…and this is a 
Do you recall this incoherent tale of incest and racism I got a while back? Like almost 4 months ago? Well, the fellow seems to have just now discovered that we were laughing at him, and has sent me his rebuttal. It's only fair that I post it for you now.
There are people that are well educated and very smart. But they just don't have any common sense. If God wanted Adam and Eve to have sex and create then there was absolutely no reason to create the Garden of Eden. He would have given them the power to have sex and create like he did the animals. That's why he created the Garden of Eden. That was their home for eternity. And Adam and Eve would not destroy the Garden of Eden and the animals would never destroy the earth. That makes sense to me. If it doesn't make sense to you and the rest of those idiots that commented on my story then you and the rest of them are the ones that need help. Open your eyes and see the truth. Your simply going to over populate one day in the future. So stop creating and tell your inbred children not to create when they grow up. If you don't then it will be your inbred generations that suffer it won't be mine.
Did that make sense to you? It didn't make sense to me. Obviously, I must be the one with the problem.
Comments
Posted by: JD | July 1, 2009 3:56 PM
Goddamn insanity. WTdoubleF??
Posted by: Mike the Englishman | July 1, 2009 3:57 PM
It's because you're not filled with the spirit. Ask any cretin.Posted by: Davey | July 1, 2009 3:57 PM
Incredible. There must literally be a different interpretation of the bible for every human who wishes to believe it.
Posted by: DGKnipfer | July 1, 2009 3:59 PM
@ #1,
Hey now!! No WTboubleFing around here or you'll over populate the planet just like the Waco is telling us!!!
Posted by: Owlmirror | July 1, 2009 3:59 PM
The words, syntax and grammar are English, but the language is still Crazy.
Posted by: Svetogorsk | July 1, 2009 4:00 PM
So where does the talking snake come in?
Posted by: damnedyankee | July 1, 2009 4:00 PM
Boldface Comic Sans? Is that like a sort of Pharyngulite standing ovation for those taking their lunacy above and beyond all expectations?
He certainly doesn't disappoint. I'd say his train of thought derailed, but I don't think it was ever on rails to begin with.
Posted by: Jadehawk, OM
|
July 1, 2009 4:01 PM
Voluntary Human Extinction Movement member with mental health issues...?
Posted by: Crispin | July 1, 2009 4:02 PM
I'm just glad they won't be 'creating'. Candidate for a Darwin Award really.
Posted by: 'Tis Himself, OM
|
July 1, 2009 4:04 PM
The stupid, it bewilders.
Posted by: Ash | July 1, 2009 4:06 PM
@ Mike the Englishman: by "spirit", you obviously mean alcohol.
Posted by: VitoT | July 1, 2009 4:06 PM
So wait, allowing us to have sex is God's way of punishing us for original sin? Showed us!
Posted by: dean | July 1, 2009 4:07 PM
Puts a new take on referring to their god as a "creator", doesn't it.
Posted by: Josh
|
July 1, 2009 4:09 PM
Well, if we presume that he's talking about people in general, then at least he got something possibly right. That's better than our resident delusionist
sareis currently fairing.Posted by: 'Tis Himself, OM
|
July 1, 2009 4:09 PM
You've never heard of the one-eyed trouser snake?
Interestingly, our boy here claims that Adam and Eve weren't supposed to have sex but were fully equipped with reproductive organs.
Posted by: forksmuggler | July 1, 2009 4:11 PM
Too bad his parents didn't share this philosophy.
Posted by: Michael | July 1, 2009 4:11 PM
While over-population is certainly a problem that will most likely only get worse the reasoning this guy is using is just totally insane.
Though, this is what you would expect from cretinists.
Posted by: daveau
|
July 1, 2009 4:13 PM
See? You do get it.
I recall us being very concerned about this fellow's mental health.
Posted by: Tomato Addict | July 1, 2009 4:13 PM
@15: Fully equipped? You mean fig-leaves are not standard equipment? I learn something new every day ...
Posted by: Glen Davidson
|
July 1, 2009 4:14 PM
I guess he takes ID seriously, as he's afraid that we will "create," not "procreate."
Sorry about all my creating. But honestly, I thought the platypus was a pretty good April 1 creation. And don't whine to me about camels, they work okay no matter what they look like.
You try creating, moron, before complaining about me creating.
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p
Posted by: Quidam
|
July 1, 2009 4:15 PM
I recall a pastor getting very upset when I pointed out that the Garden of Eden was a story of children growing up, finding out about sex* and rebelling against a repressive father figure who wanted them to stay as children.
*the 'tree of knowledge' is an obvious metaphor, especially when we know what the bible means when it says 'know'.
Posted by: The Woo Master | July 1, 2009 4:15 PM
'There are people that are well educated and very smart'
Well, you can't argue with that! Unfortunately, he is not among that group.
Posted by: gypsytag | July 1, 2009 4:22 PM
the question is - did this lunatic reproduce?
or is he just another typical fundie nutter that thinks the rules don't apply to him?
Posted by: Ichthyic | July 1, 2009 4:24 PM
And Adam and Eve would not destroy the Garden of Eden and the animals would never destroy the earth.
That makes sense to me.
that's what worries me.
Posted by: Rev. BigDumbChimp | July 1, 2009 4:24 PM
wait
What?
Posted by: Gabriel Torres | July 1, 2009 4:25 PM
Well, after reading the post, I'm assuming he won't be doing any "creating", and therefore passing on the crazy. I can't believe they let people like that use the Internet (I know there are cases that are at least as bad, if not worse, but bear with me.)
Posted by: DGKnipfer | July 1, 2009 4:25 PM
Crispin @ #9
I have my doubts there. I'm betting he's going at it every day with his sister/daughter/cousin (an all in one package deal) every night.
Posted by: 386sx | July 1, 2009 4:25 PM
But they just don't have any common sense.
I like the new Firefox web browser.
If God wanted Adam and Eve to have sex and create then there was absolutely no reason to create the Garden of Eden.
I like the Opera web browser too. I will use them both.
He would have given them the power to have sex and create like he did the animals.
I will not be using Internet Explorer.
Posted by: JackC
|
July 1, 2009 4:25 PM
Wow. I forgot that I had even commented on the original thread. I kind of liked that "SheMale" concept though. all MetroSexual and all...
This person just doesn't get any better with age. At least the one long paragraph - was shorter.
Won't someone think of the morfadites??
JC
Posted by: Gorogh | July 1, 2009 4:26 PM
Does voluntary elimination from the gene pool qualify for the Darwin Award? Not very spectacular, but definitely stupid as hell.
Posted by: Salvatore | July 1, 2009 4:35 PM
@ #5
Did you read that insane e-mail carefully? I don't mean to be critical of your comment, but his syntax and grammar could use some rework as well as his crazy word choice which you alluded to.
Posted by: Dan | July 1, 2009 4:41 PM
If Christians would follow his logic (common sense as he calls it), then they should not procreate and one day we would be rid of them. But unfortunately they don't practice what they preach.
Posted by: RowanVT | July 1, 2009 4:46 PM
I have but one rebuttal to that level of crazy:
If we weren't meant to have sex, we wouldn't have a penis or a vagina. There would have been no "nudity" to cover as Adam and Eve would have both been neuters. Your argument is flawed beyond repair.
Posted by: Deen | July 1, 2009 4:50 PM
Sorry, you're writing to the wrong group if you want to stop overpopulating. It's not the atheists who tend to have the largest families.Posted by: Brian's A Wild Downer | July 1, 2009 4:53 PM
I really don't understand people that want to tell atheists about what god wants, or wanted, or is like. Do they not understand that we don't believe such a thing exists? If i were to tell you about how I was abducted by aliens and you didn't believe me, would it help to convince you if I told you how nice the aliens were?
Posted by: lose_the_woo
|
July 1, 2009 4:53 PM
My piece of advice to this - eh hem - person...
Stick to coloring books.
Posted by: The Tim Channel
|
July 1, 2009 4:53 PM
Rightwing facts are kinda like creationist facts. Rush Limbaugh recently stated:
"Facts are facts.
Michael Jackson flourished under Reagan.
Languished under Clinton/Bush and
Died under Obama.
Michael Jackson died under the era of the first Black president."
Isn't Rush Limbaugh a real dick?
Enjoy.
Posted by: No One Of Consequence | July 1, 2009 4:54 PM
More than anything, this statement has me scratching my head...
...He won't have children... RIGHT?
Posted by: NewEnglandBob
|
July 1, 2009 4:55 PM
Word Salad! With bible juice dressing! created by a nuthouse.
Now I go back to my lab in the belfry where I create like mad. Bwahahahaha........
Posted by: The Rockridge Brother | July 1, 2009 4:55 PM
Wow..
This guy is so repressed that he cant even come up with a better word than 'create'?! I bet just typing S-E-X made his fingers tremble on the keyboard and sweat break out on his forehead, accompanied by an unfamiliar tingling sensation..
Posted by: littlejohn | July 1, 2009 4:55 PM
If Genesis is to be believed, Adam and Eve had genitals (why else did they feel the need for the fig leaves, etc.?). If not for reproduction, why did they have ... Oh shit, I'm picking on the retarded kid at recess.
Whenever someone starts extolling the benefits of "common sense" over actual intelligence, you know where they're headed. And you know which they don't have.
Posted by: Caymen Paolo Diceda | July 1, 2009 4:56 PM
It was nominally English. At least I recognized the words. However it's not really coherent enough to understand or reply to. Sad that there are such idiots out there, but I guess they have that right -- to be idiots -- if they don't interfere with society.
They're good entertainment, but people like Hovind and his blog are a lot more fun, because some of them can actually write.
Posted by: Josh
|
July 1, 2009 4:59 PM
I didn't really need another reason to think Rush was a complete fucking waste of a human being, but thanks for offering it up anyway. It's a fitting bit of punctuation after a really despicable sentence.
Posted by: Richie P | July 1, 2009 5:01 PM
To quote the infamous Victor Meldrew-
"What language are you speaking? It appears to be bollocks".
Posted by: Fatmop | July 1, 2009 5:04 PM
If my pet ferret wanted Sally and Liz to play basketball and build models out of legos then there was absolutely no reason to create the gender equality. He would have given them the power to play basketball and build models out of legos like he did the boys. That's why he created the gender equality. That was their cause for eternity. And Sally and Liz would not destroy the gender equality and the boys would never destroy the earth. That makes sense to me.
Posted by: Paul | July 1, 2009 5:05 PM
I must have missed the first letter, so I went back and read it. I woke up my napping wife and scared the dogs out of the office because I was laughing so hard! This is good stuff! The more recent letter is way too short...I want more!! Easily some of the funniest crazy ever committed to a blog post.
Posted by: Stu
|
July 1, 2009 5:08 PM
If we weren't meant to have sex, we wouldn't have a penis or a vagina.
Exactly. And if men's nipples weren't meant to be played with...
Posted by: Chris | July 1, 2009 5:09 PM
Aside from lacking common sense this person doesn't even know how to read the bible correctly. The very first instruction god gives to humanity is to, "Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it..." (Gen 1:28 KJV) in stark opposition to the opinion of the e-mailer.
Posted by: strangebrew | July 1, 2009 5:09 PM
Just further proof ...if ever required...that god bothering inevitably and systematically leads to excessive and virulent insanity of the totally raving kind...
Posted by: Becca Stareyes
|
July 1, 2009 5:13 PM
Nitpick -- there are plenty of smart people who do not plan on directly contributing to the gene pool. (I'm content on making sure my (future) nieces and nephews and present and future cousins' kids grow up smart and exposed to science).
Granted, there are also plenty of stupid, ignorant and crazy people who also are not parents nor plan on being parents.
Posted by: BMcP | July 1, 2009 5:13 PM
So in summary: All sex, and he means all sex, is evil, man it must suck to be his wife.
Love how Satan put in this tree and God just decide to take a risk and warn Adam and Eve rather then, I dunno, remove the freakin' tree. Then he proceeds to curse all of mankind for their eating of the fruit of the tree he could have just removed, knowing what will happen. Epic.
Posted by: John Pieret | July 1, 2009 5:16 PM
Even without reading it, something tells me that "fair" is the last thing this person needs.
Posted by: Waydude | July 1, 2009 5:18 PM
Not only am I not going to stop creating, I'm going to go make sure all of my educated have loads of rugrats. It's a numbers game people, get to procreatin'! Just imagine hoards of rational people spreading the word of reason across the world, going out in little teams of two and knocking on doors.
Nah, that would never work.
Posted by: skyotter | July 1, 2009 5:19 PM
huh. made perfect sense to me: the author was trying to use sarcasm, and failing badly
the sarcasm is that the author obviously believes that Dog *did* create humans to reproduce (like animals? lol!) and that Teh Ghey Ajenduh is all about *not* reproducing
just more evidence that people who don't understand sarcasm shouldn't try to employ it
Posted by: Cay | July 1, 2009 5:19 PM
PZ - This guy is obviously crazy. I think publishing his email rants, poking fun at them, and starting off a big comment thread so other people can attack him crosses a line of human decency. I don't want to bully a guy with such obvious mental issues and I hate when you do it it.
Blog entries about public figures like Jenny McCarthy or Kent Hovind are different. Mostly because they have widespread influence and can cause great harm, but also because they are functional enough to defend themselves.
My rational humanist ethics, not religion or god, say attacking this poor guy is immature and cruel.
Posted by: Jabfish | July 1, 2009 5:20 PM
DGKnipfer @ #27
I just wasted 5 minutes of my day figuring out if it was possible to have sex with your sister/daughter/cousin. I drew a family tree. It is.
Posted by: Jabfish | July 1, 2009 5:22 PM
DGKnipfer @ #27
I just wasted 5 minutes of my day figuring out if it was possible to have sex with your sister/daughter/cousin. I drew a family tree. It is.
Posted by: bill stockdale | July 1, 2009 5:23 PM
Sounds like Sarah Palin, almost.
Posted by: Cay | July 1, 2009 5:23 PM
PZ - This guy is obviously crazy. I think publishing his email rants, poking fun at them, and starting off a big comment thread so other people can attack him crosses a line of human decency. I don't want to bully a guy with such obvious mental issues and I hate when you do it it.
Blog entries about public figures like Jenny McCarthy or Kent Hovind are different. Mostly because they have widespread influence and can cause great harm, but also because they are functional enough to defend themselves.
My rational humanist ethics, not religion or god, say attacking this poor guy is immature and cruel.
Posted by: Cay | July 1, 2009 5:27 PM
PZ - This guy is obviously crazy. I think publishing his email rants, poking fun at them, and starting off a big comment thread so other people can attack him crosses a line of human decency. I don't want to bully a guy with such obvious mental issues and I hate when you do it it.
Blog entries about public figures like Jenny McCarthy or Kent Hovind are different. Mostly because they have widespread influence and can cause great harm, but also because they are functional enough to defend themselves.
My rational humanist ethics, not religion or god, say attacking this poor guy is immature and cruel.
Posted by: skyotter | July 1, 2009 5:29 PM
may i point out that i got the Submission Time-Out message, but hit "back" then "refresh" instead of posting again?
or would that be self-serving?
Posted by: Rev. BigDumbChimp | July 1, 2009 5:29 PM
/sigh
Posted by: Tom Foss | July 1, 2009 5:31 PM
Thanks for reminding me of that letter (and the priceless comment thread), PZ. It's almost certainly my favorite letter you've ever posted--right up there with John Kwok's "you owe me a camera" threat.
Posted by: WdaBrock | July 1, 2009 5:32 PM
Made sense to me, the first word in the post that is! The rest was was the bitter dregs of someone on a JesusJuice binge.
Posted by: Caymen Paolo Diceda | July 1, 2009 5:33 PM
For some good sport head over to Eric Hovind's Blog (http://erichovind.blogspot.com/). He has mostly left comments free and open w/o moderation so you can actually have some debate with the creationists who hang out there. He has the usual rules about capitalization etc., enforced by scripts, but they're not too onerous.
His post today is Q&A nonsense about "The Flood."
Have fun!
Posted by: Cuttlefish, OM | July 1, 2009 5:37 PM
Actually, that made perfect sense:
With zero reproduction rate, and population static,
There are no ills of over-use; it's really quite pragmatic!
A self-sufficient microcosm, Eden was sustainable--
I don't know why you think this situation's unexplainable.
But since Eve bit the apple, well, we've reproduced like rabbits,
And the world has suffered greatly from our numbers and our habits;
No more a balanced system that could just as well be sealed,
As the writer of your email has so cogently revealed.
A Malthusian catastrophe could surely be prevented
If with zero population growth we'd only been contented;
The population problem is tremendous and complex,
And it's all because, in Eden, we decided to have sex.
Posted by: waldteufel | July 1, 2009 5:38 PM
After reading this clown's original e-mail, and then this new one, the only conclusion I can come to is that he's insane. A semi-literate, largely ignorant, palpably insane, demented fuckwit.
Posted by: Paul Burnett | July 1, 2009 5:39 PM
VitoT (#12): "So wait, allowing us to have sex is God's way of punishing us for original sin? Showed us!"
Also proved that God has a sense of humor.
Posted by: David Utidjian | July 1, 2009 5:39 PM
Ummm....
Genesis 1:27-28 (NIV)
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”
blah,
blah,
blah...
Not sure how they could be "fruitful" without using their genitalia in the accustomed fashion. Hmmm... perhaps accustomed isn't the right word since it was hardly a custom at that point. Anyhow, they must have had lots of fun exploring their sexuality and figuring out how to multiply since it was commanded of them and all that.
Posted by: Aaron Baker | July 1, 2009 5:39 PM
What about the skunk ape? He mentioned the skunk ape last time, and now I can't stop thinking about it.
Posted by: Bride of Shrek OM | July 1, 2009 5:39 PM
It took FOUR months to reply?
You better watch out PZ, at this rate you'll get his crazy arsed emails at least two or three times a year. What will we do for chuckles in between?
Posted by: Lyle | July 1, 2009 5:40 PM
I read both or his emails, and I tried to see things his way, but it make my head hurt.
It reminds me of a country song - "Momma don't let your babies grow up to be wackjobs!"
Posted by: FunkJunkie | July 1, 2009 5:45 PM
Exactly. And if men's nipples weren't meant to be played with...
Haaaahahaha.
Seriously though, it took the guy this long to construct a rebuttal? It's been months! And it's nowhere near as long and loopy as the original. Surely someone as crazy as this guy should have immediately sat down and spewed another 100,000 words "rebutting" (AKA repeating himself ad nauseum) all the fantastic comments on the last post.
Posted by: Chris Talerico | July 1, 2009 5:45 PM
@Cay (#55)
I have to agree, I can't help but feel this is nothing more than "look at how stupid the believers are", when this guy either has severe mental problems or is putting you on.
Posted by: Caymen Paolo Diceda | July 1, 2009 5:48 PM
He could also be a troll, in which case he's laughing at us all scurrying around.
Posted by: Les Lane | July 1, 2009 5:48 PM
What grade level are we talking about here?
Posted by: Alethias | July 1, 2009 5:49 PM
I've taken the liberty of correcting his spelling grammar, and word-choice errors to make it more comprehensible. Here is a corrected version:
"There are people that are well educated and very smart. But they just don't have any common sense. If God wanted Adam and Eve to have sex and procreate then there was absolutely no reason to create the Garden of Eden. He would have given them the power to have sex and procreate like he did the animals. That's why he created the Garden of Eden. That was their home for eternity. And Adam and Eve would not destroy the Garden of Eden and the animals would never destroy the earth. That makes sense to me. If it doesn't make sense to you and the rest of those idiots that commented on my story then you and the rest of them are the ones that need help. Open your eyes and see the truth. You're simply going to over populate the earth some day in the future. So stop procreating and tell your inbred children not to procreate when they grow up. If you don't, then it will be your inbred generations that suffer -- it won't be mine."
It makes more sense that way, but its stupid, illogical and inconsistent.
I agree that overpopulation presents problems. But that doesn't relate to adam having sex in the garden of eden. Why would you, even as a christian, assume that adam and even had no sex before they sinned? There is nothing in that passage of scripture about sex. It is about the sin of violating a commandment of not eating a specific fruit from a specific tree. It is neither implicit nor explicit that such a fruit is sex.
Why do you assume that the creation of the garden is in any way tied to sex, or lack thereof? Some people are entirely too focussed on sex and attach way to much importance to it. I think maybe you are one of those? Maybe you are just sex starved and so that is all you can think about? I feel for you, man.
I figure that maybe if the garden of eden actually existed, The original sin was asceticism. Maybe adam and eve sinned and partook of the forbidden fruit by denying each other sex. Maybe god was actually punishing them for not having enough sex? Maybe god just wants you to go out and get laid.
Posted by: lose_the_woo
|
July 1, 2009 5:49 PM
Ok, I'm with you here. I follow. You already lost me. It used to be common sense that the Earth was flat. I'm not sure I'm a big fan of the common sense argument. Well here you're all over the place. You presume without evidence the existence of an inept deity, a magical garden, a lone man and woman. You're going to need a lot more background information and lines of evidence to even begin to get this assertion close to the realm of the rational. The fabled account I was taught was that he did. Fictitious creatures can not create anything material. That magical garden is also fictitious. Now you're just pretending to know stuff. None of this is backed up in any way other than the ancient collection of myths you hold so dearly. They would never eat jelly beans either, or learn to surf. Pity. I'm sure it does. The trick is, to pass the insanity test, it also has to make sense to others. But be careful, some of us will actually want evidence for your outlandish assertions. But it does make sense. Perfect sense. Just as much sense as we all know there is a pot of gold at the end of every rainbow, with a leprechaun not too far away. A person can only see what is shown. You have shown nothing. You have demonstrated an ability to plea emotionally and state irrational assertions as certainty without evidence to back them up. Perhaps. Perhaps not. Contraception is a good idea. I think you're just trying to fling insults now because you're frustrated. I'm not sure though...you seem like a stable fellow. PZ, does he know something about your family tree that we don't?Posted by: Salamander | July 1, 2009 5:50 PM
I sometimes worry that I am not fulfilling my responsibilities enough.
Perhaps I should drop my studies and concentrate on populating the earth?
I have yet to find my wife however. In Biblical times fertile men would have far more children than is typical today. There are still good Christians who do have several children by their women though..
Posted by: Michelle R
|
July 1, 2009 6:36 PM
Wow... I just read the original post for the first time. It's... mesmerizing. I actually like his interpretation of the bible! It's original, and it DOES make some sense. More sense than the other interpretations!
Sure it's crazy shit, but it's crazy shit on the level of the other crazy shits.
Posted by: Bridget McKinney | July 1, 2009 6:42 PM
Not going to jump into an anti-creationist rant. Just going to point out:
Genesis 1:28
God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground." (NIV)
I would understand Biblical literalism a bit better if people would actual stick to the literal reading that they claim to adhere to.
Also, I wish I had a penny for every time I see scripture misquoted, every time someone ignores a pertinent verse, every example of biblical quote mining, and every time a biblical literalist uses the words "metaphor" or "allegory" or "symbolic" in their (faulty) exegesis. Then I would donate most of those pennies to the Richard Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science.
Posted by: DLC | July 1, 2009 6:42 PM
At the risk of being accused of also kicking puppies :
If God/Zeus/Yaweh/Yog-Sothoth created the garden of Eden, and meant for Adam and Steve to stay there forever and never reproduce, why did he give them genitals ?
Also, if he meant for them to never reproduce and populate the earth, why allow them to find the tree of knowledge of good and evil, why allow an apple to grow on said tree, and why allow his alter ego to trick them into eating ?
Posted by: Alexander | July 1, 2009 6:59 PM
/OFF Whaha, I always learn somethin' new, now in the first comment: "WTdoubleF??" Lovely!! :)
Posted by: Count_01 | July 1, 2009 7:04 PM
The part that kills me is he uses "scientists" as evidence that there is a hole in the ozone layer (as indeed, geochemists proved) but believes apparently, that human beings and gorillas have the same number of chromosomes and can therefore reproduce (they do not.) You'd think his knowledge of "science" would have covered that.
Posted by: Gorogh | July 1, 2009 7:07 PM
Becca @ 50, nah, I was only referring to "that guy's" stupidity, not to the lack of desire to procreate in general. I guess I simply like the perspective that some people with highly dubious morals won't share them with possible children.
Anyway, no offence.
Posted by: Roland Branconnier | July 1, 2009 7:08 PM
Did someone say - Non Sequitur?
Posted by: Qwerty | July 1, 2009 7:08 PM
Ahhh, this is the Reader's Digest version of his earlier rant. At least he didn't mention the orangutans again.
Posted by: Krystalline Apostate | July 1, 2009 7:12 PM
DGKnipfer @ 27:
The family that plays together, stays together, as they say in the Ozarks.
Posted by: apthorp
|
July 1, 2009 7:14 PM
You know, it sounds like this guy is the prey for the sort or parasitic scam artist that publish books, open museums, and invite whatever sort of ridicule can be heaped on them. At least that would seem to be a conclusion from the "FSM this guy is stupid" consensus above.
Is this the crowd that ridiculed the poor kid who sat in the back corner and was quite as quick or as smart assed as the rest? It must be ok if the teacher does it too, but sometimes a touch of empathy or even graciousness goes a long way.
Posted by: Rev. BigDumbChimp | July 1, 2009 7:19 PM
ycin, as
Posted by: Jaycubed | July 1, 2009 7:20 PM
This piece is nowhere near as interesting as his earlier writings. Is this an excerpt? Or the complete piece?
By the way, this guy posts nearly identical missives on various sites, mostly posting on right wing & mainstream christian sites and berating them for exactly the same things he berates us atheists for.
He doesn't focus his message to the audience.
Posted by: Stu
|
July 1, 2009 7:25 PM
At least that would seem to be a conclusion from the "FSM this guy is stupid" consensus above.
No, the consensus is more like "FSM this guy is fucking nuts". But rest assured, your concern is noted, and rest assured, nobody gives a shit.
Posted by: maddogdelta | July 1, 2009 7:33 PM
Someone sent you a copy of the bible?
Posted by: jimmiraybob | July 1, 2009 7:34 PM
59 - PZ - This guy is obviously crazy. I think publishing his email rants, poking fun at them, and starting off a big comment thread so other people can attack him crosses a line of human decency.
But where do you draw the line between literal Biblical interpretation and crazy? I can easily imagine Michelle Bachmann (R 6th District of Minnesota) reading this or something close on the floor of congress.
Posted by: apthorp
|
July 1, 2009 7:37 PM
Stu -- I'm afraid 5th grade was too long ago and I'm at a loss for the appropriate response.
Please, carry on the vital task of recording the wit and wisdom of the west.
Posted by: Eric | July 1, 2009 7:38 PM
Man, I hadn't thought about "Hee Haw" in YEARS and then I read that letter...
Posted by: 'Tis Himself, OM
|
July 1, 2009 7:43 PM
apthorp #95
Concern troll is concerned.
Posted by: dylan in florida | July 1, 2009 7:43 PM
Well, he's right that we're all inbred, as is everything that has ever lived to some degree or another. And he's right that we should stop our population growth before we strangle our planet to death. But he also thinks stone age creation myths really happened. I dont know how to feel about that.
Posted by: NextChapter
|
July 1, 2009 7:55 PM
I have to go with Cay @ 55. I have worked serveral years as a psych nurse. This seemed to be a frequent theme for some reason with paranoid schizophrinics. It usually includes word salad, flight of ideas, religious ideation, concrete thinking without the ability to think in metaphoric terms; such as, 'A rolling stone gathers no moss', to them would mean exactly that. If you keep a rock rolling over and over again, no moss can grow on it.
Creationist fundies who run around with their fingers in their ears, eyes shut tight, yelling, "LaLaLaLaLa, I can't hear you!", are more than fair game. In fact, I feel a personal duty to piss of as many of them as I can.
But someone who is mentally ill can't help it. And I can tell you from having worked with them, they hate what the illness does to them, and they would give anything to be able to think in a clear thoughtful manner.
Just my 2 cents.
Posted by: Rob Jase | July 1, 2009 8:07 PM
"Posted by: 'Tis Himself | July 1, 2009 4:09 PM
So where does the talking snake come in?
You've never heard of the one-eyed trouser snake?
Interestingly, our boy here claims that Adam and Eve weren't supposed to have sex but were fully equipped with reproductive organs."
hmmmm....that would mean that Adam's penis is the snake, his "seed' (as biblers like to call it) would be the fruit and oral sex was the original sin.
No wonder it feels so good!
Posted by: David Marjanović, OM | July 1, 2009 8:19 PM
Father figure? Little Yahwe (which could mean "becoming")was just about 12 years old and had no idea what was going to happen when he created adults. At least that's what some think, and...
...that makes sense to me.
Posted by: jimmiraybob | July 1, 2009 8:27 PM
NextChapter @ 99,
I asked Cay @ 55, and I didn't mean it as snark, where the line gets drawn between literal Biblical interpretation and crazy? Really, I don't know. What is the indicator? Bad grammar? Excessive capitalization? 5,000-word paragraphs? More bizarre interpretations than the accepted bizarre interpretations? Is it not being able to differentiate between metaphor & allegory and the real?
Is it sane to go on about talking snakes in a mythical garden thousands of years ago but insane to write "If God wanted Adam and Eve to have sex and create then there was absolutely no reason to create the Garden of Eden."?
I'm not advocating kicking the downtrodden and clinically delusional but what is the tell? What's the difference that we can use to tell (in emails especially) the difference between extreme ignorance expressing passionate faith in the unseen and unknowable and insanity?
Posted by: MadScientist | July 1, 2009 8:30 PM
@Jadehawk: hahaha - VHEMT. Unfortunately there is already such a widespread movement with mantras like "humans can't damage the global environment", "science will miraculously come up with a solution", "sustainable growth", and "population growth is a good indicator". Unfortunately, unlike VHEMT, the results will not be as good for humans and many other organisms.
Posted by: epawson | July 1, 2009 9:02 PM
I work in a public library and have spoken to a number of homeless that ramble on in the same manner. They have access to the public computers and use them frequently. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that this is the product of a mentally "unstable" person with free access to a computer. This may also explain the delay in response.
Posted by: sailor1031 | July 1, 2009 9:05 PM
Thanks PZ. I don't know how I missed the original piece but when I just read it I have not laughed so hard in years. Obviously this guy is a totally priceless satirist. Thanks so much for this!!
Posted by: Katherine | July 1, 2009 9:07 PM
At least if he thinks that people should not "create" then he will not have any children to pass the crazy on to.
Posted by: Inky | July 1, 2009 9:23 PM
Oh, the guy that fantasizes about having sex with primates not his own species! You know, I went back to that email and I still can't read it through.
Crazy is as crazy does.
Posted by: RC | July 1, 2009 9:24 PM
I think we'd be doing the world a favour by passing this around to creationist websites. Hopefully we can prevent them all from reproducing. At least this guy isn't!
Posted by: Rorschach | July 1, 2009 9:29 PM
@ 12,
Like some guy(Begala ?) said on Maher the other week, "sex is a vile and disgusting act we are meant to save for the one we truly love ".
Posted by: Beadknitter | July 1, 2009 9:34 PM
"If God wanted Adam and Eve to have sex and create then there was absolutely no reason to create the Garden of Eden. He would have given them the power to have sex and create like he did the animals."
Ummm, I have 2 kids. I got them by having sex. Isn't that how animals do it? Or is he referring to birds laying eggs in nests?
Without the Garden of Eden, how would there have been the good tree and the bad tree? I could have sworn those were important to the story. This guy makes me laugh so hard I have asthma attacks.
The stupid, it burns!
Posted by: Samantha Vimes | July 1, 2009 9:42 PM
It is more to be pitied than scorned. Here's someone who obviously was brought up in religion and anti-sex propaganda. And when mental illness hit, he was bright enough to mix together some logic (If Eve was made from Adam, she's a clone and their DNA is too close!) with religious beliefs he's not clear enough in his thinking to break from fully. He's created a new religion, and it doesn't actually make *less* sense than traditional Creationism; he's probably more intelligent than say, Ken Ham.
Posted by: Dahan | July 1, 2009 9:56 PM
He still can't figure out how to put in a paragraph break. Sigh.
PZ, you stated in the previous post that
While this is impressive, I'm wondering why he couldn't come up with some way to mention enemas as well. That would have really clinched this as an all-time favorite of mine.
Posted by: MikeS29
|
July 1, 2009 9:57 PM
@55,59,60
I understand your concern for this guy's mental health, but I think posting this here is different than us invading this guy's web site. He came here, spouted off unintelligible biblical bullshit (which differs only slightly from mainstream biblical bullshit, by the way) and was able to actually find the site again for a second go around.
I say fire when ready.
Posted by: Pablo | July 1, 2009 10:00 PM
Boy, this guy isn't going to like it when I get around to writing my novellette, to be made into a TV movie, about the lives of Adam and Eve. It was going to start with them in the Garden of Eden with lots of full nudity (there weren't any fig leafs before the fall) and gratuitous sex (most religious recognize the existence of sex before the fall). I figure, what else was there to do?
For some reason, even among the religious, I don't expect them to give it the same "it's not appealing, but it is realistic and therefore acceptable" deference that they gave the gratuitous violence in the Passion of the Christ.
Posted by: ursulamajor | July 1, 2009 10:18 PM
To the writer of this letter:
It wasn't your fault. Whoever molested and hurt you when you were a child was wrong. You were the victim. They lied to you and stole from you. They used the bible to excuse their crime against you. Please get help. Your anger has driven you to a place where you are danger to yourself and others.
Posted by: J-Dog | July 1, 2009 10:30 PM
PZ - Level with us... Which Republican Gov or Senator sent that to you?
Posted by: JefFlyingV | July 1, 2009 10:37 PM
I think the person that sent you the e-mail rebuttal had one too many rides on the dinosaur saddle at the "Creationist Museum". Is this rebuttal a reality-religious disconnect?
Posted by: Mig | July 1, 2009 11:06 PM
Wow, he's back. I am firmly in the camp that worries about this person's mental health-- he, I assume it's a he, is pretty disturbed. This is no Poe.
That being said, I know this guy is a wack-job, but, I have to confess... it would be fascinating to follow him around. I wouldn't want him to KNOW I was following him, of course, but, there's some real bat-shit crazy goin' on in this one; I would love to observe him.
(Does anyone think this guy is just one member of a larger group who hold these beliefs? Are there pockets of society in which this kind of thinking is common? I mean, specifically, THESE beliefs.)
Anyway, it's time for me to go shave the elephants-- those residing in northern zoos will tend to go all shaggy on ya, if they aren't shaved regularly. Visitors hate that...
Posted by: NextChapter
|
July 1, 2009 11:06 PM
jimmyraybob @ 102.
I understand what you are saying. It is ironic that it can be damn difficult to be able to tell the difference between someone who is psychotic and right-wing, conservative, religious, fundamentalist. I think there are a few ways though, even through email.
Bad grammer, disjointed sentences and paragraphs that go onto infinity can be applied to either one. However, if you go back and read this guys 1st email, Not only does he have all of that, he is also showing a very clear example of, 'Flight-of-Ideas'. His sentences and the thoughts he's trying to get across are barely coherent, especially in the first letter. It is also fixated on sex. People who are bipolar can have a psychotic break in either the depressive or manic state. When it happens in the manic state, people can become hypersexual. With a psychotic break, it is thought that the reason it is often accompanied by religious ideation is because it states a 'good' and 'bad' side. Black. White. People having a psychotic break are rarely able to think in shades of grey or the ability to access their higher level cognitive skills. Their thinking is more concrete.
I could go into more detail, but here is one way that I think you can tell the difference between a crazy, christian fundie, and a person who is crazy that christian fundies got ahold of.
Crazy christian fundie - Either:
1. You stupid, fucking, piece of dog shait! I hope you burn in Hell for a million years while Satan screws you in your ass and his penis comes out of your mouth you low life atheist, Hitler worm. Or -
2. Jesus is the way, the truth and the light. If you will just dedicate you entire life to him and sing his praises to all who will listen, he may decide to spare your eternal soul,...even though you are a piece of dog shait that is not worth it and you'll never be good enough. I will pray for you.
Psychotic person - Religious bizarre ramblings? Yes.
Do they either try to convience you that you are wrong and try to convert you, or, are they outraged and feel you should hung or burned at the stake because you are a traitor to God and country? No. They are not that insane. :)
But we have different levels of crazy in this country now. This one just blew me away. When did the Republicans go insane?! Glen Becks guest, Scheuer, feels the only way to get America back on the right track is to have Osama Bin Laden to lauch a major attack against us on American soil
And the lines blur even more.
Posted by: NextChapter
|
July 1, 2009 11:26 PM
Damn! Link didn't work. Try this.
Glen's guest wants to save America by having war over here
Posted by: MoGemStone
|
July 1, 2009 11:43 PM
Wow, I wish(?) that I had read the original screed on 13Feb!
Try this : Internet search "create closer than closer flesh" - my 1st Google hit was "Satan The Bible And Evolution" 28Feb09. Identical screed (but with paragraphs). It included an email for comments!
Is this a ripoff of the 13Feb missive, or is it a re-posting by the same person? These questions are easier to contemplate than the questions raised by reading the screed.
Please, PZM, publish condensed versions of such insanity for those of us whose frail minds have not yet been inured to kookism.
Posted by: Y. Esme | July 2, 2009 12:06 AM
There is no possible way that there's anyone who believes in the stuff that was written in those emails actually exit. It's gotta be a troll.... at least, for the sake of humanity, I hope it is.
Posted by: someguy | July 2, 2009 12:14 AM
At least he clearly said that he's not going to "create". So the plus side is that he won't pass on whatever crazy gene he has.
Posted by: Jeff S | July 2, 2009 12:43 AM
I read through it a few times.
I think his point is that everyone is related (being the offspring of Adam and Eve), so anyone who procreates is participating in incest.
Its an interesting kind of religious crazy. If all theists took this stance they would die out in one generation.
He does make one good point that I would think most theists would see as inconsequential (being that the earthly world is temporary and will end with the coming of some zombie dude named jesus. We are destroying the earth and over populating.
Posted by: Gio | July 2, 2009 12:48 AM
I just never understood how if God can forgive people for most of their sins why can't people forgive each other for most of their sins. It's like they do not pay attention in church. ;)
Posted by: jimmiraybob | July 2, 2009 12:48 AM
NextChapter,
I'm glad that my question was read as a serious inquiry. I love the snark and feel that ridicule is a valuable tool but using either on the truly mentally ill is not a good thing. But when I hear Michell Bachmann spew some of the stuff that she does I wonder where the line is.
I'm glad that you brought up the Scheur/Beck piece. To me this epitomizes the heights (or lows) of right-wing speak these days - it's been increasing at such an astonishing rate I'm actually nervous these days (used to be able to blow this stuff off as isolated crackpottery but these days....). To seriously suggest that what we need is to loose a city and thousands to millions of people just to give us the lesson that we deserve is beyond even Coulter....barely. Now I suppose there'll be a race to outcrazy Scheur and the escalation continues.
I think that they have or will soon be hitting peak insanity en masse - even though I'm not a doctor I think it's probably clinical - and then where do they go? Forging ties with Bin Laden? Tim McVeigh with a nuke? I'd just seen the Scheur/Beck piece at C & L and it was on my mind when I was typing my earlier question to you.
Anyway, thanks for the reply. May we all survive the ride to the top of crazy mountain.
Posted by: fairmack
|
July 2, 2009 2:19 AM
MICHAEL THE NARC-ANGEL
Millions of little members of the worldwide F.F.A. (Future Followers of the Antichrist) have finally learned how to find a certain part of their lower anatomy and quickly touch it while dancing - thanks to Michael Jackson, the highest paid Lower Anatomy Toucher of all time! Special thanks also go to the Jesus-bashing, Hell-bound Hollywood moguls who were just as quick to see higher profits in lower anatomies! [Just saw this opinion on the web. Other grabby items on MSN, Google, etc. include "Separation of Raunch and State," "David Letterman's Hate, Etc.," "Tribulation Index becomes Rapture Index," and "Bible Verses Obama Avoids." - something for everyone!]
Posted by: Markus Saers | July 2, 2009 2:20 AM
"If you don't then it will be your inbred generations that suffer it won't be mine."
I really wonder what it is that makes his inbred "generations" less prone to future suffering...
Posted by: Cowcakes | July 2, 2009 2:30 AM
Well if Ceiling Cat didn't want us to have sex he really cocked up (excuse the pun) with the giving Adam & Eve a penis and vagina thing. But then again we are replete with poor design choices.
Posted by: Richard Eis | July 2, 2009 4:36 AM
-So stop creating and tell your inbred children not to create when they grow up-
Does that mean he is in favour of the gay agenda?
Posted by: TheThomas | July 2, 2009 4:45 AM
I think that he was saying that he is not going to breed, that's a plus.
Posted by: Gilian | July 2, 2009 4:53 AM
I can't take this e-mail serious, there's Not EnOUGH RAndOM CAPITALS iN IT !!111shiftone!
Posted by: Pixel | July 2, 2009 5:53 AM
It saddens me that there really are people like this out there. And they're breeding.
*sigh*
Posted by: Drosera
|
July 2, 2009 6:25 AM
NextChapter @120,
Thanks for the link. This is really frightening stuff. Shortly after 9/11 I wrote to an American friend that if the terrorists had used nuclear weapons, this would have given certain elements in the US government the excuse to create the perfect totalitarian state. All the technology necessary to do so is already available.
And now we have the CIA man responsible for intelligence concerning Osama bin Laden, Scheuer, suggesting that it would be a good thing if said terrorist nuked a city in the US, since this would finally force the government to step up security. I think I know exactly what this creep has in mind (see my first paragraph).
Speaking of ‘the enemy within!’
Posted by: Jim | July 2, 2009 7:33 AM
Uh oh, he used that old number. I keep forgetting that the more pseudoscience and superstition you believe in, the more open-minded this apparently makes you.
Posted by: Silverlock | July 2, 2009 10:02 AM
And a new meme is hatched by JefFlyingV in comment #117:
Any person who writes one of these crackpot manifestos shall henceforward be said to be "riding the dinosaur saddle."
Nicely done, JefFlyingV.
Posted by: Silverlock | July 2, 2009 10:02 AM
And a new meme is hatched by JefFlyingV in comment #117:
Any person who writes one of these crackpot manifestos shall henceforward be said to be "riding the dinosaur saddle."
Nicely done, JefFlyingV.
Posted by: Barklikeadog | July 2, 2009 10:48 AM
Having sex in the Garden of Eden is sorta like doing it in a church. It's exhilirating and fun. The prospect of getting caught makes all the more fun. Must have been a great time. Sounds really kinky, feeding each other fruit and with a pet snake and all the animals watching. Then the guilt. Oh, the guilt afterwards. All the more reason to do it again just to see if you resolve the guilt issue. But the second time we did get caught and on top of that she got pregnant and oh, if you think things were peachy then you should have seen our parents reactions. My Dad snickered. I caught him at it.
Posted by: Foster Disbelief | July 2, 2009 12:47 PM
Well, over population is a problem, so he gets one point. My question is simple. Where do you go to get trained in this kind of idiotic delusion? Who teaches that before Jesus was born, people cut the vocal nerves of children with birth defects so they could never speak english? Who teaches that the romans, jews, and the f'n christians rose up and had Jesus crucified?
That's it, I'm blaming all of the worlds problems on the english speaking christians who killed christ while committing incest.
Seriously....I think there is a mental hospital with an empty bed looking for the author.
Posted by: Foster Disbelief | July 2, 2009 12:51 PM
Well, over population is a problem, so he gets one point. My question is simple. Where do you go to get trained in this kind of idiotic delusion? Who teaches that before Jesus was born, people cut the vocal nerves of children with birth defects so they could never speak english? Who teaches that the romans, jews, and the f'n christians rose up and had Jesus crucified?
That's it, I'm blaming all of the worlds problems on the english speaking christians who killed christ while committing incest.
Seriously....I think there is a mental hospital with an empty bed looking for the author.
Posted by: Slaughter | July 2, 2009 4:35 PM
There was racism in that February post? I had to quit midway through the Garden of Eden stuff. Life's too short to deal with such idiocy.
Posted by: Dorkman | July 3, 2009 1:35 PM
On the upside, he seems to be implying that, due to our common ancestry with Adam & Eve, ALL procreation is incest, and he refuses to be a part of it. In other words, he's been kind enough to take himself out of the gene pool for us.
Posted by: Penis Enlargement Pills | July 8, 2009 8:17 AM
Vimax, Vigrx Plus, and Prosolution may be up best penis enlargement pills available, and can increase the size of the penis between 3-4 inches with as little as 2 weeks. http://www.pill-penisenlargement.com