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PZ Myers is a biologist and associate professor at the University of Minnesota, Morris.
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« Hey, Academics, join the club! | Main | Jellyfish gettin' it on, baby »
Category: Pointless polls
Posted on: October 9, 2008 10:25 PM, by PZ Myers
Oh, come on. A poll at a forum for the Minerals, Metals and Materials society that asks, "Which U.S. Presidential Candidate Would Better Advance Science and Engineering if Elected?", and John McCain is winning 59% to 39%? That poll needs some adjusting.
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Comments
Posted by: KristinMH | October 9, 2008 10:31 PM
Done and done.
Posted by: John McKay | October 9, 2008 10:34 PM
We've already reversed it.
Posted by: Azdak | October 9, 2008 10:34 PM
It's the engineering part of the question that's throwing everyone...
Posted by: Glen Davidson | October 9, 2008 10:34 PM
Is the pointless part the practice for the election?
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7
Posted by: Gregory Kusnick | October 9, 2008 10:35 PM
Actually, the poll asks which candidate "would better advance the cause of the materials science and technology profession". That's a pretty narrow constituency. For all I know, McCain has cronies in that field and might actually send more pork their way than Obama would.
Posted by: Gregory Kusnick | October 9, 2008 10:44 PM
Now if they'd asked who'd be better for advancing the cause of planetarium science and technology, then I'd know which way to vote.
Posted by: dogmeatib | October 9, 2008 10:56 PM
I actually accidentally skewed the heck out of that poll. Apparently if you have what looks like a network freeze and hit the vote button a dozen or so times, you vote a dozen or so times without the poll refreshing.
Posted by: Atheist Chaplain | October 9, 2008 11:00 PM
I think the site is getting Pharyngulated at the moment as it takes forever to load and when I did vote it took an interminable age to update. That's a good thing, right??
Posted by: clinteas | October 9, 2008 11:06 PM
I had to think of the planetarium projector as well.
How could this be in McCain's favor before being pharyngulated??
Posted by: Peter | October 9, 2008 11:09 PM
Even if McCain decides to send more pork to materials science and engineering than Obama, part of Obama's plan is to double federal funding for basic research. That's the kind of thing that has big ripple effects, even if they're mostly indirect.
Posted by: Kobra | October 9, 2008 11:09 PM
I don't even consider it crashing the poll this time. After all, Obama is the more pro-science candidate. This is a matter of fact, not opinion.
Posted by: cicely | October 9, 2008 11:13 PM
Pharygulization in progress:
Barack Obama
1212 votes 83.53 (%)
John McCain
229 votes 15.78 (%)
Other
10 votes 0.69 (%)
Posted by: Phoesune | October 9, 2008 11:17 PM
Since we got Obama up so high...Should we also vote for other so that it outpaces McCain?
Posted by: crucifinch | October 9, 2008 11:17 PM
Is it our fault that the poll has such unbearable lag, or is it due to them being material scientists and not computer scientists??
Posted by: crucifinch | October 9, 2008 11:24 PM
Obama 1504 votes 85.65 (%)
McCain 230 votes 13.10 (%)
Other 22 votes 1.25 (%)
Posted by: Slaughter | October 9, 2008 11:28 PM
Oh, come on, McCain's gonna *love* science soon, 'cause it'll be the only thing keeping him alive.
Posted by: Phoesune | October 9, 2008 11:28 PM
Obama 1614 votes 86.26 (%)
McCain 230 votes 12.29 (%)
Other 27 votes 1.44 (%)
Posted by: Kinzua Kid | October 9, 2008 11:32 PM
This poll has been Pharyngulated. Unbearable refresh time after voting. Incredible. I used to call that "FARKing" a website. It seems I'm going to have to switch my meme references here.
Posted by: Kinzua Kid | October 9, 2008 11:34 PM
Update:
Looks like "other" is now outpacing McCain
Obama: 1714
McCain: 230
Other: 321
Posted by: Chris (in Columbus) | October 9, 2008 11:43 PM
John McCain and Sarah Palin aren't quite sure what the causes of Global Warming are! How could they ever advocate science?! Oh, lordy, every day it gets worse...
Posted by: Blake Stacey | October 9, 2008 11:46 PM
We broke it.
Eit.
Posted by: Mozglubov | October 9, 2008 11:47 PM
That must have been a very small number of misinformed initial voters for McCain to pull ahead... what a confusing crazy random happenstance. I'm glad it is now put back on proper track (with the added bonus of other beating McCain), but unfortunately it won't let me vote... perhaps it knows I'm Canadian and therefore technically ineligible to vote?
Posted by: SC | October 9, 2008 11:54 PM
OT:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081009/ap_en_mo/film_fireproof
Gag.
Posted by: Tony Sidaway | October 10, 2008 12:04 AM
There is a poll on the Bill O'Reilly page on Fox News that seems to be coming to an inaccurate result. Help Bill to predict the result of the election correctly.
The question is: "Who will win the presidential election?"
Posted by: Rey Fox | October 10, 2008 12:35 AM
Well, it's Minerals, Metals, and Materials, so McCain should be the winner there. Drill baby drill, mine baby mine, extract baby extract.
Obama ain't about minerals, metals, and materials, he's more into destroying America with gays, terrorism, and "happy holidays". I'd come up with some catchy alliteration, but I'm not interested enough.
Posted by: Tatarize | October 10, 2008 12:39 AM
Vote early, vote often.
Posted by: Pyroclasm | October 10, 2008 1:14 AM
Maybe "Engineering" is code for oil drilling infrastructure?
Posted by: sara | October 10, 2008 1:46 AM
But weapons research and seeking/drilling oil is science. Seriously, Laser shock of materials is pretty cool. It is the sort of science that reduces malacologists and ornithologists to mere curators and custodians of zoo parks and museums, regretfully. And who cares about stem cells as long we can assemble a multifunctional Al-Qaeda sensor?
Posted by: The Chimp's Raging Id | October 10, 2008 2:23 AM
The site took so long to respond when I voted that I thought we'd killed the server!
That's how much hurt Team Pharyngula can inflect. Anyway:
Barack Obama 4150 votes 86.68 (%)
John McCain 255 votes 5.33 (%)
Other 383 votes 8.00 (%)
pzwnd
Posted by: The Chimp's Raging Id | October 10, 2008 2:31 AM
Oh, and Obama is losing 32% to Grandpa McShame's 68% on O'Reilly's poll. Come on guys, that needs sorting out ASAP.
BTW, I meant "inflict" not "inflect" above.
Posted by: Bunkie | October 10, 2008 2:35 AM
Barack Obama 4240 votes 86.90 (%)
John McCain 255 votes 5.23 (%)
Other 384 votes 7.87 (%)
Posted by: Funkula | October 10, 2008 2:52 AM
@25: Homos, Hezbollah, and Happy Holidays.
Posted by: scott | October 10, 2008 2:54 AM
I voted "other". McCain is too easy. But Obama supporters seem to ignore his recent vote in favor of giving telecoms immunity and that Biden helped write the Patriot act. Sheep all around if you ask me.
Posted by: JakeS | October 10, 2008 3:04 AM
Obama 87.34%
McCain 5.03%
Why is it that I always find out about these poll crashings too late to make a difference?
Posted by: foxfire | October 10, 2008 3:35 AM
OT and sorry again for introducing a bit of noise into a conversation that appears to be in equilibrium. In an inverted "fitness landscape" ,a random slight disturbance might be the only way out to get over the rim (so go sue Murray Gell-Mann for seeing the connection between a Quark and a Jaguar)
PZ, I just sent you an e-mail that really REALLY needs to get to SOMEONE in the Obama arena that doesn't grasp why RINOs (Republicans In Name Only) might not be thundering in his direction.
I am so very sorry for doing this PZ and I will continue to insert noise until you do what I want. Get IT (the e-mail) to somebody in the Obama contingent
Posted by: BobC | October 10, 2008 3:39 AM
McCain has less votes than "Other".
McCain will lose the real election badly. He is now expected to lose in the states he must win, North Carolina, Ohio, and Florida.
Posted by: Nemo | October 10, 2008 4:01 AM
scott:
But those aren't related to science and engineering.
I'm not crazy about those points, either, but seriously, do you want me to vote for Nader again? For the fourth time?
foxfire: What makes you think PZ has an in with the Obama campaign?
Posted by: John Morgan | October 10, 2008 4:33 AM
It would seem that a full 8% of people out there are smart enough to realise that neither McBama or Ocain is going to be good for American science in the next four years.
OB 87%
Mac 5%
Other 8%
Posted by: Sleeping at the Console | October 10, 2008 6:09 AM
Obama is more pro-science.
Posted by: Carlie | October 10, 2008 8:07 AM
My first thought was "Let me guess, they're engineers, right?"
(not to disparage the wonderful engineers who frequent this site)
Posted by: JBlilie | October 10, 2008 8:08 AM
I have already done my real patriotic duty and voted for Obama by absentee. One of the proudest votes I've ever cast.
Posted by: tceisele | October 10, 2008 8:18 AM
Carlie (#40): Well, thank you for not disparaging *all* engineers. Actually, this is one of the engineering societies that I've actually been a member of. It's easy to see why McCain got an initial lead from them. Metallurgy and materials science *really* get a big boost from wars and military buildups. If it wasn't for the military, there probably wouldn't even *be* a significant market for metallic titanium, for example. That said, McCain appears to have so little regard for any science and engineering that doesn't have direct military applications that I think he would, at best, be a wash for the materials people this time. Obama might not throw any particular pork to materials, but his support for science in general (including materials science) looks a lot better overall.
Posted by: Grammar RWA | October 10, 2008 8:45 AM
WRONG.
That too is Pharyngulation.
See above:
Other was at 10 votes 0.69 (%) before we got to it.
Posted by: Harry | October 10, 2008 8:48 AM
I would also like to add that mining engineers and metallurgists are a very traditional (read: conservative) lot. The field is dominated by older, white males, which is McCain's base. While materials engineers tend to be slightly more diverse, the younger generation of materials engineers are typically into fields other than metals (nanotechnology, electronics, polymers, biomaterials, etc.) and are usually members of different professional societies beyond the TMS such as the Materials Research Society (MRS), the American Ceramics Society (ACerS), or the American Chemical Society (ACS).
I think the overall number of McCain votes that first had McCain in the lead (230) reflects the lack of interest in web polls from the society. When y'all "Pharyngulated" the poll, you added thousands of votes for Obama while the McCain tally only went up by 25.
Disclaimer: I do retain my membership to TMS, but I don't really pay attention to what's going on. I am much more active in the ACS and the Electrochemical Society.
Posted by: Carlie | October 10, 2008 8:55 AM
It's easy to see why McCain got an initial lead from them. Metallurgy and materials science *really* get a big boost from wars and military buildups.
That was my point. If you're an engineer, you see McCain as being good for your field, and might easily transfer that to thinking he must be good for science in general.
Posted by: Grammar RWA | October 10, 2008 8:56 AM
Send it to the campaign yourself. What makes you think PZ has any influence whatsoever over the Obama campaign? PZ's a good guy, but he's not the Prince of this world, nor the ruler of the powers of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience. That's Warren Buffett.
Posted by: Reginald Selkirk | October 10, 2008 8:57 AM
Seems to have been a dramatic turnaround in the polling, John "overhead projector" McCain is currently losing by a large margin.
Posted by: Eric Atkinson | October 10, 2008 9:00 AM
Vote early, vote often.
The democrat creed.
Posted by: David Marjanović, OM | October 10, 2008 10:09 AM
It is always a pleasure to obey, Master.
That one still needs work.
"He who casts the vote decides nothing. He who counts the vote decides everything."
--
Kenneth "Katherine" BlackwellStalinPosted by: rob | October 10, 2008 10:17 AM
well i for one think that the honor of best for science title should go to john "overhead projectors and grizzly bears are dumb" mccain.
(no, not really)
Posted by: Steve Cuthbertson | October 10, 2008 11:17 AM
#49 Strangely enough,after voting myself, those numbers stayed the same...
Posted by: Gregory Kusnick | October 10, 2008 12:33 PM
Carlie #45:
You don't seem to think much of engineers' reasoning powers. Just because McCain might be good for the defense industry, it does not at all follow that he would be good for science in general, and I expect most engineers are smart enough to realize this.
In any case, the poll was not about science in general; it was about "who will give my narrow specialty the bigger boost?" You cannot infer anything about science in general from this poll.
Posted by: Chris P | October 10, 2008 12:41 PM
A lot of engineers in this country seem to favor the Republican party. Don't know why. I joined the ASME on the basis that it represented the most mechanical engineers and offered health insurance.
They discontinued the health insurance and still don't believe in global warming or resource depletion.
Their magazine is hopeless - I will not be renewing my membership this year. European engineering societies and magazines are all onboard trying to fix global warming.
Posted by: Dahan | October 10, 2008 12:51 PM
Here's another poll that needs a bit of adjustment. It's asking asking if Sarah Palin is qualified.
http://www.time-blog.com/swampland/2008/09/no_questions_please_were.html
It's a PBS poll which apparently the Republicans knew about in advance and are flooding the voting with YES votes. Anyone want to help out with this?
Posted by: Robert J. Grieve | October 11, 2008 3:42 AM
Barack Obama 9701 votes 84.23 (%)
John McCain 592 votes 5.14 (%)
Other 1224 votes 10.63 (%)
PZ's listed result must have been very early on in the poll. Currently, even the "other" category is pulling twice that of McCain.
Posted by: Sondra | October 12, 2008 2:46 PM
Obama is still winning by a very large margin.
Good for you PZ - you have influence.
Good for us all.