wapo https://scienceblogs.com/ en Washington Post's Fred Hiatt and George Will: Stupid, Lying, or Craven? « The Way Things Break https://scienceblogs.com/illconsidered/2009/04/washington-posts-fred-hiatt-an <span>Washington Post&#039;s Fred Hiatt and George Will: Stupid, Lying, or Craven? « The Way Things Break</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>So, George Will and the Washington Post <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/01/AR2009040103042.html">are at it again</a>, head over to <a href="http://thingsbreak.wordpress.com/2009/04/02/washington-posts-fred-hiatt-and-george-will-stupid-lying-or-craven/">Things Break for the details</a>.</p> <p>These institutions are oblivious to their own impending demise, a <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/20/AR2009032002660.html">demise</a> that articles like George Will's show they fully deserve.</p> <p>[Update: <a href="http://www.grist.org/article/2009-04-07-post-reporter-calls-out-will/">Grist notes</a> that Will is <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/06/AR2009040601634.html">called out by name by his own paper</a> for making claims contradicted by the facts...and let's call a spade a spade, given that he has been loudly and repeatedly informed of his factually incorrect claims and yet repeats them, he must be stupid or a liar.]</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/author/illconsidered" lang="" about="/author/illconsidered" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">illconsidered</a></span> <span>Wed, 04/08/2009 - 04:39</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mainstream-media" hreflang="en">mainstream media</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/other-blogs" hreflang="en">other blogs</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/george-will" hreflang="en">George Will</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/things-break" hreflang="en">things break</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/wapo" hreflang="en">wapo</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/washington-post" hreflang="en">Washington Post</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585607" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1239182585"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I won't miss the WP when its gone. In a similar vein the Associated Press is up in arms again about Google getting rich off of their content, and trying to establish a way that newspapers could demand Googlegeld, their own version of Danegeld, a tribute tax they felt entitled to get just for being listed in Google. Daggle has a good article pointing our the flawed thinking of print publishers in the internet age.</p> <p><a href="http://daggle.com/090406-225638.html">http://daggle.com/090406-225638.html</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585607&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="OHBJDqcAkb9NE5EfzXo8RuMpgUJ3FGisi2CY0eYHwOE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">kevin (not verified)</span> on 08 Apr 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585607">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585608" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1239279532"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Actually, there is (of course) even more.</p> <p>See: <a href="http://getenergysmartnow.com/2009/04/09/washington-posts-willfully-civil-war/">http://getenergysmartnow.com/2009/04/09/washington-posts-willfully-civi…</a> </p> <p>And</p> <p><a href="http://getenergysmartnow.com/2009/04/09/mea-culpa-i-trusted-george-will-and-washington-post-fact-checking/">http://getenergysmartnow.com/2009/04/09/mea-culpa-i-trusted-george-will…</a></p> <p>And</p> <p><a href="http://getenergysmartnow.com/2009/04/02/will-writes-will-whines/">http://getenergysmartnow.com/2009/04/02/will-writes-will-whines/</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585608&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="64_0FV258_cEydfae5pPzgKFfoLSxTie-2wBjTN2xH4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a rel="nofollow" href="http://getenergysmartnow.com" lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">A Siegel (not verified)</a> on 09 Apr 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585608">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/illconsidered/2009/04/washington-posts-fred-hiatt-an%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Wed, 08 Apr 2009 08:39:31 +0000 illconsidered 41095 at https://scienceblogs.com Things Break takes down George Will's latest https://scienceblogs.com/illconsidered/2009/02/things-break-takes-down-george <span>Things Break takes down George Will&#039;s latest</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Things Break does <a href="http://thingsbreak.wordpress.com/2009/02/27/george-will-and-the-washington-post-reputations-gone-up-in-smoke-over-global-warming-denialism/">a thorough take-down of George Will's continued dishonesty</a> in the Washington Post. For the background, if somehow you have missed this kerfuffle, <a href="http://thingsbreak.wordpress.com/2009/02/20/waiting-for-wapo/">check his earlier post</a>.</p> <p>The story in a nutshell is not remarkable: mainstream columnist prints op-ed full of outright falsehoods, complaints are rejected, paper stands by its right to fill the information age with disinformation. ie <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2009/02/washington_post_rejects_the_co.php">Facts don't matter</a>.</p> <!--more--><p>The only remarkable thing really is the attention it is receiving and who knows, perhaps there will be some <a href="http://www.scienceprogress.org/2009/02/the-george-will-scandal/">real consequences</a>... like maybe people will remember this for a change.</p> <p>It is also worth noting the <a href="http://initforthegold.blogspot.com/2009/02/revkin-beyond-pale.html">destructive contribution</a> made by Andy Revkin from the New York Times by his <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/25/science/earth/25hype.html">all too standard</a> equation of a questionable characterization in a small portion of an Al Gore presentation (already retracted) and the continual, unapologetic <a href="http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/2009/02/23/george-will-zombie/">repetition of outright falsehoods</a> by George Will.</p> <p>I have a little more sympathy than <a href="http://initforthegold.blogspot.com/2009/02/revkin-beyond-pale.html">Michael Tobis</a> for people who I <em>think</em> are very well intentioned but working from inside the machine, but sometimes the price of not rocking the boat is too high. Michael is absolutely right that framing the debate with Gore and Will as the two extreme ends puts the "reasonable middle ground" far too far to the wrong. The IPCC's <em>is not</em> a radical viewpoint, it is a very conservative and cautious, <a href="http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2007/03/the-ipcc-sea-level-numbers/">to a fault</a>, voice in the range of viewpoints. Gore is very careful not to stray very far from that conservative consensus. He may chose what to emphasis and when and may simplify his message by sacrificing caveats and error bars, but this is simply nowhere close to the tactics used by the George Wills of this circus. Another egregious error in this equation is that Al Gore's role in this issue is an issue advocate, George Will is supposedly bound by some journalistic ethics. Revkin does a grave disservice to his readers when he pretends to hold them to the same standard, forget that his standard is clearly a double one in Will's favour.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/author/illconsidered" lang="" about="/author/illconsidered" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">illconsidered</a></span> <span>Fri, 02/27/2009 - 07:56</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/debunking" hreflang="en">Debunking</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/news" hreflang="en">News</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/other-blogs" hreflang="en">other blogs</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/climate-change" hreflang="en">climate change</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/george-will" hreflang="en">George Will</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/global-cooling" hreflang="en">global cooling</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/global-warming" hreflang="en">global warming</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/media-lies" hreflang="en">media lies</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/nyt" hreflang="en">nyt</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/wapo" hreflang="en">wapo</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585515" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1235740500"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>âThere is little evidence to suggest that it is effective at building broad-based support for policy action,â Dr. Nisbet said. âPerhaps worse, his message is very easily countered by people such as Will as global-warming alarmism, shifting the focus back to their preferred emphasis on scientific uncertainty and dueling expert views.â</i></p> <p><i>But Dr. Nisbet said that for Mr. Will, there was little downside in stretching the bounds of science to sow doubt.</i></p> <p><i>Criticism of Mr. Willâs columns, Dr. Nisbet said, âonly serves to draw attention to his claims while reinforcing a larger false narrative that liberals and the mainstream press are seeking to censor rival scientific evidence and views.â</i><br /> From the Revkin column.</p> <p>Though the column itself is frustratingly 'centrist,' I think this is a very legitimate point, and really illustrates how much better denialists are at framing the debate (though I'm loathe to use the word debate). Al Gore at least has the honesty to correct mistakes when they're pointed out to him, whereas George Will just cries censorship. It comes back to the point that the deniers are interested in scoring debating points, whereas 'alarmists' are interested in getting the science right.</p> <p></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585515&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="YHxGTO6SSBspPSLPCfI1HZ751t894arZ56M8s3VsJSE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Adam (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585515">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585516" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1235743957"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Will is not a journalist - and I don't mean that as an insult. He's not a journalist. He's a <i>columnist</i>. He's not bound by any form of ethics, and he takes full advantage of that. He's not as obvious or egregious as some, and he writes well so lots of people think he's "reasonable", but he's a partisan hack for all his writing skills.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585516&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="X9ZpWuphyHHBmVAYON1bjVdBs4sknNcPm0ToXTKF138"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a rel="nofollow" href="http://thegreenbelt.blogspot.com" lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">The Ridger (not verified)</a> on 27 Feb 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585516">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585517" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1235757829"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Aware that he is a columnist, I was trying to be careful. Do you really think that there are no ethical considerations (at least in theory) for a columnist being published in the WSJ?</p> <p>I don't know, but I would have assumed some...?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585517&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="s-MHgzh9rrf_ckP8OzjAt3_FqB76-afAQ0aakyXFMaw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a rel="nofollow" href="http://scienceblogs.com/illconsidered/2008/07/how_to_talk_to_a_sceptic.php" lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">coby (not verified)</a> on 27 Feb 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585517">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585518" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1235809104"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>A columnist is not a journalist? Only someone with no experience in the journalism business would argue that.</p> <p>The only difference between an opinion column and a news story is that the former is allowed to make value judgments and the latter simply report the facts. But both must make honest use of source material. A columnist can be and often is a journalist. Some of the best journalists in the business are columnists. </p> <p>So let's get past this notion that George F. Will isn't obliged, as a paid journalist, to respect the basic tenets of journalism: rely on facts, not lies, and present them fairly and accurately. Just because you're paid to have opinions doesn't mean you are exempt from those two basic rules.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585518&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="gLhwAE3yU-Ne2ZuW54QR7Ld0M2cxnV8wsxFKzpan2aE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a rel="nofollow" href="http://scienceblogs.com/islandofdoubt" lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">James Hrynyshyn (not verified)</a> on 28 Feb 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585518">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1585519" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1235817657"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Yup. The Ombudsman has widened the circle of scrutiny now by including discussion of the methods used by the writer's group and editors to check the references they're using.</p> <p>He's made this teacup tempest into a fine opportunity for growth -- big enough for the entire organization.</p> <p>I said so in their comments, urging him to post their "20" links and an explanation of how they check this kind of stuff.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1585519&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wCMy1lC2w2DKwu3U4hr37OWQvoKvjRVjaY5Ofi3a1yk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Hank Roberts (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2009 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/11437/feed#comment-1585519">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/illconsidered/2009/02/things-break-takes-down-george%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:56:53 +0000 illconsidered 41068 at https://scienceblogs.com