Well, if you believe in online polls, they don't like it very much. But hey, you know what we think of online polls! I suspect that we'll be able to win over all of the beautiful country of Spain with a few clicks on all of our computers. Here's the question, and the current state of affairs:
Que opinas sobre esta campaña ateista? (What do you think of the atheist bus campaign?)
Pésima (very bad): 83%
Mala (bad): 4%
Antiliberal: 8%
No se (don't know): 0%
Buena (good): 5%
Will it become buena in the next few hours?
By the way, the slogan sounds much prettier in Spanish: Probablemente Dios no existe. Deja depreocuparte y disfruta la vida.
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Buena!
Well, it seems to be on a blog that is a "[c]ampaña anti los buses ateos" or a "campaign against the atheist buses." Of course the people reading that blog would choose "pésima," it's like conducting an internet poll asking "do you use the internet?"
Voté por "buena". ¡Voten conmigo, amigos!
Like Mark Sandman (RIP) said:
I think it's time for me to finally introduce you to the buena, buena, buena, buena...good, good, good!
This is an easy poll to crash. Just turn off cookies and keep going in and out of the site.
I'm not familiar with this particular site. I do know that the campaign arrived in Barcelona first and did well. A small evangelical group in Madrid (largely catholic, of course) chose to preempt the atheists and started a campaign of its own, saying "God does exist, enjoy a life in Christ". (Again, I'm not sure if that is sexual reference).
I think it is important to remember that in Spain gay marriage was legalized in 2004-2005, without the socialists paying a price for that at the polls in 2008. The catholic church has also been criticized for its close collaboration with the Franco dictatorship.
Pésima 46% (273 votes)
Mala 2% (13 votes)
Antiliberal 4% (26 votes)
No se <1% (4 votes)
Buena 46% (273 votes)
@#6
Evangelical Catholic? Now that's something new.
Antiliberal? That makes absolutely no sense.
Bad 38%
Good 54%
Keep pushing
Note: not (allegedly) against Christians or Catholics, but against Christianity and Catholicism.
Funnily enough, on Bravo this morning I finally saw Kathy Griffin's live show in which she talks about being attacked by the Catholic League and then finding out that it's just Bill Donohue and his computer.
Why do they have "very bad" and "bad", but only "good" and not "very good"? And why do they throw in "antiliberal"? Ridiculous.
Although I think the phrase on the buses is a good one, I'm indifferent to the campaign itself. However I voted "buena" anyway, just to annoy the people behind the poll.
Bad 37%
Buena 55%!
Viva Pharyngula!
59% and climbing rapidly.
Buena 61%
Buena 65%
Like, totally pwned. 65%
We're at 67% now =)
Ahhh, I missed doing this to polls.
The "Good" option is ample majority now~
I actually think these poll crashings might be useful. One way to change people's opinions is to make them think they're in the minority.
Buena now at 71%. :)
I love Spain! And I'm pleased to help them take a positive approach to atheism :-)
Now 69% "buena" and counting....
I think that "antiliberal" is being used in the sense of "intolerant".
Pésima 21% (289 votes)
feedback bar
Mala <1% (13 votes)
feedback bar
Antiliberal 2% (26 votes)
feedback bar
No se 4% (61 votes)
feedback bar
Buena 72% (1016 votes)
feedback bar
Total Votes: 1405
Buena, kinda fun to watch.
We now have ¾ of the vote. Keep it up everyone!
Spain is a catholic country, where if you're old, feminine sex, and catholic, you are the devil and a really dangerous person for the rest of the world LOL. Usually works that way in Spain or America. But anyway, Dr.Myers, ya sabe que usted es bienvenido cuando quiera a los paises de habla-hispana, porque ya que lo admiramos mucho. :)
Cheers!
#@23 MadMonk
Strange of them to say that, especially since THEY are the ones against the campaign, while they continue to do their own proselytizing campaigns. I guess that they consider all expressions of ideas that are contrary to theirs "intolerant."
By the way, Pharyngula is STILL not on the first place here: http://2008.weblogawards.org/polls/best-science-blog/
Vote immediately! PZ for president!
Stick a fork in it, it's done
Buena 74% - Faringulación completa.
Lol the scale is so skewed, there's a 'very bad' but no 'very good'.
Pésima 16% (289 votes)
Mala <1% (13 votes)
Antiliberal 1% (26 votes)
No se 3% (62 votes)
Buena 79% (1474 votes)
79% now - love the Spanification Sanity Jane!
82% for Buena!
Buena wins. Viva Pharyngula!
@29: Make sure to vote xkcd for Best Comic too.
By your command.
Espana es mi pais favorito otro de los EUA.
eh, xkcd seems to have best comic locked up, I'm voting for Jesus and Mo now, hoping to boost it up to a better %
If xkcd was in more danger of getting toppled then I'd toss my vote that way.
Fully reversed at 84%. More fun than watching TV.
OK - Next
We're still losing to a global warming denialist.
http://2008.weblogawards.org/polls/best-science-blog/
82% for good!
It's sort of old, but there has been a response from the evangelicals, even though catholics are the majority there. The news here: http://www.elpais.com/articulo/espana/evangelicos/contraatacan/autobus/…
The bus says "God does exist. Enjoy life in christ"
Oh I didn't read the whole thread first. Sorry!
Como se dice FAIL?
Diego, they have a poll there that asks if there's too much religion in society (I think that's what my high-school Spanish can decipher), but the results page is awful! How do you know who voted for what? I can't see any instructions for how to read the results, anywhere. Is the first bar si, second no, third nc?
Another Poll!
YAY!
no hay probablemente dios, ahora para el preocuparse y disfruta de vida.
#3
We will miss you Mark!
Aquaria,
You are correct -- the first bar (blue) is yes (86%ish when I checked) and the next bar is for no (14%ish). The words are shifted too far to the left (they also seem to be color-coded, but it's hard to tell since the third option (NsNc -- don't know/didn't comment -- not sure about the second one) is basically 0.
Pésima 10% (292 votes)
Mala <1% (13 votes)
Antiliberal <1% (26 votes)
No se 2% (63 votes)
Buena 86% (2507 votes)
It's just too easy to crash online polls. I only wish I could see the site owner's reaction when he checks the results.
Aquaria:
Once I vote, I see 5 bars, representing the votes. The first one corresponds to "Pésima" (terrible), which has 10% (292 votes). Then there is "mala" (bad) "antiliberal" (same as in English) and "No sé" (I don't know), which have between 1 or 2% each. The last one corresponds to "Buena" (Good), which has 86% (2502 votes). I hope I'm not mistaken, but what I understand is that most people voted for "buena" (good) to the question "Que opinas sobre esta campaña ateista?" (What do you think about this atheist campaign?)
Me again, sorry, I thought you were asking for the poll the initial post was talking about. My bad.
Looks like you've turned it around.
I don't think the original score (as it was when PZ first looked at it was very reliable anyway - if you look at the top it says that is the website of the "Campaign against the atheist buses"!
I live in Spain years ago, and I can assure you there are plenty of atheists!
88%
LOL ,the power of the Pharyngulite,Pharyngulian,Pharynguliese
I am glad that poll crashing is unaffected by the Scienceblogs update! Very satisfying. :-)
Salute from Spain, the country of buses.
It's very nice to have the superpowerful pharyngulas' one hundred thousand tentacles crash that online poll. Although we're really a lot of atheists here, we barely have any organization. Shame on all of us.
So thanks friends for your help. This is going to be wonderful because it has happened in our sleeping time. It's going to be great to see how the webmaster wakes up and checks how god punished him with a massive FAIL in his poll, probably for masturbating before going to bed. I wonder if he will leave it like this.
Rodger T NZ said:
We are Legion!
Ohhh buena!
The Spanish bus-campaign even made it in the Danish newspapers! With a lovely picture of Ariane Sherine and Richard Dawkins and a British bus... hmmm pictures from Spain were obviously scarce. But there was a nice little interview with the Spanish campaignleader and all.
Not bad for a Danish newspaper.
Viva Espana!
What I love about the atheist bus campaign is how the other side keep on giving us free passes!
These god believers seem to be doing all they can to keep the issue in the media as much as possible. Whenever it goes a bit quiet one of them tries to get the adds banned, or condemns it in some public way, and the signs are on TV again!
I don't even live in the UK, but those signs keep on popping up, mostly because of the efforts of the god botherers!
Yay! Let's hope they keep getting offended!
The bus campaign, along with the picture of Sherine and Dawkins even made it into the national Indian newspaper (ironically, named Hindu).
Yay for the campaign. It's especially important to promote the message that it is ok to be an atheist, and that there are other people who think similarly.
You did it! Now its 89% "Buena". Anyway, this web has been created specially against the atheist bus campaign (that's what is says at the top) so it hardly could reflect what Spanish people think about it.
Whoa, I'm gonna translate a previous post by that loon, just because I can, and have nothing to do at work. Seems like a Donohue-type to me. The post caught my attention because its title is "Thanks, atheists". I thought it was a comment by someone else. He's commenting on the "PROBABLY GOD DOESN'T EXIST - STOP WORRYING AND ENJOY LIFE" tagline of this campaign. If anything seems a little off, I'm doing a literal translation, comments in brackets are mine.
Left a couple of comments there, but alas, I just figured out that this was printed on that newspaper, so it's not a blog post per se, and probably the author, a priest, won't read my calling him basically a bastard. Oh well.
Pesima 8% (302 votes)
Mala <1% (14 votes)
Antiliberal <1% (26 votes)
No se 2% (63 votes)
Buena 89% (3341 votes)
My little buena is there too!
Viva pharyngula!!
This poll is in a website owned by a very active christian group in catalonia (spain) called e-christians.
You should check the web that is accepting donations for that campaign:
http://busateu.org/
The poll here is:
¿Qué te parece esta campaña? (WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THIS CAMPAIGN)
* 1. Excelente (67%)(EXCELLENT)
* 4. Mala (19%)(BAD)
* 2. Buena (9%)(GOOD)
* Sin comentarios (4%) (NO COMMENT)
* 3. Regular (2%)
btw, you can donate here:
http://ateus.org/busateu/?page_id=292
Note: "La razon" is a right wing, very conservative, catholic newspaper.
Miko | January 11, 2009 10:10 PM
Antiliberal? That makes absolutely no sense.
"Liberal" in spanish has almost the opposite meaning that you know, meaning it is a person who opposes any state regulation only in economical matters, but prefers a strong state in matter like security, control, ideology and religion:
By Spanish standarts, Bush is a liberal or "neoliberal". sometimes its meaning is very similar to "neoconservative".
Since "spanish liberals" prefer a strong and religious state, this campaign could be considered antiliberal.
In my city, Zaragoza (Spain) there was also projected another bus campaign. But it will not be: the bus company has rejected it. The reason provided: The advertising campaigns that contain political or religious content must be approved by the bus company, and this one hasn't.
Believe it or not.
Have you heard Joaquín Sabina's Adivina adivinanza? It might just be the most geniusest of all his geniuser songs. (Well, that one and Pero qué hermosas eran. Oh, and Noches de boda. oh, and Pastillas para no soñar... screw it, the guy's a genius).
buena: 90% (3556 votes)
hurray!
Unfortunately, the Popular Party made the same gamble that the GOP did: they have decided to ally themselves with the Godbots in order to get votes that would not be available to them otherwise.
I think that this gamble is far more unlikely to pay of here that it was in the US, since the population here is far more left-leaning and secular than the populaiton in the US. Tnough the popular party has not yet lost many votes, I think that is just because people have nto yet realized how reactionary the party has become.
Their drift toward the lunatic fringe caused me to stop voting for them, and I doubt I'll be the only one. Perhaps I'm wrong, and there is a strong current of idiocy running through Spain that was silent until now, but I do beleive that that idiocy expresses itself in other ways (like the fandom in football matches).
Though the popular party has not yet lost many votes,
If they do, will they be legally obliged to change their name to the Unpopular Party? ;-)
buena 90%
Hurray! One more vote from India!!
"WHY WORRY? BE ATHEIST"
See
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20090110.RENZETTI10/TP…
Bono Estente!
What? "Campaña ateista"? "Ateista" is not a word in Spanish! It should be "campaña atea". FAIL
And I thought I was the only Pharyngulite in Spain. How wrong can I be?
I'd just like to point out that the designers of the Spanish atheist bus campaign probably shouldn't have used the word "probablemente." In spanish it expresses a lot of doubt, so in english their slogan sounds more like "There might be no god."
Sadly, my vocabulary is so pathetic that I can't think of a better word at the moment.
João
And I thought I was the only Pharyngulite in Spain. How wrong can I be?
Very wrong, you bet.
Am I the only one who's bothered by the fact that there's both a "very bad" and a "bad" option, but only one "good" option? Polls shouldn't be skewed like that, at least if they're aiming for neutrality.
You're assuming too much there.
Now, I'm not an expert in poll rigging, but isn't the practice in such cases to split the option you don't like, instead of the one you do like?
When I just voted, we totally pwned! them at 91%
Yes, "liberal" in Spanish is pretty much "neocon" in English, meanwhile, "Libertario" is not your typical randbot, but more something like a Chomskian Socialist Libertarian... Useful to have this in mind when reading automatic translations, as nothing will make sense otherwise.
Fer, another Pharyngulite from Zaragoza! This is exciting!
From that web site's "Thanks, atheists" page: "The same way, one would have to invite thieves, rapists, drug traffickers, into atheism".
I find this funny because in Mexico, another very christian country, most, if not all of the thieves, rapists and drug traffickers are deeply religious. This is a fact, in which it is known that they pray to their god(s) (la virgen, la santa muerte, Jesus, santeria's spirits, et. al.) in order to be able to perform their deeds without obstacles.
Brg
"Libertario" is not your typical randbot, but more something like a Chomskian Socialist Libertarian - Guido
Indeed, the US anti-statist right have stolen the word "libertarian", in a deceitful attempt to appropriate the idea of freedom and suggest no-one else values it. That's why I always put it in scare quotes when referring to these dishonest people.
Well, after reading those links, I have to say I am a bit ashamed. I did not know I was swiming so deep in kooks here. There is certainly very lip-service paid to religion outside the churches, unlike in the US.
Then again, as Insightful Ape said, gay marriage was legalized and the party that did it did not suffer for it. I guess that blog is below average.
Back in 1568 Pope Pius V forbade bull fighting in Spain as it was deemed sinful. He decreed that any one killed in a bull fight would not receive a Cristian burial. In response, the Spanish Crown conducted a poll of theologians on the ruling. Results of the poll proved that the Pope was indeed wrong.
Just one more update:
Thank you for voting!
Pésima 6% (329 votes)
Mala <1% (15 votes)
Antiliberal <1% (30 votes)
No se 1% (63 votes)
Buena 92% (4818 votes)
Total Votes: 5255
As it happens too often, this kind of sites is liable to backfiring.
Cheers,
FG
Currently, "Buena" has around 90% votes.
Gracias, amigos!
Now, there still is this other poll (http://www.elpais.com/encuestas/encuesta.html?id=11300) asking whether or not crucifixes should be removed from classrooms...
and 85% of the people say "NO". So, they shouldn't be removed?
Just voted, it's a pity I'm not in Barcelona while they're doing this. I'm glad us Catalan atheists are finally standing up and showing our colors.
As of 8:25 PST 90% Buena! Happy monkey everybody!
Well that poll is pretty well spanked now. Find it kind of funny actually.
-t
And for the next poll (in French, partly to carry on the European theme, and partly just because I can. Any native speakers, feel free to correct me):
Les bloggeurs doivent-ils savoir contruire des bons sondages?
A. Non - Ce sont les internets! Pas besoin de s'informer avant de poster.
Ach - it is, of course, "les blogueurs", hard g.
Note to self: Use preview function!
@ Fer, Zipi & Mike Lara:
Maybe it's time we started the Spanish branch of Pharyngula. Or at least some sort of delegation...
It seems that the National Catholics cannot handle being the tiny minority they are in Spain, now that there is no little dictator to force their religion down people's throat. So they have shut down the poll... Very telling...
BTW, tx PZ for paying attention to my country but here religion has stopped being a problem. It's now reduced to reasonable proportions. Just a cultural folkloric thing alongside bull fights, sevillanas and romerías. Enjoyable even by die-hard atheists. Come to Seville's holy week and I'll show you how to shout to the glory of the most beautiful "Virgen" of our city: "¡Macareeeeeena GUAPA!". As I do, you'll maybe shed some tears just like when I listen to some Jimi's riff in Voodoo Chile :-)
@João
Não deveria ser Ibérico em vez de Espanhol? ;-)
I'll handle Andalusia and Algarve :-P
Well, looks like they have disabled the vote, not counting my bueno. (maybe we spazzed the server)
I was vote 6666. Number of the Pharyngubeast.
Take a look at this:
http://www.uaar.it/news/2009/01/12/bus-atei-anche-a-genova/
It seems that atheist bus campaign is spreading in Italy too!
http://www.uaar.it/news/2009/01/12/bus-atei-anche-a-genova/
It seems that the atheist bus campaing is spreading through Italy too!
What poll are you guys reading?
I get
pesima 10%
mala <1%
buena 1%
excellente 88%
That's weird, I just went there and there was an 'excelente' option, which is beating the pants off all the rest.
It seems that the atheist bus campaing is spreading through Italy too: http://www.uaar.it/news/2009/01/12/bus-atei-anche-a-genova/
@ El Guerrero del Interfaz:
sim, poderia ser Ibérico com certeza. :)
Pero vivo en Valencia, así que me encargo yo del la zona de Levante... Alguién más se apunta?
Does the invitation for Holy Week in Seville extend to others or is it only for PZ?
//By the way, the slogan sounds much prettier in Spanish: Probablemente Dios no existe. Deja depreocuparte y disfruta la vida.//
PZ, is "de preocuparte", two words, "depreocuparte" is wrong.
@João
As an old "motard", I'm used to receive lots of guests. A while ago we had a little atheist meeting at the nearest Bulli. With some friends from around your place BTW. So yes, it's open to all pharyngulites and other "gentes de mal vivir" ;-) And by the Holy Week, and the Feria, of course, I'm always around here. My only "religious" holiday "de guardar" is Faro in July ;-)
And about Spanish pharyngulites, I'm sure the likes of Suzudo, Dubarri, Zapi and so on lurk often around here.
@João
As an old "motard", I'm used to receive lots of guests. A while ago we had a little atheist meeting at the nearest Bulli. With some friends from around your place BTW. So yes, it's open to all pharyngulites and other "gentes de mal vivir" ;-) And by the Holy Week, and the Feria, of course, I'm always around here. My only "religious" holiday "de guardar" is Faro in July ;-)
And about Spanish pharyngulites, I'm sure the likes of Suzudo, Dubarri, Zapi and so on lurk often around here.
To some extent, these bus campaigns are preaching to the converted. Most of the British, and Spanish(and lots of the Italians too) are already functional atheists. What would be cool is a bus campaign written in Arabic(also Turkish and Farsi), and run on buses in Paris, Amsterdam, Copenhagen, Germany, Scandinavia.
A Atheist Bus in India will be cool, something like "hey, eat the fuc..... hamburguer, the cow won't complain" or something like that
Knoche (#108):
An Atheist Bus in India would be cool, but I'm not sure about your slogan. It says to me that atheists are less concerned about respect for animals or the environmental impact of food - and as an atheist and Green I'm pretty sure this is not true. I certainly can't see a positive correlation between a country's religiosity and its animal welfare standards.
andyo (#61):
I suspect the writer of that opinion piece didn't stop to find out why the Atheist Bus campaign chose its slogan (i.e. as a reassuring response to religious ads which linked to a website telling non-Christians that they would burn in hell forever), and made the unwarranted assumption that this slogan encapsulates the whole philosophy of atheism. If God really existed, he would long ago have smitten such people for worshipping straw men!
86% - iBuena buena!
Just a question of curiosity, why should atheists care what anyone else believes? Atheists have no holidays, no philosophy not history or culture. Atheists are boring and antithetical to culture.
I admit that the Religious bozos have made themselves a target by getting involved with politics, but why attack Christmas? Why not run your little ads for Muslim, Jewish or the major holidays of other religions? Why not run your ads during a non-religious month, like July?
You people who would throw money into the pot to put up ads like this are scumbags.
Johnnyb,
Isn't it obvious? We must all coexist in society, and what people believe influences their actions. When the beliefs are delusional, they act irrationally.
In short, believers affect us, and not for the better. That's why we care.
Of all the drivel from xians, all through crackergate, this complaint (and its variants) has been the most pathetic.
Here, here, Eddie! I conpletely agree. Johnnyb, Since (most) humans are self-contained living units, there's really no reason for us to interact at all. Why don't all become hermits, move to a tiny cabin in Montana, with a lifetime supply of peanut butter? Or maybe you'd prefer powdered milk and melba toast.
@ Guerrero del Interfaz:
I was only teasing you about the invitation to Seville but thanks anyway.
What I'd really like to know is if you have a webpage or an Association of some kind where those events are promoted. We sure need to get organized in some way.
<facepalm> Moooooron. Atheists have no holidays, philosophy, history or culture in common with each other.
It was nice to see the number reach 88% yesterday. The numbers were reset today to put it back at 5%. *sigh*
Typical.
Right now 'Buena' (14%) is at the top of the list and Pesina (83%) the bottom, the reverse of how it's shown in PZ's post. Hmmm. *is suspicious*
OhWell #117, did they put everything back to zero?
They've changed the poll, they've made another one, it seems the people behind it have their own methods for winning the battle. Why don't we try to vote again for Buena?? I've already done it
As I said in a previous comment, whatever they do to rig the vote, the "ultras" (that is the fundies) are a dwindling tiny minority here in Spain. Even in their own "side". The most popular and respected catholic authority is Monseñor Amigo, precisely the most "liberal" (which is like speaking of the most "sportive" Harley...) Pope candidate, the one who would have been elected if the Vatican theocracy has been a democracy. At least here in Spain...
@João
I'm a lonesome cowboy. More than 40 years with my ass on a bike and never in a MC. And Spain is mostly like me. That's one of the reason why I live here :-) (I'm an immigrant too). I get involved in issues but usually don't get in clubs. Although I'm a Bright.
But there are lots of organized sites like sindioses.org, digital.el-esceptico.org, cyberateos.org or personal like elaverno.net, from an agnostic more combative than most atheists. I evolved (Lamarck-wise) in FIDO and Usenet is my natural environment. Imagine, years of lurking here before posting... But I like Pharyngula because it feels like a blend of a newsgroup and biker bar with a loudmouthed and wise boss picking on the news ;-)
Gracias Guerrero. I'll take a look at those pages. Maybe we'll meet someday in Seville, or in Valencia if you ever stop by...