Pharyngula

The Great Desecration

It is finished.

I wonder how many of our Catholic friends have heard of the Fourth Lateran Council of 1215? This is the event where many of their important dogmas were codified, including the ideas of Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, that the Eucharist was the sacrament that only properly ordained priests of the Catholic church could give, and that the Jews were a pariah people, who could hold no public office, had to pay a special Jew tax for their right to exist, and were required to wear special clothing to distinguish them from Christians. The yellow badge marking the Juden was not an invention of the Nazis, but a decree by faithful Catholics in the Middle Ages. That’s an interesting juxtaposition, that a symbol of Christian exceptionalism was formalized at the same time that they formally decreed the Jews to be inferior, and a target of hatred.

That combination was useful, too. Declare something cheap, disposable, and common to be imbued with magic by the words of a priest, and the trivial becomes a powerful token to inflame the mob — why, all you have to do is declare a bit of bread to be the most powerful and desirable object in the world, and even if it isn’t, you can pretend that the evil other is scheming to deprive the faithful of it. Now you could invent stories of Jews and witches taking the communion host to torture, to make Jesus suffer even more, and good Catholics would of course rise in horror to defend their salvation. None of the stories were true, of course — Jews and infidels see no power at all in those little crackers, and the idea that they were obsessing over obtaining a non-sacred, powerless, pointless relic is ludicrous — but heck, it’s a cheap excuse to make accusations illustrated by cheesy woodcuts of hook-nosed Jews hammering nails into communion wafers and lurid tales of blood-spurting crackers and hosts that pulsed like and beating heart, and thereby providing a pretext to encourage massacres.

The first recorded accusation was made in 1243 at Berlitz, near Berlin. As a consequence all the Jews of Berlitz were burned on the spot, which was subsequently called Judenberg. Another famous case that took place in 1290, in Paris, was commemorated in the Church of the Rue des Billettes and in a local confraternity. In 1370 in Brussels, the charge of host desecration, long celebrated in a special fest and depicted in artistic relics in the Church of St. Gudule, led to the extermination of the Jews of the city. The case of 1337, at Deggendorf, still celebrated locally as “Deggendorf Gnad”, led to a series of massacres across the region. In 1510, at Knoblauch, near Berlin, 38 Jews were executed and more expelled from Brandenburg. The alleged host desecration in 1410, at Segovia, was said to have brought about an earthquake, and as a result, the local synagogue was confiscated and leading Jews were executed; the event continues to be celebrated as a local feast of Corpus Christi. Similar accusations, resulting in extensive persecution of Jews, were brought forward in 1294, at Laa, Austria; 1298, at Röttingen, near Würzburg, and at Korneuburg, near Vienna; 1299, at Ratisbon; 1306, at St. Pölten; 1325, at Cracow; 1330, at Güstrow; 1338, at Pulkau; 1388, at Prague; 1399, at Posen; 1401, at Glogau; 1420, at Ems; 1453, at Breslau; 1478, at Passau; 1492, at Sternberg, in Mecklenburg-Schwerin; 1514, at Mittelberg, in Alsace; 1558, at Sochaczew, in Poland. The last Jew burned for stealing a host died in 1631, according to Jacques Basnage, quoting from Manasseh b. Israel. Casimir IV. of Poland (1447).

That is the true power of the cracker, this silly symbol of superstition. Fortunately, Catholicism has mellowed with age — the last time a Catholic nation rose up to slaughter its non-Christian citizenry was a whole 70 years ago, after all — but the sentiment still lingers. Catholicism has been actively poisoning the minds of its practitioners with the most amazing bullshit for years, and until recently, I had no idea that a significant number of people actually believed this nonsense, or that the hatred was still simmering there, waiting for an opportunity to rise up in misplaced defense of absurdity.

All of the regular readers have seen it — thousands of mindless comments by Catholics, demanding that no harm come to a cracker. My email is melting down with swarms of insults, threats, pleas, and promises of prayers because I threatened to violate one of their holy crackers. In my years of loud and often inflammatory blogging, it is the most impressive demonstration of mass lunacy I have ever seen.

Mark Sutton is representative of the majority of my email. No threats, at least, but instead he simply takes for granted an astonishing piece of insanity.

Professor Myers,

I was saddened to hear of your plans to harm our Lord Jesus Christ.

It obviously isn’t the first time and it won’t be the last.

I know you do not believe, but what if it truly is Jesus that you are attempting to hurt?

You are in my prayers.

You would not believe how many people are writing to me, insisting that these horrible little crackers (they look like flattened bits of styrofoam) are literally pieces of their god, and that this omnipotent being who created the universe can actually be seriously harmed by some third-rate liberal intellectual at a third-rate university (the diminution of my vast powers is also a common theme).

Jim Nicholson cranks up the crazy even more. Not many accused me of being a freemason — I’ve got lots that call me a Jew, which is illuminating given the history of this issue — and I cringe at the thought of a circumcised heart. But yeah, this kind of angry rant is fairly common, too.

You must be the devil himself as even he knows the power in the Holy Eucharist (don’t you dare disparage the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ by calling Him Who died for you a cracker!). You must be a freemason, or just a very sick man who needs healing and believe me, I will pray for your conversion. Pray you live to see that day so you can ask Him to forgive you and your uncircumcised heart. Just the mere thought of desecrating the Holy Eucharist is enough to get one into hell, but, maybe that is, for now, the horrible place you are aiming for. I dare you to read about Our Lady of Fatima and the accounts of hell as the three children saw, then, maybe you will change you sick mind. God forgive you. However, it was great that you got many people praying for your conversion since you showed the world how sick you are, and maybe God will convert your hard heart. Pity you. From a lay evangelist who prays for you and the rest of this sick world of secular humanists.

Another common theme has been the attempt to turn away the desecration of a Catholic symbol into the desecration of an Islamic symbol. Obviously, it’s not desecration they find disagreeable — it’s the idea that someone would offend their weird sectarian sensibilities. Here’s one from Jack Isaacks that fits the mold.

Dear Professor Meyers,

If you REALLY want to do a courageous, revolutionary act, defecate publicly on a copy of the Quran.

Or do you have the cojones?

Christians won’t attack you for desecrating a host, but will those wonderful cuddly peace-loving Muslims be as forbearing if you used their book for a toilet?

Well, how brave are you?

Yeah, right. Catholics won’t attack me, but Muslims will. Never mind that the Catholic League demands that I be fired, thousands of Catholics write to me demanding I be kicked out of the university immediately, and that they send me death threats, both the explicit kind and the vaguely menacing kind. Let’s not forget Webster Cook, who started this all by simply walking back to his seat with a cracker, and now faces censure and possible expulsion from his university. Oh, those Catholics sure are forbearing and tolerant.

And since I mentioned yesterday that I was taking my oldest son to the movies, these good Catholics have leapt to the opportunity. Since I’m not demonstrating any fear over their threats against me, well hey, let’s try a new target! KJ Atkins of Bellarmine University thinks cowardly warnings against my family might be effective.

You fool, the vengeance for your sacrilege will not be . exhausted against you, but it will be carried out on your child. Wait and see.

Oh, I’m sorry, KJ. I’m only impressed by significant material concerns, and yours and other slanders against my family (I’m looking at you, Miki Tracy, the despicable person who thinks making up lies about my father might be persuasive) are not going to convince me of anything other than that religion breeds the most disgustingly vile haters in our country, and that Catholicism fits right in with the rest. I will note, however, that since Bill Donohue tried to get CAIR to join him in his crusade, I have gotten no email from outraged Muslims, over a span of time in which I’ve received thousands of Catholic hate mail messages.

If you want to see the deep danger of religion, you have to read this comment from Isaac.

As a Christian it is an insult for anyone to call my beliefs stupid shit. I have respected every religion and every idea for years.

Ah, what a beautiful illustration of the complete open mind — utterly undiscriminating, lacking any criteria for acceptance, simply blissfully and uncritically according every idea his full respect. Although, of course, it’s also a lie: Isaac does not regard every idea as equally deserving, since he clearly considers the atheist idea that the sacraments of his faith are empty foolishness to be an outrage. Rather, what he loves is the idea that everyone else must respect his beliefs, no matter what they are, and that any disagreement is an insult. This is exactly the kind of uncritical, unskeptical, nonjudgmental idiocy all religions seek to promulgate, because they all know that if we tore off the blinders of tradition and artificiality and mindless etiquette, we’d see right through their lies. Respect every idea! Especially mine! And if you find the idea that this cracker is a god stupid, why, you must be disrespectful and no gentleman!

For even deeper inanity, let’s not forget the Catholic blogs! We’re talking some serious derangement there: look at Mark Shea’s reaction.

I won’t mince words. Myers is an evil man. And as evil men, particularly evil intellectuals, tend to be, he is also a mad man as are most of his acolytes and followers.

Myers and Co. are enmeshed in these lies because they have chosen evil. It is evil–archetypally evil–to desecrate the Eucharist. It’s the sort of stuff archetypal bad guys in the movies do. It’s completely unnecessary gratuitous evil.

To the Mark Shea’s of the world, I would say…it’s just a cracker.

I think if I were truly evil, I would have to demand that all of my acolytes be celibate, but would turn a blind eye to any sexual depravities they might commit. If I wanted to be an evil hypocrite, I’d drape myself in expensive jeweled robes and live in an ornate palace while telling all my followers that poverty is a virtue. If I wanted to commit world-class evil, I’d undermine efforts at family planning by the poor, especially if I could simultaneously enable the spread of deadly diseases. And if I wanted to be so evil that I would commit a devastating crime against the whole of the human race, twisting the minds of children into ignorance and hatred, I would be promoting the indoctrination of religion in children’s upbringing, and fomenting hatred against anyone who dared speak out in defiance.

I’m sorry to say that I only aspire to be a teeny-tiny bit evil, and my target is a handful of virtually inedible crackers in my possession. It’s not much, and all I can say in my defense is…it’s a start. A very small start. I’m going to need lots and lots of people to rise up and follow suit, subjecting old, dishonest institutions of hardened dogma to our chief weapon of ridicule and deris…our two weapons of ridicule, derision and laughter…no, three weapons of ridicule, derision, laughter, and skeptici…oh, never mind. You know what I mean. Get to work.

OK, time for the anticlimax. I know some of you have proposed intricate plans for how to do horrible things to these crackers, but I repeat…it’s just a cracker. I wasn’t going to make any major investment of time, money, or effort in treating these dabs of unpleasantness as they deserve, because all they deserve is casual disposal. However, inspired by an old woodcut of Jews stabbing the host, I thought of a simple, quick thing to do: I pierced it with a rusty nail (I hope Jesus’s tetanus shots are up to date). And then I simply threw it in the trash, followed by the classic, decorative items of trash cans everywhere, old coffeegrounds and a banana peel. My apologies to those who hoped for more, but the worst I can do is show my unconcerned contempt.

i-257338cb344684ea469cb3ee02346036-desecrated.jpg

By the way, I didn’t want to single out just the cracker, so I nailed it to a few ripped-out pages from the Qur’an and The God Delusion. They are just paper. Nothing must be held sacred. Question everything. God is not great, Jesus is not your lord, you are not disciples of any charismatic prophet. You are all human beings who must make your way through your life by thinking and learning, and you have the job of advancing humanity’s knowledge by winnowing out the errors of past generations and finding deeper understanding of reality. You will not find wisdom in rituals and sacraments and dogma, which build only self-satisfied ignorance, but you can find truth by looking at your world with fresh eyes and a questioning mind.

Comments

  1. #1 Maria
    July 24, 2008

    May God have mercy on your soul.

  2. #2 H.H.
    July 24, 2008

    It is done.

  3. #3 FormerMilitary
    July 24, 2008

    Well done.

  4. #4 Tucker
    July 24, 2008

    Well this is going to be epic.

  5. #5 Anthony
    July 24, 2008

    PZ: My gin and tonic will be hoisted up in your name tonight.

  6. #6 JSorrell
    July 24, 2008

    Well, if you thought the deluge of email was bad now! :)

    Thanks for pointing out that nothing should be held sacred.

  7. #7 Blake Stacey
    July 24, 2008

    Requiescat in pace, Crustum Christi.

  8. #8 Brian
    July 24, 2008

    Well said PZ. Wish I could think of something more to add.

    Brian

  9. #9 Deepsix
    July 24, 2008

    Let the games begin!!

  10. #10 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    Hahah… I hope Seed’s servers are ready for the influx of crazy that this post will bring.

  11. #11 Mystic Olly
    July 24, 2008

    And yet I fail to see the remains of last nights spaghetti bolognese. Do you cower in fear of His Noodley Appendage?

    I think we should be told . . .

  12. #12 AJ Milne
    July 24, 2008

    Nothing must be held sacred. Question everything.

    Very nice. This did not disappoint.

    A response to a post in a previous thread, carried forward (since, y’know, I’m sure this’ll be going on for a bit, anyway)…

    I’ve been thinking about this for awhile now. I originally agreed with those saying that PZ is needlessly provoking the religious, but their batshit crazy responses tell me it isn’t so needless.

    Yep. Or sorta. I’d never have gone as far as ‘needlessly provoking’, but I sure did see it as pretty trivial, initially.

    And I still do. But only in the one sense. More precisely, I was never much for or agin’ it, initially. I mean, as I understood it, it started out as a snarky (and, in context, entirely appropriately snarky) riposte to the sheer nuttiness of what happened at UCF anyway. I don’t think any of us even figure he even meant it terribly seriously, at first. I mean, seriously, why would anyone bother, either way? And I think if he’d actually done it two weeks ago, my reaction woulda been: oh, okay… an odd thing to do… and… ummm… why, seriously? I’m still trying to wrap my head ’round the fact that the folk taking Donohue’s bait haven’t thought about that, more. I mean honestly, do you really think Donohue even thought PZ meant it that seriously? Or that Donohue even cared if he did? His reaction was pure political opportunism. Somethin’ he figured he could make some hay with.

    But making that hay, it leads places, whether he and his followers like it or not. And the sheer lunacy of those objecting shifts things, oddly. I mean, you say you’re going to do something that should be so trivially silly, and all of a sudden, there’s this windbag demagogue getting all red-faced, going on and on about what a horror this is, working on whipping up the outrage, and oh my, but people are actually falling for it. And there are people trying to get people fired, and the trolls are winding up and sockpuppeting the hell out of this place, there’s nuts making threats and getting their wife fired, and you get to thinking: well, y’know, yeah, okay, maybe you should do that cracker thing. Sure it’s silly, sure it’s trivial, but, strangely enough, it does prove a modestly significant point, in this now truly bizarre context. Which is that pushy, arrogant gasbags like Donohue and the loud but not terribly bright folk he’s managed to mobilize do not get to call the shots–not here, not anywhere. They don’t get to demand anything, let alone respect, from anyone else, not with an attitude like that. Death threats, huh? Demands folk be fired, huh? Endless attempts, in fact, to demand punishment and suffering for what in the end is mere expression of an opinion they don’t happen to like–and yes, folks, not that it’s even entirely relevant, but I’m pretty sure that’s exactly what it is, all their mumbo jumbo and handwaving about mystical rites and transubtantiation notwithstanding. Same as it’s always been, same old excuse for any extremism they might want it to justify.

    And this is how they presume to command ‘respect’, is it? And is this to be the way of things: the gasbags who threaten most and who scream ‘bigotry’ loudest gets to say what is and what is acceptable mockery of their particular irrationality of choice? What next, will we begin prosecuting blasphemy in the west again, jail those who dare to fail to show proper respect for the currently dominant faith?

    So, okay, if they want to be like that about it, I’m with him all the way. And the cracker’s toast. Sure it might still seem sorta a silly thing to do, on the face of it. But it’s a madness with a certain method after all.

    (And the banana peel sure is a nice touch.)

  13. #13 Kobra
    July 24, 2008

    The secret addition was a few papers from the God Delusion?

    Very appropriate! I say this without an ounce of sarcasm, by the way.

  14. #14 clinteas
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,you should eat your bananas before they turn brown.

  15. #15 drake33
    July 24, 2008

    +1 to PZ Myers.

  16. #16 Katharine
    July 24, 2008

    Well said, PZ.

  17. #17 Anne Nonymous
    July 24, 2008

    I can’t wait to hear what Richard Dawkins thinks of this. :)

    Also, don’t you still have a whole bunch of other crackers? What’re you gonna do with them?

  18. #18 Analiese
    July 24, 2008

    Shit, pz, I hope you’ve got a lid on that garbage lest the cracker rise again! Great post. Ahhhhh, men….

  19. #19 Alan
    July 24, 2008

    May the Hand of God bless you as you deserve.

  20. #20 Jim RL
    July 24, 2008

    I don’t think anything is done at this point. I think the shitstorm is just about to start. You should really have a composting bin for all of that organic matter. Ashes to ashes and all that.

  21. #21 Deepsix
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, and PZ, don’t close this thread. Let’s see just how high this sucker will go.

  22. #22 Steve
    July 24, 2008

    Nothing Sacred – reminds me of a Zen story…Bodhidharma telling the pissed off Emperor of China that “Nothing is holy”… Then there is the old:”If you meet the Buddha, Kill him” Tossing a wooden Buddha on the fire etc… all to prove that nothing should be held above “reality”. Why can’t we have more “religions” like that? Or better yet, none at all…

  23. #23 jb
    July 24, 2008

    You don’t compost your banana peels and coffee grounds? You ARE evil…..

  24. #24 Norman Doering
    July 24, 2008

    Now we wait for the lying press release from Bill Donohue and the deranged Catholic hordes that follow.

    Good work, PZ. You used it to make a good point: No cheap, little material object should be considered sacred. Adding the pages from the “God Delusion” was a good move.

  25. #25 Ranson
    July 24, 2008

    Hmm. No spurting blood? Maybe the fruit peel will lose it’s browning in a spontaneous healing miracle.

  26. #26 Kobra
    July 24, 2008

    http://www.kobrascorner.com/opine/nothing-is-sacred.php

    I wrote this the other day, and because of this I greatly approve of including pages of The God Delusion. I’m sure even Prof. Dawkins will approve of the gesture (especially since PZ has already read it and there’s no point in keeping it intact, right?).

  27. #27 Luke O'Dell
    July 24, 2008

    The God Delusion? I was on the right lines with my Origin of Species prediction, then. Nice job, PZ.

  28. #28 TripMaster Monkey
    July 24, 2008

    Nice to see that you threw in some pages from The God Delusion. I know it’s just a book, like the Qur’an, but it’s still an excellent way to demonstrate that your goal is to show that nothing is, or should be, “sacred”, and not simply to piss off some extremists (although I’m sure they’ll find a way to get worked up just the same).

  29. #29 The Science Pundit
    July 24, 2008

    The page from The God Delusion proves to us that you are not a loyal member of the Church of Dawkinity! I immediately move for your excommunication!!!

  30. #30 Deepsix
    July 24, 2008

    Cheeses Christ, PZ, you’ve already bogged down the server.

  31. #31 Norman Doering
    July 24, 2008

    Now we wait for the lying press release from Bill Donohue and the deranged Catholic hordes that follow.

    Good work, PZ. You used it to make a good point: No cheap, little material object should be considered sacred. Adding the pages from the “God Delusion” was a good move.

  32. #32 PeteC
    July 24, 2008

    Well done; the “it is finished” is a nice touch too.
    But.. don’t they have recycling in Morris? Paper and food waste in the trash? That’s sacrilege here in the Bay Area…

  33. #33 MartinDH
    July 24, 2008

    Hopefully after the howls of outrage from the godbots subside we’ll see no more fourteen hundred reply threads!

    Anyway, well done PZ…the picture just shows it’s a “fracking” nailed cracker and some paper.

    oh, and Maria (#1): There are no gods to have mercy on non-existent souls. Just thought you might like to know as you seem to be stuck in la-la land.

    Martin

  34. #34 Rich Stage
    July 24, 2008

    Great job, PZ. I was worried that you might get carried away, but you have done exactly what was needed to be done.

  35. #35 Steve
    July 24, 2008

    Brillant PZ. Loved every word of it. You have my support.

  36. #36 SC
    July 24, 2008

    Bellarmine University

    How fitting.

  37. #37 Draconiz
    July 24, 2008

    +1 to PZ!

  38. #38 MartinDH
    July 24, 2008

    Hopefully after the howls of outrage from the godbots subside we’ll see no more fourteen hundred reply threads!

    Anyway, well done PZ…the picture just shows it’s a “fracking” nailed cracker and some paper.

    oh, and Maria (#1): There are no gods to have mercy on non-existent souls. Just thought you might like to know as you seem to be stuck in la-la land.

    Martin

  39. #39 TG
    July 24, 2008

    It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host? I think it is nothing more than an attention-getting stunt for noteriety. Weak.

  40. #40 Lee Brimmicombe-Wood
    July 24, 2008

    We wait with bated breath to discover what trepid outrage the god-botherers will cast down upon you.

    What a hollow god they serve! How delicious a treatment of their sacred relics!

  41. #41 Potter
    July 24, 2008

    You, sir, handled this perfectly! Bravo!!

  42. #42 David Wegehaupt
    July 24, 2008

    Well done… I’m glad this ordeal is over

    *ignores the following 2000 comments about the damn cracker*

  43. #43 Robin
    July 24, 2008

    Brilliant. This is the first blog post I have literally applauded.

  44. #44 freelunch
    July 24, 2008

    KJ Atkins of Bellarmine University thinks cowardly warnings against my family might be effective.

    I wonder whether that Louisville college ever considered calling itself Torquemada University. Bellarmine would be unknown except for his treatment of Galileo. Torquemada was famous.

  45. #45 Jim RL
    July 24, 2008

    TG, why do you doubt it is a consecrated host? Do you doubt his ability to get one? Do you doubt his willingness to desecrate one? You’re grasping at straws.

  46. #46 Hessenroots
    July 24, 2008

    And it is done. Couple thousand more comments and the troll-fest will come to a close.

    I’m quite sure it’s unintentional but the banana peel (you know, the atheists worst nightmare!) is a wonderful bit of irony to top it off. ;P

  47. #47 mk
    July 24, 2008

    The God Delusion, too. Brilliant!

  48. #48 dave
    July 24, 2008

    Yay! Splendidly anticlimactic, nicely judged. Just a bit unsure about the rusty nail, a hint of Voodoo tetanus going on there. Could be uncomfortable for those who believe in magic….

    And sad to see the desecration of books, which are all special, but fair’s fair.

  49. #49 Dylan Dog
    July 24, 2008

    Great article PZ!

  50. #50 AndrewG
    July 24, 2008

    Thank you PZ for posting this, it is needed.

    Faith inebriated, lunatics, ridiculed and mocked me as a teenager for daring to question God’ existence. For several years they wasted my time and forced me to ingest prodigious fables of super heroes. I look forward to the response or rather the maunderings, of His Excellence, the CEO of the Roman Catholic Church when this news reaches him. His mental gymnastics is a treat and I have little doubt that he and his lieutenants will have no difficulty in further embarrassing themselves in the eyes of the civilized world.

    Faithaholics have enjoyed power far too long and have abused it repeatedly yet they continue to demand respect. Fuck their feelings and fuck their intellectually lazy minds. I celebrate this occasion with all sane people around the planet. Screw all gods especially the sketsophrenic trio, Jesus, his Daddy and Casper from the Dutch Reformed Church in South Africa.

    Peace everyone, please. Man created God and no amount of violence will change that.

    Andrew

  51. #51 Anne Nonymous
    July 24, 2008

    I wonder if PZ’s gonna be woken up in the middle of the night by the sound of some Catholic digging through his trash trying to “rescue” the cracker.

    Seriously, this is awesome entertainment.

  52. #52 Reginald Selkirk
    July 24, 2008

    I wonder how many of our Catholic friends have heard of the Fourth Lateran Council of 1215?

    That Darwin and his time machine; always causing trouble.

  53. #53 Josh West
    July 24, 2008

    #39 It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host? I think it is nothing more than an attention-getting stunt for noteriety. Weak.

    That’s pretty much the point. ‘Consecration’ is meaningless drivel. Not sacred.

    Bravo PZ, nice ending to this mess.

  54. #54 freelunch
    July 24, 2008

    KJ Atkins of Bellarmine University thinks cowardly warnings against my family might be effective.

    I wonder whether that Louisville college ever considered calling itself Torquemada University. Bellarmine would be unknown except for his treatment of Galileo. Torquemada was famous.

  55. #55 Zeno
    July 24, 2008

    Dawkins will undoubtedly smite you in his terrible wrath!

    But thank God that’s over!

    (I don’t really mean the “thank God” part, of course. It’s just an expression.)

  56. #56 Matt Penfold
    July 24, 2008

    Oh brilliant. Simply brilliant.

    The God Delusional is a nice touch. The only thing I might have added is a page from Origins.

  57. #57 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Good going! Justice has been done. The text’s a bit too long for me to read right now so I’ll be sure to read it later in depth!!! I skimmed through it and saw the mighty picture.

    Unfortunately I’m sad you didn’t try to make a cross out of popsicle sticks. Now THAT would’ve been funny.

    Wait uh… w…what’s the brown stuff? O_o

    …coffee? PHEW

  58. #58 Paul W.
    July 24, 2008

    It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host?

    I’m sure that will be forthcoming, just as soon as somebody provides PZ with evidence that his consecrated host was transubstantiated into the Body of the Living God.

    Why does one matter without the other?

  59. #59 Richard Wolford
    July 24, 2008

    Beautiful, and point well taken. I would have longed for some pages of On the Origins of Species in there as well, but The God Delusion was likely more fitting, so again, beautiful.

  60. #60 Quinn Martindale
    July 24, 2008

    Meh…

  61. #61 Greta Christina
    July 24, 2008

    It is finished.

    Father, into Your hands I commend my crumbs.

    And I never again want to hear about sophisticated modern theology, and how nobody takes that magical- thinking stuff seriously anymore.

  62. #62 E.V.
    July 24, 2008

    Oh no, the hand-wringing has begun.

  63. #63 GeoffI
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    I hope you saved that piece of art you have created. You could sell it on eBay and give the money to a pro-science charity.

  64. #64 Brian W.
    July 24, 2008

    ripping a few pages out of those books is ok, as long as the aren’t completely ruined. I hate to see ANY book destroyed.

  65. #65 Guido
    July 24, 2008

    Great.
    Excellent.
    Now, all they have to do is pray. Right? The Lord listens to them

    Right?

    Come on, people, stop writing e-mails. Have TRUE faith.

  66. #66 bad Jim
    July 24, 2008

    Holey crackers!

  67. #67 TG
    July 24, 2008

    “TG, why do you doubt it is a consecrated host? Do you doubt his ability to get one? Do you doubt his willingness to desecrate one? You’re grasping at straws.”

    I am a man of science. I want proof, not claims based on authority.

  68. #68 SteadyEddy
    July 24, 2008

    Excellent write-up as always PZ! There are some un-rational people who might accuse you of copying something that has already been done, but I can think of nothing more fitting than to nail that ort of stale tasteless bread to some processed wood fiber. Well done PZ!

  69. #69 F. Jardim
    July 24, 2008

    Amazing writing in your prelude to the main event. A+ as far as I am concerned.

    As for the festivities themselves, I liked the casual utilitarianism of the desecration. Adding a page from The god Delusion was also thoughtful and helps showing that the truly unbiased, rational mind doesn’t revere icons, even if their meaning agrees with their own conclusions. I think a page from ‘Origin of the Species’ would have been FAr more effective in rubbing on the faces of fundies how we do not hold Evolution or science as a religion.

  70. #70 Physicalist
    July 24, 2008

    He desecrated The God Delusion??? Forget excommunication; BURN HIM!!!!!

  71. #71 Jon
    July 24, 2008

    Nice touch there with the God Delusion. That should sufficiently perplex them.

    It won’t, of course.

  72. #72 Rob
    July 24, 2008

    @TG: I seem to recall others asking how to prove it’s consecrated, and you refuse to say how.

    PZ, I’m a little disappointed in what you did. I think you gave too much consideration. IMHO, you should’ve forgone the nail and just tossed it all in the garbage.

  73. #73 Rich Stage
    July 24, 2008

    It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host? I think it is nothing more than an attention-getting stunt for noteriety(sic). Weak.

    Can’t you hear the little jeebus cracker screaming?

    That’s the giveaway there, innit?

  74. #74 Josh West
    July 24, 2008

    #39 It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host? I think it is nothing more than an attention-getting stunt for noteriety. Weak.

    That’s pretty much the point. ‘Consecration’ is meaningless drivel. Not sacred.

    Bravo PZ, nice ending to this mess.

  75. #75 TripMaster Monkey
    July 24, 2008

    TG sez:

    It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host? I think it is nothing more than an attention-getting stunt for noteriety. Weak.

    Tell you what, TG. If you can pick a consecrated host out of a lineup of unconsecrated ones, I’ll concede that your question is relevant, and I’ll ask PZ to provide proof of consecration. Sound fair?

  76. #76 Zeno
    July 24, 2008

    Dawkins will undoubtedly smite you in his terrible wrath!

    But thank God that’s over!

    (I don’t really mean the “thank God” part, of course. It’s just an expression.)

  77. #77 Quinn Martindale
    July 24, 2008

    It’s weird, but the destroying of books disturbs me regardless of their sacred status.

  78. #78 Milo Johnson
    July 24, 2008

    Now if we could just make the rest of the religious crackers in the country go away…

  79. #79 Philboid
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, you nailed it.

  80. #80 BluesBassist
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo! Not bad for a “third rate” intellectual.

  81. #81 Kawa
    July 24, 2008

    * applauds *

  82. #82 Shygetz
    July 24, 2008

    While it does kinda bother me that you destroyed two perfectly servicable books instead of giving them to people who could read them (not sacreligious, just not cool) I found the conclusion (if it truly is such) to be suitably anti-climactic, which is exactly what the disposal of a cracker should be.

  83. #83 MartinDH
    July 24, 2008

    TG #39:

    Can’t you see the blood and ichor oozing from the stabbed host?

    Wait…

    That’s because there’s no difference between a fracking cracker and a consecrated host. (mumble mumble Hoc est corpus christi mumble mumble [nice ass on that choirboy] mumble mumble)

    Why don’t you use your amazing christo-powers to discern the cracker’s consecrated nature?

    Martin

  84. #84 John C. Randolph
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    This is one of the finer essays you’ve written. Thanks for the history lesson, and well done.

    -jcr

  85. #85 Slen
    July 24, 2008

    stupid simple cracker

    May is decompose like the trash it is.

  86. #86 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    …Wait a sec guys. Where’s the blood?! I thought they said there was a guy that had a flood of blood, and that jews had stains of blood coming out of there! HEY!

    Could it be that it’s… it’s just a tasteless sheet of paper? Oh no.

  87. #87 Anne Nonymous
    July 24, 2008

    I wonder if PZ’s gonna be woken up in the middle of the night by the sound of some Catholic digging through his trash trying to “rescue” the cracker.

    Seriously, this is awesome entertainment.

  88. #88 Jack of Knives
    July 24, 2008

    The picture makes it a bit grittier than it should seem, but…

    I liked the conclusion best. It’s a good take home message.

  89. #89 God
    July 24, 2008

    God damn it, PZ. Now I have to start the universe all over again.

  90. #90 Chris
    July 24, 2008

    Nice post. I really liked your last paragraph.

  91. #91 blf
    July 24, 2008

    I suspect Teh Big Oxidized Spike is deeply offended at this disgraceful treatment of a rusty nail, and its followers will send a congregration of angry screws after you. Pay attention as to whether they are normal, Phillips, Robinson, of other types of screws, this is a matter of great division in Spikemythical, with much flaking of the rust.

  92. #92 Jesus, called Christ
    July 24, 2008

    As the dead Jew that Catholics claim to worship, I would just like to say that I entirely approve.

  93. #93 Slinky
    July 24, 2008

    Excellent, i loved the inclusion of the god delusion pages, i think they helped prove a point.

  94. #94 Kobra
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, you have a typo!

    All of the regular readers have seen it — thousands of midnless comments by Catholics, demanding that no harm come to a cracker.

  95. #95 John
    July 24, 2008

    GULP – The God Delusion…in the trash?!

    You my friend, have Large Brass Balls.
    You may need a wheelbarrow to carry those in…
    (Yes – a Bill Hicks reference)

    Wow.
    I stand here shaken (not stirred)

    Bravo, PZ, Bravo!

  96. #96 F. Jardim
    July 24, 2008

    Amazing writing in your prelude to the main event. A+ as far as I am concerned.

    As for the festivities themselves, I liked the casual utilitarianism of the desecration. Adding a page from The god Delusion was also thoughtful and helps showing that the truly unbiased, rational mind doesn’t revere icons, even if their meaning agrees with their own conclusions. I think a page from ‘Origin of the Species’ would have been FAr more effective in rubbing on the faces of fundies how we do not hold Evolution or science as a religion.

  97. #97 Patricia
    July 24, 2008

    Standing ovation!
    Bravo PZ! Bravo!

  98. #98 Jesse
    July 24, 2008

    Good blog. The preamble was perfect.

    I wouldn’t have bothered with the nail, although the page of the God Delusion was a nice touch. Unconcerned throwing out with the trash. Perfect.

    Good luck wading through the hate mail.

  99. #99 S. Fisher
    July 24, 2008

    Brace yourself PZ. I’ve been reading your blog for several years (since sometime in ’05) and this seems to be some sort of culminating event. I think you’ve definetly got the attention of the worlds Godbotherers now. It’s been fun, and will continue to be fun to watch your antics. Changing the world one post at a time.

  100. #100 Matt Penfold
    July 24, 2008

    TG,

    Surely Catholics will be able to tell if the wafer is consecrated or not. In fact this whole thing has been about just that claim, that there is a difference. Well if there is, Catholics presumably will be able to tell. After all if that wafer really is the body of Christ it will not be the same as just an ordinary wafer.

    So come Catholics, tell us. Is that wafer consecrated or not ?

  101. #101 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    Crucified again ;)

    What’s this thread (and/or follow-ups) going to, 5000 comments?

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  102. #102 Michael Hogan
    July 24, 2008

    I’m an atheist and think religious beliefs are stupid but I wish you hadn’t done this. It will just inflame them. It would have been better to do nothing and let their own intolerant words condemn them. The Catholics have revealed their true nature.

    Love your web site otherwise.

  103. #103 Milo Johnson
    July 24, 2008

    Now if we could just make the rest of the religious crackers in the country go away…

  104. #104 bullfighter
    July 24, 2008

    I hope your trash is picked up before the third day. I wouldn’t want to have a holey cracker rise from my trash can and walk around my house.

  105. #105 Kobra
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, you have a typo!

    All of the regular readers have seen it — thousands of midnless comments by Catholics, demanding that no harm come to a cracker.

  106. #106 Vivek
    July 24, 2008

    The God Delusion is about what we don’t believe; the Eucharist and the Koran are symbols of what other people do believe. I would’ve preferred a genuine work of science to be among the desecratees.

    Vivek

  107. #107 God
    July 24, 2008

    God damn it, PZ. Now I have to start the universe all over again.

  108. #108 John
    July 24, 2008

    GULP – The God Delusion…in the trash?!

    You my friend, have Large Brass Balls.
    You may need a wheelbarrow to carry those in…
    (Yes – a Bill Hicks reference)

    Wow.
    I stand here shaken (not stirred)

    Bravo, PZ, Bravo!

  109. #109 TG
    July 24, 2008

    I’m sure that will be forthcoming, just as soon as somebody provides PZ with evidence that his consecrated host was transubstantiated into the Body of the Living God.

    Why does one matter without the other?

    ++++++++++++

    No desecration would have taken place were the host not consecrated, and thus no Catholic would even bother to notice. Yet, PZ claims the host was consecrated. Let him prove hi8s claim. Nobody has to believe it is the body of Christ for the act of consecration is a public act perfomed by a Catholic priest.

    So, where’s the proof, or is this place not about science after all?

  110. #110 Reginald
    July 24, 2008

    HOW DARE YOU! YOU HAVE DEFILED THE GREAT TENANT OF MY FAITH! I WILL NOW PRAY TO MY GOD:

    OH MIGHTY AND MERCIFUL BAZELKESH, FORGIVE THIS MAN FOR COMBINING COFFEE GROUNDS WITH YOUR SACRED ‘SPOTTILY BROWNED BANANA PEELS’ HE KNOWS NOT WHAT HE DOES.

  111. #111 charfles
    July 24, 2008

    Woot finally. The God Delusion desecration was predicted (Prophesied?) by a few people in the earlier threads.

  112. #112 S. Fisher
    July 24, 2008

    Brace yourself PZ. I’ve been reading your blog for several years (since sometime in ’05) and this seems to be some sort of culminating event. I think you’ve definetly got the attention of the worlds’ Godbotherers now. It’s been fun, and will continue to be fun to watch your antics. Changing the world one post at a time.

  113. #113 Bryan
    July 24, 2008

    This is so G-rated compared to all of the atrocities done in the name of Jesus.
    I applaud your family values PZ!

  114. #114 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    Brilliant. I especially liked the abuse of the book by Dawkins, just to prove atheists consider nothing to be sacred.

    Also brilliant was the massive evidence for the idea that Catholics are the most immoral people in human history, a problem that obviously continues today.

    Well done, sir.

  115. #115 MartinDH
    July 24, 2008

    TG #39:

    Can’t you see the blood and ichor oozing from the stabbed host?

    Wait…

    That’s because there’s no difference between a fracking cracker and a consecrated host. (mumble mumble Hoc est corpus christi mumble mumble [nice ass on that choirboy] mumble mumble)

    Why don’t you use your amazing christo-powers to discern the cracker’s consecrated nature?

    Martin

  116. #116 mk
    July 24, 2008

    Wow! That’s got to be the quickest trip to 100 comments ever!

  117. #117 Andrew W
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ.

  118. #118 fireant451
    July 24, 2008

    Some may hoist a G&T, but I shall have a Rusty Nail tonight in PZ’s honor.

  119. #119 Reginald
    July 24, 2008

    HOW DARE YOU! YOU HAVE DEFILED THE GREAT TENANT OF MY FAITH! I WILL NOW PRAY TO MY GOD:

    OH MIGHTY AND MERCIFUL BAZELKESH, FORGIVE THIS MAN FOR COMBINING COFFEE GROUNDS WITH YOUR SACRED ‘SPOTTILY BROWNED BANANA PEELS’ HE KNOWS NOT WHAT HE DOES.

  120. #120 Viscount
    July 24, 2008

    Great post PZ! It was exactly what was needed. Thanks for going through with this and not caving to the threats.

    Incidentally, how did you manage to get the consecrated host? Did someone sneak it out of Mass or did you find a disgruntled ex-priest to Jesusize it for you?

  121. #121 DB
    July 24, 2008

    Whatever your attitude towards the Host may be – your actions and bragging about them display a hatred and utter disdain for those who believe differently from you.

    I understand that YOU don’t hold it sacred. That’s fine, if you don’t believe, you don’t believe and that’s your business. That is, it’s between you and God (and if you don’t believe in Him, also your business).

    The fact is, the Host IS sacred to millions if not billions of people. Your actions reveal a deep seated hatred, contempt and disdain for those people and their beliefs. I guess nothing matters to you except what YOU think, how YOU feel and what YOU want. Must be nice being god on You Planet.

  122. #122 Zeno
    July 24, 2008

    Sorry for the double post, but I got a message telling me my comment had been aborted. (Sorry, Catholics, for using that terrible word.)

    I assume the double post is a miracle!

  123. #123 Brian
    July 24, 2008

    Well, it’s somewhat of an anticlimax for sure. No daylight instantly turning to night, no curtains ripping, no blood gushing, ground shaking…

    I guess God either doesn’t give a shit about crackers, Q’urans and mindless followers or perhaps…

    Man made up the whole God thing.

    hmmm

    Either way, god doesn’t give a shit. Live life, enjoy your family and friends and show respect to your fellow man/woman and not to crackers and silly beliefs.

  124. #124 RM
    July 24, 2008

    That was beautifully done.

  125. #125 Autumn
    July 24, 2008

    Given that the picture was below the fold, as well as the length of the post, any people claiming to be outraged about it are obviously going to great lengths to find images which offend them. How sick is someone who really, really needs to be angry all the time?

  126. #126 Greta Christina
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, P.S.: I just want to say how sorry I am for everything you’ve been through with this, PZ. You took one for the team. Thanks, dude.

    (And I also want to say that, when I started my initial comment, the comments were at 7, and yet mine came in at #61. Fracking hilarious.)

  127. #127 Moses
    July 24, 2008

    Yeah!

  128. #128 Reed Braden
    July 24, 2008

    Wooo! Carnage!

  129. #129 Adam
    July 24, 2008

    Don’t let the bastards grind you down

  130. #130 Gene Goldring
    July 24, 2008

    “That’s one small step for [a] man, one giant leap for mankind”

  131. #131 Katharine
    July 24, 2008

    Vivek -

    Science is not religion.

  132. #132 BaldySlaphead
    July 24, 2008

    Congratulations PZ; you made the point even more forcefully than I had hoped by treating this whole preposterous affair with the casual contempt it so rightly deserved. The God Delusion was a great touch!

    Hope the fuckwits leave you alone now.

  133. #133 PZ Myers
    July 24, 2008

    The books I destroyed were ones that I had duplicate copies of — I’ve actually got several other copies of The God Delusion still. I think Richard will forgive me. In fact, he might join me in encouraging all of you to go buy a second copy so you can desecrate your first.

    Nobody is going to be going through my garbage. The date was picked intentionally to be after the weekly garbage pickup here. I suppose some Catholic crazies could head out to bless the Morris landfill, if they want.

  134. #134 e.citizen
    July 24, 2008

    Hell laughed indeed.Did God hurt? I’m sure God wouldn’t burn in hell, but you have chosen to be. hahahahahaha

  135. #135 Anne Nonymous
    July 24, 2008

    Argh, sorry for the double post, I see the server is already toasted. I’m sure PZ’s overlords at Scienceblogs are just thrilled. But boy has this ever been worth it.

  136. #136 Wayne Walker
    July 24, 2008

    As a worshiper of the Great Spotted Banana, I will express a modicum of outrage at 4pm, over tea. Followed by a nap.

  137. #137 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    Blessed be the holy evolution, PZ did not desecrate the holy Origin.

    Had he violated my holy religion, vengeance would follow (you know I’m kidding, right)?

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  138. #138 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    May God forgive you.

  139. #139 Parker
    July 24, 2008

    Fantastic ending to an embarrassing display of MIddle Age irrationality and sickening idiocy.

  140. #140 Eric
    July 24, 2008

    Good one. Nice touch by adding in Dawkin’s book.

  141. #141 Honna
    July 24, 2008

    I was starting to get bored today.

  142. #142 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,you should eat your bananas before they turn brown.

    No way! Bananas have to be brown to taste right. Chiquita says so!

    Fabulous post, PZ. Very well-written and thought out.

  143. #143 Anthony
    July 24, 2008

    I can’t desecrate my first copy of The God Delusion – Professor Dawkins consecrated it with his signature.

  144. #144 Celtic_Evolution
    July 24, 2008

    Beautiful. Elegant. Poignant. Thought-provoking. A glass raised to you, my friend.

    And, a request to the rest of my atheist friends here. We all know the “righteous” will come here bellowing. I suggest we sit back, and quietly let them, in our own form of silent protest. I’d love nothing more than to let this thread fill up with nothing but hate-filled vitriol from the catholics, reinforcing PZ’s post. Let it fill with the complaints and screeches of those who don’t get the point. I myself will contribute not one more word to this matter, and although I would never insist that you do the same, I think it would be great to just sit back and let it sink in… silently.

    CE

  145. #145 e.citizen
    July 24, 2008

    Hell laughed indeed.Did God hurt? I’m sure God wouldn’t burn in hell, but you have chosen to be. hahahahahaha you are not posting my comment, huh….where’s your son tonite?

  146. #146 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    TG’s got a point and no logic driven being can deny that! We need proof it was consecrated. But unfortunately that proof will only be the word of the guy/girl that got it from him. Annecdotes aren’t great as we point out to the silly christians/various fanatics. I doubt they let people videotape masses.

    Guess for that one we’ll just have to take it on… gasp… faith. Or start over and try to sneak camera proofs!

  147. #147 Geoff
    July 24, 2008

    I would like to personally thank Dr. Myers for not desecrating spaghetti or pasta of any kind.

    His holyness the FSM is pleased.

  148. #148 rb
    July 24, 2008

    sorry, but the Koran does not look like an official Koran it looks like a translated version, which would diminish its sacredness.

  149. #149 fireant451
    July 24, 2008

    Some may hoist a G&T, but I shall have a Rusty Nail tonight in PZ’s honor.

  150. #150 Jim RL
    July 24, 2008

    TG, if you were actually a man of science you would never demand proof of anything. It is impossible to prove anything outside of mathematics and formal logic. Scientists deal in evidence. It is clearly a host. PZ is clearly capable of getting a host from his blog horde. PZ is clearly unconcerned with desecrating a consecrated host. Only extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Without evidence to the contrary there is no evidence to doubt his claim.

  151. #151 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    May God have mercy on you.
    Oh my Jesus forgive us our sins and save us from the fires of hell. Please lead all souls to heaven especially those most in need of thy mercy. Amen.

  152. #152 Steve
    July 24, 2008

    Just a thought to all the people wishing for God to Punish PZ – according to your shtick, all you have to do is “not believe” to go to hell, so what’s the big deal about poking a hole in the bread wafer? Doesn’t really add anything to the imagined tortures that were already imagined to be waiting in some imaginary after life…

  153. #153 PaulT,
    July 24, 2008

    As an ex-catholic, just let me add that whatever you have done to that cracker, it is not nearly evil as what those priests did to those children for so many years.

  154. #154 thundergunn
    July 24, 2008

    Well done! I’m going to raise a glass of Laphroaig in toast, and munch on some cheese and ‘crackers’.

  155. #155 Brian W.
    July 24, 2008

    Vivek, I think that is a good point. Oh well.

    BTW, an Elder Scrolls fan?

  156. #156 Erik
    July 24, 2008

    I will not stand for the desecration of the God Delusion. May science have mercy on your soul.

  157. #157 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    Beautiful!

    “…you can find truth by looking at your world with fresh eyes and a questioning mind.”

    Sagan, Feynman, Dawkins, Aasimov… All have inspired me at one point or another. It may be that you are not such a “rockstar” as them, but now it is your turn to inspire, PZ.

    Thanks. Well done!

  158. #158 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    May God forgive you.

    Posted by: Mike | July 24, 2008 2:31 PM

    He won’t, he’s always pissed off. Sour guy, that G fellow.

  159. #159 Honna
    July 24, 2008

    I was starting to get bored today.

  160. #160 razib
    July 24, 2008

    if you mean germany as a catholic nation 70 years ago, that’s wrong, germany was (is) majority protestant (more then than now, as more secular germans have protestant than catholic background). as for the muslim vs.catholic comparison, i think the point is that the catholic league wants to fire you, the muslim league would want to set you on fire :-) that’s a difference between obnoxiousness and savagery.

  161. #161 Reginald Selkirk
    July 24, 2008

    Nothing is sacred, nothing I say! I’m going to set my browser to your web site, then drive a nail through my monitor. That will show you who’s serious.

  162. #162 Jason W
    July 24, 2008

    The pages make me a little sad, but I recognize I’m pretty irrational when it comes to books. Took me the better part of the first year of college to be willing even to write notes in a textbook.

  163. #163 mr_p
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo.

    But why a rusty nail? I thought it took wooden stakes or silver bullets to kill the undead?

    A reply to a comment on a prior post who compared this to destroying a family heirloom or something to that effect, These things are mass produced by the thousands, if not more everyday. It was by no means a rare or one of a kind item. No catholic had to forgo communion because of a shortage of crackers.
    When everything becomes sacred, then nothing is.
    Anyway, the world seems to not have ended. Everyone as you were.

  164. #164 DaveX
    July 24, 2008

    Absolutely perfect, PZ– glad to see you did this right. I also appreciate the historical leadup, which was very interesting.

    Gotta wonder, though… how long before some nutjob sees the face of Jebus in the coffee stains?

  165. #165 Tom Morris
    July 24, 2008

    A sacred cracker gets crucified. Now only a few weeks filled with crazy zealots and concern trolls.

  166. #166 raven
    July 24, 2008

    Since I’m not demonstrating any fear over their threats against me, well hey, let’s try a new target! KJ Atkins of Bellarmine University thinks cowardly warnings against my family might be effective.

    You fool, the vengeance for your sacrilege will not be . exhausted against you, but it will be carried out on your child. Wait and see.

    wikipedia Bruno
    His trial was overseen by the inquisitor Cardinal Bellarmine, who demanded a full recantation, which Bruno eventually refused. Instead he appealed in vain to Pope Clement VIII, hoping to save his life through a partial recantation. The Pope expressed himself in favor of a guilty verdict. Consequently, Bruno was declared a heretic,

    What sort of morons name a university after a torturer who condemned Giordano Bruno to burn at the stake and almost torched Galileo. Both for thinking that the earth orbits the sun. Must be for the Catholics who are desperately homesick for the middle ages.

  167. #167 Michael
    July 24, 2008

    I can’t wait to hear what Richard Dawkins thinks of this. :)

    Dawkins would pad PZ on the back saying job well done you showed how science disproved the wafer being God. And since you got some bad responses it clearly justifies you in provoking such anger in the first place. Your such a martyr for the militant atheist cause which is a movement to wipe out religion all together. Oh that was also a lovely picture of the Quran I wish I could hang that up on my wall.

    People with common sense just shake their heads, them militant atheists are like little kids fighting on a playground or in an alley somewhere. I wouldn’t be surprised if someone burns PZ picture…lol

  168. #168 Kylgar
    July 24, 2008

    Ah, well said and well played.
    It is, after all, *just* a cracker.
    …and *just* paper.
    …and *just* a banana
    (the latter of which, I have had and will have, no nightmares regarding, I’d like to add)

  169. #169 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    May God have mercy on you.
    Oh my Jesus forgive us our sins and save us from the fires of hell. Please lead all souls to heaven especially those most in need of thy mercy. Amen.

  170. #170 Kobra
    July 24, 2008

    #133: You might be right about that, PZ.

  171. #171 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    May God have mercy on you.
    Oh my Jesus forgive us our sins and save us from the fires of hell. Please lead all souls to heaven especially those most in need of thy mercy. Amen.

  172. #172 Brownian, OM
    July 24, 2008

    Wow. I’ve never considered myself an acolyte of yours PZ (I just happen to also be a liberal atheist who’s prone to ranting at stupidity), but I might have to become one now.

    This little dnouement of yours, including the Judge Jones-esque preamble on the history of host desecration, was fitting, tactful, and if I may, somewhat graceful. No bloodthirsty foaming at the mouth like the goddies hoped for (“He hates the cracker! More proof of God’s love!”), no disgusting freak show antics, but a simple statement of our intent as activist atheists: toss those sacred relics out with the rest of the things we no longer need. Bye-bye to gods, be they deities or Dawkinses or Darwinses.

    I was wondering if you’d have the guts to toss out The God Delusion, though. We Darwinist atheists invented Hitler, you know.

  173. #173 e.citizen
    July 24, 2008

    Hell laughed indeed.Did God hurt? I’m sure God wouldn’t burn in hell. But you are a good candidate…hahahaha

  174. #174 OctoberMermaid
    July 24, 2008

    Kind of a waste of a rusty nail, if you ask me.

  175. #175 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    I do like the anti-climax. Hell, one could even argue that the nail was a fitting tribute to Xian superstition.

    It’s diplomatic (and safer–which should be aimed for) to “violate” various supposedly sacred texts.

    By the way, though, I don’t know if a Quran in English really counts. The “real Quran” is believed to be only the Arabic version. Not that some Muslims wouldn’t be offended by “violating” an English translation, it’s just that the “real offense” would probably require the original Arabic.

    Just saying.

    I’m certainly not suggesting a re-do with an Arabic version, of course. That, too, is a silly superstition.

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  176. #176 Ken
    July 24, 2008

    Good work PZ! It has been fun to see just how seriously these religious nuts take their religion. I would love to see any of them justify their reactions using their own holy book. As a recovering christian I would especially love to hear how they think their Jesus would react to this. I am fairly certain they will not find passages where Jesus commanded people to threaten someone or their family with physical harm. Again, the whole episode has shown the fundie true colors.

  177. #177 Greg
    July 24, 2008

    Well done. As far as the lack of Muslim complaints go, Zizek noted that European Muslims found that they allies were atheists after the Danish comic controversy.

  178. #178 Ticktockman
    July 24, 2008

    So now, evidently, you’ve harmed (and caffeinated) Jesus. I’ve been wondering which *part* of Jesus, exactly has been harmed; which blessed bodily bit of flesh is the cracker. Since dogmatically speaking, Jesus is whole and eternal and all that in Heaven, it must be some part of his allegedly sinless flesh that didn’t make the trip, perhaps some part of the, er, Holy of Holies separated at a young age.

    Just *picture* it, my Catholic friends, chewing over that bit as it transubstantiates in your gullet. Holy indeed.

    -TTm

  179. #179 MicroZealous
    July 24, 2008

    So, will Dawkins now show stigmata? I’m confused.
    Also, why are some people so eager to see this end? This is great entertainment for a long, hot summer.
    May Thor forgive you all, then torture you.
    Peace and Love ;<)

  180. #180 Andrew Cramb
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ. I can’t imagine a more appropriate post.

    BRAVO!!!

  181. #181 Spook
    July 24, 2008

    How did you manage to get a nail *through* one of those brittle crackers? I would expect it to simply break…

    Perhaps I should repeat the experiment. You know, for science and stuff.

  182. #182 Pete Rooke
    July 24, 2008

    And still no one has substantively countered my analogies. I’m not surprised.

    Myers, I had hoped you would prevent you perverted desire from taking hold but you gave in. I still hold out hope for you somehow despite this.

  183. #183 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, no, link didn’t work!

    Chiquita song

  184. #184 Hilary
    July 24, 2008

    Nothings sacred are you nuts? Every sperm is sacred, especially mine! I give each one a name and would provide them with crackers but thy have no mouths and as such eating (and screaming) are right out.

  185. #185 Charades
    July 24, 2008

    @ #151: Oh, please.

    *applauds PZ’s brilliant blasphemy* Great job!

    Pax Nabisco, people!

  186. #186 Nick Winnick
    July 24, 2008

    From V for Vendetta:

    Finch explains to Party leader Adam Susan the transcript of a recording made as V assassinates Archbishop Tony Lilliman.

    Mr. Finch: There’s something that sounds like “Kill me sentiment”… just gibberish… and then they talk about Communion and the Communion Wafer…There’s the word “Transubstantiation”: That’s the miracle of Transubstantiation when the wafer transforms into the Body of Christ. Catholic concept originally. There, now listen to this…

    V (on tape): And at the moment this enters your mouth it becomes the flesh of the Saviour?
    Archbishop Lilliman (on tape): Yes. Yes. Look, please…
    V (on tape): And whatever it is made of now, it will become the Body of Christ?
    Archbishop Lilliman (on tape): Yes. Whatever it is now. Whatever.
    V (on tape): I want you to swallow it.

    Mr. Finch: And then there’s a funny little human noise. And then there’s just Beethoven’s Fifth. End of tape. We’ve just had the Path reports through. The Bishop was poisoned. The Host was full of cyanide. And do you know what? When it reached his abdomen it was still cyanide.

  187. #187 raven
    July 24, 2008

    Since I’m not demonstrating any fear over their threats against me, well hey, let’s try a new target! KJ Atkins of Bellarmine University thinks cowardly warnings against my family might be effective.

    You fool, the vengeance for your sacrilege will not be . exhausted against you, but it will be carried out on your child. Wait and see.

    wikipedia Bruno
    His trial was overseen by the inquisitor Cardinal Bellarmine, who demanded a full recantation, which Bruno eventually refused. Instead he appealed in vain to Pope Clement VIII, hoping to save his life through a partial recantation. The Pope expressed himself in favor of a guilty verdict. Consequently, Bruno was declared a heretic,

    What sort of morons name a university after a torturer who condemned Giordano Bruno to burn at the stake and almost torched Galileo. Both for thinking that the earth orbits the sun. Must be for the Catholics who are desperately homesick for the middle ages.

  188. #188 very clever
    July 24, 2008

    Dear Mr. Meyers,

    I don’t think you can claim unconcerned contempt for the host with the treatment that you’ve given it. Well, perhaps contempt, but not a lack of concern. Where did you find this rusty nail that you drove through the crotch of this jesus cracker? If you had to go searching for a rusty nail for just this purpose, your claim to a lack of concern loses its force. If you happen to have rusty nails sitting about, why?

    As for desecration, there are many options you could have entertained, yet you chose to make a minor spectacle. You could have, as a colleague of mine suggests, painted it pink and placed it in a urinal in a church; you could have nailed it to a tree, or you could even have chosen to ignore it completely… Why the minor spectacle?

    But seriously, the coffee and banana are a nice touch.

  189. #189 Rodney Trotter
    July 24, 2008

    Still haven’t made my mind up about this. As an atheist (Russell agnostic technically) I don’t respect crazy beliefs that tradition says we should; but there is a level of provocation here I feel slightly uncomfortable about.

    I’ve been trying to think of a suitable analogy – the closest I got was taking a sacred Hindu cow and making a decent barbeque from it in front of the temple. Does that not make you feel slightly strange?

  190. #190 adam
    July 24, 2008

    Quote from
    http://markshea.blogspot.com/

    Repeatedly tried to get Myers to verify the “death threat” bit, but was shouted down by the throngs of Myers cultists who took the claim on faith

    Oh the irony

  191. #191 Hilary
    July 24, 2008

    Nothings sacred are you nuts? Every sperm is sacred, especially mine! I give each one a name and would provide them with crackers but thy have no mouths and as such eating (and screaming) are right out.

  192. #192 rob
    July 24, 2008

    Mark: Eucharist!
    Jack: Cojones!
    KJ: Sacrilege!
    PZ: It’s only a cracker.

  193. #193 Norman Doering
    July 24, 2008

    Except for the odd spaghetti and banana worshipers, I’m not seeing a lot of god-bots posting on this thread yet.

    Is the infestation over?

  194. #194 No One of Consequence
    July 24, 2008

    It would not surprise me in the least to find out that a group of Catholics would go through PZ’s trash, or even to the local dump to search for the Eucharist and then take it back to a church, douse it in “Holy Water” and then give it a “proper” burial.

  195. #195 aiabx
    July 24, 2008

    Well done, PZ. That’s a history lesson worth learning there.

  196. #196 Timothy Wood
    July 24, 2008

    *claps*

  197. #197 Gary Hilson
    July 24, 2008

    You rock.

  198. #198 Epinephrine
    July 24, 2008

    I am a man of science. I want proof, not claims based on authority.

    Posted by: TG

    Bwahaha…. if there were any way of proving that a host had been consecrated, it would lend at least some weight to the argument that it is special. But there isn’t. All the “accidents” of the wee wafer are the same. There can’t be proof, because there is no transubstatiation.

  199. #199 tsig
    July 24, 2008

    Ite missa est.

  200. #200 PZ Myers
    July 24, 2008

    I knew the first thing that would happen is that the loons would claim it is a fake cracker. The one I chose to photograph is one that the sender actually provided video documentation of where it came from.

    Not that there’s any substantial difference between the consecrated and unconsecrated version.

  201. #201 skyblue
    July 24, 2008

    We’re going to have to demand that the St. Paul police increase security and put a cordon around these nasty “Catholics” who say they’re coming to the city to worship their gods at the RNC convention. They’ve already made numerous threats of violence and death to local residents. We can’t have them wandering among the public.

  202. #202 Aden B
    July 24, 2008

    Excellently done, PZ.

  203. #203 Randy
    July 24, 2008

    Well said, of course, and AJ Milne @ #12 – also well said. Right to the crux of the matter, I’d say.

    A little less seriously, I was saddened to find that PZ’s heart is not only uncircumsized, but hard as well. Not just the arteries from all the filthy things we’re all sure an eeeevil man like him does to his own body, but the entire heart. That’s unfortunate.

    As for myself, I must admit to a bit of ambivalence about being called an acolyte. On the one hand, no one has ever called me that before and it sort of has a nice ring to it – on the other hand I get the sneaky feeling mark Shea didn’t mean it in a very nice way.

  204. #204 Andy
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    surprisingly, I have to say, seing this picture: I really don’t care about this desecregation-thing.

    But you should think about seperating your biological waste from paper. I don’t know how that is handled in the U.S. but here in Germany they would tell me to keep my garbage if I don’t care for recycling (there are actual laws about that). That in fact I found much more offensive than the desecregation (though, of course, hardly offensive at all).

    But the Koran and the cracker – It just so doesn’t concern me. What deluded moron could possible care about that? I am afraid, we are to see…

    Wish you luck,
    Andy

  205. #205 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    And still no one has substantively countered my analogies. I’m not surprised.
    Posted by: Pete Rooke | July 24, 2008 2:38 PM

    Analogies? Which crazy one were you again? There’s so many we lost track.

  206. #206 Clock
    July 24, 2008

    The “surprise entry” was pages from the God Delusion? Brilliant! Very impressive show, PZ. Well played.

  207. #207 Timothy Wood
    July 24, 2008

    *claps*

  208. #208 Reed Braden
    July 24, 2008

    Wooo! Carnage!

  209. #209 James
    July 24, 2008

    I love it! This thread will go to infinity three times over!

  210. #210 e.citizen
    July 24, 2008

    Hell laughed indeed.Did God hurt? I’m sure God wouldn’t burn in hell. But you are a good candidate…hahahaha

  211. #211 zer0
    July 24, 2008

    Well said.

  212. #212 Canuck
    July 24, 2008

    Well, before this thread gets to the thousands, let me just say that I’m very curious to see how long it takes for the bloviating Donohue to issue another press release, how long it takes for the hordes of believers to register their outrage, and how long before the first Muslim shows up. I think this may draw one into the fray. But we await with bated breath.

  213. #213 Joe Cracker
    July 24, 2008

    The Donahues will have a big problem here. There is no way for them to prove that the cracker was consecrated.

    I DARE THEM TO PROVE THAT THE NAILED CRACKER IS JESUS!

    You really nailed it, PZ!

  214. #214 MT
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo PZ!

    The anti-climax is genius. This post reads, from top to bottom, like one of your brilliant science posts that attracted me to this site in the first place.

    No ranting or vulgarities that would prevent sensitive souls from reading it or make it inappropriate for sharing with children – just a recitation of historical facts and logic conclusions.

    This is the art of teaching, in the finest sense of the word.

  215. #215 Jim RL
    July 24, 2008

    Well done with the documentation PZ. That is more evidence then we’ll ever get for any recognized “miracle” by the church.

  216. #216 idahovic
    July 24, 2008

    This is such a enlightening and fun post it ought to be illegal. Oh, wait…

  217. #217 Owlmirror
    July 24, 2008

    No desecration would have taken place were the host not consecrated, and thus no Catholic would even bother to notice.

    Ordinarily, I would agree, but a Catholic (in another thread) asserted that:

    Moreover, even desecration of a host which is known to be unconsecrated is simple sacrilege. So desecration still brings great pain to Catholics, since it *may* be a severe act of indignity to Christ, and it appears to be one.

    Me, I’ve argued that desecration of crackers is impossible anyway, but no one listens to me.

  218. #218 kb9aln
    July 24, 2008

    Excellent.

    PZ, you continue to get my respect for your lucid treatment of the issue.

    All the best to you and yours.

  219. #219 Spook
    July 24, 2008

    How did you manage to get a nail *through* one of those brittle crackers? I would expect it to simply break…

    Perhaps I should repeat the experiment. You know, for science and stuff.

  220. #220 Yoo
    July 24, 2008

    Seeing what Catholics have actually said to PZ, I have a hard time believing my eyes when I read a lot of Christians saying that he’s the one that needs to get a grip. Threatening to disrespect a single wafer among trillions (probably an underestimate by a few orders of magnitudes) versus death threats? And there are people who actually consider the former a more serious offense? I can only hope that such people will be able to learn basic human decency that is common to most of humanity, instead of clinging to their religious faith used to justify horrendous things.

  221. #221 Pete Rooke
    July 24, 2008

    And still no one has substantively countered my analogies. I’m not surprised.

    Myers, I had hoped you would prevent you perverted desire from taking hold but you gave in. I still hold out hope for you somehow despite this.

  222. #222 Don O'Treply
    July 24, 2008

    what – no Velveeta on this cracker? And I was hoping for a recipe for Nacho Cheesus.

    At any rate, PZ, you’ve done the world (another) favour by pointing out how vile the Catholic “religion” really is. Truly disgusting, the lot of them.

  223. #223 Jason W
    July 24, 2008

    The pages make me a little sad, but I recognize I’m pretty irrational when it comes to books. Took me the better part of the first year of college to be willing even to write notes in a textbook.

  224. #224 Kim
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ. At least you are consistent, and it is good that you treat Evangelical Atheism the same way as Evangelical Catholicism……..

  225. #225 anevilmeme
    July 24, 2008

    PZ I have officially added you to my list of heros!

  226. #226 K
    July 24, 2008

    PZ totally PWND Jesus

  227. #227 Andrew Cramb
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ. I can’t imagine a more appropriate post.

    BRAVO!!!

  228. #228 Nick
    July 24, 2008

    I’ve been reading your blog for a while but this is my first comment. I must say, this is one of the finest pieces of expression I’ve seen on the topic and is a marvelous example of how to respond to religious fanatics with both class and witticism.

    Bravo!

  229. #229 Hessenroots
    July 24, 2008

    “making a decent barbeque from it in front of the temple. Does that not make you feel slightly strange?”

    Poor analogy only in that this wasn’t done outside a mosque or church (as far as we know).

    Taking pictures of the steak and posting them on a blog would be more like it.

  230. #230 MT
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo PZ!

    The anti-climax is genius. This post reads, from top to bottom, like one of your brilliant science posts that attracted me to this site in the first place.

    No ranting or vulgarities that would prevent sensitive souls from reading it or make it inappropriate for sharing with children – just a recitation of historical facts and logic conclusions.

    This is the art of teaching, in the finest sense of the word.

  231. #231 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    Celtic_Evolution (#144) wrote:

    And, a request to the rest of my atheist friends here. We all know the “righteous” will come here bellowing. I suggest we sit back, and quietly let them, in our own form of silent protest. I’d love nothing more than to let this thread fill up with nothing but hate-filled vitriol from the catholics, reinforcing PZ’s post. Let it fill with the complaints and screeches of those who don’t get the point. I myself will contribute not one more word to this matter, and although I would never insist that you do the same, I think it would be great to just sit back and let it sink in… silently.

    Excellent suggestion. I will try my best to not respond to the Catholic insanity that’s sure to come.

    I hope the Catholics who come here read PZ’s excellent summary of Catholic atrocities.

    Catholics don’t throw people in gas chambers anymore, and they no longer murder people who refuse to eat crackers, but this cracker incident proves beyond any doubt Catholics are still the most immoral people in human history.

  232. #232 John Swindle
    July 24, 2008

    Wonderful. Appropriate. Well considered. Beautifully stated. Highly moral.

    Exactly what I would’ve said if I were articulate enough to do so.

    And you even included a Python reference.

    Today, PZ, you are the King of Blogdom.

  233. #233 Preston
    July 24, 2008

    Cool. It is, indeed, just a cracker.

    And I’m glad you included some pages from the God Delusion, to emphasize the idiocy of holding ANYTHING sacred.

  234. #234 Leukocyte
    July 24, 2008

    [Yawn]… I can’t wait for this to die down and go away. I stay away from church so I can think about things that actually matter without having to deal with the crazies. Now the crazies are all over my favorite blog. Can we please cleanse our palate with some more blogging about developmental biology papers? Everyone knows that jargon-laden research papers are to fundamentalists as sunlight is to vampires.

  235. #235 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    Now, if only there were a true account of the time wasted over a single piece of baked wheat paste.

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  236. #236 No One of Consequence
    July 24, 2008

    [poe]
    Look at the picture closely. I’m sure there is a Dilbert cartoon in the trash as well. You can just see the corner of it underneath the book.

    Alert the Dilbots!!!!
    [/poe]

  237. #237 Pablo
    July 24, 2008

    As an ex-catholic, just let me add that whatever you have done to that cracker, it is not nearly evil as what those priests did to those children for so many years.

    And, whereas sexual abuse is certainly the pinnacle of it, others, such as myself, were abused in other ways. For example, my second grade teacher, Sister Claire Marie Meyer never hesitated to hit us for doing bad things, like coloring outside the lines in art class. She would hit us with whatever she had conveniently in her hand, which could be a ruler, or the handle of a scissors. If she didn’t have anything in her hand, she would just turn around her big fat nun ring and slap us upside the back of the head with the stone.

    Again, we were in second grade. Find your nearest 8 year old and start whacking them over the head with solid objects.

    Talk about a coward.

    But at least she never desicrated a host, right?

  238. #238 JT Eberhard
    July 24, 2008

    Good riddance. Well done Dr. Myers. You are appropriately brave, and your arguments are sensible and well-written.

    Tonight, we shall toast your name in Springfield.

    JT

  239. #239 Kim
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ. At least you are consistent, and it is good that you treat Evangelical Atheism the same way as Evangelical Catholicism……..

  240. #240 stevogvsu
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    This night I will drink (copiously) and have sinful vigorous sex in your honor.

  241. #241 Mike B
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ; it proves that atheists have more compassion and forgiveness than all the religions combined.

  242. #242 llewelly
    July 24, 2008

    Pray you live to see that day so you can ask Him to forgive you and your uncircumcised heart.

    Uhh… Is there a weird sect of Catholicism which circumcises the heart?

  243. #243 DaveH
    July 24, 2008

    PZ MYERS WILL DIE…eventually, and, emmm…that will be the end of it for him, like everyone else. Personally, if I’m still around at the time, I will mourn the passing of a great educator. Slainte mha!

  244. #244 Ken E.
    July 24, 2008

    I’ve been following this a bit but, I’m sorry, religion just isn’t worth all this effort.

  245. #245 HumanisticJones
    July 24, 2008

    I have to say, I think the high point of all of this was the pages from TGD in the trash with everything else. One could have attempted to hamstring your argument of holding nothing sacred by claiming that you can dish it out, but not take it. However, I think that it would have been more impacting if you had done this with Origin of Species… you know… since we Atheists apparently worship Darwin.

    Bravo for the wonderful post before that unsurprisingly anti-climactic picture of trash in a trash can.

  246. #246 OneMadClown
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo, Professor.

  247. #247 SC
    July 24, 2008

    I’ve actually got several other copies of The God Delusion still.

    I wouldn’t mind one of those, if they’re just sitting around. :)

  248. #248 GAtheist
    July 24, 2008

    Funny how Donohue threatened to tell CAIR that PZ was going to desecrate a Koran when it was his band of cracker crusaders that were the ones demanding PZ do it…

  249. #249 Guido
    July 24, 2008

    Great.
    Excellent.
    Now, all they have to do is pray. Right? The Lord listens to them

    Right?

    Come on, people, stop writing e-mails. Have TRUE faith.

  250. #250 Preston
    July 24, 2008

    Cool. It is, indeed, just a cracker.

    And I’m glad you included some pages from the God Delusion, to emphasize the idiocy of holding ANYTHING sacred.

  251. #251 Ryan F Stello
    July 24, 2008

    Amazingly well put.

    Now, hopefully, sanity will return here…..maybe with the help of a ban hammer.

  252. #252 The skepTick
    July 24, 2008

    Let freedom ring.

  253. #253 unicow
    July 24, 2008

    Wonderful post. Wonderful desecration.

    Can we talk about cephalopods now?

  254. #254 gir
    July 24, 2008

    Zombie jebus cracker will eat your brains.

  255. #255 Bryan
    July 24, 2008

    Pete Rooke #221

    “And still no one has substantively countered my analogies. I’m not surprised.”

    And the conceit of the faithful continues…

  256. #256 Andy
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    surprisingly, I have to say, seing this picture: I really don’t care about this desecregation-thing.

    But you should think about seperating your biological waste from paper. I don’t know how that is handled in the U.S. but here in Germany they would tell me to keep my garbage if I don’t care for recycling (there are actual laws about that). That in fact I found much more offensive than the desecregation (though, of course, hardly offensive at all).

    But the Koran and the cracker – It just so doesn’t concern me. What deluded moron could possible care about that? I am afraid, we are to see…

    Wish you luck,
    Andy

  257. #257 arensb
    July 24, 2008

    I see no response yet from either Bill Donohue (d/b/a the Catholic League) or Richard Dawkins.

    Anyone wanna bet which one has more important things to do than comment on this, like wash the dog, and which one will throw a tantrum as soon as he recovers from the vapors?

  258. #258 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    You know what would be nice is a substantive post right about now.

    This whole cracker business is too meaningless, and I hope that it will die down soon. It’s hard to believe that either side can invest as many electrons to this business as they have.

    Something meaningful on this blog would be most welcome right now.

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  259. #259 OctoberMermaid
    July 24, 2008

    Jesus?

    Jesus!?

    JESUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUS!

  260. #260 Kent
    July 24, 2008

    Alah Akbar alert

    This website link will be given to all the radical jihadis on youtube. You wanted attention so now you will get it.

    Second rate, anybody can come university attention seeker will now get attention from the “religion of peace”

  261. #261 Dustin
    July 24, 2008

    Fuck. A nail through a cracker is very mild in comparison with the things people the Catholics were fond of putting them through. I don’t think Bruno and Vanini appreciated the sharp metal objects.

    Here’s a short list of things which are not goddamned crackers.

  262. #262 Kenny
    July 24, 2008

    Absolutely brilliant! Of all the myriad ways I imagined you could deal with this cracker, I can’t think of a more appropriate ending.

  263. #263 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, that was one of the most brilliant posts I have ever read, thank you so much for this!

    Congratulations on the desecration, I hope it leads to mass cracker killings all around the nation.

  264. #264 Snark
    July 24, 2008

    Well done! My salutations.

  265. #265 JustaTech
    July 24, 2008

    Oh no PZ! Now the librarians will be after you. Nancy Pearl will lead them in their charge on you and terrify you with their “sushing action”. Lo, feel the ground tremble! *Much humor* Seriously, good job.

  266. #266 Morris
    July 24, 2008

    Thanks for your enlighting us.

  267. #267 The skepTick
    July 24, 2008

    Let freedom ring.

  268. #268 waldteufel
    July 24, 2008

    Thanks, P.Z.

    This was one of your very best posts.

  269. #269 Interested reader
    July 24, 2008

    Hmm… some smart guy. Talk about being totally moronic, I can only think of God’s mercy toward this guy is going to be a baseball bat to his head so he finally gets it through that head of his that the Eucharist is Jesus.

  270. #270 Dave
    July 24, 2008

    Strange, I thought everyone here looked for compelling evidence for everything before coming to a conclusion. There’s no evidence given by Dr. Myers that this host was actually consecrated. I, for one, don’t believe it.

  271. #271 Chris
    July 24, 2008

    Won’t Way of the Master be upset that you desecrated a banana?

  272. #272 Fiziker
    July 24, 2008

    Still seems a little too complicated for what it’s worth. I think it was the right choice to go for something simple. As I was reading, I thought that flushing it down the toilet might be appropriately simple, but I realized that God might smite you by backing up your toilet.

    Well done, PZ!

  273. #273 Vince
    July 24, 2008

    Well done Prof. Myers. I will raise a glass of Jack Daniels to you.

    So when is this going to get national press coverage? NY Times? The Today Show?…oh forget it. Random thoughts seep out now and then.

  274. #274 Michael Edmondson
    July 24, 2008

    Wow. I may have to make an animation of this…

  275. #275 Ken Cope
    July 24, 2008

    Well done. Nothing is sacred. No idea is above challenge. In the words of Lenny Bruce, “Everybody’s ass is up for grabs.” At first it appears too studied to achieve that epic Zen casualness, but the randomness of coffee grounds, rusty nail (I wonder if Luther used a rusty nail to pound his message into the church door?) and overripe banana peel really tie it together. Titling the entire mess a God Delusion simultaneously twits and pays homage to the Zen Roshi of Atheism. What you did to the cracker is an apt punishment and a victimless crime.

    Here’s to the day when it can truly be said that religion is just dessert. As pictured, it sure looks like an ugly mess of a main course.

  276. #276 HolyRusk
    July 24, 2008

    I’m proud humanity also consists of people like you, Mr Myers. Now, up to us to act with intelligence and humor.

  277. #277 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, that was one of the most brilliant posts I have ever read, thank you so much for this!

    Congratulations on the desecration, I hope it leads to mass cracker killings all around the nation.

  278. #278 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    I’ve been trying to think of a suitable analogy – the closest I got was taking a sacred Hindu cow and making a decent barbeque from it in front of the temple.

    FAIL. If you haven’t noticed, this is happening on his blog, which does not show up by magic on people’s computers. They have to come here to see it. The proper analogy would be having a barbeque at his own house. I’m sure no good Catholic has ever had a barbeque at their house before, out of concern for offending Hindus, right?

  279. #279 The skepTick
    July 24, 2008

    Let freedom ring.

  280. #280 Andy
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    surprisingly, I have to say, seing this picture: I really don’t care about this desecregation-thing.

    But you should think about seperating your biological waste from paper. I don’t know how that is handled in the U.S. but here in Germany they would tell me to keep my garbage if I don’t care for recycling (there are actual laws about that). That in fact I found much more offensive than the desecregation (though, of course, hardly offensive at all).

    But the Koran and the cracker – It just so doesn’t concern me. What deluded moron could possible care about that? I am afraid, we are to see…

    Wish you luck,
    Andy

  281. #281 Macron
    July 24, 2008

    You should have treated it like the cracker that it is and just eaten it for a snack.

  282. #282 someone221
    July 24, 2008

    Hmm… some smart guy. Talk about being totally stupid, I can only think of God’s mercy toward this guy is going to be a baseball bat to his head so he finally gets it through that head of his that the Eucharist is Jesus.

  283. #283 sQuee.
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo. I generally thought all of this was well done and am quite pleased how the ending came about. There was definite proof that it occurred, although the cracker blends into the pages in the picture. You have to find the nail, then look for the cracker on the nail. I normally wouldn’t have agreed with the nail, seemed a tad overboard, but made it very easy to see that there was indeed a dry, tasteless looking cracker at the end of said nail.
    All in all, bravo.

  284. #284 Inky
    July 24, 2008

    *Standing ovation*

    Nicely done; and I mean the text.

    I didn’t give a crap what you did with what.

  285. #285 Kenny
    July 24, 2008

    Absolutely brilliant! Of all the myriad ways I imagined you could deal with this cracker, I can’t think of a more appropriate ending.

  286. #286 mk
    July 24, 2008

    For Michelle at #205

    That was funny as hell! Thanks for the crack up.

  287. #287 Bill Dauphin
    July 24, 2008

    PZ:

    Not that there’s any substantial difference between the consecrated and unconsecrated version.

    Nor any insubstantial difference, either, no?

  288. #288 Steve_C
    July 24, 2008

    It’s all just stuff. That says it all.

  289. #289 MrMarkAZ
    July 24, 2008

    “Class dismissed.”

  290. #290 RamblinDude
    July 24, 2008

    Well done.

  291. #291 NoAstronomer
    July 24, 2008

    Nice move including the God Delusion, that was a surprise.

  292. #292 Cleon
    July 24, 2008

    It’s weird, but the destroying of books disturbs me regardless of their sacred status.

    You know, I had a very similar thought.

  293. #293 Brownian, OM
    July 24, 2008

    Quote from
    http://markshea.blogspot.com/

    Repeatedly tried to get Myers to verify the “death threat” bit, but was shouted down by the throngs of Myers cultists who took the claim on faith

    Oh the irony

    Posted by: adam | July 24, 2008 2:39 PM

    I totally know what you mean. He’s worse than those devil-spawn children who claimed to be molested just to give the church a black-eye, or those who claim that Galileo was excommunicated and held under house arrest for claiming that the Earth was not the centre of the solar system, when in fact it was Galileo who persecuted those scientific men of God in the Vatican. In fact, the world is so hostile to Catholics that, fearing more repercussions like the Crusades (a Freemason frame job), the Vatican didn’t feel safe coming out with their heliocentric findings until 1992.

    Besides, no one’s ever been able to prove Mary wasn’t a virgin and why would so many people risk their lives for a lie if the bible isn’t true and what about frozen waterfalls and how come nobody’s ever seen a consecrated host evolve into a pumpernickel? I can’t wait to see how you Myers-ists try to deny God’s love when you’re all burning in Hell for eternity!

  294. #294 dale
    July 24, 2008

    Dominoes Nabisco, et cum sirit tu tuo.

  295. #295 Janus
    July 24, 2008

    Brilliant post, PZ. We’re very lucky to have you as one of the champions of reason.

  296. #296 Fiziker
    July 24, 2008

    Still seems a little too complicated for what it’s worth. I think it was the right choice to go for something simple. As I was reading, I thought that flushing it down the toilet might be appropriately simple, but I realized that God might smite you by backing up your toilet.

    Well done, PZ! I’m glad that no blood squirted out of the host when you stabbed it.

  297. #297 Guido
    July 24, 2008

    Great.
    Excellent.
    Now, all they have to do is pray. Right? The Lord listens to them

    Right?

    Come on, people, stop writing e-mails. Have TRUE faith.

  298. #298 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Hmm… some smart guy. Talk about being totally moronic, I can only think of God’s mercy toward this guy is going to be a baseball bat to his head so he finally gets it through that head of his that the Eucharist is Jesus.

    Posted by: Interested reader | July 24, 2008 2:51 PM

    I would find that totally funny… If I could figure out if you’re serious or joking.

    I’ll go with joking cuz that’s a great parody cartoon you just described there. :) (Cuz if you’re serious… That’s not very christian of you!)

  299. #299 Andy
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    surprisingly, I have to say, seing this picture: I really don’t care about this desecregation-thing.

    But you should think about seperating your biological waste from paper. I don’t know how that is handled in the U.S. but here in Germany they would tell me to keep my garbage if I don’t care for recycling (there are actual laws about that). That in fact I found much more offensive than the desecregation (though, of course, hardly offensive at all).

    But the Koran and the cracker – It just so doesn’t concern me. What deluded moron could possible care about that? I am afraid, we are to see…

    Wish you luck,
    Andy

  300. #300 Andrs Diplotti
    July 24, 2008

    * golf clap *

  301. #301 Ash
    July 24, 2008

    beautifully written, beautifully ‘executed’. thank you Professor.

  302. #302 Dahan
    July 24, 2008

    Why’d ya have to do that to a nail! As a designer and builder, don’t you know what that nail represents to me! What that symbolizes? Damn you! I’d rather you would have come over and skinned my cats than to defile the sacred nail. I’ll be praying to the almighty hammer for you.

    Ok, with that, keep up the excellent blog PZ. Thanks.

  303. #303 MrMarkAZ
    July 24, 2008

    “Class dismissed.”

  304. #304 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    I just want to throw in my support for a job well done, PZ. Throwing away those items harms no one, and you’ve at least brought the issue of freedom of speech to the forefront of a lot of people’s minds, right where it needs to be. Most of those people have been Catholics though, since the majority of atheists already favor and defend free speech regularly. Now we just have to wait and see if there are any Catholic Leaguers out there who poses the ability to look at this situation rationally and realize that you had, and continue to have, all the right in the world to perform this act.

  305. #305 thegomezsymbol
    July 24, 2008

    Oh man, you desecrated coffee?
    You will sure burn in hell for that one!

    Hurray for a good set of… gills.

  306. #306 mayhempix
    July 24, 2008

    You “nailed it” PZ.

    Now we wait for the crucifying to come from Donawhore, et al.

  307. #307 Jeff Arnold
    July 24, 2008

    BRAVO!

  308. #308 Longtime Lurker
    July 24, 2008

    You ripped up a copy of “The God Delusion”? Richard Dawkins will surely strike you down with a great bolt of NOTHING!

  309. #309 Jeff Arnold
    July 24, 2008

    BRAVO!

  310. #310 Pete Rooke
    July 24, 2008

    Michelle: “Analogies? Which crazy one were you again? There’s so many we lost track.”

    An uncomfortable truth still remains a truth. Here is the compilation:

    1) Suppose you were a milkman with rotting teeth and cankerous lips. Before delivering each milk bottle you would take a swig and place it on the doorstep. You continued to abuse you privileged access to other people’s milk for years. Then one day you decide to retire. Before you leave however, you let all of your customers know what you’ve been engaged in by letter while also leaving a picture of your cankerous mouth under each bottle. You have gleefully proclaimed your actions to all who will listen. No one was physically harmed and yet every customer (read: Catholic) affected feels deeply violated and abused. PZ Myers is effectively that milkman.

    2) Suppose your are an embalmer. You are busy embalming a person for an open coffin ceremony and you decide to pilfer there lush locks of blonde hair for the construction of high class wigs (a business you have going on the side).
    This person happens to be a Sikh. In order to hide the fact you have stolen their hair you then purchase a cheap synthetic wig and replace it. In the small print of the contract (which the distraught family don’t read carefully enough) you make mention of this.

    After the event you then decide to publicize this gleefully on a blog. No physical harm has been done to either person and yet I would argue that this is equivalent to PZ Myer’s theft and subsequent desecration of the Eucharist publicized on his blog (of which extra web traffic generates money).

    3) Young ladies like to wear an item of clothing called a mini-skirt these days. The material is often sheer and by its definition does not even come close to covering the knee roll.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniskirt)
    Now if someone chooses to wear such an item it does not in the least bit make rape and sexual abuse permissible despite the fact that the odds increase exponentially. In both the eyes of the secular law and of my religion the assailants are still just as culpable.

    So merely because Catholicism may seem like a remarkably soft target for PZ Myers (he has since been roped into desecrating the Koran) he is still as culpable as someone who chooses to attack say the more benign and watered down religions of Quakerism/Unitarian-Universalism.

    4) Suppose you had a very sacred book outlining your philosophy on life. This book also happened to be stitched together and bound in the skin and flesh of a loved one who had recently passed away.

    Now desecrating the Eucharist would have the same effect as desecrating that book and posting the evidence in glee.

  311. #311 Inky
    July 24, 2008

    *Standing ovation*

    Nicely done; and I mean the text.

    I didn’t give a crap what you did with what.

  312. #312 Jay
    July 24, 2008

    I know you do not believe, but what if it truly is Jesus that you are attempting to hurt?

    That’s just it. These people live their lives based on the “what if”. They don’t actually believe, but they are scared into acting as if they do because they are afraid of being wrong.

  313. #313 HolyRusk
    July 24, 2008

    I’m proud humanity also consists of people like you, Mr Myers. Now, up to us to act with intelligence and humor.

  314. #314 Jon
    July 24, 2008

    Hmm… some smart guy. Talk about being totally stupid, I can only think of God’s mercy toward this guy is going to be a baseball bat to his head so he finally gets it through that head of his that the Eucharist is Jesus.

    Mercy. You’re doing it wrong.

  315. #315 Gus C
    July 24, 2008

    Nothing must be held sacred.

    Exactly!! People come up to me and say they respect that I am atheist. I tell them to fucken not!

  316. #316 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    There’s no evidence given by Dr. Myers that this host was actually consecrated. I, for one, don’t believe it.

    Excellent! Congratulations! You may be on the path to recovery. Just start subjecting ALL ideas that are presented to you to this very same treatment. It may feel a little bit funny at first, but you will get used to it. Eventually, you will start abandoning bullshit… until you abandon the last god that you still cling to. This will be good: you will be able to walk around without you security blanket… And it will free your mind.

  317. #317 The skepTick
    July 24, 2008

    Great show. Let freedom ring. Let reasonable minds prevail.

  318. #318 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Wow I think this all caused a terrible server comment lag. Comments are bumping into each other so much that the comments numbers are moving up and down and some comments are being fitted inbetween.

  319. #319 Andy
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    surprisingly, I have to say, seing this picture: I really don’t care about this desecregation-thing.

    But you should think about seperating your biological waste from paper. I don’t know how that is handled in the U.S. but here in Germany they would tell me to keep my garbage if I don’t care for recycling (there are actual laws about that). That in fact I found much more offensive than the desecregation (though, of course, hardly offensive at all).

    But the Koran and the cracker – It just so doesn’t concern me. What deluded moron could possible care about that? I am afraid, we are to see…

    Wish you luck,
    Andy

  320. #320 Nelson M.
    July 24, 2008

    I hope we can all get on with our respective lives now.

  321. #321 bellerophon
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    Good job, brilliantly conceived, spectacularly finished. As said, you deserve a standing ovation for that. A second G&T’s hoisted up for you tonight in London. (We can turn this into a flashmob drinking session, people, just a thought.)

    I can imagine the Catholics furor now. Either they’re gonna go on “demonizing” you, or they’re gonna call you a coward because you haven’t recorded it live, you don’t show proof that the cracker’s consecrated, etc. Either way, it’s gonna be so much fun to watch.

    Thanks PZ, and homage to your big balls of steel.

  322. #322 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    I just want to throw in my support for a job well done, PZ. Throwing away those items harms no one, and you’ve at least brought the issue of freedom of speech to the forefront of a lot of people’s minds, right where it needs to be. Most of those people have been Catholics though, since the majority of atheists already favor and defend free speech regularly. Now we just have to wait and see if there are any Catholic Leaguers out there who poses the ability to look at this situation rationally and realize that you had, and continue to have, all the right in the world to perform this act.

  323. #323 mayhempix
    July 24, 2008

    You “nailed it” PZ.

    Now we wait for the crucifying to come from Donawhore, et al.

  324. #324 Turdus
    July 24, 2008

    Well said PZ. I especially liked the part about “sacrilege to the host” as an excuse to murder non-believers. This blog got a lot of attention from a lot of people, PZ. I think the thing that drives Catholics crazy the most about the whole affair is that YOU DID GET SOME PEOPLE THINKING, especially young people who saw this, in spite of assurances otherwise. That is really what is driving them NUTS!

  325. #325 kestrien
    July 24, 2008

    Watch out, P.Z., they’re coming…

    …to pray for you.

    “What would he do if Catholics and other Christians, and even sympathetic members of other faiths, turned up en masse on his campus simply to pray quietly for him?”

    http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2008/07/pz-myers-desecrates-the-euchar.html

    For some reason, I think he might stop by to say “hey,” then go about his business.

  326. #326 Parker
    July 24, 2008

    Fantastic end to a fantastically pitiful display of human progression and rational thinking.
    I’m glad you desecrated the God Delusion to show that we don’t even take our own books that seriously.
    Oh but Kirk Cameron’s gona be soooo pissed that you trashed his yellow proof of gawd.

  327. #327 JackC
    July 24, 2008

    May I have permission – or is it implied here – to copy your “If I wanted to…” portion of this? Positively spot-on.

    JC

  328. #328 Kent
    July 24, 2008

    Alah Akbar alert. ………..Attention getter lol

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

    Sending this to islamic jihadist websites

  329. #329 Tony Phillips
    July 24, 2008

    I guess I understand why…you see religion as dangerous. Ok I get it, I don’t agree but I get it. I see Godlessness as being even more dangerous…and we could go back and forth all day with examples of how the Catholic church did this terrible thing and how communists and other athiest organizations did that terrible thing. (Funny how you left that out of your litany of people who killed in the name of belief.)

    But you know what’s really funny? Your picture is a fake. I handle unconcecrated hosts every day and concecrated hosts every week, just like the one in your picture. If you even pressed the tip of a nail to a host it would crack into pieces. So that nail sticking right through it is a product of some picture editing software. So I guess you didn’t do all you say you did. It makes me wonder if you did any of the other stuff. Interesting…confusing but interesting.

  330. #330 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, that was one of the most brilliant posts I have ever read, thank you so much for this!

    Congratulations on the desecration, I hope it leads to mass cracker killings all around the nation.

  331. #331 deadvole
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, will you be my stand-in grandpa when I move to Minnesota? Because I need one as awesomely cool and eloquent as you. Very beautifully handled, that.

  332. #332 Vic
    July 24, 2008

    Dr. Myers, my hat’s off to you. That’s better than anything I could’ve dreamed up, and the real cherry on the sundae is that this is one of your best blog posts ever – enlightening, informative, incisive, and ever-so-quotable.

    Plus, of course, imagining what the riled-up-hordes will do with the image of the God Delusion ‘desecrated’ along with their fetish items.

  333. #333 Ric
    July 24, 2008

    I have an uncircumcised heart and an uncircumcised penis, and I’m happy about both.

    That was a beautifully written essay, PZ. Screw the stupid cracker.

  334. #334 Randy
    July 24, 2008

    Kent @ #260:

    Do you know a lot of “radical jihadis”? Hmmm, expect the NSA and Homeland Security to come down your parents basement stairs any moment.

  335. #335 TripMaster Monkey
    July 24, 2008

    someone221 sez:

    Hmm… some smart guy. Talk about being totally stupid, I can only think of God’s mercy toward this guy is going to be a baseball bat to his head so he finally gets it through that head of his that the Eucharist is Jesus.

    Is that what it took for you, someone221, or were you just naturally mentally deficient enough to believe that a little round cracker is your God? c^_^?

  336. #336 thegomezsymbol
    July 24, 2008

    Oh man, you desecrated coffee?
    You will sure burn in hell for that one!

    Hurray for a good set of… gills.

  337. #337 Ben D
    July 24, 2008

    If you believe that truth is relative, why can’t you respect what “my truth” is? I believe that the host becomes Jesus. You don’t. I respect that you don’t believe; I have no issue with your disbelief. I don’t make fun of you for not believing. As a fellow human, I would have expected the respect to be reciprocal.

  338. #338 Pierre
    July 24, 2008

    Magnificent post, PZ. I hope the religiously inclined will
    read it carefully. I mean REALLY read it, and understand it,
    not just browse the picture and complain. There’s nothing
    evil here, nothing hateful. Just plain common sense, and
    a reminder that freeing ourselves from religion is the
    most moral thing that we humans can do. It’s just a cracker.

  339. #339 Steve_C
    July 24, 2008

    It’s all just stuff. That says it all.

  340. #340 Rey Fox
    July 24, 2008

    Another echo from an acolyte here. Good work.

    “This whole cracker business is too meaningless, and I hope that it will die down soon. It’s hard to believe that either side can invest as many electrons to this business as they have.”

    Right, I’m afraid this blog has become too silly, and I’ll ‘ave to shut it down.

    And the really troublesome part is as it gets more crowded, this thread will end up having even more replies due to that warning message that pops up in times of heavy traffic, and people re-submitting even though they most likely don’t have to.

  341. #341 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Stop posting, Andy! The intertubes are all clogged up. Don’t worry, you’re getting through multiple times, it just takes awhile.

  342. #342 Stark
    July 24, 2008

    Well done sir. Well done.

  343. #343 Chris
    July 24, 2008

    Lovely stuff and nicely done. Good on ya PZ

  344. #344 HolyRusk
    July 24, 2008

    I’m proud humanity also consists of people like you, Mr Myers. Now, up to us to act with intelligence and humor.

  345. #345 chigurh
    July 24, 2008

    adding the god delusion was clutch. well done!

  346. #346 Bill Dauphin
    July 24, 2008

    PZ:

    Not that there’s any substantial difference between the consecrated and unconsecrated version.

    Nor any insubstantial difference, either, no?

  347. #347 ash
    July 24, 2008

    beautifully written, beautifully ‘executed’. thank you professor.

  348. #348 thegomezsymbol
    July 24, 2008

    Oh man, you desecrated coffee?
    You will sure burn in hell for that one!

    Hurray for a good set of… gills.

  349. #349 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    @Tony Phillips

    um…No. It’s certainly a delicate operation sorta but it’s perfectly doable. I actually already poked one of them crackers through. Not a church one, a “candy” one (who the fuck thought “hey let’s use theses as candy”!? They’re gross!) Yea, there was one on my birthday cake at one time. I poked a candle through it and it stayed in one piece. Honest to “god”.

    Anyway, if he couldn’t do that, why did the church claim back then that the jews were doing it all the time?

  350. #350 Dave2
    July 24, 2008

    Pete Rooke wrote:

    And still no one has substantively countered my analogies. I’m not surprised.

    Pardon me, but where are these analogies to be found? Not on this page, anyway.

  351. #351 Andy
    July 24, 2008

    I’m so sorry for this repeated post above. It was unintended.

    Shame upon me.

  352. #352 Cardinal Shrew
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    You should put the remains of that copy of The God Delusion on ebay, it may not be sacred but I for one wouldn’t mind owning it.

  353. #353 Exitus
    July 24, 2008

    Posted by Ticktockman and #178:

    perhaps some part of the, er, Holy of Holies separated at a young age.

    Just *picture* it, my Catholic friends, chewing over that bit as it transubstantiates in your gullet. Holy indeed

    Ha! Nearly sprayed tea accross the room when i read this one.
    Hehehe…

  354. #354 Noadi
    July 24, 2008

    Beautiful job! I don’t mean the actual desecration, I honestly don’t care much about it other than being happy it’s over. What you wrote though is the far more important thing for people to realize. Nothing is sacred or should be taken on faith, question, learn, give respect where it is earned and deserved not where it is demanded. If it takes seeing symbols destroyed for some to wake up and see it than it’s worthwhile to do.

  355. #355 jb
    July 24, 2008

    “They are just paper. Nothing must be held sacred. Question everything.”

    Amen.

  356. #356 Dustin
    July 24, 2008

    Folks, this happens every time Myers Pharyngulates himself. Just hit the post button once and have faith that it will be carried by His Noodly Appendage to the comments where it belongs.

  357. #357 tim gueguen
    July 24, 2008

    Waaaaah, PZ is being a big meany by sucking up blog hits for yet another day! Traffic is down on mine, and I just know its because of this whole “cracker” business. This includes the outrage hits, as I have yet to have someone make an angry comment about my post claiming Mark Steyn is full of hot air, or that cocaine use won’t make the Barenaked Ladies seem hip and edgy.

  358. #358 Turdus
    July 24, 2008

    Well said PZ. I especially liked the part about “sacrilege to the host” as an excuse to murder non-believers. This blog got a lot of attention from a lot of people, PZ. I think the thing that drives Catholics crazy the most about the whole affair is that YOU DID GET SOME PEOPLE THINKING, especially young people who saw this, in spite of assurances otherwise. That is really what is driving them NUTS!

  359. #359 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Now if someone chooses to wear such an item it does not in the least bit make rape and sexual abuse permissible despite the fact that the odds increase exponentially.

    OH MY NON-EXISTENT GOD NO IT DOESN’T. Pete, feel free to have your bizarre and irrelevant analogies, but don’t be spreading actual untruths. Clothing has nothing do do with frequency of rape. Amazingly enough, the only thing that correlates with probability of rape is the presence of a rapist. And using something as horrendous as rape as analogy to an event involving throwing a cracker in the trash can is so wrong I can’t even express my contempt that you tried.

  360. #360 mark
    July 24, 2008

    Pete at #310: There is nothing to respond to; what you’ve written is simply irrelevant nonsense.

    I, too, cringe at the desecration of books!

  361. #361 Melanogaster
    July 24, 2008

    This was way cool. Well done!

  362. #362 Exitus
    July 24, 2008

    When I started writing my last comment, there were 214 posts. By the time the server accepted it there were 356. Wow.

  363. #363 Cat's Staff
    July 24, 2008

    Oh come on…’third rate’….U of M Morris is better then that!

  364. #364 Ben
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, are we still on to go unicorn hunting this fall?

  365. #365 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Holy motherfucking christ, John, get a fucking life you spammer!

    How come there’s no character limit on this blog anyway?!

  366. #366 Nina in London
    July 24, 2008

    P Z Myers in post #200 wrote

    “Not that there’s any substantial difference between the consecrated and unconsecrated version.”

    Hey, PZ is a comedian! To us Catholics, transubstantiation is *exactly* the difference. It is a wafer of wheat with the exactly the same form and taste as before the consecration, but after consecration the form is still of wheat but the substance is now the Body of Christ.

    To share the bread is wonderful and beautiful sacrament, to those that believe – and surely worthy of respect. Those that eat the host are proclaiming “I am part of the Church and I believe in what it teaches and we are all one in Christ.”

    This incident is not going to damage the Church and I hope that it will strengthen people’s faith and encourage people to find out about the Catholic faith in all its richness.

    Incidentally, the Brompton Oratory, scene of the theft, is very beautiful and any visitors will enjoy the tranquility and reverent atmosphere, but please in future treat it and those that serve and worship there with respect.

    Anyway, I would think that Jesus is having a good chuckle at all this. After all, he was renowned for eating with sinners rather than those who proclaimed themselves to be holy, the Gospels are full of dinners indoors and out. His message was one of forgiveness and encouragement.

  367. #367 Benjamin Franklin
    July 24, 2008

    Well Done, PZ!

    You might want to start worrying about that banana, though.
    Next thing you know, Ray Comfort & Kirk Cameron are going to come to Morris & paper your house with $1,000,000 bill tracts. See what you have started now?

    By the way, I knew I was right a couple of threads back when I called out that coward to prove that UM Morris is a 4th tier University, as he so inaccuratly called it.

    ps – I still think the Viking funeral would have been comical, yet dignified.

    pps- The focus group results on ChristoCracker-Desecratingly Delicious haven’t scored as high as we had hoped, so we sent the package down to marketing, & they have really done an outstanding job to upscale the product.

    Announcing – CHRISTESSENCE Table WafersBaked in the Spirit

    We’re still working on the whole ad package, kind of a riff on the Keebler elves,
    only with angels – what do you think?

    ..
    .

  368. #368 Chris
    July 24, 2008

    Lovely stuff, well done PZ

  369. #369 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    It’s the iron-fortified cracker.

    By the way, to those offended, note what the Church itself did about all of this. Nothing.

    Really, it does no good for the church (though it might convince you that you’re good) to make a big deal about a common offense. I’m sure that much “worse” is done by many out of the public eye, so that you’re not protesting the violation so much as the fact that it is well-known. Unfortunately (and I’m serious, I wish it had not been hyped), you are thereby ensuring that it will be even more well-known.

    I wouldn’t have done it, but that’s my judgment, not to be confused with PZ’s. I suggest giving it a rest.

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  370. #370 Longtime Lurker
    July 24, 2008

    Dear Mr Rooke, WTF is up with your miniskirt/rape obsession? You are a creep of the greatest magnitude.

    Just to do some gratuitous priest-bashing… how many of those young male victims were wearing miniskirts, Mr Rooke?

  371. #371 Kenny
    July 24, 2008

    Absolutely brilliant! Of all the myriad ways I imagined you could deal with this cracker, I can’t think of a more appropriate ending.

  372. #372 Dave
    July 24, 2008

    Ale #316:
    “Just start subjecting ALL ideas that are presented to you to this very same treatment.”

    Ahh, but I do. I will grant Dr. Myers the same level of evidence I accept from the apostles and their disciples: if an actual eyewitness (e.g. the person who gave him the host) or someone with direct contact with the eyewitness (e.g., presumably, Dr. Myers himself), is willing to die rather than recant his claim that the host was consecrated, I will be convinced that it was, in fact, consecrated.

  373. #373 octopod
    July 24, 2008

    Couldn’t have been done with any more style or substance. PZ, you’re awesome.

  374. #374 HolyRusk
    July 24, 2008

    whoops apology for repeated posts, the servers seem to have reached their final hour.

  375. #375 merkin j. pus-tart
    July 24, 2008

    perfect . . .

  376. #376 Jonathan
    July 24, 2008

    I am shocked and outraged by your treatment of The God Delusion. That was unnecessary and hurtful to my beliefs.

    Now, I’ll have to kill you in some painful and horrific way. I’m a little busy at work right now, so it might have to wait. hmmm. Come to think of it, I’m on the west coast, so it’s a little far for me to travel to… whatever state you’re in. I hear there’s states other than California and Los Vegas, but I don’t know what they are… It would really help if you came here. Perhaps I could give you a good killing over lunch. I know a fantastic sushi place you’ll just love. Tuesdays and Thursdays are best for me. Just give your number to my people, and they’ll set something up for us.

    Thank you for your immediate attention to this matter.

    Jonathan

  377. #377 jfatz
    July 24, 2008

    How DARE you desecrate the holy writ of our Lord and Savior, Richard Dawkins? You will surely burn! BURRRRRN!

    …you know. If you, like… go to the beach. And don’t bring suntan lotion.

  378. #378 abeja
    July 24, 2008

    Excellent!

  379. #379 Steve P.
    July 24, 2008

    A post for the ages.

  380. #380 pksp
    July 24, 2008

    I don’t know why you had to waste a perfectly good copy of The God Delusion to prove your point? At least that book is geared towards opening minds.

    With that said, well done.

  381. #381 5ive
    July 24, 2008

    @106
    “The God Delusion is about what we don’t believe; the Eucharist and the Koran are symbols of what other people do believe. I would’ve preferred a genuine work of science to be among the desecratees.
    Vivek”

    Wouldn’t the banana count since it has been scientifically engineered to reach its current edible-tasty state? Not to mention the trash can itself and the book pages and the ink on the pages and the coffee grounds and the rust reaction with the metals of the nail are a direct “symbol” of “scientism”, wait, the cracker, too, used science to be “created”. Don’t forget about the breath PZ was exhaling and inhaling while he did this, that counts as science as well.
    I guess we desecrate science every freaking day.

  382. #382 Chuck Lunney
    July 24, 2008

    Not that there’s any substantial difference between the consecrated and unconsecrated version

    Wait, PZ! Didn’t you mean there isn’t any TRANSsubstantial difference?

    And I heartily applaud including part of The God Delusion in this “public desecration”. About the only thing missing was a page from Origin of the Species. Oh well — can’t have everything. Besides, it looked like your trashcan was getting full.

    The prologue was worth the price of admission!

    Congratulations on a spectacular non-event of less-than-epic proportions.

  383. #383 Dr Doctor
    July 24, 2008

    John

    Have you ever heard of keeping things brief?

    PZ Myers, you turned this into an object lesson. Bravo.

  384. #384 Alexander Treseder
    July 24, 2008

    imagine reading all of #355 and staying awake.

  385. #385 TripMaster Monkey
    July 24, 2008

    John,

    Nice copypasta. Do you feel better now?

  386. #386 Spook
    July 24, 2008

    Shorter #355:

    “blah blah magic man blah blah CRACKERS blah blah”

  387. #387 BG
    July 24, 2008

    PZ – it’d be cool if the entire episode could be recapped with highlights so I can pass it along (like to my kids) without making people wade through 1,000s of comments.

    My only fear is that PZ has jumped the shark.

  388. #388 Mark
    July 24, 2008

    So, John at #355, are the contorted scribblings of deluded old men supposed to scare us?

  389. #389 Matthew
    July 24, 2008

    “No desecration would have taken place were the host not consecrated, and thus no Catholic would even bother to notice. Yet, PZ claims the host was consecrated. Let him prove hi8s claim. Nobody has to believe it is the body of Christ for the act of consecration is a public act perfomed by a Catholic priest.

    So, where’s the proof, or is this place not about science after all?”

    TG, that’s a silly detail. The fact that the presence or absence of hand-waving and Latin mumbling near the cracker has any affect on whether Catholics should be pissed off or not just goes to highlight how incredibly stupid this mythology really is.

  390. #390 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Just saw the proof video! This is not a matter of faith anymore! Thanks PZ, thanks mysterious dude! GOOD JOB!

  391. #391 Ric
    July 24, 2008

    Hey PZ, can you delete that long bullshit post that John made?

  392. #392 Eric
    July 24, 2008

    @ #373

    Ahh, but I do. I will grant Dr. Myers the same level of evidence I accept from the apostles and their disciples: if an actual eyewitness (e.g. the person who gave him the host) or someone with direct contact with the eyewitness (e.g., presumably, Dr. Myers himself), is willing to die rather than recant his claim that the host was consecrated, I will be convinced that it was, in fact, consecrated.

    That is only evidence for the strength of their beliefs. It’s not evidence for the truth of their beliefs.

  393. #393 Savagemutt
    July 24, 2008

    Very nice post. And you’ve handled the whole incident with remarkable restraint.

  394. #394 Happy Girl 300
    July 24, 2008

    The only sacrilege in this case is a possible waste of food calories. If it had been a jar of peanut butter, that would have been MUCH worse.

  395. #395 Mohamed(real)
    July 24, 2008

    What a wild ride!

  396. #396 Erasmussimo
    July 24, 2008

    I have been following this brouhaha with mixed feelings. On the one hand, I agree that PZ Myers’ actions have instructive value; sometimes it’s salutary for somebody to blatantly challenge our assumptions in a flamboyant fashion. On the other hand, I am uncomfortable with deliberate attempts to hurt other people’s feelings. Let’s face it, Mr. Myers’ actions do hurt the feelings of Catholics and are intended to do so. Does the educational value of Mr. Myers’ actions outweigh the emotional hurt inflicted? I don’t know. It is fundamental to human nature that nobody learns without some pain. The advance of civil rights in the 1960s took place only by inflicting some pain upon racists. It was justifiable because the pain they inflicted through their racism was greater than the emotional discomfort that was wrought upon them to change their ways. But does the diffuse injury to society inflicted by religion justify the specific emotional pain the Mr. Myers visits upon Catholics? I don’t know.

    My greatest concern, however, is not with the mainstream reaction to Mr. Myers’ actions, but with the reactions from the wingnuts. There will surely be Catholics who react with ugly ferocity, and these few may further polarize the cultural response. Mr. Myers is taking a significant risk here; while I admire his courage, I fear that violence directed against him will polarize the situation and make healthy progress more difficult.

    There is an opportunity for a positive result in all this: if members of the Catholic community firmly and loudly declare that the essence of Christianity demands that Catholics turn the other cheek and love Mr. Myers as much as they love themselves, then the nobler side of religion will be asserted and perhaps some progress will be made against the ignoble side of religion. At this point, the ball is in their court. The challenge has been placed upon them: is Catholicism a religion of love or a superstitious tribe? I retain some small optimism that perhaps the outcome will a happy one.

  397. #397 Steve_C
    July 24, 2008

    It’s all just stuff. That says it all.

  398. #398 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    John (#355), thanks for the spam, but next time please just provide a link. Several screens of copying and pasting is a bit much.

  399. #399 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, that was one of the most brilliant posts I have ever read, thank you so much for this!

    Congratulations on the desecration, I hope it leads to mass cracker killings all around the nation.

  400. #400 drjimmy
    July 24, 2008

    Well done, PZ. A wonderful essay and an appropriate final act to the drama.

  401. #401 Mohamed
    July 24, 2008

    What a wild ride!

  402. #402 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    Hey PZ, can you delete that long bullshit post that John made?

    Or rather, replace it with a link. No censorship, it’s just that no one’s going to read it, hence it is so much spamming.

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/2kxyc7

  403. #403 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    @John (www.catholic.com)

    Come on, man! That was infantile. Am I posting the entire TimeCube page over at your blog? No, I did not think so… So why do you do it here?

  404. #404 sQuee.
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo. I generally thought all of this was well done and am quite pleased how the ending came about. There was definite proof that it occurred, although the cracker blends into the pages in the picture. You have to find the nail, then look for the cracker on the nail. I normally wouldn’t have agreed with the nail, seemed a tad overboard, but made it very easy to see that there was indeed a dry, tasteless looking cracker at the end of said nail.
    All in all, bravo.

  405. #405 Sarcastro
    July 24, 2008

    if you mean germany as a catholic nation 70 years ago, that’s wrong, germany was (is) majority protestant (more then than now, as more secular germans have protestant than catholic background).

    #1: Spain and Poland are both better contenders for what PZ was rattling on about.

    #2: Look up the difference between ‘majority’ and ‘plurality’. The latter is what Protestants in Germany are. The former is what they are not.

    In fact, the single largest Christian denomination in Germany is Catholicism. Only when all Protestant denominations are added together do they outnumber the Catholics. And not by a whole lot.

  406. #406 Joe
    July 24, 2008

    The scene looks carefully staged what with the nail over two title pages that are facing us with the other trash off to the side. You are a schemer, PZ.

  407. #407 sil-chan
    July 24, 2008

    I think its time to impliment a maximum limit to the length of a post due to people like John. Here I was going along reading posts and BAM… A huge pile of words fell on me >.>

  408. #408 Doubting Foo
    July 24, 2008

    I agree with a few others above…you should have included the title page from Origin of Species…

  409. #409 Dustin
    July 24, 2008

    Fuck you, John.

  410. #410 Randy!
    July 24, 2008

    Still working my way through the comments but wanted to get my “Bravo!” in here while the thread was still open.

    I really like that any Catholic furbrains will have to try to read through the history of their religion before getting to the meat of the post. Perhaps one of them will get a bit of enlightenment…

  411. #411 sQuee.
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo. I generally thought all of this was well done and am quite pleased how the ending came about. There was definite proof that it occurred, although the cracker blends into the pages in the picture. You have to find the nail, then look for the cracker on the nail. I normally wouldn’t have agreed with the nail, seemed a tad overboard, but made it very easy to see that there was indeed a dry, tasteless looking cracker at the end of said nail.
    All in all, bravo.
    Oh, and as a note: if a cracker is actually the body of someone (regardless of whom), Catholics are cannibals and should be thrown in jail. There have been a few cannibals in the past century who have claimed that they did it to become closer to God. Lovely, lovely religion you people have going on. Yeesh.

  412. #412 Rebecca Watson
    July 24, 2008

    Just chiming in to add my “nicely done,” PZ. Well-written and educational response.

  413. #413 ihatevi
    July 24, 2008

    #79 – LOL!!

  414. #414 ErikFK
    July 24, 2008

    #355 John: nice copy and paste job. Now please go preach your neighbor’s cows – and don’t forget to pray for them.

    To the actual topic: I’m impressed. PZ gave the whole story a excellent final turn, I can identify myself with – though I’m certainly far more respectful of religions than he is.

  415. #415 TS Loosli
    July 24, 2008

    Well Done PZ. Let the religious beat thier chests and stand on their hind legs. Unlike real apes, they are nothing to fear.

    Kudos,

    TS

  416. #416 Bachalon
    July 24, 2008

    Well said, Professor. Thank you.

  417. #417 Philip H.
    July 24, 2008

    “Nothing must be held sacred. Question everything. God is not great, Jesus is not your lord, you are not disciples of any charismatic prophet. You are all human beings who must make your way through your life by thinking and learning, and you have the job of advancing humanities’ knowledge by winnowing out the errors of past generations and finding deeper understanding of reality. You will not find wisdom in rituals and sacraments and dogma, which build only self-satisfied ignorance, but you can find truth by looking at your world with fresh eyes and a questioning mind.”

    If you actually read Christian Scripture, you will see Jesus encouraging his followers to do EXACTLY THIS. That fact that humans, in all our wonderful wisdom, ignore Jesus call and teaching, doesn’t mean he isn’t right. He ate, afterall, with tax collectors and prostitutes, some of the most reviled people of his day.

  418. #418 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    John, go touch yourself, you’re annoying.

  419. #419 Voltaire
    July 24, 2008

    Quite possibly the most elegant essay I’ve read this year. Thank you, sir.

  420. #420 TripMaster Monkey
    July 24, 2008

    Again with the copypasta, John?

    Thanks for verifying you have nothing to contribute. I was going to ask you to discuss what you had posted, but now I see you’re not really equipped for that sort of rational discussion.

    PZ, could you please remove John’s novels from the comments page? Thx.

  421. #421 Brownian, OM
    July 24, 2008

    The challenge has been placed upon them: is Catholicism a religion of love or a superstitious tribe? I retain some small optimism that perhaps the outcome will a happy one.

    Posted by: Erasmussimo

    In the great ledger sheet of Catholicism’s virtues and vices, history would seem to trump optimism every time.

  422. #422 qbsmd
    July 24, 2008

    Does this count as art? You might be able to get someone to buy your trash can.

  423. #423 Rob
    July 24, 2008

    It is appropriate that PZ destroyed books. Recall the library of Alexandria was burned by religious fanatics. I believe that the Catholic Church even canonized someone for the deed.

  424. #424 Juan
    July 24, 2008

    PZ is the best!

  425. #425 Dave
    July 24, 2008

    @#393

    That is only evidence for the strength of their beliefs. It’s not evidence for the truth of their beliefs.

    Granted. This is why I stipulated that those professing the beliefs be eyewitnesses or have direct contact with eyewitnesses. I tend to believe eyewitness accounts when they are so strongly believed.

  426. #426 Matt Penfold
    July 24, 2008

    Hey, PZ is a comedian! To us Catholics, transubstantiation is *exactly* the difference. It is a wafer of wheat with the exactly the same form and taste as before the consecration, but after consecration the form is still of wheat but the substance is now the Body of Christ.

    That is meaningless. It is just an abuse of the English language. What you are in effect saying is that it is both the same and different. That is simply nonsensical. What properties does it have after consecration that it did not have before ? If there are no physical differences then there is no difference. Did you not do science at school or something ? There is an important concept in science, that basically states if you cannot tell two things apart then they are identical.

  427. #427 GAtheist
    July 24, 2008

    Fuck, we need a block user option. Spammer StJohn is a shitbag.

  428. #428 Cardinal Shrew
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    I too would like to add my sentiments before the thread gets too full. Well done!

  429. #429 Adrienne
    July 24, 2008

    Hey, I think I see the face of Jesus weeping in the banana peel. Seriously, though, I’m glad this is over. Enough of Wafergate.

  430. #430 Anthony
    July 24, 2008

    Am I the only one that thinks John’s long ass post can be aptly characterized as WHITE NOISE?

  431. #431 Steve_C
    July 24, 2008

    Someone’s IP address needs to be banned.

    Fucktard.

  432. #432 lytefoot
    July 24, 2008

    Wow… attacking FOUR sacred cows at once! The communion, the koran, the god delusion, and English grammar. I believe you meant to say “Humanity’s knowledge,” that is, the knowledge of just one humanity (say hooray to our friend, the collective noun!).

    Just kidding with the spelling flame, of course–though if there’s one thing that inflames my irrationality it’s the desecration of the sacred apostrophe. Very good post, well written, showing excellent insight into the history of the issue–I only wish Xians showed as much insight into the history of their religion. Wanted to chime in and and that, ha ha, I won the betting pool around here, I suspected you’d throw it in the trash.

    This whole thing started out as kind of childish, but it ended up fairly moving. Like a lot of your more thoughtful pieces, it ended up coming across as moving in the same way that a good church service does. (Note: I was raised Unitarian, this has shaped my perception of the way a church service Should Be. If you don’t argue about it at least all the way home afterward, it wasn’t any good.)

    Good luck, PZ. Hope none of the violent crazies are also motivated. You might want to consider hiring a ninja.

  433. #433 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    What kind of idiot is this? He did it again! 3 times now!

    Killfile Dungeon! < \b>

  434. #434 J.D. Hutton
    July 24, 2008

    John:

    tl;dr

  435. #435 H.H.
    July 24, 2008

    Delete the spammer(s), please. It is clear that when pressed to think for themselves, they resort to drowning themselves in mind-numbing blocks of meaningless text. Fine, but no reason the rest of us need to drown as well.

  436. #436 ryanm
    July 24, 2008

    fuckin’ A. Bravo, PZ. Though significant on a symbolic level, what you have done is so trivial, no, of no import WHATSOEVER compared to the vile barbarism perpetrated in the name of Catholicism. I single that one out just because they’re the only ones who give a fuck about this goddamn cracker, and they’ve been so gracious as to show through their recent comments that vile barbarism is apparently alive and well in the ranks of the faithful. Good luck, and Reason-speed.

  437. #437 Atticus
    July 24, 2008

    Love it

  438. #438 ThirtyFiveUp
    July 24, 2008

    As always, PZ is a teacher. And an accomplished writer. I did not know about the Fourth Lateran Council of 1215 which led to repeated murders of Jews. Murdered because superstitious Christians believed bread could be Jesus.

    By the way, I eagerly await publication of his book.

  439. #439 Rey Fox
    July 24, 2008

    “No way! Bananas have to be brown to taste right. Chiquita says so!”

    All right, NOW we got blasphemy on our hands. Bananas are best when they have just a little green still on them. Only the fool in his heart says otherwise.

    (Although browned bananas are still useful for making things like banana bread.)

  440. #440 Kevin L.
    July 24, 2008

    You know, for all this gnashing of teeth over “where’s the proof of consecration?” or “I thought this site was about SCIENCE and EVIDENCE” and “you’re just accepting Myers’ word on FAITH that it was real,” whatever… There’s one critical difference between accepting the word of, say, a priest, and accepting the word of PZ. PZ, unlike the priest, has demonstrated frequently and repeatedly that he is honest and credible, and, speaking for myself, I have no reason to doubt him now. Similarly, unlike, say, a religious zealout, Pharyngula enthusiasts, if faced with EVIDENCE that their trust was misplaced, will own up to their error.

    A very nice post, PZ – a fitting way to end the madness. Now: more cephalopods, please! :)

  441. #441 AaronSTL
    July 24, 2008

    Well played, PZ but I still think you should have copied some text from the Koran onto the cracker and fed it to a willing Jewish person…maybe along with some bacon and a good beer.

  442. #442 eguy
    July 24, 2008

    I love the Monty Python references. Although I disagree with your need provoke catholics I would agree with most of what you said. I mean death treats over a cracker. You can’t make this stuff up.

  443. #443 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    The spammer is a sock puppet. He’s used at least 3 names. I’m strongly against censorship, but I don’t think deleting spam and deleting sock puppets is censorship.

  444. #444 Eric
    July 24, 2008

    @ #428

    Granted. This is why I stipulated that those professing the beliefs be eyewitnesses or have direct contact with eyewitnesses. I tend to believe eyewitness accounts when they are so strongly believed.

    Yet in the case of Christianity you accept edited, translated, censored versions of second- or third-hand (or possibly more) eyewitness testimony.

    One thing people are missing here is that there’s two competing theories – that it was consecrated, or that it wasn’t – and you need to compare the evidence for the two, not just demand evidence for one until it meets your expectations.

    If you think it wasn’t consecrated, present your evidence.

  445. #445 Exitus
    July 24, 2008

    Ye Gods, this ‘John’ bloke is getting rather annoying. To the Dungeon with him!

    Exitus

  446. #446 Jolly Bloger
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, this insult will not stand. I can’t believe you did something so horrible to the God Delusion! I expect an apology immediately.

    http://jollybloger.blogspot.com/2008/07/pz-has-gone-too-far.html

  447. #447 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    Come on, PZ! Spamming, morphing, insipidity, godbotting… this must be a record: The idiot got himself into Dungeon-worthy shape after a handful of posts!

  448. #448 Minneapolitian
    July 24, 2008

    Thank you so much for doing this. You are a hero to anyone who actually uses their brain to think. Another reason for me to be proud of living in liberal Minneapolis is this happened right in my city! Ohhhh, you must plan something new!!!

  449. #449 ryanm
    July 24, 2008

    fuckin’ A. Bravo, PZ. Though significant on a symbolic level, what you have done is so trivial, no, of no import WHATSOEVER compared to the vile barbarism perpetrated in the name of Catholicism. I single that one out just because they’re the only ones who give a fuck about this goddamn cracker, and they’ve been so gracious as to show through their recent comments that vile barbarism is apparently alive and well in the ranks of the faithful. Good luck, and Reason-speed.

  450. #450 Melinda Dillon
    July 24, 2008

    Well done!!!

  451. #451 gruggach
    July 24, 2008

    Way to go, PZ! I’m very happy with what you’ve done. You very eloquently hit the nail on the head.

  452. #452 Hap
    July 24, 2008

    1) I see somebody found out how to cut and paste. How unfortunate.

    2) This seems like an appropriate ending. Someone might learn something from it (it wasn’t just to annoy people), or at least, know where you stand. Of course, the multithousand post threads indicate that there isn’t very much willingness to listen or to learn anything, so the show goes on (sort of).

    Although, realizing this, it sounds too much like the dialogue between the kid and Arnold in the desert scene in Terminator 2: “We’re not going to make it, are we?”

  453. #453 Chris P
    July 24, 2008

    Hopefully you will go back through your trash and recycle properly.

    Otherwise best thread yet. Another step in dismantling the stupidity of gods.

  454. #454 Chicago
    July 24, 2008

    For all of you hoping for the long threads of catholics and religious, I laugh! Out of the first 100 I’ve read there was one, maybe a questionable two. The others, just a bunch of attention starved children, led by a man who is still hoping to get noticed. Bravo, bravo- Out of these post, all of the threads- you yourselves have accounted for 90% of your own grandstanding.

  455. #455 Jay
    July 24, 2008

    Well done. Kudos.

  456. #456 Jochen
    July 24, 2008

    I’d still say that turning the flesh of jesus into poop is more offensive. And that’s what these catholics are doing every sunday! Unbelievable! Damn cannibals!

  457. #457 Jolly Bloger
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, this insult will not stand. I can’t believe you did something so horrible to the God Delusion! I expect an apology immediately.

    http://jollybloger.blogspot.com/2008/07/pz-has-gone-too-far.html

  458. #458 ryanm
    July 24, 2008

    fuckin’ A. Bravo, PZ. Though significant on a symbolic level, what you have done is so trivial, no, of no import WHATSOEVER compared to the vile barbarism perpetrated in the name of Catholicism. I single that one out just because they’re the only ones who give a fuck about this goddamn cracker, and they’ve been so gracious as to show through their recent comments that vile barbarism is apparently alive and well in the ranks of the faithful. Good luck, and Reason-speed.

  459. #459 fontinalis
    July 24, 2008

    Well played, sir. I raise a glass in your honor. Your words, both well chosen and articulated, almost made the closing image anticlimactic. Almost.

  460. #460 Feshy
    July 24, 2008

    Well played, PZ, well played.

  461. #461 Crudely Wrott
    July 24, 2008

    Done with finesse and grace, Dr. Myers.

  462. #462 Zar
    July 24, 2008

    I wish Catholics would make half the fuss over the Church’s shameful, deadly policies regarding family planning in third-world countries as they do about snack desecration.

    Destruction of a cracker: an outrage.
    Death of Africans: whatev.

    Andy:

    Generally, the US is much less vigilant about proper waste disposal than Germany. We’re pretty wasteful. Here, we recycle paper, cans and bottles, and not a lot else. Many recycling plants don’t process assorted Verpackungen stuff. And I don’t know of any sanitation department that handles biological waste; you have to take care of that yourself with a compost heap in the backyard (if you have a backyard, that is—if you live in an apartment, forget about it!). If you want to be eco-friendly, it requires a lot more effort on your part. It stinks.

    I was amazed to find out how particular waste disposal was in Germany. I think it’s great! I wish we did stuff like that, but I suppose it would cost a fair amount of money and we just don’t have the public funds as the taxes are so much lower and all.

  463. #463 the other Adam
    July 24, 2008

    I’d have desecrated a watermelon too (since they’re yummy and in season) and a copy of Atlas Shrugged. Except that in my town, paper, banana peels and metal all go in different bins.

  464. #464 Jack Picknell
    July 24, 2008

    In the paraphrased words of our Lord, forgive him Father, he does not know what he is doing. PZ I humbly suggest that you seriously consider repenting.

    Remember that the God who made you and I both has said “I will repay”.

  465. #465 Chris Granade
    July 24, 2008

    Holy crap… what’s the comment length cap? I like being able to post a length comment now and again, but BnotAfraid takes the cake for long comments. Then again, copy-and-pasting a comment is kind of cheating, no?

  466. #466 kryptonic
    July 24, 2008

    Is that jesus’ likeness I see there in the banana peel?

    What’s the character limit on this blog anyway? Whatever it is, it’s too high.

  467. #467 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    This deserves a fucking Pulitzer.

  468. #468 Mika H
    July 24, 2008

    Devastating.

    Bravo, PZ.

    I hope there’s one more thing theists of all kind take home from this: hate or desire to hurt someone was never PZ’s motivation nor goal. If you think so, or feel deeply hurt by this article, it’s time to take off the blinders and do some serious soul searching.

    Shame, though. It would’ve been great to time the desecration with the coming solar eclipse. ;)

    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/07/080722-solar-eclipse.html

  469. #469 Aaron
    July 24, 2008

    In the words of Brian:

    You’re all individuals!

  470. #470 Kergillian
    July 24, 2008

    What? You DARE DESECRATE THE GOD DELUSION? I loved that book! And the Banana! What did it ever do to you?
    That is an outrage!

    No Soup for you!

    I’ll bet you wouldn’t have the balls to do that to the Eucharist or the Quran… oh, wait… you did. Well then. Never mind.

    Oh, and well said! Now if you’ll excuse me, I’m having a sacred cow for lunch, and I think I’ll have it with some bacon.

  471. #471 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Make ready the lacy, gently wafting curtains in the dungeon for John!

  472. #472 cyborgsuzy
    July 24, 2008

    Hmm. Personally, I prefer recycling for the paper products, and composting for the coffee grounds, banana peels and crackers.

  473. #473 SteadyEddy
    July 24, 2008

    #68 oops… “unrational” isn’t even a word. I meant irrational or, better yet, unreasonable. I was in a hurry to break the top 100. PZ’s much more eloquent than I am… which leads me to ask PZ… when can we look forward to a book of your thoughts on science and religion? Maybe see you for Sunday brunch at Q.Cumbers… again, well done PZ!

  474. #474 Bert Chadick
    July 24, 2008

    You done ‘dem crackers wrong, but why throw away a banana when it’s just getting good.

    PZ, You’ve been traveling a lot lately, and I hope you have been taking the bibles out of the rooms when you check out. I use them in my paper fired charcoal starter and they work great. Better than newspaper.

  475. #475 Dustin
    July 24, 2008

    PZ I humbly suggest that you seriously consider repenting.

    You’re full of shit. Humility and sanctimony aren’t compatible.

  476. #476 AGatMSI
    July 24, 2008

    @ #450:

    Epic Win!

  477. #477 Dahan
    July 24, 2008

    “Hmm… some smart guy. Talk about being totally stupid, I can only think of God’s mercy toward this guy is going to be a baseball bat to his head so he finally gets it through that head of his that the Eucharist is Jesus.”

    Posted by both : someone221 and Interested reader.

    Here’s a clue for ya. If your going to use Sockpuppetry, try changing the words a little so we may think it’s not the same person… god, you people really are dumb as a box of rocks aren’t ya.

  478. #478 Chicago
    July 24, 2008

    For all of you hoping for the long threads of catholics and religious, I laugh! Out of the first 100 I’ve read there was one, maybe a questionable two. The others, just a bunch of attention starved children, led by a man who is still hoping to get noticed. Bravo, bravo- Out of these post, all of the threads- you yourselves have accounted for 90% of your own grandstanding.

  479. #479 CalGeorge
    July 24, 2008

    I hope that was an organic banana, PZ.

    And shade-grown, fair-trade, organic coffee.

    And please remember to recycle that paper!

    Three cheers for the trashing and desecration of that moronic symbol of Catholic stupidity.

  480. #480 onclepsycho
    July 24, 2008

    Just wait until that strident Dawkins guy hears about this…

  481. #481 Bob
    July 24, 2008

    Amen PZ.

  482. #482 Susannah
    July 24, 2008

    There can be no danger of excess in our care for this mystery, for “in this sacrament is recapitulated the whole mystery of our salvation”.”

    I think John has taken the bolded part to heart. But Pope Rat was wrong.

    (Yes, I read the screed. At least, some of it. FSM help me!)

    And, Bravo, PZ!

  483. I guess it had to be anti-climatic. After all, I can’t think of any possible way to be truly evil to a cracker.

    P.S.: You’re conclusion is the best thing I’ve read all year. Cheers.

  484. #484 Todd
    July 24, 2008

    Praise FSM!

  485. #485 Chicago
    July 24, 2008

    For all of you hoping for the long threads of catholics and religious, I laugh! Out of the first 100 I’ve read there was one, maybe a questionable two. The others, just a bunch of attention starved children, led by a man who is still hoping to get noticed. Bravo, bravo- Out of these post, all of the threads- you yourselves have accounted for 90% of your own grandstanding.

  486. #486 Kergillian
    July 24, 2008

    What? You DARE DESECRATE THE GOD DELUSION? I loved that book! And the Banana! What did it ever do to you?
    That is an outrage!

    No Soup for you!

    I’ll bet you wouldn’t have the balls to do that to the Eucharist or the Quran… oh, wait… you did. Well then. Never mind.

    Oh, and well said! Now if you’ll excuse me, I’m having a sacred cow for lunch, and I think I’ll have it with some bacon.

  487. #487 eguy
    July 24, 2008

    I love the Monty Python references. I disagree about how you approached this, being rude on purpose about meaningless things does not strike me as the right thing to do. I do agree that the responses are 50 times worse than any thing I would have imagined. I mean death threats over a cracker? You can not make this stuff up.

  488. #488 Brownian, OM
    July 24, 2008

    Next time, run a rusty nail through the douchebag spambot. What a waste of stem cells.

  489. #489 Martin
    July 24, 2008

    #310 Pete Rooke: Suppose you had a very sacred book outlining your philosophy on life. This book also happened to be stitched together and bound in the skin and flesh of a loved one who had recently passed away.

    Now desecrating the Eucharist would have the same effect as desecrating that book and posting the evidence in glee.

    Which just goes to show how incredibly stupid and silly your view of your cracker is. Your cracker is not the skin or flesh of a loved one, or anyone else. It’s a cracker, that you fantasize you have transformed into something else by virtue of a medievalist superstitious ritual. In terms of reality, it is still a cracker, no matter what gibberish and hand-waving spell-casting some man in robes does over it.

    Honestly, do you really think these cartoon analogies constitute impressive arguments?

  490. #490 Dav Laurel
    July 24, 2008

    Gratuitous and stupid. And that’s coming from an agnostic who never received any formal religious instruction.

  491. #491 Dave Godfrey
    July 24, 2008

    John you git, you owe me a new scroll wheel.

  492. #492 Glen Davidson
    July 24, 2008

    Hey John, do you really like using the “Holy Father’s” words as so much garbage to gum up a forum’s works?

    Seems that you have a problem with committing sacrilege, at least according to your religion.

    Glen D
    http://tinyurl.com/

  493. #493 Paul Hands
    July 24, 2008

    Nice one, PZ!

    I just hope this doesn’t spur one or another set of nutters to actually take a ction against you or yours…..please be careful.

    As for that Tony Philips nobhead (#329), he’s wrong. Before learning to think for myself, I was brought up a catholic, and was an altar boy (not of my own volition). The consistency of the crackers varies remarkably with age/humidity etc. Some would indeed shatter, but some, especially newer ones, could be bent in half without breaking. We used to use them as micro-frisbees, and they wouldn’t break.

    Being a catholic is like having rabies when nearly everyone else has distemper, and only a few are healthy.

  494. #494 JackC
    July 24, 2008

    Contrary to other opinions, and assuming from the position of prominence that recent consumption had taken place, that banana was just about perfect.

    JC

  495. #495 Feshy
    July 24, 2008

    Hey, what do you know. Another thing God perfectly designed a banana to do! ;)

  496. #496 Tom
    July 24, 2008

    Hard to grasp, but posts 419 and 457 were even more fucking ridiculous as post 482.

  497. #497 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Psst, John – NO ONE IS READING ANYTHING YOU POST.

  498. #498 ErikFK
    July 24, 2008

    god and his army of Johns, StLukes, BNotAfraid etc. knows how to make a denial of service attack?

    god, you have really impressed me – such allmightyness forces me to reconsider my atheism…

  499. #499 ed
    July 24, 2008

    Loud applause.Standing “O”.For the article not the fracking cracker.I wonder if the cat-licks teach that part of their past on Sundays?

  500. PZ, you’ll soon be hearing from the United Church of the Sacred Banana Peel.

  501. #501 Blaidd Drwg
    July 24, 2008

    444

    Just a cut-rate version of 666…

  502. #502 ZorkFox
    July 24, 2008

    Inspiring and illuminating. I’ll be sharing this with friends.

  503. #503 Helioprogenus
    July 24, 2008

    This is brilliant. Here we are thinking of the most elaborate ways of desecrating this idiot sucking symbolic piece of bread, and PZ does the least labor intensive and most time saving method of cracker mutilation. As for the Quran and the God Delusion, that’s an interesting touch. Nothing religious is sacred to rational, skeptical, and actual free thought.

    We should all just send in pictures of us desecrating something religious and have PZ post them up. Imagine how frenzied and insane these religious fucks would get. It wouldn’t just be limited to catholics either, but other christians, jews, muslims, hindus, buddhists, jains, etc.

  504. #504 ix
    July 24, 2008

    Well written Professor Myers.

    If I wanted to be an evil hypocrite, I’d drape myself in expensive jeweled robes and live in an ornate palace while telling all my followers that poverty is a virtue.

    That sentence was gold.

  505. #505 Rey Fox
    July 24, 2008

    Also, banana peels tend to brown rapidly when they have been separated from the rest of the banana.

    Also, please stop whining about recycling the paper. This was a symbolic gesture. I’m sure PZ recycles every other scrap of paper he comes into contact with. Two trashed books aren’t going to destroy the world.

    (Nor a trashed cracker, OH!)

  506. #506 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Yea cuz you know, copy pasting annoyingly long stuff written by a church guy and pissing off everyone on a blog is the best way to convert them to Jesus, see.

    Stop being such an anus.

  507. #507 Jason
    July 24, 2008

    Well, its done. Looks like those Witchita Indian spirits gan finally rest now.

  508. #508 the other Adam
    July 24, 2008

    Never mind the LHC, I think John Paul’s comments are going to collapse into a singularity that will swallow the Earth.

  509. #509 doug
    July 24, 2008

    Jesus Christ, TheAnswer, that’s a long comment.

  510. #510 S.Scott
    July 24, 2008

    How come there aren’t any noodles in there?

  511. #511 dhonig
    July 24, 2008

    The experiment is not really over for another three days. Also, instead of covering the garbage can with a lid, can you use a large rock?

  512. #512 Phyllis
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo Professor Meyers!

  513. #513 kryptonic
    July 24, 2008

    Is that jesus’ likeness I see there in the banana peel?

    What’s the character limit on this blog anyway? Whatever it is, it’s too high.

  514. #514 Parsnip Money
    July 24, 2008

    John has turned into ‘GlobalWarmingFraud’

    WTF?

  515. #515 Buzz Buzz
    July 24, 2008

    Wow. I totally called the special addition.

    Or, well, I was damned close. I was thinking origin of species, but the god delusion was better option. I think that was about the best way you could have done that.

    Maybe that’ll get it through their thick skulls.

    Or more probably it just wont.

  516. #516 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    John? Listen up you fanatic. I got something to tell you.

    that’s all cute words, but back in 2003 the Pope was a vegetable. There’s no way he would’ve written all that. It was written by the puppetmasters behind the poor walking cadaver, okay?

  517. #517 tsg
    July 24, 2008

    Strange, I thought everyone here looked for compelling evidence for everything before coming to a conclusion.

    The amount of evidence required to conditionally believe an assertion is true is dependent on two things: how unlikely the claim is to be true; and how important it is to be correct. In this case, the answer is “not very” to both. It doesn’t matter in the slightest whether or not it is a consecrated cracker. The intolerance demonstrated by the believers is the entire point.

    There’s no evidence given by Dr. Myers that this host was actually consecrated. I, for one, don’t believe it.

    You’re learning, grasshopper.

  518. #518 chicago
    July 24, 2008

    For all of you hoping for the long threads of catholics and religious, I laugh! Out of the first 100 I’ve read there was one, maybe a questionable two. The others, just a bunch of attention starved children, led by a man who is still hoping to get noticed. Bravo, bravo- Out of these post, all of the threads- you yourselves have accounted for 90% of your own grandstanding.

  519. #519 Baba
    July 24, 2008

    That’s a sorry excuse for a desecration, and not even original. You should thank God that a tedious lack of imagination isn’t a mortal sin.

  520. #520 Josh G
    July 24, 2008

    Very well done! Great message, thank you for sharing.

  521. #521 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    If you believe that truth is relative, why can’t you respect what “my truth” is? I believe that the host becomes Jesus. You don’t. I respect that you don’t believe; I have no issue with your disbelief. I don’t make fun of you for not believing. As a fellow human, I would have expected the respect to be reciprocal.

    Posted by: Ben D | July 24, 2008 3:00 PM

    Ben, PZ doesn’t believe that the truth is relative. No serious Secular Humanist does. PZ wouldn’t be a scientist if he didn’t view approximate truth as highly important to himself and others. The whole deal here is: your religious truth claim is false. The idea that those wafers are a dead Jewish man is groundless. There is no legitimate evidence for it. He’s not a relativist, you are in insisting that he should respect a false claim as truth.

  522. #522 Who Cares
    July 24, 2008

    @GlobalCooling Fraud: Next time just post a link. Then you might have people actually reading what you say.

  523. #523 Jim
    July 24, 2008

    Just to add to the pile on the thread:

    OMGZ!11 UR GOIN TUH HAY-UHL!1!

    Love you, PZ. Keep up the good work. :D

  524. #524 the strangest brew
    July 24, 2008

    #406

    ‘Thou shalt not spam bullshite’, whether it be popery or blusterings of a mindless clone.

    When all the howling, gnashing of teeth, pontification and squealing is done tis just a cracker…live with it…!

  525. #525 Reginald Selkirk
    July 24, 2008

    RE #482: Another threat on your life; it appears someone is trying to bore you to death.

  526. #526 Canuck
    July 24, 2008

    What is a circumcised heart? I thought I knew about all of the strange religious rituals in the West. Sheesh. Is the heart’s foreskin sensitive? Inquiring minds want to know.

  527. #527 Hap
    July 24, 2008

    John seems to be implementing a DOS attack. You might want to block him or at least shrink his comments (disemvoweling, etc.), but YMMV.

  528. #528 Phyllis
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo!

  529. #529 Jason
    July 24, 2008

    And isn’t all this Catholic spam the equivalent of an atheist making a point in a debate, followed by a Christian covering their ears, closing their eyes, and quoting scripture loudly and incessantly in order to block out reason and logic?

  530. #530 Nerd of Redhead
    July 24, 2008

    Wonderfully understated desecration. Your preliminary remarks told the whole story.
    I add my desire to see the remarks of John Boy of our copy/paste deleted. FWIW, I never read any post that is longer than a screen until I see who wrote it. And then, I only read the long posts of the regulars.

  531. #531 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Seriously, you copy-pasters of long-winded bullshit. Fuck off. You should be banned for this crap.

  532. #532 Jim
    July 24, 2008

    OMGZ!11 UR GOIN TUH HAY-UHL!1!

    Love you, PZ. Keep up the good work. :D

  533. #533 Soybomb
    July 24, 2008

    Looks fitting to me. A cracker doesn’t need an elaborate disposal.

  534. #534 Buzz Buzz
    July 24, 2008

    I can’t even follow the conversation because all of the concentrated crazy that’s flying around in here.

  535. #535 Colin M
    July 24, 2008

    Chicago @462:

    “For all of you hoping for the long threads of catholics and religious, I laugh! Out of the first 100 I’ve read there was one, maybe a questionable two.”

    Unfortunate for you that your post is right after BnotAfraid’s post filled with 60+ paragraphs of Catholic dogma & apologetics.

  536. #536 Kristina
    July 24, 2008

    I hope it IT IS FINISHED. PZ what is happening to your SCIENCE BLOG…come on..is this something new that you going to do from now on…BORONG BORING BORING…I mean how many THANK YOU GREAT POST do you need…I feel like I am with a buch of morons from youtube…we hate atheists…no we hate christians…no we hate hamburgers…you’re an idiot…no you are…i hate you…no i hate you…WTF

  537. #537 mr-zero
    July 24, 2008

    wtf stmatthew – haven’t you heard of links!
    Z

  538. #538 alex
    July 24, 2008

    GlobalCooling Fraud:
    blahblahblahblah

    BAN

    also, massive kudos PZ.

  539. #539 -R
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, will you PLEEAAASSSEEE disemvowel all but the first posting of screed that keeps getting posted? It’s taking up like half the page.

  540. #540 Umilik
    July 24, 2008

    Beautiful.
    Just beautiful, Dr. Myers.
    Pure poetry.
    It gave me goosebumps.

  541. #541 Dirk
    July 24, 2008

    Skimming past the novels… there actually is a Magisterium? I totally thought Philip Pullman made that up!

  542. #543 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    I love how the Christians on here deny that it’s even a real “consecrated” wafer.

    How the hell would they recognize one if they mixed it up in a bag of regular wafers? That’s the whole point–this whole so-called miracle of the eucharist is nonsense.

  543. #544 chrisD
    July 24, 2008

    Thanks for the birthday present, PZ! You couldn’t have picked a better day!

  544. #545 AndrewG
    July 24, 2008

    John, what the fuck is wrong with you? Are your feelings so hurt that you cannot type? Relax my friend everything will be OK. Breath in … breath out.

    HAVE A CRACKER!

  545. #546 Righteous Bubba
    July 24, 2008

    I am disappointed that you didn’t have a tiny black hood, crate, and electrical cables handy.

  546. #547 Giljorak
    July 24, 2008

    BLAHBLAHBLAH DUH EUCHACRISPIA

    Of His Uselessness Pope Whats Its Face
    To The Biatches, Prudes, and Deamons
    Men and Women in the Secreted Life
    And All the Lay Faithbul

    On the Euchacrisp in its Relationship to the Chruch

    CHAPTER ONE
    THE MYSTERY OF BAKING

    Dude, it’s a frackin’ cracker.

    CONCLUSION
    YUMMY

    Pass the spray cheese please.

    Given in Rome, at Saint Nowhere’s, on 23 July, Thursday, in the year 2008, the uselessness of my Pontificate, the Year of the Rosey Palm.

  547. #548 Hessenroots
    July 24, 2008

    @ 310

    OK then Pete, lets see what we have here:

    1) Suppose you were a milkman with rotting teeth and cankerous lips…”

    The mythical milkman is entrusted and payed to deliver the milk to paying customers. The disgusting behavior you suggest violates that trust and poses a possible long term health risk. You suggest PZ, by his actions, is akin to this milkman.
    The only part of this analogy that fits is that someone was offended in the end. If that’s your point well then, bravo. You’ve pointed out, rather obtusely, that someone is offended. There is no question of that, nor is that in question. Where is the violated trust? Risking the health of others?…

    2) “Suppose your are an embalmer. You are busy embalming a person for an open coffin ceremony and you decide to pilfer there lush locks of blonde hair…”

    As in your first analogy, there is an underlying level of trust involved. Much like the milkman story the ‘victims’ are unaware until after the fact. You also allude to PZ’s ‘theft’ and possible proft. Again, there has been no violation of trust. He’s not exactly been quiet or secretive about the situation nor did he steal anything. As for your point on profiting from the act, I’m unsure if he’s payed by Seed for this blog. If he is then yes, you are correct in that aspect of the analogy (yet at the same time, whats your point?), otherwise the only similarity is the offended victim in the end.

    “3) Young ladies like to wear an item of clothing called a mini-skirt these days…”

    I hope I’m not the only one you lost with this sad little tale. You’re suggesting that wearing a mini-skirt increases the chances of rape (which is mind boggling but I’m playing along)…so are you saying the Catholic church has left itself vulnerable, thus incited this ‘attack’? To what end and once again, what’s your point?

    “he has since been roped into desecrating the Koran”

    Actually if you dig a bit into his blog you’ll find that he’s alluded to it more then once in the past. The piles of emails and replies he’s been getting isn’t the cause.

    he is still as culpable as someone who chooses to attack say the more benign and watered down religions of Quakerism/Unitarian-Universalism

    I doubt anyone would deny that (watered down and benign, nice!). It’s not whom is the target but why they’re a target. The whole point of this exercise isn’t about whom is being ‘picked on’…if you’ve taken that away from this you’re completely missing the point, not to mention victimizing yourself.

    4) Suppose you had a very sacred book outlining your philosophy on life. This book also happened to be stitched together and bound in the skin and flesh of a loved one who had recently passed away.

    Yes, it would have the same effect in that someone would be offended in the end. The point being made here is that sacred symbols, rites and rituals are silly and powerless beyond those whom hold them sacred. The difference here, which may or may not matter, is that the book is made of flesh and we’re talking about biscuits and paper books. The concept of grief and mourning a loved one and treating the remains of that loved one with decency is a bit more universal then suggesting biscuit = jesus. The mere idea of bounding a book in the flesh of a loved one would be enough to offend a lot of people of varying faiths and backgrounds, no further disregard needed.

    Overall, if the only point you were trying to make is that people are offended, you’ve managed to succeed (in the most obtuse and roundabout way possible). There’s no question that people are offended, no ones trying to say people aren’t…so what’s your point, Pete?

  548. #549 Matt Penfold
    July 24, 2008

    “FWIW, I never read any post that is longer than a screen until I see who wrote it. And then, I only read the long posts of the regulars.”

    I have a general rule that anything worth saying can be said in what can be seen on the screen at anyone time. If it goes on longer than that it either needs to be edited, split up or links given to where more a more detailed discussion can take place. Like all rules, there are times when the rule should be ignored.

  549. #550 NotAFuckTard
    July 24, 2008

    Ah, so this is why all the trolls left the other thread.

    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee…this is gonna be FUN!

  550. #551 Jack Rawlinson
    July 24, 2008

    Great piece, PZ. I was hoping you’d take the opportunity to really spell out why these deranged primitives and their absurd fetishes deserve to be disrespected, and so you have.

    As for the outraged Catholic (and other) loonies – get over it and grow a goddamned mind, you absurd clowns. You call PZ’s behaviour immature and yet look at you. Look at you. Get the damned logs out of your eyes, eh?

  551. #552 bullet
    July 24, 2008

    Just one quibble:

    …the last time a Catholic nation rose up to slaughter its non-Christian citizenry was a whole 70 years ago, after all…

    Ummm, Serbia?

  552. #553 MrMarkAZ
    July 24, 2008

    Thank you, PZ.

  553. #554 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    Seems that godbots are in full-speed copypasta mode.
    .
    Ban the Troll!!
    .

  554. #555 LaTomate
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, you da man.

  555. #556 Iason Ouabache
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo, good sir! I’m just disappointed that you didn’t go with a blender instead of the trash can.

  556. #557 Cardinal Shrew
    July 24, 2008

    Don’t submissions require a valid email address? Can’t we block them or the IP or something. I have liked not having to register but if the little copy and paste bitches are going to ruin everything, I will register.

  557. #558 ThirtyFiveUp
    July 24, 2008

    As always, PZ is a teacher. And an accomplished writer. I did not know about the Fourth Lateran Council of 1215 which led to repeated murders of Jews. Murdered because superstitious Christians believed bread could be Jesus.

    By the way, I eagerly await publication of his book.

  558. #559 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    You said nothing is sacred PZ. Interesting that you bring up the Jews. Not long ago atheists like yourself, and yes they were atheists so don’t try your usual canards, killed 6 million of them. They did it scientifically. You would do it again if we were the ones you could kill. Don’t claim otherwise since you believe nothing is sacred.

    Atheists do not believe life is sacred. They don’t believe in goodness, truth, or beauty. Those things are meaningless to them. For them there is no meaning. Human beings have no intrinsic worth, so in a way you encourage death threats by your own philosophy. How ironic. Even though you know that no Catholic would harm a hair on your little head. I cannot say the same for how atheists treat us.

    I find your little exercise pathetic. Your justifications are drivel. You just wanted to hurt people. There was no desire to “teach” or give “wisdom.” Please spare us such lies. Like most bigots you are filled with mindless hate. That is it in a nutshell: you hate us.

    In the end you have only been preaching to your choir of sycophants. No one has changed their mind because of what you have done. In fact you simply confirmed in our minds the fact that atheists are vicious hateful bigots. And you wonder why people won’t vote for an atheist for President! Just look in the mirror for the answer to that. Your actions have brought shame to your school, profession, and family. You are a sad little man devoid of decency. People don’t admire you, they pity you.

  559. #560 firemancarl
    July 24, 2008

    Thanks PZ. Great read. My grandfather on my moms side we all Cherman Juden. his entire family was hunted down during WWII. He survived the war, hiding in Berlin of all places. It is “nice” to know that the hatred of the Juden started eons before the Nazis took over. I have never understood religion, especially the loony Catholics (and Muslims).

  560. #561 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    I’ll come back to read the comments after the Catholic spammer is thrown in the Killfile Dungeon. I’m wearing out my Page Down key to get past the books he’s publishing here.

  561. #562 stogoe
    July 24, 2008

    #310 Pete Rooke: Suppose you had a very sacred book outlining your philosophy on life. This book also happened to be stitched together and bound in the skin and flesh of a loved one who had recently passed away.

    Hey everyone! Pete’s got a Necronomicon! Sweet!

    Lemme see if I can remember how it goes…

    Klaatu… Verata… Um… Necktie? Nectar? Somebody help me out here.

  562. #563 cuervo
    July 24, 2008

    Yes. Good post, although…you were finally getting going in the last paragraph…work that up to a full post would you? You know, let yourself go.
    [nice add with the God Delusion BTW]

  563. #564 S.Scott
    July 24, 2008

    That’s God spam is pissin’ me off! What an asshole …

  564. #565 kent
    July 24, 2008

    Serbia is not Catholic lol.

    Serbia is Orthodox.

    Croatia is Catholic.

  565. #566 CLM
    July 24, 2008

    So if Catholics are eating the body of Jesus doesn’t that make them cannibals?

  566. #567 bullet
    July 24, 2008

    #561:

    Couldn’t just post a link? Too dumb?

  567. #568 Greg
    July 24, 2008

    In the immortal words of Bender,

    OH… YOUR… GOD.

  568. Excellent work.

  569. #570 Mika H
    July 24, 2008

    Very nice, reducing the wise words of your pope to a cheap DDoS attack.

  570. #571 Tyler DiPietro
    July 24, 2008

    “Not long ago atheists like yourself, and yes they were atheists so don’t try your usual canards, killed 6 million of them.”

    Got a historical question for ya: what the slogan on the Wehrmacht’s belt-buckle translate to in English?

  571. #572 Crudely Wrott
    July 24, 2008

    You who are lately GlobalWarmingFraud, are a one trick pony. While you are mildly troublesome (all the extra scrolling, long refresh time) you are fortunately easily ignored.

  572. #573 Friso
    July 24, 2008

    Excellent article, and precisely the throwaway treatment this deserves. Well done.

  573. #574 ix
    July 24, 2008

    In light of the spam, perhaps it would be a good idea for user posts greater than 500 characters to be cut off at the character limit, and a ‘read more’ JavaScript URL appended to it for expanding the rest of their message.

  574. #575 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    @CLM: S’what we claim and what folks like Dr. J thinks. BTW, Dr. J. I believe in goodness, love and beauty. I see it in the people I love, the wonderous world around me, the universe that we’re part of and I don’t need your imaginary friend to be moved by the grace of the universe.

    Science is beautiful.

  575. #576 Tom
    July 24, 2008

    Let’s see–climate change is a fraud, but it is in fact true that in July of 2008 PZ Myers put a nail though the actual flesh of a first-century peasant from an obscure backwater of the Roman Empire.

    Riiiiiiiiiiight.

  576. #577 Rayven Alandria
    July 24, 2008

    I have only read a few comments in this thread. Reading the bazillion comments in the other threads has given me a migraine. Please forgive me if I bring up something that has already been mentioned.

    It is my prediction that catholics will now claim that it could not have been a consecrated Jebus Cracker. They cannot deal with the fact that their imaginary friend will not do unspeakable harm to PZ, so….since PZ will not be stricken down by a bolt of lightening within the next few days, they will see it as proof that the Jebus Cracker was not a concecrated one.

    They have to do something to make themselves feel safe again. They will invent a way out, a loophole. After an initial outrage they will begin to convince themselves and each other that it was not a consecrated jebus cracker, and they will wrap themselves in their psychological security blanket once more. Their idolatry will continue and they will think their little Jebus idols/crackers, are safe and sound. (Although they may do strip searches to make sure no evil Atheists have come to Mass to smuggle out Jebus crackers.)

    Hopefully, this nonsense will make at least a few people take a good, hard look at their religion and admit that it’s all a crock of hooey invented by humans to control other humans. That’s my hope anyway.

    A message to the catholics who are in emotional agony over this issue. I am sorry you are in pain. I hope that someday you find a path to reason and no longer allow superstition to cause you such suffering. It bothers me that you are sad, I don’t like to see suffering, even if it is self-induced and based on delusional thoughts. Just as I wish I could flip a switch and fix mentally ill patients and remove their irrational fear and agony, I wish I could flip a switch and remove yours. I cannot do that for you though. Only you can flip that switch.

  577. #578 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    I think John is about to have himself reported to his ISP for denial of service attacks, yes?
    It’s curtains for you, John. Lacy, gently wafting curtains.
    (Yeah, I know I said it already. I’m enjoying the fact that I have a chance to use that line.)

  578. #579 Elf Eye
    July 24, 2008

    Quick way to get past godbot spam in Mozilla Firefox. Use ‘find’ feature, type in number of what would be the next comment. Leaps right past the spam. A more permanent solution to the problem (PZ, are you listening): dungeon!

  579. #580 Jack Rawlinson
    July 24, 2008

    Great piece, PZ. I was hoping you’d take the opportunity to really spell out why these deranged primitives and their absurd fetishes deserve to be disrespected, and so you have.

    As for the outraged Catholic (and other) loonies – get over it and grow a goddamned mind, you absurd clowns. You call PZ’s behaviour immature and yet look at you. Look at you. Get the damned logs out of your eyes, eh?

  580. #581 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J, John, chicago, Global Warming Fraud and what not, go fuck a fucking cracker, and stop spamming the threads. Brainless gits.

  581. #582 Owlmirror
    July 24, 2008

    Interesting that you bring up the Jews. Not long ago Christians, and yes they were Christians so don’t try your usual canards, killed 6 million of them.

    Fixed.

  582. #583 Enshoku
    July 24, 2008

    PZ for the love of all that is good and sacred… STOP THE ASSHAT SPAMMER

  583. #584 Saint Bubba
    July 24, 2008

    May God have mercy on your soul.

    Posted by: Maria | July 24, 2008 2:03 PM

    “Every sperm is sacred, every sperm is good.”

    You parody yourselves.

  584. #585 Alexander Treseder
    July 24, 2008

    copy and paste attack!

  585. #586 Roman Werpachowski
    July 24, 2008

    Dear PZ:

    The XIXth century is long past. I give you some points for trying, but zero for style.

  586. #587 Sili
    July 24, 2008

    Sic frecat crustulum.

  587. #588 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    @stogoe:

    Are you talking of Klaatu Barada Nikto?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaatu_barada_nikto

    Because that is not a Lovecraft reference. It is cool as well, though. Maybe you are thinking of Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cthulhu

  588. #589 imr90
    July 24, 2008

    These people were responsible for a 1000 year long dark age. They will never give up trying to bring it back.

  589. #590 Thomas R. Holtz, Jr.
    July 24, 2008

    @”Fr.J”

    I recognize that God is simply a human construct. I am an atheist.

    Yet I:
    a. believe in goodness
    b. belive in truth
    c. belive in beauty
    d. consider these things meaningful (indeed, among the most meaningful things in life)
    e. recognize that many additional things have meaning.

    Thus, your statement is negated by the evidence. QED.

    Additionally, I doubt you are in fact an ordained priest. I am willing to sign my name to the above statement in this public forum; are you willing to do the same?

  590. #591 JHJEFFERY
    July 24, 2008

    I guess we won’t know the outcome of this for another three days . . .

    At least the cracker has zero grams of Trans(substantiation)fat.

    Well done, PZ.

  591. #592 Ghost of Minnesota
    July 24, 2008

    Adding The God Delusion was a stroke of brilliance. Bravo, Dr. Myers.

  592. #593 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Rayven Alandria:
    It is my prediction that catholics will now claim that it could not have been a consecrated Jebus Cracker.

    Yes, a good prediction because they did. At comment #200 though, PZ posted a video proof. But it was most likely lost in the mass (ahaha) of comments.

    It’s worth reposting. THIS IS THE ABDUCTION OF THE GLUTEN!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHPZFsGrt-Y

  593. #594 TripMaster Monkey
    July 24, 2008

    Rayven sez:

    It is my prediction that catholics will now claim that it could not have been a consecrated Jebus Cracker.

    They’re already headed down that road.

  594. #595 MicroZealous
    July 24, 2008

    Re “Chicago”, “ClimateChange Fraud”, et al:
    I note the revealing parallels between religiosity and anti-science attitudes. Denial is not just a lake in South America . . .

  595. #596 ErikFK
    July 24, 2008

    #569: Atheists do not believe life is sacred. They don’t believe in goodness, truth, or beauty. Blah blah blah

    Of course not. We eat babies at breakfast, admire only people like Stalin and terrorists and, of course, burn religious people when we’re bored and have no more cracker at hand.

    Please move to the moon. You’ll be nearer to your god – and far from his victims.

  596. #597 hhabilis
    July 24, 2008

    What’s really ironic is that Jesus Himself said: “Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man [that is, Jesus] will be forgiven…” (Mt 12:32) Maybe the hypocrites ought to read their own Book.

  597. #598 Paul W.
    July 24, 2008

    To the troll spamming the thread with repeats of long nonsense…

    Do be aware that what you’re doing is not just tacky, but a crime. It’s called a “denial of service attack” and it’s legally far more serious than stealing a cracker.

    Also, some of us are pretty good with computers, and can probably figure out where you live.

    PZ can just delete your posts, by the way. He has that kind of godlike power over comments and crackers.

  598. #599 Parsnip Money
    July 24, 2008

    Oh thank Jeebus, Fr. J is back.

    how many times do we have to tell you that Nazi Germany did not kill people in the name of Atheism, but in the name of Nazi Germany!

    Even if what you claim to be true was true, it doesn’t negate the fact that millions more have been killed in the name of your imaginary sky-being!

  599. #600 Jaap Weel
    July 24, 2008

    I think you desperately need some updates to the comment system. First of all, limit comments to a certain size, may 1 kilobyte or so. Second, you may want to consider using a comment system like Disqus that lets people vote on comments, so that interesting comments will actually be discoverable among the quotations from encyclicals and the like.

  600. #601 Tom
    July 24, 2008

    Nice one, stogoe #572.

  601. #602 Patrick
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo

  602. #603 HC Grindon
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo, Professor Myers, bravo! The last paragraph after the picture really says it all. Thank you for your voice of reason throughout this silliness known as Crackergate.

  603. #604 bullet
    July 24, 2008

    kent(#575):

    Orthodox is Catholic. That’s why there’s a modifier for Roman Catholic.

  604. #605 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    See #569 from Fr. J Shithead. (The number may change after the Catholic spam is deleted.)

    Godwin’s Law: “As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one.”

  605. #606 nullifidian
    July 24, 2008

    Question everything.

    Why?

  606. #607 The Pope
    July 24, 2008

    Of His Holiness Pope John Paul II
    To The Bishops, Priests, and Deacons
    Men and Women in the Consecrated Life
    And All the Lay Faithful

    On Spamming

    HEY ASSHOLE! KNOCK IT OFF YOU DOUCHE! I wanna read these comments so I can get back to buggering some choir boys.

    Sheesh.

    XOXOXO

    Da Pope (for shizzle!)

  607. #608 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    cosmology@yahoo.com ?

    Is that your email or something?

  608. #609 Bob Kowalski
    July 24, 2008

    The best that I can say???

    God Almighty, how I wish I had written that!

  609. #610 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J,

    You are a dumbass.

    Atheism can’t motivate anyone to do anything, it’s a mere absence of belief. Religion on the other hand represents affirmative beliefs which can in fact motivate people to do terrible things.

    Nazism was just like a religion. Dogmatic, irrational, and hostile to any dissent.

    You simply cannot accept that human beings can be decent, free, loving and happy without believing in horseshit.

    Also, you have not once demonstrated that your god even exists. You have a contempt for the truth and reality that is mind-boggling.

  610. #611 MicroZealous
    July 24, 2008

    Re “Chicago”, “ClimateChange Fraud”, et al:
    I note the revealing parallels between religiosity and anti-science attitudes. Denial is not just a lake in South America . . .

  611. #612 W.C.Walker
    July 24, 2008

    Religious controversies are always more productive of more acrimony & irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause. Geo. Washington, letter to Edw. Newenham, 6-2 1792 200 plus years later it’s no different.

  612. #613 Irene
    July 24, 2008

    Are your actions and words representative of the 8th rate university you teach at? So anyway, why did you leave Temple? Or were you run out of town?

  613. #614 writzer
    July 24, 2008

    John, Benotafraid, JohnPaul2weloveyou …

    No matter how many words are used to explain the irrational, it’s still irrational. It’s still … just a cracker.

  614. #615 Hal in Howell MI (not far from Hell, MI)
    July 24, 2008

    Excellent essay, PZ. Thank you. Sorry you felt it necessary to use books (I guess books are as close to “sacred” I get, except for Bach and Beethoven.) At least the books were not unique and can easily be replaced. So, no harm, no foul.

    This entire episode has proven, beyond reasonable doubt, that there is only a thin vernier separating so-called religious mores from the threat of religious violence.

    “There is something feeble and a little contemptible about a man who cannot face the perils of life without the help of comfortable myths. Almost inevitably some part of him is aware that they are myths and that he believes them only because they are comforting. But he dare not face this thought! Moreover, since he is aware, however dimly, that his opinions are not real, he becomes furious when they are disputed.” – Bertrand Russell, Human Society in Ethics and Politics

  615. #616 Gary
    July 24, 2008

    An English copy of the Koran (Qu’ran) is not the true Koran. To really do the job right, you need an Arabic version.

  616. #617 lurker_above
    July 24, 2008

    Haha. This is going well. Bravo, PZ.

  617. #618 jl
    July 24, 2008

    Jesus should be used to being pierced by nails.

    I’ll lift a beer to you tonight PZ

  618. #619 mostlywater
    July 24, 2008

    An appropriate end to a nontroversy.

  619. #620 Ferin
    July 24, 2008

    Interesting choice tossing the god delusion pages in there too.

    I don’t entirely agree with what you did, but I guess I can understand it.

    I just hope that people’ll learn something from all of this silliness.

  620. #621 Tony
    July 24, 2008

    You’re my new idol PZ, for real, you’re the man. Cheers from Finland! :-)

  621. #622 Emmet Caulfield
    July 24, 2008

    Interesting that you bring up the Jews. Not long ago atheists like yourself, and yes they were atheists so don’t try your usual canards, killed 6 million of them.

    You lying bastard.

  622. #623 alex
    July 24, 2008

    Posted by: Hussein Obama/Global Warming Fraud etc: blah blah blah

    PZ! POPE KNOWS HOW TO USE INTERNET!

  623. #624 Sven DIMilo
    July 24, 2008

    Atheists do not believe life is sacred. They don’t believe in goodness, truth, or beauty. Those things are meaningless to them. For them there is no meaning.

    Loathe as I am to enter the Land of Double Posts (and Triple, etc.), especially since I earlier promised to no longer pay any attention to the whole Ineffable Magical Cracker scene, I…cannot…help pointing out that, of course, sentences 2, 3, and 4 quoted above do not remotely follow from #1. And #1, while literally true (since nothing is sacred) is as close to wrong as something literally true can get.

    “Father” J., you are wrong from top to bottom. I know how you feel about personal insults, and so I will avoid them while pointing out that you have not paid the slightest bit of attention to anything anyone else has posted in response to your bullshit. Aaaah, screw it: you suck, asshole.

    You and Pete “False Analogy” Rooke would be banned for inane thick-skulled slagging if I were the owner of the blog, and the fact that PZ leaves your crap up and allows you to post the same shit again and again is just evidence of the bend-over-backwards-to-be-fair kind of guy he is. Nobody got hurt by the little rusty-nail demonstration–not you, nobody. Please quit whining.

  624. #625 JoshH
    July 24, 2008

    *Gnashes teeth loudly and angrily*

  625. #626 Irene
    July 24, 2008

    Are your actions and words representative of the 8th rate university you teach at? So anyway, why did you leave Temple? Or were you run out of town?

  626. #627 jl
    July 24, 2008

    Jesus should be used to being pierced by nails.

    I’ll lift a beer to you tonight PZ

  627. #628 Parsnip Money
    July 24, 2008

    Hey look, John has added ‘Nancy Pelosi’ and ‘Hussein Obama’ to his ranks of intense paste lovers.

  628. #629 writzer
    July 24, 2008

    John, Benotafraid, JohnPaul2weloveyou …

    No matter how many words are used to explain the irrational, it’s still irrational. It’s still … just a cracker.

  629. #630 stogoe
    July 24, 2008

    @stogoe:

    Are you talking of Klaatu Barada Nikto?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaatu_barada_nikto

    Because that is not a Lovecraft reference. It is cool as well, though.

    Alas, the joining of the two is not my idea but Sam Raimi’s, in Army of Darkness.

  630. #631 Zaphod
    July 24, 2008

    > W.C.Walker said -
    > Religious controversies are always more productive of
    > more acrimony & irreconcilable hatreds than those which
    > spring from any other cause. Geo. Washington, letter to
    > Edw. Newenham, 6-2 1792 200 plus years later it’s no
    > different.

    I like Franklin’s take on it:
    “Indeed, when religious people quarrel about religion, or hungry people quarrel about victuals, it looks as if they had not much of either among them.
    – Benjamin Franklin”

  631. #632 Steve
    July 24, 2008

    Absolutely brilliant. PZ, I only wish I could have put together such and EXCELLENT piece of prose. Complete. Accurate. Fair. And of course very witty!

    So many have already offered you the same praise I wish to offer. Others have used the “copy / paste” function to the point it should be banned…All I will add is that I, too, will hoist a glass in your honor tonight!

  632. #633 Justin
    July 24, 2008

    Holy Jesus Christ, people.
    Religions suck. Do you know how stupid you’re all sounding?
    IT IS JUST A CRACKER. EFFING MOLECULES. BAKED.

    Cheers PZ Myers, you’re awesome.

  633. #634 fafnir
    July 24, 2008

    I never figured Jesus’d show up in anything less than a Double Stuff.

  634. #635 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    PZ said: Fortunately, Catholicism has mellowed with age — the last time a Catholic nation rose up to slaughter its non-Christian citizenry was a whole 70 years ago, after all — but the sentiment still lingers.

    Did you read that, Fr. J?

  635. #636 Baba
    July 24, 2008

    Nothing must be held sacred.

    How Mao of you!

  636. #637 blf
    July 24, 2008

    Pee Zed is well aware of St John the Copy Pasting Annoyer and is working on the problem (see the comments in the Roy Zimmerman thread after this one), so the posts asking him to do something about it are, in a sense, just as much spam as the bishop’s blatterings.

  637. #638 sailor
    July 24, 2008

    Great move. Get the whole bunch of them running to PZ over a cracker and then let go with both barrels about the nature of this rubish where they are all sure to read it.
    I think the nail was a bit over the top, the garbage bin perfectly apropriate and the final advise:
    “God is not great, Jesus is not your lord, you are not disciples of any charismatic prophet. You are all human beings who must make your way through your life by thinking and learning, and you have the job of advancing humanities’ knowledge by winnowing out the errors of past generations and finding deeper understanding of reality. You will not find wisdom in rituals and sacraments and dogma, which build only self-satisfied ignorance, but you can find truth by looking at your world with fresh eyes and a questioning mind.”
    worthy of more permanent publication.

  638. #639 E.V.
    July 24, 2008

    “I’m going to raise a glass of Laphroaig in toast”

    Man, do you know how to induce Single Malt envy. (pout)

  639. #640 Female God
    July 24, 2008

    May God have mercy on your soul.

    Posted by: Maria | July 24, 2008 2:03 PM
    #2

    It is done.

    Posted by: H.H. | July 24, 2008 2:04 PM
    #3

    Well done.

    Posted by: FormerMilitary | July 24, 2008 2:04 PM
    #4

    Well this is going to be epic.

    Posted by: Tucker | July 24, 2008 2:04 PM
    #5

    PZ: My gin and tonic will be hoisted up in your name tonight.

    Posted by: Anthony | July 24, 2008 2:06 PM
    #6

    Well, if you thought the deluge of email was bad now! :)

    Thanks for pointing out that nothing should be held sacred.

    Posted by: JSorrell | July 24, 2008 2:08 PM
    #7

    Requiescat in pace, Crustum Christi.

    Posted by: Blake Stacey | July 24, 2008 2:08 PM
    #8

    Well said PZ. Wish I could think of something more to add.

  640. #641 Cafeeine
    July 24, 2008

    http://www.catholicleague.org/release.php?id=1465

    MYERS DESECRATES THE EUCHARIST

    July 24, 2008

    University of Minnesota professor Paul Z. Myers made good on his pledge to desecrate the Eucharist today. According to his statement on the subject, “I pierced it [the Host] with a rusty nail (I hope Jesus’s tetanus shots are up to date). And then I simply threw it in the trash.”

    Saying he did not want to “single out just the cracker,” Myers also tore pages from the Koran along with a few pages from Richard Dawkins’ The God Delusion and nailed them to the Host. He then said, “They are just paper. Nothing must be held sacred. (His emphasis.) Question everything. God is not great, Jesus is not your lord, you are not disciples of any charismatic prophet.”

    Catholic League president Bill Donohue responded as follows:

    “A formal complaint against Myers has already been made. What he did–in both word and deed–constitutes a bias incident, as defined by the University of Minnesota. The policy says that ‘Expressions of disrespectful bias, hate, harassment or hostility against an individual, group or their property because of the individual or group’s actual or perceived race, color, creed, religion…can be forms of discrimination. Expressions vary, and can be in the form of language, words, signs, symbols, threats, or actions that could potentially cause alarm, anger, fear, or resentment in others…even when presented as a joke.’

    “The University must now take action and apply the appropriate sanction. We are contacting the president, Board of Regents and the Equal Opportunity and Affirmative Action Office at the school, as well as Minnesota’s governor and both houses of the state legislature; the Catholic community in Minnesota is also being contacted. Moreover, we are also contacting Muslim groups nationwide.

    “It is important for Catholics to know that the University of Minnesota will not tolerate the deliberate destruction of the Eucharist by one of its faculty. Just as African Americans would not tolerate the burning of a cross, and Jews would not tolerate the display of swastikas, Catholics will not tolerate the desecration of the Eucharist.”

    (Note: For information purposes only. The poster does not subscribe to the above wackiness)

  641. #642 ail
    July 24, 2008

    I have kind of the opposite of your view but a similar goal.

    Everything is sacred.

    All those things in your picture are expressions of divinity playing out its ever-evolving and -devolving energy in space and time.

    To me what you have done isn’t sacrilege but art. It’s a rudimentary and minor effort, but still an original variation using evocative elements in a strong, precise statement of individual values, intended to make the viewer rethink familiar objects and entrenched ideas.

    I think it’s a messed up world when we call a wafer sacred but not a banana.

    In fact, we can always manufacture, and get some priest to “bless”, more wafers. The bananas are another story, as the particular variety we eat are slowly dying out from a fungal disease.

    To you nothing’s sacred, to me all of it is, but in both views breakiing down false mysteries is a step toward respecting and valuing the real world for what it is.

    I’m outta’ here, you got too many commenters already. If there is a goddess, She loves ya’! :)

  642. #643 David
    July 24, 2008

    Voltaire said that those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. This quotation comes to my mind when I read of the massacres that were instigated by false claims of host desecration, and also when I read the threats of violence from a few outraged Christians.

    I want to thank Dr. Myers for reminding us that religious superstition is not harmless, but it has deadly consequences.

  643. #644 Mike Smith
    July 24, 2008

    I’m excited to see where this leads. I’m with you all the way, PZ.

  644. #645 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    According to the Catholic religion, only assholes are allowed in heaven. That would explain all the Catholic spam.

  645. #646 JoJo
    July 24, 2008

    To misquote Lewis Carroll:

    Speak roughly to your little boy
    And beat him when he spams,
    He only does it to annoy
    And he thinks it damns.

  646. #647 Rodney Trotter
    July 24, 2008

    Carlie –

    Ok if the worst that can be said about the Hindu cow analogy is where he ate the meat I’m happy, it works. The sentiment is the same.

    Don’t get me wrong, the religious outcry/spam etc is an absurd over-reaction. I just think there’s such a thing as poor taste, this being quite close. Might be an English thing.

  647. #648 bonefish
    July 24, 2008

    Great post. Always enjoy whatever you’ve got to say, PZ.

    did take me a hell of a long time to get down here, though. if i wanted to read the papal address in its entirety i am perfectly capable of looking the endless thing up on my own.
    i may reread the history of the various church councils, though. they’re always interesting.

  648. #649 MrMarkAZ
    July 24, 2008

    I wonder who’s going to make post #666? Hopefully it will be that no-talent ass-clown whose posting the same sputum ad nauseum. He’s not just wacka-loon, he’s a cracka-loon!

  649. #650 Patrick
    July 24, 2008

    Some serious trolling going on here…

  650. #651 Hal in Howell MI (not far from Hell, MI)
    July 24, 2008

    @Father J & Hillarywasscrewed, et al:

    Bollocks!!!!

    Please don’t pray for me because I will then have to think for both of us.

  651. #652 Sam L.
    July 24, 2008

    Brilliant, appropriate, and final. Great conclusion, PZ.

  652. #653 Anon
    July 24, 2008

    Great now that that is done, lets get back to some hot squid on squid action.

  653. #654 Mike
    July 24, 2008

    As a Catholic with a sense or irony I’ve decided the only thing I’ll be praying for is the conversion of PZ’s child(ren) to Catholicism. Catholic with a sense of ironic justice.

  654. #655 mick lafferty
    July 24, 2008

    Communism through Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, HoChi Mihn, Castro and many others has killed many more than Christianity.

    Literally, hundreds of millions, not to mention the atheistic nazis killing 6 million Jews and 10 million others.

  655. #656 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    @Cafeeine

    [random Donohue vomit here]

    Wow. He REALLY bit the bait uh? My god (Also known as my own self, yes, you heard me, I’m God. Live with it and hail to me.) he’s really a blind fanatic man. Sad existence he has.

  656. #657 Dahan
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J

    “Atheists do not believe life is sacred. They don’t believe in goodness, truth, or beauty. Those things are meaningless to them. For them there is no meaning. Human beings have no intrinsic worth, so in a way you encourage death threats by your own philosophy. ”

    How can you have been posting bullshit for ever on these threads and still not know what an atheist is? You really are the dumbest person I’ve ever read here on this blog, and that includes Kenny. That’s saying something.

    Unlike you, we don’t believe in some fairy made afterlife. We believe this life is all we get, therefore, life is INCREDIBLY important to us. We don’t have the “faith” you do that some sky-daddy will sort everything out in the end and make it right. We have to do the work ourselves.
    We don’t believe in goodness, truth, or beauty? Define “goodness”. Is that the bit in your holy book that tells us just how much we can beat our slaves? Truth? You’re the one living in a fantasy world with made up beings and rules… what do you know of truth? Beauty? I can enjoy the world and it’s beauty more than you ever can, because I allow myself to see the wonders around me instead of focusing on hoped for unrealities.
    No meaning? Your life would have no meaning without your imaginary friend? You wouldn’t want to build a better world for your children, your wife, for everyone? You wouldn’t see a reason to get up in the morning? You are DEEPLY sick. Get to a mental health professional immediately.
    Human beings have no intrinsic worth? You’re the one who views the imaginary soul as the end-all be-all. Not us.
    And as has been put to you probably 50 times already. THERE HAVE BEEN NO GREAT MASSACRES IN THE NAME OF ATHEISM!!! There have been atheists who committed massacres, but not in it’s name. There have been MANY massacres committed in the name of religion.
    I don’t know why I bother. You don’t appear to be able to reason. All you can do is spout dogma. You stopped using your brain and it’s atrophied to the point that it no longer functions. It’s pathetic. really.

  657. #658 RelidjusGuy931285
    July 24, 2008

    Fore reasins why you athists are rong:
    1. I hate you.

    2. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetuer adipiscing elit. Mauris accumsan, neque et tincidunt porttitor, erat orci condimentum nunc, eu commodo ante pede vel ligula!
    Fred 7:13

    3. Im’ mad.

  658. #659 Mark B
    July 24, 2008

    I suppose I just have to be satisfied with the neighbor of the beast, since Patrick got post #666.

  659. #660 JF
    July 24, 2008

    Sooooooooooooo happy to be done with religion after over twenty years of active intellectual denial and ongoing suspended disbelief. Sorry folk there is no evidence for anything supernatural and to think otherwise involves hanging up your thinking processes and holding onto a story with no more merit than tooth ferries, Santa or waiting vestal virgin daiquiris’.

  660. #661 laurisa
    July 24, 2008

    Which stupid fuckers didn’t get the memo: DON’T PRAY IN OUR SCHOOL, WE WON’T THINK IN YOUR CHURCH! Oh, must be those christians when god pulled a no show that day. Like the long ass posts are getting read with any hint of seriousness. Are you winning? Do you feel strong? dumbasses.

    I was mighty put out though when I stopped the scroll long enough to see that ‘church’ has desecrated ME…why is that feeble shack a “she?” total bummage.

  661. #662 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    @stogoe:

    Yikes! Way cool. I consider myself outgeeked :D

  662. #663 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Ok if the worst that can be said about the Hindu cow analogy is where he ate the meat I’m happy, it works. The sentiment is the same.

    Then you don’t ever eat beef? If you do, the sentiment is the same, and you’re acting, as you said, in poor taste. And as was said long ago by someone else on one of the epic threads, if you eat pork, you’re pissing on Jews and Muslims, and if you swat a mosquito, the Jains will be miffed.

  663. #664 Bureaucratus Minimis
    July 24, 2008

    I want to revisit TG’s original post @ 39. I think everyone(*) here has missed that he and those like him are totally running scared:

    It is easy to see the titles of the books, but where is the proof that is a consecrated host? I think it is nothing more than an attention-getting stunt for noteriety. Weak.

    See, he’s in denial. He refuses to believe that anyone could or would actually “desecrate” the cracker. In his mind nobody would dare do this for fear of divine retribution. Also, IHO there are no real atheists, only believers who are angry at god.

    So no matter what proof you offer him, he can still cling to his worldview. Just like poor Binky Brown…

    (*) OK, I stopped reading @ 241 because of all the duplicate posts and ridiculously long gibberish about the cracker.

  664. #665 erik542
    July 24, 2008

    Ooo monty python reference. Nice. Very fitting too.

  665. #666 Owlmirror
    July 24, 2008

    Literally, hundreds of millions, not to mention the Christian nazis killing 6 million Jews and 10 million others.

    Fixed.

  666. #667 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    BTW, Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus did not originate at Lateran IV. It predates it by centuries, see St. Cyprian. Also PZ doesn’t even understand what it means. The interpretation of it is apparently beyond his intellect. Hopefully he will retract his error, but let’s not hold our breaths.

    Also the Council legislation concerning Jews dealt primarily with limiting interest rates ie. usury. It did NOT mandate a yellow star of David. It stated that Jews and Muslims were to wear distinguishing dress. Why? Because of the tension between the groups and the fact that in Islamic lands this was part of their law. Also this was part of Jewish law and was enforced by Jews in Israel. In other words it was common in virtually all societies at the time. Did Jews get a fair shake? No. But they never have from almost anyone. We at least have taken steps to establish good relations with Jews. PZ hates Jews and despises their religion. Think about what he would do to the Torah if he had a chance.

    Jews also could not vote or hold office in many early American colonies. Atheists, like in the old USSR, treated Jews terribly. PZ didn’t mention that? Of course not. The fact is that PZ and atheists don’t really care about how Jews are treated. It is a tactic and nothing more. He would have no qualms about eliminating Jews. Remember, for him nothing is sacred.

    Does he mention how atheists treated Christians during the French revolution? About how many heads have rolled because of people like himself? The brutality of atheism beggars the imagination and makes religious people look like amateurs. 100,000,000 dead on account of PZ’s philosophy in the last century. Don’t deny it, we all know it is true. We can read.

    All of this is a cloak in which he hides his own bigotry and hate. He wants to distract you and justify his own actions. Don’t be fooled. For him, NOTHING IS SACRED, and that includes the truth.

  667. #668 gb
    July 24, 2008

    A toast to our host (PZ … not the other one) for such an educational demise of that which is not sacred.

  668. #669 Sam
    July 24, 2008

    So, let’s see. In my question for knowledge, to whom shall I look as a model of intellectual inquiry, rigor, and substance? Prof. P.Z. Myers on the one hand, Thomas Aquinas on the other hand.

    Hmmmmm…tough choice, isn’t it…

  669. #670 CJ
    July 24, 2008

    In keeping with the whole body of christ theme, I believe you shorted the host a few nails.

  670. #671 Bugger Pope
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, silly Mike @ #670! You Catholics are ALWAYS trying to get more little boys to join up, aren’t you?

  671. #672 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    #671–

    Nazi Germany was predominantly Christian. From the rank-and-file Wehrmacht soldier up to the top-ranked generals, Christians had more than their fair share of participation in the Third Reich’s evil doings.

    You fail.

    P.S. God doesn’t exist. Have a nice day.

  672. #673 Nino
    July 24, 2008

    I like the way you got the fruit that is THE proof for ID involced in all of this as well !
    Plus equal oportunity by ripping pafges out of Dawkins…..
    Well done !

  673. #674 Jason
    July 24, 2008

    Tonight, I eat a box of Saltines in memorial of the cracker.

  674. #675 Parsnip Money
    July 24, 2008

    Donahue has responded. Any minute now the Catholic A-Team Go Force Samurai Cyber Squad Patrol will be knocking down PZ’s door and saving their beloved piece of be-yeasted flour.

    CRACKERGATE HAS BEGUN.

  675. #676 CarpeGuitarrem
    July 24, 2008

    Interesting. Apparently you view Richard Dawkins’ book as a holy text?

  676. #677 firemancarl
    July 24, 2008

    @#569. No, the Chermans weren’t atheists you silly god botherer. They all fully believed. Even Himmler thought he could find ‘the holy grail’. Heck the Wehrmacht were issued belt buckles with ‘Gott mit uns’ on ‘em. Totally what you’d expect from an atheist army. I dig your logic, i have since converted.

  677. #678 HC Grindon
    July 24, 2008

    “He’s not just wacka-loon, he’s a cracka-loon!”

    Frickin hi-larious! A new term is coined! ROFLMAO!

  678. #679 Nina in London
    July 24, 2008

    #427 was in answer to what I wrote:
    Hey, PZ is a comedian! To us Catholics, transubstantiation is *exactly* the difference. It is a wafer of wheat with the exactly the same form and taste as before the consecration, but after consecration the form is still of wheat but the substance is now the Body of Christ.

    #427 replied:

    “That is meaningless. It is just an abuse of the English language. What you are in effect saying is that it is both the same and different. That is simply nonsensical. What properties does it have after consecration that it did not have before ? If there are no physical differences then there is no difference. Did you not do science at school or something ? There is an important concept in science, that basically states if you cannot tell two things apart then they are identical.”

    MY RESPONSE:

    Science and Religion have different remits, they are not mutually exclusive. Science is the how, Religion is the why. People ask “WHY do I exist? What does my life mean?” Science does not provide answers to that. That is Religion’s job.

    Science is neutral, scientists pose hypotheses and argue them to try to explain things in the world. Science does not deal with the soul, heaven, morality, goodness, the agonising question of why people behave violently to each other. Again, Religion offers answers.

    Science is always changing – one hypothesis gets replaced by another as further discoveries are made.
    I personally don’t look to Science for inspiration, spiritual uplift and moral guidance, to make sense of life, to give a wider context.

    Religion deals with the eternal. God. Religion is the expression of man’s longing for something greater than he is. We Christians believe that God became Man to show us how we can live life to the full, to live as one, with respect for all others on earth, not to live selfishly. To love when love seems impossible, as Jesus did.

    (And now I really must go home because it’s late over here!)

  679. #680 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Katie Couric now? Had a sex change?

    I have to agree with that name for that post this time, John. She’s a great way to measure shit.

  680. #681 Boosterz
    July 24, 2008

    For all the claims to vast cosmic power that they attribute to their god, I would expect something flashier then sending a minion to spam the comments with cut and paste nonsense. lol

  681. #682 randy
    July 24, 2008

    reversing the situation, circle your answer:
    Fred Phelps has or has not received death threats.

    Fred Phelps and his clan should be allowed to protest inside, outside, nearby, two blocks away or not at all at funerals of returned soldiers and homosexuals.

  682. #683 Marsten
    July 24, 2008

    You have offended my God in your desecration of our most holy artifacts, the Sacred Banana! Heathen and blasphemer, know you not that those who decry against the Sacred Banana will be sludged forever in its yellowey goo?
    May you slip on many a banana skin for such heresy!

  683. #684 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    I hope PZ tosses another consecrated cracker in the trash for every time that big-ass stupid screed of whatever-the-hell-I-won’t-read-it gets posted.

  684. #685 Rodney Trotter
    July 24, 2008

    Carlie –

    Yes I eat beef – but specific cows are sacred to Hindus, not every one. If I ate the specific cow they had told me previously was some incarnation of whoever, just to prove a point to them, I would feel a bit disappointed with myself.

  685. #686 Owlmirror
    July 24, 2008

    Voltaire: “crasez l’infme”.

    Bill Donahue: Arrest Voltaire!

  686. #687 Ben D
    July 24, 2008

    If you believe that truth is relative, why can’t you respect what “my truth” is? I believe that the host becomes Jesus. You don’t. I respect that you don’t believe; I have no issue with your disbelief. I don’t make fun of you for not believing. As a fellow human, I would have expected the respect to be reciprocal.

  687. #688 Drake33
    July 24, 2008

    Ran the Trolls’ ungodly length cut and paste rambling it through the ghetto translator. It was… too long for the Ghetto Translator to handle so I trimmed off a couple of lines. Much better if you ask me. Enjoy:

    CONCLUSION

    60. At da dawn uh dis third millennium, we, da children uh da Church, be called to undasnatch wid renewed enthusiasm da journey uh Christian livin`. As ah` wrote in my Apostolic Letter Novo Millennio Ineunte, \”it be not a matta` uh inventin` a ‘new programme’. da programme aleyebally exists: dat be da plan found in da Gospel and in da livin` Tradition; dat be da same as ever. Ultimately, dat gots its centre in Christ himself, who be to be known, loved and imitated, so that in him we may live da life uh da Trinity, and wid him transform histo`y until its fulfilment in da heavenly Jerusalem\”.103 da implementation uh dis programme uh a renewed impetus in Christian livin` passes through da Eucharist.

    Every commitment to holiness, every activity aimed at wheelsrying out da Church’s mission, every wo`k uh pastoral plannin`, must draw da strength dat needs from da Eucharistic mystery and in turn be directed to that mystery as its culmination. In da Eucharist we have Jesus, we have his redemptive sacrifice, we have his resurrection, we have da gift uh da Holy Spirit, we have adoration, obedience and love uh da pops. Were we to disregard da Eucharist, how could we overcome our own deficiency?

    61. da mystery uh da Eucharist – sacrifice, presence, banquet – duz not allow fo` reduction o` exploitation; dat must be experienced and lived in its integrity, both in its celebration and in da intimate converse wid Jesus which snatchs place after receivin` communion o` in a prayerful moment uh Eucharistic adoration apart from Mass. dese be times when da Church be firmly built up and dat becomes clear what she truly be: one, holy, catholic and apostolic; da people, temple and family uh God; da body and bride uh Christ, enlivened by da Holy Spirit; da universal sacrament uh salvation and a hierarchically structured communion.

    The path snatchn by da Church in dese fust years uh da third millennium be also a path uh renewed ecumenical commitment. da final decades uh da second millennium, culminatin` in da Grfeed Jubilee, have spurred us along dis path and called fo` all da baptized to respond to da prayer uh Jesus \”ut unum sint \” (Jn 17:11). da path itself be long and strewn wid obstacles grfeeder than our human resources alone kin overcome, yet we have da Eucharist, and in its presence we kin hear in da depths uh our hearts, as if they were addressed to us, da same wo`ds heard by da Prophet Elijah: \”Arise and feed, else da journey will be n` all grfeed fo` you\” (1 Kg 19:7). da treasho` uh da Eucharist, which da Lord places befo`e us, impels us towards da goal uh full sharin` wid all our brothas and sistas to whom we be joined by our common Baptism. But if dis treasho` be not to be squandered, we need to respect da demands which derive from its being da sacrament uh communion in faith and in apostolic succession.

    By givin` da Eucharist da prominence dat deserves, and by being wheelseful not to diminish enny uh its dimensions o` demands, we show that we be truly conscious uh da grfeedness uh dis gift. We be urged to do so by an uninterrupted tradition, which from da fust centuries on gots found da Christian community ever vigilant in guarding dis \”treasho`\”. Inspired by love, da Church be anxious to hand on to future generations uh Christians, widout loss, her faith and teaching wid regard to da mystery uh da Eucharist. dere kin be no danger uh excess in our wheelse fo` dis mystery, fo` \”in dis sacrament be recapitulated da whole mystery uh our salvation\”.104

    62. Let us snatch our place, dear brothas and sistas, at da school uh da saints, who be da grfeed interpreters uh true Eucharistic piety. In dem da theology uh da Eucharist snatchs on all da splendour uh a lived reality; dat becomes \”contagious\” and, in a manner uh speakin`, dat \”warms our hearts\”. Above all, let us listen to Mary Most Holy, in whom da mystery uh da Eucharist appears, mo`e than in ennyone else, as a mystery uh light. Gazing upon Mary, we mosey on down to know da transformin` power present in da Eucharist. In her we see da wo`ld renewed in love. Contemplatin` her, assumed body and soul into heaven, we see jimmeyin` up befo`e us those \”new heavens\” and that \”new earth\” which will appear at da second comin` uh Christ. Here below, da Eucharist represents their pledge, and in a certain way, their anticipation: \”Veni, Domine Iesu!\” (Rev 22:20).

    In da humble signs uh beyeball and wine, changed into his body and blood, Christ walks beside us as our strength and our food fo` da journey, and he enables us to become, fo` everyone, witnesses uh hope. If, in da presence uh dis mystery, reason experiences its limits, da heart, enlightened by da grace uh da Holy Spirit, clearly sees da response that be demanded, and bows low in adoration and unbounded love.

    Let us make our own da wo`ds uh Saint Thomas Aquinas, an eminent theologian and an impassioned poet uh Christ in da Eucharist, and turn in hope to da contemplation uh that goal to which our hearts aspire in their thirst fo` joy and peace:

    Bone pastor, panis vere,
    Iesu, nostrah` miserere…

    Come then, phat Shepherd, beyeball divine,
    Still show to us thy mercy sign;
    Oh, feed us, still keep us thine;
    So we may see thy glories shine
    in fields uh immo`tality.

    O thou, da wisest, mightiest, best,
    Our present food, our future rest,
    Come, make us each thy chosen guest,
    Co-heirs uh thine, and comrades blest
    wid saints whose dwelling be wid thee.

    Given in Rome, at Saint Peter’s, on 17 April, Holy Thursday, in da year 2003, da Twenty- fifth uh my Pontificate, da Year uh da Rosary.

  688. #689 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J,

    You kook, atheism isn’t a philosophy. It’s a state of disbelief in gods. Just like your (I presume) disbelief in Santa Claus is a state of disbelief and not a whole philosophy.

    I challenge you to define atheism in an objective manner.

    This should be revealing.

  689. #690 Helioprogenus
    July 24, 2008

    Did you all hear that? No? That’s the sound of an idiot masturbating over a treastise that another idiot with a hat decided to implement a number of years ago. Listen, do you morons actually seriously think you’re going to convert even one person here? If you really want to save someone, go help those suffering with aids because they were told they would go to hell for using contraceptives. Go to the little children molested by priests and help them understand that only sick, misguided individuals like yourselves would ever do that to them. While you’re at it, why don’t you pray to your imaginary deity and stop pestering us. You’re just proving why we don’t need your kind, and why the world would be better off when all of you are dead and gone. In Essence, go fuck yourselves your religious assholes.

  690. #691 Pat
    July 24, 2008

    Go John go! LOL

  691. #692 david broome
    July 24, 2008

    Way to go, PZ. You have my full support. Its time to stand up and be counted for your what you DO believe in: the power of evidence and reasoned argument. Long live science!

  692. #693 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    PZ, get rid of spamming John. A single post and a link from him would have sufficed, but nooo… now everyone has to spend forty thousand minutes scrolling past his nonsense to see the rest of the comments.

  693. #694 Enshoku
    July 24, 2008

    nina, that is bullshit. Science does explain altruism(goodness), morality, and that little thing called violence. The first two stem from societal structures as well as propagation of the species, and violence comes from too many things to name, emotional highs, lack of education, primitive instincts, etc.

  694. #695 dubiquiabs
    July 24, 2008

    @ #121 #134 #145 #151 and all the other believers:

    “Absolute Truth” appears to be neither.

  695. #696 AGH
    July 24, 2008

    Nice desecration, PZ! You still have the option to hock a loogie on it if necessary.

  696. #697 Anonymous
    July 24, 2008

    Ogod. Your blog has been Ecclesiastijacked.

  697. #698 oldcola
    July 24, 2008

    Quite entertaining post, thank you PZ.
    People, let’s get PZ’s trash viral, all over the blogs ;-)

  698. #699 Pat
    July 24, 2008

    Well done John. Speaking of John ……

    The Gospel According to Saint John
    1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 1:2The same was in the beginning with God. 1:3All things were made through him; and without him was not anything made that hath been made. 1:4In him was life; and the life was the light of men. 1:5And the light shineth in the darkness; and the darkness apprehended it not. 1:6There came a man, sent from God, whose name was John. 1:7The same came for witness, that he might bear witness of the light, that all might believe through him. 1:8He was not the light, but came that he might bear witness of the light. 1:9There was the true light, even the light which lighteth every man, coming into the world. 1:10He was in the world, and the world was made through him, and the world knew him not. 1:11He came unto his own, and they that were his own received him not. 1:12But as many as received him, to them gave he the right to become children of God, even to them that believe on his name: 1:13who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. 1:14And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth. 1:15John beareth witness of him, and crieth, saying, This was he of whom I said, He that cometh after me is become before me: for he was before me. 1:16For of his fulness we all received, and grace for grace. 1:17For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. 1:18No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. 1:19And this is the witness of John, when the Jews sent unto him from Jerusalem priests and Levites to ask him, Who art thou? 1:20And he confessed, and denied not; and he confessed, I am not the Christ. 1:21And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elijah? And he saith, I am not. Art thou the prophet? And he answered, No. 1:22They said therefore unto him, Who art thou? that we may give an answer to them that sent us. What sayest thou of thyself? 1:23He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said Isaiah the prophet. 1:24And they had been sent from the Pharisees. 1:25And they asked him, and said unto him, Why then baptizest thou, if thou art not the Christ, neither Elijah, neither the prophet? 1:26John answered them, saying, I baptize in water: in the midst of you standeth one whom ye know not, 1:27even he that cometh after me, the latchet of whose shoe I am not worthy to unloose. 1:28These things were done in Bethany beyond the Jordan, where John was baptizing. 1:29On the morrow he seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold, the Lamb of God, that taketh away the sin of the world! 1:30This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man who is become before me: for he was before me. 1:31And I knew him not; but that he should be made manifest to Israel, for this cause came I baptizing in water. 1:32And John bare witness, saying, I have beheld the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven; and it abode upon him. 1:33And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize in water, he said unto me, Upon whomsoever thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and abiding upon him, the same is he that baptizeth in the Holy Spirit. 1:34And I have seen, and have borne witness that this is the Son of God. 1:35Again on the morrow John was standing, and two of his disciples; 1:36and he looked upon Jesus as he walked, and saith, Behold, the Lamb of God! 1:37And the two disciples heard him speak, and they followed Jesus. 1:38And Jesus turned, and beheld them following, and saith unto them, What seek ye? And they said unto him, Rabbi (which is to say, being interpreted, Teacher), where abideth thou? 1:39He saith unto them, Come, and ye shall see. They came therefore and saw where he abode; and they abode with him that day: it was about the tenth hour. 1:40One of the two that heard John speak, and followed him, was Andrew, Simon Peter’s brother. 1:41He findeth first his own brother Simon, and saith unto him, We have found the Messiah (which is, being interpreted, Christ). 1:42He brought him unto Jesus. Jesus looked upon him, and said, Thou art Simon the son of John: thou shalt be called Cephas (which is by interpretation, Peter). 1:43On the morrow he was minded to go forth into Galilee, and he findeth Philip: and Jesus saith unto him, Follow me. 1:44Now Philip was from Bethsaida, of the city of Andrew and Peter. 1:45Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, wrote, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph. 1:46And Nathanael said unto him, Can any good thing come out of Nazareth? Philip saith unto him, Come and see. 1:47Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile! 1:48Nathanael saith unto him, Whence knowest thou me? Jesus answered and said unto him, Before Philip called thee, when thou wast under the fig tree, I saw thee. 1:49Nathanael answered him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art King of Israel. 1:50Jesus answered and said unto him, Because I said unto thee, I saw thee underneath the fig tree, believest thou? thou shalt see greater things than these. 1:51And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye shall see the heaven opened, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man.
    2:1And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: 2:2and Jesus also was bidden, and his disciples, to the marriage. 2:3And when the wine failed, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. 2:4And Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come. 2:5His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. 2:6Now there were six waterpots of stone set there after the Jews’ manner of purifying, containing two or three firkins apiece. 2:7Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim. 2:8And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the ruler of the feast. And they bare it. 2:9And when the ruler of the feast tasted the water now become wine, and knew not whence it was (but the servants that had drawn the water knew), the ruler of the feast calleth the bridegroom, 2:10and saith unto him, Every man setteth on first the good wine; and when men have drunk freely, then that which is worse: thou hast kept the good wine until now. 2:11This beginning of his signs did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested his glory; and his disciples believed on him. 2:12After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples; and there they abode not many days. 2:13And the passover of the Jews was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 2:14And he found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: 2:15and he made a scourge of cords, and cast all out of the temple, both the sheep and the oxen; and he poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew their tables; 2:16and to them that sold the doves he said, Take these things hence; make not my Father’s house a house of merchandise. 2:17His disciples remembered that it was written, Zeal for thy house shall eat me up. 2:18The Jews therefore answered and said unto him, What sign showest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things? 2:19Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. 2:20The Jews therefore said, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou raise it up in three days? 2:21But he spake of the temple of his body. 2:22When therefore he was raised from the dead, his disciples remembered that he spake this; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said. 2:23Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, during the feast, many believed on his name, beholding his signs which he did. 2:24But Jesus did not trust himself unto them, for that he knew all men, 2:25and because he needed not that any one should bear witness concerning man; for he himself knew what was in man.
    3:1Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: 3:2the same came unto him by night, and said to him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that thou doest, except God be with him. 3:3Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except one be born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God. 3:4Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb, and be born? 3:5Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except one be born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God! 3:6That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 3:7Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born anew. 3:8The wind bloweth where it will, and thou hearest the voice thereof, but knowest not whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. 3:9Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? 3:10Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou the teacher of Israel, and understandest not these things? 3:11Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that which we know, and bear witness of that which we have seen; and ye receive not our witness. 3:12If I told you earthly things and ye believe not, how shall ye believe if I tell you heavenly things? 3:13And no one hath ascended into heaven, but he that descended out of heaven, even the Son of man, who is in heaven. 3:14And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; 3:15that whosoever believeth may in him have eternal life. 3:16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life. 3:17For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through him. 3:18He that believeth on him is not judged: he that believeth not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only begotten Son of God. 3:19And this is the judgment, that the light is come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the light; for their works were evil. 3:20For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, and cometh not to the light, lest his works should be reproved. 3:21But he that doeth the truth cometh to the light, that his works may be made manifest, that they have been wrought in God. 3:22After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 3:23And John also was baptizing in Enon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized. 3:24For John was not yet cast into prison. 3:25There arose therefore a questioning on the part of John’s disciples with a Jew about purifying. 3:26And they came unto John, and said to him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond the Jordan, to whom thou hast borne witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him. 3:27John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it have been given him from heaven. 3:28Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but, that I am sent before him. 3:29He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, that standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom’s voice: this my joy therefore is made full. 3:30He must increase, but I must decrease. 3:31He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is of the earth, and of the earth he speaketh: he that cometh from heaven is above all. 3:32What he hath seen and heard, of that he beareth witness; and no man receiveth his witness. 3:33He that hath received his witness hath set his seal to this, that God is true. 3:34For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for he giveth not the Spirit by measure. 3:35The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. 3:36He that believeth on the Son hath eternal life; but he that obeyeth not the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abideth on him.
    4:1When therefore the Lord knew that the Pharisees had heard that Jesus was making and baptizing more disciples than John 4:2(although Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples), 4:3he left Judea, and departed again into Galilee. 4:4And he must needs pass through Samaria. 4:5So he cometh to a city of Samaria, called Sychar, near to the parcel of ground that Jacob gave to his son Joseph: 4:6and Jacob’s well was there. Jesus therefore, being wearied with his journey, sat thus by the well. It was about the sixth hour. 4:7There cometh a woman of Samaria to draw water: Jesus saith unto her, Give me to drink. 4:8For his disciples were gone away into the city to buy food. 4:9The Samaritan woman therefore saith unto him, How is it that thou, being a Jew, askest drink of me, who am a Samaritan woman? (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.) 4:10Jesus answered and said unto unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water. 4:11The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: whence then hast thou that living water? 4:12Art thou greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his sons, and his cattle? 4:13Jesus answered and said unto her, Every one that drinketh of this water shall thirst again: 4:14but whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall become in him a well of water springing up unto eternal life. 4:15The woman saith unto him, Sir, give me this water, that I thirst not, neither come all the way hither to draw. 4:16Jesus saith unto her, Go, call thy husband, and come hither. 4:17The woman answered and said unto him, I have no husband. Jesus saith unto her, Thou saidst well, I have no husband: 4:18for thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: this hast thou said truly. 4:19The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet. 4:20Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship. 4:21Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when neither in this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, shall ye worship the Father. 4:22Ye worship that which ye know not: we worship that which we know; for salvation is from the Jews. 4:23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and truth: for such doth the Father seek to be his worshippers. 4:24God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship in spirit and truth. 4:25The woman saith unto him, I know that Messiah cometh (he that is called Christ): when he is come, he will declare unto us all things. 4:26Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he. 4:27And upon this came his disciples; and they marvelled that he was speaking with a woman; yet no man said, What seekest thou? or, Why speakest thou with her? 4:28So the woman left her waterpot, and went away into the city, and saith to the people, 4:29Come, see a man, who told me all things that ever I did: can this be the Christ? 4:30They went out of the city, and were coming to him. 4:31In the mean while the disciples prayed him, saying, Rabbi, eat. 4:32But he said unto them, I have meat to eat that ye know not. 4:33The disciples therefore said one to another, Hath any man brought him aught to eat? 4:34Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to accomplish his work. 4:35Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh the harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields, that they are white already unto harvest. 4:36He that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal; that he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together. 4:37For herein is the saying true, One soweth, and another reapeth. 4:38I sent you to reap that whereon ye have not labored: others have labored, and ye are entered into their labor. 4:39And from that city many of the Samaritans believed on him because of the word of the woman, who testified, He told me all things that ever I did. 4:40So when the Samaritans came unto him, they besought him to abide with them: and he abode there two days. 4:41And many more believed because of his word; 4:42and they said to the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy speaking: for we have heard for ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Saviour of the world. 4:43And after the two days he went forth from thence into Galilee. 4:44For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honor in his own country. 4:45So when he came into Galilee, the Galilaeans received him, having seen all the things that he did in Jerusalem at the feast: for they also went unto the feast. 4:46He came therefore again unto Cana of Galilee, where he made the water wine. And there was a certain nobleman, whose son was sick at Capernaum. 4:47When he heard that Jesus was come out of Judaea into Galilee, he went unto him, and besought him that he would come down, and heal his son; for he was at the point of death. 4:48Jesus therefore said unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will in no wise believe. 4:49The nobleman saith unto him, Sir, come down ere my child die. 4:50Jesus saith unto him, Go thy way; thy son liveth. The man believed the word that Jesus spake unto him, and he went his way. 4:51And as he was now going down, his servants met him, saying, that his son lived. 4:52So he inquired of them the hour when he began to amend. They said therefore unto him, Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him. 4:53So the father knew that it was at that hour in which Jesus said unto him, Thy son liveth: and himself believed, and his whole house. 4:54This is again the second sign that Jesus did, having come out of Judaea into Galilee.
    5:1After these things there was a feast of the Jews; and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 5:2Now there is in Jerusalem by the sheep gate a pool, which is called in Hebrew Bethesda, having five porches. 5:3In these lay a multitude of them that were sick, blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. 5:4for an angel of the Lord went down at certain seasons into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the waters stepped in was made whole, with whatsoever disease he was holden. 5:5And a certain man was there, who had been thirty and eight years in his infirmity. 5:6When Jesus saw him lying, and knew that he had been now a long time in that case, he saith unto him, Wouldest thou be made whole? 5:7The sick man answered him, Sir, I have no man, when the water is troubled, to put me into the pool: but while I am coming, another steppeth down before me. 5:8Jesus saith unto him, Arise, take up thy bed, and walk. 5:9And straightway the man was made whole, and took up his bed and walked. Now it was the sabbath on that day. 5:10So the Jews said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath, and it is not lawful for thee to take up thy bed. 5:11But he answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk. 5:12They asked him, Who is the man that said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk? 5:13But he that was healed knew not who it was; for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in the place. 5:14Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing befall thee. 5:15The man went away, and told the Jews that it was Jesus who had made him whole. 5:16And for this cause the Jews persecuted Jesus, because he did these things on the sabbath. 5:17But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh even until now, and I work. 5:18For this cause therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only brake the sabbath, but also called God his own Father, making himself equal with God. 5:19Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father doing: for what things soever he doeth, these the Son also doeth in like manner. 5:20For the Father loveth the Son, and showeth him all things that himself doeth: and greater works than these will he show him, that ye may marvel. 5:21For as the Father raiseth the dead and giveth them life, even so the Son also giveth life to whom he will. 5:22For neither doth the Father judge any man, but he hath given all judgment unto the Son; 5:23that all may honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He that honoreth not the Son honoreth not the Father that sent him. 5:24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth him that sent me, hath eternal life, and cometh not into judgment, but hath passed out of death into life. 5:25Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour cometh, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God; and they that hear shall live. 5:26For as the Father hath life in himself, even so gave he to the Son also to have life in himself: 5:27and he gave him authority to execute judgment, because he is a son of man. 5:28Marvel not at this: for the hour cometh, in which all that are in the tombs shall hear his voice, 5:29and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of judgment. 5:30I can of myself do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is righteous; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. 5:31If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true. 5:32It is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true. 5:33Ye have sent unto John, and he hath borne witness unto the truth. 5:34But the witness which I receive is not from man: howbeit I say these things, that ye may be saved. 5:35He was the lamp that burneth and shineth; and ye were willing to rejoice for a season in his light. 5:36But the witness which I have is greater than that of John; for the works which the Father hath given me to accomplish, the very works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. 5:37And the Father that sent me, he hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his form. 5:38And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he sent, him ye believe not. 5:39Ye search the scriptures, because ye think that in them ye have eternal life; and these are they which bear witness of me; 5:40and ye will not come to me, that ye may have life. 5:41I receive not glory from men. 5:42But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in yourselves. 5:43I am come in my Father’s name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 5:44How can ye believe, who receive glory one of another, and the glory that cometh from the only God ye seek not? 5:45Think not that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, on whom ye have set your hope. 5:46For if ye believed Moses, ye would believe me; for he wrote of me. 5:47But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
    6:1After these things Jesus went away to the other side of the sea of Galilee, which is the sea of Tiberias. 6:2And a great multitude followed him, because they beheld the signs which he did on them that were sick. 6:3And Jesus went up into the mountain, and there he sat with his disciples. 6:4Now the passover, the feast of the Jews, was at hand. 6:5Jesus therefore lifting up his eyes, and seeing that a great multitude cometh unto him, saith unto Philip, Whence are we to buy bread, that these may eat? 6:6And this he said to prove him: for he himself knew what he would do. 6:7Philip answered him, Two hundred shillings’ worth of bread is not sufficient for them, that every one may take a little. 6:8One of his disciples, Andrew, Simon Peter’s brother, saith unto him, 6:9There is a lad here, who hath five barley loaves, and two fishes: but what are these among so many? 6:10Jesus said, Make the people sit down. Now there was much grass in the place. So the men sat down, in number about five thousand. 6:11Jesus therefore took the loaves; and having given thanks, he distributed to them that were set down; likewise also of the fishes as much as they would. 6:12And when they were filled, he saith unto his disciples, Gather up the broken pieces which remain over, that nothing be lost. 6:13So they gathered them up, and filled twelve baskets with broken pieces from the five barley loaves, which remained over unto them that had eaten. 6:14When therefore the people saw the sign which he did, they said, This is of a truth the prophet that cometh into the world. 6:15Jesus therefore perceiving that they were about to come and take him by force, to make him king, withdrew again into the mountain himself alone. 6:16And when evening came, his disciples went down unto the sea; 6:17and they entered into a boat, and were going over the sea unto Capernaum. And it was now dark, and Jesus had not yet come to them. 6:18And the sea was rising by reason of a great wind that blew. 6:19When therefore they had rowed about five and twenty or thirty furlongs, they behold Jesus walking on the sea, and drawing nigh unto the boat: and they were afraid. 6:20But he saith unto them, It is I; be not afraid. 6:21They were willing therefore to receive him into the boat: and straightway the boat was at the land whither they were going. 6:22On the morrow the multitude that stood on the other side of the sea saw that there was no other boat there, save one, and that Jesus entered not with his disciples into the boat, but that his disciples went away alone 6:23(howbeit there came boats from Tiberias nigh unto the place where they ate the bread after the Lord had given thanks): 6:24when the multitude therefore saw that Jesus was not there, neither his disciples, they themselves got into the boats, and came to Capernaum, seeking Jesus. 6:25And when they found him on the other side of the sea, they said unto him, Rabbi, when camest thou hither? 6:26Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye seek me, not because ye saw signs, but because ye ate of the loaves, and were filled. 6:27Work not for the food which perisheth, but for the food which abideth unto eternal life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him the Father, even God, hath sealed. 6:28They said therefore unto him, What must we do, that we may work the works of God? 6:29Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. 6:30They said therefore unto him, What then doest thou for a sign, that we may see, and believe thee? what workest thou? 6:31Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness; as it is written, He gave them bread out of heaven to eat. 6:32Jesus therefore said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, It was not Moses that gave you the bread out of heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread out of heaven. 6:33For the bread of God is that which cometh down out of heaven, and giveth life unto the world. 6:34They said therefore unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread. 6:35Jesus said unto them. I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall not hunger, and he that believeth on me shall never thirst. 6:36But I said unto you, that ye have seen me, and yet believe not. 6:37All that which the Father giveth me shall come unto me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. 6:38For I am come down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. 6:39And this is the will of him that sent me, that of all that which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. 6:40For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believeth on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. 6:41The Jews therefore murmured concerning him, because he said, I am the bread which came down out of heaven. 6:42And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how doth he now say, I am come down out of heaven? 6:43Jesus answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves. 6:44No man can come to me, except the Father that sent me draw him: and I will raise him up in the last day. 6:45It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught of God. Every one that hath heard from the Father, and hath learned, cometh unto me. 6:46Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he that is from God, he hath seen the Father. 6:47Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth hath eternal life. 6:48I am the bread of life. 6:49Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 6:50This is the bread which cometh down out of heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die. 6:51I am the living bread which came down out of heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: yea and the bread which I will give is my flesh, for the life of the world. 6:52The Jews therefore strove one with another, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat? 6:53Jesus therefore said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, ye have not life in yourselves. 6:54He that eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood hath eternal life: and I will raise him up at the last day. 6:55For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. 6:56He that eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood abideth in me, and I in him. 6:57As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father; so he that eateth me, he also shall live because of me. 6:58This is the bread which came down out of heaven: not as the fathers ate, and died; he that eateth this bread shall live for ever. 6:59These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum. 6:60Many therefore of his disciples, when the heard this, said, This is a hard saying; who can hear it? 6:61But Jesus knowing in himself that his disciples murmured at this, said unto them, Doth this cause you to stumble? 6:62What then if ye should behold the Son of man ascending where he was before? 6:63It is the spirit that giveth life; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I have spoken unto you are spirit, are are life. 6:64But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who it was that should betray him. 6:65And he said, For this cause have I said unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it be given unto him of the Father. 6:66Upon this many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. 6:67Jesus said therefore unto the twelve, Would ye also go away? 6:68Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 6:69And we have believed and know that thou art the Holy One of God. 6:70Jesus answered them, Did not I choose you the twelve, and one of you is a devil? 6:71Now he spake of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
    7:1And after these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Judaea, because the Jews sought to kill him. 7:2Now the feast of the Jews, the feast of tabernacles, was at hand. 7:3His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may behold thy works which thou doest. 7:4For no man doeth anything in secret, and himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou doest these things, manifest thyself to the world. 7:5For even his brethren did not believe on him. 7:6Jesus therefore saith unto them, My time is not yet come; but your time is always ready. 7:7The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that its works are evil. 7:8Go ye up unto the feast: I go not up unto this feast; because my time is not yet fulfilled. 7:9And having said these things unto them, he abode still in Galilee. 7:10But when his brethren were gone up unto the feast, then went he also up, not publicly, but as it were in secret. 7:11The Jews therefore sought him at the feast, and said, Where is he? 7:12And there was much murmuring among the multitudes concerning him: some said, He is a good man; others said, Not so, but he leadeth the multitude astray. 7:13Yet no man spake openly of him for fear of the Jews. 7:14But when it was now the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught. 7:15The Jews therefore marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned? 7:16Jesus therefore answered them and said, My teaching is not mine, but his that sent me. 7:17If any man willeth to do his will, he shall know of the teaching, whether it is of God, or whether I speak from myself. 7:18He that speaketh from himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh the glory of him that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him. 7:19Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you doeth the law? Why seek ye to kill me? 7:20The multitude answered, Thou hast a demon: who seeketh to kill thee? 7:21Jesus answered and said unto them, I did one work, and ye all marvel because thereof. 7:22Moses hath given you circumcision (not that it is of Moses, but of the fathers); and on the sabbath ye circumcise a man. 7:23If a man receiveth circumcision on the sabbath, that the law of Moses may not be broken; are ye wroth with me, because I made a man every whit whole on the sabbath? 7:24Judge not according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment. 7:25Some therefore of them of Jerusalem said, Is not this he whom they seek to kill? 7:26And lo, he speaketh openly, and they say nothing unto him. Can it be that the rulers indeed know that this is the Christ? 7:27Howbeit we know this man whence he is: but when the Christ cometh, no one knoweth whence he is. 7:28Jesus therefore cried in the temple, teaching and saying, Ye both know me, and know whence I am; and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, whom ye know not. 7:29I know him; because I am from him, and he sent me. 7:30They sought therefore to take him: and no man laid his hand on him, because his hour was not yet come. 7:31But of the multitude many believed on him; and they said, When the Christ shall come, will he do more signs than those which this man hath done? 7:32The Pharisees heard the multitude murmuring these things concerning him; and the chief priests and the Pharisees sent officers to take him. 7:33Jesus therefore said, Yet a little while am I with you, and I go unto him that sent me. 7:34Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, ye cannot come. 7:35The Jews therefore said among themselves, Whither will this man go that we shall not find him? will he go unto the Dispersion among the Greeks, and teach the Greeks? 7:36What is this word that he said, Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me; and where I am, ye cannot come? 7:37Now on the last day, the great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me and drink. 7:38He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, from within him shall flow rivers of living water. 7:39But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believed on him were to receive: for the Spirit was not yet given; because Jesus was not yet glorified. 7:40Some of the multitude therefore, when they heard these words, said, This is of a truth the prophet. 7:41Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, What, doth the Christ come out of Galilee? 7:42Hath not the scripture said that the Christ cometh of the seed of David, and from Bethlehem, the village where David was? 7:43So there arose a division in the multitude because of him. 7:44And some of them would have taken him; but no man laid hands on him. 7:45The officers therefore came to the chief priests and Pharisees; and they said unto them, Why did ye not bring him? 7:46The officers answered, Never man so spake. 7:47The Pharisees therefore answered them, Are ye also led astray? 7:48Hath any of the rulers believed on him, or of the Pharisees? 7:49But this multitude that knoweth not the law are accursed. 7:50Nicodemus saith unto them (he that came to him before, being one of them), 7:51Doth our law judge a man, except it first hear from himself and know what he doeth? 7:52They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and see that out of Galilee ariseth no prophet.
    7:53And they went every man unto his own house:
    8:1but Jesus went unto the mount of Olives. 8:2And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them. 8:3And the scribes and the Pharisees bring a woman taken in adultery; and having set her in the midst, 8:4they say unto him, Teacher, this woman hath been taken in adultery, in the very act. 8:5Now in the law Moses commanded us to stone such: what then sayest thou of her? 8:6And this they said, trying him, that they might have whereof to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground. 8:7But when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. 8:8And again he stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground. 8:9And they, when they heard it, went out one by one, beginning from the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman, where she was, in the midst. 8:10And Jesus lifted up himself, and said unto her, Woman, where are they? did no man condemn thee? 8:11And she said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said, Neither do I condemn thee: go thy way; from henceforth sin no more. 8:12Again therefore Jesus spake unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in the darkness, but shall have the light of life. 8:13The Pharisees therefore said unto him, Thou bearest witness of thyself; thy witness is not true. 8:14Jesus answered and said unto them, Even if I bear witness of myself, my witness is true; for I know whence I came, and whither I go; but ye know not whence I come, or whither I go. 8:15Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man. 8:16Yea and if I judge, my judgment is true; for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me. 8:17Yea and in your law it is written, that the witness of two men is true. 8:18I am he that beareth witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me. 8:19They said therefore unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye know neither me, nor my Father: if ye knew me, ye would know my Father also. 8:20These words spake he in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man took him; because his hour was not yet come. 8:21He said therefore again unto them, I go away, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sin: whither I go, ye cannot come. 8:22The Jews therefore said, Will he kill himself, that he saith, Whither I go, ye cannot come? 8:23And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 8:24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for except ye believe that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. 8:25They said therefore unto him, Who art thou? Jesus said unto them, Even that which I have also spoken unto you from the beginning. 8:26I have many things to speak and to judge concerning you: howbeit he that sent me is true; and the things which I heard from him, these speak I unto the world. 8:27They perceived not that he spake to them of the Father. 8:28Jesus therefore said, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself, but as the Father taught me, I speak these things. 8:29And he that sent me is with me; he hath not left me alone; for I do always the things that are pleasing to him. 8:30As he spake these things, many believed on him. 8:31Jesus therefore said to those Jews that had believed him, If ye abide in my word, then are ye truly my disciples; 8:32and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. 8:33They answered unto him, We are Abraham’s seed, and have never yet been in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free? 8:34Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Every one that committeth sin is the bondservant of sin. 8:35And the bondservant abideth not in the house for ever: the son abideth for ever. 8:36If therefore the Son shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed. 8:37I know that ye are Abraham’s seed: yet ye seek to kill me, because my word hath not free course in you. 8:38I speak the things which I have seen with my Father: and ye also do the things which ye heard from your father. 8:39They answered and said unto him, Our father is Abraham. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham’s children, ye would do the works of Abraham. 8:40But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I heard from God: this did not Abraham. 8:41Ye do the works of your father. They said unto him, We were not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God. 8:42Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I came forth and am come from God; for neither have I come of myself, but he sent me. 8:43Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word. 8:44Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof. 8:45But because I say the truth, ye believe me not. 8:46Which of you convicteth me of sin? If I say truth, why do ye not believe me? 8:47He that is of God heareth the words of God: for this cause ye hear them not, because ye are not of God. 8:48The Jews answered and said unto him, Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a demon? 8:49Jesus answered, I have not a demon; but I honor my Father, and ye dishonor me. 8:50But I seek not mine own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth. 8:51Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my word, he shall never see death. 8:52The Jews said unto him, Now we know that thou hast a demon. Abraham died, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my word, he shall never taste of death. 8:53Art thou greater than our father Abraham, who died? and the prophets died: whom makest thou thyself? 8:54Jesus answered, If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing: it is my Father that glorifieth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God; 8:55and ye have not known him: but I know him; and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be like unto you, a liar: but I know him, and keep his word. 8:56Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day; and he saw it, and was glad. 8:57The Jews therefore said unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 8:58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was born, I am. 8:59They took up stones therefore to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple.
    9:1And as he passed by, he saw a man blind from his birth. 9:2And his disciples asked him, saying, Rabbi, who sinned, this man, or his parents, that he should be born blind? 9:3Jesus answered, Neither did this man sin, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him. 9:4We must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work. 9:5When I am in the world, I am the light of the world. 9:6When he had thus spoken, he spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and anointed his eyes with the clay, 9:7and said unto him, Go, wash in the pool of Siloam (which is by interpretation, Sent). He went away therefore, and washed, and came seeing. 9:8The neighbors therefore, and they that saw him aforetime, that he was a beggar, said, Is not this he that sat and begged? 9:9Others said, It is he: others said, No, but he is like him. He said, I am he. 9:10They said therefore unto him, How then were thine eyes opened? 9:11He answered, The man that is called Jesus made clay, and anointed mine eyes, and said unto me, Go to Siloam, and wash: so I went away and washed, and I received sight. 9:12And they said unto him, Where is he? He saith, I know not. 9:13They bring to the Pharisees him that aforetime was blind. 9:14Now it was the sabbath on the day when Jesus made the clay, and opened his eyes. 9:15Again therefore the Pharisees also asked him how he received his sight. And he said unto them, He put clay upon mine eyes, and I washed, and I see. 9:16Some therefore of the Pharisees said, This man is not from God, because he keepeth not the sabbath. But others said, How can a man that is a sinner do such signs? And there was division among them. 9:17They say therefore unto the blind man again, What sayest thou of him, in that he opened thine eyes? And he said, He is a prophet. 9:18The Jews therefore did not believe concerning him, that he had been blind, and had received his sight, until they called the parents of him that had received his sight, 9:19and asked them, saying, Is this your son, who ye say was born blind? How then doth he now see? 9:20His parents answered and said, We know that this is our son, and that he was born blind: 9:21but how he now seeth, we know not; or who opened his eyes, we know not: ask him; he is of age; he shall speak for himself. 9:22These things said his parents, because they feared the Jews: for the Jews had agreed already, that if any man should confess him to be Christ, he should be put out of the synagogue. 9:23Therefore said his parents, He is of age; ask him. 9:24So they called a second time the man that was blind, and said unto him, Give glory to God: we know that this man is a sinner. 9:25He therefore answered, Whether he is a sinner, I know not: one thing I know, that, whereas I was blind, now I see. 9:26They said therefore unto him, What did he to thee? How opened he thine eyes? 9:27He answered them, I told you even now, and ye did not hear; wherefore would ye hear it again? would ye also become his disciples? 9:28And they reviled him, and said, Thou art his disciple; but we are disciples of Moses. 9:29We know that God hath spoken unto Moses: but as for this man, we know not whence he is. 9:30The man answered and said unto them, Why, herein is the marvel, that ye know not whence he is, and yet he opened mine eyes. 9:31We know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and do his will, him he heareth. 9:32Since the world began it was never heard that any one opened the eyes of a man born blind. 9:33If this man were not from God, he could do nothing. 9:34They answered and said unto him, Thou wast altogether born in sins, and dost thou teach us? And they cast him out. 9:35Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and finding him, he said, Dost thou believe on the Son of God? 9:36He answered and said, And who is he, Lord, that I may believe on him? 9:37Jesus said unto him, Thou hast both seen him, and he it is that speaketh with thee. 9:38And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him. 9:39And Jesus said, For judgment came I into this world, that they that see not may see; and that they that see may become blind. 9:40Those of the Pharisees who were with him heard these things, and said unto him, Are we also blind? 9:41Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye would have no sin: but now ye say, We see: your sin remaineth.
    10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the fold of the sheep, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. 10:2But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. 10:3To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out. 10:4When he hath put forth all his own, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice. 10:5And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers. 10:6This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them. 10:7Jesus therefore said unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 10:8All that came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 10:9I am the door; by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and go out, and shall find pasture. 10:10The thief cometh not, but that he may steal, and kill, and destroy: I came that they may have life, and may have it abundantly. 10:11I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd layeth down his life for the sheep. 10:12He that is a hireling, and not a shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, beholdeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth, and the wolf snatcheth them, and scattereth them: 10:13he fleeth because he is a hireling, and careth not for the sheep. 10:14I am the good shepherd; and I know mine own, and mine own know me, 10:15even as the Father knoweth me, and I know the Father; and I lay down my life for the sheep. 10:16And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice: and they shall become one flock, one shepherd. 10:17Therefore doth the Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. 10:18No one taketh it away from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment received I from my Father. 10:19There arose a division again among the Jews because of these words. 10:20And many of them said, He hath a demon, and is mad; why hear ye him? 10:21Others said, These are not the sayings of one possessed with a demon. Can a demon open the eyes of the blind? 10:22And it was the feast of the dedication at Jerusalem: 10:23it was winter; and Jesus was walking in the temple in Solomon’s porch. 10:24The Jews therefore came round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou hold us in suspense? If thou art the Christ, tell us plainly. 10:25Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believe not: the works that I do in my Father’s name, these bear witness of me. 10:26But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep. 10:27My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 10:28and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand. 10:29My Father, who hath given them unto me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. 10:30I and the Father are one. 10:31The Jews took up stones again to stone him. 10:32Jesus answered them, Many good works have I showed you from the Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? 10:33The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. 10:34Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, ye are gods? 10:35If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came (and the scripture cannot be broken), 10:36say ye of him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? 10:37If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. 10:38But if I do them, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father. 10:39They sought again to take him: and he went forth out of their hand. 10:40And he went away again beyond the Jordan into the place where John was at the first baptizing; and there be abode. 10:41And many came unto him; and they said, John indeed did no sign: but all things whatsoever John spake of this man were true. 10:42And many believed on him there.
    11:1Now a certain man was sick, Lazarus of Bethany, of the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 11:2And it was that Mary who anointed the Lord with ointment, and wiped his feet with her hair, whose brother Lazarus was sick. 11:3The sisters therefore sent unto him, saying, Lord, behold, he whom thou lovest is sick. 11:4But when Jesus heard it, he said, This sickness is not unto death, but for the glory of God, that the Son of God may be glorified thereby. 11:5Now Jesus loved Martha, and her sister, and Lazarus. 11:6When therefore he heard that he was sick, he abode at that time two days in the place where he was. 11:7Then after this he saith to the disciples, Let us go into Judaea again. 11:8The disciples say unto him, Rabbi, the Jews were but now seeking to stone thee; and goest thou thither again? 11:9Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If a man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world. 11:10But if a man walk in the night, he stumbleth, because the light is not in him. 11:11These things spake he: and after this he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus is fallen asleep; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. 11:12The disciples therefore said unto him, Lord, if he is fallen asleep, he will recover. 11:13Now Jesus had spoken of his death: but they thought that he spake of taking rest in sleep. 11:14Then Jesus therefore said unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead. 11:15And I am glad for your sakes that I was not there, to the intent ye may believe; nevertheless let us go unto him. 11:16Thomas therefore, who is called Didymus, said unto his fellow-disciples, Let us also go, that we may die with him. 11:17So when Jesus came, he found that he had been in the tomb four days already. 11:18Now Bethany was nigh unto Jerusalem, about fifteen furlongs off; 11:19and many of the Jews had come to Martha and Mary, to console them concerning their brother. 11:20Martha therefore, when she heard that Jesus was coming, went and met him: but Mary still sat in the house. 11:21Martha therefore said unto Jesus, Lord, if thou hadst been here, my brother had not died. 11:22And even now I know that, whatsoever thou shalt ask of God, God will give thee. 11:23Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again. 11:24Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day. 11:25Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth on me, though he die, yet shall he live; 11:26and whosoever liveth and believeth on me shall never die. Believest thou this? 11:27She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I have believed that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, even he that cometh into the world. 11:28And when she had said this, she went away, and called Mary her sister secretly, saying, The Teacher is her, and calleth thee. 11:29And she, when she heard it, arose quickly, and went unto him. 11:30(Now Jesus was not yet come into the village, but was still in the place where Martha met him.) 11:31The Jews then who were with her in the house, and were consoling her, when they saw Mary, that she rose up quickly and went out, followed her, supposing that she was going unto the tomb to weep there. 11:32Mary therefore, when she came where Jesus was, and saw him, fell down at his feet, saying unto him, Lord, if thou hadst been here, my brother had not died. 11:33When Jesus therefore saw her weeping, and the Jews also weeping who came with her, he groaned in the spirit, and was troubled, 11:34and said, Where have ye laid him? They say unto him, Lord, come and see. 11:35Jesus wept. 11:36The Jews therefore said, Behold how he loved him! 11:37But some of them said, Could not this man, who opened the eyes of him that was blind, have caused that this man also should not die? 11:38Jesus therefore again groaning in himself cometh to the tomb. Now it was a cave, and a stone lay against it. 11:39Jesus saith, Take ye away the stone. Martha, the sister of him that was dead, saith unto him, Lord, by this time the body decayeth; for he hath been dead four days. 11:40Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou believedst, thou shouldest see the glory of God? 11:41So they took away the stone. And Jesus lifted up his eyes, and said, Father, I thank thee that thou heardest me. 11:42And I knew that thou hearest me always: but because of the multitude that standeth around I said it, that they may believe that thou didst send me. 11:43And when he had thus spoken, he cried with a loud voice, Lazarus, come forth. 11:44He that was dead came forth, bound hand and foot with grave-clothes; and his face was bound about with a napkin. Jesus saith unto them, Loose him, and let him go. 11:45Many therefore of the Jews, who came to Mary and beheld that which he did, believed on him. 11:46But some of them went away to the Pharisees, and told them the things which Jesus had done. 11:47The chief priests therefore and the Pharisees gathered a council, and said, What do we? for this man doeth many signs. 11:48If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation. 11:49But a certain one of them, Caiaphas, being high priest that year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all, 11:50nor do ye take account that it is expedient for you that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not. 11:51Now this he said not of himself: but, being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for the nation; 11:52and not for the nation only, but that he might also gather together into one the children of God that are scattered abroad. 11:53So from that day forth they took counsel that they might put him to death. 11:54Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the Jews, but departed thence into the country near to the wilderness, into a city called Ephraim; and there he tarried with the disciples. 11:55Now the passover of the Jews was at hand: and many went up to Jerusalem out of the country before the passover, to purify themselves. 11:56They sought therefore for Jesus, and spake one with another, as they stood in the temple, What think ye? That he will not come to the feast? 11:57Now the chief priests and the Pharisees had given commandment, that, if any man knew where he was, he should show it, that they might take him.
    12:1Jesus therefore six days before the passover came to Bethany, where Lazarus was, whom Jesus raised from the dead. 12:2So they made him a supper there: and Martha served; but Lazarus was one of them that sat at meat with him. 12:3Mary therefore took a pound of ointment of pure nard, very precious, and anointed the feet of Jesus, and wiped his feet with her hair: and the house was filled with the odor of the ointment. 12:4But Judas Iscariot, one of his disciples, that should betray him, saith, 12:5Why was not this ointment sold for three hundred shillings, and given to the poor? 12:6Now this he said, not because he cared for the poor; but because he was a thief, and having the bag took away what was put therein. 12:7Jesus therefore said, Suffer her to keep it against the day of my burying. 12:8For the poor ye have always with you; but me ye have not always. 12:9The common people therefore of the Jews learned that he was there: and they came, not for Jesus’ sake only, but that they might see Lazarus also, whom he had raised from the dead. 12:10But the chief priests took counsel that they might put Lazarus also to death; 12:11because that by reason of him many of the Jews went away, and believed on Jesus. 12:12On the morrow a great multitude that had come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem, 12:13took the branches of the palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried out, Hosanna: Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord, even the King of Israel. 12:14And Jesus, having found a young ass, sat thereon; as it is written, 12:15Fear not, daughter of Zion: behold, thy King cometh, sitting on an ass’s colt. 12:16These things understood not his disciples at the first: but when Jesus was glorified, then remembered they that these things were written of him, and that they had done these things unto him. 12:17The multitude therefore that was with him when he called Lazarus out of the tomb, and raised him from the dead, bare witness. 12:18For this cause also the multitude went and met him, for that they heard that he had done this sign. 12:19The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Behold how ye prevail nothing: lo, the world is gone after him. 12:20Now there were certain Greeks among those that went up to worship at the feast: 12:21these therefore came to Philip, who was of Bethsaida of Galilee, and asked him, saying, Sir, we would see Jesus. 12:22Philip cometh and telleth Andrew: Andrew cometh, and Philip, and they tell Jesus. 12:23And Jesus answereth them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. 12:24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a grain of wheat fall into the earth and die, it abideth by itself alone; but if it die, it beareth much fruit. 12:25He that loveth his life loseth it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. 12:26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will the Father honor. 12:27Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour. But for this cause came I unto this hour. 12:28Father, glorify thy name. There came therefore a voice out of heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again. 12:29The multitude therefore, that stood by, and heard it, said that it had thundered: others said, An angel hath spoken to him. 12:30Jesus answered and said, This voice hath not come for my sake, but for your sakes. 12:31Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 12:32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto myself. 12:33But this he said, signifying by what manner of death he should die. 12:34The multitude therefore answered him, We have heard out of the law that the Christ abideth for ever: and how sayest thou, The Son of man must be lifted up? who is this Son of man? 12:35Jesus therefore said unto them, Yet a little while is the light among you. Walk while ye have the light, that darkness overtake you not: and he that walketh in the darkness knoweth not whither he goeth. 12:36While ye have the light, believe on the light, that ye may become sons of light. These things spake Jesus, and he departed and hid himself from them. 12:37But though he had done so many signs before them, yet they believed not on him: 12:38that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake,
    Lord, who hath believed our report?
    And to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
    12:39For this cause they could not believe, for that Isaiah said again,
    12:40He hath blinded their eyes, and he hardened their heart;
    Lest they should see with their eyes, and perceive with their heart,
    And should turn,
    And I should heal them.
    12:41These things said Isaiah, because he saw his glory; and he spake of him. 12:42Nevertheless even of the rulers many believed on him; but because of the Pharisees they did not confess it, lest they should be put out of the synagogue: 12:43for they loved the glory that is of men more than the glory that is of God. 12:44And Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me. 12:45And he that beholdeth me beholdeth him that sent me. 12:46I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me may not abide in the darkness. 12:47And if any man hear my sayings, and keep them not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 12:48He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my sayings, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I spake, the same shall judge him in the last day. 12:49For I spake not from myself; but the Father that sent me, he hath given me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 12:50And I know that his commandment is life eternal: the things therefore which I speak, even as the Father hath said unto me, so I speak.
    13:1Now before the feast of the passover, Jesus knowing that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto his Father, having loved his own that were in the world, he loved them unto the end. 13:2And during supper, the devil having already put into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon’s son, to betray him, 13:3Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all the things into his hands, and that he came forth from God, and goeth unto God, 13:4riseth from supper, and layeth aside his garments; and he took a towel, and girded himself. 13:5Then he poureth water into the basin, and began to wash the disciples’ feet, and to wipe them with the towel wherewith he was girded. 13:6So he cometh to Simon Peter. He saith unto him, Lord, dost thou wash my feet? 13:7Jesus answered and said unto him, What I do thou knowest n

  699. #700 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    Tom, no I will not give my name and address. Haven’t you noticed some of the atheists posting here? My life would be in serious danger.

    Twist in the wind atheists. Yes YOU killed 100 MILLION people in the last century alone. Nothing you say will convince me otherwise because it is true. I happen to believe in truth, unlike you who think nothing is sacred.

    You don’t believe in the good, true, or beautiful-you can’t. Such things require objective goodness, truth, and beauty. You deny that and admit it. Atheism is only hate and ugliness-a boot in the face-forever. That is why you have lost. Whether Julian said them or not the words are true, “Galilean, you have conquered.”

    PS: Spammer, I understand your anger, but please stop.

  700. #701 D. Edward Farrar
    July 24, 2008

    Gee, there are even submissions from Pope John Paul II (who, last time I looked, was dead).

  701. #702 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    Bill Donohue: The University must now take action and apply the appropriate sanction. We are contacting the president, Board of Regents and the Equal Opportunity and Affirmative Action Office at the school, as well as Minnesota’s governor and both houses of the state legislature; the Catholic community in Minnesota is also being contacted. Moreover, we are also contacting Muslim groups nationwide.

    I noticed Donohue is not contacting Richard Dawkins. Why not? PZ abused his book.

    I bet the American Muslims will think Donohue is nuts, and will ignore the whole thing.

    We already know what the Catholics will do. They’ll prove they’re more like terrorists than any Muslim. The out of control Catholic spam on this thread is a good example of their fake morality.

  702. #703 JM Inc.
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo, PZ Myers! Holy shit (crackers), I was expecting just a little picture or two, plus a description of a cracker impaled by a nail and buried under a rock next to a travelling garden gnome (let’s see you get out of that tomb, Jesus!). Well said, well done, well for it, and all that nonsense! I admit to having been a bit uncomfortable with this whole affair, mostly because I felt you weren’t getting the point across emphatically enough, but this post takes the cake! Of course, I doubt you’ll reach any of the died-in-the-wool believers, but it’s worth having done just to have gotten that message out. Thanks for making this whole affair worth while.

  703. #704 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Oh great, another masturbator has joined the spam dance. Where’s PZ anyway? Or is there another moderator on this website?

  704. #705 WayBeyondSoccerMom
    July 24, 2008

    Yay, PZ!

  705. #706 Cthulhu
    July 24, 2008

    Ban these a$$hats trying to crash the server with god garbage.

  706. #707 Nicole
    July 24, 2008

    Holy heck, PZ, you really did it! You certainly have guts.

    And, thanks for the history lesson. Funny how all that NEVER came up in my Catholic school upbringing. I shudder to think of it all.

    Was the coffee good at least? Hmmm… caffeinated christ…

  707. #708 Brownian, OM
    July 24, 2008

    Again, Religion offers answers.

    Yeah, in the same way that an exhausted parent shuts up his child’s constant “why”s with a firm “because!” If you’d like, science could do the same.

    Science is always changing – one hypothesis gets replaced by another as further discoveries are made.

    Yeah, good thing the various churches have all been in universal, unchanging agreement for the last few millennia. Fucking Galileo–all he did was reiterate what the church had been saying all along: We’ve always been at war with Eastasia.

    I’ll take the humility of science over the humility of religion any day.

  708. #709 Rayven Alandria
    July 24, 2008

    Thank you John spambot, you have wonderfully demonstrated how religious people cannot refrain from the emotional raping of others. You feel you have the right to go to someone else’s blog and copy paste massive amounts of religious drivel so as to interrupt conversation.

    People like you are the reason I feel that the Abrahamic religions teach followers to rape and violate. You have no comprehension of personal boundaries. You feel you are superior and have the right to emotionally rape and violate the rest of us.

    You are frustrated by the inability to do bodily harm to PZ, so instead you abuse in any way you can. What would your jebuscracker do? Would his crumbliness approve of your behavior?

    Come to think of it, he probably would, this kind of abusive behavior is exactly what your religion teaches you to do.

  709. #710 WayBeyondSoccerMom
    July 24, 2008

    Yay, PZ!

    (BTW, my right pointer finger is tired, after clicking past all those long winded nastygrams to you.)

  710. #711 Chris Swanson
    July 24, 2008

    Books may just be paper, and non-sacred, but I do wince at seeing them at all disfigured and rather wish you would’ve come up with a different way doing that. Perhaps a poster of Darwin and a picture of that big stone block in Mecca that I can’t ever remember how to correctly spell the name of?
    Ah, well. C’est la vie, and shame to the Catholics for getting enraged over this when there is so much else in the world that needs to be worked on.

  711. #712 AJ Milne
    July 24, 2008

    The spambot’s a nice illustration of the thinking on this subject from certain parties from the very beginning, tho’, innit? So very appropriate… And so of a piece with the same narrative, everywhere this thinking rears its ugly head.

    They don’t want to hear something? They find it offensive? Well, then, that settles it. No one should be allowed to say it. Verboten. End of story. They get to say. Their protestations of outrage are taken to trump all other considerations. Our beliefs will not be mocked. Because we will not let you mock them. Because we can’t take it. Because it threatens us.

    So, thwarted in this attempt, they’ll still attempt to suppress that expression of ridicule by whatever means necessary. And since the death threats failed, the endless kvetching failed, the endless, circular, repeatitive attempts at misdirection, changing the subject, burying the whole thing in pseudolegalistic bafflegab, shouting ‘bigot’ reflexively and repeatedly all failed, what’s next up?

    Why, massive quantities of spam, natch.

    It’s a priceless illustration. Couldn’t have drawn it better myself.

  712. #713 Richard Harris
    July 24, 2008

    “Just the mere thought of desecrating the Holy Eucharist is enough to get one into hell.”

    Well, I’m thinking about desecrating it, like spitting on it, pissing on it, shitting on it, or feeding it to the dog. He’d still eat it after that treatment, too.

    Oh feck, now I’m gonna go to hell, bwahahaha. Well, I sure as hell wouldn’t want to spend an eternity in feckin’ heaven with those crazy Christians. Feckin’ religious edjits.

  713. #714 kestrien
    July 24, 2008

    The Donohue press release has landed!

    http://www.catholicleague.org/release.php?id=1465

    Get ready for more hate mail, PZ.

  714. #715 Dutch Delight
    July 24, 2008

    Didn’t you guys know that if you repeat nonsense enough, it becomes more credible over time… if anything the RC church is an example of that. What we’re observing here is the slow accumulation of micro-credibility into macro-credibility over time.

  715. #716 Steve_C
    July 24, 2008

    DELETE THE SPAM.

  716. #717 GeoffI
    July 24, 2008

    The person who is spamming this forum is demonstrably an idiot and a sore loser too.

  717. #718 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    @Fr. J: Yea, like they’re gonna listen to you. They’re busy having an orgasm, isn’t it evident?

    But hey, if you really want them to stop, you could pray to Jesus. He would break their computers. But then again, you would’ve tried that on PZ’s arms first.

  718. #719 Pat
    July 24, 2008

    “The out of control Catholic spam on this thread is a good example of their fake morality.”

    LOL, desecration = super cool, spam = immoral, u = moron.

    Tried to keep that simple for you sporty.

  719. #720 delosgatos
    July 24, 2008

    To skip the spam, just note the post number and search for the subsequent number. And firefox opens the find in a bar at the bottom and leaves it up – makes it quite quick.

    Papa J – or is it Fryer J? – You don’t believe in the good, true, or beautiful-you can’t. Such things require objective goodness, truth, and beauty.

    Lol. Weak.

  720. #721 Dahan
    July 24, 2008

    At 693,

    “Interesting. Apparently you view Richard Dawkins’ book as a holy text?”

    No shit for brains, that’s his point, he pointed it out very clearly. THERE ARE NO HOLY THINGS!!! Dawkin’s book isn’t holy, neither is the Koran, and neither’s the cracker. That’s why he can destroy them without feeling concerned in any way. How can you be so willfully obtuse?

    He didn’t say “I’m gonna destroy some holy things.” for fuck’s sake.

  721. #722 Jay
    July 24, 2008

    Somebody sure does love their “cut and paste”.

    So much wasted effort. So little thinking.

  722. #723 The Cheerful Nihilist
    July 24, 2008

    “Bone pastor, panis vere,
    Iesu, nostri miserere…”

    From the encyclical posted by Hussien Obama Nut-job to screw-up the thread.

    Translation: “Priest’s boner pains rear, increases our misery.”

    My Latin is pretty weak. Sorry.

  723. #724 Laurie Mann
    July 24, 2008

    I’m so glad I’m an atheist!

    PZ, you rock!

    My husband, raised a Catholic, used to pretend Necco wafers were the host and would “play mass” with them. Guess he’ll “burn in hell” too.

    Can’t say we lose any sleep over that.

  724. #725 Thomas R. Holtz, Jr.
    July 24, 2008

    @Fr.J,

    “no I will not give my name and address.”

    I never asked for an address.

    So I call you coward or liar. Either you are a priest who fails to live up to his calling and publically and OPENLY proclaim his faith before the people, or you are a priest wannabe who seeks to pretend he has taken up that mantle without undergoing the long process of the seminary.

    Having known a number of priests in my time, I suspect you are in fact the latter.

    So take a page from spammer-boy, and take up a new handle.

  725. #726 Bas
    July 24, 2008

    Quick! Somebody update the wikipedia entry! :)

  726. #727 Must Conform
    July 24, 2008

    Must conform to liberal academia.

    Must conform to liberal academia.

    Must conform to liberal academia.

    Fight the Power.

    The power is academic liberal orthodoxy

  727. #729 Carlie
    July 24, 2008

    Spamming comment threads makes the baby Jesus cry.

  728. #730 D. Edward Farrar
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J – There are no atheists out there trying to kill you for being silly. And a cracker is still just a cracker, even if you worship it.

  729. #731 Zaphod
    July 24, 2008

    Bill Donohue said:
    > ‘Expressions of disrespectful bias, hate, harassment or
    > hostility against an individual, group or their property
    > because of the individual or group’s actual or perceived
    > race, color, creed, religion…can be forms of
    > discrimination. Expressions vary, and can be in the form
    > of language, words, signs, symbols, threats, or actions
    > that could potentially cause alarm, anger, fear, or
    > resentment in others…even when presented as a joke.’

    Disrespecting a cracker endowed with magical properties by magical mumbo jumbo != disrespecting an individual, group or their property.

  730. #732 Jon
    July 24, 2008

    Can someone please post the WHOLE Bible instead of small random excerpts?

    Greatly appreciated.

  731. #733 Ticktockman
    July 24, 2008

    Ya know, I think we can have a rapprochement here. I figure if PZ can demonstrate that he defiled an innocent, under-aged cracker then hid the evidence, Catholics like Fr.J won’t have such a problem with it. Everyone’s a winner!

    -TTm

  732. #734 tsg
    July 24, 2008

    Communism through Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, HoChi Mihn, Castro and many others has killed many more than Christianity.

    Literally, hundreds of millions, not to mention the atheistic nazis killing 6 million Jews and 10 million others.

    Bigger Pile of Bodies argument. Nothing to see here.

  733. #735 Nicole
    July 24, 2008

    “Oh feck, now I’m gonna go to hell, bwahahaha. Well, I sure as hell wouldn’t want to spend an eternity in feckin’ heaven with those crazy Christians. Feckin’ religious edjits.”

    I secured my ticket when I took the blasphemy challenge a couple of years ago.

    Window seat please!

  734. #736 Patricia
    July 24, 2008

    Somebody please grab John & bend him over, I’ve got a pineapple!

  735. #737 Ale
    July 24, 2008

    Awww…

    The religiobots are raiding us… How cute.

    If this is the extent of the influence of god on Earth, Pascal’s wager is even more absurd than I thought. Anyway, godbotters and their infantile copypasta will only succeed in boring us today, in this particular thread. But the point has been made, the idea will endure. And no amount of idiotic comment pestering will change that.

  736. #738 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    Pat,

    As a Christian, you no doubt have a warped sense of morality.

    For most of us atheists, morality is a question of suffering versus happiness, not what custom dictates.

    No one suffered physical pain as a result of PZ’s desecration. Whatever sort of emotional stress they might have suffered is absolutely baseless, and that’s the whole point of this exercise–to point out how ridiculous this particular belief is.

    Spamming on the other hand is actively disrupting communication, and if you are doing it, you can kiss my ass.

  737. #739 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    http://www.alamoministries.com/content/english/Antichrist/nazigallery/13nunspavelic.jpg

    Holy smokes how can these ladies take themselves seriously? It’s too much even for an Halloween costume!

  738. #740 El Herring
    July 24, 2008

    To hell with this, I’m not reading this page until the spam vomit has been cleaned up.

    I sincerely hope that July 24 2008 will be remembered as the day organised religion was finally exposed for scam it really is, and the colossal fraud it has imposed on the entire human race for the last 2000 years (or more).

    Well, I can dream, can’t I?

  739. #741 Parsnip Money
    July 24, 2008

    Fr.J:

    the statement ‘nothing is sacred’ does not mean that we do not believe in truth. In fact, it implies the opposite: the idea of a commonplace object being ‘sacred’ is an insult to the concept of truth in that it is a spurious claim that cannot be supported by evidence. What you call ‘truth,’ I call an unsubstantiated yet successful memeplex.
    The word ‘sacred’ has nothing to do with the word ‘truth’ if you actually look the word up. ‘Sacred’ relates exclusively to religious objects and ideas, and ‘truth’ was around way before any religion was.

    P.S. “Nothing you say will convince me otherwise because it is true.”
    if you really believe that truth is sacred, then you should not only be careful about where you get your truths from, but also be open to the idea that what you believe to be true may in fact not be. Or have you never changed your mind about anything before in your life?

  740. #742 Capital Dan
    July 24, 2008

    Dr. Myers?

    You are a brilliant man. Thank you for writing these things which must be told. Thank you for reminding those who wish to do us all great harm of their history of constant, unmitigated hatred toward their fellow human beings in the name of their small, petty faith.

    I hope just one believer takes to heart your well-chosen words and learns that, even though religion itself is neither good nor bad, it’s what you do with that faith that will determine whether you are an evil human being or a good person.

    I for one am very glad you showed this cracker the respect it truly deserves in the world of the rational adult.

  741. #743 Pat
    July 24, 2008

    “Spamming on the other hand is actively disrupting communication, and if you are doing it, you can kiss my ass. ”

    Awe gee shucks. Here I thought we were going to be pals. Go John go!

  742. #744 Paul D
    July 24, 2008

    In other news, Uncircumcised Heart would make a great band name.

  743. #745 Cardinal Shrew
    July 24, 2008

    The cut and paste patsies, poor impotent fools that have not the mind to fight their own fights or the courage to defend the points they post. Cowards, cutting and pasting from sock puppet personas they conjure, to annoy and infuriate us. They speak of high and mighty virtue and yet display none of it themselves. They are hypocrites and cowards.

    When people post opinions I don’t agree with them I can at least respect them for standing toe to toe and arguing with what they have. The childish impotent fools that do nothing but cut and paste are no better than the spoiled child that that takes his ball and goes home when he doesn’t win.

    I pity them.

  744. #746 Emmet Caulfield
    July 24, 2008

    FYI: The easiest way to skip the denial-of-service spam is to search for the text at the end. I find “Given in Rome” works so far.

    In Firefox or IE, use Control-F to bring up the search dialog.

  745. #747 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    Pat,

    You have no arguments, you can only cover your ears and scream. Pathetic.

  746. #748 Zaphod
    July 24, 2008

    PaulD said:
    > In other news, Uncircumcised Heart would make a great
    > band name.

    LOL!

  747. #749 Rey Fox
    July 24, 2008

    Unsurprisingly, Padre J demonstrates that he has not learned one thing about atheists or atheism in all this time. His heart has been hardened. Sad, really. May Jesus or some other associated deity show him the way.

  748. #750 Janus
    July 24, 2008

    Spamming a thread does actual harm (admittedly, very little harm, but still): It disturbs the ordinary flow of a discussion. If you want to compare it to something, compare it to singing a rock song really loudly during a Catholic ceremony.

    ‘Desecrating’ a holy cracker does no harm whatsoever. There are millions of holy crackers. They’re mass-produced and mass-blessed. They’re handed out for free. PZ doing anything he likes to a cracker in the privacy of his home doesn’t disturb anyone. The only thing it hurts is your feelings. Well, that’s too bad, but your feelings are your problem, not PZ’s, especially since the source of your feelings is a baseless superstition.

  749. #751 Morse
    July 24, 2008

    Go John go!

    Yes John, go. Because your posts will be permanent. There is no possible way PZ will be able to delete all your posts and then ban your IP address from posting on his site. That is far beyond the power of mere mortal men.

  750. #752 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    I said earlier: The out of control Catholic spam on this thread is a good example of their fake morality.

    LOL, desecration = super cool, spam = immoral, u = moron. Tried to keep that simple for you sporty. Posted by: Pat

    Pat, if you need more examples of the immorality of Catholics, read what PZ said at the top of this thread. With that kind of bloody history, Catholics would throw out their religion if they had any moral values at all.

  751. #753 rb
    July 24, 2008

    From Catholic League site:

    “It is important for Catholics to know that the University of Minnesota will not tolerate the deliberate destruction of the Eucharist by one of its faculty. Just as African Americans would not tolerate the burning of a cross, and Jews would not tolerate the display of swastikas, Catholics will not tolerate the desecration of the Eucharist.”

    Donohue may have a slight point here, although only if a Catholic student or colleague felt that PZ was directing actions at them (I think).

  752. #754 Mr. C
    July 24, 2008

    For all of you wondering if the host is consecrated or not, what does it matter? Your interest in that particular question only suggests one of two things 1)you are actually entertaining the possiblity that it is something more than a cracker or 2)you are hoping it is consecrated because you know that makes a difference to Catholics and it will piss them off all that much more, in which case you’re just as stupid and childish as PZ for starting this in the first place, and just as stupid and offensive as the individuals who are making threats towards PZ. Grow up, people!

  753. #755 Dave UH
    July 24, 2008

    I’m going to make a little video. Thanks for a great read PZ

  754. #756 King Aardvark
    July 24, 2008

    Beautifully written. In my discussions with other atheist bloggers, I became worried that the anger you would incite would trump any point you were making, but you desecrated that wafer in the best possible way. Kudos.

    Btw, that is an artistic photo there. Can you post a higher resolution picture so I can use it as my wallpaper?

  755. #757 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    Tom, I hesitate to imagine the kind of priests you know. I wonder if they know you? Do they know that you are all for desecrating the Eucharist? Do they know that you don’t seem to mind others calling all priests pedophiles? Are you shocked that I object to such things? Is that why you doubt my credentials? I have openly proclaimed the faith, which really seems to have annoyed you. Utterly ludicrous.

    I doubt you. I think you are someone who would do me harm and is just trying to bait me into giving out personal information where hundreds can see it. I would be harassed and perhaps endangered.

    It won’t work. I really don’t care what you think. Would I post here if I cared what atheists thought of me? As far as I know you are a nut who would shoot me. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

  756. #758 Jonathan
    July 24, 2008

    I’m loving all the accusations that PZ took a non-consecrated cracker to throw in the trash. What possible motivation would he have for faking this? It’s not like it’s hard to get your hands on a Jesus cracker, it’s not like he fears the fiery pits of hell, it’s not like he cares whether the cracker is “Jesus” or not “Jesus”.

    I’m going to have to agree with the other people who chimed in. Figure out a way to test if a wafer is consecrated. It’s true that we only have his word, but why should we not believe him?

  757. #759 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Yes Pat, go john go for he and you are proving that you are afraid to have a conversation and would rather destroy than actually talk. By the way, it’s lame and it does not prove any point. It just makes you a lousy spammer. It’s like a child plugging its ears going “LALALALA I’M NOT LISTENING I’M NOT LISTENING.”

    You have proven you have no arguments left, you have proven that you have no life. You have proven that you are a silly devout. In fact, you should be outside helping the poor instead of wasting your time copy pasting here. I’m sure Jesus is sad for you right now.

    Are you thinking that spamming the internet will get you a free ticket to Heaven? It’s not how it works.

    PS: How much money you have? Did you give everything you have to the poor yet, like you should?

  758. #760 El Herring
    July 24, 2008

    All hail the great god Copyandpaste!

    Seriously, is that the best you can do? 2000 years of suffocating oppression and violence has now been reduced to spamming weblogs. I bet you long for the good old days when you could burn us evile herry ticks at the stake and dance on our graves singing hally loo ya.

    Religion. What good has it ever done anyone?

  759. #761 Benjamin Franklin
    July 24, 2008

    Damn!

    Just got the memo back from legal-

    Seems like we can’t use CHRISTESSENCE Table Wafers.
    Bill Donohue holds the trademark on Christ – Who knew?

    Undaunted, we shall continue with-

    CristESSENCE Table Wafers“It’s good for the soul!”

    now available in fun colors!

    Pure White,
    Papal Purple, and
    Shoes of the Fisherman Red

    ..
    .

  760. #762 Brian D
    July 24, 2008

    To everyone actually following the discussion here:

    GreaseMonkey is an excellent addition to Firefox, and there’s a simple killfile script available for it that works on ScienceBlogs. I’ve just searched for text near the end of the BibleBot’s ejaculations, and clicked “kill” every time I see it — and the page is noticably shorter as a result, as it often gets more than one repost in just one click.

  761. #763 J.H. Christy
    July 24, 2008

    Man! Copy and pasting shit from the pope and the bible has really convinced me that I, a fornicating, lying, blaspheming atheist, am truly truly wrong!

    WOE IS OUR ATHEISTIC REASOING AND RHETORIC! Who could have forseen the power of the ctrl+c/ctrl+v touch of death combo!

    Oh well, seeing as how I’ve converted to catholism now, guess I’ll go rape me some little boys.

  762. #764 Stephen Ockham
    July 24, 2008

    Right on PZ, glad to see it done.

    Now to kick back and watch the religious nuts humilate themselves in return.

    Cost of stunt: negligible
    Results: Priceless

  763. #765 Bunk
    July 24, 2008

    At #727

    Oh yeah?!

    Bravo PZ. Looks like you’re going to have to take out some more Catholic trash with the book paster.

  764. #766 The Adamant Atheist
    July 24, 2008

    “I have openly proclaimed the faith”

    And you deserve our ridicule for it.

  765. #767 Matt Penfold
    July 24, 2008

    Fr J,

    Go bugger an alterboy.

  766. #768 SR
    July 24, 2008

    Well, kudos on keeping to your word.

    But damn, hire a bodyguard /now/. Preferably a non-religious one. Or several. I’m not kidding.

  767. #769 Pat
    July 24, 2008

    “You have no arguments, you can only cover your ears and scream.”

    LOL, now you’ve gone and hurt my feelings. Not. Get over yourself dude. I’m just enjoying the sideshow.

    Dance!

  768. #770 Sastra
    July 24, 2008

    Well said, PZ. And using The God Delusion is a better choice than The Origin of Species, since it continues to keeps the whole evolution issue out of it. This issue has nothing to do with creationism (though some of the Catholic commenters seem to be confused).

    Rayven Alandria #734 wrote:

    People like you are the reason I feel that the Abrahamic religions teach followers to rape and violate. You have no comprehension of personal boundaries. You feel you are superior and have the right to emotionally rape and violate the rest of us.

    Ah, no, Rayven. Comparing some childish spam attempts to “emotional rape and violation” is the sort of overblown rhetoric and failure to make distinctions which started this whole mess in the first place.

    Sooner or later, PZ will remove and delete these unnecessary posts on the history of the Eucharist. I assume it’s a simplistic attempt to teach us what it feels like to have “personal boundaries” crossed, and there’s not any intention to educate (I’m sure as heck not reading that mess.) Of course, it’s a poor analogy. It would be better for St Spam to post some snide comments about the absurdity of atheism on HIS blog, and then see how WE like it.

    We either won’t care, or will come and try to argue points. What we won’t do is ask that our sensitivities be respected, and he be expelled from his school or fired from his job.

  769. #771 John
    July 24, 2008

    It won’t work. I really don’t care what you think. Would I post here if I cared what atheists thought of me? As far as I know you are a nut who would shoot me. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

    Posted by: Fr. J | July 24, 2008 4:44 PM

    The pedophile above raises an interesting point. It thinks it has eternal life in heaven. It, therefore, cannot be killed. As a matter of fact, the only rational conclusion to draw from people who believe as this pedophile does is that Christians, generally speaking, are immortals who cannot be killed. If they are alive in heaven, then by definition they aren’t dead anywhere.

    So why would they be so worried about getting shot?

  770. #772 SR
    July 24, 2008

    Well, kudos on keeping to your word.

    But damn, hire a bodyguard /now/. Preferably a non-religious one. Or several. I’m not kidding.

  771. #773 Iason Ouabache
    July 24, 2008

    Seriouisly, why isn’t there a limit to the number of characters you can put in the comment box? That would have taken care of this problem before it even started.

  772. #774 Michelle
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J. You are paranoid. I don’t think we can say much more. I certainly wouldn’t kill you for I’m actually, GASP, a moral person. Like most people on earth are. Just because we don’t have your beliefs does not make us monsters. (But just between you and me, giving info on the net would be absolutely stupid. It’s the best way to get spam snail mail.)

    It’s pretty sad that you believe so, but then again it is written in the bible for you to do so. I guess you can’t help it.

  773. #775 BostonRob
    July 24, 2008

    religion breeds the most disgustingly vile haters in our country

    Haha, sorry about this, but the “youth terminology” leaked into my mind when I read this. Hate the game, not the playah! Hoo boy. Nearly Friday.

  774. #776 Christophe Thill
    July 24, 2008

    - “Klaatu barada niktu” is NOT in the Necronomicon. Let’s not get confused with “I Shub-Niggurath, the Black Goat of the woods with a thousand young”. I admit the confusion is possible.

    - I still don’t understand why some ignorant guys insist that the Nazi holocaust was perpetrated by atheists. Hitler said he was doing “the work of the Creator” (the quotation is now rather famous). I guess most of the SS were brought up in the dominant Lutheran religion. But they had a sort of semi-official mystic, deriving from ancient Germanic polytheism. Atheism was definitely not an option.

    - PZ, that’s terrible? What have you done to the banana, the fruit most loved by the Almighty? Remember, He loved mankind so much that He gave it this unique fruit, just the right size to fit a human hand. Mistreating a banana is more than a crime.

    - I had never heard the story about the church of the Billettes. Well, now I know. It was built on the site of a destroyed house belonging to a Jew, who was killed (the story goes) for desecrating the host. How charming.

  775. #777 foxfire
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ!

    There once was a teacher called P-Zed,
    who dishonored a relic of stale bread;
    This raised catholic ire
    and the lambkins did fire
    threats of great harm and to make-dead.

  776. #778 Mark B
    July 24, 2008

    Hey PZ:

    1. How about a post character limit? Although it might be hard on some of the more thoughtful posters, 4096 characters would be enough for most posts. If someone has something longer to say, they can split it into tow posts.

    2. How about a little javascript to defeat the most common forms of cut-and-paste. You can easily write something to defeat right clicking and cntrl-V. I suspect you can defeat dragging text in with the mouse, but I don’t know how to do that off the top of my head. Such things are pretty easy to defeat, but it should stop some of the stupider spammers from pasting in long screeds.

  777. #779 Rourke
    July 24, 2008

    As an ex-Catholic I have to say, bravo. I used to be a “liberal Catholic” who liked the idea of openmindedness, but hated it in practice. I’ve been to Catholic schools where they teach modern ideas of democracy and tolerance right beside the myth that the Middle Ages wasn’t that bad, the Catholic Church had nothing to do with it, and the world is horrible because of secular humanism (gasp!) They also taught the myth that evolution is “guided”, that we had to respect Tradition with a capital “T”, and all *sorts* of other myths besides! I feel bad for you, having to suffer through all the mindless idiot comments from supposedly “modern” Catholics getting all riled up about this. The Catholic Church, for the small good it sometimes does (Catholic Charities, etc.) is a relic of the Middle Ages. Good grief!

  778. #780 Jason Failes
    July 24, 2008

    Never have so many had so much to say about such a small and meaningless thing.

    Cheers, PZ, maybe some will stick around and learn a little when the sharp point of your intellect is pointing at some other target, or pointing to some new and interesting piece of biological science.

    I guess that’s my challenge, angry Catholics. Don’t leave with the cracker, stay and read PZ’s posts for a year. You just may find that empiricism, science, and rational thinking are not only infectious, but a hell of a lot of fun, too.

  779. #781 ennui
    July 24, 2008

    Phase 1 is finally complete: crackerjack/crackerfrack/crackerwhack.

    I anxiously await Phase 2: PZ and Ken Miller formal debate on the subject of transubstantiation. Watch the NOMA people squirm! Watch the framers sweat!

    C’mon PZ, put out the challenge! Teh internets demands it.

  780. #782 John
    July 24, 2008

    Sir, I salute you. Mmm, banana flavored coffee :)

  781. #783 pcarini
    July 24, 2008

    I’m sure I’m incredibly late to the fray now, but excellent post PZ.

    Also, Firefox has this lovely feature where you can type in a word an go to its position on the page instantly. Zipping past the super long eucharist spam takes about 3 keystrokes: Ctrl+F + [the number of the post after it]

  782. #784 BostonRob
    July 24, 2008

    religion breeds the most disgustingly vile haters in our country

    Haha, sorry about this, but the “youth terminology” leaked into my mind when I read this. Hate the game, not the playah! Hoo boy. Nearly Friday.

  783. #785 dinkum
    July 24, 2008

    Just about time to imprison the spamming godbot douchebag, innit?

  784. #786 John Lewandowski
    July 24, 2008

    Great job, Professor Myers. You have intentionally insulted the world’s one billion Catholics, the vast, vast majority of which have done absolutely nothing to you, in order to get back at a few dozen who sent you rude emails. Bravo.

    Do you think you’re the first to desecrate the Eucharist? You aren’t the first, and you won’t be the last – it has been desecrated for nearly 2,000 years, as we Catholics have believed in transubstantiation since long before the 13th century. St. Augustine, a man from the 4th century, wrote about the Eucharist being the actual Body and Blood of Christ, after all.

    But, if it makes you feel better to believe that we arbitrarily invented transubstantiation 800 years ago in order to persecute Jews, who am I to ask that you bother to argue according to historical fact?

    Though I do have one critique of your desecration method. You should have nailed the Eucharist to a small wooden cross. Then you could have said to it, If you truly are the Christ, come down from the Cross and save yourself, and then proceeded to sneer at and mock the ‘cracker’ when nothing happened. That would have been an excellent reenactment of what happened nearly 2,000 years ago. Plus it would have made you look even more ridiculous than you already do.

    Anyway, it’s too bad your acolytes don’t take your advice when you ask them to question everything. Obviously they don’t question your actions, no matter how stupid and illogical they may be.

  785. #787 John
    July 24, 2008

    Sir, I salute you. Mmm, banana flavored coffee :)

  786. #788 Gilipollas Caraculo
    July 24, 2008

    (Holding a gun on a wafer)

    Gimme your money or the cracker gets it!

  787. #789 minus
    July 24, 2008

    Referenc 553:
    “When all the howling, gnashing of teeth, pontification and squealing is done tis just a cracker…live with it…!”

    I always wondered about that. How does one gnash one’s teeth anyway?

    Great Job PZ, and I don’t mean the book of…

  788. #790 Voltaire
    July 24, 2008

    @804 – unfounded claims that he is a pedophile = not cool.

  789. #791 Chris
    July 24, 2008

    Holy fuck, the spam.

    Well, it just helps prove the point.

  790. #792 James Stein
    July 24, 2008

    Delete the spam please, and kudos on throwing out the trash!

  791. #793 anthropic
    July 24, 2008

    PZ,

    I admire your science and your efforts in educating those who are ignorant of it. This blog is the first one I read every day (often more than once a day). But this whole cracker thing is beneath you. It has hurt the cause of rational thought.

    Rational thinkers (those who do not rely on accepting things as true without evidence) all know it’s just a piece of unleavened bread. But this incident is nothing more than a provocation of those who live with their delusions. It makes atheists look like wackos (just horses of a different color).

    Everything Dawkins, Dennett, Harris, Hitchens, and you have worked so hard for up until now has suffered a major set back as the result of this whole thing. Rather than continuing to use reason and knocking down delusional behavior by presenting evidence, all this did was to draw unfavorable attention. Now we – atheists – look like as stupid as the delusional hate-flled morons we are trying so hard to debunk.

    I’m sorry to say, but you went too far with this one. You were miles ahead and now we’re all rolling in the mud with cretins (who will probably succeed in hurting you or getting you fired). You are outstanding in your clarity of thought and on principle I agree with you 100%.

    If you want to get rid of a hornets nest you can freeze it. Then you nicely clip it off the stem, wrap it in a bag, and dispose of it. Unfortunately, what you did was whack it with a stick, just to show that you could.

    Please, please, please, get back to science; to rational thinking. Don’t stoop to the level of the cretins. Battle them with sound scientific evidence. This is not Springer, after all.

  792. #794 D. Edward Farrar
    July 24, 2008

    mick lafferty:

    “the atheistic nazis killing 6 million Jews and 10 million others.”

    When will you learn: Hitler was Catholic! (So were all but one of the major Fascist leaders, by the way: So there you have Mussolini, Franco, Salazar, Laval and Petain…some of the minor dictators were even priests. Oh, the exception was Quisling in Norway. He was Protestant. None of them was an atheist.)

    And if you were planning on playing that game where you claim he was only pretending to be a Christian, then presumably you believe all the other good Germans who packed the church pews on Sundays before returning to their jobs as Concentration Camp guards or Gestapo torturers or Hitler Youth guarding railroad stations to make sure the Jews did not escape when their trains stopped (like young Joseph Ratzinger, before he became Pope – you do recall he was a Hitler Youth don’t you?) were faking it too. They were not obviously.

    WW2 was just not a high point in the history of the Catholicism, even before Bishop Alois Hudal assisted prominent Nazis in escaping to South America. So in the future, I advise you to avoid mentioning the entire period if you are trying to defend your church.

  793. #795 Rayven Alandria
    July 24, 2008

    Don’t you find it odd that if we went to a catholic site and pasted huge texts blocks in an attempt to crash the server they would be demanding that we be charged with a hate crime?

    In their eyes it’s not a hate crime when it’s done to Atheists.

    As I said before though, at least he serves as wonderful example of what we’ve been saying about Abrahamic religions teaching people to abuse others.

  794. #796 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    Spam may be repetitious, but so are the atheist’s comments. I should offer a reward for a new idea from the atheists.

    The Catholic League may indeed have a point. Dr. Myers may have violated UM standards. I am sure you all would want him held accountable? Of course, you could push to eliminate such policies at universities. But that would leave atheists nothing to hide behind.

  795. #797 Sandi
    July 24, 2008

    Kudos to Bill Donahue–go get him, Tiger! Donahue’s analogies were great. Would a University stand for it if one of its professors donned a white hood, burned a cross on his front lawn, said “I hate Niggers”, and posted that film on the Internet? No. The University would fire him. Would a University stand for it if one of its professors posted a picture of himself wearing a swastika t-shirt with “Jews Suck” emblazoned thereon, ripping a Torah, and placing it in the trash bin with a side of ham? No. The University would fire him. It’s time to treat Catholics with the same respect. Fire the bum!!! Myers didn’t keep his hatred and bigotry to himself–he posted it on the Internet for all the world to see. That made it the University’s business; that made it fair game in terms of firing him. Who wants such an immature bigot teaching our students? I’d be willing to guess that he subtly or not-so-subtly carries over his prejudices into the classroom. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that he mocks Catholics and other Christians in his classroom. (Heck, I heard at least 3 public school teachers insult Catholics during classtime when I was a kid.) Or perhaps he gives his Catholic students lower grades when they stand up for their religion? We just don’t know. The bottom line is, a puerile, adolescent, hate-filled bigot should not hold a position as a professor at any reputable University. I call on the students to boycott his classes, the teachers to yell for his resignation, and the University to fire him. And to all his dumb-ass groupies on this website, you should recognize that the Catholic Church is the single largest charitable provider in the WORLD. Don’t discount the amazing love and kindness the Church shows the world each day simply because a handful of homosexual priests broke their vows. The VAST majority of priests have remained faithful to their vows and have sacrificed their lives to help other people. I’m wasting my breath, though. Closed-minded bigots will never change.

  796. #798 Homeotic
    July 24, 2008

    From recent Catholic League Press Release: Concluding paragraph…”It is important for Catholics to know that the University of Minnesota will not tolerate the deliberate destruction of the Eucharist by one of its faculty. Just as African Americans would not tolerate the burning of a cross, and Jews would not tolerate the display of swastikas, Catholics will not tolerate the desecration of the Eucharist.”

    Non-sequitur alert! How can the CL make these comparisons. Utter inanity.

  797. #799 Muffin
    July 24, 2008

    ^5 PZ!

  798. #800 River
    July 24, 2008

    I like how Catholics think spamming this blog with their frivolous, giant blocks of inanity will actually do anything.

    Anyway, I really liked this post and how it attacked the frivolity of belief in deities and sacred objects. That’s one of the things I love about PZ: his mysterious use of evidence and reason when he makes an argument.

    One of things I like about Buddhism is that the Dali Lama once said that if Buddhist teachings did not match those teachings of science, then it was the Buddhist teachings which should be modified–not the other way around. If only more religions followed that standard, then I think the world would be a better place. I’ve also never met a Buddhist who thought it was his/her duty to convert me.

  799. #801 Pat
    July 24, 2008

    #799 Concern troll! Lets get him!

  800. #802 the strangest brew
    July 24, 2008

    They lay their religion bare…for all to witness the gutless,pointless,mind numbing,idiocy of their position.

    This is the level of intelligence they display,how out of touch with reality,brain dead incompetent posers…spectacularly how incapable of being of the Christian faith that these pathetic vermin so stridently boast and claim they are…Lying hypocritical posers.

    Devoid of meaning, devoid of life, devoid of relevance,devoid of dignity and devoid of honour and certainly devoid of grace…may their god forgive them for their insanity…
    They should be thoroughly ashamed of their religion…and thoroughly ashamed of themselves above all.

  801. #803 Christian Ridley
    July 24, 2008

    After reading this article, if I could pick out one defining point in my life in which my atheism was confirmed above all, I would place this moment near to the top. This whole outrage over a cracker has done nothing but affirm my intense disgust for Catholicism and religion.
    Well done PZ for finally doing it, it can’t be easy right now being you with all this bullshit flying around, but you have support the world over.

  802. #804 Benjamin Franklin
    July 24, 2008

    CristESSENCE Table Wafers“It’s good for the soul!”

    now fortified with iron!

    ..
    .

  803. #805 Heteroscedasticity
    July 24, 2008

    As an Atheist I must say I agree with your post anthropic

  804. #806 TonyT
    July 24, 2008

    The Catholic League is all about getting upset for the sake of getting upset. How do they know the cracker had the magic spell put on it? How do they know for certain that it is the Eucharist? Before thinking, they want blood. Also, can they not read??? What about the death threats?? Just ignore those and not take responsibility like cowards.

    This is my favorite part. And I hope the Catholics and apologetics roll this paragraph around in their mouth and read it aloud before they post anything:

    “I think if I were truly evil, I would have to demand that all of my acolytes be celibate, but would turn a blind eye to any sexual depravities they might commit. If I wanted to be an evil hypocrite, I’d drape myself in expensive jeweled robes and live in an ornate palace while telling all my followers that poverty is a virtue. If I wanted to commit world-class evil, I’d undermine efforts at family planning by the poor, especially if I could simultaneously enable the spread of deadly diseases. And if I wanted to be so evil that I would commit a devastating crime against the whole of the human race, twisting the minds of children into ignorance and hatred, I would be promoting the indoctrination of religion in children’s upbringing, and fomenting hatred against anyone who dared speak out in defiance.”

  805. #807 Charles
    July 24, 2008

    here is little Effie’s head
    whose brains are made of gingerbread
    when judgment day comes
    God will find six crumbs

    stooping by the coffinlid
    waiting for something to rise
    as the other somethings did-
    you imagine his surprise

    bellowing through the general noise
    Where is Effie who was dead?
    -to God in a tiny voice,
    i am may the first crumb said

    whereupon its fellow five
    crumbs chuckled as if they were alive
    and number two took up the song
    might i’m called and did no wrong

    cried the third crumb, i am should
    and this is my little sister could
    with our big brother who is would
    don’t punish us for we were good;

    and the last crumb with some shame
    whispered unto God, my name
    is must and with the others i’ve
    been Effie who isn’t alive

    just imagine it I say
    God amid a monstrous din
    watch your step and follow me
    stooping by Effie’s little, in

    (want a match or can you see?)
    which the six subjective crumbs
    twitch like mutilated thumbs;
    picture His peering biggest whey

    coloured face on which a frown
    puzzles, but I know the way-
    (nervously Whose eyes approve
    the blessed while His ears are crammed

    with the strenuous music of
    the innumerable capering damned)
    -staring wildly up and down
    the here we are now judgment day

    cross the threshold have no dread
    lift the sheet back in this way
    here is little Effie’s head
    whose brains are made of gingerbread

    E. E. Cummings

  806. #808 LawnBoy
    July 24, 2008

    Brian D (#762),

    Do you have that GreaseMonkey script (or a know a way for us to get it)?

    Thanks

  807. #809 Andrew
    July 24, 2008

    Anyone want to specify how exactly one can use Greasemonkey to filter out all of this spam? Thanks! =)

  808. #810 Jason Failes
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, and PZ, if you need a bodyguard, I am 201cm, 285lbs, a 2dan, and I can yell a hell of a “NOOOOOOOO!” while jumping in front of you to block a bullet.

    However, I will not work for stale bread. I don’t care how many gods it has in it….

  809. #811 Matt Penfold
    July 24, 2008

    Like Christian Ridley it was not until all this cracker furore kicked off that I realised just how vile Catholicism is, and how nasty some of its adherehents could be.

    Well done Fr J. You have confirmed in my mind yours is a vile, petty, vindictive religion that cares more for dogma than it does for people.

  810. #812 Numad
    July 24, 2008

    “[...]simply because a handful of homosexual priests broke their vows.”

    You are pondscum.

  811. #813 TomJoe
    July 24, 2008

    So PZ, that’s the best you could come up with? Sheesh.

    How anti-climactic.

  812. #814 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Yah, spam-free since 5 PM (Eastern).

  813. #815 GeoffI
    July 24, 2008

    thanks Brian D! For anyone who is interested:

    Greasemonkey
    https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/748

    Killfile for science blogs
    http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/4107

  814. #816 Sandi
    July 24, 2008

    Myers: Thanks for giving us your take on the Year 1215. Did you know we’re now in the year 2008? Maybe you didn’t get the memo. If I follow your “logic” correctly, the Catholic Church did a few things you didn’t like in the year 1215, so you feel justified today in desecrating Catholic property and intentionally baiting Catholics? Talk about holding a grudge. I think society in general was a little rough in the middle ages–not just the Catholic Church. I think people have gotten much more civilized over the centuries. Most of us have, anyway. You’re obviously still a brutish, uncivilized, dumb ass. If we follow your analogy, any non-Christians (including atheists) who committed brutal acts in the year 1215 or otherwise should be punished today–in 2008. Wow, you just set yourself up!

  815. #817 Lord Zero
    July 24, 2008

    Well, thats just what they deserve.
    Rest in the trash can its just fitting.
    Anyway, the idiot who copy-pasted all that
    text must be really bored. Please it hurt
    my eyes, could you delete it ?

  816. #818 Jtradke
    July 24, 2008

    Thanks for this, PZ. Excellent statement of protest.

  817. #819 Rick Schauer
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo, PZ!

  818. #820 Richard Wolford
    July 24, 2008

    Hey there Sandi,

    The Catholic church burned people; PZ tossed a cracker in the trash.

    So kindly shut the fuck up you ignorant little tool.

  819. #821 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Sandi, read the original posts and get a clue.

  820. #822 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    If you believe that truth is relative, why can’t you respect what “my truth” is? I believe that the host becomes Jesus. You don’t. I respect that you don’t believe; I have no issue with your disbelief. I don’t make fun of you for not believing. As a fellow human, I would have expected the respect to be reciprocal.

    Posted by: Ben D | July 24, 2008 3:00 PM

    Ben, PZ doesn’t believe that the truth is relative. No serious Secular Humanist does. PZ wouldn’t be a scientist if he didn’t view approximate truth as highly important to himself and others. The whole deal here is: your religious truth claim is false. The idea that those wafers are a dead Jewish man is groundless. There is no legitimate evidence for it. He’s not a relativist, you are in insisting that he should respect a false claim as truth.

  821. #823 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    anthropic, in a way you are right. He has done a disservice to your cause. However, your own prejudice betrays you. Those delusional cretins you bemoan are your fellow atheists. They also share your beliefs. They agree with your bigoted attitudes towards Christians. PZ shows us the true face behind the facade. Behind the mask is a sneer. Once you pierce that thin crust of geniality a scalding lava of hatred pours out. He is just out of the closet. You are no different from him, you just hide it better.

  822. #824 Nicole
    July 24, 2008

    In case anyone can still read through the barrage of BS…

    Comment #89 wins.

  823. #825 Nino
    July 24, 2008

    Well, this is absolute proof: religion is a spam… or was is scam???

  824. #826 Rose
    July 24, 2008

    Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed are thou amongst women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen

  825. #827 Nerd of Redhead
    July 24, 2008

    I suspect Bill Donowhore will have apoplexy when he discovers that PZ is only under the listed University rules when he is on campus or on official school business. What he does in his own home and on his own time is not under the jusristiction of the Univeristy.

  826. #828 Cyde Weys
    July 24, 2008

    I know I’m just getting lost in the crowd now, but …

    I’d like to see some media coverage of this from the reality-based angle. You know, a reporter not credulously stating that destroying a cracker is some huge sacrilege.

    It’s not like it was even a good cracker or anything.

  827. #829 Le Shreve
    July 24, 2008

    Kudos. I am so inspired to end my self-imposed gag-order on the idiocy of religion for the sake of social harmony. Madness. Idiots. Hilarity!

  828. #830 JoJo
    July 24, 2008

    Tom, no I will not give my name and address. Haven’t you noticed some of the atheists posting here? My life would be in serious danger.

    Isn’t this the guy who was telling us about all those brave martyrs, dying at the hands of atheists or North Koreans or whatever? I guess his faith isn’t that strong that he’d prove god’s existence in a cracker by dying for his faith. Why am I not surprised?

    “Everyone wants to go to Heaven, nobody’s in a hurry to get there.” -Old Irish Saying

    Twist in the wind atheists. Yes YOU killed 100 MILLION people in the last century alone.

    This canard has been disproved several times. You’d think that a guy with 12.52 degrees and an IQ of 14210 would only have to be told once. Unless he’s an unthinking ideologue.

    Nothing you say will convince me otherwise because it is true.

    Yep, unthinking ideologue.

    I happen to believe in truth, unlike you who think nothing is sacred.

    “‘What is truth?’said jesting Pilate; and would not stay for an answer.”

    You don’t believe in the good, true, or beautiful-you can’t.

    This is so much bushwah. I know they exist and I try to be good and true in my life (beauty, unfortunately, has been denied me). I just have other bases for goodness, truth and beauty than belief in The Big Guy In The Sky?. My goodness, truth and beauty are found internally, not forced upon me by an outside authority.

    Such things require objective goodness, truth, and beauty. You deny that and admit it.

    What are you babbling about, “Father”? Are you saying that The Big Guy In The Sky? is the only source of goodness, truth and beauty? Several billion Hindus, Buddhists, animists, etc. would disagree with you.

    Atheism is only hate and ugliness-a boot in the face-forever.

    Atheism is a disbelief in deities. Nothing more, nothing less. That you hate it, because it might make you actually examine your beliefs, is not our fault. For someone who’s supposedly so smart, you are very narrow minded.

    That is why you have lost.

    Yeah right. That’s why you’ve been whining at us for the past several days. The only reason we may have lost is that we weren’t having a contest in the first place.

    Whether Julian said them or not the words are true, “Galilean, you have conquered.”

    The Galilean had not actually won, because Rome smuggled into the new ‘Christianity’ all its pet paganisms: polytheism, temple worship, priests, sacrifices and virgin cult. People could call themselves Christians while actually opposing Christianity.

    Have I mentioned that you’re still a patronizing, pompous prig?

  829. #831 D. Edward Farrar
    July 24, 2008

    Apparently Fr. J also wishes to pretend that Hitler wasn’t Catholic, and that Joseph Ratzinger wasn’t a member of the Hitler Youth before becoming Pope.

  830. #832 Benjamin Franklin
    July 24, 2008

    This desecration has been brought to you by:

    The producers of Religulous, coming soon to a theater near you,

    and,

    The new Belgian owners of Amhauser Busch
    “This Bud’s for Jesus!”

    and,

    new, low calorie, Christ o’Cracker Lite table wafers-
    “Tastes Great!”
    “Less God-Filling!”

    ..
    .

  831. #833 Dr_Dave
    July 24, 2008

    I’m still not sure what I think about this whole thing, it had smacked of insult for insult’s sake. But I suppose that’s the whole point – people are being insulted over the fate of a … biscuit. What bigger indictment of the inanity of “modern” religion?

  832. #834 JeffreyD
    July 24, 2008

    A very good post, sir. I salute you.

    And now, for the last time – Pax Nabisco

  833. #835 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Behind the mask is a sneer.

    Trust me, I have no mask. Just a sneer for all the ignoramuses like you. Disclaimer: I am referring to ignoramuses, not christians.

  834. #836 Waltherian Succession
    July 24, 2008

    It’s cute how Sandi @ #816 thinks it can make an argument. Lemme spell it out for you, kid:

    Your bullshit theology, with its foundations laid at many such church conferences, is still steeped in Middle Age Magical Thinking. Case in point, the poor college kid who got death threats over nabbin’ a damn cracker from church. PZ Myers here thought it was stupid to get all up in arms about cracker-desecration, which apparently is a crime to you guys. That cracker-desecration stuff comes from 1215.

    Reading can open a whole world of understanding!

  835. #837 Adam
    July 24, 2008

    Dear Professor,

    I guess I don’t get it. As a Catholic, I am very saddened to see what was done. I also don’t understand the point of the destruction of a Quran.

    No one is forcing you to believe in God, to believe in the Eucharist.

    Certainly the Church has done terrible things in the past. So has pretty much every group on the face of the planet. If you disagree, why not enter into dialogue to convince people of your point of view? The hatred spewed against you by Catholics is unfortunate, but the insults given to you were based on an insult to Christians.

    You can think it’s a cracker. I don’t mind. I don’t think many Catholics would mind. If you want to debate, that’s just fine. You might even win some folks over to your point of view, and isn’t that a better reward for you? What reward did you get from this? You made a lot of people mad. You got some attention. Is that really that fulfilling?

    From what I’ve read of your work, you are incredibly intelligent. From the discussions I’ve heard you take part in, you are incredibly engaging. Certainly you and I disagree on many things, but how can a genuine discussion take place if you resort to this sort of behavior?

    Some of my best friends are atheists and we have such great discussions. You could have engaged so many in great debate and even won many to your side, perhaps. Now, however, you have simply galvanized the teams. Those who support you now adore you. Those who disagree with you now despise you. What a shame the opportunity for scholarly debate has been lost.

  836. #838 DMH
    July 24, 2008

    Well done, PZ.
    Truly a well-written piece; I will forward the link to my few catholic friends, if only one of them opens his/her mind, it will have been worth it.

    Oh, by the way, I hope the jeebus-fanatics will soon learn than there is a subtle (!) difference in praying vs. preying for someone’s soul. Or maybe they’re just flouting their predatory instincts, for all to behold. Organised religion sickens me to my core.

  837. #839 Anne Nonymous
    July 24, 2008

    Somebody please grab John & bend him over, I’ve got a pineapple!

    Apropos of nothing, this reminds me of a joke I heard a few years back…

    Three men get shipwrecked and wash up on a tropical island, where they’re captured by cannibals. They’re terrified and they beg the cannibals not to eat them, so finally the cannibals’ leader says, “Okay, we’ll let you live, but only if you pass a test. The first part of the test is to go out into the jungle and collect ten pieces of fruit. I’ll tell you the second part when you get back.” The men all agree to the test and each heads out separately into the jungle to collect his fruit.

    The first guy comes back with ten apples. The cannibal leader says, “Okay, good job. Now here’s the second part of the test: if you can shove all ten of those apples up your ass and keep a straight face, you get to live, otherwise we kill you.” So the guy tries his best to do it, but he only gets about three up there before he loses it and the cannibals kill him instantly.

    Then the second guy comes back, and he’s got ten tiny little berries. The cannibal leader tells him what he’s got to do, and he gets started. He’s got about eight up there, with little trouble and plenty of room for more when all of a sudden he bursts into uncontrollable laughter. So the cannibals kill him too.

    The second guy gets to heaven and meets the first guy there, and the first guy says, “Hey man, what gives? You could’ve made it easy! Why’d you lose it at the end there?” And the second guy replies, “I just couldn’t help it! I was going along with no trouble at all and I was sure I was gonna be okay, and then I saw the third guy coming back with pineapples!”

  838. #840 Jamie
    July 24, 2008

    nice work PZ, i have enjoyed following this.

    i wonder if you have seen the new tarsem movie ‘the fall’ (dvd on sep. 9)? it’s wonderful so i recommend it, but in it a little girl takes a cracker from a church because she is to young to understand the (absurd) significance. she eats it later, for the simple fact that she is hungry. wonder why a big hoopla wasn’t made of this–i’m thinking it’s because religious people listen more to what they are told from there idiot preachers then go to art house movie theaters.

  839. #841 AJ Milne
    July 24, 2008

    Anyone want to specify how exactly one can use Greasemonkey to filter out all of this spam? Thanks! =)

    Install Greasemonkey first (Firefox extension) if you don’t have it already, then go to the Dungeon tab. There’s a link there to the killfile script. Follow it, there’s a link to install the script. Then you’ll get little ‘kill’ and ‘hide comment’ options next to all comments. Hide/kill to your heart’s content.

  840. #842 Brownian, OM
    July 24, 2008

    You have intentionally insulted the world’s one billion Catholics

    Yeah, an unfortunate bit, that. The real unfortunate part is that you should have been insulted when your church was found to be complicit in the atrocities of the Nazis, and you should have been insulted when your head Pontiff assisted in the coverup of molestation by priests, and you should and should remain insulted when your leaders oppose methods of birth control that would save the lives of millions of Africans, and you should be insulted by the million of other insults to humanity your church sees fit to inflict upon the rest of us.

    But it’s pretty clear that all that matters to you people is the protection of your own beliefs and rituals, and damn the rest of the world.

    Anyways, we’re all terribly sorry that your feelings are hurt. If it makes you feel better, in the time that it took me to type this, ~50 Africans were just infected with HIV. So boo-fucking-hoo, you genocide-supporting prick.

  841. #843 David Uezato
    July 24, 2008

    #793,

    The point of Dawkins, Hitchens, and the rest of them, is that religion should not be treated with any kind of respect. Do you not pick up on the contempt in the tone of their books and debates? Professor Myers has done nothing to tarnish their goals. He has infact exemplified the behavior they wish to see bestoyed upon religion in a very dignified manner. Not all atheists have the same goals as you or feel that the goal, of removing religion, will be achieved in the same way. Your input is appreciated but I ask you to understand the message of the people you refer to before you comment on them.

  842. #844 JanieBelle
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo, Dr. PZ.

    A piece of art and reason for the ages, which I will not hold sacred!

    Kisses to you

  843. #845 Horwood Beer-Master
    July 24, 2008

    Wait, old coffeegrounds?

    BLASPHEMY!!!

    Those should be tea-leaves dammit!

    May Russell’s teapot strike you down for your disgusting heathen choice of caffeinated beverage!

    What next? Desecration of a Wedgwood set? I never thought I’d live to see such blatant anti-teapotist bigotry from a so-called college professor.

  844. #846 Sconnor
    July 24, 2008

    The picture is reminiscent of the Dutch artists, from the 17 century, who were masters of still life.

    PZ, in a word — BRILLIANT!

    –S.

  845. #847 firemancarl
    July 24, 2008

    Look, I am just over joyed that PZ has referred to us as his acolytes. Damn, it feels good!

  846. #848 StinkyFeet
    July 24, 2008

    The only hate crime would be if P.Z. lost his professorship because of the idiocy of the Catholic League

  847. #849 Ticktockman
    July 24, 2008

    Posted by Rose:
    “Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed are thou amongst women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.”

    So *that’s* what was up with the banana!

    -TTm

  848. #850 Tom L
    July 24, 2008

    Haven’t time to sift through all the comments to see if anybody has already made these points; please forgive if I’m being redundant.

    1) The fact that no Muslims have bothered you over this is not any endorsement of their comparative tolerance; it’s merely a demonstration of your principle that pious people are not actually opposed to desecration, only desecration of their particular symbols. Now that you have actually thrown away some pages from a Koran, I would not be surprised to see the Muslims join the fray.

    2) It’s unfortunate that you should choose to drive a nail through the Host, as that reinforces their silly stories about desecration. If you had wanted to reinforce your position about it being nothing but a cracker, the most appropriate thing to do with it would be what one does with any ordinary cracker: namely, unceremoniously eat it. (Preferably with Cheese Whiz, an approximate match in terms of palatability.)

  849. #851 TG
    July 24, 2008

    “I knew the first thing that would happen is that the loons would claim it is a fake cracker. The one I chose to photograph is one that the sender actually provided video documentation of where it came from.

    Not that there’s any substantial difference between the consecrated and unconsecrated version.”

    ROTFLMAO!

  850. #852 rke
    July 24, 2008

    The God Delusion? You bastard!

  851. #853 Traffic Demon
    July 24, 2008

    I used to be an atheist. PZ is my god now. RAmen.

  852. #854 Kryth
    July 24, 2008

    Hey PZ can I get that picture on a T-shirt?

  853. #855 Jeff Knapp
    July 24, 2008

    To st Luke and all the rest who keep posting this crap. It ain’t gonna work! Fucking idiots.

    At any time, your silly posts can be removed. I’m guessing they are being left up just to show how utterly stupid and crazy you all are. Oh, and the sever has not crashed. Hmmmmm…

    Stop quivering in fear like frightened children and get your stupid, god-soaked heads out of your asses and join the real world. You never know, you just might like it.

  854. #856 a coward
    July 24, 2008

    “Nothing must be held sacred.” …excepting, of course, the tenet that nothing must be held sacred.

  855. #857 Nick
    July 24, 2008

    Jesus never answered me when I asked for his help when a priest, a “close, family friend”, fucked me and my sisters when we were kids. In fact, he did the opposite. One of his “men on earth” branded me a hysterical liar and my parents were dumb enough to believe him. The catholic church concealed his well documented paedophilia for years – it all finally came out in a court case 18 months ago – not just us but dozens of kids, and the church knew it but just kept moving him around from parish to parish. He’s now doing time, and I haven’t spoken to my family for 10 years. Catholicy? You have a lot to answer for.

  856. #858 Rodrigo Neely
    July 24, 2008

    I think the page from the God Delusion in there was a particularly nice touch, especially since it asserts your opposition to dogma.

    I think many people of faith don’t realize that we, secular humanists, don’t hold stuff sacred.

  857. #859 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    JoJo, I hesitate to say this but…for an alleged former Captain you aren’t very bright. But hey, you were Navy. I remember squid officers like you back in the day. I pity those who had the misfortune to be under your command.

    How about some light reading? Try, The Christians as the Romans Saw Them by Wilken. If you are going to be an atheist at least try not to disgrace yourself. Cheers.

  858. #860 Nick Gotts
    July 24, 2008

    Is there a weird sect of Catholicism which circumcises the heart? – llewelly
    I believe so: the Novices of the Sacred Heart. The name refers to the fact that the order consists only of novices, no full brothers, since circumcising the heart is invariably fatal.

    I vote that PZ be awarded both Bill Donahue’s ears, and his tail.

  859. #861 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    To all of you saying that critiquing religious ideology and assaulting and tormenting other human beings on the basis of their ethnicity are equal, here’s a newsflash: you are insane. Ethnicity is not a choice and does not in itself make any truth claims. People are born into their ethnic identity without having a say in the matter. Religion is an individual’s choice, and one which can be critiqued by others on the basis of the truth of falsity of that religion’s truth claims. There is no reasonable ground for critiquing someone on the basis of their ethnic identity. Therefore, saying that the act of PZ Myers tossing those items into a garbage can is comparable to an ethnic hate crime is absurd. Get a grip. Think a little.

  860. #862 Brian D
    July 24, 2008

    LawnBoy:Brian D (#762),

    Do you have that GreaseMonkey script (or a know a way for us to get it)?

    Thanks

    The script I use is available at:
    http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/4107
    GreaseMonkey is available through FireFox’s add-ons.

    Hope that helps.

  861. #863 Moses
    July 24, 2008

    Posted by: Pete Rooke | July 24, 2008 2:57 PM

    There is something wrong with the above person. Seriously wrong.

  862. #864 Rose
    July 24, 2008

    Response to #849. Actually, you just said your first prayer and maybe that will be the first step to aid in your salvation. May God have mercy on you, my friend.

  863. #865 john tate
    July 24, 2008

    I think we should all be grateful to whoever it was who posted the copy of the ECCLESIA DE EUCHARISTIA. Yes, perhaps it is overlong (and one posting would have been enough) but it will surely be a revelation to our erstwhile catholic visitors to see the breathtaking inanity of this document. I’m convinced that the more catholics know about the official doctrines of their faith, the more likely they are to ditch it out of pure embarassment.

  864. #866 Pablo
    July 24, 2008

    BTW, where are all the schmoes who were claiming he wouldn’t have the guts to mess with the Koran?

  865. #867 Keith B
    July 24, 2008

    To all of you saying that critiquing religious ideology and assaulting and tormenting other human beings on the basis of their ethnicity are equal, here’s a newsflash: you are insane. Ethnicity is not a choice and does not in itself make any truth claims. People are born into their ethnic identity without having a say in the matter. Religion is an individual’s choice, and one which can be critiqued by others on the basis of the truth or falsity of that religion’s truth claims. There is no reasonable ground for critiquing someone on the basis of their ethnic identity. Therefore, saying that the act of PZ Myers tossing those items into a garbage can is comparable to an ethnic hate crime is absurd. Get a grip. Think a little.

  866. #868 Greg Laden
    July 24, 2008

    I would not be surprised to see the Muslims join the fray.

    Yes, I’m sure that this is true. But the biggest concern should be the rage of the Banana People.

  867. #869 philiph
    July 24, 2008

    This Cracker Kerfuffle (a term I heard on the Skeptic’s Guide to the Universe) reminded me of an article I heard a while ago. It was about the catholic church in Ireland opposing a stricter drunk driving law because of the chances of priests getting arrested after performing mass.

    Apparently, besides the little bit they drink during mass, they also have to finish off any unused, blessed wine. Otherwise, they’d be as ‘sinful’ as was Webster Cook. Much better that we have drunk priests driving around than desecrate the blood of christ! Here’s a link to the article.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2007/1102/1193444384351.html

  868. #870 Logicel
    July 24, 2008

    Perfect post.

    Humans don’t lack the will to work towards change–in this case, to keep focused on denying respect for ridiculously primitive religious beliefs, while respecting at the same time the right to profess religious beliefs. Instead, we find it difficult to maintain awareness of the situation we want to change. So that will be the purpose of this post for me, when I get lax in keeping up my fever-pitched ridiculing of religious beliefs, I will re-read this post and be aware of why it is important to ridicule ridiculous beliefs at every possible chance.

    Nincompoop in London wrote: Those that eat the host are proclaiming “I am part of the Church and I believe in what it teaches and we are all one in Christ.

    Let me translate that for us: Those that eat a tasteless, shitty cracker are proclaiming, “I am part of an criminal organization and I support and encourage its criminal intentions and activities and we are all one in dangerous delusion.”

  869. #871 Rayven Alandria
    July 24, 2008

    Interesting….
    ____________________________
    anthropic, in a way you are right. He has done a disservice to your cause. However, your own prejudice betrays you. Those delusional cretins you bemoan are your fellow atheists. They also share your beliefs. They agree with your bigoted attitudes towards Christians. PZ shows us the true face behind the facade. Behind the mask is a sneer. Once you pierce that thin crust of geniality a scalding lava of hatred pours out. He is just out of the closet. You are no different from him, you just hide it better.

    Posted by: Fr. J | July 24, 2008 5:08 PM
    _________________________________________

    You are in need of some serious therapy. Your delusion that Atheist all think alike is akin to someone thinking all green eyed people think alike. It’s absurd. It’s been stated about a hundred time before but let me say it again…ATHEISM IS NOT A SET OF BELIEFS.

    The only thing Atheists have in common with other Atheists is that we don’t believe in deities. That’s it. Some Atheists are passive, some are not. Some Atheist are in favor of gun ownership rights, some are anti-gun, some Atheists are are pro-war, some are anti-war, some Atheists are pro-choice, some are anti-abortion, some Atheists are nice, some are not so nice…the list goes on and on and on.

    I am no more inclined to be similar to the other Atheist you meet than I am to be similar to the other green eyed women you meet. Your prejudice is just another example of your religion’s failure to teach it’s flock to be ethical beings.

  870. #872 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J says,

    How about some light reading?

    The irony.

  871. #873 Randall
    July 24, 2008

    Used to be Catholic, Jesus tastes terrible, that’s why they hand out the wine to was him down with.

  872. #874 liz
    July 24, 2008

    i am sure xtian loonies will think twice before linking to this post for propaganda…The post is sublime…it would be wonderful to be a student in your class.

  873. #875 kestrien
    July 24, 2008

    Sandi, pedophiles are PEDOPHILES. Meaning they like children.

    They are not gay.

  874. #876 Karl Withakay
    July 24, 2008

    I feel like there’s no point in posting a comment; as post 6xx in the crowd, it won’t likely be noticed much but here goes.

    Jesus said (supposedly) “take eat, this is my body.” and “take drink, this is my blood.”, and this has become a major foundation of many/most Christian religions, that it is in some way literally true.

    Jesus also said, “I am the vine, and you are the branches.” and yet, there seems to be no belief in our transubstantiation into branches. I fail to see how one can pick and choose which (supposed) words of Christ are literally true, and which are interpreted to be metaphor.

    Why, even if you are a true believer in the divinity of Christ, can you not believe that Christ was saying, in essence, “take eat, this is a symbol of my body…take drink, this is a symbol of my blood….Do this as a ritual to remind yourselves of me and the things I have done and will do for you.”?

    It seems like many Christian faiths paint themselves into unnecessary corners, by firmly anchoring their faith on essentially unimportant precepts, such as the virgin birth, the immaculate conception, and transubstantiation. Perhaps it is because flexibility leads to questions, which lead to thoughts, and those just mess up everything where religion is concerned.

  875. #877 Coriolis
    July 24, 2008

    What type of “scholarly” debate is there to be had Adam, about religion? You believe in fairies, we don’t, end of story. Neither side can convince the other, so that’s that.

    What can be debated is the actual, physical effects of religions on people, throughout history and now. I don’t need to go over all the killings done in the name of religion in the past and to this very day. It’s telling that apparently there are plenty of people who’re willing to threaten the family of an evil cracker abuser and send him death threats. On the other hand, it is preposterous to even think that an atheist professor is going to do anything other then berate a student who decided to burn a science book or some other science object. For atheists, there are no objects that are as important as people, like sacred objects are for the religious. That’s kind of the point.

  876. #878 cynickal
    July 24, 2008

    They are just paper.

    You aren’t recycling?!
    I’m calling on all liberal, hippy, tree-hugging, elitists to call down the wrath of the Libeal League on to you and your ivory tower academia!!!

    Uhm… tommorow, I have to get ready for yoga right now.

    Oh wait, tomorrow is Swimming with Otters…

    Well, someday! Someday you will feel the full wrath of the Liberal Leage and you’ll convert your non-recycling ways!

  877. #879 Pierce R. Butler
    July 24, 2008

    I felt a great tremor in the Force…

    Oh, never mind. It was just a cosmic typo.

    o ^a

  878. #880 Kristen from MA
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo sir!

  879. #881 Dustin
    July 24, 2008

    6xx in the crowd, it won’t likely be noticed much but here goes.

    Sadly, you have become post #875.

  880. #882 Jeff Knapp
    July 24, 2008

    Well… Looks like st Luke’s et. all. have indeed been removed – during the time I wrote my post above.

    As I said, they can be removed at any time … and were!

    –JK–

  881. #883 La_voix_de_la_raison
    July 24, 2008

    Hm.. this all seems rather childish. I am sure the point of this silliness was relayed somewhere in this hectic mess of sensationalism, but I missed it. I am sure it is something in the vein of “they started it”.

  882. #884 dina624
    July 24, 2008

    I think all catholics and Christians of good will need to pray for this poor man and take this as the sign of the times that it is that it is NOT finished, but the beginning of persecution of all people of faith, but in particular Catholics.

    Hitler may have first come for the communists, and finished with the Jews, but in America, in the west,they are starting with anyone who stands against the emerging Culture of Death, and quit frankly….only the Catholic church truly stands against them.

    So it begins.

    d~

  883. #885 Fergy
    July 24, 2008

    Sanctimonious Sandi wrote:

    Closed-minded bigots will never change.

    Oh, the sweet, sweet irony…

  884. #886 Stuart Potter
    July 24, 2008

    Well done PZ!

    I’m worried this’ll get you in a bit of hot water with the anti-cartoon brigade but I’ll be more than happy to contribute to a protection fund! ;p

  885. #887 Stephen Wells
    July 24, 2008

    They still haven’t grasped that what happens on Pharyngula is not connected to the University, have they?

  886. #888 Nicole
    July 24, 2008

    Le-yawn. It’s your American right to do this and the Catholic’s American right to be outraged. Their American right to believe in God, your American right to think it’s all menudo. I’ve fought for your right to do it and I’ve fought for our right to be angry about it.

    Am I Catholic? Yes sir. Am I angry? Yes Sir. Is it going to shake my faith? No sir. All in all, the gesture was as pointless as a man shitting in his own yard – it might be unsightly to the neighbors but the stink is yours alone to behold.

    Cheers, PZ

  887. #889 Inky
    July 24, 2008

    re: pete rooke #310
    3) Young ladies like to wear an item of clothing called a mini-skirt these days. The material is often sheer and by its definition does not even come close to covering the knee roll.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniskirt)
    Now if someone chooses to wear such an item it does not in the least bit make rape and sexual abuse permissible despite the fact that the odds increase exponentially. In both the eyes of the secular law and of my religion the assailants are still just as culpable.

    Young ladies like to wear an item of clothing ca
    Okay. First off, your analogies suck ass. That is probably the reason why no one bothered to respond to them. I wouldn’t respond to them, either.

    BUT:

    Besides the absolutely freakish logical tangent that got you from crackers to mini-skirts (seriously, wtf is your problem?), your underlying assumptions and rationales for your statements are so fundamentally asinine that I’m quite literally amazed.
    No, the material is not often sheer. Only in your heavily denied fantasies do women wear Saran Wrap mini-skirts. Apparently, voluminous women, because I sure as hell do not have rolls at my knees.
    Rape and sexual abuse is not correlated with any type of clothing. Where are the alter boys wearing mini-skirts? Or even those at prison wearing mini-skirts?
    Rape and sexual abuse is tied with violence, domination, and the lack of decency in a person.
    I couldn’t give a shit what you wear, I wouldn’t rape you or sexually abuse you.
    I have never befriended nor dated a guy that would do these things, either.
    Thank you, you fucking asshole, for blaming the victims of these heinous crimes for apparently provoking attacks from dipshits like you. How dare you. And don’t say that you put in that disclaimer that the assailants are culpable–reading in between the lines, it is clear where you truly stand. “What a bad thing for the guy to do, but the girl was asking for it.” You miserable twat.

  888. #890 Trance Gemini
    July 24, 2008

    The God Delusion was a really nice touch. I love it. You’re absolutely right. Nothing should be held sacred. Words on a piece paper, crackers, and the such are just not that important. Life is important and Freedom is important. Particularly freedom of speech. People have a right to express themselves without being harassed, receiving death threats, being intimidated by threats to their employment, etc. The more people who assert this right the better. Why? Because it will make it that much harder for threats and intimidations from the religious to work. Well done, PZ.

  889. #891 arensb
    July 24, 2008

    To us Catholics, transubstantiation is *exactly* the difference. It is a wafer of wheat with the exactly the same form and taste as before the consecration, but after consecration the form is still of wheat but the substance is now the Body of Christ.

    That’s nice.

    Of course, you have evidence to back this up, right? Some way of telling that this is reality and not lunacy?

  890. #892 Sven DIMilo
    July 24, 2008

    *sigh*.
    As long as Dr. Myers continues to do a good job teaching his courses, is a good academic citizen with regard to committee work and meetings and such, does some research that involves undergraduates in a meaningful way, and refrains from antagonizing, molesting, or harming individual students, the administration of the University of Minnesota will not care what he does in his spare time with his personal blog, Ineffable Baked Goods, squids, or anything else.
    And nor should they. What a waste of time.

  891. #893 chancelikely
    July 24, 2008

    #883 dina624:

    The irony of a Christian using “Culture of Death” disparagingly of another group is surely lost on you, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t there.

  892. #894 DK
    July 24, 2008

    I couldn’t be more pleased with how you did it, I wouldn’t have thought to throw the God Delusion in there–way to keep EVERYBODY honest.

  893. #895 Derek Colanduno
    July 24, 2008

    I am beginning to believe that the ONE thing that religious belief might have as a benefit is… it obviously CREATES some form of physics breaking time creation effect. I say this because, *I* have never had enough time to come up with some of the ultra insane stuff that I see these folks post, or bitch about. I mean, REALLY, do any of them have the free time to relax or REALLY enjoy life?

  894. #896 Nicole
    July 24, 2008

    Vishnudammit, PZ, I WAS being productive today. Now I’m sucked into this hilarity.

    In other news, according to my spell checker, hilarity is a word. Funny that.

  895. #897 TonyT
    July 24, 2008

    War Over Nothing!

    The logic of the Catholic League is to make the world a worse place than it is.

    How does this work?

    Someone says something they don’t like, they raise a fuss, it causes some of the crazies in their ranks to send death threats.

    Lets see Bill Donohue war causality count so far.

    1. College Student receiving death threats.
    2. College Student possibly getting expelled from school.
    3. Professor Gets Death Threats
    4. Threatening Professor’s job.
    5. Woman gets fired from Flowers.com because of crazy hubby sending death threats.

    See what your Church does?? People involved in catholicism should be totally ashamed of themselves for representing such an odious set of ideas and hatred. It’s ruining lives even as we speak.

  896. #898 Fr. J
    July 24, 2008

    Rayven, why are you unconcerned with the fact that not all religions are the same? In fact Catholicism is very different from fundamentalist baptist. BUT you insist on acting as if we were all the same. You bring up incidents from a thousand years ago and act as if it is current. Then you object when we point out atheist misbehavior from yesterday. You claim that is just individuals who happen to be atheists. If I claimed that about us you would object. Atheism is a belief and cannot be proven objectively. It has consequences and we have seen them. They are unpleasant. Are you not disturbed by the bigotry expressed here? I am right. It is a bit forthright for some, but you do think that way about us. When I see atheists objecting to the incredibly foul language, insults, bigotry etc. that I see here then you can lecture me on ethics.

    We are going in circles folks. It is been proven scientifically right before my eyes that atheists are indeed bigoted and hateful towards religious people. Just read their posts. Myers has created animosity and pain. Some of you like that and therefore prove my point. He is a sick sad little man and so are his worshipers. Pax

  897. #899 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Have I mentioned that PZ does a great service to the society? Because he does, and ever so eloquently. The secularist movement needs more people like him.

  898. #900 bgbaysjr
    July 24, 2008

    Perfect! Both the essay, and the performance piece. (Nice touch, Comfort’s banana…)

  899. #901 Owlmirror
    July 24, 2008

    Hitler, the Catholic, may have first come for the communists, and finished with the Jews, but in America, in the west, you have the freedom to worship crackers as much as you want, and quite frankly….only the Catholic church has a long history of bloody hands when it comes to the tradition of religious persecution, done in the name of Catholicism.

    Fixed.

  900. #902 anthropic
    July 24, 2008

    Fr J @ 823

    Um….sorry, but you are wrong. I harbor not hatred. I just think you’re a complete moron whose arguments simply don’t add up. I’m not hiding anything. I grew up in a strictly Catholic household, went to a Catholic elementary school, Catholic high school, and graduated from a major Catholic university. I soaked in the stuff. Theology was forced down our throats.

    I simply do not accept ANYTHING as true without evidence. Period. It’s as simple as that. I do not believe writing cobbled together thousands of years ago by a bunch of bronze age desert dwellers and filled with hate and contradiction is the word of some deity.

    I cannot prove there isn’t a God. All I know is that there is zero evidence of one. I’d rather spend my life exploring nature and the universe in a rational manner than accept stories that have no substance as fact.

  901. #903 Maitresse
    July 24, 2008

    People ask “WHY do I exist? What does my life mean?” Science does not provide answers to that. That is Religion’s job.

    No, it is my job to decide the meaning in my own life. It is my job to decide what I will do with my life.

    Science does not deal with the soul, heaven, morality, goodness, the agonising question of why people behave violently to each other. Again, Religion offers answers.

    Religion makes up answers.

    Religion deals with the eternal.

    I’m sorry to break this to you, but as far as we know, nothing is eternal. Each of us will eventually die, and even this planet will eventually be gone.

    Religion is the expression of man’s longing for something greater than he is.

    Religion was made up by primitive people who could not otherwise explain things like disease, crop failures, or lightning. It was a way to deal with fear of the unknown. Why do you still need that? You are like a child who cannot give up his security blanket.

  902. #904 Rayven Alandria
    July 24, 2008

    # 868 philiph, Thank you for that link. I found it quite interesting.

    I begs the question, if holy wine truly is turned into Jebus blood, why does it still get them drunk? Kind of debunks their whole claim right there, don’t it? Duh.

    Perhaps all that blood drinking/getting drunk is why they are able to spout what they do. Does anyone realize they are sitting there listening to the ramblings of a bunch of drunk people?

    My youngest son came up with this gem of wisdom when he was a wee boy of six and we were studying religious history….

    “I think humans invented religion because they took drugs and saw things they could not explain.”

    or something to that affect, in small-boy-talk. We were discussing our theories of when and why humans first developed religious beliefs.

  903. #905 HermitCrab
    July 24, 2008

    Well done, PZ.

  904. #906 Ticktockman
    July 24, 2008

    Response to Rose at 864

    Incorrect. I prayed often as a religiously raised child. Even then I found the whole shebang questionable but decided to do my own research, which led inevitably to atheism. Reason works.

    -TTm

  905. #907 Pierce R. Butler
    July 24, 2008

    hmmm – we’re approaching 300 comments/hr here, almost 5 each minute.

    Is this a local record?

    I haven’t seen a Guiness Book in several years – do they have a blogistics category? Could this be a world record?

    Prof. Myers may have escaped this escapade virtually unscathed, but the Seed servers are surely suffering in his stead.

    Inquiring minds need to know – what sins did said servers (or the anonymous techies who slave to tend them in the dark bowels of Castle Seed) commit to deserve this digital torment?

  906. #908 gdlchmst
    July 24, 2008

    Fr. J needs a world history course, taught in a real school.

  907. #909 Eris
    July 24, 2008

    Bravo Dr. Myers!

    If I had a “host” I’d join you in tossing it in the trash. As it is, I will settle for eating a hotdog bun.

    Cheers!

  908. #910 dubiquiabs
    July 24, 2008

    @ #620
    Why not?

    BTW, well done, PZM

  909. #911 Jeff Knapp
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, btw PZ. Thank You! You handled this perfectly. The symbolism was wonderful. You are a natural storyteller – as all good teachers ultimately are.

  910. #912 Skeeve
    July 24, 2008

    @145
    “Hell laughed indeed.Did God hurt? I’m sure God wouldn’t burn in hell, but you have chosen to be. hahahahahaha you are not posting my comment, huh….where’s your son tonite?

    Posted by: e.citizen | July 24, 2008 2:32 PM ”

    Only took 145 comments for a threat against PZs son to appear.

    Nutless freak.

  911. #913 John Lewandowski
    July 24, 2008

    An atheist just replied to me with, “So boo-fucking-hoo, you genocide-supporting prick.”

    Wow. You atheists are almost as hateful as Fred Phelps and his Westboro Baptist “Church” which goes around protesting at funerals.

    Thank you for helping to strengthen my faith in Catholicism, as atheism clearly results in nothing but a hate-filled existence. I wouldn’t want to live like that.

  912. #914 BobC
    July 24, 2008

    dina624 said: I think all catholics and Christians of good will need to pray for this poor man and take this as the sign of the times that it is that it is NOT finished, but the beginning of persecution of all people of faith, but in particular Catholics.

    Let me fix that for you.

    I think all catholics and Christians of good will need to pray for this poor man and take this as the sign of the times that it is that it is NOT finished, but the beginning of the RIDICULE of all people of faith, AND ALL RELIGIONS.

    Ridicule is what you god nuts can expect for the rest of your pathetic lives. I wouldn’t call ridicule “persecution”, but you can call it anything you like. Just get used to it. Since 9/11/2001 being religious has become as disgraceful as being a racist. Your idiotic beliefs will never be respected again.

    By the way, your “praying” is going to get ridiculed. Praying = talking to yourself = a mental illness.

  913. #915 dina624
    July 24, 2008

    I think all catholics and Christians of good will need to pray for this poor man and take this as the sign of the times that it is that it is NOT finished, but the beginning of persecution of all people of faith, but in particular Catholics.

    Hitler may have first come for the communists, and finished with the Jews, but in America, in the west,they are starting with anyone who stands against the emerging Culture of Death, and quit frankly….only the Catholic church truly stands against them.

    So it begins.

    d~

  914. #916 Mena
    July 24, 2008

    Alas, Donahue is still being an attention whore. Whore somewhere else, ok? Somewhere where people are actually getting hurt or are going hungry perhaps?

  915. #917 Barron
    July 24, 2008

    I just can’t get over how the damage to the books really bugs me. Especially a hardcover book (religious, science, politics, fiction whatever). I am shamed by my lack of irreverence.

    Won’t someone think of the book binders!

  916. #918 Nicole
    July 24, 2008

    other Nicole: “All in all, the gesture was as pointless as a man shitting in his own yard – it might be unsightly to the neighbors but the stink is yours alone to behold.”

    You’ve got the part about rights down, but I don’t agree with your quote above. It DOES make a difference to people who are on the fence with losing their faith. It does make them sit up and say, “wait, I believed what? Hmm, maybe that is a bit silly.” Having been in that situation myself once, such an example would have been helpful in looking at things rationally, rather than being morally torn between tradition and reason.

    BTW, if you are Catholic, and I am atheist, does that make me Evil Nicole? And if so, do I have to grow a goatee?

  917. #919 X
    July 24, 2008

    Haw Haw! – Jack T. Chick

  918. #920 JoJo
    July 24, 2008

    JoJo, I hesitate to say this but…for an alleged former Captain you aren’t very bright.

    I guess that makes us even, because for an alleged priest and supposed college graduate you’re very stupid yourself. Plus you’re a patronizing, pompous prig.

    But hey, you were Navy. I remember squid officers like you back in the day. I pity those who had the misfortune to be under your command.

    Thanks for proving you’re a patronizing, pompous prig.

    How about some light reading? Try, The Christians as the Romans Saw Them by Wilken.

    Why don’t you do some reading yourself. Geoffrey Parker. The Thirty Years’ War. London: Routledge and Kegan Paul, 1984. You might learn about how in the 17th Century your pet religion helped kill about 1/3 of the population of what’s now Germany and the Czech Republic.

    If you are going to be an atheist at least try not to disgrace yourself. Cheers.

    Whereas you disgrace yourself continually by being a patronizing, pompous prig.

  919. #921 Bostonian
    July 24, 2008

    Well-written and thorough. This blog post should be required reading.

    You might want to consider collecting some of these moments in book form, PZ. I hear there’s something of a market these days for so-called “New Athiest” literature and a collection of some of your better rants (especially this one) would be excellent in dead-tree form.

    I think I have to read this again …

  920. #922 mothwentbad
    July 24, 2008

    Oh, man. Citing wikipedia? That’s adding insult to injury.

    I wonder if the Conservapedia article starts with the 21st century? Or maybe it goes back to the 13th century, but adds on, “Well yeah, but Stalin was the worst ever”?

  921. #923 Ambrose
    July 24, 2008

    I just spent a day escorting a priest who grew up in the former Soviet Union and now is back there serving the post-Soviet Catholics. He personally knew martyrs for the faith at the hands of the Soviet atheists, people who died in the gulags of the Soviet Union. Your intolerance seems to have much in common with that state atheism. Religion is to be exterminated, beginning with its ideas and symbols.

    It is well and good to condemn theocratic societies of the past, no one except the Moslem extremists believe in them today anyway, but I would not want to live in an atheocratic society with men such as yourself in charge. Trampling the host as a mark of contempt is a very short distance from destroying houses of worship (as the Nazis and Communists did, and the Chinese communists still do) and ultimately killing believers, as still occurs in China, Sudan and many other places. If we are only the product of evolution, why not? Survival of the fittest would permit the fit to destroy the weak. Why not impose your lack of belief on others? You have already shown yourself capable of it in principle, by the thorough and absolute contempt you have shown for the opinions and symbols of others.

    Enjoy your fifteen minites of fame, professor. When it is over you will return to being nothing, and I presume you take that as a dictum. “Sit transit gloria mundi.”

  922. #924 Thomas J. Theobald
    July 24, 2008

    AHHHHH!!!! My hands!!!! AHHH! You stabbed a rusty nail through my…

    Oh wait, never mind, it’s a cracker, not my hand. Sorry, false alarm, my bad ).

    T

  923. #925 Dave UH
    July 24, 2008

    I made a short video of your desecration “Trash can” picture PZ.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wdxmjl-EjGU

  924. #926 Tenure
    July 24, 2008

    I’m catholic. I don’t have the time to read your long dissertation, but my thought is that I bet you wouldn’t have had the cajones to do what you did or have done or are going to do, if you didn’t have tenure.

  925. #927 TrueSceptic