Mike Adams https://scienceblogs.com/ en Contamination requiring ritual purification: Superstitious concepts at the heart of antivaccine beliefs https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/08/10/contamination-requiring-ritual-purification-superstitious-concepts-at-the-heart-of-antivaccine-beliefs <span>Contamination requiring ritual purification: Superstitious concepts at the heart of antivaccine beliefs</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Over the years, I've frequently contemplated just where many of the ideas that underlie alternative medicine in general come from. Certainly, I'm not the first to have thought of this by any stretch of the imagination, but over the last 13 years, I've become convinced that it is a fear of bodily "contamination" that harks back to ideas found in many religions. Think about it. Where does the fear of "toxins" in vaccines come from? Vaccines are portrayed as "foreign," as something "unnatural" that is "injected right into the bloodstream." Never mind that vaccines are not injected directly into the bloodstream. To the antivaxer, there is no difference between an intramuscular and intravenous injections because to them both are equally "contaminating." It's also not a coincidence that many of the treatments for "vaccine-induced autism" or any other condition falsely attributed to vaccines are represented as "detoxification." They are basically purges, to purge the "evil humors" that antivaxers believe vaccines to be packed full of. It's not for nothing that I've not infrequently described alternative medicine "detoxification" as being akin to ritual purification of the sort found in many different religions.</p> <p>Sometimes, antivaxers even help to make my case for me. For instance, here's antivaxer and all-around supporter of everything quacky, John Rappoport, declaring the <a href="http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/occult-archetype-called-vaccination" rel="nofollow">The Occult Archetype Called Vaccination</a>. Here, Rappoport claims to examine the "archetypes and symbols" that surround vaccination and to him "give it occult power." My first reaction was: Projection, thy name is antivaxer. You know he's off the rails from the very beginning when he begins with a claim that vaccination was begun as a "crude version of homeopathy." Here's a hint. Variolation predated homeopathy by 75 years, and other investigators had tested vaccination with cowpox to protect against smallpox a couple of decades before Samuel Hahnemann dreamt up the sympathetic magic that is homeopathy. Even Jenner's work was roughly contemporaneous with Hahnemann's first descriptions of homeopathy in the late 1790s. Homeopaths (and quacks like Rappoport) love to claim that vaccination was somehow an imitation of homeopathy (or, these days) that homeopathic nosodes are the equivalent of vaccination because of homeopathy's "law" of "like cures like."</p> <!--more--><p>Then we get to the "meat" (if you can call it that) of Rappoport's comparison:</p> <blockquote><p> Today, as a revival of ancient symbology, vaccination is a conferred seal, a sign of moral righteousness. It’s a mark on the arm, signifying tribal inclusion. No tribe member is left out. Inclusion by vaccination protects against invisible spirits (viruses).</p> <p>The notion of the tribe is enforced by dire predictions of pandemics: the spirits of other tribes (from previously unknown hot zones in jungles) are attacking the good tribe, our tribe.</p> <p>Mothers, the keepers of the children, are given a way to celebrate their esteemed, symbolic, animal role as “lionesses”: confer the seal on their offspring through vaccination. Protect the future of the tribe. Speak out and defame and curse the mothers who don’t vaccinate their children. Excommunicate them from the tribe. </p></blockquote> <p>Or it could just be that they understand that herd immunity is important and that unvaccinated children can serve as vectors for disease outbreaks.</p> <p>There's also a rather amazing extension of normal antivaccine arguments in which Rappoport claims that the child is "more than the offspring of the parents" and is now the "property of the village" You might remember how often I point out that the invocation of "parental rights" by antivaxers often assumes that children are the property of the parents. Indeed, I <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/02/22/in-the-age-of-donald-trump-vaccine-policy-is-becoming-politicized-with-potentially-deadly-consequences/">often quote Rand Paul</a>, who, referring to the "right" of parents not to vaccinate their children, once said, "The state doesn’t own the children. Parents own the children, and it is an issue of freedom.” Now get a load of what Rappoport says:</p> <blockquote><p> The ceremony of vaccination is a rite of passage for the child. He/she is now more than the offspring of the parents. The child is in the village. The child is property of the village. As the years pass, periodic booster shots reconfirm this status. </p></blockquote> <p>See what I mean? The only difference between this remark and Rand Paul's objection to vaccination is that Rappoport substitutes the "village" for the "government" referred to by Paul.</p> <p>Now here's where Rappoport really lets you know that I'm right about their viewing vaccination as contamination by the way he describes what he perceives to be the mystical aspect of vaccination:</p> <blockquote><p> Some ancient rituals presented dangers. The child, on his way to becoming a man, would be sent out to live alone in the forest for a brief period and survive. Vaccination symbolizes this in a passive way: the injection of disease-viruses which might be harmful are transmuted into protective spirits in the body. The injection of toxic chemicals is a passageway into immunity. If a child is damaged in the process, the parents and the tribe consider it a tragic but acceptable risk, because on the whole the tribe and the village are protected against the evil spirits (viruses).</p> <p>The psychological and occult and archetypal impact of vaccination is key: modern parents are given the opportunity to feel, on a subconscious level, a return to older times, when life was more bracing and immediate and vital. That is the mythology. Modern life, for basic consumers, has fewer dimensions—but vaccination awakens sleeping memories of an age when ritual and ceremony were essential to the future of the group. No one would defect from these moments. Refusal was unthinkable. Survival was All. The mandate was powerful. On a deep level, parents today can experience that power. It is satisfying. </p></blockquote> <p>There is no doubt that there is a feeling of satisfaction that vaccinating one's children can bring. It is indeed the feeling of protecting one's offspring against diseases that might threaten their lives. It has little to do with the "mandate" of the "tribe" or anything else like that. What's interesting is that Rappoport tries to dismiss the societal mandate to vaccinate as though it were nothing more than some ancient tribal ritual transplanted into modern society. I think that's very telling. He can't explain vaccine mandates any other way than as ritual. He also represents vaccination as some sort of dangerous process that might damage the child, when in fact it is very, very safe, with serious adverse reactions exceedingly rare.</p> <p>Then there is the religious aspect. Note the language: "Injection of the disease-virus." This is a very clear reference to the "contamination" that I was talking about. Indeed, this choice of phrasing is very common in antivaccine circles, where vaccines are often referred to as "injecting disease matter," which is technically true but phrased to make it sound as scary as possible.</p> <p>And, of course, who is at the center of this "mystic ritual"? You guessed it. It's the physician, who is portrayed by Rappoport as a shaman:</p> <blockquote><p> The doctor giving the injections is, of course, the priest of the tribe, the medicine man, the holder of secrets. He is the spiritual source of, and connection to, “unseen realms” where opposing spirits carry out warfare and struggle for supremacy. Without the medicine man, the tribe would disintegrate.</p> <p>The medicine man is permitted to say and do anything. He can tell lies if lies serve a noble purpose and effect greater strength of the tribe. He can manipulate language and truth and meaning. He can turn day into night. He can present paradox and contradiction. No one can question his pronouncements.</p> <p>Loyalty to the medicine man is absolute. In this regard, a rebel is exiled or destroyed. </p></blockquote> <p>Methinks that Mr. Rappoport vastly overestimates the power that physicians have in society. Oddly enough, what he is describing seems to be an extreme version of medical paternalism that was common 70 years ago but hasn't been a part of medicine for decades. There is much projection here, as well. In fact, the real shaman/healer/medicine man tends to be the alternative medicine practitioners and the antivaccine doctor-"heros" like Andrew Wakefield whom antivaxers do basically idolize much like the description of medicine men above. Indeed, I've <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2012/08/22/quackademic-medicine-versus-cancer-quackery/">explained in depth</a> why the appeal of this sort of unscientific medicine, part of which includes antivaccine beliefs, is the <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/03/09/integrative-medicine-the-lure-of-the-healer-companion/">appeal of the shaman</a>, a view that Dr. Mehmet Oz, of all people, appears to support without realizing it.</p> <p>The sort of thinking that Rappoport is attributing to those advocating vaccination is in actuality much more characteristic of believers in alterntive medicine in general and the antivaccine movement and their quacks in particular.They are the unquestioned, shaman-healer so common in so many societies in pre-scientific times. Bringing us back to the religious aspect of "contamination" that I started out with, as I've pointed out time and time again, in ancient Egypt, physicians were also priests; both functions, physician and priest, were one, which made sense given how little effective medicine there was. Praying to the gods for patients to get better was in most cases as good as anything those ancient physicians could do. All of this is of a piece with the antivaccine view of vaccines as "contamination" that makes the child "unclean" such that he must be ritually purified with "detoxification."</p> <p>I sometimes like to reference the <em>über</em>-quack and <em>über</em>-scammer Mike Adams, because he goes so over the top that he often illustrates my points for me, albeit in a sort of <em>reductio ad absurdum</em> manner. A couple of days ago, <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/08/08/dumb-and-dumber-kent-heckenlively-and-mike-adams-team-up-to-support-an-antivaccine-whitehouse-gov-petition/">he was claiming that Facebook</a> was "censoring" Natural News. Today he's claiming that is "<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20170809080657/http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-08-09-facebook-declares-war-on-children-censors-independent-science-that-tries-to-protect-infants-from-medical-harm.html" rel="nofollow">declaring war on children</a>" by "censoring him." I must admit that in this rant Adams outdoes himself in pure looniness, but inadvertently he helps make some of my points for me, again largely by projection.</p> <p>For instance, to him vaccination goes beyond mere "contamination" and becomes both violation (as in rape) and contamination with something even more unspeakable than "toxins" or "disease matter":</p> <blockquote><p> Mark Zuckerberg isn’t accused of raping little children with his biology, but he controls the social media network that openly espouses the medical violation of childrens’ bodies with toxic injections — a form of “medical rape” that obscenely violates the American Medical Association’s medical ethics when mandated by coercive government (as has already happened in California with SB 277).</p> <p>Further adding to the horrifying truth of what Zuckerberg and Facebook are really up to, many vaccines given to children in America today are made from the ground-up, homogenized, disease-inoculated organs of aborted black babies. These “human embryonic lung cell cultures” are openly listed as chicken pox vaccine ingredients by the CDC and vaccine manufacturers, all of whom also openly admit that vaccines are made from diseased animal organs such as African Green Monkey kidney cells. (MMR vaccines are also made from the tissue of aborted human babies.) </p></blockquote> <p>I will give Mikey credit for one thing. I've heard and debunked the claims that vaccines are made from the "tissue of aborted babies" (dude, cells isolated from a fetus in the 1960s and maintained in culture over 50 years are <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/03/07/how-aborted-fetal-cells-in-vaccines-saved-lives/">not the same thing as "tissue from aborted human babies"</a>) and many others, including the fear mongering about African Green Monkeys. I've also <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/09/30/anti-vaccine-not-pro-safe-vaccine-vaccination-described-as-rape/">dealt with the vile simile that likens vaccination to rape</a>. However, I've never heard the claim that vaccines are made from the "ground-up, homogenized, disease-inoculated organs of aborted black babies." I did some Googling and was unable to find the origin of that incredible (and false) claim. Seriously, Mikey. Now you're just making shit up even more than usual.</p> <p>Now, as ridden with hyperbole this is, it is far too close to normal, common antivaccine claims to be Mike Adams. So, naturally, Adams has to ramp the stupid and outrage up to 11 and beyond by likening vaccination to ritualistic child sacrifice and cannibalism:</p> <blockquote><p> Today, Mark Zuckerberg and Facebook demand the <strong>ritualistic sacrifice of children to the “vaccine gods”</strong> as a way to appease their globalist controllers. Just like in the era of the Maya, children are especially prized for their innocence which is violated by puncturing the skin and <strong>injecting the child with foreign DNA extracted from other children sacrificed at abortion centers</strong>.</p> <p>Quite literally, the dead children are liquefied and “fed” to other children, many of whom are maimed or killed by the toxic intervention (yes, this is how vaccines are manufactured). This is all carried out in the name of “science,” just as the Maya high priests carried out their sacrifices in the name of “cosmic powers.”</p> <p>What few people have recognized yet is that in the realm of globalist power, <strong>the sacrifice of children is always required for an ascending globalist to “prove” their commitment to the cause</strong>. Zuckerberg, you see, wants to become a “high priest” of the modern technocracy which is founded in a scientific dictatorship, medical tyranny and the power of the coercive state. The ritualistic sacrifice of children is a necessary component of those ascensions to power. </p></blockquote> <p>I had to read that passage three times because I couldn't believe what I had just read, Yes, Adams really wrote it. So let me get this straight. Dead children are somehow "liquified" and "fed" to other children, thus both contaminating them in such a way that "violates" their innocence, presumably both because it is (to Adams) like rape and because it also somehow "contaminates" them. Again, projection is the key here. This is how hard core antivaxers think.</p> <p>Lest you think that Adams is so over-the-top, that Natural News is a wretched hive of scum and quackery so much scummier and quackier than all the other wretched hives of scum and quackery that it can be ignored, let's take a look at another article, over at Megan Heimer's wretched hive of scum and antivaccine quackery, entitled <a href="http://www.livingwhole.org/what-you-didnt-know-about-the-aborted-baby-parts-in-your-vaccines/" rel="nofollow">What You Didn’t Know About the Aborted Baby Parts in Your Vaccines</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> You might have also heard that only two babies were used and it was a really long time ago, which justifies the continued use of shooting up live babies with dead babies. This just simply isn’t true and if you think it is, watch one of the many Planned Parenthood videos. These people are harvesting baby parts for a reason.</p> <p>Aborted baby is supposedly some sort of magic that makes vaccines more effective (albeit safely untested and could contribute to conditions like autism and cancer). </p></blockquote> <p>No, the only people invoking "magic," "ritual," "contamination," and "purification" with respect to vaccine components are people like Mike Adams, John Rappoport, and Megan Heimer. That's because so much of the antivaccine belief system is rooted in ancient superstitious and religious concepts, the most prominent aspect of which are contamination and ritual purification. Sometimes they even throw violation (rape) in there for good measure. Basically, to many antivaxers vaccines are like fluoride in Dr. Strangelove. They sap and contaminate your precious bodily fluids, but they'll go even beyond that. They'll <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2012/03/14/beware-vaccines-will-sap-and-impurity-yo/">contaminate you so much that they corrupt your DNA</a>. I wish I were exaggerating about these beliefs, but I'm not.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a></span> <span>Wed, 08/09/2017 - 21:00</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine-nonsense" hreflang="en">Antivaccine nonsense</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/religion-0" hreflang="en">religion</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/skepticismcritical-thinking" hreflang="en">Skepticism/Critical Thinking</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine" hreflang="en">antivaccine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/contamination" hreflang="en">contamination</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/john-rappaport" hreflang="en">John Rappaport</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/megan-heimer" hreflang="en">Megan Heimer</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mike-adams" hreflang="en">Mike Adams</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/natural-news" hreflang="en">Natural News</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/quackery" hreflang="en">quackery</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/ritual-purification" hreflang="en">ritual purification</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/vaccines" hreflang="en">vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/religion-0" hreflang="en">religion</a></div> </div> </div> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-categories field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Categories</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/channel/social-sciences" hreflang="en">Social Sciences</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363799" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502340592"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>The doctor giving the injections is, of course, the priest of the tribe</p></blockquote> <p>Uh, I dunno about you, but in my neck of the woods vaccination is done by nurses. You don't even need to <i>see</i> a doctor before getting childhood vaccinations done. So much for the high priest, eh?</p> <p>Also, are uninjected vaccines ok? There's a lot of needle phobia in antivax land. Maybe things like the rotavirus and old-school polio immunisations are gateway vaccinations, to lure small children into trying the harder stuff, though.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363799&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="l69I90csva6YFOgFRjs-RTHvPUteu95qfjlD43JJb3E"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">tunicate (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363799">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363800" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502341627"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Today, as a revival of ancient symbology, vaccination is a conferred seal, a sign of moral righteousness. It’s a mark on the arm, signifying tribal inclusion. No tribe member is left out. Inclusion by vaccination protects against invisible spirits (viruses).</i></p> <p>If vaccination were some sort of tribal mark, shouldn't we still be doing smallpox vaccination, since it was a vaccine that truly left a mark on your arm? Oh, wait--smallpox was eradicated through vaccination (making members of that tribe are age 50 and older and not children anymore). And BCG vaccine (against tuberculosis) can leave a vaccination scar as well, but many countries don't give it, so this whole "mark on the arm" thing from vaccines ain't making sense (except in the echo chamber of Rappoport's largely empty cranium). </p> <p>Also, it's strange how vaccines= contamination, but yet, for many AVers it's ok if mom eats her placenta--something they will almost certainly still support even though there was a recent warning of group B strep neonatal infection from a mom taking encapsulated placenta post partum (<a href="https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/66/wr/mm6625a4.htm">https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/66/wr/mm6625a4.htm</a>). But, hey--it's probably the baby's fault for contracting group B strep anyhow, right?</p> <p>Over at the misnamed "Immunity Education Group"-- anti-vaxxers recently penned a piece claiming that last year's change in the vaccine schedule from 3 HPV vaccines to 2 shows how the ebil ones at the CDC are backtracking and trying to cover up how dangerous HPV vaccine is. You would think IEG might have expressed gratitude that--since vaccines are full of "toxins" --that one less vaccine on the schedule would equal fewer "toxins". Alas, no...you can't do anything to placate AVers because their messed up minds will just convolute whatever you do into some even more diabolical plan to kill children/sterilize society/put lizard overlords in power. </p> <p>When it comes to contamination, there's not enough GoLytely in the universe to even partially flush the crap-filled brains of hardcore AVers.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363800&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="QUqAzjLD7FsBiVUW-2qYNQt4TQLx7cu0Bmf6RvqhAZ4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363800">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363801" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502342594"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Right from the beginning, opposition to vaccination has been religion and "freedom" based. From the Jenner Institute's website, "People quickly became fearful of the possible consequences of receiving material originating from cows and opposed vaccination on religious grounds, saying that they would not be treated with substances originating from God's lowlier creatures. Variolation was forbidden by Act of Parliament in 1840 and vaccination with cowpox was made compulsory in 1853. This in its turn led to protest marches and vehement opposition from those who demanded freedom of choice."</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363801&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="iRQSKvlGnqdtn38HZdMjftQNIk5JexoDpM4MxBNjrkQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Edward (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363801">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363802" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502344495"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Fred Clark, on the blog Slacktivist, often writes about the love people have for stories about Satanic baby killers, and how they don't want to let those stories go. It appears that this same mentality is found among the anti-vaxxers, and probably for the same reason. It elevates them and separates them from 'the other.' They can feel righteous knowing they would never do such a terrible thing. I still want them all in an iron lung for 24 hours, with a bad case of Shingles. Then, I want them in Dara O'Briain's sack.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363802&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="n3gcu6gFMaJffzEPbbqLB0vv8RtykYh1SoOQxV1PTYE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Elloe (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363802">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363803" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502344561"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Oops! I misspelled my own name. Good grief. I guess I need more coffee before reading about anti-vaxxers.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363803&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wPNGWsmkOk2yTmADuaRBJImuA6wQrgPXFx_e-D9nkeQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Ellie (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363803">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363804" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502345335"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>The doctor giving the injections is, of course, the priest of the tribe, the medicine man, the holder of secrets.</p></blockquote> <p>And so on. Such a long-winded rant to claim that vaccines are ritual magic.</p> <p>How do you call magic which has been shown to be working? Medicine.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363804&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="37PT2TMdKs55nJPsRJADhuulo5v5qB5fIKBch9dL-0M"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Helianthus (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363804">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363805" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502346693"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>They're out to pollute our bodily essences.</p> <p>I think Rappoport should re-watch Dr Strangelove and realize it's not a documentary. Then again, maybe the problem is, no-one wants his bodily essences.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363805&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-XXvZd31ff7cdxIR3FDEAUW-wzh_D5RlcOPuTed2_3s"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Anonymous Pseudonym (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363805">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363806" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502348242"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>As George Carlin said, I will leave symbols to the simple-minded.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363806&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="GrYT4_8B38B_IaNhUaZsKJsET0FGgQcWnO5DEHVXebM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Zach (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363806">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363807" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502349272"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Adams seems to have lost whatever little bits of his mind were still in his possession. He seems to be saying that Soylent Green isvaccines are made of people.</p> <p>And I'll second Ellie's remarks about the satanic baby killers schtick. People will often go to great lengths to "prove" their moral superiority, even to the point of inventing such horrors out of whole cloth.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363807&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Qq4ryUU9iFAYnYpi9-qW35C5Mh-Jk5lq7nMvRQ5vnsI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363807">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363808" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502351117"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I wonder when is the last time any of these people actually watched a child vaccinated.</p> <p>I guess this is behind the language we hear that talks of unvaccinated children as "vaccine-free" or having an intact immune system, whatever that is. </p> <p>And is the logic behind the demand for a vaccinated/unvaccinated study and t new movie Azeris making, designed to present unvaccinated children as better, including publicly humiliating the vaccinated children of the participating families by working to present them as less good.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363808&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="92zzcV5BdL1enA6UcOAwyDUI4zfbXtydl7tVwu54fWk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363808">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363809" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502352700"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Rappaport actually manages what would be a few bits of semi-respectable cultural analysis, if he didn't expect us to take it to literally, and didn't put such a pejorative twist on it. Vaccination as rite of passage, through danger, into the tribe and village, conferring a moral righteousness, presided over by a shaman, etc. It's exaggerated, but not totally wrong. The problem is, 'So what's wrong with that?!' or 'You say that like it's a <i>bad</i> thing!' A respectable cultural anthropologist might make similar observations, especially a Levi-Straussian structuralist, but wouldn't find anything sinister or even "religious" really in any of it. That is, these things would be seen as resonances of fundamental symbols systems human beings have employed across very different cultures over long periods of time in order to understand the world and deal with it socially in some <i>functional</i> way. </p> <p>But even the later part where Rappaport goes full looney – "Loyalty to the medicine man is absolute... a rebel is exiled or destroyed" – looks like genius in comparison to Adams rantings. To those, I can only shake my head, in lack of comprehension at how anyone could go there, and just have no words... W. T. F. ??</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363809&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="4kgngBqXZ6xgqv02d9NEB2sccMqQIDKqZlijQXJPMC8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">sadmar (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363809">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363810" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502357759"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Wait a minute..<br /> he's talking about archetypes ( of the collective unconscious?) and he fails to mention the SHADOW?<br /> You know, the Dark Side of human nature which ever lurks in the hearts of men. . which would be<br /> US.</p> <p>Seriously.</p> <p>and on a more serious note...<br /> he's talking about primitive people, tribes, medicine men, symbolic mother _lionesses_, JUNGLES...<br /> doesn't that sound a little racist? ... black people in Africa as the appeared in old movies or ancient pulp fiction**.</p> <p>Not enlightened folk like him.</p> <p>** or Disney musicals</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363810&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="135QrYz-3AGzmMYv6ogt30igKdQfukPFyO3aCmvJAMA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363810">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363811" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502359978"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Chris Hickie</p> <p>Since you an turn day into night, and o one can question your pronouncements, you could get those AV parents to immunize their tots if you just pulled out the shamanic powers you were inducted into in med school. I admire your restraint and respect for your patients' parents autonomy. ;-)<br /> ____________</p> <blockquote><p>doesn’t that sound a little racist?</p></blockquote> <p>Oh, you noticed that. Why, yes it does.</p> <p>I should have added above that Ripapart likely cribbed the outline of those comments from a legit anthro text, and just put his negative spin on all of it. This could be just projection as Orac says, but also a more Turdblossomish mustache-twirling scheme to tar his opponents with false accusations of his own groups 'issues'. We know who the real dark side occultists are one way or the other.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363811&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Ocg85A0GSgNCFwZ1I3YlI0pKMi8Q9v98t-FRNu-BMRs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">sadmar (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363811">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363812" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502361262"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Maybe a good idea to improve vaccination rates is to combine the shot with an actual tattoo. Not a big one, just a small mark that would be part of a larger pattern that would only be completed by many years of consistent vaccination. A flu shot might add a feather to the eagle. Gardasil would be a snake the eagle is carrying.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363812&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="v6FPnzg4IyFvVHjg-RlxOkZfPEMz-jC7xihhExJk1nM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Mark Thorson (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363812">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363813" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502369305"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I want them in Dara O’Briain’s sack.</p></blockquote> <p>They can't escape the sack. The sack sees them all. The sack embraces them all.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363813&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="6B9JzoHW0EHYMnTqeYqlokES4ORXW0rjjz7xVdT6Yl8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Woods (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363813">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363814" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502372702"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Sadmar #13: Well, lets just say I prefer not using Jedi mind tricks when it comes to consenting for vaccines ;)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363814&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="aJ6Na8iJn27Q5eJgFpGCY2nykCdw6sdo3JUIOdLFtW0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363814">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363815" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502376308"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>When med-scammers adopt the 'abortions = BABY-KILLING' language of the fetus-fetishists, there's probably an element of good old-fashioned Affinity Fraud. If you want to defraud the religious loons -- and ever since religion became a branch of right-wing politicis, that's where all the Stupid is -- then you need to spout all the fetish-fondling shibboleths, so that the suckers will trust you.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363815&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="K-B6A3Czw_jszM_RahvWbBEichj76ccP36vTgg-wqsw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363815">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363816" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502376935"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Fred Clark, on the blog Slacktivist, often writes about the love people have for stories about Satanic baby killers, and how they don’t want to let those stories go.</i></p> <p>Norman Cohn's "Europe's Inner Demons" is my go-to source, for I am old-school. Cohn traces the tradition back to attacks on the early Christians as part of Roman Imperial persecution, which the Christians immediately adopted and redirected at their enemies (heretics) as soon as they had control of the Empire.</p> <p>But when Adams combines the baby-eating stories with names like "Zuckerberg" --</p> <blockquote><p> Mark Zuckerberg and Facebook demand the ritualistic sacrifice of children</p></blockquote> <p>-- we're in <b>Blood Libel</b> antisemitism territory. Adams can't quite bring himself to shout out "MATZOHS IZ MADE OF BABY BLOOD!!" but that is what he wants his readers to think.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363816&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="U7LWVcBuDaSUC3h8QSWVeJqXqetX3RpSU5XTTMsHmRI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363816">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363817" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502378017"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Granted, I'm absent minded, but I can't ever remember having checked out anyone's arms at any time to check that they are members of my "tribe".</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363817&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3QiJFsQKODIU-2xid0mGyemFBfnFsimohbFU4EwlZhY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363817">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363818" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502378926"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I have been saying for years (this is sarcasm) that we should be doing drive by vaccinations and ear tagging to know who needs what. Ears tag would mark safe people to be around and those who avoid. Without ear tags we could ostracize those people. We could have teams of doctors, nurses and cowboys riding around doing the vaccinating and ear tagging. The cowboys could rope the little critters so they can be ear tagged. </p> <p>Don't you think this would be a lot more fun setting around in a doctors office giving shots? If we did the vaccinating in schools we could use squeeze chutes and vaccinate and ear tag at the same time. I don't think branding would be necessary.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363818&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-X2cmRcZHVCViRN24YFC2kfOEcnx2kDX4y1TUWiuL2I"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363818">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363819" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502379747"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"I can’t ever remember having checked out anyone’s arms at any time"</p> <p>A clear indication that you are a member of the tribe of those who do not check other people's arms. Welcome!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363819&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Db-dncmM4wj_zZBBvA02oxJDYZRY3aGSiKQBJ81myPQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">rs (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363819">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363820" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502379830"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p># 2 Chris Hickie</p> <p><i>f vaccination were some sort of tribal mark, shouldn’t we still be doing smallpox vaccination, since it was a vaccine that truly left a mark on your arm?</i> </p> <p>We have replaced the mark with tattoos which actually is better since tattoos allow for one to indicate rank. The priest, err doctor, will have the most tattoos and the most sophisticated ones.</p> <p>If you meet Orac in person you will hardly see one bit of bare skin.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363820&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IKLXqwSgYBRh9vaUNjL2ghS4Tefh7b9amsx6Dmd_eLQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">jrkrideau (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363820">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363821" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502379998"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>ExCUSE me. Tag the ears of the UNvaccinated, and leave my perfectly formed lobes alone.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363821&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TPjbTMqGrnBLDpz2NsGGr3x9CNZpv650vwWWzdZa5cw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363821">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363822" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502380348"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Panacea, as you noticed I was being sarcastic. Although, many people pierce various body parts to dangle things from. Myself, I have no piercings but do have 3 tattoos. The tattoos were applied as aiming points for radiation treatment a few years back.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363822&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wmK_LiWHV1sd6Td57Z6oMgKwixLmjX3nDLy_rYGg_So"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363822">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363823" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502381732"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>If you meet Orac in person you will hardly see one bit of bare skin.</i></p> <p>As befits one of the <a href="http://www.sciencefictionmuseum.com/stories/reviews/snop009.html">Scientific People</a>.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363823&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="NYPwmUjQZq2Cx2miz41GbZBLLaq5S_FwKVlt9kwGVL8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363823">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363824" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502382705"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Rich: Heh. I didn't get my ears pierced until I was 35, and my friends practically had to drag me. First go round I went, "Nope!" and ran out of the store when a six year old ahead of me in line cried when she got hers. </p> <p>Besides, the unvaccinated SHOULD wear the ear tags, since they're advertising they're willing to be diseased cows.</p> <p>I'll never get a tattoo, but if I got one it would be like the kind you have.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363824&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-1sWK9nbFsVvkaJ8WJmEttbI3gB9VYPz94TvbvBI4DQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363824">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363825" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502384660"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>he’s talking about primitive people, tribes, medicine men, symbolic mother _lionesses_, JUNGLES…<br /> doesn’t that sound a little racist? … black people in Africa as the appeared in old movies or ancient pulp fiction**.</i></p> <p>My money is on "Watched trailer for 'Black Panther', saw imagery to coopt for his cause".</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363825&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mqvh_GA78wyp0o-H0prMSixE8f3sf4C7FZ_XqiZv0TQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363825">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363826" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502387163"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>HDB @18: I was wondering when someone was going to notice that. It's about as subtle as a 2x4 to the head.<br /> So, in summary: racist *and* anti-semtic, all in one!</p> <p>(OT: How the heck could anyone who has ever seen matzoh ever think there is any blood in it? It's whiter than a saltine! You want food with blood, look at black pudding. I mean, it's *actively* stupid.)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363826&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="B3ob4DITaG0gb6bzq_Ti22DM-7NdA9j4ACGb96LbsAk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">JustaTech (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363826">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363827" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502387495"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>WTF Mike Adams is doing on Facebook if he believe Facebook is this evil:</p> <p><a href="https://www.facebook.com/NaturalNews">https://www.facebook.com/NaturalNews</a></p> <p><a href="https://www.facebook.com/HealthRanger/">https://www.facebook.com/HealthRanger/</a></p> <p>Incquiring mind want to know :)</p> <p>Al</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363827&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="nw8cC-q7b0BiL8egMVapPfAnW664ypD785N_0tgdDdw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363827">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363828" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502388958"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Panacea,</p> <p>You should see mine, on my back (4h single session).</p> <p>Al</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363828&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="6Ij_EDkZbUr6VyPy7i3MmfTJYZg20Nc8SdLJ68K_gDo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363828">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363829" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502389395"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Myself@29,</p> <p>Tattoo that is.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363829&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ReO5z0SAOR_90BR6e5TUoy5_QDHHH8pi1zRXq4ZntlU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363829">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363830" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502392821"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Jrkrideau - the vision of Oracle with the full sleeve tattoos (face tattoo too?) made me laugh out loud but he's a robot.. wouldn't be a full decal? But that would hide the blinking lights...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363830&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="gWdpn_d3s1QVYE_71WWR5tsoHeTTCGRC2GVWoeGpyCs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363830">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363831" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502393299"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Alain: Adams has never pretended to be consistent.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363831&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="LE3RmNIPYkay3zsDEKn3VBIEdfTLDkLrb_oHzNejiW4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363831">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363832" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502393334"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>HDB and JustaTech...so it wasnt just me. Shades of Leo Frank.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363832&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="P2_CnRK4BDPDuy929OoWGLwSomORcYeEEbzmqFfCDWo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">shay simmons (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363832">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363833" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502405619"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Rich Bly - </p> <p><a href="https://xkcd.com/933/">https://xkcd.com/933/</a></p> <p>Also</p> <p><a href="https://xkcd.com/836/">https://xkcd.com/836/</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363833&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="nWrpDvCEsZRTevlgJ8idwZ6e61Lc831uPXW3fvNynSI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363833">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363834" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502414053"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Myself, no tattoos or piercings, because I donate blood.<br /> Say, isn't bloodletting used in certain rituals? ;)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363834&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="6cCwq7vF5_srkkt9HduJ4ppqMhlm1aPI59udl3iF-3g"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363834">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363835" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502427716"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>In case you haven't caught the news (I have been away from civilization this week) Polly Tommey has been kicked out of Australia and banned from re-entry for being a danger to public health (and possibly other reasons).</p> <p>She has been touring Australia with VaXXed, lying to venues about what the bookings are for and making outrageous statements about public health. She hasn't taken her banning well, but I suppose anti-vaccine liars can't help themselves.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363835&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="FlJPzhaYHGPjYmxxdX0UrweEJ6dyA4UTE7KruF-Lt7g"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Preston (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363835">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363836" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502427763"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Myself, no tattoos or piercings, because I donate blood.</p></blockquote> <p>Unfortunately, I can't give blood (Hashimoto disease since 2005); thus, tattoo it is.</p> <p>Alain</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363836&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qtqpDNP8V92UjVtuOGpcQhBMcdbjC-7kV5492B5-I8Q"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363836">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363837" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502427954"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Mine look like this one:</p> <p><a href="http://clipart-library.com/images/rTjrp58kc.jpg">http://clipart-library.com/images/rTjrp58kc.jpg</a></p> <p>The wings cover all the width of my back and the pin cover my spine down to the belt.</p> <p>Alain</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363837&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="dRRJ1qG5gAQxS911hw0Wh7qONEkQyBNAEHwrYYRY4kc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363837">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363838" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502433899"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>How ridiculous. I don't care if the medicine is mud if it works and is safe - but there is the rub. For families with genetic tendencies towards immune system and inflammatory disorders or a history of adverse reactions, these vaccines have been proven to be less than safe. Moreover, they don't seem to be that effective, either. </p> <p>So it's a simple question, is questionable benefit of not contracting a disease which has a small risk of causing permanent harm to you worth the risk of intentionally assuming the risk lifelong disease or disability from a vaccine that has limited efficacy? </p> <p>Answering that question must be a personal choice, not mandated by law or coerced by dogmatic doctors. </p> <p><a href="http://www.oatext.com/Pilot-comparative-study-on-the-health-of-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-6-to-12-year-old-U-S-children.php">http://www.oatext.com/Pilot-comparative-study-on-the-health-of-vaccinat…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363838&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="CHrN61aUbBvdQ9Ok2ct66xLGUEj6_xW6vXJbijN1quc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Annonymous (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363838">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1363839" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502434278"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>See:</p> <p><a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/08/a-horrendously-bad-vaxedunvaxed-study-rises-from-the-dead-yet-again/">http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/08/a-horrendously-bad-vaxedun…</a></p> <p><a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/18/the-check-must-have-finally-cleared-or-mawsons-incompetent-vaxedunvaxed-study-is-back-online/">http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/18/the-check-must-have-finall…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363839&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3vyAOV6jhn5H056NBS4-calCZ2sno-nrRe5kBgqy6L0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363839">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1363838#comment-1363838" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Annonymous (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363840" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502434482"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Annonymous: since that study has been debunked here and other places as a horrible example of how to do a comparative study, try again.</p> <p>Vaccines are safer than the disease they protect against, and are generally very effective. True, the flu vaccine isn't as good as we'd like, because the virus mutates so rapidly, and the acellular pertussis doesn't last as long. But scientists are seeking to improve all vaccines.</p> <p>Nothing is 100% safe. Life isn't safe. And some of us care about others as much as we care about ourselves.</p> <p>By the way, give *good* peer-reviewed studies that vaccines are "more dangerous" than the disease for <i>For families with genetic tendencies towards immune system and inflammatory disorders or a history of adverse reactions, these vaccines have been proven to be less than safe.</i></p> <p>Note that Mercola, Null, and oatext may get you laughed out of the room.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363840&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="HkgwCKKqmqdv5GbrFUws-P6n7FRPheWN8PgHe0rMXOc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363840">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363841" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502434538"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Rats. Beaten by the All-Knowing plexiglass box about the study. :)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363841&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_JRqEGC1KQVqEMmm5SoSwr-rr9JU5dOve0F5Vx5U4w0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363841">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363842" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502437443"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>It never hurts to reinforce the basics, MI Dawn ;)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363842&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8w7XId4vryuaXEYovDByM1OFOrinTmxGrVw_vJQj9ns"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363842">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363843" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502444400"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Thanks Johnny.</p> <p>My motto is: Living is hazardous to your health.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363843&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="OigX1xdYN1flhekJKODe-yHecPnvzZ7yLIWEQxF9j_Y"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363843">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363844" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502450550"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>You are totally spot on. I remember when I was an anti-vaxxer, how I would see children who had been vaccinated as somehow defiled, with a toxic substance running through their veins.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363844&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="6TGurwJOdeykmxW2cCkHGD4PDCxT7ZatZet7HiMvBEE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rina (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363844">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363845" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502450667"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Right after I posted the above comment, I clicked on an Onion article in my email and at the top, there was the ad "Is your body toxic". Google knows what I type.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363845&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="YABsBNCR82pUB0jBBk0DmuT4WSpq5YJ9ud4mgdCi_8c"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rina (not verified)</span> on 11 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363845">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363846" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502593373"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Orac writes,</p> <p>...antivaxers frequently speak in terms of contamination due to vaccines as a cause of autism and all the other conditions...</p> <p>MJD says,</p> <p>A few antivaxxers clearly have difficulty grasping the phrase "the dose makes the poison", but, many vaccine safety advocates are certainly worried and uncertain about the phrase "the antigen makes the allergy/autoimmunity".</p> <p>Master Orac and Master Vinu continue to be the voice of reason for both phrases.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363846&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Hka8S3znXnSgmhCw78n9FQWzBgN1fwtsZlSt5UB-s9g"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Michael J. Dochniak (not verified)</span> on 12 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363846">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/insolence/2017/08/10/contamination-requiring-ritual-purification-superstitious-concepts-at-the-heart-of-antivaccine-beliefs%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Thu, 10 Aug 2017 01:00:59 +0000 oracknows 22602 at https://scienceblogs.com Dumb and dumber: Kent Heckenlively and Mike Adams team up to support an antivaccine WhiteHouse.gov petition https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/08/08/dumb-and-dumber-kent-heckenlively-and-mike-adams-team-up-to-support-an-antivaccine-whitehouse-gov-petition <span>Dumb and dumber: Kent Heckenlively and Mike Adams team up to support an antivaccine WhiteHouse.gov petition</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Yesterday was a busy day for a number of reasons. I thought of skipping it, but I couldn't resist taking notice of one particularly hilarious bit that I found on what is perhaps the wretchedest of all the wretched hives of scum and quackery on the Internet, NaturalNews.com. There, yesterday, on a very special day for me, I saw this headline by Mike Adams: <a href="http://bit.ly/2ulrJDq" rel="nofollow">Facebook blocks all Natural News article posts to 2.2M fans after site posts White House petition citing immunization dangers</a>:</p> <!--more--><blockquote> In the latest outrageous example of total censorship against the independent media, Facebook has blocked nearly 100 percent of the sharing of articles from Natural News. It all began when a Natural News story linked to this <a href="https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/trumps-five-year-moratorium-childhood-vaccines-and-destruction-pharma-control-media">White House petition demanding a moratorium on childhood immunizations</a> for five years while toxicology experts study the skyrocketing statistics of autism, adverse events and deaths following vaccinations. <p>Immediately after the story was posted on the Natural News Facebook account — which has over 2.2 million followers — Facebook <strong>manually deleted the post and banned nearly all sharing of ALL posts from Natural News</strong>. The White House petition asks for the repeal the 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act — the act 0f Congress that granted vaccine companies absolute legal immunity from all the damage and deaths caused by vaccines across America. This law would be equivalent to granting Big Tobacco total immunity from tobacco lawsuits or granting Monsanto legal immunity from glyphosate cancer lawsuits. </p></blockquote> <p>(Note that Mikey has been known to play with redirects, and, clicking on that link, you might find yourself directed to a page about the "Health Ranger's scientific accomplishments." If that happens, try this <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20170808161315/http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-08-07-facebook-blocks-all-natural-news-article-posts-white-house-petition-immunization-dangers.html#">Archive.org link instead</a>.)</p> <p>Besides Mikey's childish messing with redirects, I laughed out loud at Mikey's histrionics, but I wondered what the heck he was talking about. Before I delved into his claims any deeper, I wandered over to the NaturalNews.com Facebook page and, as a test, tried to share some articles to my own FB page. I had no problem sharing whatever I liked from the page, after which I deleted the shared articles. I also couldn't help but notice that there is now a Natural News app, which made me half tempted to download it to see what sort of crap Mikey serves up to mobile devices. I thought better of it, of course. Who knows what sort of privacy-invading "features" Mikey's added to his app?</p> <p>I do remember reading about a month ago that Facebook was going to try to do more to prevent the spread of fake news on its platform by <a href="https://newsroom.fb.com/news/2017/06/news-feed-fyi-showing-more-informative-links-in-news-feed/">deprioritizing clickbait links and fake news on users' newsfeeds</a>. Last November, Mark Zuckerberg himself had <a href="https://www.facebook.com/zuck/posts/10103269806149061">promised to do more about the spread of fake news</a> on Facebook. Then three week ago, I saw an article about how Facebook starting to <a href="https://media.fb.com/2017/07/18/next-steps-to-addressing-link-preview-modification/">disable</a> the ability of all Pages to edit the previews of the links they post in the Page composer or API, with an exemption for some original publishers. I wonder if it is this change that is what tripped up Mikey somehow.</p> <p>Aside from that, obviously, there must have been complaints about his antivaccine post regarding Kent Heckenlively's hilarious yet horrifying "<a href="https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/trumps-five-year-moratorium-childhood-vaccines-and-destruction-pharma-control-media">petition</a>" to the White House for a five year moratorium on childhood vaccination. I both <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/07/11/an-antivaxer-starts-a-whitehouse-gov-petition-for-a-five-year-moratorium-on-childhood-vaccines-hilarity-ensues/">mocked and expressed my horror at the concept about four weeks ago</a>, when I first noticed it, but I notice that the date on the petition is now August 2, which means that Heckenlively posted a new petition. Why would he do that? Well, the date on the <a href="https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/five-year-moratorium-childhood-vaccines">old petition</a> was July 3, and petitioners at WhiteHouse.gov have 30 days to reach 100,000 signatures. August 2 is exactly 30 days after July 3, which means that as soon as Heckenlively's old petition failed (which it did, with only 7,328 signatures in 30 days), he posted the same petition again. I guess that's how he's going to roll. Every 30 days he'll post the same petition again after the old one fails. I suppose the attention from Natural News got him some attention with 1,503 signatures in 6 days (as I write this), but that's nowhere near the pace Heckenlively needs to hit 100,000 signatures in 30 days. In fact, its roughly the same pace as the last version of this petition, and I predict he'll wind up with roughly the same number of signatures as last time.</p> <p>None of this stops the delusional Mr. Heckenlively from <a href="http://bolenreport.com/trumps-five-year-moratorium-childhood-vaccines-destruction-pharma-control-media-petition/" rel="nofollow">crowing about his new petition</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> Yes, that’s the name of the new White House petition. Do you like it? I LOVE it.</p> <p>Why? I love it because it’s provocative. I love it because it gets people’s attention. I love it because it will probably drive the trolls, people like Orc, Dumb Dorritt, and Dr. Proffit absolutely bananas. I’m hoping this gets the attention of people like Emily Willingham of Forbes magazine and she writes one of her odious articles attacking it.</p> <p>Because then this idea starts winning. It will have become CONTAGIOUS, spreading like a MIND VIRUS through the consciousness of the public.</p> <p>I love it because it changes people’s perception of what is possible, and if I can get the trolls angry enough, they will do the job of spreading this wonderful idea. Yes, my enemies are part of this plan because they are stupid and hateful enough not to realize that they will help this succeed. </p></blockquote> <p>Poor delusional Kent. He really seems to think that just adding Donald Trump's name to the petition and adding a bit about "pharma control" will make the difference! As for his petition driving "Orc" absolutely bananas (there he goes again with the Tolkien fantasy of him as Aragorn fighting the Dark Lord Sauron and his Orcs, removing the "a" from my 'nym to do it), well, yes, it does sort of—bananas with gut-busting, doubled over, having-difficulty-catching-my-breath laughter at Kent. I almost thought of not writing about Kent's petition after finding his post over at the odious Bolen Report after seeing Mikey's little screed, because I'm always reluctant to give an antivaxer like Heckenlively what he wants. However, I changed my mind for two reasons. First, I don't let cranks control what I write, even in the reverse psychology sort of manner of not writing about something they clearly want me to draw attention to. Second, this blog rarely gets over 10,000 visitors a day, and the vast majority of them will be laughing along with me at Kent. It's not as though anything I right is likely to have the reach to push Heckenlively's petition from 1,500 signatures to 100,000. So I write what I want when I want.</p> <p>Besides, it's hard not to fall into one of those doubled over, trying-to-catch-my-breath fits of laughter when I read passages like this from Kent:</p> <blockquote><p> I won’t be surprised if in a week or two somebody writes that “Trump wants a five year moratorium on childhood vaccines!” Will I correct the record at that point? Maybe. Maybe not. </p></blockquote> <p>See how desperate and pathetic he is. He openly admits that he's trying to trick someone into writing fake news about Trump supporting his insane plan. He's also gone from likening himself to Aragorn, Son of Arathorn, and the one true heir of Isildur to the throne of Gondor in J.R.R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings, to likening himself to—get this!—General George S. Patton, Jr. (a.k.a. "Old Blood and Guts"), the World War II general known for his audaciousness and his "always be on the attack" philosophy:</p> <blockquote><p> I think it’s like Patton in World War II, seizing towns in Sicily ahead of the projected advance, then when he informs headquarters they tell him he wasn’t supposed to go into that town yet.</p> <p>“What should I do? Give it back to the Germans?” Patton replied.</p> <p>So let people think that this wasn’t my idea, or the idea of some truly brilliant lawyers, but was instead Trump’s idea, and the trolls will work themselves into a frenzy and only hasten the day of their own destruction. </p></blockquote> <p>Sigh. So much pathetic fantasizing in such a short passage of prose. It can only be followed by what I like to refer to as the fantasy of ultimate vindication:</p> <blockquote><p> Now, some people have made comments along the lines of, “You failed because your White House petition only got a little more than 7,000 signatures in the 30 day period.”</p> <p>A little perspective is in order…</p> <p>My first White House petition was for Suramin as a treatment for autism. Personally, I think that is the breakthrough treatment for autism and will END the epidemic. That White House Petition got about 700 signatures. Petition #2 got more than 7,000 signatures.</p> <p>Want to take any wagers on the final number for Petition #3? Petition #4? Petition #5? </p></blockquote> <p>I'll give you my prediction. Each of them will get maybe 7,000 to 10,000 signatures. Kent Heckenlively has almost certainly hit (or come very close) to his ceiling.</p> <p>Which brings us back to Mikey. I once said of antivaccine fantasies, "<a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/03/16/the-antivaccine-conspiracy-theory-narrative-you-want-it-darker/">You want it darker</a>" (a nod to Leonard Cohen's last album before his death). Well, Mikey does indeed want it darker, a lot darker:</p> <blockquote><p> Natural News has published numerous stories critical of Mark Zuckerberg and left-wing cult fanaticism, refusing to be silenced by the <em>tolerati</em> of the delusional Left which has devolved into a culture of internet bullies and delusional sh#theads. The internet has truly entered a phase where <strong>stating any true facts about vaccines or transgenderism gets you immediately banned</strong> by left-wing internet gatekeepers like Google, Facebook, YouTube and Twitter.</p> <p>Merely stating obvious, irrefutable facts — such as “men cannot give birth to children” — gets you censored and labeled a “hate speech” proponent. Pointing out real scientific data — such as the fact that vaccines contain over 50,000 ppb of mercury, a toxic heavy metal — gets you labeled a “conspiracy” website.</p> <p>That’s why it’s time to <strong>regulate Google, Facebook and Twitter as public utilities</strong>. Their abuse of power to silence dissenting views has become a danger to the liberty of all Americans.</p> <p>Why this technocracy dictatorship ends in civil war</p> <p>We have now truly reached the point of runaway left-wing insanity combined with totalitarian censorship. In essence, the Left-wing internet gatekeepers have become a <strong>technocracy dictatorship</strong> that demands unwavering obedience to the insanity of the left-wing SJW cult (and its statist tyranny). </p></blockquote> <p>He then provides a link to this video:</p> <iframe src="https://player.vimeo.com/video/228714403" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" webkitallowfullscreen="" mozallowfullscreen="" allowfullscreen=""></iframe><p> In the video, Adams claims that everything in the mainstream media is "fake news" and everything in the "independent media" (e.g., him) has science, the facts, and The Truth on its side, that President Obama "betrayed" America, and that Hillary Clinton had anyone who got close to the truth "killed." And, yes, civil war is coming, according to Mike Adams. I had to give up listening after about three or four minutes.</p> <p>Clearly, Kent Heckenlively and Mike Adams belong together. Maybe next Mr. Heckenlively will again generously offer me a chance at "<a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/02/19/in-which-i-am-called-an-astroturfer-and-offered-an-unconditional-surrender-by-an-antivaccine-crank/">unconditional surrender</a>."</p> <p><strong>ADDENDUM 8/8/2017, 2:45 PM:</strong> Holy moly! If only I had waited a while to write this. I might have had the amusement of discussing in depth Kent Heckenlively's followup post, <a href="http://bolenreport.com/kent-heckenlively-worlds-1-anti-vaxxer/" rel="nofollow">Kent Heckenlively – World’s #1 Anti-Vaxxer?</a> The word "hilarious" doesn't even begin to describe it. I must admit, though, he does make a good case in the early running:</p> <blockquote><p> Okay, I’m going to make it easy for the trolls.</p> <p>I am the world’s #1 anti-vaxxer. Seriously, I deserve the title. Who else has come up with an idea for a <strong>FIVE YEAR MORATORIUM ON CHILDHOOD VACCINES</strong> as well as a plan for the <strong>COMPLETE DESTRUCTION OF PHARMA CONTROL OF MEDIA</strong>? </p></blockquote> <p>Yes, arguably only the world's "#1 Antivaxer" could come up with an idea as utterly devoid of science, reason, and sanity as a five year moratorium on childhood vaccines. Antivax is a scientifically, intellectually, and morally bankrupt ideology, and the idea of a five year moratorium on childhood vaccines is as scientifically, intellectually, and morally bankrupt an idea as I've heard in a long time. Also, behold the power of ALL CAPS. With bold yet.</p> <p>His delusions of grandeur get even more delusional, too:</p> <blockquote><p> I’ve been very disappointed in the trolls because they haven’t been reading Saul Alinsky’s, Rules for Radicals, specifically Rule #13, “Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” The idea is that it’s easier to go after people than institutions. I mean, Alinsky did dedicate his book to Lucifer and the trolls do want to destroy the human race, so why aren’t they with the program?</p> <p>I offer myself as the target to freeze, personalize, and polarize. Just think of me as the Jeff Goldblum character, Ian Malcom, in the first Jurassic Park movie, lighting off that flare so the T-Rex stops attacking the children and goes after him instead. The only difference is that the T-Rex is probably smarter then the pro-pharma trolls.</p> <p>I really don’t think the trolls should consider that my ancestor was Martin Luther, the 16th century Protestant reformer who took on the all-powerful Catholic Church and not only escaped a burning at the stake, but is generally credited with sparking the Reformation and the Renaissance which gave birth to the modern era. I’m sure that family story is probably wrong. </p></blockquote> <p>Yes, and Martin Luther <em>also</em> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Luther_and_antisemitism">contributed greatly to German anti-Semitism</a> and was arguably a major influence on Nazi anti-Semitism. No, I'm not saying Kent Heckenlively is anti-Semitic. I don't believe that he is. I do, however, believe that he is promoting an ideology that is potentially just as harmful as anti-Semitism, his antivaccine views. Also, I bring up Martin Luther's virulent anti-Semitism to remind Mr. Heckenlively that he should perhaps be more careful in choosing the heros after whom he wants to pattern himself.</p> <p>As for the rest, as usual, Heckenlively thinks way too highly of himself. He thinks that I and other pro-science advocates, for instance, are going to spend a lot of time going after him and his silly idea of a vaccine moratorium. Well, I have news for Mr. Heckenlively. Writing about him is the sort of thing I do on days when I don't have a lot of time or thought to devote to blogging. In other words, he's a very easy target. It takes me little effort at all to deconstruct Heckenlively's claims and mock him, after which I rapidly forget about him and move on to far more important topics the following day.</p> <p>He then concludes with a bravado-filled challenge:</p> <blockquote><p> Vaccines are safe! Let’s never question them again! </p> <p>That really is your message. It’s a little like saying, rotary phones are great! Stop all forward progress! We would never have cellular phones.</p> <p>You are the past. I am the future.</p> <p>I am happy to go in front of Matt Lauer, Anderson Cooper, Jake Tapper, or any of those other pretty boy excuses for newsmen on networks that get up to 70% of their income from pharmaceutical companies – and take you on.</p> <p>In fact, I even promise that if you ever do find the courage to take me on in an honest public debate, that I will fight you with half my brain tied behind my back. </p></blockquote> <p>If Heckenlively really were to "tie half his brain behind his back," he probably couldn't outargue a six year old.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a></span> <span>Tue, 08/08/2017 - 05:10</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine-nonsense" hreflang="en">Antivaccine nonsense</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/politics" hreflang="en">Politics</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/popular-culture" hreflang="en">Popular Culture</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine" hreflang="en">antivaccine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/donald-trump" hreflang="en">Donald Trump</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/kent-heckenlively" hreflang="en">Kent Heckenlively</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mike-adams" hreflang="en">Mike Adams</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/petition" hreflang="en">Petition</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/vaccines" hreflang="en">vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/whitehousegov" hreflang="en">WhiteHouse.gov</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/politics" hreflang="en">Politics</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363604" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502185206"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>left-wing internet gatekeepers like Google, Facebook, YouTube and Twitter</p></blockquote> <p>Not that we need any more evidence Adams is delusional, but how disconnected from reality do you have to be to think these corporations are "left-wing"? Unless, of course, you define "left-wing" as "those who do not agree with me", which makes this claim an updated version of the "liberal media" canard. It says much more about Adams' political views than it does those of Google, Facebook, YouTube, or Twitter.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363604&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="sNa5sgww6wWG3HUumWZ-NaRbGu5iKDyF5Fbjv5u-FnA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363604">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363605" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502186518"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Well, on the bright side, Mr. Heckenlively seems to be perpetually optimistic about his chances and of good cheer, so maybe living within his skin isn't as bad as what some of the other conspiracy theorists may be feeling.<br /> And on the even brighter side, as you say, this attempt to deprive children from protection from disease seems to have as much chance of success as his previous ones.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363605&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="KHlUhAo17XxUseYLacTnMMYH0cB9teeThNPkVlTRYBQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363605">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363606" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502186718"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Eric Lund: This makes me think of the quote in Good end about one of the charactershatimg all Northernees. The book explained that by his definition of northerners he was standing on the South Pole.</p> <p>A little hard to have a left/right equivalent on a globe, though.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363606&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="P9LrMht0M10k3kfthlf-bQgCCbaUVsZcLJ7B7hvestU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363606">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363607" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502187054"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Orac writes,</p> <p>And, yes, civil war is coming, according to Mike Adams. I had to give up listening after about three or four minutes.</p> <p>MJD says,</p> <p>I reached about the 4:32 mark of the Mike Adams video and realized that my mind was wandering elsewhere about 95% of the time.</p> <p>Q. What's the difference between an ORC and ORAC.</p> <p>A. ORC's eat man flesh while ORAC simply detests the man flesh of Kent Heckenlively and Mike Adam.</p> <p>@Orac,</p> <p>Great read...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363607&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="LBGoSeH9VDzNcflgvozjoTAqnJODYUONapA_GiedI0o"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Michael J. Dochniak (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363607">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363608" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502187154"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Eric--Mikey is delusional, but his distorted reality is always balanced by his greater greed for $$$. I think when he gets really dark like this that he is playing to a crowd that he feels he can milk for clicks and profit. </p> <p>Now Heckenlively....he's ICD-10 level delusional without a doubt. And not very clever, either.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363608&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="n4Uhi7Dv-XW1RBspFdoVKFEuOHDpQGBuBGyzaTata78"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363608">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363609" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502187217"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I just read/ listened to Mikey and perused Bolen's site. WTF.</p> <p>-btw- both MIkey and Null have talked about civil war and/ or social collapse since about 2008-9:<br /> in the wake of the financial crisis, I believe they feared people might stop buying their woo and thus had to get the fans excited so that they would stick with them. Both sites then became more political and speculated on the economy in typically ham handed ways. Both expanded into networks that mimic radio / television. Adams takes ads. Null's site IS an ad for his nonsense.</p> <p>Characterising liberal beliefs about politicians being 'angelic' is profoundly unrealistic and exemplifies his black and white thinking ( or how he believes his fans think)</p> <p>Heckenlively's inability to get large numbers of supporters illustrates what I've always believed about anti-vaxxers-<br /> there aren't that many although we might see 50K or 60K likes for TMR or Vaccine Machine I assume that they get everyone they know to sign on - most of these people won't sign a petition.</p> <p>Mikey may have 2 million plus fans but I wonder how he got them: someone at RI once wrote that if he gets your name/ e-mail you're counted - even if someone signs on in order to access his material et al. I'm sure his history with manipulation supports my speculation.</p> <p>I have so much more about Mikey but at present he's given me a headache. Ooo. that voice.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363609&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="WTEEoQceaGdHMZCoq-8DIS9GstTs87AGWDTS4Hp1o8s"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363609">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363610" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502189501"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>A little hard to have a left/right equivalent on a globe, though.</p></blockquote> <p>Not at all. You just have to have some fun with branch cuts, to use the technical mathematical term. For instance, there are those who claim that the easternmost point in the US is in Alaska, because the Aleutian Islands chain extends west of 180 degrees longitude. Or to take a more practical example: there has to be a line somewhere in the world where you skip a day either forward or backward (depending if you are traveling west or east); the International Date Line is the line countries have agreed to use for this purpose. I am of the opinion that the political spectrum has a similar feature (i.e., far right and far left meet at some point), but that's a separate discussion.</p> <p>It is plausible that Mikey is so far to the right that anybody sane looks left-wing to him. I have been told by a self-identified member of Norway's Conservative Party that were Bernie Sanders Norwegian, he would be considered a mainstream Conservative.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363610&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Xkk7fMr_tfGC-6nwPh0A6YDeNiaGLue_HbZcdRGobKU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363610">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363611" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502194774"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>ORAC &gt; Gandalf.</p> <p>Eat that, Mikey.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363611&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="PxwenOKCkG4Sqz64GwRHEqQo_b3XNUrSn_GHQBK_26I"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Christine Rose (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363611">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1363612" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502196308"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Note my addendum. Heckenlively's going even more full mental jacket on us.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363612&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="kReB8lNmMfQpGCEONHnLhG4BRj4_S6Rgl88K2pLhg90"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363612">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363613" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502196461"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>there aren’t that many although we might see 50K or 60K likes for TMR or Vaccine Machine I assume that they get everyone they know to sign on</p></blockquote> <p>Serious question: how many of those are bots?</p> <p>I am not suggesting that TMR or even Mike Adams have created bot accounts. Adams probably doesn't have the know-how to pull it off, and it's even less likely anybody at TMR does. But some people working for Vladimir Putin certainly do: you may have seen a recent news item about a bunch of suspected pro-Trump bots having their Twitter accounts suspended. Given the political proclivities of the most vocal anti-vaxers these days (particularly people like Adams), it's hardly a stretch to imagine bot accounts "liking" some of these posts as it would help them make more legitimate.</p> <blockquote><p>Mikey may have 2 million plus fans but I wonder how he got them: someone at RI once wrote that if he gets your name/ e-mail you’re counted</p></blockquote> <p>And I suspect you are counted once for each e-mail address of yours he has. People do change their e-mail addresses every now and then.</p> <p>I'll illustrate by using myself as an example. There are four e-mail addresses I actively use: my home account, my actual work account, my "official" work address, and one provided via my undergraduate alma mater (the latter two both resolve to my actual work account). A fifth address, on my own personal domain, is currently inoperative because my domain name host can't seem to handle e-mail correctly. I have used others in the past: a previous employer, and an old home account. The latter one changed not because I changed ISPs, but because the ISP was sold to another company, so my account of the form user[at]old_isp[dot]net became one of the form user[at]new_isp[dot]net, Another such change may be in my near future as I hear my current ISP is in merger talks with another company. Were I subscribed to Mikey's newsletter under all of those e-mail addresses, he would probably consider me to be seven different subscribers, even as at least two of those addresses would generate bounce messages if he tried to send to them.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363613&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="DRSi7aNvcHCxA-Ip3_8s97RQpEbMa4cXQLRGeA5fs0E"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363613">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363614" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502196515"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Maybe he can get the #1 Comic Relief Anti-Vaxxer award. </p> <p>Did he tell Andrew Wakefield, Barbara Loe Fisher, and other more seriously harmful anti-vaccine activists about his new title?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363614&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Y9CwUEhNQe06O3h15XGkgkX41eGLmsjHy7FoPJ6KWKI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363614">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363615" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502196736"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Well, I have news for Mr. Heckenlively. Writing about him is the sort of thing I do on days when I don’t have a lot of time or thought to devote to blogging. In other words, he’s a very easy target. It takes me little effort at all to deconstruct Heckenlively’s claims and mock him, after which I rapidly forget about him and move on to far more important topics the following day.</p></blockquote> <p>Don't sugar coat it, Orac. Tell us how you really feel.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363615&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="gGVWuV94GYKOAuGVqRCWJcCsqtyb8CVQ-wzM2SRSWts"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363615">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363616" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502199535"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>...people like Orc, Dumb Dorritt, and Dr. Proffit...</p></blockquote> <p>Is Heckenlively twelve or something?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363616&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="z0v4uuJgapgZPzb-k98HCJ8uiQBJ6p6eHqVSWsUEu1c"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363616">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363617" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502199955"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Is Heckenlively twelve or something?</p></blockquote> <p>I know right? And to think he's a school teacher.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363617&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Zg_O1HCMXhEh53cTusd0dJymwZ2a052QyhmRTftOsbM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363617">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363618" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502201043"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>To tie half his brain behind his back would first require a microscope and some laser tweezers.</p> <p>Ah, well, that'll do Ken, that'll do.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363618&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="JqBQm1k25poDdrE2pv9CuJI_AH58JTzyFIVKjWhmdWU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363618">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363619" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502201131"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Kent Heckenlively wrote:<br /></p><blockquote>I really don’t think the trolls should consider that my ancestor was Martin Luther</blockquote> <p>FWIW, the trolls should also refrain from considering that—although poor, pathetic Kent may not be from the noble line of Aragorn—he is <i>also</i> descended from Nefertiti, Confucius, Muhammad, and Charlemagne. Of course, as a high school biology teacher, Kent should have understood genetics well enough to know that before he wrote his silly screed, and he should have known that most of you were descended from Charlemagne, as well. </p> <p><a href="https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/05/the-royal-we/302497/">https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/05/the-royal-we/30249…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363619&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Cay0duNZy7TFxS8Fb0Hv44PZmHuqw4CFUYRGjRIhfa8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">brian (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363619">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363620" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502202236"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>At best, he is a modern Don Quixote chasing after his equivalent of windmills...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363620&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="CBcRa9CEZ0Ib9F5usg2NHFlxENUd_NtU-l_uPUYOQRg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Zach (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363620">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363621" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502203610"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>the quote in Good end about one of the characters hatimg all Northernees.</i><br /> Good <b>Omens</b>?<br /> Autocorrect is not our friend!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363621&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="lCxFjFdVZt8-Ez-17sUt8AVoW5I5W3a42KjsxgEuZo0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363621">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363625" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502211334"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Yes, thank you! I'm a bit miffed I missed that. Thanks!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363625&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="dTOrOP0PlGXHfSQg3F_XHfhTjt5GXMRjVxirO_ixsrk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363625">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1363621#comment-1363621" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363622" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502203827"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Half his brain tied behind his back - sounds very uncomfortable to me!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363622&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tSghIoFaaikrQRkJ7NtlaOMcJKRcSK2Fpd23TIPALwI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363622">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363623" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502204925"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>tolerati of the delusional Left</i><br /> "Tolerati" is a word in the Adams vocabulary? The worst thing he can say about companies he dislikes is that they tolerate views other than his?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363623&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="yOWaQsG6CmlMyZm1TyxdvJZuA7fdgjKEPd13gl6Sas8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363623">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363624" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502210717"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>To continue what I wrote before...</p> <p>I think that web woo-meisters like Mikey or Null, ardently welcome anti-vaxxers to their various websites, broadcasts and events because they know that these groups are obsessed with alt med theories and anti-governmental rabble rousing so they may pick up new customers for their dreck/ supplements. You will notice that posts about vaccines get a higher number of hits.</p> <p>In addition, they sell items of special interest to these partisans - films/ books about vaccines, autism, medical corruption; natural 'cures', supplies for preppers, water filters, superfoods etc.</p> <p>If you haven't, take a look at Mikey's 'store' at Natural News or Gary's Vitamin Closet ( that's the real name)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363624&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="9KGUoeHe_e-7Qrt1VcZ_i04t1SH9TA2vWcGLTzgWmoY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363624">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363626" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502213267"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I read things like this post and listen to the President's (and his favorite alt-media supporters) pronouncements of deep-state overthrow, etc., and actually end up very worried for this country. Though these people might be in a statistical minority, in their world they are the last saviors of truth and virtue, and anything that is against their hero is a lie and they will do anything to protect him and the future of the movement. </p> <p>The hardest thing for me, though, is the many Evangelical leaders defending him at every turn. I was raised to believe these people wouldn't lie. If they are insisting that Trump is an innocent victim of Satan trying to destroy the country, and Obama is amassing forces to take over the country, then where do I go?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363626&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="DjVuASSyoA90nKDAXtP82xCuDvWu7OvEA_hpeuUwpFk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Mrs Woo (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363626">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363627" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502222682"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Kent's purported ancestor, Martin Luther, must have owned a Tardis, since the Renaissance begun in 14th century Italy, not 16th century Germany. But perhaps I'm nitpicking.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363627&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Bc3N6YjmFnfOyl8_8JbMdY8dbE1s0tK_Z8Zz9CUs-vM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363627">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363628" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502223858"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Holy crap. Heckenlively is a biology school teacher????</p> <p>I had no idea. Poor kids.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363628&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="0bBH29t01LmF_ZNVwLl4zB6xqsKYys5gL6k9ZakGLKI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363628">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363629" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502224184"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Jane: but the Protestant Reformation began in 16th century Germany, when Martin Luther nailed his 95 Theses onto a church door.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363629&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="dhuNXY2RUn2vQ9ZPz7BqjYaQxw6CFcbjU7xZyCRsHqw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363629">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363630" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502226467"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Yes I know, but in the addendum, Kent claims Luther sparked both the Reformation AND the Renaissance. Quite the busy guy.<br /> Next Luther will have invented the internet...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363630&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="uTVkfq21SUdbeJo8lOkP6MysI39Y0rj_k2IyBSIRLTU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363630">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363631" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502231120"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ah, Kent, it was theses, not feces, that were nailed to the door.</p> <p>Something tells me he would lose a game of Table Talk, though.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363631&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_FSMM0kmGKW2rfqbT_kZR80U6lamaQGeekxw6qkhHDw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363631">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363632" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502233746"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>That’s why it’s time to <b>regulate Google, Facebook and Twitter as public utilities</b>.</p></blockquote> <p>So, wait, they're going to get to install smart meters and roll trucks around the neighborhood? I'm confused by this proposal.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363632&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3aEjfUd3mDucgOMLK-cUpB_PiEJoED18ngyf6rQTsEA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363632">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363633" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502235722"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>It’s a little like saying, rotary phones are great! Stop all forward progress! We would never have cellular phones.</p></blockquote> <p>Pitiful, <a>just pitiful.</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363633&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8ZtzWepP1vVVk__iSB3SYgPN_7H_Cg4EMnIxBEID3EI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363633">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363634" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502240521"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Narad, I wish I'd thought of that pun first.</p> <p>If you cannot trust the government, why would you want to have Google, Facebook or Twitter public utilities? Not strong on logic.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363634&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Kt8Hvj5F3KzpKbNOAIG5qi6gFT8yOrYitn4IYssg6gI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363634">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363635" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502246400"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Hmmm, I wonder what Mike Adams and the other prominent figures in the antivax movement think about Heckenlively's claim to be the No. 1? I mean, loosing the crown count could cut into their fame and profit and I guess they would not take this lightly. Could be fun.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363635&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="laeagESf_FJZcK2OjBITwZMuCFoyLItRORDZoDTLe6M"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="StrangerInAStrangeLand">StrangerInAStr… (not verified)</span> on 08 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363635">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363636" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502255569"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Brian @16: And if you have any Asiatic ancestry you probably posess some of Genghis Khan's genes - at least according to recent genetic research. I can't find the link to check, but it appears that the legend about him having sex with a virgin every night may have some substance to it.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363636&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Jc70VFUm_rG-ykCwFQZA4qK0aefBv54xKYwdUY38ffM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Mrs Grimble (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363636">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363637" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502259398"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>In other news, Congressman Posey appears to have introduced a bill in Congress <i> "To direct the Secretary of Health and Human Services to conduct or support a comprehensive study comparing total health outcomes, including risk of autism, in vaccinated populations in the United States with such outcomes in unvaccinated populations in the United States, and for other purposes."</i> ( <a href="http://tinyurl.com/y8lm7oev">http://tinyurl.com/y8lm7oev</a> )</p> <p>Because, of course, there are absolutely no comprehensive studies out there on this (s/o). I wonder which of the wealth AVers gave him more money.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363637&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="dw3U5pjXsd1UtaHjFt6v1s5t2qzbWydmYyDnO4HGuo8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363637">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363638" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502261724"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>DW: "I think that web woo-meisters like Mikey or Null, ardently welcome anti-vaxxers to their various websites, broadcasts and events because they know that these groups are obsessed with alt med theories and anti-governmental rabble rousing so they may pick up new customers for their dreck/ supplements...they sell items of special interest to these partisans"</p> <p>Adams isn't even subtle about it. In an NN article claiming the CDC and other "nefarious actors" are behind a cyberattack on his little empire, he suggests the public response should include:</p> <p>"Help support the Health Ranger Store, which provides you the world’s most laboratory-scrutinized, ultra-clean superfoods and nutrients"</p> <p>What the CDC, WHO, Bill Gates, Cthulu and "Orc" should do is obtain some of the NN store's "ultra-clean" products and run tests on them to document what heavy metals, glyphosate etc. are to be found therein. It'd be fun to see his public and competitors demanding "safe" NN products, like the loons currently protesting Ben &amp; Jerry's ice cream.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363638&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="VqTS9q_x9x7rawF5G34jxqh4L7x4EpjUlxY3MfN46Nk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363638">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1363640" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502264506"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Oh, yes. I noticed that now Adams has gone from claiming that Facebook is "censoring" him to claiming that he's the target of a massive DDoS attack initiated by...wait for it...the CDC! How does he come to this conclusion? <a href="http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-08-08-natural-news-targeted-in-massive-well-funded-ddos-attack-to-silence-debate.html">Behold</a>:</p> <blockquote><p>The CDC is a military organization run by an Air Force Major known as Dr. Brenda Fitzgerald, M.D. She served at the Wurtsmith Air Force Strategic Air Command (SAC) Base in Michigan and at Andrews Air Force Base in Washington, D.C. Why is this significant? Because the United States Air Force runs Cyber Command, an infrastructure engineered to carry out acts of cyber warfare against intended targets.</p></blockquote> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363640&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="cIb61MTI0NWqZMIeZ8VBnrjAL4N8TRihY3lG8RHKgD0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363640">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1363638#comment-1363638" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363639" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502263541"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>It'll die in committee. Once someone points out that research costs money, Grover Norquist will send nasty notes to the Republicans in Congress to vote NO.</p> <p>Jane: oops! Missed that. Thanks.</p> <p>Re genetics: Hm. My family has claimed for years that we're descended from Robert the Bruce. If I believe this, it might actually be true. But then again, so is everyone else, so the snobs in the family still need to just shut up.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363639&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="K3jdVm03w9sIimFen1WuFGvMEZBILxT2wAdTbmilzK8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363639">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363641" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502264593"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Speaking of ancestry, it has been calculated that Europeans inherited 2-4% of their genome from Neanderthals. In addition, there is evidence that humans interbred with the Denisovian hominids.<br /> Boasting of your ancestry is racist, not to mention lame. As Abraham Lincoln is purported to have said, "I am not interested in the man his father was, I am interested in the man he will be."</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363641&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Q7Rb0OpAF5p6gGzGL2s0HfBKYVZsGnMktDqIORBESn4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363641">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363642" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502270003"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Dangerous Bacon:</p> <p>What's very funny about these guys is that they masquerade as 'just folks' - regular middle class people whilst living on estates or ranches that must be valued in the millions.</p> <p>They don't admit their earnings though.</p> <p>Null actually shows his estates and uses them to conduct 'retreats' - i.e. thinly disguised alt med/ energy healing in a resort setting. </p> <p>So far I haven't been able to find photos of Adams' current Austin area home- he only videos ducks and geese- so I assume it is not as humble as he says. He did show his Ecuadorian hacienda/ 'food forest' which was for sale and opulent for the area. He bragged that locals would work for him for almost nothing.</p> <p>Recently some business news reported about his ( co-called) lab and that he was expanding his warehousing or suchlike.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363642&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="2Yg43Dmz97izZR2hiRP0--wwuym6sAbulEWe3aZCiGA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363642">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363643" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502271460"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Because the United States Air Force runs Cyber Command</p></blockquote> <p>I'm sure this will come as a great surprise to the Navy admiral who commands it. I don't think Mikey gets how this organizational chart works.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363643&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="i3wKMAz0AmpQTLDI54oidEsCz_unXOFPfhQIcK984Pg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363643">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363644" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502271532"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Oh, good lord. So he thinks that an OB GYN is out to get him because she was stationed at an Air Force base where Cyber Command is located?</p> <p>Cyber Command wasn't formed until 2009. She would have left the Air Force long before then, probably because she either decided not to go career or she didn't make rank. It's hard to tell when she joined the military but it looks like it was probably in the 1980's or 90's at the latest. If she left with a rank of major she was in probably about 10-15 years depending on how fast she got promoted. She was probably out before 9/11 happened is my guess.</p> <p>There used to be a full service hospital at Andrews until some time in the 90's early 2000's when the Air Force downsized its military hospital facilities at most of its military bases. Bethesda took over the inpatient services. I actually trained at Malcom Grow Hospital, in my LPN program, in the mid 80's. I did a Med Surg, Peds, and OB rotation there and had a great experience.</p> <p>The food in the hospital cafeteria was fantastic, and you could get seconds.</p> <p>Mikey, as usual, is talking out of his a**. He really should talk to someone about the voices he must be hearing based on what he's writing.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363644&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="f9FDXPATViaPjsN_2Mb4y2V8Wm9Fq7F1kEZxTlj-1Pg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363644">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363645" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502273334"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Oh, good lord. So he thinks that an OB GYN is out to get him because she was stationed at an Air Force base <b>where Cyber Command is located</b>?</p></blockquote> <p>Fort Meade is an Army base.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363645&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tOYF74K-DIzZm7v-id4sjIY2G4L67JBjhQAIGTVUKdc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363645">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363646" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502273420"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Orac@36: Wow. That isn't even coherent enough to be considered a conspiracy theory.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363646&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="MMe24WNxjLTnzUARnTkitAIMVLzbTWcu6jCQhBFujnU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363646">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363647" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502273621"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ft Meade is also at or near where the NSA does its thing too.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363647&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="MsvKZSdwJ51l3k5MW8OH6IsYBwoBsN4HoD4AeJwS-S4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MikeMa (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363647">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363648" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502274386"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p> So he thinks that an OB GYN is out to get him because she was stationed at an Air Force base where Cyber Command is located? </p></blockquote> <p>It's worse than that - if you look at where the AF parts of Cyber Command are, Wurtsmith and Andrews aren't included. Also, Wurtsmith was closed in 1993, 16 years before Cyber Command was created.</p> <p>See the list of locations at the bottom of -<br /><a href="https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-Fourth_Air_Force">https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-Fourth_Air_Force</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363648&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_lmAflDlsP1scHIm6ss-YbPacUQGBkR3LFXJ2JeX7qo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363648">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363649" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502275639"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Orac@36,</p> <p>I read that book last month:</p> <p><a href="https://www.amazon.com/NSA-National-Security-Claude-Delesse-ebook/dp/B01CYODVPK/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&amp;ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1502297066&amp;sr=1-1&amp;keywords=NSA+%3A+National+Security+agency">https://www.amazon.com/NSA-National-Security-Claude-Delesse-ebook/dp/B0…</a></p> <p>Never in this potentially well researched (in my opinion, I'm no expert there) it is mentioned about any national security agency to have any discussion whatsoever with the CDC.</p> <p>Alain</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363649&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_ksbFSWTFSc9UAKlGi5wAxjwH_o7Mq3tqpjQ_EN1ZMo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363649">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363650" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502286138"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Mrs. Woo: The hardest thing for me, though, is the many Evangelical leaders defending him at every turn. I was raised to believe these people wouldn’t lie.</p> <p>That's really odd. My mother was sort of Lutheran, my dad never went to church much as a kid (Grandpa was liable to get the pastor into a debate) and I was the only kid that was baptized and briefly went to Sunday school when I was fivish or so. Consequently, I grew up viewing the "religious" people as a sort of odd subspecies and thought for the longest time that the commandment was 'thou shalt bear false witness.'" Evangelicals have been lying about everything for basically forever.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363650&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="HzpIQatD_jJNiNkjvM-dBw9rmb2aXlj74TT9vsSEvJI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Politicalguineapig (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363650">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363651" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502310648"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>So he thinks that an OB GYN is out to get him because she was stationed at an Air Force base where Cyber Command is located?</i></p> <p>Not to mention, in the Air Force (like the rest of the DOD), majors barely command respect.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363651&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ixcJalcZwxzzo1BG_BYpUPasMliZHLqZmEk8erkZx74"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">shay simmons (not verified)</span> on 09 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363651">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363652" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502410949"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"he should perhaps be more careful in choosing the heros after whom he wants to pattern himself."<br /> That goes for George Patton too. Patton was an unhinged anti-Semite and general racist. He tormented his troops with what is variously known as "Mickey Mouse" and "chickenshit", an exaggerated adherence to petty and unrealistic regulations. He thought death in battle was the most glorious death possible and didn't quite get that none of his troops shared that sentiment - they said of Old Blood and Guts, "Yeah, your blood, his guts". He threw away troops on mad missions, such as the poorly planned and equipped doomed raid into Czechoslovakia to rescue officer POWs, one of whom by cosmic coincidence happened to be his son-in-law. He was removed from command of the US occupation zone in Germany for declaring that the Nazi party was just another political party just like the Republicans and Democrats. His last harebrained scheme was to rearm the Wehrmacht and join them in an all-out war with those racially inferior Soviets. Never mind that most US troops just wanted to go home, and most German troops had no desire to return to the Eastern front after four years of misery and horror.<br /> All in all, not a great role model.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363652&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="n7IRnLDAmdJyF55I_ppOw1cdVxEefNKeLZBXjbWDTDw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Old Rockin&#039; Dave (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363652">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363653" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502411267"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>We know that ancient humans mated with Homo neanderthalensis, Homo denisovensis, and Homo heidelburgensis.<br /> I guess our ancestors were just a big bunch of Homo-sexuals.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363653&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="YoRjrqLXmKkevyAKGHIE6bUXaD-yHlfwl5JGF0H7jiw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Old Rockin&#039; Dave (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363653">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363654" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502411439"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Jane Ostentatious, it should be easy for Kent to fight with half his brain tied behind his back.<br /> From the evidence so far, behind his back is where his brain is already.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363654&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ZxCOj6vNGZdJduql9aReEHLjWC8VpVbgbLcJ7HuLSsY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Old Rockin&#039; Dave (not verified)</span> on 10 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363654">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363655" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502527927"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ORD #50, LOL!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363655&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="svbnum6eDQBoRv7vm5KtLARQ6vIqbifPiiA6ZBTHoD8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 12 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363655">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363656" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1502620023"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>OT but Adams reveals who he really is</p> <p>Yesterday and today, Natural News</p> <p>Mikey responds to the events in Charlottesville</p> <p>Take a peek.<br /> Warning - it might make you sick.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363656&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="CXocjLljSe5VS76SyCsqsEgSyUiAsveS9c_BLxn9gYQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 13 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363656">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363657" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504162935"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><blockquote> Now, some people have made comments along the lines of, “You failed because your White House petition only got a little more than 7,000 signatures in the 30 day period.” <p>A little perspective is in order…</p> <p>My first White House petition was for Suramin as a treatment for autism. Personally, I think that is the breakthrough treatment for autism and will END the epidemic. That White House Petition got about 700 signatures. Petition #2 got more than 7,000 signatures.</p> <p>Want to take any wagers on the final number for Petition #3? Petition #4? Petition #5? </p></blockquote> <p>I’ll give you my prediction. Each of them will get maybe 7,000 to 10,000 signatures. Kent Heckenlively has almost certainly hit (or come very close) to his ceiling. </p></blockquote> <p>To get to 7,000 signatures, they are going to have to get 1,901 today. </p> <p>I wonder how (if at all) Ken will spin this.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363657&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="br5DYvj5sChuVacYpWxaOzEs8Cb546OpujpqXm2M8cE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363657">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363658" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504165871"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Oops - I must have pulled up a cached page from a coupla days ago. The current total is 6,826, so they need 174 to reach 7000.</p> <p>Or maybe Ken had a bunch of bots ready to go in case this happened.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363658&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="btrrt-Y-6ZNKUfTUKW3jDSmGofZJwmZxW_tM27YOwCE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363658">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363659" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504178266"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ah, the petition did get a bump today (I think it's today)<br /><a href="http://bolenreport.com/heckenlively-opens-talks-trump-regarding-aid-australian-rebels/">http://bolenreport.com/heckenlively-opens-talks-trump-regarding-aid-aus…</a></p> <p>Yep, Heckenlively talked to Trump. Well, a Trump action figure. But that's the same thing, isn't it?</p> <p>I wonder if it talked back.</p> <p>6876 signatures on the petition</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363659&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="u8TO2CNQo0M2h0UrCQiYqqHJbZLOcuDM553POI-RatY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363659">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363660" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504179127"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The petition did get a shot in the arm (heh) today.<br /><a href="http://bolenreport.com/heckenlively-opens-talks-trump-regarding-aid-australian-rebels/">http://bolenreport.com/heckenlively-opens-talks-trump-regarding-aid-aus…</a></p> <p>Yes, it seems Heckenlively talked to Trump. Well, a Trump action figure. But that's all perfectly normal, isn't it"</p> <p>6884 signatures on the petition.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363660&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="zdGqzqTxWshxZz3PV7ZMjzMuIKzFpx9Uq_f2uaDdTQ4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363660">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363661" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504187611"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ah, the petition did get a bump today (I think it's today)<br /><a href="http://bolenreport.com/heckenlively-opens-talks-trump-regarding-aid-australian-rebels/">http://bolenreport.com/heckenlively-opens-talks-trump-regarding-aid-aus…</a></p> <p>Yep, Heckenlively talked to Trump. Well, a Trump action figure. But that's the same thing, isn't it?</p> <p>I wonder if it talked back.</p> <p>6912 signatures on the petition</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363661&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="vL43EY0NYxV89i-9jzNn0cxJBOfxM5iu4xtNPvmApF0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363661">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363662" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504193589"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Suramin as a treatment for autism. Personally, I think that is the breakthrough treatment for autism</i></p> <p>Which breakthrough treatment is this? The 3rd? 4th? 5th? How many times has Heckenlively cured his son now? Ah well, when life gives you lemons an autistic son, make lemonade you have a guineapig for experiments.</p> <p>Suramin is Naviaux's schtik, founded entirely on yet another feckin' <b>mouse model of autism</b> which even Mady Hornig thinks is whack. He was mainly interested in antipurinergic treatment for mitochondrial dysfunction, and spun it as "autism cure" because that's what his funding source wants to hear.</p> <p>Suramin is NOT A HAPPY FUN TOY.</p> <blockquote><p>There is a greater than 50% chance of adrenal cortical damage, but only a smaller proportion will require lifelong corticosteroid replacement.</p></blockquote> <p><a href="http://eusa-riddled.blogspot.co.nz/2013/04/why-is-mouse-that-spins.html">http://eusa-riddled.blogspot.co.nz/2013/04/why-is-mouse-that-spins.html</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363662&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="orTT7wtAL8DAdr8gQZKijH4oyVErUWePw1MI9tleDjc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363662">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363663" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504197610"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p> I must have pulled up a cached page from a coupla days ago. The current total is 6,826, so they need 174 to reach 7000.</p></blockquote> <p>It was at 6809 when I checked this morning right after seeing your comment, I think, and then "jumped" to 6814. A veritable groundswell.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363663&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="PKxllIKKS2YKFde-ULudsAyjVw66UPlmxEDLcR4cCxg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 31 Aug 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363663">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1363664" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1504283504"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The petition is closed now, and the final tally is 7,132 SIGNED. The previous petition drew 7,328, so 196 fewer. </p> <p>I wonder what Kent's Trump doll will say about that.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1363664&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="BXGx9_XA-fXVkhHWcItVOFnMOAZrBSHiXvH5_UMzpmY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 01 Sep 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1363664">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/insolence/2017/08/08/dumb-and-dumber-kent-heckenlively-and-mike-adams-team-up-to-support-an-antivaccine-whitehouse-gov-petition%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Tue, 08 Aug 2017 09:10:07 +0000 oracknows 22600 at https://scienceblogs.com The violent rhetoric of the antivaccine movement: "Vaccine Holocaust" and potential impending attacks on journalists https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/17/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement-vaccine-holocaust-and-potential-impending-attacks-on-journalists <span>The violent rhetoric of the antivaccine movement: &quot;Vaccine Holocaust&quot; and potential impending attacks on journalists</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>After yesterday's post about how antivaxers were utterly losing their mind about an ill-chosen idiom that appeared in a <a href="http://www.bostonherald.com/opinion/editorials/2017/05/editorial_preying_on_parents_fear"><em>Boston Herald</em> editorial</a> last week. In it, the editor concluded by saying that how antivaxers have been <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/12/the-somali-measles-outbreak-in-minnesota-thanks-again-andy-and-american-antivaxers-for-the-measles/">preying on the Somali immigrant population in Minnesota</a>, feeding them <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/05/hanks-for-the-measles-yet-again-andy-antivaxers-swoop-in-like-vultures-to-spread-antivaccine-misinformation-among-the-minnesota-somali-immigrant-community/">antivaccine misinformation</a> that has resulted in two measles outbreaks, one in 2011 and one this year, which is <a href="https://www.mprnews.org/story/2017/05/15/minnesota-measles-outbreak-spreads-to-lesueur-county">up to 58 victims</a>, a number that continues to climb, should be a "hanging offense." <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/16/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-24-violent-imagery-for-me-but-not-for-thee/">In my post</a>, I emphasized the hypocrisy and disingenuousness of the response of antivaxers, who took an offhand use of a questionable idiom and turned it into headlines blaring that the <em>Boston Herald</em> is advocating death squads to undertake the mass murder of antivaxers. Basically, antivaxers routinely use imagery on a daily basis far more violent than an offhand quip about a "hanging offense," such as photos in which antivaccine mothers <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/12/03/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement/">brandish large caliber weapons</a> to defend their children against depraved pro-vaxers, idiots like Del Bigtree say that antivaxers should <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2016/07/19/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement-vaxxed-edition/">take up arms to resist the new California law</a> eliminating nonmedical exemptions to school vaccine requirements (<a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2016/07/20/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement-i-didnt-really-mean-it-edition/">which he hilariously walked back when called on it</a>), and all manner of antivaxers liken the vaccination program to <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/09/30/anti-vaccine-not-pro-safe-vaccine-vaccination-described-as-rape/">rape</a>, <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/04/09/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-15-robert-f-kennedy-jr-and-the-vaccine-associated-holocaust/">the Holocaust</a>, <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/11/12/the-autism-holocaust-why-antivaccine-advocates-are-not-autism-advocates/">Nazis</a>, <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2012/04/23/the-annals-of-im-not-anti-vaccine/">the Titanic, the Oklahoma City bombing</a>, the <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/08/22/brian-hooker-proves-andrew-wakefield-wrong-about-vaccines-and-autism/">Tuskegee syphilis experiment</a>, and a tsunami.</p> <!--more--><p>In fact, I couldn't help but laugh when I saw a particularly odious antivaxer, Ginger Taylor <a href="http://www.ageofautism.com/2017/05/rachelle-cohen-wants-you-dead-but-you-are-not-to-respond-in-kind.html" rel="nofollow">practically beg her fellow antivaxers not to threaten violence or use antisemitic language</a> criticizing the <em>Herald</em>'s editorial page editor Rachelle Cohen. Cohen, not surprisingly, has gotten a lot of hate mail, including (predictably, given her name) antisemitic hate mail, complete with a large volume of antisemitic calls and e-mails, leading her to observe drolly (and quite correctly), “Discussions that begin with how sorry folks are I’m not headed for ‘the ovens’ [are] not likely to be fruitful.” (prominently featured was a comment about how disappointed an antivaxer was that she wasn't being sent to the ovens). It amuses me to no end how antivaxers so gleefully make my points for me. Ginger basically has to beg her readers to knock it off with violent imagery far worse than the poorly chosen quip about a “hanging” offense that she now finds oh-so-offensive, coupled with Nazi level antisemitism. Hilarity indeed. I’d almost feel sorry for Ms. Taylor, but she brings it on herself—with gusto—and her Dunning-Kruger arrogance of ignorance is off the charts. However, compared to what's going on now, Ms. Taylor is merely an amusing sideline, as you will see. I realize that some of this will be a little repetitive of yesterday's post, but I consider this important enough to cover again, but from a different angle.</p> <p>While it was fun to focus on the hypocrisy, what was less fun was what I learned later in the day and only mentioned in addendums. Specifically, it's a very conscious campaign on the part of antivaxers, led by Mike Adams, to threaten and intimidate journalists criticizing the antivaxers who have been spreading misinformation among the Somali community. To give you an idea where he's coming from, he's recently set up a website that he calls <a href="http://vaccineholocaust.org" rel="nofollow">Vaccine Holocaust</a>. (Obviously, anything resembling subtlety or good taste was never Adams' strong suit.) At the top of the headlines last night when I perused the website was <a href="http://vaccineholocaust.org/2017-05-16-vaccines-are-harming-more-babies-each-day-than-gunshots.html" rel="nofollow">More children harmed by VACCINES than from GUNSHOTS, government statistics reveal</a>. It's a truly hilariously dumb article in which someone named Lance D. Johnson (who deserves all the ridicule he can get for writing this) takes a look at the horrific statistics on gunshot injuries and deaths among children in the US and compares them to the number of adverse events reported to the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) database, the vast majority of which are minor and many of the rest not even related to vaccines because lawyers have been encouraging parents to report "vaccine injury" for a long time. Basically, it's comparing data from a verified database (the National Database of Inpatient Stays for Children) to that of a database where the reports are not verified (VAERS) and parents can report that vaccines <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20060427200248/http://neurodiversity.com/weblog/article/14/chelation-autism">turned someone into the Incredible Hulk</a> and have the report entered.</p> <p>The stupid, it burns.</p> <p>But Vaccine Holocaust is about more than just flaming stupidity. It's about naked intimidation; that is, if Adams actually goes through with his threats. As is his wont, Adams claims to have reported the editorial staff of the <em>Boston Herald</em> to the FBI, the Massachusetts Attorney General, the Boston Police, and more. Not surprisingly, the Attorney General didn't take him seriously (as well he shouldn't have, given the First Amendment). I'm sure there were many chuckles in the Attorney General's office though, likely coupled with a whole lot of facepalming. From this Adams, again, as is his wont, concludes that it's the <a href="http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-05-16-massachusetts-attorney-general-says-its-okay-for-mainstream-media-to-publish-death-threats-against-anti-vaxxers.html" rel="nofollow">beginning of a huge conspiracy to murder antivaxers</a> based on the raving of an equally <a href="http://www.jeffereyjaxen.com/news/official-calls-for-violence-hate-speech-in-media-greenlighted-by-massachusetts-attorney-general" rel="nofollow">deluded antivaxer, Jeffery Jaxen</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> Beta testing, sometimes referred to user acceptance testing, is defined in the computer world as a technique in which hardware is subjected to small trial environment before full implementation. Establishment media outlets and government health agencies have ramped up the pressure and targeting of families, parents, and children over the past few years. Vaccination, once a choice after careful deliberation over the dangers by way of full informed consent, has been painted as an authoritarian demand by the state. The removal of full informed consent, public health debates and medical choice has been superseded to make way for the ever-expanding profit margins of pharmaceutical corporations. </p> <p>Media outlets now regularly attack and dehumanize anyone who does not subscribe to what can only be described as a religious-like dogma of the failing tenets of the medical-industrial complex. Humanity has witnessed governments and their mouthpieces, often with corporate collusion, attempt to divide and conquer their populations for the purpose of greater control and, in extreme cases, extermination. The slippery slope practice of painting innocent subgroups of society, often used as scapegoats for failed government policy, as a danger to the collective is well-documented and extremely dangerous.</p> <p>To pave the way for California Senate Bill 277, marinated in Big Pharma money and political corruption, The LA Times ran the article titled "Rich, educated and stupid parents are driving the vaccination crisis." Such a headline now seems tame in today's accepted media landscape ever since the Boston Herald labeled public debate about questionable health practices and parents talking about their children's vaccine injuries "a hanging offense." </p></blockquote> <p>You can guess what's coming next. Jaxen cites Anthony Mawson's terrible study that was retracted from not just one, but two, bottom-feeding predatory pay-to-publish "open access" journals without mentioning the little bit about the retraction, and concludes that more fascism in the service of "forced vaccination" is on the way. Not surprisingly, Adams eats this up. Unfortunately, though, he <a href="http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-05-16-massachusetts-attorney-general-says-its-okay-for-mainstream-media-to-publish-death-threats-against-anti-vaxxers.html" rel="nofollow">takes it in a truly ugly direction</a>. Based on the Attorney General's recognizing a crank when he sees one (or, quite possibly, a bunch of cranks if several more antivaxers complained), Adams thinks himself justified to do this:</p> <blockquote><p> In other words, the Massachusetts government has just told anti-vaxxers that you must now take up your own self-defense against journo-terrorists, since the “authorities” in government refuse to apply the law to those who work at the Boston Herald. Your lives are now in danger. You are being targeted by the Boston Herald and any number of psychopaths who may be motivated by the Herald’s call for mass murder. The government has now declared it will do nothing to stop the calls for murder by “journalists” as long as they are targeting people who oppose toxic vaccine ingredients.</p> <p><strong>It’s time to start publishing the home addresses of journo-terrorists who escalate violence against concerned parents and independent scientists</strong></p> <p>This all explains why I plan to publish the home addresses of the journo-terrorists working at the Boston Herald, in order to warn local Bostonians that they might be living next to murderous, sociopathic mental health miscreants who are a danger to society. Since the Massachusetts government refuses to take any action to protect the public from these dangerous psychopaths, it’s obvious that we must take action to protect ourselves. The right to self-defense, after all, is one of the most sacred rights we possess.</p> <p>Our non-profit division is also launching the public education site VaccineHolocaust.org where journo-terrorists who deny that vaccines harm children will be named and shamed, providing a permanent record of their crimes against children and humanity. </p></blockquote> <p>There is a "protest" planned for tomorrow at the Boston Herald being publicized by a local antivaccine group, <a href="https://www.facebook.com/events/1941790046105098/">Health Choice Massachusetts</a>. As of last night there were 23 saying they were going, a whole five up from the night before. In any case, at this "rally," Adams is <a href="http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-05-15-boston-rally-this-thursday-to-target-the-boston-herald-for-stating-that-vaccine-skeptics-should-all-be-hanged-to-death.html" rel="nofollow">urging people to do this</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> Bring your cameras to the protest! Natural News plans to publish photos of Boston Herald staff members walking to and from the building, their vehicle license plate numbers and other details, to the extent allowed by law. If you attend this rally, be sure to take photos and send them to Natural News for publication.</p> <p>If anyone attending the rally can bring an audio recorder, attempt to interview Boston Herald staffers and ask if they support government-run execution squads of so-called “anti-vaxxers.” If they answer yes, ask them if they plan to do the killing themselves, or if they want government to do the killing for them. Find out if they plan to use lethal injection, hanging, machetes or guns. After all, history has shown there are all sorts of ways for genocidal factions of society to run mass murder campaigns against the people they don’t like. We’re wondering which method the Boston Herald favors.</p> <p>You might also ask them whether they think killing children with toxic vaccine ingredients is also ethically justifiable, since they’re also advocating the mass murder of naturopaths, scientists and journalists who oppose mercury in vaccines. Find out if there’s any other group they also think should be murdered, such as “climate denialists” or people who grow herbs. Maybe they hate “man boobs” and want to murder men with breasts. </p></blockquote> <p>You know, whenever I think Adams can't sink any lower or become any more ridiculous, he always proves me wrong. As much as I like to laugh at his ridiculousness in urging antivaxers to pretend they're Michael Moore or Geraldo Rivera asking "gotcha" questions, his threat to the journalists of the <em>Boston Herald</em> is anything but funny. For one thing, a lot more people work at a newspaper than just journalists, and only a relatively small number of people put together most editorial pages. Even fewer still actually write the editorials. Neither is this the least bit amusing:</p> <p><a href="/files/insolence/files/2017/05/DespicableAntivaxposter.jpg"><img src="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/files/2017/05/DespicableAntivaxposter-300x450.jpg" alt="" width="300" height="450" class="aligncenter size-medium wp-image-10872" /></a></p> <p>The sheer cynicism is breathtaking. Here you have a group of people, nearly all white, latching on to one of the most shameful parts of American history, the lynchings of black people, mostly men, that took place over many decades after the Civil War and claiming to be on the side of the Somali immigrants, who are also black. The condescending racism is beyond belief. So is the obsessive use of hanging imagery, be it Ms. Taylor's use of an illustration of women being hung after the Salem witch trials or Adams' use of an old photo of the lynching of a black man to try to claim he's on the side of the Somalis, or the many photos of nooses obsessively included in posts and articles on various antivax blogs and websites. It's almost as though they really, really like (or are fascinated) by the imagery of hanging.</p> <p>I also can't help but point out here that, first of all, the press is not attacking the Somalis. Racist xenophobes (but I repeat myself) are attacking them, using the measles outbreak as a convenient excuse and ignoring how it was American antivaxers who fed them misinformation that vaccines cause autism, who frightened the Somalis into not vaccinating. If there were no measles outbreak, the same people would just continuing to demonize the Somalis as a fertile recruiting ground for ISIS. Rather, most journalists in the mainstream press realize that the Somalis are victims of American antivaxers and, of course, the British fraud who inspired them, Andrew Wakefield, and that's at whom their ire is being directed, not the Somalis—and appropriately so. Again, the Somalis are the victims, and antivaxers are the perpetrators. Meanwhile, the public health officials trying to combat the antivaccine misinformation being spread by the antivaxers are the heros, and the journalists are documenting it all.</p> <p>These are the reasons why I scoff when antivaxers claim not to be antivaccine. I mean, seriously. Think about it. Not only do they liken vaccination programs to all those horrible things I discussed above, but they think nothing of using obvious intimidation tactics to attempt to frighten critics who have the temerity to call them out into silence. I first noticed that 12 years ago when I was a new blogger and my true identity was actually not one of the worst-kept secrets on the Internet. Antivaxers and other cranks were obsessed with finding out who I was. That's because they have no science and therefore can't win when science is the basis of the discussion. Instead, they seek ways to attack their critics, either through ad hominems or through the threat of actual physical attacks (and, let's face it, that's the undertext of Adams' plans). Discovering who their critics are, digging for every bit of dirt they can on them, publicizing anything negative they can find, and harassing critics at their jobs or schools are the first preferred techniques of dealing with criticism, not the use of evidence, science, and reason to persuade. Adams' plan to dox employees of the Boston Herald and other provaccine advocates who criticize antivaxers is nothing new. It's how antivaxers operate. It's how they've always operated since I first discovered that there are people clueless enough to view vaccines as dangerous.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a></span> <span>Wed, 05/17/2017 - 00:00</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine-nonsense" hreflang="en">Antivaccine nonsense</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/history" hreflang="en">History</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/holocaust" hreflang="en">Holocaust</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/politics" hreflang="en">Politics</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/popular-culture" hreflang="en">Popular Culture</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/pseudoscience" hreflang="en">Pseudoscience</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/quackery-0" hreflang="en">Quackery</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/skepticismcritical-thinking" hreflang="en">Skepticism/Critical Thinking</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine" hreflang="en">antivaccine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/auschwitz" hreflang="en">Auschwitz</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/autism" hreflang="en">autism</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/ginger-taylor" hreflang="en">Ginger Taylor</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/hanging" hreflang="en">hanging</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/lynching" hreflang="en">lynching</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mike-adams" hreflang="en">Mike Adams</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/minnesota" hreflang="en">Minnesota</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/somali" hreflang="en">Somali</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/vaccines" hreflang="en">vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/politics" hreflang="en">Politics</a></div> </div> </div> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-categories field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Categories</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/channel/social-sciences" hreflang="en">Social Sciences</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359219" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494997494"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Just when you thought Adams couldn't sink any lower, he goes out and proves everyone wrong in magnitudes greater than expected.<br /> I certainly hope the Boston Herald takes the "protest" seriously enough to protect their employees from the doxxing and hate mail the antivaxxers would happily send to them....we all know the antivaxxers are so polite that way.<br /> Of course, if the Herald does ask for police to monitor the protest, we can all bet on the fact that Adams will seize on that as preventing "freedom of speech" - only allowed when it's his, not anyone else's, by the way. It's OK to doxx anyone you disagree with, in his mind (and many antivaxxers), but heaven forbid anyone do it to them.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359219&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="uMLrXcty8B-TDbm0dmRWoCrk9uEErmdRNpXi5uXOkRM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359219">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359220" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494999246"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Doxxing per se is not illegal. But stalking and harassment are. </p> <p>Adams is walking a fine line. He'd better watch his step, or the local prosecutors may indeed take an interest . . . just not the one he wants.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359220&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Eo-gpsurvDNI8TRmb8BcfHbCsXAS2j-VIO0_0zOauog"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359220">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359221" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495001334"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Panacea: I know doxxing isn't illegal. But we all know that when the antivaxxers doxx someone, they don't leave it at that, they write to friends, neighbors, employers and threaten families. And since they aren't brave enough to put their names on the harassment, it's very difficult for law enforcement to manage.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359221&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="4Y9TbbTORYCiEbLHXMqY1Y8M0y7-zT-fn2BgjIhQ4QQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359221">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359222" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495004523"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I haven't listened yet, but I wonder if Ms. Taylor, talking about this yesterday, distanced herself from Mr. Adams' implied threats.<br /><a href="http://www.robertscottbell.com/show-archives/">http://www.robertscottbell.com/show-archives/</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359222&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="L-R8trscQD-OIoxjosq6yoAe4LVF6OQeGMBDre-cDQ8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359222">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359223" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495006587"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Jaxen cites Anthony Mawson’s terrible study that was retracted from not just one, but two, bottom-feeding predatory pay-to-publish “open access” journals without mentioning the little bit about the retraction, and concludes that more fascism in the service of “forced vaccination” is on the way.</p></blockquote> <p>Weirdly, the fact that both surveys were retracted is evidence to the irrational worldview of anti-vaxxers that "we" are somehow frightened of this information and also feeds into their persecution complex. It is this persecution complex and irrationality, along with a healthy dose of cognitive dissonance that allows them to justify harassing their critics with the same methods they accuse their critics of employing.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359223&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wQKie0DF2bct1xODdA15DIh8sYm9BPtp9TdqkelOTKo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359223">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1359224" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495009699"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The first study appears to be back on the OAT website...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359224&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="cgXshmMtRUk5OhF7J9Ox5vz1qlY1PIJ2LjbHn95keV0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359224">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359225" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495010023"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Science Mom: Nothing weird about it, it's how conspiracy theorists operate. The paper was published? Evidence of a conspiracy. The paper was retracted? Evidence that a conspiracy is suppressing the evidence. It made no difference to the anti-vax crew what happened to the Mawson et al. paper after it was submitted.</p> <p>A minor point on the original post: Not only does the VAERS database overstate the incidence of vaccine injury (by not verifying the claimed injuries), but the National Database of Inpatient Stays for Children almost certainly understates the incidence of gun injuries to children. Assuming that the latter database is exactly what it says on the tin, it would exclude (1) children who died before being admitted to a hospital and (2) children whose injuries were not severe enough to merit hospitalization. The CDC is actually prohibited from investigating the incidence of gun injuries, because certain politicians who are in the pocket of the gun lobby don't want to find out the answer. And I have the impression that, among his many other proclivities, Mike Adams is a gun nut.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359225&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tzyQC6CGdXO5acVU-eEuexr-1yS3lpwU4MVhvYOkWPA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359225">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359226" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495012737"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>MI Dawn: yes, I get that. But Adams is effectively inciting the behavior. They don't have to track the doxxers. They can go to Adams. That's why I said he should watch his step.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359226&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IMSWOAPSJAhajid1ASNsjMYx9-_zCN7J6MehvLO_lAM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359226">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359227" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495012850"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>The first study appears to be back on the OAT website…</p></blockquote> <p>At what ransom I wonder.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359227&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="r7ljBnxC84KXYzbE7l9lofudmu6wd0-gyLr9U0Nnulw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359227">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359228" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495012868"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Re: Johnson's use of the VAERS information.</p> <p>This is a continuing fetish of data abuse on the part of the anti-vaxxers. If I recall correctly, there are several warnings about the data collected by VAERS, explaining that it is unfiltered, unverified, and unreliable for anything other than possible more reliable investigations. One page even makes visitors acknowledge reading disclaimers before getting to the actual information. For any one with basic reading comprehension, this is about as close as a government agency is likely to get to shouting "Don't go data diving here for anything approaching reliable information!"</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359228&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="OfUKdA5OZZ_dI3119MostS9LyQKSHgoXwes2AMFTIR4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">sirhcton (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359228">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359229" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495015269"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I think a phrase I learned in college back in the early 1960s says it all:</p> <p>"L'hypocrisie est un hommage que le vice rend à la vertu."</p> <p>"Hypocrisy is an homage that vice pays to virtue."</p> <p>François de La Rochefoucauld<br /> (September 15 1613 – March 17 1680)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359229&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="h0GT-EzQ3wSrt7f5IcaRh2dEsj_6Xr3MbYtOeC2U3P8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH">Joel A. Harris… (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359229">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359230" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495015941"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>For any one with basic reading comprehension, this is about as close as a government agency is likely to get to shouting “Don’t go data diving here for anything approaching reliable information!”</p></blockquote> <p>Of course, some people will still fall for the <a href="http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SchmuckBait">Schmuck Bait</a>. Mr. Johnson, whose surname just happens to be a slang term for "schmuck", would be among them.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359230&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Tl3gTIOCtUMQoqsxBAb7KgPA267KQjxIwup9QYGiN2A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359230">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359231" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495016537"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Not too long ago I ran across a comment (don't recall where) from someone who moaned about all that up-front effort required to get into VAERS and how it seemed like a deliberate attempt to keep people out - then proceeded to cite VAERS entries in a manner warned against.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359231&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7s4x1MEelesuyUIEn0gZ_tj48wRX-SiYdM_uj_pNucc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">doug (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359231">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359232" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495016760"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Bring your cameras to the protest! Natural News plans to publish photos of Boston Herald staff members walking to and from the building, their vehicle license plate numbers and other details</p></blockquote> <p>Does anyone know the car registrations of Adams, Taylor &amp;Co?<br /> How delicious if those who worked at the Herald drove in tomorrow with a mock up of Adams' and Taylor's numberplates on their cars.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359232&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Xy0cYRWwKtZXRxZYEGi5O_1ZSnbMZ00GZNYVDF2SYMo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">dingo199 (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359232">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359233" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495017983"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>all manner of antivaxers liken the vaccination program to rape, the Holocaust, Nazis, the Titanic, the Oklahoma City bombing, the Tuskegee syphilis experiment, <b>and a tsunami</b></p></blockquote> <p>From the Department of Idle Curiosity, it turns out that the first appearance of this one at AoA that G—le coughs up is from <a href="https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Aageofautism.com+%22tsunami%22&amp;biw=1153&amp;bih=661&amp;source=lnt&amp;tbs=sbd%3A1%2Ccdr%3A1%2Ccd_min%3A1%2F1%2F2004%2Ccd_max%3A12%2F31%2F2017&amp;tbm=#q=site:ageofautism.com+%22tsunami%22&amp;tbs=sbd:1,cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/2004,cd_max:12/31/2017&amp;start=70">February 2008</a>.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359233&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="AkMHjdjioFE0WJtBdx518fkLywSPsX4qqr0mTTAQqII"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359233">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359234" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495019601"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Eric,</p> <p>Oh yes, Mikey makes sure to mention at any opportunity that's he's always armed. When the "holistic doctors are being murdered" conspiracy reared its ugly head, he pointed out that anyone who tried that on him would face a barrage of bullets.</p> <p>He's also said that had he been in the audience in the Colorado movie theatre during the "Batman" shootings he would have taken down the shooter with his firearms prowess.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359234&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="hwyMV7AkUCQrwObUJoAwCcweGh8au3Yh1ctB418fLU0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Woo Fighter (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359234">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359235" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495021593"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I see what you're trying to do here, but using an actual Holocaust photo and one depicting a real lynching? in very, VERY poor taste. Shame on you.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359235&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="f49nKvTN3DJgkTv6P82lRqwN7eEP8Y2IdGKAE1qIEI8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Melissa (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359235">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359236" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495024255"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>anyone who tried that on him would face a barrage of bullets</p></blockquote> <p>Not that we needed any more evidence that Adams is delusional, but this only works if he is able to draw his gun and shoot it before the "bad guy" perforates him. Which, if said "bad guy" were intent on harming Adams, would not be the case.</p> <blockquote><p>he would have taken down the shooter with his firearms prowess</p></blockquote> <p>If I ever became world dictator, one of my actions would be to take guns away from idiots like this. Because that is one heck of a dangerous fantasy. Suppose you are a "good guy with a gun" in a situation where a "bad guy with a gun" starts shooting, and somebody else starts shooting back. Or suppose you are a police officer arriving on the scene where this scenario is taking place. Which shooter is the bad guy? My guess is that if I were in that scenario, I would have a 50-50 chance of guessing wrong, and I suspect the same is true for almost all civilians and many cops. (Not to mention the risk of hitting an innocent bystander, as I am under no illusions about my marksmanship in this scenario.) However, I don't suffer from Dunning-Kruger syndrome, at least on the subject of firearms. Far too many gun nuts do. The Second Amendment does specify that the militia should be "well-regulated".</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359236&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="LAWr8zY4dkfOhP2moVTyRUZqplL-q8XzoeWscwETPWA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359236">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359237" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495025827"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Melissa: So, Orac using public photos to demonstrate the rhetoric of the antivaxxers (because they <b>have</b> compared giving vaccines to the Holocaust, and rape, etc, as noted above) is horrible and very poor taste? What do you have to say to the AV'ers who use the language? Who threaten to "meet you at work and blow your head off" or other threats? I suppose those are free speech and OK, right?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359237&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="hQm3RuQ_vRlAzM8Glj2dg02vj6SxieJPoTQ983ovlyU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359237">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359238" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495025863"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Or would you have also condemned the infamous Thanksgiving picture that AOA posted a few years ago?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359238&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="4oaw3sBpatH8mrajfg48yRshNFJwAjpYA6GzEUQ3vAw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359238">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359239" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495026536"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Somehow, I don't quite get Melissa's outrage over the use of a Holocaust-era photo (which appears to show prisoners being liberated from Auschwitz) to illustrate the profound cluelessness and insulting imagery to which antivaxers stoop when they invoke the Holocaust for their purpose.</p> <p>And perhaps she should direct the rest of her ire at Mike Adams (whose lynching photo was reproduced here).</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359239&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-K8_lsXSr9IBIB4RhFqSW5goeK7Y7XQZRA-jj7E2p5Q"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359239">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359240" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495026693"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Somehow, I don’t quite get Melissa’s outrage over the use of a Holocaust-era photo (which appears to show prisoners being liberated from a camp) to illustrate the profound cluelessness and insulting imagery to which antivaxers stoop when they invoke the Holocaust for their purpose.</p> <p>And perhaps she should direct her ire over the lynching photo of the person who first posted it (not Orac).</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359240&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qsuOOC4vJifoj6FWwkFBTqBlrEpI5ujq0kvezeeI4IY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359240">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1359242" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495034761"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I don't get it either. Now, I did think about whether to reproduce the photo used by Mike Adams, but in the end I thought that illustrating just how vile Adams' imagery is outweighed the possibility that some might be offended. However, regarding the Auschwitz picture, I am at a loss. I've written about the use of Holocaust analogies by historically ignorant antivaxers more times than I can remember, and I frequently illustrate such posts with a Holocaust-related photo, like the train line to Auschwitz, the Auschwitz gate shown in the photo I picked for this post, photos of the ruins of the krema (crematoria) or of the gas chambers, or photos of Hitler or marching Nazis. I've never gotten a complaint on that basis. Methinks there's a bit too much sensitivity here.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359242&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="c_Vo0NChkWDLt1FFg3kwxUS2ADU0Y6_Mf_2JLjBr0ok"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359242">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359240#comment-1359240" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359241" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495029347"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>For one thing, a lot more people work at a newspaper than just journalists</p></blockquote> <p>Carefully disguised <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/files/2015/10/Washer.jpg">in yellow pants</a>, no doubt.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359241&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="taXtmCkDvAsBk2Mwgee-KNM83QcGLx1goD_2rr5x1FQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359241">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359243" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495037343"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>there are several warnings about the data collected by VAERS, explaining that it is unfiltered, unverified, and unreliable for anything other than possible more reliable investigations. One page even makes visitors acknowledge reading disclaimers before getting to the actual information</i></p> <p>That is why NVIC offer their own mirror of the database for people who don't want to know about the disclaimers.<br /><a href="http://www.medalerts.org/">http://www.medalerts.org/</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359243&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tz1y7y-Csk8BxUCSM69hV6la85VlHgOstYLhglg0dOo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359243">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359244" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495038458"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Eric Lund #28, I actually know my level of proficiency with firearms, courtesy of training and experience provided by the US taxpayer.<br /> One thing that has awakened me in a cold sweat, was a nightmare of being in a crowd while a shootout began.</p> <p>As for the movie theater shooting, I know what I'd do in that situation as well - hide with pride. The notion of being in a large, dark theater and trading shots with someone, all in the midst of a panic ridden crowd is something that I'd heartily recommend the one suggesting said notion have his or her head examined for emptiness.*</p> <p>*Many years ago, I did have a concealed carry permit. One evening, while having to clean the pistol, yet again, of all of the gunk accumulated from carrying it, I pondered how sporting a criminal would have to be for me to avail myself of that weapon.<br /> "Oh, excuse me, Mr Criminal. I have a firearm as well, can you hold on a second while I get mine out and we're even?"<br /> Yeah.<br /> Into the safe it went and stayed.</p> <p>As for doxxing, been there, done that, got the "I've been doxxed" tee shirt. One, being exceptionally enterprising, both doxxing me and threatening to come to my home, murder my family, rape my wife, then murder me. It didn't enter his equation that I'd not agree to observe passively.<br /> Which, I disabused him of, quite graphically and mentioning that I'd only use a firearm against an invader of my home if I were feeling charitable - which would be highly unlikely, but that I am proficient with edged weapons, of which I have aplenty.<br /> Which is quite true, I use my old bayonets and fighting knives that I still retain (I gave most of them away when I retired) for yard work. That'll teach those pesky dandelions!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359244&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="iVsOwP2R6DdoKQqLFgXmXcb6CKOEn2JC81Y96mdFpIU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Wzrd1 (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359244">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359245" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495038625"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>A little over ten years ago a young man in the army killed in the middle east, he was from a small town (about) in the county I worked in.</p> <p>That Baptist church from the mid-west threaten to protest at the burial (they were banned from entering the cemetery).</p> <p>I knew the volunteer fire chief and we hatched a plan to take care of their protest. We would start a small fire between the protesters and the burial. No direct violence would have done to the protesters, they just by chance be in the wrong place at the right time.</p> <p>The volunteer fire department would be called out to put the fire. They would have unfortunately sprayed the protesters with lots of water. It was winter time and the temp was hovering around 10F. Unfortunately the protestors didn't show up.</p> <p>I think it would be great fun to do something like this to these protesters. Unfortunately, it is a lot warmer Boston right now than it was in the small town I was talking about.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359245&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="4DtVNireo-hApMdK8NabkO62Wa7vrfH9IvaSLEuIYPY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359245">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359246" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495038948"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Wzrd1, </p> <p>I showing my Claymore off the other day and it is still by my chair. </p> <p>I still remember the line from one of Crocodile Dundee movies: you can that a knife.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359246&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Am5csCXE2O7RhInIy4DRQFKkyl8CSmmZf6I8te4WysQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359246">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359248" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495052334"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Rich Bly,<br /> "They can take our lives, but they can never take our -" Zzzzzt! "light fixture..."</p> <p>Yeah, I know. Not in the house.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359248&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="pjpnEk1vTsqjinGul328ifke07WuYDpllzriVFMrqIk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Wzrd1 (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359248">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359246#comment-1359246" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359247" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495043680"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Does anyone know the car registrations of <b>Adams</b>, Taylor &amp;Co?</p></blockquote> <p>One could always <a href="http://www.txdmv.gov/txdmv-media/open-records-requests">ask</a>.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359247&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qHb-yKXKzc2NHoMufoT9kcS5IruUlHrD7_PI06ipIME"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359247">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359249" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495082517"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"Hate speech and harassment (which is the personal, rather than group-focused, cousin of hate speech) impose costs on others for speaking. In so doing, they limit speech to those most able to pay those costs. This is the simple secret behind harassment campaigns, especially ones on the Internet. It’s also why “real name” policies have no effect on abuse: the offenders generally get social <i>credit</i> in their communities for doing so. (There are plenty of communities in which being an asshole not only costs you nothing, it’s a way to show off. Vide Trump.)"</p> <p><a href="https://extranewsfeed.com/free-speech-and-hate-speech-17a1eaf1e78">https://extranewsfeed.com/free-speech-and-hate-speech-17a1eaf1e78</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359249&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="oeB3WdrDQ-XJJL2JPSoxEO0AuOQkvAyaQNVHZxc4ELU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lighthorse (not verified)</span> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359249">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359250" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495090252"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Orac@23<br /><a href="http://www.autisminvestigated.com/ku-vax-klan-hang-black-people/">The gnat</a> did it before Adams.Probably where Mikey got the idea of using a photo like that.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359250&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="b0WxykvcbX3QMFgFqNgGV35vNqf5Tb03rCmwPTFgE-Q"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Roger Kulp (not verified)</span> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359250">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359251" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495096378"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>That Baptist church from the mid-west threaten to protest at the burial</p></blockquote> <p>If you are referring to the group I think you are referring to, then they have been in my neck of the woods at least a couple of times. The first time, almost 20 years ago now, was after a nearby high school's senior class named a lesbian couple as "class sweethearts". Apparently things were so hunky-dory in their back yard that they could protest at a high school some 2000 km away. They were mostly ignored at the time. But they were not, at least at the time, gun nuts.</p> <p>That group eventually forced out their (since-deceased) leader because he wasn't extreme enough for them.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359251&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="b0qdIbOvEpp5PZtIo4gHK7ZhBCSL5VsK9kWcxfbkWsY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359251">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359252" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495109583"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>At present the only violence from the anti-vaxers is in the rhetoric, and attacks on journalists are potential. When this topic is raised here, I always wonder why the actual violence and real attacks on health care providers are so easily ignored when they are directed against abortion providers. I can only suppose that you don't want to open this particular Pandora' box, but it seems odd to be so concerned about potential violence when members of your profession are frequently threatened and sometimes killed, while the conservative side of the political spectrum encourages the violence.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359252&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="4EnLEbeNz9OkIVm3pmN2L3LJ6OeorgN5CZQ0ra3rdrQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Cloudskimmer (not verified)</span> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359252">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1359254" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495127438"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Sigh. This comment is basically a "Why don't you blog about what <em><strong>I</strong></em> think you should blog about?" comment. Regular readers know that I <em><strong>never</strong></em> take kindly to such comments.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359254&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="5kmrn4aTogMuLQ9QDds2qLUn-XFlHGk9NUATh44Rywk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359254">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359252#comment-1359252" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Cloudskimmer (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359253" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495121208"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Cloudskimmer @34: We tend to stick to vax/anti-vax topics here, so a more apt comparison might be the groups internationally who specifically target vaccine workers in places like Pakistan.</p> <p>Thankfully here it is still just rhetoric, whereas there it is actual killings.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359253&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="9SPFYXqLLL-RQXr0w9o8pabZ4oxsv2HRMnFoVYmkhX8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">JustaTech (not verified)</span> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359253">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359255" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495161689"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I also recall several choice words towards anti-abortion groups on this blog, even without articles directly talking about the murder of abortion providers.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359255&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="31725-mAEJgnXupSXQWgyDt3DzPMQvMfp6k664yFJE0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">LouV (not verified)</span> on 18 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359255">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359256" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495628736"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>If one thinks anti-vaccine propaganda is just dangerous for the unvaccinated children, think again.<br /> In August last year a lady who blamed her childs autism on vaccinations, stabbed a pediatrician in the head. The pediatrician survived, but is unable to work.<br /> Alas I can't find anything about this in English, so I just post the Dutch link. Perhaps Google translate can help.<br /><a href="http://nos.nl/artikel/2174794-vier-jaar-cel-en-tbs-voor-insteken-op-kinderarts.html">http://nos.nl/artikel/2174794-vier-jaar-cel-en-tbs-voor-insteken-op-kin…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359256&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="nh8WOkySGHib7ldZwgDN_8sZcxZ4-neds6FYKQ5HHoM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Renate (not verified)</span> on 24 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359256">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/insolence/2017/05/17/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement-vaccine-holocaust-and-potential-impending-attacks-on-journalists%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Wed, 17 May 2017 04:00:39 +0000 oracknows 22554 at https://scienceblogs.com The annals of "I'm not antivaccine," part 24: Antivaxers threaten to dox Boston Herald employees over the newspaper's use of imagery much less offensive than what antivaxers use on a daily basis https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/16/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-24-violent-imagery-for-me-but-not-for-thee <span>The annals of &quot;I&#039;m not antivaccine,&quot; part 24: Antivaxers threaten to dox Boston Herald employees over the newspaper&#039;s use of imagery much less offensive than what antivaxers use on a daily basis</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Over the last few years, I've been doing a recurring series that I like to refer to as <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/?s=annals+of+I%27m+not+antivaccine">The Annals of "I'm not antivaccine."</a> Amazingly, it's already <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/02/15/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-23-vaccine-injury-and-waterboarding/">up to part 23</a>. It's a series based on an oft-repeated antivaccine claim that is either a like or a delusion (sometimes both), namely the claim made by antivaccine activists ranging from Jenny McCarthy to Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., the latter of whom is best known for making such claims after likening "vaccine-induced autism" <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/04/09/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-15-robert-f-kennedy-jr-and-the-vaccine-associated-holocaust/">to the Holocaust</a>. (Indeed, RFK, Jr. takes denial to a ridiculous extreme by proclaiming himself not just "pro-vaccine" but "<a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/10/28/cranks-of-a-feather-part-3/">fiercely pro-vaccine</a>.") Almost no matter who the antivaxer is, the refrain is the same: I'm not antivaccine. At the same time, they <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/06/17/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-18-dr-bob-goes-full-godwin-over-sb-277/">liken</a> vaccination policy to <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/05/05/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-17-more-nazis-versus-freedom/">Nazis</a>, the Holocaust (<a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/02/24/as-states-try-to-crack-down-on-non-medical-exemptions-to-school-vaccine-mandates-antivaccinationists-lose-it/">with themselves as the Jews</a>), <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/02/15/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-23-vaccine-injury-and-waterboarding/">waterboarding</a>, and, most despicably, <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/09/30/anti-vaccine-not-pro-safe-vaccine-vaccination-described-as-rape/">rape</a>. You get the idea. Basically, antivaxers proclaim themselves as being "not antivaccine" but rather vaccine safety activists, even as they liken the vaccine program to all manner of atrocities and crimes like rape.</p> <!--more--><p>I was reminded of this by an article that appeared in the <em>Boston Herald</em> last week. More specifically, it was the reaction on the part of antivaxers to a bit of hyperbole that I found quite telling. Basically, it was an editorial, entitled <a href="http://www.bostonherald.com/opinion/editorials/2017/05/editorial_preying_on_parents_fear">Preying on parents’ fear</a>, pointing out how antivaxers preyed on the Somali immigrant community in Minnesota. It's a story I've <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/01/thanks-for-the-measles-yet-again-andy/">discussed</a> several <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/05/hanks-for-the-measles-yet-again-andy-antivaxers-swoop-in-like-vultures-to-spread-antivaccine-misinformation-among-the-minnesota-somali-immigrant-community/">times now</a>, even as recently as <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/05/12/the-somali-measles-outbreak-in-minnesota-thanks-again-andy-and-american-antivaxers-for-the-measles/">just last week</a>. In brief, thirteen years ago ,the Somalis in Minnesota vaccinated their children at a rate even higher than native-born Americans living in the same area. Then, about a decade ago stories were published in the media about an "autism" cluster in the Somali community. Whether or not it was real was not known at the time. (Subsequent studies have shown no more Somali children being diagnosed with autism than American children living in the same area.) Antivaxers, however, are nothing, if not certain, and they were certain that the cluster must be real and that vaccines done it.</p> <p>As the <a href="http://www.bostonherald.com/opinion/editorials/2017/05/editorial_preying_on_parents_fear">Boston Herald</a> put it:</p> <blockquote><p> Skepticism about vaccines within Minnesota’s Somali community goes back a decade, the Post reported, after parents raised concern about possible higher rates of autism among their children (research later indicated that wasn’t the case).</p> <p>But it seems that was all the truthers needed to hear. When Somali parents sought answers to explain autism, anti-vaccine activists were delighted to fill in the information gap. The disgraced British doctor who once reported a link between vaccines and autism — which was deemed fraudulent and cost him his medical license — has met with families, the Post reported. Even amid this latest outbreak, anti-vaccine groups have fanned the flames, making it hard for public health officials and doctors to be heard above the noise.</p> <p>These are the facts: Vaccines don’t cause autism. Measles can kill. And lying to vulnerable people about the health and safety of their children ought to be a hanging offense.</p></blockquote> <p>I groaned and immediately really wished that the editors had chosen a different idiom to express their outrage. It should go without saying that I don't approve of calls for violence and never make them, but it won't. Any antivaxer who reads this will try to suck me into the maw of accusations being made by antivaxers now. I also didn't think that the editors of the <em>Boston Herald</em> were actually calling for antivaxers to be hanged. After all, <em>I</em> know that the term "hanging offense" is an idiom, intentional hyperbole used to make a point. <em>You</em> know that it's an idiom, intentional hyperbole used to make a point. I daresay that even <em>antivaxers</em> know it's intentional hyperbole used to make a point. The reaction was very much predictable, incredibly disingenuous, and utterly hypocritical, given the rhetoric routinely used by antivaxers. But, then, you knew that, didn't you? No, no one seriously believes that the <em>Boston Herald</em> is calling for the deaths of antivaxers, least of all I and certainly not the antivaxers piling on, but I knew that antivaxers, despite their history of even worse language, would seize upon this bit of verbiage as a pretext to lose their friggin' minds. Same as it ever was.</p> <p>For instance, the wandering band of merry antivaxers over at the antivaccine crank blog <a href="http://www.ageofautism.com/2017/05/dr-lyons-weiler-invites-boston-herald-to-retract-editorial-as-hate-speech.html" rel="nofollow">Age of Autism</a> were really impressed with an "<a href="https://jameslyonsweiler.com/2017/05/11/dr-lyons-weiler-invites-boston-herald-to-retract-editorial-as-hate-speech/" rel="nofollow">open letter</a>" written by James Lyons-Weiler. After a rant about how, even though he's vaccinated his children and none of them has autism, he stands "with the parents who call for warnings against the current vaccine schedule, and by those who call for spreading them out, and for those who call for safer vaccines without neurotoxins like mercury, and aluminum" because he's "read the REST of the science," over 2,000 studies on autism. Never mind how ridiculous his claim is. If it takes an hour to read and digest each study and Lyons-Weiler spent 16 hours a day every day reading, it would have taken him 125 days to get through that many studies. Even if it only took a half-hour per study, it would still would have taken almost 63 days. Does anyone think that either Lyons-Weiler spent between 63 and 125 days doing nothing but reading studies or that he's so brilliant that he can digest a complex scientific study in much less than a half hour?</p> <p>He also goes where antivaxers have been going over this editorial since it was published. But first he prefaces his deep dive down that rabbit hole with this:</p> <blockquote><p> The autism parents rank among the best people in the world to me. They don’t need protection from free speech about vaccine risk. Neither do the Somali parents. These parents are WARRIORS. They are smart, informed, educated, logical, and reasonable.</p> <p>Unlike you, Rachell, they care. They are good people, taking the time to educate Somalis and other African Americans that they might be able to protect their kids from harm with vitamins.</p></blockquote> <p>Lyons-Weiler owes me a new keyboard, as I spit up my iced tea upon reading that. Let's just say that the antivaxers who have poisoned the minds of a vulnerable population against vaccines, leading to this year's growing measles outbreak among the Minnesota Somalis are anything but "informed," logical or reasonable.</p> <p>Be that as it may:</p> <blockquote><p> Parents of children with vaccine injury who speak out have one and only one agenda.</p> <p>To protect other peoples’ kids.</p> <p>And each one of them, I’m sure, would line up at your gallows to be the first martyr in the war for our children’s brains, and our minds.</p> <p>But, if you want to pick the trees, or construct the gallows, Rakkell, we won’t stop you.</p> <p>Hang us, Raqueel. Hang us all.</p> <p>One question.</p> <p><strong>Whatever will you do with all the bodies?</strong></p> <p>While you’re calling for death squads, the rest of us peaceable, civilized folks are discussing health directions in neurodevelopmental disorders, the future of immunity, and discussing vaccine safety science and science integrity and the size of the market for vaccine safety screening biomarkers.</p> <p>Oh, and we’re all subscribing to the Boston Globe. Because they don’t condone hate speech.</p></blockquote> <p>Notice how hyperbole about "hanging offense" morphs into "calling for death squads." Also notice how it's turned into "hate speech." Not surprisingly, after recounting a number of antivaccine tropes, Kim Stagliano dons the mantle of victimhood and accuses The Boston Herald of calling for violence against antivaxers:</p> <blockquote><p> Really, this is just startling coming from Boston. Home of the Tea Party and Freedom Train. Boston. Massachusetts. Liberal to the core in so many ways. Protectors of the rights of everyone - except us. And calling for violence against families who choose to alter the CDC vaccine schedule.</p> <p>Violence.</p></blockquote> <p>Isn't it amazing how much can be read into a two word phrase? Antivaxers were just getting warmed up, though. If regular, run-of-the-mill antivaxers ramp up the crazy to 11, there's only one man who can double it to 22, cranking it up beyond the capacity of any crazy meter to tolerate. I'll give you two guesses who that man is. Oh, never mind. Regular readers know of whom I speak: Mike Adams, a.k.a. The Health Ranger, or, as most skeptics call him, The Health Danger. It didn't take him long at all to issue an "emergency action alert":</p> <blockquote><p> Earlier this week, the Boston Herald openly published an editorial representing the views of its entire editorial staff, essentially calling for <strong>government-run execution squads to mass murder scientists, journalists and naturopathic physicians</strong> who oppose mercury in vaccines. According to the Boston Herald, all these people should be “hanged to death” for daring to question the quack science cult of vaccine fundamentalism.</p> <p>This was not an April Fools’ joke by the Boston Herald. The newspaper, which has now revealed itself to be a domestic terrorism group, deliberately intends to see people like myself murdered by the government in order to appease their pharmaceutical interests.</p></blockquote> <p>Now wait. A flippant bit of hyperbole about how spreading antivaccine misinformation among a vulnerable population should be a "hanging offense" has morphed even more. Now it's "calling for <strong>government-run execution squads to mass murder scientists, journalists and naturopathic physicians</strong> who oppose mercury in vaccines." Of course, the wag in me can't help but point out that the antivaccine misinformation spread among the Somalis was all Andrew Wakefield's discredited ideas, and those were about the MMR vaccine, which never contained thimerosal and therefore never contained mercury. Yes, it's a bit of pedantry, but it's a fun and necessary bit of pedantry that reveals just how far beyond reality Mike Adams will go to wind up his base:</p> <blockquote><p> The Boston Herald justifies this call for mass murder — a felony crime under U.S. law — by claiming that because a few dozen children in Minnesota caught the measles — a common infection similar to chicken pox — and that the millions of Americans who oppose government-enforced vaccine violence should all be mass slaughtered in a Holocaust-level execution event to somehow make up for it.</p> <p>I have already begun the process of filing criminal complaints with the FBI and the Boston Police, but we also need bloggers, journalists, scientists and naturopaths in the state of Massachusetts who can file local complaints with law enforcement to investigate and potentially prosecute these Boston Herald domestic terrorists who are posing as journalists.</p></blockquote> <p>Because the Boston Police and the FBI don't have better things to do than to deal with a flood of complaints from a bunch of cranks about a newspaper exercising its right to free speech under the First Amendment. Of course, Adams tried the same thing with me, claiming that he reported me to the FBI for colluding with Dr. Farid Fata, the evil oncologist who bilked Medicaid and Medicare for tens of millions of dollars for giving patients chemotherapy they didn't need. Over a year later, let's just say I haven't been arrested or even questioned yet.</p> <p>Hilariously (to reasonable people), Adams maintains his utter lack of self-awareness, as he calls for a <a href="http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-05-15-boston-rally-this-thursday-to-target-the-boston-herald-for-stating-that-vaccine-skeptics-should-all-be-hanged-to-death.html" rel="nofollow">protest outside the <em>Boston Herald</em></a>:</p> <blockquote><p> Notably, no one in the Washington Post, New York Times or CNN has denounced the Boston Herald’s call for the murder of vaccine skeptics. This is very nearly an implied endorsement of the murder, of course, which is consistent with the deranged, violent tendencies of the vaccine-collaborating (and pharma-influenced) media that continues to deny the existence of the Vaccine Holocaust.</p> <p>Rally this Thursday in front of the Boston Herald</p> <p>Now, Health Choice Massachusetts has announced a rally to take place at the steps of the Boston Herald this Thursday, May 18th, at 11:00 am.</p> <p><a href="https://www.facebook.com/events/1941790046105098/">Click here for the Health Choice Massachusetts Facebook page</a> which contains details of the rally. So far, 110 people say they are interested in attending the rally. This number will no doubt grow between now and Thursday.</p></blockquote> <p>Hmmm. When I checked the page last night, there were 117 listed as "interested," but only 17 saying they'll attend.</p> <p>Now here's where Adams gets vile, even for him:</p> <blockquote><p> What you might consider doing, however, is staging a MOCK HANGING of an “anti-vaxxer” who happens to be African American or another minority, in order to point out the inexcusable, anti-humanitarian stance of the Boston Herald and how such ignorance and violence against men and women has been carried out in the past to silence enemies of the establishment. Seriously: If you want to make some news, theatrically stage the Boston Herald’s proposed LYNCHING of an African-American “anti-vaxxer” in front of their offices to demonstrate the truth about how vaccines are violence against African-Americans. It’s true: CDC scientist Dr. William Thompson is on the record, testifying about the CDC cover-up of how vaccines disproportionately harm young African-American boys with an increased risk of autism.</p></blockquote> <p>No, the "CDC whistleblower" William Thompson is on the record saying no such thing. I'm torn, though. Half of me would almost like to see the spectacle of a bunch of white people (and, make no mistake, it's likely that any antivaxers who show up to this "protest" will be overwhelmingly white) staging a mock lynching of a black person, regardless of the reason. They're so clueless that they really don't know just how horrible the optics would be if they were to do that. The other half of me doesn't want to see such a shameful and hateful spectacle in which antivaxers pervert a horrific chapter in American history when lynchings of black people were commonplace to promote their own twisted cause. Yes, the latter half definitely wins this time.</p> <p>Now here's where Adams' hypocrisy shows:</p> <blockquote><p> Bring your cameras to the protest! Natural News plans to publish photos of Boston Herald staff members walking to and from the building, their vehicle license plate numbers and other details, to the extent allowed by law. If you attend this rally, be sure to take photos and send them to Natural News for publication.</p></blockquote> <p>Yes, this is exactly what it sounds like: Intimidation and threats against people working for the <em>Boston Herald</em>. Where the Boston Herald only used a flippant, ill-advised idiom, Mike Adams is actually urging his readers to send him photos of <em>Boston Herald</em> employees so that he can publish them on his website, as well as license plate numbers and other identifying details. The only reason for being interested in license plate numbers is to allow Adams' readers to discover names and home addresses. Yes, Adams urges nonviolence, but he does so in a way that practically says the opposite:</p> <blockquote><p> Do not assault or attempt to intimidate Boston Herald staff members. Do not bring weapons like the insane Leftists at UC Berkeley. Keep your protest peaceful and non-violent.</p></blockquote> <p>Of course, Adams has a history of doing this very sort of thing, publishing an enemies list, but trying to leave just enough plausible deniability that he's trying to intimidate his enemies to silence. Does anyone remember the website <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/07/25/how-they-view-us-mike-adams-and-kent-heckenlively-edition/">Monsanto Collaborators</a>? Basically, it was a website almost certainly created by Mike Adams (although he later called the site a "false flag" operation and claimed he had nothing to do with it). Adams is no slouch with violent imagery, either, being particularly prone to likening scientists to Nazis and blaming them for basically every evil in the world, including the Holocaust. Meanwhile, Elissa Meininger is publishing with a straight face two articles asking <a href="http://bolenreport.com/vaccines-new-crimes-humanity/" rel="nofollow">Vaccines – Are They the New “Crimes Against Humanity?” (Part 1)</a> and <a href="http://bolenreport.com/vaccines-new-crimes-humanity-2/" rel="nofollow">Vaccines – Are They the New “Crimes Against Humanity?” (Part 2)</a>.</p> <p>So let me get this straight. Antivaxers aren't "antivaccine," but they liken vaccine policy to the Holocaust, rape, torture, Nazi medical experiments, Sauron, sex trafficking, the Titanic, and more. They can unironically <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2016/07/20/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement-i-didnt-really-mean-it-edition/">use violent imagery</a> that implies that portrays anyone seeking to vaccinate one's child as a <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2016/07/19/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement-vaxxed-edition/">deadly threat</a> against whom <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2015/12/03/the-violent-rhetoric-of-the-antivaccine-movement/">lethal force is justified</a> (and even glorified in fantasy). All the while, they can claim they're "not antivaccine" and justify their rhetoric as being hyperbole. Yet, if a pro-vaccine advocate's speech or writing isn't perfectly genteel, suddenly antivaxers become the special snowflakes they accuse "pro-vaxers" of being. It's hypocritical and disingenuous as hell, but it's how antivaxers operate.</p> <p>I'd take the outrage (which is actually <em>faux</em> outrage) of antivaxers over this editorial somewhat more seriously if they actually reined in their own violent imagery describing <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/03/16/the-antivaccine-conspiracy-theory-narrative-you-want-it-darker/">dark fantasies of persecution in which the CDC and pro-vaccine advocates finally face bloody justice when the antivaxers "win."</a> This will, of course, never happen, because to antivaxers' violent imagery "is for me, not for thee." They can publicly indulge in dark fantasies of shooting health officials trying to vaccinate their children and that's OK, but should a pro-vaccine advocate make an ill-advised crack about a "hanging offense" suddenly it's a "hate crime."</p> <p><strong>ADDENDUM:</strong> <a href="http://www.ageofautism.com/2017/05/rachelle-cohen-wants-you-dead-but-you-are-not-to-respond-in-kind.html" rel="nofollow">Ginger Taylor has finally weighed in</a>, and, as usual when she does, hilarity ensues. The lack of self-awareness is strong in this one, as she publishes an e-mail exchange between <em>Boston Herald</em> editor Rachelle Cohen and an antivaxer. Cohen, not surprisingly, has gotten a lot of hate mail, including (predictably, given her name) antisemitic hate mail, complete with a large volume of antisemitic calls and e-mails, leading her to observe drolly, "Discussions that begin with how sorry folks are I'm not headed for 'the ovens' [are] not likely to be fruitful."</p> <p>Indeed.</p> <p>It amuses me to no end how antivaxers so gleefully make my points for me. Ginger basically has to beg her readers to knock it off with violent imagery far worse than the poorly chosen quip about a "hanging" offense that she now finds oh-so-offensive, coupled with Nazi level antisemitism. Hilarity indeed. I'd almost feel sorry for Ms. Taylor, but she brings it on herself—with gusto—and her Dunning-Kruger arrogance of ignorance is off the charts.</p> <p><strong>ADDENDUM #2:</strong> The Massachusetts Attorney General has rebuffed Mike Adams complaint against the Boston Herald. This can only mean one thing: <a href="http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-05-16-massachusetts-attorney-general-says-its-okay-for-mainstream-media-to-publish-death-threats-against-anti-vaxxers.html" rel="nofollow">Lulz galore</a>, except that it's too serious:</p> <blockquote><p>Following the Boston Herald’s call for anti-vaxxers to be “hanged to death”, Natural News issued an urgent action item for readers and fans to report the Boston Herald to law enforcement authorities. A wave of complaints hit the Boston FBI, Boston Police and the Massachusetts Attorney General, requesting criminal investigations into the Boston Herald for its unabashed call for anti-vaxxers to be executed in the same way black slaves were once lynched in America.</p> <p>In response, as shown in the letter below, the Massachusetts Attorney General has declared it will not investigate the matter.</p> <p>Of course, if you or I openly declared we were going to murder a journalist who worked at the Boston Herald, the investigation would be swift and highly publicized, but when the Boston Herald calls for the murder of people like us, the state government says that’s not worth investigating, and no other mainstream media outlet covers the story.</p> <p>In other words, the Massachusetts government has just told anti-vaxxers that you must now take up your own self-defense against journo-terrorists, since the “authorities” in government refuse to apply the law to those who work at the Boston Herald. Your lives are now in danger. You are being targeted by the Boston Herald and any number of psychopaths who may be motivated by the Herald’s call for mass murder. The government has now declared it will do nothing to stop the calls for murder by “journalists” as long as they are targeting people who oppose toxic vaccine ingredients.</p> <p>It’s time to start publishing the home addresses of journo-terrorists who escalate violence against concerned parents and independent scientists</p> <p>This all explains why I plan to publish the home addresses of the journo-terrorists working at the Boston Herald, in order to warn local Bostonians that they might be living next to murderous, sociopathic mental health miscreants who are a danger to society. Since the Massachusetts government refuses to take any action to protect the public from these dangerous psychopaths, it’s obvious that we must take action to protect ourselves. The right to self-defense, after all, is one of the most sacred rights we possess.</p> <p>Our non-profit division is also launching the public education site VaccineHolocaust.org where journo-terrorists who deny that vaccines harm children will be named and shamed, providing a permanent record of their crimes against children and humanity.</p></blockquote> <p>So let's see. Editors at the Boston Herald use an ill-advised idiom to express anger at the evil done by antivaxers who misinformed the Somalis in Minnesota that the MMR vaccine causes autism. In response, antivaxers threaten to publish personal information about Boston Herald employees on NaturalNews in order to intimidate journalists to silence and allow antivaxers to find them, either to harass them or attack them. This is particularly hypocritical given how Adams has done everything he can to make himself hard to locate. One can only imagine how he'd react if someone managed to find his home address and cell phone number and publish it. I can't help but say again: Through their actions, antivaxers make my point for me better than I ever could.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a></span> <span>Tue, 05/16/2017 - 00:00</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine-nonsense" hreflang="en">Antivaccine nonsense</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/pseudoscience" hreflang="en">Pseudoscience</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/quackery-0" hreflang="en">Quackery</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/skepticismcritical-thinking" hreflang="en">Skepticism/Critical Thinking</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine" hreflang="en">antivaccine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/boston-herald" hreflang="en">Boston Herald</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/holocaust" hreflang="en">Holocaust</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/lynching" hreflang="en">lynching</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mike-adams" hreflang="en">Mike Adams</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/minnesota" hreflang="en">Minnesota</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/racism" hreflang="en">racism</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/somali" hreflang="en">Somali</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/vaccines" hreflang="en">vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> </div> </div> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-categories field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Categories</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/channel/social-sciences" hreflang="en">Social Sciences</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359167" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494915582"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>While the antivax tu quoque machinery rushes into high gear over this, they might realize that the Herald is a tabloid newspaper prone to sensationalism. Beyond editorials, the paper is also known for its, um, sensitive headlines in response to world events:</p> <p><a href="https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/a8/eb/16/a8eb1604433a72b77430093f964bd45c.jpg">https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/a8/eb/16/a8eb1604433a72b77430…</a></p> <p>I think that one may be in part a tribute to the classic N.Y. Daily News headline about the execution of Ruth Snyder.</p> <p><a href="https://thepowerofthefrontcover.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/daily_news_dead_cover.jpg?w=595">https://thepowerofthefrontcover.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/daily_news_…</a></p> <p>Gotta love how the Herald makes a dumb editorial comment that no one otherwise agreeing with the editorial would take seriously, while antivaxers have said (and threatened) much worse in all earnestness.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359167&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Wc0pDqbpMUcCeCpYDVQDcZwSD23EX9Zc8iK6WAQX1oE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359167">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359168" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494915583"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Living at Fort Lewis WA where my father was a young M.D. physician, I caught the mumps and measles as a child -- no big deal. Now in my dotage I am surprised when outbreaks of the mumps sweep periodically through the campus of my University of Washington alma mater -- apparently because the students were not vaccinated in childhood. Although I avoid flu vaccinations out of personal preference, my important work at <a href="http://www.reddit.com/r/mentifex">http://www.reddit.com/r/mentifex</a> on artificial intelligence makes me glad to have been vaccinated against poliomyelitis and smallpox and the other serious diseases that could have cut short my life or health. (I last saw a doctor over thirty years ago, so I am being admittedly foolhardy.)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359168&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="QZUM596NS9LpCnv079IHBRgK5Ri-giJMLW1FG8iL1I8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Mentifex (Arthur T. Murray)">Mentifex (Arth… (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359168">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359169" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494917491"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I expect the FBI gets a lot of these kind of baseless letters. I wonder what their procedure on that is.</p> <p>I wish the Boston Herald hadn't used that language. But thanks for calling out the hypocrisy of the cries of outrage from a movement that has no hesitation using violent rhetoric.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359169&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="miYzQFUi4_8yBitvqmTeSni8LSTzXXrYdKKf1OAr2QU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359169">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1359170" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494918913"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Yeah, whoever wrote the editorial probably thought it was an appropriate idiom to communicate the harm antivaxers are doing, but in reality, even though it is obvious that no one is seriously calling for hanging antivaxers promoting misinformation among the Somalis, using such an idiom provided disingenuous and hypocritical twits like Mike Adams and the crew at AoA to jump all over this.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359170&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="27qGUbEbHBYCCVYWMdfklVUfFlXXHK9xifo30LBDtJ8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359170">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359169#comment-1359169" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359171" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494919188"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I guess they need to grab at whatever they can to mobilize their group and try to deflect the fact that the measles outbreak their movement directly caused is putting kids in the hospital.</p> <p>The hypocrisy is especially obvious when some of them, thinking they're being clever, I'm sure, try to apply the idea in reverse to the people they hate, like CDC officials.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359171&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="gGZzE06vkVS2fhTyNGZpELJjPRY5rUaQcUESVw0LGu8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359171">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359172" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494919704"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Wow, the hypocrisy.</p> <p>How many times has AoA called for the death or harm to people like Dorit, Dr. Offit &amp; others?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359172&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wOiqfRhNxdbef7xGXfOSmqWKtzE_O6mk3GZU6Yoo-nY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359172">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359173" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494920001"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"Hanging offense" may be hyperbole, but it also has a historical basis. English law, on which US law is based, once provided <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloody_Code">a mandatory death penalty for the theft of goods worth more than 12 (pre-decimal) pence</a>. The phrase was also used in the Old West, where it had an association with vigilante justice--ironically, the sort of justice Adams is advocating by urging the doxxing of Boston Herald employees, most of whom had nothing whatsoever to do with the writing of that editorial.</p> <p>FWIW, the Boston Herald tends to be politically well to the right of the Boston Globe, which is considered the mainstream newspaper for points east of the Connecticut River.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359173&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="UGPmtI79-UvenqcQJ9Of5gbKmP6lM1ToAfjuj-K0SxY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359173">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359174" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494920288"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Well, now I know why Del BigTurd had some webinar on whether AVers should be hanged. I just couldn't bring myself to click on his link (nor post it here, either) because I can't endure any more neuronal apoptosis from watching AVers.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359174&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="2SNGx7fh9ubfx-8hEc9yaavcvxOXkVg2X5XbFb4Mk8w"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359174">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359175" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494921254"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Dorit</p> <p>I'm not a lawyer; but wonder if as a result of not vaccinating a child, that child dies or develops a serious disability, e.g. blindness, from the vaccine-preventable disease, and the parents can make a case that their choice to not vaccinate was mainly made based on what was told them by antivaccinationists, could they sue the antivaccinationists and would they have a reasonable probability of winning the lawsuit?</p> <p>While I understand that "hanging offense" does not mean actual hanging and I have been against the death penalty since pre-teen years, I wonder if giving clearly unscientific advise should have some criminal penalty. As an analogy, imagine a parent fails to put an infant in a car seat and the car is struck by a drunken driver. Obviously, the drunken driver is the proximate cause of any injury or death to the infant; but by not placing the child in a secure car seat, would the parent have, say, committed some form of criminal negligence and, if so, could that be applied to advice from antivaccinationists?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359175&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="l03OqOxWuS1sYhlvpXT_cSegYUNJg96FGLRNH0cD-sI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH">Joel A. Harris… (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359175">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359177" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494921596"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I haven't found any applicable criminal laws in Minnesota - the child endangerment laws are specific to people responsible for the child. doesn't mean there aren't any, just that I don't know what they would be. Nor what the federal criminal statutes applicable would be - criminal law really isn't my area.</p> <p>In both cars, an issue here is that the parents chose who to listen to.</p> <p>I think a tort suit is possible, though not easy. You can apply this discussion here even more strongly. <a href="http://www.skepticalraptor.com/skepticalraptorblog.php/vaxxed-misinformation-legal-remedies-harmed/">http://www.skepticalraptor.com/skepticalraptorblog.php/vaxxed-misinform…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359177&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="F0r-waC_RFf8bktc3w83pGr1S7GXKN9z2hRBsmqcazs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359177">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359175#comment-1359175" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH">Joel A. Harris… (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1359176" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494921273"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Note addendum. :-)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359176&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ss22j2m7A23rFsTQ4NZ2QkF95-AQlvmiA5aEE26JYZw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359176">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359178" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494922525"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ginger is flinging about a whole bunch of insanity in that piece.</p> <p>If you took the Herald editorial at face value, they're advocating a law providing for the death penalty for harming children through antivax deception. Somehow Taylor gets from that a call to lynch, torture and assassinate "autism moms".</p> <p>These people are well beyond bats in the belfry. They've got a whole Carlsbad Caverns full of creatures flitting around up there.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359178&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8ZK7xPGLC068J2h7grAXID5ZfWuaN1LSG0mjT1tS87k"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359178">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359179" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494922805"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'll add my voice in to those saying the Herald's choice of words were inappropriate.</p> <p>But the reaction to them is just off the deep end. </p> <p>I did note that in Ginger's response, one of the emails sent to Ms. Cohen, in between a series of vile statements, referenced the incompetent study recently dissected here. </p> <p>@ Dorit #2: I imagine the FBI spends very little money on toilet paper.</p> <p>@ Joel #8: IANAL either, but I imagine such a suit would have a very difficult time succeeding because of First Amendment considerations. Spreading anti vax misinformation is not like yelling fire in a crowded theater. Caveat emptor applies; such parents also have access to correct information, and are therefore responsible for their own choices in what to believe.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359179&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tStxuBFd9GyGstwkNvxJvybONwTv8ooPOXT4-4zXPwY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359179">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359180" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494924366"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The first amendment is not absolute. I address one way to deal<br /> With it in my post above - highlighting that false statements of fact are less protected than other statements. Dr. Offit, whonis also not a lawyer but is right on this, addressed another line of argument here: <a href="http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/05/13/did-anti-vaxxers-spark-a-measles-outbreak-in-an-immigrant-community">http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/05/13/did-anti-vaxxers-spark…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359180&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="aqzaLO_x5IUaLG5693L5xdR51DQRB7nZ2IVLHv6MvFg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359180">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359179#comment-1359179" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359181" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494926427"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Dorit</p> <p>Though I realize it is not the same, during the 1950s the tobacco industry criticized studies finding association of smoking and disease; but the industry also claimed they wanted to get at the truth and they funded their own studies, some extremely well-done. Their studies confirmed the association of smoking and disease; but they listed as the Principle Investigator one of their lawyers and because of "privilege" suppressed the studies. Of course, the lawyer wasn't the real PI. So, by promising to get at the truth, then intentionally suppressing it, since this led to 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and disability, e.g. chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, would there have been any legal grounds to criminally prosecute them?</p> <p>As it is, the tobacco industry paid billions of dollars in lawsuits; but NEVER close to enough to hurt their bottom line and the immense harm they had caused and because many STATES became dependent on these monies in order to reduce taxes, the tobacco industry has been able to keep in business.</p> <p>Antivaccinationist webpages often intentionally allow only one side to the argument. On numerous occasions I have submitted a comment that was not posted, e.g. one article claimed there had never been a single double-blinded randomized clinical trial of vaccines. My comment described the Salk polio trial of 1954-55, gave URLs and said I could supply many more examples. It was NOT posted. Though not the same as the suppression of studies by the tobacco industry, could this in some way be legally considered intentionally supplying misinformation? Especially when several of the antivaccinationist websites claim they just want to find the truth.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359181&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="XiO07Ul6dDXBXigIFtah8HNkKEGqrOx7xvAuTdtW5_4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH">Joel A. Harris… (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359181">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359184" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494929291"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>You would have to point to a specific offense for criminal prosecution - and that would be hard, though not impossible, I think.</p> <p>I agree that torts is a more promising route, though even that's not without its difficulties (again, see above).</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359184&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="xdnW-ViZVwzhfD4aVZVOQ2RdKDrQZ09Ns9u7HW7eGT8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359184">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359181#comment-1359181" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH">Joel A. Harris… (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359182" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494927163"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Discussions that begin with how sorry folks are I’m not headed for the ovens’ are not likely to be fruitful.</p></blockquote> <p>A nice bit of understatement from Ms. Cohen, which shows the hypocrisy of the anti-vaxer's rhetoric. There is no way to have a rational discussion with somebody like that.</p> <p>Also, given that anti-vaxers have routinely accused their critics of having Nazi tendencies, I need to get a new irony meter. The one that I was using just exploded.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359182&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ifdkkHNGcZABN94WdXM_BUF7fBlr0RKRlEo7hiUUWuk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359182">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359183" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494927403"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I haven’t found any applicable criminal laws in Minnesota</p></blockquote> <p>IANAL, but I would think that if there's anything actionable here, it would be in civil rather than criminal court. Which is, in the end, how the tobacco companies were forced to cough up (so to speak) the settlements in those cases.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359183&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3tBnJlSzChMPdIiR0KY2_kQxp4i4MhNw8CSKsPun3-k"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359183">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359185" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494931337"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I clearly remember that the use of violent and disrespectful communication was frowned upon in kindergarten.</p> <p>It's true, the most important lessons we learn are taught in kindergarten.</p> <p>@ Orac,</p> <p>Did you practice respectful insolence in kindergarten and were you ever sent to the principle's office?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359185&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="NSHUvPhNnZkj3VZ5FzzFsf59RxO2A3iGgkQF9iWNufU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Michael J. Dochniak (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359185">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359186" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494931915"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The standard of proof is different in civil court. In criminal cases you must prove your case beyond a reasonable doubt. That's important when you're talking about a verdict that's likely to result in one losing their liberty.</p> <p>In civil court it's the preponderance of evidence or more likely than not (Dorit please correct me if I'm getting this wrong). </p> <p>Dorit made some great points, but civil litigation takes years, and often settles out of court with no admission of wrong doing. The parents might get some financial compensation, but unless they really get nailed for a big judgement, I question how much good it will really do.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359186&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IEnW6cZsdE9iBuZQ5Bd_a_ayGPgwfgFsIfi8EZyQ7OY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359186">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359187" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494936110"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ironic that individuals who claim a severe vaccine reaction can file with the NVICP with no "out of pocket" expenses, while those who's children die or are crippled from Vaccine Preventable diseases are instead left with nothing but filing long-shot Civil Litigation.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359187&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8rlY4KZFuRYPyOyRIb--0Wxk0ogyB9Sspi8LuRXP7Cg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359187">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359188" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494937099"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Spreading anti vax misinformation is not like <b>yelling fire in a crowded theater</b>.</p></blockquote> <p>Please, just <a href="https://www.popehat.com/2016/12/05/cracked-drunkenly-paws-at-free-speech-theory-again/">let it die</a>.</p> <p>"The observation that some speech is outside the First Amendment is true but irrelevant and unpersuasive absent specific explanations of how particular established exceptions apply to particular speech. The 'you can't shout fire in a crowded theater' bit is a reference to a rhetorical flourish in a subsequently overturned case that means <a href="https://www.popehat.com/2012/09/19/three-generations-of-a-hackneyed-apologia-for-censorship-are-enough/">absolutely nothing</a>."</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359188&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="H71uGsZhNTXojdmA-BaCSP1FQpIAQWpX8V3tb9lVcY8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359188">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359189" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494937294"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'll defer to Popehat on criminal law, but he's wrong on torts. You can sue in torts based on speech that causes harm. In fact, there are several lines of cases that do just that.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359189&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="0MK7wtD-x4leNhsQ5igjxMgq2bdUaIJTl6YCa3yvgcI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359189">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359188#comment-1359188" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359190" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494937429"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Well, he wasn't actually talking about torts, so saying "he's wrong" is inaccurate. You can sue for certain kinds of speech in torts. It depends on the specifics.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359190&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="EdGkBgVRDzAnPyfoo04gRzmK3Cy-v87flana4Mm-yAU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359190">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359188#comment-1359188" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359191" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494937825"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>-btw-<br /> IIRC, Lyons-Wheeler showed up at RI a while back prior to his stint at AoA. </p> <p>Lulz is correct.</p> <p>Srsly, the exaggeration about time spent 'studying' vaccines ( 2000 studies) is similar to the anti-vax standard of studying "14 ( 0r 15) thousand hours" which I've heard from several of the usual suspects.<br /> If you did it full time- 8 hours a weekday- all year- it would still take QUITE a while. And don't these people work and clean their houses?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359191&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="OfG65roZWodydSWD1pb5xPguxKUQJVQunNb_gmaQX7c"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359191">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359192" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494938326"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>You can sue for certain kinds of speech in torts. It depends on the specifics.</p></blockquote> <p>I know what you're saying; Ken White uses more nuance <a href="https://www.popehat.com/2016/06/11/hello-youve-been-referred-here-because-youre-wrong-about-the-first-amendment/">here</a>, which item I'll quote for those who might not go read the SR entry right away:</p> <p>"[I]n 1964, <a href="https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/376/254#writing-USSC_CR_0376_0254_ZO">faced with an Alabama defamation judgment against the New York Times</a> for running an advertisement about abuse of civil rights protesters by local officials, the Supreme Court noted that the First Amendment obviously applies to private civil actions that employ state power. 'The test is not the form in which state power has been applied but, whatever the form, whether such power has, in fact, been exercised.' Because civil lawsuits aimed at speech invoke state power to attack speech, they are limited by the First Amendment. That doesn't mean that all civil lawsuits attacking speech are absolutely barred. It means that First Amendment analysis applies to them, and may or may not provide a defense to them.</p> <p>"If you think about it even a little, this is the only sensible interpretation. Under a contrary interpretation, a state could pass a law saying that private parties could sue you for offending them, or annoying them, or for expressing certain political views the state disfavors. People could then use the coercive power of the courts to sue you based on those laws."</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359192&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TRUKMJLtmcTn-futivOQ-koTSuiaWEUUUzHL61dgel0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359192">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359193" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494940857"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>From the caption to the photograph that accompanies Orac's post: "I particularly like how he has an anatomy bust in the background. I've never seen such a thing in an actual functioning lab"</p> <p>I was struck by what looks like a thermos parked on the bench to Adams' right (along with headphones and books). Having/enjoying your drink on a lab bench right next to test equipment does not strike me as desirable. What would an accreditation agency say?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359193&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="bwy4M2eZKzHtmw8Ixa7Qi2cmHVPe73gK1neEtV0dnjQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359193">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359194" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494941067"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I find it ironic that while the anti-vaxers have their drawers in an uproar over the term "hanging offense", they actually kept MN DOH employees away from a meeting of Wakefield and the Somali community with the use of armed guards!</p> <p>While I have no problem with security, and while I think Wakefield probably does need a security guard, to use guns to suppress free speech is abhorrent.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359194&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="u4ED8wK8eIvpdAFlTq9w6wGzDxyBCfhlnX2hE_AHKQg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Gretel Hansen (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359194">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359195" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494941293"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Actually, I do believe Lyons-Weiler did read all those studies because I have his book. I badgered him, on twitter, until he sent me a copy for free. He cherry picked every single study he could find that had anything to do with autism and had his budy, Bernadette, help him write a book about it. He even makes outlandish claims, like the CDC ignored Geier and Geier's works. (eyeroll). I do think that, between the two of them, James and Bernadette did read all those studies. They just did not use critical thinking skills at all.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359195&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wzovzmsOlg9MEkPNX9qA14IFVNQLZMDieWnrlDpQ-tE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Kathy (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359195">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359196" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494941503"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The autism parents are the best in the world comment made me very angry. I have a kid on the spectrum. I know many people who are on the spectrum or have kids on the spectrum who are provax and hate what James stands for. But, I know that this is how James makes his living. He lives off book sales, appearances, and donations from his "warriors." So, he is appealing to that awful group of loud antivaxers who think vaccines cause everything bad because this is how he makes a living.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359196&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TIv3KvY3T_jLw6eRMQH0y4m7838_5ru-ZTjKPL_9YjY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Kathy (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359196">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359197" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494941564"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Does this post count as some judo-like <i>tu quoque</i> argument, where our kind host points out that Adams et al, in observing and then screaming about the Herald's misstep, get buried in their own over-the-top past rhetoric and actions? In attempting to push the Herald's editorialist off the precipice, they seem to have forgotten how often they themselves have already plummeted. I won't go on to mention glass houses.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359197&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ToMDHjQsSyYxTBLaFHoZmIpsgReTWOvyPtHGH1jPmLU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">sirhcton (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359197">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359198" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494941933"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>While I have no problem with security, and while I think Wakefield probably does need a security guard, to use guns to suppress free speech is abhorrent.</p></blockquote> <p>I think "abhorrent" is a bit strong here. A private event can exclude whomever the organizers wish to exclude, and the security hired is of no particular consequence, unless they start wildly drawing (presumably) legally held sidearms or something.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359198&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="c9cKcjX_197QnPx_kI3Vx7-EaUOh9JIzUEBrOKqQbYU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359198">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359199" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494941960"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Mr. Dial-Up-The-Crazy-To-22 has now announced he plans to publish the home addresses of Boston Herald employees.</p> <p>He's also indignant about a written response from the Mass. Attorney General's Office saying that the Civil Rights Division has decided not to pursue (?his?) complaint filed with the office. So apparently the AG is, like, OK with the mass murder of antivaxers. So bad, so sad. :(</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359199&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mMOiBlHzhdIIoYvV8y9UZVIy3YgIdYTXt-PVxr1ryUw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359199">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1359201" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494942597"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Yes, I made a note of that in a second addendum. I'm starting to think that I might have more to say about Adams' plans than can fit in an addendum. The dude really is despicable.</p> <p>I also changed the title of the post to reflect more clearly what Adams is doing.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359201&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="M3jyhtHHcxjJtIYuwqLB21yhlv_C2IK58Ff2Vo5B6M0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359201">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1359199#comment-1359199" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359200" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494942501"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Your second addendum does really make your point, and is concerning.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359200&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="P7FcvP9gqxNZY6p1alyQuRKU-S2kHIFHIlMP-2_TiI4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359200">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359202" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494943191"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Mr. Dial-Up-The-Crazy-To-22 has now announced he plans to publish the home addresses of Boston Herald employees.</p></blockquote> <p>And apparently has <b>veiny</b> arms as well as ill kempt kitchenware. It's a Photoshop just waiting to happen.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359202&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="JQlYFtGlaw6mQR_RDo0liyVZZF-yXNK5HKgwozitCPA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359202">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359203" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494943834"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I note that by perceiving themselves as having been told they should be hanged (or worse) by the editorial, they are admitting that they lie to 'vulnerable people about the health and safety of their children'. Ha!<br /> You're so dishonest, you probably think this line is about yoooooo...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359203&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ZeOaFcRuj0szCQqRpe0XI5hl3nPmtsSbzGWobDhYIsY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Maddy (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359203">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359204" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494944819"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>^ The "beta testing" bit is a nice non sequitur, though. Maybe that's what "Monsanto Collaborators" was all about, modulo marketing.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359204&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mNiPLaWkMi7G20sfVJkeqKRwU7WCIs1MQj7YZ0U78FA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359204">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359205" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494944865"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>In other news on the anti-vaccine front:<br /> Wakefield is apparently deep into a sequel to his laughable disinfo vid Vaxxed:</p> <p>Article about the Stowe, Vt. chiroquack who has scheduled a group of anti-vaxxers to speak at his k00kfest ( he assures they and he aren't anti-vaccine... really... ):</p> <p><a href="http://www.mychamplainvalley.com/news/health-event-attracts-controversy-for-anti-vaccine-speakers/714351946">http://www.mychamplainvalley.com/news/health-event-attracts-controversy…</a></p> <p><i>"Andrew Wakefield, known as the “Father of the Anti-Vaccination Movement,” was scheduled to speak but has since cancelled.</i></p> <p>Dr. Rauch says <b>Wakefield had schedule conflicts in the production for the sequel to his documentary, Vaxxed.</b>"</p> <p>The revenue stream from TOS (The Original Scam) must be getting thin so what else to do?<br /> Make a Part II. (Orac mumbling something about Electric Boogaloo?).</p> <p>Have fun and prepare for round two of the derpicity of Quaxxed Part II.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359205&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="pRp6SypI1_722mSv-ZleVhCF70xRSrfvguLBWwOF-sQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Reality (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359205">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359206" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494948709"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>One might point out to Adams that "hanging offense" has a very clear meaning of a law which carries hanging as an available consequence of a finding of guilt at trial for breaking the law. That is something quite remarkably different from lynching or advocating extrajudicial murder.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359206&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="gxvlXz4I1eL8R7BrnJ_ErY-afwY-HCMGZBhvrfejkbk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">doug (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359206">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359207" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494952433"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Does anyone else think that James Lyons-Weiler's repeated and deliberate mis-spelling of Rachelle Cohen's name smacks of a very specific type of disrespect? To me it feels rooted in racism, but I could be wrong.<br /> Yet another example of how anti-vaxxers can't argue with facts so they go with insults.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359207&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qHyeAUvewszyrWwgyEKbRIvrW8yn2Mzab4hMPm8lvPM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">JustaTech (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359207">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359208" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494956580"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>And lying to vulnerable people about the health and safety of their children ought to be a hanging offense.</p></blockquote> <p>subheading for follow-up:<b><i>anti-vaxxers admit lying, fear courts will punish them severely</i></b><br /> They might consider making a call for advice to that entertainer with the big nose and the big house.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359208&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="aCXVqVWcPZ9Zv8neGmjCD2NI6SR17nB5Ki3Xl1_HWQk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">doug (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359208">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359209" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494960200"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Our non-profit division is also launching the public education site VaccineHolocaust.org where journo-terrorists who deny that vaccines harm children will be named and shamed, providing a permanent record of their crimes against children and humanity.</p></blockquote> <p>That whole public shaming thing worked out so well for him last time.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359209&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="lOBR2NoMizgDuMFH4gnhPifMtZerKk0y7lbKLJEgdjE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">shay simmons (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359209">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359210" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494985012"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@MJD #18</p> <p>Interesting question for Orac, whether he has ever been sent to the "principle's office". Not to be a grammar/spelling pedant, but a principle is a moral rule which informs a system of beliefs, so I would think Orac has plenty of contact with "principles". Too bad the antivaxxers have never been sent to that office.</p> <p>How cool would it be if there really were a "principle's office" in schools, companies, and daily life, where we could send those who lack principles in hopes that they would learn some good ones.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359210&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7Eauk9RSn4lYi38wq6CKo2r3S7VMmZ4ZS1MQO9D6ckQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359210">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359211" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494986412"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Mr. Dial-Up-The-Crazy-To-22 has now announced he plans to publish the home addresses of Boston Herald employees.</i></p> <p>He's threatening the safety of people in an industry that buys ink by the petapixel? Wouldn't he be better-off getting involved in a land war in Asia?</p> <p><i>the public education site VaccineHolocaust.org where journo-terrorists who deny that vaccines harm children will be named and shamed</i></p> <p>AH, the joy of Alt Facts. "The Holocaust never happened, and anyway it wasn't as bad as my personal delusion."<br /> I am struggling to imagine what is "educational" about a list of people who fail to support Mike with sufficient enthusiasm... I guess he is using the word in the sense of "re-education camps".</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359211&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="szOeqHmSu0v9fN3TxvgOioJ4ERt5Dap5c6fUm4E19Eg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359211">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359212" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494987408"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Kathy@22</p> <blockquote><p>Actually, I do believe Lyons-Weiler did read all those studies because I have his book. I badgered him, on twitter, until he sent me a copy for free.</p></blockquote> <p>I've read some extracts of his book. To me it looks like he's taken the lazy method of googling for studies and skimming the abstracts, and if there is anything that can support (or be misrepresented to support) his antivax agenda he will cite the reference.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359212&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="hWpPGprFfbwUMcoi7seXOXnGITYdEtQzylEWakNeyWM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">dingo199 (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359212">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359213" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494987581"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Does anyone else think that James Lyons-Weiler’s repeated and deliberate mis-spelling of Rachelle Cohen’s name smacks of a very specific type of disrespect? To me it feels rooted in racism, but I could be wrong.</p></blockquote> <p>Don't you mean James Lyon-Weener?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359213&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="roL4AUuBmWgaWzjXB1d_ILvgDAzRJwobW64wN-Nl4bw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">dingo199 (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359213">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359214" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494989071"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I see from the 2nd addendum that Adams still misquote the article, changing the original ill-advised hyperbole "hanging offense" into "hanged to death".</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359214&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="b0hF_07OoeoYHBGMbsQDV5bokEHtqbrZ3qxe3ro6-qo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">LouV (not verified)</span> on 16 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359214">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359215" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495021230"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Clicking on the link to the Boston Herald and scanning the comments was very disturbing with nary a sane voice among all the craziness. Don't any sane people read that publication?</p> <p>Thanks, Narad, for the link to the Supreme Court decision. It's hard to imagine just how bad things were in the 1960's, one hundred years after the end of the civil war, and how brave those students were to confront it.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359215&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="XpUhcM0CnbiRVP63pdfwmaF9owJo919kEQxKrFNI5YM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">cloudskimmer (not verified)</span> on 17 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359215">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359216" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1495738804"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"... they may be able to protect their children from harm with vitamins."... VITAMINS?... And this is from a man who claims to have read all the research on vaccines.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359216&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="cbV2-aSc7ZvKuMw_zD9CWLpT2rHM0eyyrtmRqaX2Oww"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">DANIEL GAUTREAU (not verified)</span> on 25 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359216">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359217" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1496238188"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Noted; that every time I reply to anything here, several regular posters are quick to point out how much smarter you all are than I. As much as I hate to fan the flames; I’m stuck on the irony of the Big Tobacco analogy.</p> <p>Yet, I agree; the vaccine controversy is an almost exact replica of Operation Berkshire. Except that Big Tobacco does not equal “The Antivaxers”. And “BT” does not even equal “Big Pharma”. </p> <p>To any lurking Antivaxers: Calling the regular posters here “Pharma Shills” only makes you look paranoid &amp; it’s irrelevant: Pharma doesn’t handle vaccine damage control anymore because historically; the result is an epic fail that has come close to compromising the Immunization programs of several countries. </p> <p>The Provaxers are correct: You cannot pull off a conspiracy that involves thousands of doctors, scientists, politicians &amp; lawyers; that’s too many potential weak links &amp; that is not what is happening. Nobody is paying off these thousands either; why would they? They do it for free.</p> <p>BT “got to be right because their science got to be right” but their product was so harmful that it was an unsustainable position. The “PV” (provax) also get to be right because their science "gets to" be right. </p> <p>And, of course; vaccines are not as dangerous as smoking. </p> <p>That’s where the differences end. The fact that vaccination is compulsory &amp; smoking is a lifestyle choice became irrelevant when the dangers of “ETS” (environmental tobacco smoke) was discovered. Having smokers in your home, workplace or favorite bar/restaurant was actually forcing non-smokers into “compulsory” exposure. </p> <p>And that is when BT demonstrated what it "looks like" when you “get to be right” vs. actually being right (following quotes are from Philip Morris documents intended for both media &amp; internal communications, made available at <a href="https://www.industrydocumentslibrary.ucsf.edu">https://www.industrydocumentslibrary.ucsf.edu</a>. I will try to include document #’s since I can’t multi-quote):</p> <p>1. You will identify &amp; label your obviously inferior opponent. Attack of the “Anti‘s“ ensues:</p> <p> “When we began our interviewing we were not aware of the diversity of opinions among the group we originally labelled "members of the antismoking movement."</p> <p> "Since anti-smokers are only a tiny fraction of the non-smoking population, they need to legitimize their campaign. To do so, they have misled Americans about the health effects of tobacco smoke in the air, also called environmental<br /> tobacco smoke (ETS)"(#xxxg0093)</p> <p>2. The Anti's will be accused in headlines of assassinating science:<br /> “SCIENTIFIC OBJECTIVITY LOSES OUT TO<br /> ANTI-SMOKING CRUSADE!" </p> <p>3. ... because they have challenged the science that gets to be right:</p> <p> "Another common error involves confusing correlation with causation . No study has ever found proof that secondhand smoke caused cancer with certainty" (zyfh0093)</p> <p>4. The Anti's &amp; their inferiority become laughable &amp; ominous, all at the same time: </p> <p> "many substance condemners are not doing science at all, they are doing ideology, politics and material self-interest"</p> <p> "we examined the documents published by the antismoking movement for obvious violations of the norms of science . We found much social bias and many violations of the norms of science" .</p> <p>"We have all heard of creative statistics and creative accounting --- cooking the books . Certain members of the antismoking movement now add creative epidemiology to that list of such "creative" practices"</p> <p>5. ... because all of the SMART people already know that smoking is about as harmful as apples &amp; water:</p> <p> "An apple for dessert sits on the pristine white table next to the anti-smoker's plate.The air is crisp. No smokers about.<br /> This is the pure, unbesmirched atmosphere the anti-smoker demands. But our anti-smoker had better finish his meal quickly ... that is, if he wants to continue to enjoy clean air. His apple is giving off ethylene gas-enough gas to trick a pineapple plant into flowering,"</p> <p> " there are many natural chemicals which are more potent<br /> carcinogens than pesticide residues in foods . They said that the average daily intake of DDE, the principal metabolite from DDT, is no more carginogenic than the amount of chloroforn in one glass of tap water ."(zyfh0093)</p> <p>6. Establish a few Evil Leaders of the uneducated Anti's &amp; "call out" high profile people as being one of them:</p> <p> "University of California San Francisco professor Stanton Glantz has now publicly admitted using the wrong data in his study of smoke-free bar ordinances, which analyzed the economic impact of bans in bars in seven communities in California. I don't know who should be more embarrassed, the University of California for continuing to employ Dr . Glantz, or the American Journal of Public Health for blindly publishing this man's work under the cloak of an obviously incompetent<br /> "peer review process ."(rfy0090)</p> <p>"FDA Commissioner Kessler -- who has aggressively sought to<br /> expand the agency's powers and funding since his appointment in 1990 -- is "a zealous anti-smoker ."(rsny0094)</p> <p>7. Add some "Woo":</p> <p> "And disregard for objective grounds for regulation was not confined to environmental tobacco smoke. It also extended to other "imaginary risks" including electromagnetic fields, lead contamination, dioxins and "the innumerable scares of the month that are constantly put forth to inflame our collective<br /> anxieties "</p> <p>8. Suggest that "everything else" is to blame &amp; twist the knife with an arrogant &amp; ridiculous claim:</p> <p>" we do not know all of the things that might affect lung cancer. As an example, exposure to radon, the gas that seeps out of granite rock, has only recently been associated with lung cancer. Statisticians can never be certain that they have asked all of the pertinent questions . In fact, most environmental tobacco smoke (ETS - the term scientists give to tobacco smoke in the air) studies omit many basic questions, even on factors such as diet "</p> <p>"THE world's leading health organisation has withheld from puhlication a study which shows that not only might there be no link between passive smoking and lung cancer but that it could even have a protective effect ."(msby0090)</p> <p> ... And THAT is what it might "look like", if Big Tobacco &amp; their "only right because you get to be" (for now) science was an accurate analogy for the Pro vs Antivaxer issue.</p> <p>(If it looks like a duck &amp; walks like a duck &amp; sounds like a duck ... *quack quack* ...)</p> <p> .</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359217&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="CNgHcAY_YrTzKzJG2I_cRerPhpNAqfNxlKUesxk-aoI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">christine kincaid (not verified)</span> on 31 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359217">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1359218" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1496239755"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>What?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1359218&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="nmmxYdRoB-DSyCZMbPFaCJLb1XV9BqTovuRr8K9emOQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 31 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1359218">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/insolence/2017/05/16/the-annals-of-im-not-antivaccine-part-24-violent-imagery-for-me-but-not-for-thee%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Tue, 16 May 2017 04:00:08 +0000 oracknows 22553 at https://scienceblogs.com Quoth an antivaxer: DNA vaccines are contaminating our DNA in the name of transhumanism! https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/04/28/quoth-an-antivaxer-dna-vaccines-are-contaminating-our-dna-in-the-name-of-transhumanism <span>Quoth an antivaxer: DNA vaccines are contaminating our DNA in the name of transhumanism!</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I've been at this blogging thing for well over 12 years now. I know, I know. Sometimes it amazes even me that I been doing this so long. I also know that I've been mentioning just how long I've been blogging more frequently. Sometimes I worry that the blog will turn into nothing more than posts counting down the days since I started this whole crazy thing. Of course, the main reason I mention this is not so much out of a desire for repetition but as a way of expressing amazement when I find something new and/for bizarre that I don't recall having heard before.</p> <p>So it was when I came across an article on a website called Vaxxter, which bills itself as the "ultimate guide to vaccine news and anti-pharma news, and more" entitled <a href="http://vaxxter.com/dna_vaccines_transhumanism/" rel="nofollow">DNA vaccines and Transhumanism</a>. It's written by, hilariously (or it's written hilariously by) Sherri Tenpenny, who likes to append her DO after her name plus a whole bunch of woo letters, like ABIHM (which stands for the American Board of Integrative Holistic Medicine and indicates that she's "board-certified" in that specialty) and AOBNMM (which stands for the American Osteopathic Board of Neuromusculoskeletal Medicine, which certifies DOs in the remaining part of their specialty—in the US, at least—that is still woo-based, the "manipulative," chiropractic-like aspect of their specialty). Now, to be clear, this is not the first time I've seen vaccines likened to transhumanism. <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2012/01/27/vaccines-are-transhumanism/">Sayer Ji did that at least five years ago</a> Well, I have, but not quite this explicitly. Sayer Ji did mention the fear of DNA contaminants somehow "converting our living tissue into 'vaccine-making factories' through the use of DNA and Recombinant Vector Vaccines," but he didn't go as far into the crazy as Tenpenny.</p> <!--more--><p>First, she starts out describing what transhumanism is, describing it as a "futuristic concept where man and technology blend, resulting in soulless intelligent machines." That isn't quite accurate, of course, and Tenpenny's judgment is showing in her use of the word "soulless." She then goes on to describe transhumanists as assuming "that humanity will only be enhanced by machines." That, of course, is a bit closer to the mark; from my reading it does appear to be true that advocates of transhumanism seem to assume that the coming "singularity" when humans and machines merge will only be for the good, never for the bad.</p> <p>Before she gets to the real business of fear mongering about vaccines, Tenpenny has to do a bit of fear mongering about a scientific initiative first, the better to set the stage:</p> <blockquote><p> In former-president Obama’s 2013 State of the Union Address, he announced his plan to invest in brain mapping technologies. In April of that year, a $100+ million initiative was launched called BRAIN, which stands for Brain Research through Advancing Innovative Neurotechnologies. Multiple public-private partnerships were funded, including the Allen Institute for Brain Science, the Howard Hughes Medical Institute, Salk Institute for Biological Studies, and the Kavli Foundation and Institutes. Our tax dollars also funded this project; the government allocations included:</p> <ul><li>$20 million to the National Science Foundation to study how Big Data could be used to understand the ability of the brain to generate thoughts, emotions, and memories;</li> <li>$40 million to the National Institutes of Health (NIH) to develop training tools and resources to support the BRAIN initiative; and</li> <li>$50 million was given to the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) to develop tools to capture and process dynamic neural and synaptic activities.</li> </ul><p>Using those funds – and more – DARPA announced in 2016 it would develop the Neural Engineering System Design (NESD) program. Touted as the next-level brain-computer interface (BCI), the NESD system is designed to turn brain activity into a binary code, allowing humans to engage with machines wirelessly, by simply thinking. </p></blockquote> <p>Got that? The BRAIN Initiative is in reality a plan that lays the groundwork for the singularity, whether it was intended that way or not, whether the researchers working on projects funded by the initiative believe that's the case or not. Tenpenny asserts, menacingly, that while great medical advances could come from such research, such as brain-activated prosthetic limbs, "it takes very little imagination to see how this research could quickly turn dark." Fortunately, very little imagination is exactly what Tenpenny has. Not that that stops her from going dark.</p> <p>Of course, with Tenpenny, it is, first and foremost and above all, about the vaccines. Whatever evil there is in the world of health, particularly children's health, it must have been the vaccines that done it. In this, she is, if nothing else, veyr predictable, and she doesn't deviate from the script. What bothers her is DNA vaccines. DNA vaccination is a technique in which genetically engineered DNA, usually a sequence coding for an antigen, sometimes with a viral peptide sequence tacked on in order to provoke an immune response, is injected. Cells take up the DNA and, using the DNA as a template, directly produce an antigen, resulting in a protective immunological response. DNA vaccines are currently a major area of research, particularly in cancer.</p> <p>DNA vaccines came about as the result of observations that the injection of plasmid DNA into muscle could result in the muscle cells taking up the DNA and expressing the protein for which the DNA codes. Indeed, a graduate student in the lab where I did my PhD thesis research worked on studying gene expression due to plasmids injected into embryonic chicken muscle and showed that the regulatory elements that controlled expression of the protein coded for by the DNA controlled that expression in living muscle the same way it did in cultured muscle cells. Our lab wasn't working on DNA vaccines, but that graduate student's work included experiments that could be used to guide the development of DNA vaccines.</p> <p>In any case, the first generation of DNA vaccines produced a lot of excitement. Cell culture studies, animal studies, and clinical trials were done in rapid succession. <a href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3202319/">Unfortunately</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> The first of several of phase I trials, conducted almost 2 decades ago, evaluated the efficacy of a DNA vaccine targeting human immunodeficiency virus type 1 (HIV-1) for therapeutic and prophylactic applications [5]. Other studies shortly followed that targeted cancer or other HIV-1 antigens, influenza, human papillomavirus (HPV), hepatitis, and malaria. However, the results of these early clinical trials were disappointing. The DNA vaccines were safe and well tolerated, but they proved to be poorly immunogenic. The induced antibody titers were very low or nonexistent, CD8+ T-cell responses were sporadic, and CD4+ T-cell responses were of low frequency. However, these studies provided proof of concept that DNA vaccines could safely induce immune responses (albeit low-level responses) in humans. </p></blockquote> <p>The problem, of course, is that the injection of plasmid DNA into muscle is not a very efficient way of producing expression of an antigen. Delivery was inefficient. Expression in the cells was inefficient. Newer techniques are being developed to address these deficiencies, including new delivery approaches, molecular adjuvants, and better antigen design, but for the most part the promise of DNA vaccines remains unrealized. Of course, that reality doesn't deter Tenpenny from going full mental jacket on DNA vaccines, <a href="http://vaxxter.com/dna_vaccines_transhumanism/" rel="nofollow">portraying them as incipient transhumanism</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> This process is not without <a href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17058502">problems</a>.</p> <ul><li>The DNA snip can be incorporated into the host’s DNA, leading to chromosome instability. The mutagenic affect can turn on oncogenes and turn off tumor suppressor genes, leading to cancer.</li> <li>Genetic expression is the process where genes create proteins. Genetic over-expression is when the process “goes rogue” and produces massive amounts of foreign protein, destroying human tissues via both acute and chronic inflammation.</li> <li>Often the plasmid used is resistant to antibiotics; the same antibiotic resistance can be transferred to the <a href="http://www.pitt.edu/~super7/32011-33001/32171.ppt">host</a>.</li> <li>The plasmid DNA can appear very similar to the vaccine recipient’s DNA. The anti-DNA antibodies can attack human organs with similar DNA sequences. The result is autoimmunity, clearly identified as the cause of nearly <a href="https://www.aarda.org/autoimmune-information/autoimmune-statistics/">100 different diseases</a> and suspected to be the cause at least 40 more chronic and potentially life-threatening conditions.</li> </ul></blockquote> <p>I find it amusing that Tenpenny references a <a href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17058502">review article that's 11 years old</a> and a <a href="http://www.pitt.edu/~super7/32011-33001/32171.ppt">PowerPoint presentation</a> that looks as though it were a lecture done for a class, the date unclear. For instance, there's no evidence that the first concern really is much of a concern. Antivaxers frequently cite fear of DNA from such vaccines (and even just tiny amounts of DNA contamination in, say, the HPV vaccine), attributing to them almost magical powers to recombine with the host's DNA and corrupt it...somehow.</p> <p>The problem for Tenpenny is that there's no good evidence that this is a major concern. <a href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3202319/">From a more recent review</a>:</p> <blockquote><p> The DNA platform is conceptually safer and more stable than are conventional vaccine approaches. Plasmids are nonlive and nonreplicating, which leaves little risk for reversion to a disease-causing state or secondary infection. The original concerns associated with the DNA platform were the potential for genomic integration and development of anti-DNA immune responses. Exhaustive research has found little evidence of integration, and the risk for integration appears to be significantly lower than that associated with naturally occurring mutations [28–30]. Induction of anti-DNA immune responses after DNA vaccination has been monitored in multiple NHP studies and clinical trials, but evidence of increased production of such responses or changes in other clinical markers of autoimmunity have not been reported [31]. Overall, multiple studies have reported the DNA platform to be well tolerated and to have an enviable safety record. </p></blockquote> <p>That's science. Tenpenny is promoting pseudoscience and going full bore conspiracy theory, bordering on Mike Adams territory:</p> <blockquote><p> This level of genetic manipulation makes DNA vaccines a dreamy tool of the transhumanists. With a host of companies working on biotic human body parts and DARPA working to build killer robots, designing DNA vaccines to enhance human DNA is only a step away. In fact, Editas Medicine, a US-based company, announced in November 2015 that the trials with the first humans to have their DNA genetically modified were well underway. </p> <p>If robots could think, feel and have a conscience, would that make them human? Or, would the lack of genetic material always render it as non-human? Using the combination of artificial intelligence, nanotechnology and DNA vaccines to insert human genes and human characteristics into machines is no longer just for the movies. At what point are humans no longer humans?</p> <p>As vaccine recommendations become mandates – and 30 states are now pushing for mandatory vaccines, will you retain your right to refuse? </p></blockquote> <p>Notice how she waxes lyrical about "killer robots" and designing DNA vaccines to enhance human DNA. Clearly, she hasn't been paying much attention. Not only is it very difficult to make DNA vaccines that get into cells and actually express the protein product of their DNA—not to mention to have the cells excrete it rather than simply build it up in the cells—thus far there hasn't been a method of DNA vaccination that would integrate foreign DNA into human cells at anywhere near the level needed to do anything resembling what Tenpenny described. I must admit that I laughed when she expressed fear about genetic overexpression "going rogue" and producing "massive amounts of foreign protein, destroying human tissues via both acute and chronic inflammation," given how difficult it has been even to get DNA vaccines to produce enough protein to provoke an adequate immune response to produce actual immunity to what is being vaccinated against.</p> <p>I've said many times that one of the driving forces behind the antivaccine movement is, at its core, the ancient fear of bodily contamination. Vaccines are viewed as something that endangers the body's "purity of essence," or the purity of their "precious bodily fluids" (<a href="https://youtu.be/N1KvgtEnABY">word choice intentional</a>). There's a frequent theme in the deeper, darker recesses of the antivaccine movement that sometimes even bubbles up to the less darker recesses, that vaccines somehow corrupt our DNA and make us less human. This whole invocation of "transhumanism" is just a more extreme version of that fear.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a></span> <span>Fri, 04/28/2017 - 00:00</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine-nonsense" hreflang="en">Antivaccine nonsense</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/quackery-0" hreflang="en">Quackery</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/skepticismcritical-thinking" hreflang="en">Skepticism/Critical Thinking</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/dna-vaccines" hreflang="en">DNA vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mike-adams" hreflang="en">Mike Adams</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/plasmi" hreflang="en">plasmi</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/precious-bodily-fluids" hreflang="en">precious bodily fluids</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/purity-essence" hreflang="en">purity of essence</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/recombination" hreflang="en">recombination</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/sherri-tenpenny" hreflang="en">Sherri Tenpenny</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/transhumanism" hreflang="en">transhumanism</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/vaccines" hreflang="en">vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> </div> </div> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-categories field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Categories</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/channel/technology" hreflang="en">Technology</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358281" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493358436"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>This sounds like something the Australian Greens came up with in the early days of the Anti-GMO movement, which was the claim that if you ate genetically modified food, it would cause you to become genetically modified. This is what I call comic book science, because that is the only place it would work.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358281&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8hnPMcFj6nla8MUGVubHR5Bp2E62fQYCcLewnoTh__g"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Graham (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358281">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358282" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493358617"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>As I am not a proponent of dualism, I think that Ms Tenpenny has missed the boat. Humans are soulless intelligent machines. We just run off of chemical reactions and electrical impulses. Our machinery has evolved to its current level of imperfection over ~6 million years of evolution for our ancestors and 200,000 years for us. Science has found innumerable ways to improve our quality and quantity of life.<br /> The remainder of her screed is pants on head stupid, but at least she got something almost right.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358282&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="d6jh8v1GXEjx8slNSksvX6zSbt1GOMmrDabXPzLAXSg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Anonymous Pseudonym (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358282">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358283" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493358778"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ah the rapture of the nerds. When neckbeards around the world will plug into the Matrix. Where leather pants will actually look good on use, not like we lost an argument with an inner tube.</p> <p>Unfortunately a lot of it is a pipe dream, that we map our fears and desires on to. Much as Tenpenny has.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358283&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_QKbedsGaYMkfXF2XFi-YPs-OaPVvFGqyf1kQO0aPjo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">gijoel (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358283">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358284" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493360401"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The above blog-post by Orac is grist for all my mills. Orac says "I’ve been at this blogging thing for well over 12 years now." So, you just arrived on-scene, huh? Something of a parvenu, aren't you? Welcome to the scene, Monsieur L'Arriviste. Then Orac says that Tenpenny (is that a cousin of Ms. Moneypenny, Mr. Bond?) "likes to append her DO after her name plus a whole bunch of woo letters". OK, I give up -- what are "woo" letters? And what does "woo-based" mean? Then we get into laying "the groundwork for the singularity." You rang? <a href="http://ai.neocities.org/maintainer.html">http://ai.neocities.org/maintainer.html</a> -- "AI Mind Maintainer" -- is Singularity Ground Zero. Oh, am I "going full mental jacket" now, like Orac attributes to Ms. Tenpenny? When she is "going full bore conspiracy theory, bordering on Mike Adams territory" -- that's a cartoonist, right? One final warning -- if Orac keeps making fun about concern for our "precious bodily fluids", then Orac will have to answer to the Coca-Cola Corporation.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358284&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="iV2bEkJgTreNAoYe0whhtmZEV-ROc5-LgG-bIgVLrak"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Mentifex (Arthur T. Murray)">Mentifex (Arth… (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358284">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358285" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493360666"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Dear Mr Murray,</p> <p>Yes. You're going full mental jacket. Please wipe your dribble up on the way out and go and see your local medical professional. You clearly need help.</p> <p>Kind regards,</p> <p>Becky.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358285&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="J3gUb6WQvCBRpaDg1f7HdTmYKjMm4mT9nUGm7EhtHls"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rebecca Fisher (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358285">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358286" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493361228"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Dear all, </p> <p>Please see the Arthur T. Murray FAQ...</p> <p><a href="http://www.nothingisreal.com/mentifex_faq.html">http://www.nothingisreal.com/mentifex_faq.html</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358286&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Z15gdWd4NEzkYjryxDl-JehWC8AUJWE5iuYFPnOzlJU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rebecca Fisher (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358286">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358287" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493361541"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Tenpenny is so far behind the flat earth curve. Any real 'spiracy theorist is citing CRISPR: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SeDBLw64gg">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SeDBLw64gg</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358287&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="r2zSLNk2uIIZLEK-FMGdamqY-QGrCIffttbrfPShdXU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358287">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1358288" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493361888"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Excellent point. Combine CRISPR with DNA vaccines, and the potential to reprogram humanity to serve our lizard overlords unquestioningly will be unstoppable! :-)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358288&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="0yeYPRd20fE3091fNVP155P-ZEQwqdh7z446csQhfaA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358288">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358289" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493361901"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Tenpenny is missing the boat. The prospect of killer humechanistic robots is one thing, but where are the warnings of the real threat from DNA vaccines? </p> <p>Autistic Killer Robots! Aieeee!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358289&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-pVDGib2EllE4IMrNAJEkO4djU7S4DWuMHI0KJVGWEM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358289">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1358290" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493361965"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Please see the Arthur T. Murray FAQ…,</p></blockquote> <p>I suppose I should be "honored" to have such an esteemed crank show up in the comments of my blog. He must have Google searches for anything having to do with AI or transhumanism. :-)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358290&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Yb95tX3XEyZzNlm1iudBw88cC_78SLdsz7IpUMMpOCY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358290">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358291" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493361967"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Don't feed this particular troll. He's worse than Travis.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358291&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="GHmTgImursYfnUISMnThbHsJ_04a_5Q5-45bXdvCaiw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358291">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358292" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493362073"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Tenpenny's argument only makes sense if you don't think being a cyborg is awesome. Seriously I want superpowers!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358292&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="t1S4qomW-gGxIrczW9NQpTXC_JlohJ59x3UcRjQBNpo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Zach (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358292">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358293" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493364323"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Using the combination of artificial intelligence, nanotechnology and DNA vaccines to insert human genes and human characteristics into machines</p></blockquote> <p>I think I just had a Blue Screen of Death reading this.<br /> There are research on DNA vaccines in humans to immunize against diseases<br /> ... therefore they will for sure be used in machines to insert human characteristics in them ?<br /> ...<br /> Just...<br /> ...<br /> WAT</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358293&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_-03jPXh8xCorJ6kZn-BDtLFm5LtZovTjIECPro8Lmo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">LouV (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358293">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358294" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493366053"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>With a host of companies working on biotic human body parts and DARPA working to build killer robots, designing DNA vaccines to enhance human DNA is only a step away. In fact, Editas Medicine, a US-based company, announced in November 2015 that the trials with the first humans to have their DNA genetically modified were well underway. </p></blockquote> <p>Of course, she conveniently omits the fact that this society isn't working on "enhancing" humans, but on curing severe diseases, like blindness. How dastardly of them.<br /><a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2016/03/15/first-genetically-modified-humans-could-exist-within-two-years/">http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2016/03/15/first-genetically-modifie…</a><br /><a href="http://www.editasmedicine.com/pipeline">http://www.editasmedicine.com/pipeline</a><br /> While I agree that any technology that could serve transhumanist purposes should be examined very closely and critically, Tenpenny is clearly not a credible critic...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358294&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="H6wG9CO29kALrBcngzLe0W5grmtqvv87RQejjWiCGEM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">LouV (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358294">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358295" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493366529"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>She's watched too many Borg episodes on STNG, Lou.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358295&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Bdj7hB_L1NvDwkriXeHL5VQrEHP28bWV3ws3VjNK-L8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358295">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358296" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493366606"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@14 LouV,<br /> But that contravenes someone or others master plan. It's good to have people born that have life limiting conditions, or terminal diseases that could be avoided by genetic manipulation. They get rewarded after they die or in the next life or something. These are the same yahoos that piss and moan about stem cell research being the EVIL. The line of good manipulation and bad manipulation is as fuzzy as the line between homo sapiens and homo erectus. They are distinct species, but on the path from one to the other, there is no clear delineation. If I was planning to have a child, I would happily subject the eggs, sperm and resulting fetus to genetic manipulation to ensure that my family's defects die with my generation, or at least are greatly minimized.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358296&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="6cwfo3xduEE5agfM8lhWW0xFbK7uvBlgVRwjEM5rMVc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Anonymous Pseudonym (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358296">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358297" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493366787"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Seriously I want superpowers!</p></blockquote> <p>I have done some thinking about this, as it happens, and concluded that while having a superpower would be awesome in some ways, there would be a strong temptation to abuse it. For instance, being able to put conference speakers who overrun their allotted time in a Darth Vader-style Force chokehold would be useful, but there would be the temptation to use it in other, more inappropriate situations ("I find your lack of faith disturbing, Dr. Fulano"). Not to mention that other people with superpowers might be tempted to use them against me, whether or not I "deserve" it.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358297&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="OGsrcyOLnxlMeqnWvIVA40TVDGgbTuaEW6dDPA92ECc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358297">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358298" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493367120"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Orac been on the 'net since there was a net?<br /> Also, lol, who uses Geocities anymore?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358298&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="27xUFntmT2Q_7X6NrpnelT5aXx6KufUCgNbUYMgeGwM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Politicalguineapig (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358298">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358299" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493367684"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ Eric Lund #17: Doc Vader has tried using his super powers on hospital admins--apparently they are immune: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHfan71zHKk">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHfan71zHKk</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358299&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="dxamVnRSziDP0Eo9L44YuzC4CNsF_ny3cMGtpTC4h2Y"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Hickie (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358299">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358300" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493368010"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Okay, I have a question about this which is only about 49% joke.</p> <p>I orally ingested a fair amount of DNA a few minutes ago. Does this put me in danger? I mean, if the vaccines put me in danger, wouldn't the rye bread be just as scary?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358300&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="XZfel9LVLYFF407icmsAElwrw1WM_gwY3cNnUPZ2Jjk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Christine Rose (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358300">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358301" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493368838"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>If she believes DNA in vaccines can affect human DNA, what about the DNA and RNA from the natural microbes? Of course, the answer is neither; but if any could, it would most certainly be the full-blown wild type microbes rather than the severely attenuated or killed ones in vaccines.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358301&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="N8S7DXgjqvfAtVvRw45ILyJeq4h6CIpWlgTcCmI7Q0w"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH">Joel A. Harris… (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358301">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358302" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493370526"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"...one of the driving forces behind the antivaccine movement is, at its core, the ancient fear of bodily contamination." Yep. Right from the beginning when people objected to Jenner's vaccines. Far better to die of smallpox than contaminate God's sacred vessels.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358302&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="uVwJgHR94xEEPA2kRmHwC0oLAB8651jlP38ekq4mc0A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Edward (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358302">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358303" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493373531"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Is vaccines turning us into robots better or worse than them turning us into cows, on the horror film scale?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358303&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="GwPBn9s3VhJ1hE7rV9nG_ENQ6sJZ6KdFWkT8DDoeQ9s"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358303">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358304" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493373982"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Public health advocates should thank Ms. Tenpenny, because with vaccines now linked to trans-humanism, the MMR uptake rate at the Silicon Valley Waldorf School will soon be up to over 95%.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358304&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="GmcI5rQw9S-QkwIzmNS5W8nE1bNa6j1jqJEVCamDGQU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">sadmar (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358304">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358305" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493374109"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Dangerous Bacon (#9) writes,</p> <p>Autistic Killer Robots! </p> <p>MJD says,</p> <p>Autistic Savant-Angel Robots!</p> <p>Do no harm MUST always be the prime directive for the trans-humanism collective.</p> <p>Thereafter, the Science Blog Respectful-Insolence will be obsolete and Orac will be a wax sculpture in Ripley's believe-it-or-not museum.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358305&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="aokWVQROMA3H5OG1SlEpnbYpYg8dmQDvC1Vm0yUwhx4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Michael J. Dochniak (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358305">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358306" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493375582"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"Often the plasmid used is resistant to antibiotics; the same antibiotic resistance can be transferred to the host."</p> <p>She does realise humans are supposed to be 'resistant' to antibiotics right? ....right?!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358306&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="FA9hCX6gEaUaEdMOY1nX7u-nrsm2-QYtYkcePqFOKss"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Sebastian (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358306">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358307" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493376124"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>No.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358307&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7tKU1mxfqh76YxqNSdoG7mxloqy17zYyKjGn-LJN-R4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Edward (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358307">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1358306#comment-1358306" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Sebastian (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358308" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493378745"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Zach #12:</p> <blockquote><p>Tenpenny’s argument only makes sense if you don’t think being a cyborg is awesome. Seriously I want superpowers!</p></blockquote> <p>Unfortunately, one of the inevitable side-effects is having your genitals replaced with a silvery groin plate.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358308&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="vsVpCbFxQSS3w3X2ghllaC0cqsntV-YoW8qLwNyUwY0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Woods (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358308">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358309" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493379579"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Tenpenny forgot the <a href="http://drleonardcoldwell.com/brain-eating-nanobots-being-put-in-vaccines-says-whistleblower/">brain eating nanobots</a>.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358309&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="1dYBDCCaLk3FqYGy70yPC8KUUr-2McFh5V-1lgwF6JM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Roger Kulp (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358309">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358310" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493380586"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>... humans are supposed to be ‘resistant’ to antibiotics right?</p></blockquote> <p>No, no, no. Making humans antibiotic-susceptible is part of the new world order depopulation strategy - make us all susceptible, then, under guise of developing new agents for treating disease develop extra-strength Depopamen and spread it in chem trails.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358310&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="hmdtxDfC6QpI6VemiU2lb09BhdFfT7aO1-un_xulLMg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">doug (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358310">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358311" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493381509"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>In other anti-vax ( non) news...</p> <p>AoA today reveals Orac's interaction with Shatner.</p> <p>Oh my, that Kim is quick!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358311&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Klmjx1DCotB7yTs6PnvvKQbmy0-V-x8EggiNVvydsyo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358311">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358312" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493382948"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Nimrod News was late off the mark on that breaking story as well.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358312&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="r1vi2fzIUf9PVRhKIvUZWzC6gC05_tVbTtcZc-WOWDo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358312">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358313" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493383720"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Also of interest to RI readers: I haven't seen a confirming link for this yet, but I am hearing that Alex Jones of Infowars has lost custody of his children. Cue the World's Tiniest Violin. Jones' lawyers had claimed that what he was doing was performance art. I don't think they were entirely wrong, but Jones is a seriously messed-up dude.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358313&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="9jTWsCYjtY6P50-Zc-WxX5AZT9fbQcb2A1FojI2VBRY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358313">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358314" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493386655"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Eric Lund:<br /><a href="http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/04/27/infowars-alex-jones-loses-custody-case-ex-wife-wins-right-to-decide-where-children-live">http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/04/27/infowars-alex-jones-lo…</a><br /> Here is your confirming link. Interestingly, here is what Jones' ex testified on Tuesday:</p> <blockquote><p> Alex “doesn’t believe in traditional medicine” and refuses to vaccinate his children</p></blockquote> <p>Probably didn't help his case.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358314&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="iIDPz_FmkkvGqhd8rOR6J83NlA3XwjTxT4DCPn48ywY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">TBruce (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358314">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358315" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493393578"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>LouV @14: Long ago I worked at a place that was manufacturing adenovirus for a gene therapy for some kind of terrible degenerative eye disease. I don't remember the name of the disease, but I do remember that the clinical trials were very promising. I wonder if it's related to Editas?<br /> Good on them!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358315&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="xW_qFpwQ5PdxhWb-FPO_ScN-jvKJmDEUnPdeukxOqC8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">JustaTech (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358315">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358316" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493395232"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Regarding Alex Jones' case, the judge had also ruled clips from his show as inadmissable. But the jury still agreed with his wife that he's a nut. Judge had to keep telling him off for shaking his head angrily at inconvenient testimony, and when pressed on the stand to name one good thing about his ex-wife, he refused, saying he didn't want to perjure himself becuase there is nothing good about her. Also, although clips from his show weren't allowed, his brag about sleeping with 150 women by age 16 (which ran just recently on his show) was admitted. Given that his son is 14, yeah, I can see why she's worried about this man being the kid's primary male role model.</p> <p>Also, because of having just read about the case, I read the title of this post in Alex Jones' voice.....</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358316&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="kZoA1eXbtfAkgFCZQBOUmb56NQ_4IyoCJE8csl1jhUY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Calli Arcale (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358316">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358317" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493397674"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i> I mean, if the vaccines put me in danger, wouldn’t the rye bread be just as scary?</i></p> <p>You are what you eat. Which is why I am really a 60-kg semi-sentient black pudding.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358317&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="EOZcqiGwlpIZWPe6kBEJ0MFL0PGjw79HncbqYWg7sDg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358317">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358318" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493399831"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I, for one, eagerly await the arrival of our DNA-enhanced killer robot overlords. Hold it. Wait one minute. Wouldn't they then be human-contaminated killer robots? And about that "singularity;" I thought it was when our computers achieved sentience, and being so much better and faster thinkers than us, just sent themselves off to another part of the multiverse. I am so confused.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358318&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="1dkJXphSeUGuQ3p3trqEfB7zJxvtfQTDyVgJ0_vM0j4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">sirhcton (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358318">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358319" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493402357"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I can hear it now, the metallic high-pitched screech:<br /> "Ex. Term. Inate. Exterminate! You are the Doc-tor. You must be exterminated."<br /> Orac, don't share research with any Doctor named Davros.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358319&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="OQAxUWoGpdzf3bnF9RK5olMNz-JXUlX0JL7_pI61UE0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Old Rockin&#039; Dave (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358319">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358320" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493407833"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Y'all are just ignorant. So is Tenpenny.</p> <blockquote><p>There's a whole bunch of entities waiting on the other side, saying "How wonderful that you're here! You come so rarely! We're so delighted to see you!" They're like jewelled self-dribbling basketballs and there are many of them and they come pounding toward you and they will stop in front of you and vibrate, but then they do a very disconcerting thing, which is they jump into your body and then they jump back out again and the whole thing is going on in a high-speed mode where you're being presented with thousands of details per second and you can't get ahold on [them ...] and these things are saying "Don't give in to astonishment", which is exactly what you want to do. You want to go nuts with how crazy this is, and they say "Don't do that. Pay attention to what we're doing". What they're doing is making objects with their voices, singing structures into existence. They offer things to you, saying "Look at this! Look at this!" and as your attention goes towards these objects you realise that what you're being shown is impossible. It's not simply intricate, beautiful and hard to manufacture, it's impossible to make these things. The nearest analogy would be the Fabergé eggs, but these things are like the toys that are scattered around the nursery inside a U.F.O., celestial toys, and the toys themselves appear to be somehow alive and can sing other objects into existence, so what's happening is this proliferation of elf gifts, which are moving around singing, and they are saying "Do what we are doing" and they are very insistent, and they say "Do it! Do it! Do it!" and you feel like a bubble inside your body beginning to move up toward your mouth, and when it comes out it isn't sound, it's vision. You discover that you can pump "stuff" out of your mouth by singing, and they're urging you to do this. They say "That's it!</p></blockquote> <p> -- Terence McKenna</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358320&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="E57GUCnRtkplkACWUu9NThmbfoV9wv_wET42qvMzQ8E"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Gilbert (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358320">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358321" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493409769"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>his brag about sleeping with 150 women by age 16</p></blockquote> <p>Which is almost certainly a brag, unless one of his parents was actually an accomplice. Assuming this was over a three year period (which would have been starting at or shortly after puberty), that's an average of one a week. Parents of that era may have been permissive, but (IIRC Jones is within a few years of my age) they usually weren't that permissive.</p> <p>Then again, given how Jones turned out as an adult, he may well have had parents who were either incompetent or outright enabling him.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358321&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="zCh6ybJF7_suGGL6eUcea1irc4ohMp0YOnVZcdyNoew"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358321">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358322" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493413761"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I firmly believe he did sleep with 150 women by the time he was 16. They were between the pages of his dad's old porno mags Jones hid underneath his bed.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358322&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Ko-NEXAfgTkeXlzSf9YKqLM5TWCCT-tnX1uxMyiP-2Y"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358322">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358323" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493414553"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I think Tenpenny just may be Sarah Connor.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358323&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="H0US9q0olxqHm5g1a2XWLiEz20KxYlNu2bi2yn1WzxM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Diana MacPherson (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358323">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358324" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493418487"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Exposing kids to hate-filled rhetoric really should be considered a form of child abuse, although such a provison would be impossible to enforce, of course, since one parent's hateful rhetoric is another parent's brave truth.... Imagine how stressful it must be for a child to grow up seeing the world as such a scary, dangerous, conspiracy-filled place, where traditional authorities and institutions are out to get you! </p> <p>As a parent, I find it hard to balance teaching my kids how dangerous certain ways of looking at life can be with the necessity of teaching them to show respect and consideration for people who hold those dangerous viewpoints. Regardless of whether their teacher is an anti-vaccine crackpot, my kids still have to show her respect and obey her in class. However, it is hard to explain to a six-year-old that Mr or Mrs Teacher is to be believed about math and spelling but not about his or her crazy nutrition or social beliefs.<br /> I realized with dismay that our area is not as progressive as we hoped, when my daughter came home last week from school upset, because some of the other kids on the bus were teasing the substitute bus driver for having an accent, saying he should go back to Africa where he belongs (even though, as best I can tell, he is actually from Southeast Asia originally).<br /> I also realized I may be setting my kids up for getting the snot beat out of them when my kindergarten-age son went to the anti-bullying assembly earlier this year. When the principal asked for examples of bullying from the kids, Stinker apparently piped up with "Trump is a big bully". I got a call from the principal that very afternoon, after which Stinker and I had a loooong discussion about appropriate times to share political opinions. Apparently his comment was not appreciated by some of the other kids... Who knew kindergarteners were politically aware? At that age, the biggest issues in my school were who peed in the sandbox during recess or who still sucked her thumb during naptime! With the current climate, though, even young kids seem to be aware of politics in a way I never was at that age. </p> <p>We actually signed up for Tae Kwon Do lessons this year as a family, not so the kids could get in playground fights, but to give them confidence they could defend themselves if necessary!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358324&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="pj9Aw5y99eEJZHoouoytrxJYzuStVSaToCTDRL36fpQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358324">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358325" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493418983"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Allison, you sound like a wonderful mother. This too, shall pass.<br /> Don't hide under the bed - the world needs you and your moral and ethical kids.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358325&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="BE6wW7Snzn6f0859nptLFluUq9hJ-1prvWT3HY_beaU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jane Ostentatious (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358325">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358326" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493425214"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><blockquote>his brag about sleeping with 150 women by age 16</blockquote> <p>Which is almost certainly a brag, unless one of his parents was actually an accomplice. </p></blockquote> <p>Yep. The ones who brag the most about all the pussy they're getting are the ones getting little or none.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358326&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="yUAuBQJed-f0AkKCDFvEsmnno556FDYRHKVY1rbznZo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358326">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358327" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493428424"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>My overwhelming response to this was - why can't I make a living just ranting about whatever nonsense I choose to make up?! Beats working for a living. </p> <p>Of course, my conscience and sense of ethical duty to my fellow humans make me a less than ideal candidate for that role.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358327&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tmCH71pC8sPrOGpzz12TCZsl_xTYgAIv0CqbE6tSXJ0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Can&#039;t remember my &#039;nym">Can&#039;t remember… (not verified)</span> on 28 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358327">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358328" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493449104"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Allison: Sounds to me like Stinker will be OK. You guys should enjoy TKD. I've been doing it for years and I love it. We have quite a few families who take classes together; it can be a bonding experience for the whole family. Bully for you!</p> <p>CRMN: Yes, if the woosters, cranks, and quacks had any moral or ethical sensibilities we would not have as many discussions about woo as we do, and Orac would be spending all his time on his cancer patients and research.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358328&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="y4UGI8Y2tcaIPhMSzZFUpCfGXNwC88T70Qcb7mMz6zI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358328">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358329" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493456513"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p># 44 Allison</p> <p><i>We actually signed up for Tae Kwon Do lessons this year as a family, not so the kids could get in playground fights, but to give them confidence they could defend themselves if necessary!</i> </p> <p>Bravo!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358329&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="p-5DMCjGHRt467xJbRYkQGW3gvu3j8X_CqZWONhTZkA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">jrkrideau (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358329">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358330" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493464796"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>We actually signed up for Tae Kwon Do lessons this year as a family</p></blockquote> <p> Why that instead of Ti Kwan Leep or Ecky-Thump?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358330&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="l-FQn4jkxkEO11QnISfpsdB8hCVFxCpUzCqaZTDhHk8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="Mephistopheles O&#039;Brien">Mephistopheles… (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358330">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358331" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493465544"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I’ve said many times that one of the driving forces behind the antivaccine movement is, at its core, the ancient fear of bodily contamination.</p></blockquote> <p>That's also behind the unwarranted fears over GMOs; that the "alien DNA" in GM foods will infect our bodies and do bad stuff.<br /> It explains the market for <a href="http://www.science20.com/cool-links/nongmo_salt_i_cant_wait_to_see_this_in_whole_foods-111929">non-GMO salt</a>, for example. The 'non-GMO' bit relates to the minute amount of cornstarch stabiliser added to the salt; it doesn't matter to the buyers that processed cornstarch (whatever its origins) has no DNA material, the important thing is that no part of the product has had any prior contact with GM.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358331&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="eVX_9xc5gwg87fNNOGjArDa7l4cbzSr_RQdOiu0NOL0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Mrs Grimble (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358331">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358332" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493466359"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Mephistopheles O'Brien #50:</p> <blockquote><p>Why that instead of Ti Kwan Leep or Ecky-Thump?</p></blockquote> <p>Because Herr Doktor Bimler (#37) ate all the black pudding.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358332&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wTPCoTfNqwfjXfO1bYOgBnsr9r3eIoeIL7DqEmL98vY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Woods (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358332">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358333" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493470368"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Allison, you sound like a wonderful mother. This too, shall pass.</p></blockquote> <p>Umm... perhaps:</p> <blockquote><p>the physics by which feces are discharged remain poorly understood. In this combined experimental and theoretical study, we investigate the defecation of mammals from cats to elephants using the dimensions of large intestines and feces, videography at Zoo Atlanta, cone-on-plate rheological measurements of feces and mucus, and a mathematical model of defecation.</p></blockquote> <p><a href="http://pubs.rsc.org/en/Content/ArticleLanding/2017/SM/C6SM02795D">http://pubs.rsc.org/en/Content/ArticleLanding/2017/SM/C6SM02795D</a> </p> <p>Your 12 ± 7 seconds of fame.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358333&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="HcQeTSqdX45VcaTmS7dEQ9qHvGs8e6tS05IMbH_jiwU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Gilbert (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358333">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358334" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493471063"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>If only DNA modification were so easy...</p> <p><a href="http://freefall.purrsia.com">http://freefall.purrsia.com</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358334&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="UWB9Vk4bHObdRzGod2Xudyxzv7wSQiTYwwt8Kl6kgOM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">aairfccha (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358334">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358335" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493472096"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@28: Schlock Mercenary?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358335&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="MyVTE1X5JEp_Ns1SWVXPiyFzjHEEdVlTrAgLqiBo6Vw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">aairfccha (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358335">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358336" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493480113"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Roger Kulp</p> <blockquote><p>Tenpenny forgot the brain eating nanobots.</p></blockquote> <p>It is a shame that the powers that be will use it in this manner when the 'phages' could be a force for good.</p> <blockquote><p> a treatment that uses bacteriophages, or viruses that infect bacteria.</p></blockquote> <p><a href="http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/phage-therapy-1.4090666">http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/phage-therapy-1.4090666</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358336&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="xbRXKMJ3w_afOQrxWnUQt1X-dE9vZ1Uy8B6dRr6rVvs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Gilbert (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358336">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358337" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493481592"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Vaccines are viewed as something that endangers the body’s “purity of essence,” or the purity of their “precious bodily fluids”</p></blockquote> <p>...which is why I drink only distilled water, or rain water, and only pure-grain alcohol.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358337&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="e7wqzc7yvyYWSuqZqs7rI4_PDKluPIBuApEY_WzSAUk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">keokil (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358337">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358338" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493482705"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>This is a anti-vax post by our host, so this isn't entirely off topic, but check out Jake's latest. </p> <p>I think mommy and daddy need to buy him something other than another degree. The kid is becoming obsessed.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358338&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-603A-u89gNfX8jPnO8bgGi6786A-5Sk3MqdHeB8Hmw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358338">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358339" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493483062"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Thanks for the encouragement! I never thought Trump would actually get elected, so I probably went way overboard on criticizing his policies and personal conduct in front of the kids. Now the dilemma is I have always told the kids they should show respect for the office, even if we disapprove of the current officeholder. But I just can't bring myself to be anything other than vastly disrespectful of him, so the kids have noticed I am a giant flaming hypocrite!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358339&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-buP-yi-2J4mUqXu8OrjZRZrIx0vPtv8Ibci_ualGXI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358339">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358340" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493483201"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@50 Mesptophiles - Sorry, I guess I am being a bit dense and don't get it :-( . We did pick the particular school because the instructor was willing to work around my health issues so I could participate as much as possible.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358340&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Ek8QelSakVXF36IAVjsAp4quFOmJlYMxpqk-p9he2oI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358340">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358341" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493487729"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Alison,</p> <p>It helps if you are a Dr Demento fan.</p> <p>Check out this video for the reference. </p> <p><a href="https://youtu.be/Z8VD4JXUozM">https://youtu.be/Z8VD4JXUozM</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358341&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="eWY7gVEUgb7c4dI1R3t4uOlycDLQyOpwOXfJOFOuzjA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">squirrelelite (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358341">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358342" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493489181"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Johnny, young Mr. Crosby is just upset he can't get date.</p> <p>Of course, any prospects would just google him. That should be enough to guarantee life-long celibacy.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358342&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qsbzNkXH-RIp_z_d0jQXM3U6S3mw9OlSvz82r-egCZA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358342">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358343" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493494721"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Sure, I agree with you. It just seems to me that he's becoming more unhinged lately. </p> <p>Maybe it's just my aged sensibilities. I was in the military back in the day, and locker room talk doesn't offend me. But to come right out and declare to the world you are looking for a zipless 'encounter' right out loud, effectively in front of you own mother, never mind the entire female population and future employers, suggest a level of cluelessness I don't remember from his earlier brain droppings.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358343&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TktXqcMrQ3h9OZByzzLMjhCaZyztboabu-AtbbO5C2k"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358343">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358344" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493503598"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Allison, you sound like a wonderful mother. This too, shall pass.</p> <p>Umm… perhaps:</p> <p>@53 Gilbert<br /> I think my kids would certainly agree with you and even go so far as to at that I am most certainly a horribly mean mother! </p> <p>@60 squirrel<br /> Ah, that makes more sense now, thanks! You may have to revoke my nerd credentials for not getting it, though. (I won the Biggest Nerd contest with my husband, a longtime D&amp;D dungeonmaster as a kid, by having my mother confirm to him that my My Little Ponies had a constitutional monarchy, tricameral legislature, and base 11 number system...)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358344&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="53Yt2rJfQNgxB6TCp2TLOtcCuP9Zx12oG5zL5gGjXLs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358344">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358345" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493507904"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>check out Jake’s latest</p></blockquote> <p>The preceding one, in which he demands a retraction yet again, is even more distressing to me, in that <i>JAMA Pediatrics</i> appears to have nonchalantly published a letter containing the, ah, phrase "vaccination flogosis." (There's a glaring typo in fn. 2 as well; I may have to get somebody on the blower.)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358345&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="YeD3VVk808E_VTdBrgy_C3ipywddIu9j7iuyVgRD3Wg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358345">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358346" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493508308"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>^ Oh, and Hooker's UPS-store mailbox number is "Suite 404." Nice touch.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358346&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ZaSc4ZybPLxXaEgkPZ3lYrJQ4N7utvhKqmh_BVD5oEw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358346">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358347" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493509205"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Good for you, Alison.</p> <p>My kids were more into Dragon Ball Z than the ponies.</p> <p>So I wasn't aware of those details.<br /> Base 11 math must get interesting!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358347&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qgxwA8wRMsts1yMhQNlrbf2M673W4J2E8Sfn7aYgRVI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">squirrelelite (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358347">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358348" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493509658"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>^^ And Hooker's pretty much just plagiarizing Janet Kern's comment at Pubmed Commons. Moreover, Jakeroo fails to note Zerbo et al.'s response in the same issue ("a less-conservative adjustment for multiple testing, accounting for the dependence of the entire pregnancy, would still yield a <i>P</i> value of .07 or higher").</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358348&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="arTm-kD0iKQ1-e5oXMSC8ZUVoJpG2UD5UmdMV2U864A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358348">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358349" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493509737"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>^^^ "dependence of the entire pregnancy on the trimesters"</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358349&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="HaYMLLQJ5LUhMTmbVHf5h7V74H76D72r8rwpTDkzko8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358349">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358350" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493511317"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>In line with BS Hooker's attempted criticism of the Zerbo paper, Jacob L. Crosby, MPH, now seems to blame the increasing prevalence of ASD in this country on vaccination of pregnant women with thimerosal-containing influenza vaccines; apparently in Crosby's Labyrinth the thimerosal in multi-dose influenza vaccine vials accounts for the obvious failure of anti-vaxxers' prediction that the prevalence of ASD would plummet when thimerosal-containing vaccines were removed from the pediatric vaccine schedule. </p> <p>Moreover, to support his position, Crosby suggests that the prevalence of ASD decreased dramatically in Denmark following removal of thimerosal-containing vaccines from the pediatric schedule there [1], but in fact the prevalence of ASD in that country (1 in 67 in 2011) is comparable to the condition's prevalence here, although <i>in Denmark influenza vaccination is not recommended for children, pregnant women, or indeed anyone under the age of 65 years.</i> </p> <p>On a more positive note, it's nice to see that Jake acknowledges that ASD begins to develop early in gestation, months or years before the administration of the postnatal vaccines that he and his fellow travelers have long blamed for ASD. That's progress. </p> <p>1. BTW, it's quite funny that the authors of the paper that Crosby cites in his blog post concluded: "Our results demonstrate no time trend in the ASDs recurrence risk as seen in the ASDs prevalence." Yes, as in 'there is no autism epidemic.'</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358350&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="2gopOyvPQecmmaCZd0Ez_YpaCL1tw0ozwC63fRn7ZeM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">brian (not verified)</span> on 29 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358350">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358351" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493540576"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>brian: I got news for Jake. OBGYN practices don't carry the multidose influenza vials. They carry single dose. Which doesn't contain thimerosol. </p> <p>Johnny and Narad: you've piqued my curiosity about "Jake's latest." Do you have a link? I'd love to see just how bad it is.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358351&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8xBdavb0KOX9i_R2nNJfu2H4WVT2UIvTFRLin28p6Ek"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358351">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358352" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493544271"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Johnny and Narad: you’ve piqued my curiosity about “Jake’s latest.” Do you have a link?</p></blockquote> <p>He's autisminvestigated.com.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358352&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="2lMfI85pXgHobX9kFeqsKBM7NTYlkPinUvn0SBAHExU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358352">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358353" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493544850"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'd post a link, but there is profanity in the link, and that would unnecessarily add to our host's workload. It's the 29 April post at <a href="http://www.autisminvestigated.com/">http://www.autisminvestigated.com/</a> Given the profanity, it's probably not safe for work.</p> <p>And maybe it is just me. I'm reasonably sure Jake's mom reads his blog (no doubt she pays his hosting fees), and I just can't imagine putting something like that, under my name, out where my mom would see it. </p> <p>Of course, I can't imagine "thinking" like Jake does, so that's probably part of it, too.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358353&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="T6VxxUwvfjLtM7cZr_mRnD5TXh01Qqo76M7G_VASTqU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358353">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358354" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493544928"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>And friend Narad sneaks in while I'm typing.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358354&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="w4Ij7NfEJ5vM1kNXBEeEk2CLYLdqKKA9MG0Vcl9UQ90"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Johnny (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358354">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358355" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493552719"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Wow. Thanks for the link guys. Just read it. Wow. The cray cray . . . it made my sides split from laughter.</p> <p>Jake, got news for you. You can't get a girl to sleep with you not because you're a virile stud of a man (because your post makes it clear you are not), but because you're a misogynistic a$$#0!e. </p> <p>I concur with brian and Narad's analysis. I can only concluse that JAMA Pediatrics publishes Hooker's LTE's to make an otherwise dry journal entertaining reading.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358355&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="MycTpmb3VL_tRHM6f1CvUTT5fiBuAoDNdN5pccqKqPw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358355">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358356" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493552746"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>conclude. Ack! Darn typos.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358356&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_81ceU5oP3CzTF5YIwz_eDFoRqGf-EkBex4i3E2xuos"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358356">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358357" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493554849"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>When the principal asked for examples of bullying from the kids, Stinker apparently piped up with “Trump is a big bully”.</p></blockquote> <p>Your son is quite observant, Alison. Trump is a bully. Not so much physically as financially: he has a reputation for not paying his contractors, and daring them to take him to court. When they do, he tries to drag out the process as long as he can, hoping that the contractor will run out of lawyer money before the case gets to court. Even if the contractor wins a judgment in court, Trump will often find an excuse to appeal the judgment, again hoping the contractor will run out of lawyer money.</p> <p>I don't envy anyone who is the parent of a small child in these times. Trump is the antithesis of everything we were taught in school about honesty and fair play. And kids, being keen observers, will see that those lessons don't apply in the real world.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358357&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="vIuDx5p33P_ZndvcMLcj6cWEP_tTjmJ7KfMQ0jlXk2A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358357">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358358" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493560543"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Jacob L. Crosby's apparent inability to grasp anything out of the reach of his right hand seems to have blinded him: </p> <p>Zerbo et al. state that even with less conservative corrections for multiple tests the relationship of first trimester vaccination with autism is still not significant; however, even if their result was actually true--that influenza vaccinations in the first trimester increase the risk of ASD--it would still be true that such vaccinations would <i>save the lives</i> of more children than would be tipped over into ASD by vaccination. </p> <p><a href="https://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?doi=10.1001/jamapediatrics.2017.0737">https://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?doi=10.1001/jamapediatric…</a></p> <p><a href="https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22914461">https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22914461</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358358&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7s2u8ynF-WcZlTGT_2IWu9tVQaxuwRmK0YR-x0_aUy0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">brian (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358358">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358359" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493575455"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Good point brian. It's easy to over look the risks vs benefits equation.</p> <p>Not that there's much risk here, and the risks of influenza in pregnant women are very well known.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358359&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TnQw_mfsDyZNi3Hkkm06Ebf_Jl6TJl6VFtzoR04eLCQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Panacea (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358359">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358360" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493577208"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Apparently, there is no longer any individuals named Jacob Crosby in the department of epidemiology or any other departments at University of Texas as shown by the directory search:</p> <p><a href="https://directory.utexas.edu/index.php?q=Jacob+Crosby&amp;scope=all&amp;submit=Search">https://directory.utexas.edu/index.php?q=Jacob+Crosby&amp;scope=all&amp;submit=…</a></p> <p>Alain</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358360&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="h2c14UeaaXcDstGtacj-d7iA1q__wKfloJeXxdDOvoY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358360">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358361" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493586762"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Apparently, there is no longer any individuals named Jacob Crosby in the department of epidemiology or any other departments at University of Texas as shown by the directory search</p></blockquote> <p>Apparently Jake <a href="https://sph.uth.edu/research/centers/dell/about-us/faculty-cv/CV_HARRELL_2017_1-24.pdf">Finished up in 2015</a> or at least Melissa Harrell ceased being his advisor.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358361&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="0IT-VUbwolP3H4BAfK6SBCXb4ICRzwffNPvuwsiNerc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Preston (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358361">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358362" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493588798"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Gah, Crosby might want to consider that making ridiculous statements like "men vastly outnumber women in above-average intelligence" may have a lot more to do with his romantic difficulties than autism does. Furthermore, anyone who cites Brietbart and Milo Y as a source for any research just put himself in the "not even to save humanity" category for a lot of people...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358362&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mBRpvANS2Ud3X36X7G41KFfAP2M6G2hpG8fXUZV-z1s"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358362">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358363" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493589449"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@77 Eric Lund,<br /> Indeed, I see so many bully traits in him, for example how he says ghastly, rude lies about everyone else but then cries foul when anyone says anything even the slightest bit negative (no matter how true!) about him. How many times have he and his staff whined about the "unprecedented" nastiness of someone pointing out his lies or even reminding him of something he himself said earlier?</p> <p>Like a playground bully, he can dish it out but can't take it!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358363&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="c0_54dgmE1rdKIfb6WYQbVPqlLgJleueNY2syw2Gam4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alison (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358363">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358364" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493591026"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Apparently Jake Finished up in 2015 or at least Melissa Harrell ceased being his advisor.</p></blockquote> <p>I take it that "finished up" here is some sort of regionalism for what people call "washed out" in my neck of the woods.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358364&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="u2HvAYMfgjESCXXkGAgYNK0qC4Kh4MTxyd9hqQMCZEM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358364">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358365" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493591523"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I take it that “finished up” here is some sort of regionalism for what people call “washed out” in my neck of the woods.</p></blockquote> <p>Considering his parents are rich, I'm assuming it means "failed upwards".</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358365&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="fONRsyGry1nO8roMFPYCAAdmI_uomQV3-VXylow85xk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge">The Very Rever… (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358365">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358366" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493593977"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>OK, the only other one-year entry is <a href="https://medschool.vanderbilt.edu/psychiatry/person/yasas-tanguturi">Yasas Tang[u]turi</a>. It is not unreasonable to infer that he decided to get an M.D. instead for whatever reason.</p> <p>Of the three-year students, Nicole Nicksic appears to be a postdoc, and José Medina also got his DrPH.</p> <p>Then again, it might have been simpler to merely note the L—In entry that <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=%22jacob+crosby%22+%22phd%22">pops right up</a>.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358366&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="JvUmjQ0l8qkjzc4Vs_Qfe30cX-8aNhB9wkcPMTuY880"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358366">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358367" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493601941"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>I concur with brian and Narad’s analysis. I can only concluse that JAMA Pediatrics publishes Hooker’s LTE’s to make an otherwise dry journal entertaining reading.</i></p> <p>1. Brian Feckin Hooker is lecturing <i>Lisa Croen</i> on epidemiological statistics. This was enough to make even my Siamese cat face-palm.</p> <p>2. Hooker argues that Zerbo et al. should have predicted in advance that a maternal flu vaccination in the first trimester would have more effect, so they should have focussed on comparing that particular subgroup to the control group, rather than bringing in second- and third-trimester vaccinations, as if (he implies) to conceal their findings. This backseat-driving is rather rich, coming from a dude who has built his entire career on the claim that the causes of autism are all <b>post-natal</b>.</p> <p>3. The Italian anti-vaxxers (with the “vaccination flogosis") put forward the same argument. Purely coincidental.</p> <p>4. If "maternal inflammatory response to an immune challenge during first trimester of pregnancy" were a cause of autism, there would be a strong season-of-conception variation in autism incidence from the late-winter lurgis. There is a variation, but it's small. Best not to catch flu.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358367&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7U-0fumBCb39EcMfSi_diVtVTCXUUAqHkrWdjHn9xj4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 30 Apr 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358367">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358368" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1493645974"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Saw that at least one commenter made the connection to the early GMO arguement that it would change our genes. One can actually go back to the even earlier anti-vax belief that vaccination by cowpox turned people into cows [Cartoon] {<a href="https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/94/d4/05/94d40529ebbe621195e5b95ef6ccfbb9.jpg">https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/94/d4/05/94d40529ebbe621195e5…</a>]. This is an update of that belief. As pointed out before that there have been no new anti-vax arguements since its beginning.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358368&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qCNx-vilOW5zW-DAxwNq2nGan2pIt9TrO88jp-cn3AM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Robert Blew (not verified)</span> on 01 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358368">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1358369" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1494050377"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>So, vaccines with DNA in them will bring about either the Daleks, Terminators or Robocop ?<br /> Daleks would be a bit of a pain until The Doctor got here to shoo them away. Terminators would be a bother but they might learn to get along with us. But Robocop . . . I could live with that, just so long as he didn't get it in his head to shoot me for a parking violation.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1358369&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="v7XrNHbXu1wsw2cRWsxrE1-L8EcnerqocTMCWIzpYH4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">DLC (not verified)</span> on 06 May 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1358369">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> </section> <ul class="links inline list-inline"><li class="comment-forbidden"><a href="/user/login?destination=/insolence/2017/04/28/quoth-an-antivaxer-dna-vaccines-are-contaminating-our-dna-in-the-name-of-transhumanism%23comment-form">Log in</a> to post comments</li></ul> Fri, 28 Apr 2017 04:00:06 +0000 oracknows 22542 at https://scienceblogs.com Bogus "challenges" to prove the scientific consensus: The M.O. of a crank https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/02/27/bogus-challenges-to-prove-the-scientific-consensus-the-m-o-of-a-crank <span>Bogus &quot;challenges&quot; to prove the scientific consensus: The M.O. of a crank</span> <div class="field field--name-body field--type-text-with-summary field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Way back in the early days of my blogging career, I remember coming across a "challenge" by a man named <a href="http://americanloons.blogspot.com/2015/12/1555-jock-doubleday.html">Jock Doubleday</a>. I didn't know it at the time, but Doubleday had achieved some notoriety before his "vaccine challenge" as the director or Natural Woman, Natural Man, Inc. and the author of such amazing works as <cite>The Burning Time (Stories of the Modern-day Persecution of Midwives)</cite> and <cite>Lolita Shrugged (THE MYTH OF AGE-SPECIFIC MATURITY)</cite>. <a href="https://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2006/11/27/jock-doubledays-75000-vaccine-offer/">His "challenge"</a> was in the same vein as his previous work, only more so and full-on antivaccine. The reason I'm bringing up Doubleday again after all these years is because just last week, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and Robert De Niro teamed up to do something that reminded me very much of Doubleday's "challenge," something that is a classic ploy used by cranks to promote their causes. I thus viewed <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/02/16/robert-f-kennedy-jr-and-robert-de-niro-issue-a-100000-vaccine-challenge-its-every-bit-as-much-as-scam-as-jock-doubledays-vaccine-challenge/">RFK Jr.'s new "challenge"</a> to be what we in the biz like to refer to as a "teachable moment."</p> <p>It <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20010215044738/http://www.mercola.com/2001/feb/10/vaccine_offer.htm">started out in 2001</a> with Doubleday offering a $20,000 cash prize (later upped to $75,000) to "U.S.-licensed medical doctors who routinely administer childhood vaccinations and to pharmaceutical company CEOs worldwide" who would...well, let's let Jock's own words tell the tale. The original web page no longer exists, but fortunately the <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20061012060613/http://www.spontaneouscreation.org/SC/$75,000VaccineOffer.htm">Wayback Machine has it stored in all its 2006 cranky glory</a>:</p> <!--more--><blockquote>Jock Doubleday, director of the California 501(c)3 nonprofit corporation Natural Woman, Natural Man, Inc., hereby offers $75,000.00 to the first medical doctor or pharmaceutical company CEO who publicly drinks a mixture of standard vaccine additives ingredients in the same amount as a six-year-old child is recommended to receive under the year-2005 guidelines of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. (In the event that thimerosal has recently been removed from a particular vaccine, the thimerosal-containing version of that vaccine will be used.) <p>The mixture will not contain viruses or bacteria dead or alive, but will contain standard vaccine additive ingredients in their usual forms and proportions. The mixture will include, but will not be limited to, the following ingredients: thimerosal (a mercury derivative), ethylene glycol (antifreeze), phenol (a disinfectant dye), benzethonium chloride (a disinfectant), formaldehyde (a preservative and disinfectant), and aluminum.</p> <p>The mixture will be prepared by Jock Doubleday, three medical professionals that he names, and three medical professionals that the participant names.</p> <p>The mixture will be body weight calibrated.</p> <p>Because the participant is either a professional caregiver who routinely administers childhood vaccinations, or a pharmaceutical company CEO whose business is, in part, the sale of childhood vaccines, it is understood by all parties that the participant considers all vaccine additive ingredients to be safe and that the participant considers any mixture containing these ingredients to be safe.</p> <p>The participant agrees, and any and all agents and associates of the participant agree, to indemnify and hold harmless in perpetuity any and all persons, organizations, and/or entities associated with the event for any harm caused, or alleged to be caused, directly or indirectly, to the participant or indirectly to the participant's heirs, relations, employers, employees, colleagues, associates, or other persons, organizations, or entities claiming association with, or representation of, the participant, by the participant's participation in the event.</p> <p>The event will be held within six months of the participant's written agreement to the above and further elaborated terms.</p></blockquote> <p>Doubleday concluded by listing the then-membership of the CDC Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices, whose membership he said that he'd automatically update the challenge to include. After jumping to $75,000 in 2006, it supposedly increased again to <a href="http://community.babycenter.com/post/a10905565/interesting_jock_doubledays_vaccine_challenge_has_reached_200000">$200,000 in 2009</a>. (When <a href="https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-150000-vaccine-challenge/">Harriet wrote about the challenge in 2008</a>, it was $150,000.)</p> <p>Obviously, those familiar with antivaccine misinformation, pseudoscience, and tropes will immediately recognize this hoary challenge as being based on what I like to refer to as <a href="https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/toxic-myths-about-vaccines/">the "toxins" gambit</a>, a common antivaccine trope that targets the adjuvants and other ingredients in vaccines as horrific "toxins." For example, there are trace amounts of formaldehyde in some vaccines, which antivaxers will portray as the equivalent of childhood vaccines being laced with embalming fluid when in reality the human body (even a baby's) produces formaldehyde as a byproduct of normal metabolism and has <a href="http://www.chop.edu/centers-programs/vaccine-education-center/vaccine-ingredients/formaldehyde">far more formaldehyde the bloodstream than is contained in any vaccine</a>. Of course, thimerosal wasn't even in most childhood vaccines anymore by 2006, the year Doubleday increased the value of the prize to $75,000, and thimerosal at the doses contained even when thimerosal exposure due to vaccines was at its height <a href="https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/mercury-in-vaccines-and-autism-a-failed-hypothesis/">doesn't cause autism</a> or other neurological or <a href="https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-final-nail-in-the-mercury-autism-hypothesis/">neurodevelopmental disorders</a>.</p> <p>Of course, anyone with a bit of critical thinking skills can also immediately see that this challenge is not an honest one. For one thing, drinking ingredients is not the same as injecting them intramuscularly. Even if it were, if you control for weight, the amount of thimerosal, acute toxicity with thimerosal only occurs at a dose at <a href="https://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2006/11/27/jock-doubledays-75000-vaccine-offer/">least 500-fold more</a> than any infant would have received from vaccines.</p> <p>However, where you can really tell that Doubleday wasn't sincere is in the various conditions he tacked on to his challenge, which, again, the <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20061012061946/http://www.spontaneouscreation.org/SC/ContractPartA.htm">Wayback Machine has provided</a>. Some of them are truly hilarious. For instance, Doubleday requires that participants undergo three thorough psychiatric evaluations, each performed by a different psychiatrist named by Doubleday and paid for by the participant. He also wants participants to submit to him all of their mental health records and to undergo a complete physical examination by a physician of his choice. Then there's a requirement that the participant read several antivaccine books:</p> <ol><li><cite>Vaccines: Are They Really Safe and Effective?</cite> by Neil Z. Miller;</li> <li><cite>Immunization: The Reality Behind the Myth</cite>, by Walene James;</li> <li><cite>Vaccination, Social Violence and Criminality: The Medical Assault on the American Brain</cite>, by Harris L. Coulter;</li> <li><cite>The Sanctity of Human Blood: Vaccination Is Not Immunization</cite>, by Tim O'Shea; and</li> <li><cite>What Every Parent Should Know About Childhood Immunization</cite>, by Jamie Murphy.</li> </ol><p>Oh, and there's a test, too! It consists of five separate closed-book exams of 20 yes/no, true/false, multiple-choice, and/or short-answer questions, each based on one of the five books, and the participant has to score 90% or above to proceed to the actual challenge. Well, not exactly. That's not all. <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20061012061946/http://www.spontaneouscreation.org/SC/ContractPartA.htm">Read the rest if you're interested</a>. Obviously, this test was never meant to be carried out. In fact, <a href="https://skepacabra.wordpress.com/2009/07/16/jock-doubleday-douchebag-hall-of-famer/">several doctors</a> have contacted Doubleday to <a href="http://kfolta.blogspot.com/2009/08/jock-doubledays-disingenuous-challenge.html">publicly accept the challenge</a>, but—surprise! surprise!—Doubleday <a href="http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/gentlebirth.htm">always finds reasons to reject them</a>.</p> <p>It turns out that this is a classic crank ploy: Issue a "challenge" to provide one piece of evidence that "proves" the scientific consensus, be it by not dying after drinking vaccine ingredients or…something else. I <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2017/02/16/robert-f-kennedy-jr-and-robert-de-niro-issue-a-100000-vaccine-challenge-its-every-bit-as-much-as-scam-as-jock-doubledays-vaccine-challenge/">discussed RFK, Jr.'s "$100,000 challenge" to provide</a> one—just one!—scientific study that basically absolutely proves the safety of thimerosal in vaccines. Of course, the whole thing is rigged. RFK Jr. controls who are the judges. RFK Jr. requires a $50 entry fee and, in the event of needing to resolve a dispute over the results of the challenge, half of the $400 an hour he claims that his scientific panel will charge to review the evidence. It's every bit as bogus a challenge as Jock Doubleday's.</p> <p>Of course, it isn't just antivaxers who like to issue "challenges." I've learned of several of them over the years, coming from a wide variety of science denialists. They vary in format. One of my favorites came from a creationist named Joseph Mastropaolo, who issued what he referred to as his "<a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20130329130722/http://creationsciencehalloffame.org/contests/literal-genesis-trial-contest">Literal Genesis Trial Contest</a>." The contest reminded me when I first learned of it of <cite>The People's Court</cite>, a bit of a different twist on an old game. The participant has to put up $10,000 as the price of entry, and the debate will be decided through a pseudo-legal proceeding, complete with a judge and bailiff. And <a href="http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2013/03/28/no-i-will-not-ever-debate-joseph-mastropaolo/">Mastropaolo had the judges all picked out</a>. What could go wrong? Well, Michael Zimmerman did take the challenge in its earlier incarnation as the Life Science Challenge, and he pointed out a lot of the same things we see in crank challenges like this all the time, the <a href="https://ncse.com/library-resource/life-science-prize">problems agreeing on definitions</a> and <a href="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-zimmerman/literal-genesis-trial-_b_2961284.html">on criteria to determine</a> who "wins."</p> <p>Not surprisingly, creationist Kent Hovind also <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20040509221557/http://www.drdino.com/Ministry/250k/index.jsp">offered $250,000</a> to anyone who could "prove beyond reasonable doubt that the process of evolution…is the only possible way the observed phenomena could have come into existence." Of course, Hovind's definition of evolution was a bit…problematic:</p> <blockquote><p>When I use the word evolution, I am not referring to the minor variations found in all of the various life forms (microevolution). I am referring to the general theory of evolution which believes these five major events took place without God:</p> <ol><li>Time, space, and matter came into existence by themselves.</li> <li>Planets and stars formed from space dust.</li> <li>Matter created life by itself.</li> <li>Early life-forms learned to reproduce themselves.</li> <li>Major changes occurred between these diverse life forms (i.e., fish changed to amphibians, amphibians changed to reptiles, and reptiles changed to birds or mammals).</li> </ol></blockquote> <p>Nowhere does the theory of evolution state anything like #1-#3. It is agnostic on how the universe came into being or how life arose, and #4 is stated in a rather dodgy manner. Like most cranks issuing scientific challenges, Hovind assured people that a "committee of trained scientists will provide peer review of the evidence offered and, to the best of their ability, will be fair and honest in their evaluation and judgment as to the validity of the evidence presented" but failed to list who these scientists would be or how they would be chosen. In other words, <a href="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind.html">it was a scam</a>.</p> <p>Climate science denialists have also gotten in on the act. The scientific evidence that human activity is affecting the climate, resulting in climate change consisting primarily of an overall warming of the climate, is <a href="https://skepticalscience.com">overwhelming</a>, but climate science denialists <a href="https://skepticalscience.com/argument.php">never miss a pseudoscientific trick</a> in denying this finding. For instance, Steve Milloy, proprietor of the Junk Science website, issued his <a href="http://ultimateglobalwarmingchallenge.com" rel="nofollow">Ultimate Global Warming Challenge</a>, which started out offering $100,000 (now allegedly $500,000) to anyone who can "prove, in a scientific manner, that humans are causing harmful global warming. I can't help but note that Milloy really needs to update his website, as he still has dates in 2008 and 2009 listed as his deadline and the date for results to be announced. Nonetheless, just the other day he bragged about his "UGWC" on Twitter; so I assume it's still on:</p> <blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p dir="ltr" lang="en" xml:lang="en">$150K?... it was $500K to prove catastrophic global warming. No winners. <a href="https://t.co/LNytblf5k1">https://t.co/LNytblf5k1</a> <a href="https://t.co/9f5tc9hsO5">https://t.co/9f5tc9hsO5</a></p> <p>— Steve Milloy (@JunkScience) <a href="https://twitter.com/JunkScience/status/832748453486694405">February 18, 2017</a></p></blockquote> <script async="" src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script><p> No winners by design, of course. After all, Milloy states that entrants "acknowledge that the concepts and terms mentioned and referred to in the UGWC hypotheses are inherently and necessarily vague, and involve subjective judgment and that "JunkScience.com reserves the exclusive right to determine the meaning and application of such concepts and terms in order to facilitate the purpose of the contest", as well as asserting that "JunkScience.com, in its sole discretion, will determine the winner, if any, from UGWC entries."</p> <p>Same as it ever was.</p> <p>I've even seen these sorts of "challenges" from other varieties of cranks. For instance, a 9/11 "Truther" <a href="https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/9-11-conspiracy-theorist-offers-100-000-prize-for-proof-of-official-theory.65737/">once offered $100,000 to any engineering student</a> who could "prove the World Trade Center buildings crashed the way the government says." The worst one that I remember was when the Holocaust denial group Institute for Historical Review <a href="http://www.history.ucsb.edu/faculty/marcuse/classes/33d/projects/survivors/mermelsteinbread.htm">offered a $50,000 cash prize in 1979</a> for proof that Jews were gassed at Auschwitz. In 1981 Holocaust surviver Mel Mermelstein tried to claim the prize based on his personal experiences recounted in his autobiography <cite>By Bread Alone</cite>, which was supplemented with photos, newspaper articles, and other documents to support his claim. When IHR refused to pay, <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/1981/03/11/us/auschwitz-survivor-sues-for-prize-for-proving-germans-gassed-jews.html">Mermelstein sued</a>, and the court issued a judgment ordering IHR to pay Mermelstein $90,000, and write a public apology to him, with Judge Thomas T. Johnson declaring:</p> <blockquote><p>This court does take judicial notice of the fact that Jews were gassed to death at Auschwitz Concentration Camp in Poland during the summer of 1944. It is not reasonably subject to dispute. And it is capable of immediate and accurate determination by resort to sources of reasonably indisputable accuracy. It is simply a fact.</p></blockquote> <p>Perhaps the most hilarious version of this technique came from Mike Adams earlier this month, as he proclaimed <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20170217100433/http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-02-16-health-ranger-issues-drink-mercury-challenge-to-toxic-vaccine-pushers-who-poison-infants-for-profit.html">Health Ranger issues “drink mercury” challenge to toxic vaccine pushers who poison infants for profit</a>, in which he challenges "mercury vaccine pushers to simply drink a liter of the mercury of their choice and either prove it’s safe… or not." This is about as idiotic a challenge as I've ever seen, outdoing even Jock Doubleday's challenge. I wonder if I've already qualified. Back when I wore contact lenses and thimerosal was still in many saline solutions as a preservative, I accidentally spilled some while putting saline drops in my eyes to wet the lenses. It got into my mouth and I swallowed it. It was at least a few milliliters; so that should be about the amount that a typical 0.5 ml childhood vaccine contains—or more.</p> <p>Yes, I'm laughing at Mike Adams.</p> <p>A word of advice to RFK Jr. and Robert De Niro: When you use a technique beloved by creationists, antivaxers as out of touch with reality as Jock Doubleday, 9/11 Truthers, Holocaust deniers, climate science denialists, and <em>Mike Adams</em> (you know, the guy who is pushing something <a href="https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/elemonics-nothing-but-a-dance-and-a-tune/">he calls elemonics</a>), you might want to <a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2017/02/17/the-evidence-for-vaccine-safety-is-abundant-that-will-be-100000-please/?utm_term=.2f7787bd4a31">rethink your strategy</a>.</p> </div> <span><a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a></span> <span>Sun, 02/26/2017 - 21:00</span> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-tags field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Tags</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine-nonsense" hreflang="en">Antivaccine nonsense</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/autism" hreflang="en">autism</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/pseudoscience" hreflang="en">Pseudoscience</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/quackery-0" hreflang="en">Quackery</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/skepticismcritical-thinking" hreflang="en">Skepticism/Critical Thinking</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/antivaccine" hreflang="en">antivaccine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/jock-doubleday" hreflang="en">Jock Doubleday</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mercury" hreflang="en">Mercury</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/mike-adams" hreflang="en">Mike Adams</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/robert-de-niro" hreflang="en">Robert De Niro</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/robert-f-kennedy-jr" hreflang="en">Robert F. Kennedy Jr.</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/steve-milloy" hreflang="en">Steve Milloy</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/thimerosal" hreflang="en">thimerosal</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/vaccines" hreflang="en">vaccines</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/complementary-and-alternative-medicine" hreflang="en">complementary and alternative medicine</a></div> <div class="field--item"><a href="/tag/medicine" hreflang="en">medicine</a></div> </div> </div> <div class="field field--name-field-blog-categories field--type-entity-reference field--label-inline"> <div class="field--label">Categories</div> <div class="field--items"> <div class="field--item"><a href="/channel/physical-sciences" hreflang="en">Physical Sciences</a></div> </div> </div> <section> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354407" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488162474"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Health Ranger issues “drink mercury” challenge to toxic vaccine pushers who poison infants for profit, in which he challenges “mercury vaccine pushers to simply drink a liter of the mercury of their choice and either prove it’s safe… or not.”</i></p> <p>Adams being a gunlicking 2nd-Amendment firearms fetishist, I challenge him to simply eat the bullet of his choice and either prove it's safe... or not.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354407&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="H6duGxkumu3Xaq9GIynuBys5Ml2ow3IWQ8rMzGKLYbQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 26 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354407">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354408" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488164968"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>And then there's the case of _Dr._ Stefan Lanka, who offered €100.000 (about USD 106.000) to anyone presenting a scientific publication which proves the existence of the measles virus.</p> <p>David Bardens, at the time a student of medicine, provided him with several publications, which together proved the existence of the virus, but Lanka ultimately won in court because formally a single publication was required instead of a conglomerate of papers.</p> <p>Anti-vaxxers frame this as Lanka having challenged the "pro-vaccine establishment" and having won. Essentially, he has lost the case about the virus, but anti-vaxxers don't care. They never do.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354408&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mMNy6b2-Fejf1pxxa2VNysjhNjrcctjVFUCF33WAick"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Ralf (not verified)</span> on 26 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354408">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354409" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488165722"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>With regards DeNiro, it's getting worse, now he wants to get in on Wakefields act by making another anti-vax 'documentary' .</p> <p><a href="http://www.indiewire.com/2016/05/robert-de-niro-on-vaccines-harvey-weinstein-and-i-are-working-on-doing-a-documentary-289059/">http://www.indiewire.com/2016/05/robert-de-niro-on-vaccines-harvey-wein…</a></p> <p>The comments are littered with Anti-Vax talking points.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354409&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Yk9FD9VWzCr3HfI6XiDFtvzTEqSzi6pgsPTKv2i7ybk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Graham (not verified)</span> on 26 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354409">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354410" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488178413"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"...you might want to rethink your strategy."</p> <p>I think the company they keep is not a bug, it´s a feature.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354410&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="orskXMGFJfS_C74PxYdjFPMMjK8rZacpFOxt6fQEuhE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="" content="StrangerInAStrangeLand">StrangerInAStr… (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354410">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354411" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488181713"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>[Adams] challenges “mercury vaccine pushers to simply drink a liter of the mercury of their choice and either prove it’s safe… or not.”</p></blockquote> <p>The dose makes the poison. I'm pretty sure a liter of some mercury-containing compound would be toxic, and I'm equally sure that Adams won't pay up for anything less. Even vaccines that still contain thimerosal would have several orders of magnitude less than that.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354411&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3GqsILUd1rXau0DPd14OklY3j03bOg59B90uqiVbR8w"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354411">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354412" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488184066"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>In 1970, a 6th grade punk in the neighborhood bet me $1 that I couldn't drink a 2-liter container of water in 15 minutes. </p> <p>I won, I puked, and it wasn't worth it.</p> <p>It was humiliating, a nickle here at dime there until finally I was fully compensated.</p> <p>Anyone that uses money to intentionally cause misery or harm is immature and deviant.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354412&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="M70WnnWo19Zu6285RmeoZhavhiUo_nJ8bOdlIGWlbrg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Michael J. Dochniak (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354412">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354413" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488185298"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Same as it ever was</p></blockquote> <p>Ah, the Talking Heads song ('Once in a Lifetime) ... yes, David Byrne's (and Brian Eno's) wonderfully surrealistic song and ditto video is somehow strangely appropriate for the twisted world view of antivaccine cranks, in particular when it comes to science and health... Although Byrne's rather spastic choreography may send the wrong message in this context...</p> <p>Anyway, in my opinion, these "challenges" are not just bogus, they're utterly hypocritical as well: the antivaccine cranks demand a standard of evidence for the safety of vaccines that is in fact impossible to meet (even ignoring the totally rigged nature of these challenges), yet their own claims about vaccine damage etcetera are not supported by evidence at all, or at best a sort of "evidence" that can hardly be classified as the flimsiest imaginable.</p> <p><i>They</i> are the ones claiming that damage is done through vaccination, contrary to at least a century of scientific consensus. So it's up to <i>them</i> to come up with convincing evidence before demanding that the scientific world prove them wrong.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354413&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_M5Zehw3XTh0xVLNec5x-gfKsrexXQZPUxzNHCp_j6k"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354413">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354414" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488187705"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"[Adams] challenges “mercury vaccine pushers to simply drink a liter of the mercury of their choice and either prove it’s safe… or not.”</p> <p>We should establish a Colloidal Silver Challenge - drink a liter of the stuff to prove you won't turn a permanent shade of blue-gray. Or imbibe a similar quantity of 35% "food grade" hydrogen peroxide. Woomeisters who won't take up these challenges are admitting the dangers!!!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354414&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="BuHqHUpIBNqrXvCuT0ivPT29xNOiMsTid32X0VOK_VU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354414">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354415" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488189586"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I think a fair bit of energy for this kind of stuff grows out of the old Aids denialist challenge to produce a single paper that proves HIV causes the syndrome.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354415&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7DrFfFrpRPw74NxZtUDyGoDEPzqBr_HK4kyFJ52os6I"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Brian Deer (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354415">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354416" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488190056"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>( Natural News, today via bing.com)</p> <p>Dear old Mikey believes that his critics have been poisoned by meds, vaccines and fluoride** and therefore their scoffing is a harbinger of the coming collapse of everything.</p> <p>Only the pure can hear his message or suchlike.</p> <p>He even adds a Bible verse.</p> <p>Perhaps he'll now focus on 'preparedness' and survivalism.</p> <p>I hear so much of this on prn.fm. </p> <p>The tactic: *Scare them then Sell them Stuff*<br /> Lots of crappy purification products, supplements to combat toxins, videos about surviving the coming storm. </p> <p>** at least he didn't write 'flouride'</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354416&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="y-i3GEzB538ablQe-1VJaKv1InC8Q3Yyhy2meQhC0To"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354416">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354417" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488190198"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I wonder if you or a reader could contrast these bogus challenges to the Randi Foundations challenge. I have no doubt there is a difference, but it would be an addition to my skeptic education if this could be pointed out.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354417&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="UGAvnKOKgEq7UFHLzFQ-nMde6Qw-n1Uo1y6CsimTBT0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">darwinslapdog (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354417">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354418" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488190256"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>edit: foundation’s</p> <p>(when will I learn to proofread?)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354418&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="tF_wIT-Nls2htEi08ZKvdB8COC7cZdNRjdP8EqwZoMk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">darwinslapdog (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354418">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354419" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488190407"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>According to Mikey**, his critics have been turned into *animals* ***- REPTILES even!</p> <p>No, we merely work for them.</p> <p>** I believe that I was the first to call him 'MIkey'<br /> *** actually, we are animals.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354419&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="r3XThWv-mXwUw_nfLdGsMR75FRRr9qSU4JxlAvUXU3Q"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354419">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354420" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488191110"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I still wonder if Kennedy knew what kind of tradition he is following and what kind of company he is placing himself in. </p> <p>Someone also posted this counter challenge on Facebook: <a href="https://www.facebook.com/TheSkepChef/photos/a.791733664294785.1073741828.786417031493115/920068788127938/?type=3&amp;theater">https://www.facebook.com/TheSkepChef/photos/a.791733664294785.107374182…</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354420&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="0yvj_lnrHVLAirEK1q8DEo5Zbw9C7_Ny3B66iImzrHc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354420">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354421" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488191139"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I believe that woo-meisters ( like DJT) need to stir up controversies on a near-daily basis accusing everyone of nearly everything that is corrupt, criminal and despicable<br /> IN ORDER to get readers/ viewers eyes off of their scurvy activities and BS.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354421&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TisrFUYoq0lT7xFX4K49DRCRAljxwGu3sBD9HvAWRog"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354421">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354422" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488191223"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>readers'/ viewers'</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354422&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="rOiaCwu1f0dA6D95wdpqUcDlWngteKj81xmEad7xBT8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Denice Walter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354422">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354423" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488194313"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I wonder if you or a reader could contrast these bogus challenges to the Randi Foundations challenge.</p></blockquote> <p>One important difference is that the terms of James Randi's One Million Dollar Challenge were open for negotiation between applicants and the James Randi Educational Foundation, as opposed to the unilateral and rather onerous terms stipulated by these antivaccine cranks.<br /> Also, no financial barriers were set up; instead, applicants were simply asked to provide preliminary 'credentials' in the form of at least a local reputation and support from at least one academic source. No doubt, others can point out several more differences (e.g. unbiased judgment of test results).<br /> To my knowledge, not one of approximately a thousand candidates over the years contested the fairness of the challenge, even though they invariably failed the test.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354423&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="pK4hupqkxgzcpJWlDYgYnMn14OMXxapHxv46m0SptU8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354423">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354424" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488197054"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>And oh, another important difference is the overall nature of the challenge: the JREF challenge was relatively simple, usuallly asking to demonstrate a single positive (e.g. correctly dowsing 8 out of 10 hidden objects or something like that), whereas this antivaccine challenge demands proof of a universal negative (safety can only be defined as the absence of harm), defined in vague wording ('safe' is not a precise qualification at all), in the form of just one study, no less.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354424&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-BXNO4GKE5_nGMY6recFd747B-xI9TPc-6eptzJYsgg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354424">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354425" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488197693"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Dear old Mikey believes that his critics have been poisoned by meds, vaccines and fluoride</p></blockquote> <p>Obviously Gen. Ripper--I mean Mr. Adams--is concerned about <a>our precious bodily fluids</a>.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354425&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="PP9XSgfDGF9Nzj-jkFDiqmwpMJzBmJUnUPRGDPcFv9E"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354425">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354426" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488199594"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>What better way to diffuse the issue of the safety of injecting mercury than to jumble it in with nonsense? Like drinking vaccines (ridiculous false equivalency); "climate science denialism" (doublespeak--no one denies climate science, they just disagree about what it proves); and biblical creationism versus Darwinian theory (false dialectic--there are many other possibilities).</p> <p>The lesson: don't challenged so-called "consensus science" (two incompatible terms combined to imply indisputable truth). If you do, you'll be laughed at. "OMG, no--anything but that!" Derision is a primary tool of thought control. But hey, I guess you gotta work with what you have. :D</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354426&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="j7qGABieldMvFehpqNXT8euK0bBIHpkjzsKkvK0t8mI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354426">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354428" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488202030"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'm not sure why the equivalence is false when the comparison is in that those who try to challenge the scientific consensus offer unwinnable, insincere challenges as gambits when they can't win on the merits. </p> <p>Do you see any meaningful difference in RFK's behavior, compare to the other challengers?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354428&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="7o0hqkXt1Vvif4NUgmRHlK42DC7Upy7RBxJOtZONCGs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354428">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354426#comment-1354426" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354427" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488201406"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"Derision is a primary tool of thought control. But hey, I guess you gotta work with what you have."</p> <p>Which is all you have. Oddly enough you failed to control my thoughts with it. So much for your hypothesis.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354427&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="a-P9zV3HJahkl1Qo-lcpfQFxRbCt9NU-N4Uh9exiMBM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">rs (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354427">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354429" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488203968"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Dorit Reiss -- The safety of injecting mercury has nothing whatsoever to do with the so-called "consensus" on climate and human history, and your assertion about "gambits" that "can't win on the merits" is false. You are employing the same strategy employed in this article. It's interesting that a relatively minor challenge to the vaccine paradigm, like eliminating mercury, is facing such ferocious opposition--considering RFK is staunchly pro-vaccine.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354429&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IvFPbGBRbFW1fHKaxcd7IyXhl_9kD4jV7x8Feg97qMA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354429">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354430" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488204320"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I note you have not pointed to any actual differences in the behavior in question.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354430&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="wBHe3kDSlQKtx05Ev_hLUUp-EuBNg6ybW76B3ymaFSA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354430">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354429#comment-1354429" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354433" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488204881"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I note you must not have read my original response, as you failed to address the false equivalency, doublespeak, and false dialectic mentioned there. The entire purpose, nature and terms of each of the challenges are all very different. I don't see how it's possible to miss that.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354433&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Xuv6-eVLQ-3ejHJkdJ0LQFA4kX9liZOCKuiDEUoIzOA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354433">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354430#comment-1354430" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dorit Reiss (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div></div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354431" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488204693"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Lolita Shrugged (THE MYTH OF AGE-SPECIFIC MATURITY)</p></blockquote> <p>I have held off commenting on this because it's tangential at best to the subject of the thread, but this caught my eye right away when I first read the post this morning. I don't doubt that, e.g., certain women are more sexually mature at 16 than certain other women are at 18, but the analogy to Nabokov is way off base, for at least two reasons:<br /> 1. Lolita is only 12 years old. There is a reason the age of consent is higher than that in most jurisdictions that have one.<br /> 2. More importantly, Humbert is Lolita's stepfather. That's inappropriate no matter how old she is (cf. Woody Allen and Soon-Yi Previn).<br /> I haven't read Doubleday's book (and don't think I want to), so I don't know for sure that Doubleday was making a case for incest, but that's the appearance this book title gives.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354431&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="iHUBW30f4ZKWO6xM4eDUQ8-5RQKGaVD6isC9_VWrquI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354431">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354432" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488204785"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@NWO Reporter</p> <blockquote><p>It’s interesting that a relatively minor challenge to the vaccine paradigm, like eliminating mercury...</p></blockquote> <p>Um, in cause you haven't noticed: thimerosal was eliminated from all or virtually all childhood vaccines in 2001. The effects of this measure became exceedingly clear in the years to follow: none whatsoever. There was no noticeable change in children's health whatsoever, including the autism ratio.<br /> This alone is very solid proof that the 'mercury' in vaccines had no significant effects on the health of children, and that RFK's 'challenge' is not just disingenuous, but in fact plain stupid. The evidence he is demanding has already been delivered in vast abundance in the past fifteen years.</p> <blockquote><p>considering RFK is staunchly pro-vaccine.</p></blockquote> <p>Well, he could have fooled me...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354432&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="fN6l_QoGRX7KKUV-gu-PiUQ7cLLIBT9EqlBsXI4ejg8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354432">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354434" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488205261"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Um, in case you haven't noticed, thimerosal is still contained in flu vaccines given to children, pregnant woman and other adults; in a few other childhood vaccines; and in millions of doses of vaccines given to children in third world nations. </p> <p>RFK has stated unequivocally many times that he is a strong believer in vaccines, and that all his children are fully vaccinated. It sounds like you haven't bothered to read much about this issue before making up your mind about it, Richard.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354434&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="UnYVLAFj4fgYObnX5EpSM2gxXBDy89QZku5KQp75qNE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354434">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354432#comment-1354432" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354435" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488205418"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Richard:</p> <blockquote><p>There was no noticeable change in children’s health whatsoever, including the autism ratio.</p></blockquote> <p>Actually, that's not true. There was a change -- the autism rate has continued to rise, which of course the autism alarmists have continued to hype despite the fact that it even more soundly defeats their fretting about mercury in vaccines. Whatever is causing the rise in diagnoses*, it's clearly not mercury. Anyone who still insists it must be is therefore clearly not interested in the real cause of autism; they just want to prove their pet theory correct.</p> <p>*Increased surveillance, greater willingness to diagnose "edge" cases, diagnostic substitution, greater focus on keeping kids in school rather than letting them drop out, a more intensive environment making the condition more disabling than it used to be, maybe even an actual increase in incidence due to increased parental age and so forth, etc.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354435&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="PJYU05Nd8gIr2UGFG5PV9NdcBqvgsE0Kwer_MO3cOMI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Calli Arcale (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354435">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354436" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488205497"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Derision is a primary tool of thought control.</p></blockquote> <p>This is exactly backwards. Derision is a tool typically employed to fight against people in comfortable if not powerful positions doing ridiculous things, like offering a reward they have no intention of paying. Which is what RFK Jr. is doing here. Or insisting that news linking him to Russia is fake and the people leaking the information should be punished, as Donald Trump is doing.</p> <p>There are people who try to use derision as a tool for bullying, but that hardly ever works. Humor is much more effective when it punches up than when it punches down.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354436&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="KxuJUzzvRZjCA0CCBFSA-2p2_5J1s-hsQ7uYELcUUts"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354436">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354437" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488205680"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>RFK has stated unequivocally many times that he is a strong believer in vaccines</p></blockquote> <p>Actions speak louder than words. RFK Jr. may claim to be pro-vaccine, but he acts like an anti-vaxxer. Whom should I believe: RFK or my lying eyes?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354437&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_L9bbSq-CMgluaO3VEydVg_QbbAYryl6n4VO5Xh4hkM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354437">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354438" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488206231"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I thought I would take a look at what would happen if you were to drink a liter of elemental mercury. The first issue is that a liter of mercury basically weighs 30 pounds. 30 pounds is a little much for your stomach at one time.</p> <p>From MedlinePlus:<br /> ELEMENTAL MERCURY</p> <p>Elemental mercury is usually harmless if it is touched or swallowed. It is so thick and slippery that it usually falls off the skin or leaves the stomach and intestines without being absorbed.</p> <p>You will have problems if you inhale minute droplets of mercury.</p> <p>A person could drink a liter of mercury (of your choice) not have mercury poisoning. Drinking it would not be pleasant for reasons I think we can all imagine.</p> <p>Mikey you loose as usual.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354438&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="aHci3PMOYiHiIO55scxzao1__Yx1VuMVXnLsc-_LQQ8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Rich Bly (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354438">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354439" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488206242"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>What better way to diffuse the issue of the safety of injecting mercury than to jumble it in with nonsense? Like drinking vaccines (ridiculous false equivalency); </p></blockquote> <p>This comment may have some relevance if anyone was injecting mercury. But no-one is.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354439&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="cUocZEdsiFa7YE9zMFoc36KS7Mc_gdXfOphd1WnJNhM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Preston (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354439">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354440" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488206370"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@NWO Reporter, #28</p> <blockquote><p> thimerosal is still contained in flu vaccines given to children, pregnant woman and other adults</p></blockquote> <p>Only the flu vaccines in multidose vials still contain thimerosal. The vast majority of children receive the 0.5 ml single dose variety. And in lots of countries including here in the Netherlands, thimerosal has never been used in childhood vaccines; yet here too, autism and other disorders are just as prevalent as they are in the US. So it is very safe to state that no, thimerosal in vaccines has no effect on children's health.</p> <blockquote><p>RFK has stated unequivocally many times that he is a strong believer in vaccines...</p></blockquote> <p>Yes, I know that. But then could you explain why he does very stupid things such as offer this bogus 'challenge' which only serve to undermine the public's trust in vaccines? And also please note that politicians are not exactly known for their truthfulness -- especially the one presently residing in the White House and those hobnobbing with aforementioned specimen.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354440&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="SefH44sKucIHLIjyXFFhbJML1t0HCzooQdjUaagPyDg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354440">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354447" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488207747"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Anyone who receives a flu vaccine at a drug store--which many do--will typically received the multi-dose vaccine, and they are given elsewhere as well. I'm not sure on what basis you conclude that the "vast majority of children" do not, but children are far from the only people who get the flu vaccine. </p> <p>The issue is not whether thimerosal causes autism. No vaccine causes autism--the issue is brain damage, one manifestation of which may be autism, a behavioral disorder. And thimerosal is not the only suspected culprit. Dozens of cases of brain injuries that included autism have actually been compensated in the Vaccine Injury Compensation Program.</p> <p>As for your deep conviction that injecting mercury is safe, well...I guess you should have no problem claiming that $100k. The terms of the challenge do not seem particularly onerous.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354447&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="5Q0QbHMWQAjppknRz_Wm6O_eIrnW5_WBfrEWW0XT3B0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354447">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354440#comment-1354440" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354441" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488206835"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'd also point out that the overall uptake of the Flu vaccine is extremely low, compared to vaccines like the MMR &amp; DTaP (neither of which use preservatives, at all).</p> <p>So, you have low uptake, along with a very small percentage receiving the Flu vaccine from multi-dose vials...again, I have no idea what RFK JR's point is.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354441&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Alc-vptrEcG4NfskvADNTdWYY4fsJYrP_eZxUtw-Fv0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354441">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354442" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488206848"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Calli Arcale, #29<br /> Well, yes, the number of ASD diagnoses kept rising unabatedly, so yes, that is change. But it is of course clear what I mean: abandoning thimerosal in the vast majority of childhood vaccines was not followed by any sudden change in the state of health or health trends.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354442&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="21I-sLk1iTW52MZGrl101d4G7RD_Z5wS2UOhSjVLTlk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Richard (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354442">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354443" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488207028"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>NWO Reporter" "It’s interesting that a relatively minor challenge to the vaccine paradigm, like eliminating mercury, is facing such ferocious opposition"</p> <p>RFK Jr. is criticized because he (like you) leaves a false impression that mercury pervades the childhood vaccine schedule, when in reality only one vaccine (multidose flu) still contains it, most kids get the single-dose version, and thimerosal has not been shown to have any detrimental health effects anyway.*</p> <p>Lying and obfuscation are tools of thought control that antivaxers should stop using.</p> <p>*just let it go, like the many antivaxers that have gone on to other vaccine "toxins" like aluminum, casein, albumin, sucrose, aborted baby parts, rusty auto parts, eye of newt etc.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354443&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="UIlvoGlOk6b_xMt-qkaaUsVgK1C0TbiG3x6m0680fY4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354443">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354449" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208096"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Mercury is used in the vast majority of vaccines given to children in third world nations. But apparently that is unimportant to you. </p> <p>Anyway, looks like we have another contender for that $100k. Go for it.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354449&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ABwF8rrz5_Zvr8Mv4WA-QW59Fm_RHDaX48jpQWqItoI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354449">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354443#comment-1354443" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354444" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488207305"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ignoring the fact, also, that even back in the day, the vast majority of vaccines never used it in the first place.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354444&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="KdMrcjFzEYfre5JOoG6tuAfHuHzlLJHmZ0HUkCyWobA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354444">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354445" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488207638"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Can you tell us Lawrence, why it was used at all?</p> <p>If you had the choice of using Thimerosal or phenol, what would you choose and why?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354445&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="nUtzW25xPSe70ul64gwXyfAaDBBJUVjoFDERLmb12EU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">ハルート (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354445">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354446" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488207708"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Go away Travis - you're boring.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354446&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="hqoYCYs1kbGnPgNlFBYQv9O8Ynj_b2UCkpz6LTNKaP4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354446">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354448" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488207929"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>A person could drink a liter of mercury (of your choice) not have mercury poisoning. Drinking it would not be pleasant for reasons I think we can all imagine.</i></p> <p>IIRC, people drank mercury (in smaller quantities) in the Renaissance years, to treat constipation. The idea was that anything that heavy was going to go *somewhere*, and anything in the way would come out first. Then you could retrieve the Hg from the chamberpot, wash it, and save it for next time (Renaissance cuisisne had a lot to answer for).</p> <p>How much this contributed to the general craziness of the Renaissance intellectual milieu is a moot point.</p> <p>I hope this doesn't go on at Renaissance Faires.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354448&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="sVotaZTnoZ89wltSYrKtQotpkKHx2Ol4I8Nra1hWwK4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354448">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354450" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208271"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>As for your deep conviction that injecting mercury is safe, well…I guess you should have no problem claiming that $100k. The terms of the challenge do not seem particularly onerous.</p></blockquote> <p>Exactly. Injecting mercury cannot possibly be safe. This would lead to Minamata's of the brain.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354450&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="uvgk5FwMkRvaqCw4QRMv8odZ-rQEbz9hdYYfgURI68U"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">ハルート (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354450">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354451" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208314"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>biblical creationism versus Darwinian theory (false dialectic–there are many other possibilities).</i></p> <p>How cute... NWO Troll pretends to believe the Creationist theocrats when they pretend to only want intellectual diversity. Remember when they tried to rebrand their creationist textbooks as "Intelligent Design" and screwed up the search-&amp;-replace?</p> <p>The rival schools of thought are<br /> 1. Gradual changes of species through inherited variations; or<br /> 2. A powerful magical fairy did it.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354451&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Gpr1jeS2i3UFsW3HGez_HqhaqtcewBruRPeUNtaX-3k"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354451">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354452" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208351"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>If you knew anything about how vaccines are shipped, stored, and used in the field, you'd know that the "vast majority" of vaccines in the 3rd World "don't" use Thimerosal either.</p> <p>It is still used in some, because there is currently no other method to get vaccines to some of the worst places on Earth, where electricity is scarce to non-existent.</p> <p>And most, if not all, pharmacies, carry both multi-vial and single dose flu vaccines.</p> <p>In California, for instance, all of the Flu vaccines are single dose, by law.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354452&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="x8OKjCH8DbZKIN7jHtdltrO6zyIlbXzJNV63PGzCgZw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354452">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354453" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208445"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The "terms" as have been explained above, are Bullshit.</p> <p>Basically, RFK Jr. decides who wins.</p> <p>That's not a "challenge," it's a con.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354453&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="xvHdNKh-CUl3on9-bBITEAjOplgfHAjloKEy0hL-7fY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354453">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354454" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208623"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Derision is a primary tool of thought control.</i></p> <p>No-one expects the Spanish Inquisition! Our chief weapons are sarcasm. Dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and satire...</p> <p>No, wait, that doesn't sound right.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354454&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="gQc4k3o_uPqcpd_VTj6zqBZswcacfn2czOxmrNcM6H0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354454">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354461" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209137"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'd have to agree those are powerful weapons, herr doktor. :D</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354461&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="sj0rhSvN4heZjUaS0VTWh_o-qmaosLZNUkMbqlYznyg"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354461">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354454#comment-1354454" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354455" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208689"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Could somebody who reads Japanese better than I do tell us what our kana-nymmed friend claims to be? I discovered that I don't have Asian character sets enabled on this computer.</p> <p>I agree that he is almost certainly a troll.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354455&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="vWVXe_aI5eGa2wxXe1i1e7xid8WEDmsdVSWhVSebipc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354455">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354456" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208862"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"Harte" or "Haruto"</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354456&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="v-wdklA3RaOeXmo1sB_6gbY81aUmLRy-kweqUsXokjU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354456">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354457" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208895"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>It is still used in some, because there is currently no other method to get vaccines to some of the worst places on Earth, where electricity is scarce to non-existent.</p></blockquote> <p>No other way to distribute vaccines besides spiking them with Thimerosal?</p> <p>Okay Lawrence. </p> <p>Type that comment into your computer using C++ and watch it explode. </p> <p>Linus Pauling facepalms in his grave over comments like that.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354457&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="rBXIt0D_BgIdlzPx5etZwAXmdnY8C2-iRGgYkU-gxkA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">ハルート (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354457">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354458" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488208936"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Anyone who receives a flu vaccine at a drug store–which many do–will typically received the multi-dose vaccine, and they are given elsewhere as well. </p></blockquote> <p>False. The vast majority of flu jabs available are thiomersal-free. Pharmacies carry primarily single dose jabs. Children and pregnant women receive primarily, if not exclusively thiomersal-free jabs. You'd be very hard-pressed to find someone who has received a TCV.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354458&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="PxPN_vxM47nfYGNVAea2VHfyf0L7gXsT5WOphC6dqPw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354458">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354465" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209630"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Do you get the thimerosal-free version for your children, Science Mom? Do you think it matters?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354465&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="zZsrYqZgIMfT0aKn2nCgLrt-UUdt_t0naxmyauV3-3U"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354465">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354458#comment-1354458" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354459" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209017"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Oh and Travis Schwochert, you aren't doing your job search any favour by continuing to post comments here and anywhere else.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354459&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="E-yn-jt4JUmN8WiMzPSg8kMLBHaeNjqWxpYlB67JTIY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354459">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354460" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209108"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>It's Haruto.</p> <p>Pretending that Thimerosal is the only way to preserve vaccines is weapons-grade stupid.</p> <p>Fukushima-grade stupid.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354460&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="GHTXIIqFFrv9QXSwsFILOa8Ci7MR9_ivX8QfzA_Gtlc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">ハルート (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354460">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354462" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209145"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Again, Travis just go away.</p> <p>Spend some time talking to someone from "Doctors without Borders" - ask them how they get vaccines to most of the places where they operate (Syria, Somalia, Afghanistan, etc).</p> <p>Places where you'd be lucky if you could find cold storage within 100 miles of where ever you were at....</p> <p>But still, most vaccines (including the MMR - which is vital in the 3rd World) requires no preservative.....</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354462&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ayoZMh-po0pPo-kgJ8QoyS4Jd4nmQidv5VtURtb9Ins"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354462">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354463" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209176"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>No, it's Travis-troll.</p> <p>Go away.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354463&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="9DL3yLcR67orIKHV9bXeZqROsw8bU0vkQZKN3JVncKE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354463">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354464" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488209475"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Lawrence! There are dozens of other preservatives! </p> <p>One of the most disingenuous lines that pro-vaxxers take is implying that Thimerosal served a function that could not have been served better by something else.</p> <p>It was negligent from the start.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354464&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="4xNN_SbPt6DjwZj5VGzsrQHdA4Zy3BzubhWJzY-iC8A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">ハルート (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354464">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354466" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488210124"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Looks like our latest troll (or latest incarnation of Fendlesworth, if that's what he is) is projecting like a multiplex theater. Nobody is saying that thimerosal is the only way to preserve vaccines. It is used when preferred methods such as cool storage are not available.</p> <p>Believe it or not, there are places in the world where reliable electric service is not available. For instance, war zones: war tends to do nasty things to infrastructure.[1] The people who live there don't need preventive health care any less than us first worlders.</p> <p>And then he tops it off by invoking Linus "Vitamin C Cures Everything" Pauling.</p> <p>[1]Old engineering joke: Civil engineers don't build weapons systems. They build targets.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354466&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IHMtHLql8eWJBwpe2mh_mBgglaB9wnJSNEzP5KM8Js4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354466">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354467" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488210205"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Do you get the thimerosal-free version for your children, Science Mom? Do you think it matters?</p></blockquote> <p>For the record, I always get a thimerosal-free version, because that is all that I am offered.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354467&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="rrslqjPGVVdt6sw3PyqAqnrN1ZRwFYgwiF8Ev4HbFZw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris Preston (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354467">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354468" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488211000"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Nobody is saying that thimerosal is the only way to preserve vaccines.</p></blockquote> <p>His "original" trip was "<a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=phenoxyalcohol+vaccines">phenoxyalcohol</a>," before things devolved into utter self-debasement.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354468&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="pNLPpvajFBQ8hDyK1ccLGv6xd03kIq6Yt5WPkFECkvI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354468">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354469" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488212245"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>And then he tops it off by invoking Linus “Vitamin C Cures Everything” Pauling.</p></blockquote> <p>I don't think he went quite that far, but you should listen to quantum chemists when it comes to molecules.</p> <p>Just because the cardiologists didn't want to abandon their little con game for a cheap molecule doesn't mean you have to ridicule the man. There is no indication that would lead me to believe that Pauling is incorrect in his assessment of the ætiology of cardiovascular disease. </p> <p>You should read his Journal articles before you ridicule him. His quantum mechanical treatment of hybrid bond geometry proves that he was not a flake, but a very hard-headed scientist.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354469&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="PCiid1aFtsmt_vAdHb7VZYV3Fn1TsK-dyYcVqf22KKQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">ハルート (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354469">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354470" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488213513"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Sorry, but this particular "quantum chemist" seems to know nothing about actual biology.</p> <p>Go away Travis.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354470&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="yb4BD2BsVkWNeBI01TnwMwgG_5zNSAG2KU-EvIlpJ54"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354470">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354471" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488214477"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p><i>Derision is a primary tool of thought control.</i></p> <p>If you want a vision of the future, imagine a motley-clad court jester waving a bladder-onna-stick at a human face -- forever.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354471&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="v5JNL5zFOL3grLhZAwMeFvq5c92pPf4KkmHCGH1ffOs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354471">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354472" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488220098"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Ewan McGregor did an interesting documentary following the cold chain through India up into Nepal. Showed the difficulties faced trying to get vaccines to some of the really remote villages.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354472&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Sjw2CixU7HSFR_MIfVM95-uS9DyykeV_LLW3h9cWJeU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NumberWang (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354472">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354473" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488224959"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Meanwhile, no crank signs are given off by professors who misrepresent COIs to university IRBs: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/jexto5s">http://tinyurl.com/jexto5s</a></p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354473&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="cgRtgNWRah0PPjoOY5_8kLGSWhbg5uO8IMS7I9oODFQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jake Crosby (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354473">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354474" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488225427"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Here, Jake, have a bladder-onna-stick!</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354474&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="DFtJpd1mEQBtr-uBgY9LElZpvQRYnANWvqtwjTo0jZA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354474">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354475" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488227602"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Young Master Crosby is using a tinyurl to link to his own silly blog.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354475&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TYQbnk_bSFbavmEjI3NBSw_Hf6QofbnnUDPlcFMcmxo"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Chris (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354475">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1354476" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488233623"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The Gnat buzzes and annoys. It's what gnats do.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354476&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="nImfz61w7XLPxlnUPpThDPSQaOFL-PgfxHGE6ckZo1o"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354476">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="28" id="comment-1354477" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488233678"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Young Master Crosby is using a tinyurl to link to his own silly blog.</p></blockquote> <p>The Gnat being The Gnat and getting around certain spam filters. Bad Gnat.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354477&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="uGAZhMFXkADtKlCU10BtS1CD9OjKziLWxbYHXp6gbqI"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <a title="View user profile." href="/oracknows" lang="" about="/oracknows" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">oracknows</a> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354477">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/oracknows"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/oracknows" hreflang="en"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/pictures/orac2-150x150-120x120.jpg?itok=N6Y56E-P" width="100" height="100" alt="Profile picture for user oracknows" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354478" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488234184"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>you should listen to quantum chemists when it comes to molecules</p></blockquote> <p>You wouldn't know a basis set from a CGI'd talking urethra, Fucklesworth.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354478&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="M5_xS25AtH_Ih-lSeGGcEnq1MpqYEJc6DHDHY9mCtm4"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354478">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354479" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488234639"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I always wondered what's a gnat :)</p> <p>Wonder no more: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnat">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnat</a></p> <p>Interesting critter :D</p> <p>Al</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354479&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Xf8Y2wnFEVEkXKW159q1bENJX2hts8ieOvw0VYPpYCw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Alain (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354479">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354480" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488238554"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>But anyway:</p> <blockquote><p>Nobody is saying that thimerosal is the only way to preserve vaccines. It is used when preferred methods such as cool storage are not available.</p></blockquote> <p>The only relation between these two things is that multidose vials put less of a strain on the cold chain.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354480&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="5TDiDUe05MhOCND4k0QOzj7EFTlP31uBUYePscilTfU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354480">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354481" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488243268"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I have to say, that picture at the top of the post with RFK Jnr in front of a "National Press Club" sign, that is the ugliest-ass kerning I have seen for a long time.<br /> You would think that the NPC could afford a half-competent typographer. Please make it go away.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354481&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="D06TmPeFiO6SPimSp28qqH56A6b1_4sPzAiyKZqmB_I"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">herr doktor bimler (not verified)</span> on 27 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354481">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354482" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488260444"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Orac - Pardon the digression, but check out the current "special issue" of National Geographic on the news stands and supermarket checkout lines. "Home Remedies." With a big bowl of pretty herbs &amp; flowers on the cover. And plenty of articles that appear to tout quackery &amp; BS. I didn't bother to look inside while I was on the checkout line because a) didn't have my glasses and b) didn't want to be seen reading dreck (yah, "coward!", guilty as charged).</p> <p>Don't let it cause you to ditch this forum (for anyone who doesn't know, this site is owned by National Geographic). Better to do a scathing takedown; presumably TPTB won't retaliate because you have the biggest audience of anyone on this site. (I'll bet that two of the tactics used in the magazine are "both-siderism" and "self-serving questions.")</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354482&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="YOhu6qVRykSriBvcAg2Z7_x-9tzhmXb661lEGbbepWE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Gray Squirrel (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354482">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354483" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488261419"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@ 60 Eric Lund</p> <p><i>And then he tops it off by invoking Linus “Vitamin C Cures Everything” Pauling.</i></p> <p>You mean the only person as far as I am aware to be awarded to single person Nobel Prizes in Chemistry? Or in any field, I believe. </p> <p>He did go <i>emeritus</i> over Vitamin C but he was, apparently, an absolutely brilliant chemist. We tend to forget that because he made a fool of himself over Vitamin C.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354483&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="vUQhAF5aVJ0utYTaDMtsG5rxBR1RH8qmqlcVjA_3OjE"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">jrkrideau (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354483">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354484" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488263262"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@Alain: gnats are only interesting under glass. Otherwise they are just small annoying buzzy things. Like Jake. How amusing that he still has a bee in his bonnet about Orac. </p> <p>C'mon, Jake, can't you investigate the real criminals like Suzanne Humphries or Sherry Tenpenny? People who advocate abuse and injury to austistic persons?</p> <p>@Eric Lund: Pauling was pretty brilliant when it came to chemistry. However, he did go bats*** crazy over Vitamin C, even when studies showed it didn't do what he claimed it did. IIRC, double-blinded studies showed it *may* reduce the length of a cold by a day or so. But it didn't have any of the other wonderful effects that its proponents claim it does.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354484&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8t8BlcfUA1Bjq5eqpCnb2sJtNbuhi5vUK1Fehjf5WrY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354484">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354485" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488266509"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Do you get the thimerosal-free version for your children, Science Mom? Do you think it matters?</p></blockquote> <p>It's all we've ever been offered. In fact that's all that was on campus during uni flu jab drives years ago. But it doesn't matter to me because I know what a piteously small amount of thiomersal is in a jab.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354485&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="de1_b7DCRlglIet0Yl8MI_6gdxpCB6kmuZIVwnYe_xk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354485">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354487" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488274775"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>A "piteously small amount"...multiplied by a yearly vaccine from age 6 months to 80 years. Hmm...makes sense. If given a choice, why not go for the thimerosal-containing version--I'm sure you could request it. You could use your child to prove a point...assuming he elected to continue with the plan as an adult. What could possibly go wrong? :)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354487&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3EssmJHc2Th5-ON_X4dhkC5x8RnmPz3sFJPtnbKGs3U"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354487">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354485#comment-1354485" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354486" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488273102"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>You mean the only person as far as I am aware to be awarded to single person Nobel Prizes in Chemistry? Or in any field, I believe.</p></blockquote> <p>Lots of people have won single person Nobel Prizes. Literature is almost always awarded to a single person, and the Peace Prize is frequently awarded to a single person or organization. It's less common these days for the science Nobels to be awarded to a single person, but looking at <a href="https://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/lists/all/">the list of all winners</a>, I see the following single winner science prizes just in the last ten years:<br /> 2016, Physiology or Medicine, Yoshinori Ohsumi "for his discoveries of mechanisms for autophagy"<br /> 2015, Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Science, Angus Deaton "for his analysis of consumption, poverty, and welfare"<br /> 2014, Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Science, Jean Tirole "for his analysis of market power and regulation"<br /> 2011, Chemistry, Dan Shechtman "for the discovery of quasicrystals"<br /> 2010, Physiology or Medicine, Robert G. Edwards "for the development of in vitro fertilization"<br /> 2007, Chemistry, Gerhard Ertl "for his studies of chemical processes on solid surfaces"<br /> Single winner awards were more common in the early days of the Nobel Prizes. Physics last had a single winner in 1992 with Georges Charpak "for his invention and development of particle detectors, in particular the multiwire proportional chamber" (the Chemistry award that year was also to a single person, Rudolph A. Marcus "for his contributions to the theory of electron transfer reactions in chemical systems", as was the Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Science, Gary S. Becker "for having extended the domain of microeconomic analysis to a wide range of human behaviour and interaction, including nonmarket behaviour"). All of the 1971 Nobel Prizes were awarded to single individuals, the most recent year this has happened.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354486&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="0rLzqF1DiE1SEdiAJiwiRPhygXnhMMs3xtAq6qUJqBk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Eric Lund (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354486">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354488" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488274960"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@80 Eric Lund</p> <p>I think the second "to" in your quoted sentence was meant to be "two" which gives a slightly different slant on it. If so jrkrideau was nearly correct. Apparently Linus Pauling is the only person to have won two unshared Nobel prizes. He won the prize for chemistry in 1954 (for his work on the chemical bond) and the Nobel Peace Prize in 1962 in recognition of his peace activism. He was certainly a brilliant chemist but, as mentioned above, he went "emeritus" over vitamin C, biology being outside his area of expertise.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354488&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="i-Fa_YkjIkl5Wn4xxZSrkDGTTT0joLur7n7mjoBfWI8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">DrBollocks (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354488">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354489" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488275331"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@NWO Reporter</p> <p>You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that thimerosal accumulates. It doesn't.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354489&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="c85m1VDcemeShsuc1bgydNyQj5un1olCcwn0TONE0SM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">DrBollocks (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354489">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354492" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488276200"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Looks like we have another wise one who should request the thimerosal-containing version to prove a point. :)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354492&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="K_XoPaLIUz2hQGt0PLuwQWCiYQpeeIapHGzRzPdbviM"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354492">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354489#comment-1354489" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">DrBollocks (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354490" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488275589"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Not only doesn't it accumulate, but again, most Flu vaccines are single dose, which doesn't contain Thimerosal anyway.</p> <p>Seriously, what an idiot.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354490&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="GtcqnNymJiBfnuAcsKcId4exjVdDrzuOLD5w4A_uk6A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354490">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354493" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488276319"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Unless you're a child in a poor third world country. But who cares about them anyway, right?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354493&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="pv5xnB5dV6XGPtn__2s7tu_C-ZjUs9KGBypoRAEe1As"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354493">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354490#comment-1354490" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354491" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488275910"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Some of the conversation about Linus Pauling is hilarious. He wins a Nobel Prize, thereby demonstrating his brilliance within the approved paradigm...but as soon as he steps outside the approved paradigm, he's a crank. Does it ever occur to any of you who are disrespecting his work that you aren't brilliant enough to pass judgment on it? But who am I kidding...you have plenty of "experts" within the approved paradigm from whom to regurgitate an opinion. :D</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354491&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="-HK4_elGxQ9gXdphtwGahZnDJHd7SQKusYojw52meIA"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354491">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354494" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488276484"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>So, which vaccines used internationally still use Thimerosal, if you're so smart?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354494&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="u-T0jFgafKcfzgw8kUHu7oCkdyaSk1E2hnTuPtMMuN8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354494">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354495" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488276571"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Sir Isaac Newton spent the last years of his life trying to prove that Alchemy was real....</p> <p>Genius is no guarantee against quackery.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354495&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mz9wKeQQ6ZnKGnhWWbG-QMADKYvkfjv4GE78GzFdo0o"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354495">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354496" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488277329"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>Some of the conversation about Linus Pauling is hilarious. He wins a Nobel Prize, thereby demonstrating his brilliance within the approved paradigm…but as soon as he steps outside the approved paradigm, he’s a crank. Does it ever occur to any of you who are disrespecting his work that you aren’t brilliant enough to pass judgment on it?</p></blockquote> <p>It's as common as dirt for Nobelists to go emeritus. Does it ever occur to you that there may have been a long time between his work that was honored and his babbling about vitamin C? Or so much as to see how it's held up since he shuffled off the mortal coil? The references in <i>How to Feel Better and Live Longer</i> were quite underwhelming, as I recall, but it's in storage.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354496&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8eCKVNzDXe6NJomBnmPQoI11H1iG_vpPjy6IneIkn6g"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354496">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354497" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488277712"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>A “piteously small amount”…multiplied by a yearly vaccine from age 6 months to 80 years. Hmm…makes sense. If given a choice, why not go for the thimerosal-containing version–I’m sure you could request it. You could use your child to prove a point…assuming he elected to continue with the plan as an adult. What could possibly go wrong?</p></blockquote> <p>You're ignorant. You haven't proven any harm from thiomersal-containing vaccines and put up a flaming strawman when you couldn't paint me into a corner. We all have had plenty of TCVs numpty and thiomersal doesn't accumulate like that. By the by, less thiomersal and a higher autism prevalence; it's a complete non-starter.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354497&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="W_5z6kbfi05yxhIODBNHmAE87pfzNC9xrbLGVaL9Tx8"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354497">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354505" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488282066"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I'd agree thimerasol is certainly not the only, or even the worst, perpetrator of brain injury from vaccines. Autism can be one manifestation of it, certainly not the only one, but it's a diagnosis of behavior, not of brain injury.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354505&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8HVGLOkWkcuJP7SiXYbS-Js4RUKoJaweGzAgnd8bp3s"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354505">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354497#comment-1354497" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354498" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488277925"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>It shuld also be noted tha Krebiozen recounted his <i>testing it out</i> on more than one occasion. I leave it to someone wiho's less stressed out and actually has a working machine to dig up the best version.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354498&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="3f3Bs9M6Ue-rVAEjS9Ux500ZkbM0SHFIh6XGd-2cnvw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354498">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354499" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488278024"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>The mere fact that a famous and brilliant scientist said something - regardless of the evidence for or against - is not actionable evidence, period. You're talking to the grown-ups now.</p> <p>Seriously. Elementary fallacy, one of the first ones taught in any critical thinking course. Pathetic.</p> <p>NWO - you're not serious, certainly not brilliant. You don't understand the elementary concepts of evidence. I know this will make your head explode, but if someone pulled out the same fallacy in favour of a position I agreed with, I'd say the same thing. Rationality is topic-independent and certainly not decided by a 'star system'.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354499&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="mUVtumr8E-qxm7qSYq6CFIeHaQcUvMIyCUPv6wkt90c"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">RJ (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354499">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354508" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283012"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I don't recall saying, or even implying, that the fact a famous and brilliant scientist said something is actionable evidence--and can't imagine why I would, since if anything, it is exactly opposite the opinion I hold. You think I don't understand the elementary concepts of evidence, eh? Interesting. But if you're going to be so generous with the insults, you might want to include the specific comment you're referring to that prompted your opinion. Otherwise it just sounds like a pathetic attempt to inflate yourself. :)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354508&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="vYsDj-UmBCHJswevmnLLeHbljErLhyiRaa1Z9E0HmYc"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354508">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354499#comment-1354499" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">RJ (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354500" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488278846"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>If given a choice, why not go for the thimerosal-containing version–I’m sure you could request it.</p></blockquote> <p>Your assuredness is misplaced. I <i>always</i> request extra mercury, and nobody has multtidose vials. This is unsurprising, as they, y'know, <b>expire</b> after opening, so the only place one is likely to find them is at a large-scale event. Neither pharmacists nor the local university medical center has had them for me.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354500&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="DcHPEMgk_qkI0aH2mlVUBL3bBpt9f9YRHAi33rPEng0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354500">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354501" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488279219"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>"Unless you’re a child in a poor third world country. But who cares about them anyway, right?"</p> <p>Certainly not antivaxers, who trivialize measles as a minor ailment, when it still kills about 135,000 children every year (way down from when it used to kill 2.6 million a year, before widespread measles vaccination was instituted).</p> <p>I also ask for extra thimerosal each year when I go in for my flu shot, but they only have the single-dose version available. :(</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354501&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8pCudNj-VNvQTEvm5VuysReTI032tfsz2Mg34g4kNAY"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354501">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354513" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283543"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>You may want to review the history of deaths from measles in the industrialized world from around 1900 forward. While deaths were once common from it, they had dramatically declined to extremely low levels long before the vaccine was licensed in 1963. It was known as such a benign disease, many parents never even had a need to seek medical care. The reason deaths from measles are still common in the third world is due to chronic malnutrition, poor sanitation and contaminated water--the same problems that once plagued the industrialized world. A child living in those conditions is at risk of death from virtually anything that an ordinary healthy person can easily handle with no problems.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354513&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IX0OL2uX7fsUpNbbBjhMWDpzsHMtEE5FQEGkpxOVVZQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354513">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354501#comment-1354501" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Dangerous Bacon (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354502" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488279548"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>for anyone who doesn’t know, this site is owned by National Geographic</p></blockquote> <p>No, it is and has always been owned by Seed Media. The partnership with NatGeo was short-lived.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354502&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="8MWW35FnFITcanUvNenFpmeaIuybog9F9tY2X98tNlw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Narad (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354502">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354503" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488280007"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>@NWO: if thimerosol was so bad for you, many, many of my generation (1960s) would have been autistic, since Merthiolate (TM) was the antiseptic of choice for most households and was slapped liberally on any open wound (not counting the times we used it to differentiate the "Indians" from the "Cowboys" by painting it all over any exposed skin we had. It was used copiously. Yet, weirdly, very few of my generation had autism diagnoses. </p> <p>We had plenty of "weird" or "retarded" kids, but no autistic ones. Gee...wonder what happened to the kids who were either "weird" or "retarded"? You might actually think the diagnostic criteria changed or something...</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354503&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="jV8DqIWZkNAV-ZGDSTVUxTg6Gxk-ZRU89mYHViuSIi0"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">MI Dawn (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354503">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354504" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488281865"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p> since Merthiolate (TM) was the antiseptic of choice for most households and was slapped liberally on any open wound (not counting the times we used it to differentiate the “Indians” from the “Cowboys” by painting it all over any exposed skin we had. It was used copiously. Yet, weirdly, very few of my generation had autism diagnoses. </p></blockquote> <p>Missing the right parenthesis.<br /> Are you seriously asking us to believe that you painted your face with merthiolate?<br /> Are you thinking about mercurochrome?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354504&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="l-vU2LZxPh36JtJE5pnR2RAWa3HuuEOIevmE8bHyEzw"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Jan (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354504">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354506" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488282446"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I’d agree thimerasol is certainly not the only, or even the worst, perpetrator of brain injury from vaccines. Autism can be one manifestation of it, certainly not the only one, but it’s a diagnosis of behavior, not of brain injury.</p></blockquote> <p>You just contradicted yourself. Encephalitis on the order of ~1:1mil doses of vaccines (primarily MMR) is the only "brain injury" resulting. You know what causes far more "brain injuries" than that?</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354506&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="O4OzpDwYg7395W-PI0dZHuy0bNQjq_CnK2rsgb8LB2A"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Science Mom (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354506">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354507" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488282632"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>but as soon as he steps outside the approved paradigm, he’s a crank.</p></blockquote> <p>The reality is, each branch of science has a lot of knowledge that can only be acquired by years of intense study in that field. A photoplasty contest on the Cracked Website described it.</p> <p><b>REAL SCIENTISTS</b><br /> This paper is on phytoplankton and my specialty is zooplankton.<br /> Better call Professor Joad as that's his field.</p> <p><b>FICTIONAL SCIENTISTS</b><br /> This is biochemistry and I'm an astrophysicist.<br /> Eh, I got this.</p> <p>@Narad, I'm really worried about Krebiozen. The last time he commented was one year ago.<br /> Literally. His <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2016/02/19/hillary-clinton-and-bernie-sanders-embracing-integrative-medicine-pseudoscience/#comment-430158">very last comment</a> is dated February 28, 2016.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354507&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="MrHfUny_AiuzcSG8VUCoJQhsFp_5QimnyrUA57xZxAk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354507">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354509" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283313"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><blockquote> but as soon as he steps outside the approved paradigm, he’s a crank.</blockquote> <p>The reality is, each branch of science has a lot of knowledge that can only be acquired by years of intense study in that field. A photoplasty contest on the Cracked Website described it.</p></blockquote> <p>I don't see how this follows. You are merely stating the obvious.<br /> People who have original theories are not necessarily branded a quack just for that reaso; this word is reserved for competitors of the AMA and does not necessarily mean that the person has been prove wrong.<br /> Some of the most effective healers of cancer are quacks, by definition.<br /> I would take a quack over a maimstream oncologist anyday, and you should too. </p> <p>"Ridicule is the first and last argument of a fool."</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354509&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="ReEYNUPOtu_DEp1ISSAni2h97w2i9F5bAL4ExltsAkQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">John Peer (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354509">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354510" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283429"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>You know, we have these things called MRIs - which allow us to create very detailed images of human brains.....and identify actual "brain damage."</p> <p>Autism isn't "brain damage."</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354510&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Oz5IpWuZEQbk92p-64cbr46gTfMqYn9kEi2ROnZMwRs"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354510">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354511" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283455"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Forgive my typos above; the "n" key on my keyboard is a bit choppy.</p> <p>(too much searching for the word "porn" no doubt!)</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354511&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Dj7lIFSqikJvnsaxmKzpUunJk0ZYDshARu-6NDzIwew"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">John Peer (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354511">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354512" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283496"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Funny - the people we see who went to "quacks" don't seem to live very long or well, for that matter.</p> <p>Yet, the people I know who received conventional treatments are alive and well today.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354512&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="_6lqb14-mW3y_nnxjuQMYK91SqiEfDiUS2typcdqIkU"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354512">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354514" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283678"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>To give NWO credit. He/she is the first one to imply that a scientist might just know more about their field than A.N.Other and ten minutes on Google.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354514&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="lLUFzHdD_r2RfBEpDfqAT50lc7O0fQ-u01DJzTYbtBQ"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NumberWang (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354514">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354515" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283725"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><blockquote><p>I don’t see how this follows. You are merely stating the obvious.</p></blockquote> <p>The fact that Linus Pauling won the Nobel Prize for Chemistry twice does not automatically mean that he knew what he was talking about when he mentioned Vitamin C as a Panacea. That was my point.</p> <blockquote><p>People who have original theories are not necessarily branded a quack just for that reaso; this word is reserved for competitors of the AMA and does not necessarily mean that the person has been prove wrong.</p></blockquote> <p>It means that, according to our current state of knowledge, their hypothesis is dubious, to put it politely.</p> <blockquote><p>Some of the most effective healers of cancer are quacks, by definition.</p></blockquote> <p>Give examples.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354515&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="Vfq_tMEL3zvOkykV5QKkWKo-b-qCbAPgkUDIy5yHu80"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Julian Frost (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354515">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354516" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488283872"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>Measles was never considered "benign."</p> <p>It was considered inevitable...it was so contagious that it was a forgone conclusion that every child would eventually catch it &amp; since there was no treatment (until the wide-spread use of antibiotics, which allowed for the control of secondary infections and pneumonia, which was common in cases of measles), parents just had to hope and pray that their child wasn't one who died, or went deaf or blind.</p> <p>Then there is the pesky SSPE - a 100% fatal complication of measles which occurs in around 1 in 2000 or 3000 cases. It still kills kids today.</p> <p>Of course, modern medicine could keep kids alive better. Even Iron Lungs could keep people from dying of Polio - but it wasn't until vaccines that we could actually prevent people from being infected in the first place.</p> <p>I'm always amazed at the ignorance of people like you, who obviously no nothing about immunology, biology or even medical history.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354516&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="TdzAO-WLxFDl4BJ_JkELq9bjw55bGNC98ulIQdED_fk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354516">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354519" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488284361"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>A "benign" disease: one for which full recovery is typical for an ordinary healthy child, and complications are not expected. Measles was very much a benign disease in the industrialized world long before the vaccine was licensed. The data is very clear in this regard. Most children recovered fully without any need for medical intervention at all, and were left with lifelong immunity--which the vaccine is unlikely to provide.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354519&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="IzVWAHQf1KGqk5EGpm5kJEVQkzdEWDdbUk6nc73ZBOk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354519">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354516#comment-1354516" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354517" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488284124"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>I am also amazed that anti-vaxers consider a disease "benign" which, even today in western countries, kills around 1 in 1000 people who get it...and also has the added benefit of causing SSPE, which is 100% fatal.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354517&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="v4iczHRciOuztFXlEoVEjWMamjtm94jVtXroITT3V9Y"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354517">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <div class="indented"> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354521" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488284861"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>According to the manufacturer's insert for the MMR vaccine, serious adverse reactions that have occurred following vaccination include (among others): vasculitis; atypical measles; pancreatitis; diabetes mellitus; thrombocytopenia; leukocytosis; anaphylaxis; arthritis; encephalitis; pneumonia; nerve deafness; retinitis; and death. In addition, MMR has not been evaluated for carcinogenic or mutagenic potential. The question is always about weighing risks and potential benefits.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354521&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="qX-lYJYzJQReubGlBph1QoodrkcfKR75zXpfNtK5j6k"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">NWO Reporter (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354521">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> <p class="visually-hidden">In reply to <a href="/comment/1354517#comment-1354517" class="permalink" rel="bookmark" hreflang="en"></a> by <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span></p> </footer> </article> </div> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354518" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488284193"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>And, of course, this anti-vaxer (like all of them) doesn't appear to know the difference between mortality and morbidity.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354518&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="DFOiFSIjMBwa4owshEHtraA4fA5n4-Wk8D_SL7wULfk"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <footer> <em>By <span lang="" typeof="schema:Person" property="schema:name" datatype="">Lawrence (not verified)</span> on 28 Feb 2017 <a href="https://scienceblogs.com/taxonomy/term/3017/feed#comment-1354518">#permalink</a></em> <article typeof="schema:Person" about="/user/0"> <div class="field field--name-user-picture field--type-image field--label-hidden field--item"> <a href="/user/0" hreflang="und"><img src="/files/styles/thumbnail/public/default_images/icon-user.png?itok=yQw_eG_q" width="100" height="100" alt="User Image" typeof="foaf:Image" class="img-responsive" /> </a> </div> </article> </footer> </article> <article data-comment-user-id="0" id="comment-1354520" class="js-comment comment-wrapper clearfix"> <mark class="hidden" data-comment-timestamp="1488284560"></mark> <div class="well"> <strong></strong> <div class="field field--name-comment-body field--type-text-long field--label-hidden field--item"><p>More amazing BS from the anti-vaxer.</p> <p>Here's something most anti-vaxers don't get - even contracting measles is no guarantee of lifelong immunity. Between 8 - 10% of those who contract the disease won't sero-convert, which means they can get the disease again.</p> <p>Also, if the vaccine wasn't effective, explain how we went from hundreds of thousands of cases per year (in the US) to effectively having zero domestic cases per year.</p> <p>And let's talk about the hundreds of schools for the deaf and blind, which are no longer needed.....childhood diseases like the measles and mumps were the #1 case of pediatric deafness and blindness.</p> <p>Funny, don't see too many schools for the deaf and blind around anymore.</p> </div> <drupal-render-placeholder callback="comment.lazy_builders:renderLinks" arguments="0=1354520&amp;1=default&amp;2=en&amp;3=" token="25dfLehZoYf247IF05m7MyLVHlKsRKgI4yEdObfHh5g"></drupal-render-placeholder> </div> <foo