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Category: Religion
Posted on: September 30, 2009 10:40 AM, by PZ Myers
My appearance at Bates made it to the Lewiston Sun Journal.
They did get a little piece of one point I tried to make. I don't think religion makes people do wicked things, and that's not my gripe with it. What it does is cut an intellectual brake line, making them incapable of dealing with certain situations rationally — they may do what is right, or they may do something that's just nuts, but you just can't rely on them doing what is reasonable.
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Comments
Posted by: Glen Davidson
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September 30, 2009 10:47 AM
I think some simply don't want to deal with certain things rationally. Similar outcome, I know.
Glen D
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p
Posted by: Aratina Cage
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September 30, 2009 10:53 AM
The comments there are lolicious. How dare you blaspheme their
godcracker!Posted by: fishyfred
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September 30, 2009 10:54 AM
I love love LOVE the photo they included in the article. It's like they're trying to catch you going "OOGA BOOGA BOOGA."
Posted by: daveau
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September 30, 2009 10:55 AM
An atheist and an evolutionist. Double whammy!
Posted by: Matt "Nora" Penfold
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September 30, 2009 11:21 AM
In some cases I would say only do they not want to but they cannot. A strict religious upbringing coupled with being schooled at home or in church schools, and lack of experience of the larger world is not a good way to equip someone with the tools they need to navigate their way through difficult dilemmas. Even the most rational and level-headed of people can struggle when faced with a situation in which there are no obviously good options.
Posted by: Trug
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September 30, 2009 11:46 AM
Agreed, the comments there are pretty entertaining. I popped on to congratulate the students for putting on a good event, and it couldn't hurt to get some other pharyngulites over there to do the same. If you're so inclined, of course. :-)
And is anyone else mildly offended that the term "evolutionist" exists? I don't hear of "gravityists" anywhere...
Posted by: Eamon Knight
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September 30, 2009 11:47 AM
— they may do what is right, or they may do something that's just nuts, but you just can't rely on them doing what is reasonable.
Unfortunately, humans in general aren't known for "doing what is reasonable". Religion no doubt exacerbates the problem, most obviously in extreme cases like hard-line Islamism. But in the case of the more moderate religion I generally encounter locally? I'm not persuaded that it is, for most people, a major contributor to doing silly things.
Posted by: ciphergoth
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September 30, 2009 1:25 PM
What it does is cut an intellectual brake line
Thank you! I've been looking for a metaphor to express what it is that worries me about belief. This is the closest so far.
Posted by: Sili
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September 30, 2009 1:35 PM
Well, they call it a cracker without scarequotes, so they're not too irrational.
And hell, they give your affiliation in full. I find it hard to believe that this is not effectively good PR for UMM.
As I said elsethread, I'm sure that a lot of people - like me - would not ever have heard of Morris, if it wasn't for you. In fact I doubt I'd know where Minnesota were exactly nor what it's capital is.
Posted by: sorceror171
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September 30, 2009 1:39 PM
I usually describe religion as a catalyst for irrationality. (Catalysts don't generally make an impossible reaction possible, they accelerate chemical reactions. In practice, they can accelerate some reactions from the "impractically slow" to the "usefully fast", but they don't actually change the nature of the reaction.)
Religion doesn't cause all conflict or irrational behavior in the world, and there'd still be plenty of trouble even if religion weren't around. But religion tends to enhance irrationality.
For example, did you know that, back when the Zionist movement was getting started, there was a serious proposal to establish a Jewish homeland in South America? Instead, for entirely religious reasons, the Palestine region was selected, and... well, we've seen how well that's worked out.
Posted by: Kausik Datta
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September 30, 2009 2:12 PM
Damn, Trug! You beat me to it! :)
Any time I hear the term 'evolutionist', my thoughts go to the person whose fingers typed it out or wrote it. Is there an element of ignorance, or lack of reasoning, or perhaps a spark of insanity - in that mind? In order to be an -ist, there has to be an -ism. Evolution has no -isms! Unlike religion, evolution is not a fact-free, evidence-less, faith-based belief system, neither is it a 'worldview'. Evolution is a simple biological fact, painstakingly established with evidence from a variety of scientific disciplines. When and where, in this country, did that become so difficult to understand?
Posted by: forthesakeofscience.wordpress.com
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September 30, 2009 2:16 PM
I'm glad this talk was held in Lewiston. Had it been in Augusta or somewhere more central, it probably wouldn't have had any coverage since the papers here just got bought by some conservative hack.
Oh, and there were 38 people there, not 25.
Posted by: bobxxxx
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September 30, 2009 2:31 PM
A comment from the Lewiston Sun Journal: "Just because he doesn't believe doesn't mean he should disrespect other people's beliefs."
This Christian retard needs to be told there's no reason to respect any belief. Also, respecting Christianity, or any other religion, is as immoral as respecting racism.
We now have daily suicide bombings in the Middle East, and in America we have uneducated morons yelling at biology teachers. The time for respecting religious beliefs is over. The only moral thing to do is to relentlessly attack and ridicule the out of control religious insanity in this world.
Posted by: bobxxxx
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September 30, 2009 2:36 PM
In Sunday school, where children's lives are destroyed long before learn anything about science.
Posted by: myminddroppings.wordpress.com
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September 30, 2009 2:56 PM
We've got into this mess because of the use/abuse of the words "respect". I respect your right to have different / opposing views - but that does not mean I am obliged to respect the view itself.
Views - but their very nature are ideas whose strength / weaknesses lie in how well they can be substantiated. Respecting or honoring unsubstantiated claims is an abdication of intellect. We need to disrobe such spurious constructs and do it regularly and unabashedly.
Recently, Newsweek published an article by Lisa Miller titled "Out! Out! Dammed Atheists!!". I do not recall anyone asking her to show restraint or even respect. And quite frankly - no one should. It is her right to express her views no matter how unkind they may be.
That said, she should be prepared to substantiate her views and any failure to do so should result in scathing critique. I did just that on my BLOG (http://myminddroppings.wordpress.com).
I was not hassled by the fact that she was directing critique at Atheists - I was offended by the intellectual paucity with which she was doing it. Check it out if you have some time.
Posted by: Kevin
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September 30, 2009 8:02 PM
A few months back there was an article presenting MRI evidence that expert financial advise triggered an "offloading" decision making , I have thought about the idea in the context of religious "expert" advice ever since, Your comment "...What it does is cut an intellectual brake line..." seems to be right along those lines.
http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0004957
Posted by: Tmax01
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October 3, 2009 12:39 AM
I have been searching for months for just the right phrase to explain the danger of religion and how it results in, without particularly causing, unethical behavior.
It "cuts an intellectual brake line." Thanks, PZ, you Internet Atheist God, you.