We interrupt your schedule of cats and rowing for a brief snark at the denialists: courtesy of mt, who clearly ventures where angels fear to tread, we have Newsletter: NZCLIMATE TRUTH NO 244 by Vincent Gray: THE FLAT EARTHThe attached graph is in all of the Reports of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate change, and it is fundamental to all their activities. It assumes that the earth can be considered to be flat, that the sun shines all day and all night with equal intensity, and that the temperature of the earth’s surface is constant. This is abysmal stupidity and ignorance at its septic best: Gray really does believe that this simplified picture is the basis for the climate models. Good grief. Need I say moe, guv?

Well all right. Gray continues… It ought to be obvious. The earth does actually rotate. The sun does not shine at night. The temperature is not constant. Every part of the earth has a different energy input from its output. There is a correct mathematical treatment. It would involve the division of the earth’s surface into a large number of tiny increments, and the energy input and output calculated for each one, using the changes in all the factors involved. There would then have to be a gigantic integration of all these results to give a complete energy budget for the earth. This is a not-too-bad description of how GCMs actually operate.

I’m finding it hard to believe that Gray really is this rubbish. There must be something else that he means. Or is Inferno now posting as Gray?

Update: Special bonus snarking: I should read climaterealists more often: I missed an exciting plug for Piers Corbyn. He predicted the volcano. Or something. To be honest I couldn’t be bothered to read it all. But is has a nice pic and one of those hand-drawn weather front maps that went out with the ark.


  1. #1 Mark

    “I’m finding it hard to believe that Gray really is this rubbish.”

    Tell me about it!

  2. #2 Chad

    I saw that at MT as well. I couldn’t believe what I was reading. I thought it was just snark or some kind of joke. Unfortunately, it was serious. Denialism at its best.

  3. #3 watchingthedeniers

    Wow. I mean, just wow! What’s just as amazing is the chorus of posters joining in. Take this:

    “Models like these show how weak our knowledge is – the hubris involved is STAGGERING, thinking we can predict the end results of changes in inputs and outputs based on such a primitive understanding of insanely complex and inter-related systems that act and re-act in such a myriad of UNKNOWN ways..”

    Oh the irony.

  4. #4 Boris Eyjafjallajökull

    Is Gray really this stupid? Really?

    He could be right, of course. After all he’s an “Expert Reviewer” of the TAR and AR4.

    We expect that kind of stuff here in the colonies (our ancestors being the people that were either kicked out of or ran away form all the decent countries), but I thought the Kiwis were comparatively sane.

    [You need to register that new name ASAP -W]

  5. #5 DrYak

    Oh there is a very big denial industry here, particularly comming from the agricultural sector which makes up a massive (~25%?) portion of NZ’s GHG emmissions. Federated Farmers (the agricultural lobby group) is particularly vociferous as is the far right (ACT) party currently forming part of the government.

  6. #6 Hank Roberts

    I can’t imagine where he got the idea the sun shines 24 hours a day. Clearly it can’t:

  7. #7 PeteB

    Amusingly, there is currently a web advert right in the middle of Gray’s nonsense


  8. #8 Gareth

    I’ve covered some of his more memorable pronouncements: Touch of Gray is a good one, in which he expounds on environmental Darwinism (or something, it’s not clear what), or his resignation letter from the Royal Society of NZ (When Gray turns to blue.

    Vincent Gray is 89 next birthday.

  9. #9 dhogaza

    This is a not-too-bad description of how GCMs actually operate.

    It’s really quite amazing, isn’t it? I was reading that statement of his going “but … but .. but …”.

    It’s sad that someone with his educational background and stature can be so friggingly vocally ignorant about something that can be learned by spending about fifteen minutes in the Google.

  10. #10 thomas hine

    I’ve seen the super-computer at NCAR, and must say I’m quite impressed. I hope the old guys who input the “assumptions” didn’t fall for the old flat earth bit.

    I think when the superintendent comes around they even bring out the machine that goes “ping”!

  11. #11 Eli Rabett

    Yeah, I was looking at the prescription for what was needed and thought, hey Vinnie, that’s what GCMs do, but I figured he wanted 2.5’x 7′ boxes.

    FWIW Eli knows where there are a couple of original Cray X-MPs sitting around decaying.

  12. #12 BTW

    Having just read some of the latest stuff Curry has been posting around, I have to wonder how she would expect “a reasoned dialogue” might take place over there – or better yet why a reasoned dialog should take place over there.

  13. #13 ScruffyDan

    Well Gray thinks people like you are just trying to a substitute for the theory of evolution*.

    Why do you hate Darwin?

    * Page 3 http://www.climatescience.org.nz/images/PDFs/GlobalScam3a.pdf

  14. #14 Monckhausen

    We are a new climate denial skeptics group from Calgary that will adress this problem:

  15. #15 Boris

    Oh, man. The Corbyn stuff reads like a Scientology memo or something. I had read JA’s posts on Piers, but I never knew how crazy he was.

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