate this entire comment thread for a Molly Award? The overall tone and well-chosen snark is just really on target today. Warms my heart!

  63. #63 Claudia
    April 28, 2008

    That was…incredibly surreal…

    LMAO @ #5!!!! The kid was channeling Farley!!!

  64. #64 Rikaja
    April 28, 2008

    It makes me want to vomit :/
    It is sad that if that boy was thaught also evolution, maybe he would create a different opinion…

  65. #65 Paul Lundgren
    April 28, 2008

    @ 55

    You’re forgetting, that would’ve killed a male fetus, even Muad’Dib.

  66. #66 Alex
    April 28, 2008

    Evangelical preaching… so easy a six year old can do it!

  67. #67 Kyle W.
    April 28, 2008

    Even in a different language, he sounds just like Marjoe as a child.

    Particularly those tic-like gesticulations and screamingly-loud emphasis on random words.

  68. #68 w1lp33
    April 28, 2008

    Man is not from NOTHING! God created us from DUST, and don’t you forget it!

    How is it that “made from dust” is somehow way more meaningful than (to choose the current Expelled whipping boy) “on the backs of crystals” or any “in the primordial stew” or whatever origin of life theory is currently the frontrunner.

    Growing up in the church, it was always emphasized how weak and useless and pathetic humans were, how we were from dust, and we were sinners, and we were imperfect… then as soon as someone mentions we share common descent, its a big 180 to “were so special, were perfect, were gods favourites”…

  69. #69 Exitus
    April 28, 2008

    Ha! Praying to God for cheap Petrol. Two problems there. Firstly, the obvious. Prayer! Even if you assume it’ll work, wouldn’t praying for something more appropriate be better?
    Secondly, though this may not be apparent to the Americans out there, you kind of do have cheap petrol. Or gas, whichever. Try $16 a gallon. Thats roughly what we’re on here at the moment.

    Slightly off topic there. Just a slight grudge coming to the fore…

  70. #70 frog
    April 28, 2008

    #39 bio teacher “Ardiente = burning”

    That can’t be the phrase – it doesn’t make any sense to describe Adam after the creation as “ardiente” – the English translation is “living being.” If the kid has the Spanish version right, one of those translations is terribly wrong.

    He also clearly pronounces “sardiente” and not “ardiente” – actually, he clearly says “sardillente” and neither of those, but I’m willing to give poetic license for the latter pronunciation.

  71. #71 kirk
    April 28, 2008

    Two things. First, that is the best Hitler impression I have ever seen. I wonder what BS would think of that!

    And somewhere a Priest is masturbating furiously watching that , wishing he had that kid in his choir.

  72. #72 Reginald Selkirk
    April 28, 2008

    Man is not from NOTHING! God created us from DUST, and don’t you forget it!

    Hush. If the Magisterium hears us talking about dust, we’re through.

  73. #73 Stephen Couchman
    April 28, 2008

    I am a Western Martial Arts enthusiast (the medieval/renaissance swordsmanship revival, for those unfamiliar), and in order to avoid any glamorous illusions about exactly what a sword is for, as well as to bear witness to atrocities that civilization ignores at our peril, I occasionally seek out online footage of beheadings by Islamofascists, African machete genocides, etc. It angers and depresses me, but I can sit through it. I did not, however, have the stomach to watch the entirety of this video. Seeing a life cut down by fanaticism and tribalism is one thing, but kids like this little preacher boy or the larval Baptalibanists in Jesus Camp are stuck in a kind of living death, doomed to stumble around a bleak, terrifying landscape painted on the living world by their parents and pastors. Nothing else in the world is so abhorrent to me. These kids are why we atheists are the ones on the side of the angels.

  74. #74 Mavaddat
    April 28, 2008

    Let’s be a little forgiving here, folks: Among all the benefits that a crowd of applauding adults brings a growing boy, this child is also preparing well for an adult life in professional wrestling.

  75. #75 Sven DiMilo
    April 28, 2008

    I used to be a child evangelist and faith healer,
    and look where I ended up: An atheist biblical scholar
    fighting Intelligent Design. So who knows where that
    kid will be in 10-20 years?

    Another case in point: Marjoe Gortner has been mentioned above; he ended up gettin nekkid with Wonder Woman. We all have our aspirations…

  76. #76 Rob Davidson
    April 28, 2008

    I’m just amazed how intricately young kids can mimic adult behaviour – quite mesmerising. Maybe he could be a great musician or dancer.

  77. #77 doubtingfoo
    April 28, 2008

    When I told my 8 year-old son that there were people who thought the world was only 6000 or 10000 years old he laughed and asked how people could be so stupid and not understand fossils. Yeah, he was probably parroting me like the preacher kid was parroting but I was SO PROUD anyway!

  78. #78 Paul Johnson
    April 28, 2008

    are you shitting me

  79. #79 possummomma
    April 28, 2008

    Wow. Marjoe came back as a hispanic kid. That must be proof of a god. ;)

  80. #80 possummomma
    April 28, 2008

    Forgot to add that he’s a sexist little man, too. All the scientists are male? What the hell? Hey, little man! As a female, I am capable of doing more than manufacturing Jesus Tortillas.

  81. #81 Richard Kilgore
    April 28, 2008

    I wonder if my biology teacher abused me by showing me Richard Dawkins videos back when I was in school.

    Among the misleading things Dawkins said was that there was no controversy about evolution. Actually, that was an outright propagandistic lie. Still, he did manage to mess with my mind for some years of my life. Dawkins has almost as much talent as that kid in the video.

  82. #82 Dennis N
    April 28, 2008

    He was created in God’s image, so…God’s Spanish?

  83. #83 MartinM
    April 28, 2008

    Among the misleading things Dawkins said was that there was no controversy about evolution. Actually, that was an outright propagandistic lie.

    That rather depends on what you mean by controversy. When discussing a scientific theory, it’s reasonable to suppose that one might be referring to a scientific controversy. There certainly isn’t one surrounding evolution, whatever the DI might dream about.

  84. #84 Dennis N
    April 28, 2008

    Oh go away Richard Kilbore. There is no controversy among people who know what f&$% they are talking about. Only people un-versed in science, and coincidently versed in being a batsh*t crazy fundamental Christian share your views.

  85. #85 AlisonS
    April 28, 2008

    This is absolutely chilling. My impression was of a pint-sized Adolf Hitler: his shrieking style and mannerisms were uncanny and frankly frightening. His parents and that ignorant crowd of sychophants have a lot to answer for.

  86. #86 matt
    April 28, 2008

    “Evangelical preaching… so easy a six year old can do it!”

    so true!

  87. #87 Inigo
    April 28, 2008

    #70: I guess what he says is “ser viviente”, which is the literal translation of “living being”

  88. #88 Cynthia
    April 28, 2008

    Maybe I’m just to short on godliness to be a follower of this little boy, but it seems to me than man is less godly coming from dust than from monkey…

  89. #89 Rodney Anonymous
    April 28, 2008

    Christians, like pit bulls, as so cute when they’re little.

  90. #90 Santiago
    April 28, 2008

    Jam packed massive church as well. This confirms what I try to tell Americans, that their country is not tremendously more stupid than any other, only that its populace is far, far better documented.

    Does anyone know what country is this from? He’s definitely somewhere in Latin America, but he’s not from Mexico and I would wager not from Argentina either.

  91. #91 Jack Rawlinson
    April 28, 2008

    I thought it was particularly sweet the way so many of his movements were extremely reminiscent of the way exciteable monkeys move.

  92. #92 Pierce R. Butler
    April 28, 2008

    Over 90 comments, and nobody’s asked the key question:

    How much was in the basket when the show was over?

    Whatta buncha amateurs.

  93. #93 Kyle W.
    April 28, 2008

    Christians, like pit bulls, as so cute when they’re little.

    My pit bull, unlike Christians, remains cute at an old age. However, he does, like many Christians, seem to enjoy the smell of his own shit.

  94. #94 Dennis N
    April 28, 2008

    I sent it to my friend who speaks Spanish as a first language, and she said its a Spaniard accent.

  95. #95 Alicia P
    April 28, 2008

    My aunt’s pitbull has lopsided balls…another common feature with christians? hehe

  96. #96 frog
    April 28, 2008

    Inigo #87:

    Thank you – that must be it. The kid took poetic license since he didn’t know what a “ser viviente” was but was just mouthing sounds (my father used to have a version of “how much is that doggy in the window” when he was a child, where he converted the song into Spanish puns since he didn’t speak English).

  97. #97 frog
    April 28, 2008

    I’d vote somewhere in the north of S. America, or Panama – his Spanish is actually very pretty, but lacks some of the unusual phonemes from Spain.

    Of course, Spain has a very wide range of accents, so anything could be from somewhere in Spain.

  98. #98 Ribozyme
    April 28, 2008

    He sounds just like Hugo Chávez! (the words are different, but the oratorial approach is very similar)

  99. #99 Santiago
    April 28, 2008

    #98: Ha! Actually, that “oratorial style” is pretty much the one preferred by all Latin American despots and shady, demagogue politicians. I swear he reminds me of at least half a dozen Mexican politicians waxing poetic about the devil Gringos.

    And the kid is must definitely *not* from Spain, trust me on that.

  100. #100 shonny
    April 28, 2008

    “It’s criminal to ruin the brains of children.”

    Wouldn’t be too sure there is any brain there to ruin!
    Hereditary vacuum between ears more likely.
    Pope Ratty was a HitlerJugend, so what can this make it to among god’s Nazis?

  101. #101 neneneg
    April 28, 2008

    Quite entertaining actually, like watching a trained litle monkey.The greater entertainment is watching the feeble-minded being moved spiritually by the trained monkey.

  102. #102 The Wholly None
    April 28, 2008

    It’s a show biz gig; it’s about money; and his parents are no worse than any other stage parents. Did you ever watch the earliest films of Shirley Temple? Sammy Davis, Jr.? This kid may very well grow up to be some kind of huckster, but not necessarily a religious one, or he may end up in show business.

    I agree that it’s the adult audience that’s scary!

  103. #103 JJ
    April 28, 2008

    The kid is Peruvian (http://www.cristoesturuta.cl/notasprimicias/Entrevistas/NezarethCastirey.asp). No wonder his Spanish sounded so elegant :) . He is a very vivacious boy , and it really saddens me to think his life is gonna be wasted in stupid superstitions. I can somehow relate, because when I was a kid I used to attend this kind of evangelical meetings (these things are HUGE here in Latin America, sigh) and for the people who go (that include 99% of my family) it is only about “Dios” and nothing more. Geez ,I remember the little acts we played in Christmas : ” Cold and rational Scientist/Philosopher gets to know God through his humble maid and finally understand the meaning of life” . :P .

  104. #104 Jayshun
    April 28, 2008

    I have a niece and two cousins that go to Sunday School, Church, etc. and I worry about it – it seems at such a young age they can be indoctrinated – trained to be so by adults no doubt – just yesterday I was taken aback when my nine year old cousin said he “hated” Obama because he was a Muslim and didn’t believe in Jesus – when I told him that I actually liked Obama and that he clearly WASN’T Muslim and that the a lot of people were uncomfortable w/ him just because he’s a black man he gave me a sheepish grin…

  105. #105 wrpd
    April 28, 2008

    Who wants to bet this kid is on drugs by the time he’s 13?

  106. #106 tiredofthesos
    April 29, 2008

    Re: #21

    Most Christians “read” the Bible in as much depth as teenage boys “read” Playboy.

  107. #107 Grammar RWA
    April 29, 2008

    Wouldn’t be too sure there is any brain there to ruin!
    Hereditary vacuum between ears more likely.

    A kid his age has to be smart to pull this off.

  108. #108 Robert S.
    April 29, 2008

    “A kid his age has to be smart to pull this off.”

    Smart, no. Talented, yes. Chances are Tom Cruise could’ve done this at the same age.

    I found the video alternately horrifying and depressing. Zero entertainment value.

    The crowd oblivious to the fact that what they’re watching is a circus act, not a sermon. When you see this sort of human gullibility on display, makes you think it’s no wonder so many folks still believe in Creation, Noah’s ark, angels, demons, heaven, hell, etc, but it’s also no wonder Bush was able to get reelected, people thought Iraq attacked us on 9/11, people still justify the invasion of Iraq, etc.

  109. #109 Richbank
    April 29, 2008

    No, i think he says “Ser viviante”. he just has the emphasis on the wrong syllables.

  110. #110 Max
    April 29, 2008

    I’m surprised that nobody seems to have mentioned the similarities between this and child “beauty pageants” etc. Forcing children to eat poorly, skip school and parade themselves around like that at such a young age is utterly disgusting – and it’s a very similar thing that’s going on here. This child is being forced to do something which he may decide (when he’s old enough) was completely wrong.

    I hope this child does learn just how wrong that load of claptrap was; unfortunately, he’ll likely end up staying trapped in that part of society in which he will not learn the truth about such matters. Even if he does learn the truth, I would feel sorry for him when he does, as he then has to live with the knowledge that he did that sort of thing when he was younger.

  111. #111 Etha Williams
    April 29, 2008

    Only when watching something like this do I fully comprehend how fortunate I am to have grown up in an environment in which I was not told to believe in a specific religious or political dogma, but was instead allowed to develop my reason and critical thinking skills.

    Who knows what sort of a person I’d be if I’d grown up in this kid’s environment? At best, it would be a very unhappy childhood; at worst, I would live in a constant state of cognitive dissonance and spew hatred at humanity. It’s really quite terrifying.

  112. #112 pcarini
    April 29, 2008

    I saw this Channel4 (UK) documentary on Nick Gisburne’s excellent site a while back: Baby Bible Bashers. It follows the stories of three child preachers, two from the Southern United States and one from Brazil. It’s simultaneously interesting and unsettling to watch these kids, particularly at the times when it seems like they’re trying to win their parents’ approval.

  113. #113 pcarini
    April 29, 2008

    D’oh.. I scanned the comments, but it looks like Emmet Caulfield beat me to it way back at #40.

  114. #114 Vegan Atheist
    April 29, 2008

    #45:
    Too bad he will burn in eternal hellfire for his heretical astorkist philosophy. Why do you hate the avian who brought you to your mother’s doorstep, Nezareth?

  115. #115 Gareth
    April 29, 2008

    Little Hitler in the making there.

  116. #116 Thomas J. Theobald
    April 29, 2008

    It’s exactly this kind of lunatic that will turn into the 2030 version of Jim Jones, or worse. Someone tell me why we’re not dropping “MOABs” on stadiums like this, when one well-placed drop would eliminate so much pain? I hate to be glib about this, but when I see this gang of barely-contained nutjobs, all I can hear is Robot yelling “Danger! Danger!”

    T

  117. #117 DLC
    April 29, 2008

    The rhetorical style is familiar, but more of Chavez or Castro than Hitler. Although Shickelgruber could get to moving when he worked himself up to it.
    I remember Marjoe Gortner’s coming out against televangelists, and applauding loudly when he did so.

    Scary what a well-trained and motivated witch-doctor can do, isn’t it ?

    On a side note, any of you out there see the recent Law & Order episode in which the detectives arrest a teenage boy for stoning his mother to death ?
    The scene with the little kids in Jesus Camp, learning how to chant hate — “This Means War!” Don’t tell yourself it’s only a TV show . . . there are such groups extant today.
    I wonder, will they also make war on the unbelievers, or just the Islamics ? I’d like to say I am not worried about religious fanatics, but I’d be lying.
    I use the word fanatics because they aren’t fundamentalists, having long since departed from the fundamentals laid down by Jesus or Mohammad or whoever their original witch-doctor in chief was.

  118. #118 Michael
    April 29, 2008

    Dr. Avalos beat me to it, because that was what knocked me out of my chair when I first heard him speak about his childhood; sometimes being pushed so far to one side makes it eventually flip you around to the other.

    As for the little preacher in the video, all I kept wondering was how do you say “He wants you too, Malachi” in Spanish…

  119. #119 Mac from Oregon
    April 30, 2008

    Once again I arrive late to the party.
    Beyond depressing. The joy and rapture of the adults watching this mini Falwell just makes me ill. I try to confront ignorance, I try to educate where I can but how do you get to these people? Anything you could say is automatically demonic and nonsense out of the gate.
    Anybody know of a good country to emigrate to? I am seriously considering it. The stupid is just too much to deal with. I don’t know how PZ and others can do this in this environment, I really don’t.
    As for the kid, he will reach puberty someday and then lets see how he deals with a crowd. With acne, breaking voice, pocket erections as he sees the choir girls. Sad thing is that he has probably reached his evangelical and theatrical peak, and he doesn’t even know it.

    Seriously, send emigration choices…

  120. #120 John Phillips, FCD
    April 30, 2008

    That had the same effect on me as the CH4 and beeb pieces on child preachers, vomit inducing. However, as others have noted, the child wasn’t the worst thing about it, after all, you can only feel sorry for a child of that age who generally only wants to please the adults. No, what was truly sickening was the audience reaction, now that was frightening.

  121. #121 DingoDave
    May 18, 2008

    SteveM wrote in comment #53:
    “At my Anglican school we were taught that “made in God’s image” meant we, like God, have an innate knowledge of right and wrong, not any physical similarity. If true, this would mean atheists know right from wrong too.
    No, I don’t know how this was reconciled with the story of the fruit of the tree of knowledge.”

    It irritastes me enormously when Christians claim that this is the meaning of this passage. What the Bible actually says is,

    “Then God said, “Let us make humankind in our image, after our likeness… God created humankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them male and female he created them”

    Now, what does the word ‘likeness’ mean? Let’s take a look at the dictionary definition of the word shall we?

    Likeness
    Noun:
    1. resemblance
    2. portrait
    3. an imitative appearance; semblance
    4. A pictorial, graphic, or sculptured representation of something; an image.

    The author of this text was obviously polytheistic, and assumed that the gods looked just like human men and women. If ever there was a text in a ‘holy book’ which indicates that people create gods in their own image, then this is it.
    The breathtaking dishonsty of Christians when quote-mining these verses in an attempt to weasle out of the obvious implications, makes my blood boil.
    These religious sycophants can’t even bring themselves to be honest with what their own ‘holy book’ is clearly telling them.

    If Hector Avalos happens to read this, I would appreciate his opinion as to whether he agrees with my interpretation.