Annals of McCain - Palin, III: McCain invents the internet (and cell phones and wifi and the Blackberry)

Devilstower over at Daily Kos does what I think is an effective job of eviscerating John McCain (admittedly this doesn't take a lot of effort these days, but I still admire this take down). Poor Al Gore keeps getting tagged with saying he invented the internet (something he never said, by the way) but now we know it was actually John McCain who invented it and cell phones and wifi thrown in. Here are some excerpts from "McCain's" response (yeah, like he knows what's in it!) to the ScienceDebate2008 question answered weeks ago by Obama:

Take this reply to a question about maintaining America's lead in innovation.

I am uniquely qualified to lead our nation during this technological revolution. While in the Navy, I depended upon the technologies and information provided by our nation's scientists and engineers with during each mission.

Let's stop there for a second. Here John McCain insists he's uniquely qualified to discuss technology because... he used some. Forty years ago. This is the same kind of high standard by which he assured us that Sarah Palin knew more about energy than anyone else in America, and Phil Gramm was one of the smartest people in the world on the economy. At least he didn't claim any MacGyverite tech affinities developed in Hanoi.

Okay, let's continue.

I am the former chairman of the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science and Transportation. The Committee plays a major role in the development of technology policy, specifically any legislation affecting communications services, the Internet, cable television and other technologies. Under my guiding hand, Congress developed a wireless spectrum policy that spurred the rapid rise of mobile phones and Wi-Fi technology that enables Americans to surf the web while sitting at a coffee shop, airport lounge, or public park.

And, stop. There you have it, people. John McCain not only invented cell phones, he tossed in wifi as an afterthought. (Devilstower, dKos)

I thought this was pretty hilarious, but it gets even better:

Not only did John McCain invent the cell phone and wifi, he was the first to tie them together in his other invention the Blackberry.

Asked what work John McCain did as Chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee that helped him understand the financial markets, the candidate's top economic adviser wielded visual evidence: his BlackBerry.

"He did this," Douglas Holtz-Eakin [McCain's chief economic advisor] told reporters this morning, holding up his BlackBerry. "Telecommunications of the United States is a premier innovation in the past 15 years, comes right through the Commerce committee so you're looking at the miracle John McCain helped create and that's what he did." [Politico.com]

So now we know what McCain has been doing while missing all those votes in the Senate. He's been moonlighting as a Canadian MP -- RIM, the company that makes the Blackberry, is headquartered outside Toronto.

OK, enough hilarity. Let's get to the substance. Once you look under the hood of these claims one finds the usually nest of lies and misdirections McCain has become famous for. As Devilstower points out, the major revision in telecommunications came in the Telecommunications Act of 1996. It is the foundation for subsequent cell phone and internet regulation. It passed the Senate with a vote of 81 to 18. McCain voted against it. What he did do was author the "Consumer Broadband Deregulation Act of 2002" which would have eliminated the requirement that telecom companies provide access to competitors. Fortunately it didn't pass, or you probably wouldn't be reading this. He did vote to keep a moratorium in place on taxing internet activities but this had almost universal support in the Senate (it pased 97 to 3) and had 11 sponsors. Obama was a sponsor. McCain wasn't. So far Devilstower has not been able to find any McCain sponsored bill on wifi.

Of pending legistlation, McCain is not a sponsor of the "Connect the Nation Act" - though Senator Obama is. McCain is not a sponsor of Senator Rockefeller's call for a universal next generation broadband by 2015 - though Senator Obama is. And of course, McCain isn't a sponsor of the "Internet Freedom Act" that would ensure net neutrality - though Senator Obama is. That last is no surprise. McCain has repeatedly opposed net neutrality, saying that companies have a right to restrict speed or even limit access to sites "when you control the pipe you should be able to get profit from your investment."

This isn't a "guiding hand." It's a hand job.

More like this

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This isn't even a hand job, it's a "courtesy reach around".
.

Well you know Revere its all about what you believe to the be the Truth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/16/AR20080…

And that is a mischaracterization in my read. McCain said publicly that he hadnt and that a spokesman who ought to have his brain kicked up a few notches from its current low level said it. In fact you corroborate it by your text.... Congress did and it came out of his committee. That is how they do it... via Committees. Wonder if it was an earmark though.

The speed which we all know, love and hated how slow it was before wifi was not in our best interest when it came to defense issues and our technology was outstripping our ability to defend against a hack. Hell we were all getting hacked and now we get it through programmable spyware.

Case in point when the military computers get hacked and the speeds at which it can happen, they could clean our clocks out. In fact the computers speed that is coming is going to create a need for super-firewalls and cascading trap door systems. Thats what this was in reference to. So lets keep it in context... I will give it to you that certain companies had a vested interest in this and how it would put them out of business. Hey ever heard of Qwest?

As to Al Gore inventing the internet. He said it plain and simple......

http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/03/18655
http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/03/18390

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 17 Sep 2008 #permalink

Remind me again, what was it that Clinton was impeached for...

Oh...sort of screwing a girl...

So what's it called when the president screws 300,000,000 Americans of all ages?

By Grace Colasurdo (not verified) on 17 Sep 2008 #permalink

Obviously you missed the part about Clinton/Gore according to the ACLU being the worst on privacy Grace.........?

Whats it called when a president screws 300 million Americans?

Equality......

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 17 Sep 2008 #permalink

Grace: So what's it called when the president screws 300,000,000 Americans of all ages?

The Bush administration.

Isn't this exactly the same as Gore taking credit for the internet? Just like Gore McCain is now being lampooned for the statement. However also like Gore's statement there's a fair bit of truth to it. The Congress had a lot to do with enabling technologies like cell phones. The problem wasn't the point but how he said it. (And in these times where any even slight misstatement is blown out of proportion I'm amazed anyone is brave enough to say anything)

I've decided to vote Obama, but things like this (on both sides of the fence) really, really bug me.

I just had a really scary thought. If the Consumer Broadband Deregulation Act of 2002 that McCain sponsored had passed, would we be risking the collapse of the internet the way the large financial institutions have just collapsed? Consolidation of the internet into only a few players who only service the high value markets? As in "when you control the pipe you should be able to get profit from your investment"? Who ever controls a single vital link in a distribution chain can extract all the value added the distribution chain produces.

As a society, we can't tolerate so much economic power in the hands of an entity such that it is "too large to fail". That is a recipe for disaster. Who ever controls something "too large to fail" can play chicken with the government. Look for that to happen in the outsourced GOP military.

As to Al Gore inventing the internet. He said it plain and simple....

Not long after McCullogh wrote that rather stupid article, he was taken to task by Vin Cerf and Bob Kahn, who had this to say:

Al Gore was the first political leader to recognize the importance of the Internet and to promote and support its development....[A]s the two people who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a Congressman, Senator and as Vice President. No other elected official, to our knowledge, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of time....

As far back as the 1970s Congressman Gore promoted the idea of high speed telecommunications as an engine for both economic growth and the improvement of our educational system. He was the first elected official to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship....

Gore secured the passage of the High Performance Computing and Communications Act in 1991. This "Gore Act" supported the National Research and Education Network (NREN) initiative that became one of the major vehicles for the spread of the Internet beyond the field of computer science.....

Not that you care.

I've decided to vote Obama, but things like this (on both sides of the fence) really, really bug me.

Posted by: Clark | September 17, 2008 10:25 PM

I totally agree. There are obvious political differences between the two candidates, and I'd be happy if that's what the debate focused on. Don't like abortion, gays, or environmental regulations? Vote McCain / Palin. Believe in science, diplomacy, and the social contract? Vote Obama. No need to get into where they were born, what they eat, how many flag pins they wear, or which god they claim to worship.

For the record, I think the left's attack on Palin's lack of experience is kind of silly; I'm not going to vote for a dumb-as-dirt authoritarian bigot whether she has three days of experience or thirty years. I'm sure the GOP is happier defending her experience than her beliefs.

So sorry Phila that anyone who doesnt agree with you gets the name of bigot and authoritarian, but I have come to expect that of just about every foaming at the mouth liberal. WE are better than YOU... and WE control the MORAL high ground. Obama hangs out with terrorists, slum lords and racist preachers. Vote for him if you like. As for the discourse above I prefer to engage people from the idea that they always have something to contribute. I personally dont beat up gays, burn crosses in peoples front yards and I have this nice video of myself being tear gassed at point blank range right here in old Memphis Tennessee when the Klan came to town and were attacked by anti-Klan protesters. I was just a collateral. Had to toss a 300 buck leather jacket... but WTF I am a racist remember? .

But Al Gore never said he invented the internet? I distinctly remember when he said it. That would be the memory though and I watched the segment on CNN when he was talking about inventing it. No wonder everyone in Congress went on a laugh spree.

What Gore Said

Although Al Gore never claimed to have invented the Internet, he did discuss his role in Internet development in an interview with Wolf Blitzer of Cable News Network. The interview took place on March 9, 1999 during CNN's "Late Edition" show. Specifically, what Gore said was "I took the initiative in creating the Internet."

A cynic might observe that "creating the Internet" and "inventing the Internet" are tantamount to the same exaggeration. But let's look at the entire quote in the context of the colloquy with Blitzer. Here is Blitzer's entire query to Gore:

BLITZER: I want to get to some of the substance of domestic and international issues in a minute, but let's just wrap up a little bit of the politics right now.

Why should Democrats, looking at the Democratic nomination process, support you instead of Bill Bradley, a friend of yours, a former colleague in the Senate? What do you have to bring to this that he doesn't necessarily bring to this process?

Clearly, Blitzer is asking Gore to offer an explanation of how he differs as a politician from other politicians in general, and his rival at the time, Bill Bradley, in particular. Here is Gore's entire response to Blitzer's question:

GORE: Well, I will be offering - I'll be offering my vision when my campaign begins. And it will be comprehensive and sweeping. And I hope that it will be compelling enough to draw people toward it. I feel that it will be.

But it will emerge from my dialogue with the American people. I've traveled to every part of this country during the last six years. During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet. I took the initiative in moving forward a whole range of initiatives that have proven to be important to our country's economic growth and environmental protection, improvements in our educational system.

During a quarter century of public service, including most of it long before I came into my current job, I have worked to try to improve the quality of life in our country and in our world. And what I've seen during that experience is an emerging future that's very exciting, about which I'm very optimistic, and toward which I want to lead.

But if he didnt invent it... Then this guy did.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUdjhKbImwE

Revere now you know that the only reason that Bill Clinton didnt screw us all was because 8 years just wasnt enough time to get it all in.

"I am not part of the problem. I am a Democrat."
-- Vice President Al Gore

"A low voter turnout is an indication of fewer people going to the polls."
-- Vice President Al Gore

"Illegitimacy is something we should talk about in terms of not having it."
-- Vice President Al Gore, 5/20/996

"Democrats understand the importance of bondage between a mother and child."
-- Vice President Al Gore

"Welcome to President Clinton, Mrs. Clinton, and my fellow astronauts."
-- Vice President Al Gore

"Mars is essentially in the same orbit... Mars is somewhat the same distance from the Sun, which is very important. We have seen pictures where there are canals, we believe, and water. If there is water, that means there is oxygen. If oxygen, that means we can breathe."
-- Vice President Al Gore

"What a waste it is to lose one's mind. Or not to have a mind is being very wasteful. How true that is."
-- Vice President Al Gore

"People that are really very weird can get into sensitive positions and have tremendous impact on history."
-- Vice President Al Gore

Hmmmm, anyone in particular come to mind? You'll immediately say Bush but of course.

"When I have been asked who caused the riots and the killing in L.A., my answer has been direct and simple: Who is to blame for the riots? The rioters are to blame. Who is to blame for the killings? The killers are to blame."
-- Al Gore

"The American people would not want to know of any misquotes that Al Gore may or may not make."
-- Vice President Al Gore

Lets make sure we tell the whole story Revere........ Al Gore said what he said and unfortunately he wasnt even out of college when DARPANET was in play. In fact its language runs back to the old RAC computer programs.

McCain was in a tough spot during the time that Deadie was referencing. The computers we could buy off the shelf at WalMart were better and faster than anything the military had. The F-16's had computers that were supposed to be able to interface with JTIDS and AWACS but they were top of the line and too fast for the integration. Add in that the data was supposed to come back down in realtime in nano bursts of highly compressed data and we had the problem. Those bursts could be intercepted and recorded. Might take a while but if you shot those bursts via the DARPANET which became the internet you could get it all at your leisure. All you had to do was find the frequency and sit back and listen.... You have heard the connection on an old dial up. Ever heard the one that sounds like someone beating on a pan? That problem was that if we let the people have what they wanted and the government computers were hacked then they could have sucked the intelligence computers dry before we knew it. It still happens today or the attempts anyway.

Got so bad that we had to build computers that created code to talk from system to system and built it as it went. Created the keys and used them one time and then it was done. But it was the speed that was the problem. It was a stop gap measure until the technology existed to cover us. Hey, 50 baud was the big thing.

You might recall that the computers were replaced four times in 12 years starting in the mid 80's. Well guess why. The restriction of the speed was a DIRECT reason for this. So Bill Gates sold us crappy software and Intel made processors for crappy computers that ran crappy software. McCain recognized this and slowed it up for just long enough for the systems to catch up.

Then we jump forward a bit to the Telecom Act of 02... Yup.. you are right about that one. FUBAR.

Obama showed up to sponsor something or vote? Besides Edwards he has/had one of the worst records in the Senate. I wont be voting for Obama until he answers the questions that are put out there.

As for Al Gores Vision.....If Global Warming is his vision then he needs to dump that no shit 100 foot long house boat that he just bought and put up on Center Hill Lake. But that would be hypocrisy and NO liberal is ever that.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 17 Sep 2008 #permalink

Randy, "I personally dont beat up gays... But that would be hypocrisy and NO liberal is ever that."

Oh, for the love of God!?! I had this full on spooky dream last nite dealing with "energy evolution" -- some folk had come up with a "cold fusion-esque" way of generating elec+ but were the targets of corporate killers...

Randy, stop it right now with the Obama smears -- or I WILL let EM folk know how you misconstrued H1 protein mutations with... I am in good health and don't have HIV/AIDS -- not that you seem to care!?!

PS: Gore can have his bloody boat -- Ronald (the actor) had twenty or thirty face lifts back in the 80s (the cost of a bloody houseboat)!

By Jonathon Singleton (not verified) on 18 Sep 2008 #permalink

So sorry Phila that anyone who doesnt agree with you gets the name of bigot and authoritarian, but I have come to expect that of just about every foaming at the mouth liberal.

I didn't call everyone who disagrees with me a bigot and an authoritarian. I called Sarah Palin a bigot and an authoritarian. Learn to read, and we'll get along a little better.

I'm not a liberal, by the way. And as for foaming at the mouth...have you actually read any of your 2,000-word rants over the last year, by any chance? Physician, heal thyself!

WE are better than YOU... and WE control the MORAL high ground.

Not sure what I can say to this, except that I'm sure you believe it. I'd point out that the "we" and "you" in this sentence don't refer to real entities, but I wouldn't want to confuse you further. Suffice it to say that your kulturkampf bullshit is neither moral, nor a primary moral concern of the politicians you support. But best of luck with it, all the same. You'll need it.

I personally dont beat up gays

Glad to hear it! I'm sure they're grateful. Now, if you'd just support giving them the same legal rights you have, I'd stop considering you un-American, anti-democratic, and bigoted.

but WTF I am a racist remember?

I don't recall calling you a racist. Maybe you're thinking of someone else. Or maybe you're not thinking at all, but lashing out blindly as per usual.

WE means YOU Phila.

Rants? I really dont know what to say about rants other than they are brought on by liberals deliberately trying to distort information, or leaving the most important parts out.

Al Gore is selling boat rides for a contribution to the DNC... You can funnel them through the Chinese Buddhists... no problem if they are over the maximum amount allowed.

No you are not calling Sarah Palin a bigot and authoritarian. You are referring to the Republicans when you say it by implication. I can go back and pull your comments about McCain too.

Too bad I cant post videos except by reference to counter this stuff. One other little item.... Palin has been able to convince the voters of Alaska to elect her to their highest office, so they must like bigots and authoritarians huh? Her approval rating is better than Congress by almost 60%, McCains is a little better as well. So, it would appear that you are in the minority in your opinion of her.

Face it. You dont like her because she is a Republican. You ought to just say it and get on with it.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 18 Sep 2008 #permalink

No you are not calling Sarah Palin a bigot and authoritarian. You are referring to the Republicans when you say it by implication.

Let's review: "For the record, I think the left's attack on Palin's lack of experience is kind of silly; I'm not going to vote for a dumb-as-dirt authoritarian bigot whether she has three days of experience or thirty years."

Sure sounds like I'm talking about her, doesn't it? But even if you were correct, that's still not "everyone I disagree with." This just in: Words mean things.

Now, if you want to talk about the GOP as a party, then yes, I do consider it to be bigoted and authoritarian, which is why I don't support it. They can prove me wrong at any point by changing their stance on gay marriage, butting out of people's private lives, and making a principled effort to keep church and state separate.

But individually speaking, I know Republicans who are neither bigots nor authoritarians nor theocrats (and who are also much more capable of rational, coherent argument than you). So as usual, you're talking out your ass.

Rants? I really dont know what to say about rants other than they are brought on by liberals deliberately trying to distort information, or leaving the most important parts out.

I wasn't doubting that you felt justified. But the fact remains that you have no right to accuse anyone else of foaming at the mouth. You write more here than most other posters put together, and generally speaking, what you have to say is neither civilized, nor calm, nor fair, nor accurate.

Palin has been able to convince the voters of Alaska to elect her to their highest office, so they must like bigots and authoritarians huh?

First off, politicians seldom run explicitly as bigots and authoritarians, so this is a silly argument. That's why politicians devote so much energy to framing. (People who thought the Clean Skies Initiative sounded like a good idea might not've been so enthusiastic if it'd been called the Relaxed Pollution Standards Act.)

Second, elections are unreliable as indicators of public support for actual policies (one study found that some people who voted for Bush believed he supported universal healthcare, for instance). Third, like every other country on earth, the United States has its fair share of bigots and authoritarians, and they do tend to support bigoted and authoritarian policies. Fourth, roughly 70% of Alaskans are white; I don't know what the gay population is up there, but that's pertinent too.

The point being that voting for Palin doesn't prove that Alaskans aren't bigots,any more than it proves that they are bigots. This is just a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy of the sort you make frequently.

I keep harping on the gay issue 'cause it's incredibly easy to understand: If you don't think gay people should have the same legal rights as straight people, you're a bigot and an authoritarian pretty much by definition. I know it violates the conservative PC code to say so, but too bad. Deal with it.

Phila.... If you are gay then just say it... I dont agree with your position at all. Gay marriage goes against all tenets of every religion out there. But thats if you ascribe to religion. Most here believe that there is no Creator, only that they are the only IS out there.

I comment as one of the few conservatives here. They are long, they quote a lot of things that you find irrelevant and to you, silly. Just saying that you think some of it is silly is fine, you are entitled. You can say the argument is silly too. Thats fine. But its NOT bigoted to be in line with ones religious teachings and quite frankly you can go screw yourself on that one. I treat gays the same as I would anyone else. They are in my church, they are in my workplace. Two of them work for me. However,in the same breath a marriage according to all religions of the world is between a man and a woman. You choose to discount that. I dont. So you get to pull out the B word? I think not.

You can currently be put to death in every Muslim nation for being a homosexual, or imprisoned. That to me is wrong. But, to me marriage is out of the question. Its a difference of opinion Phila and calling me a bigot because I am tolerant only to a point is a very piss poor response. Its your opinion and you are outnumbered by every religious group on this planet. I would make that to be about 5000 to 1 by population.

These groups also have tremendous problems with Obama and its because of what he has practiced across these years. I cant find anything productive that he has ever done. Sponsoring bills? Please. Its sponsored if it has Obama on it at the top of the line. Like Sarbanes-Oxley.

Even the black community of religious people have a lot of heartburn but not a totally racist church that he attends. People standing up to clap and ensure the division of the races permanently. Remember J. Jackson wants to cut him from butt to blade. Now why would that be?

Now as to the Party. It has drifted hard right across the last few years and I like to think that here locally I have had an input. The delegates issue that Revere brought up were voted on and sent to the convention. They put Palin in and it has upset the Democrats apple cart. Too bad.

That by the way is the same Dem party that blocked women from voting for years, and imprisoned them for trying to get the right. Its the 14th amendment. Its also the same Democratic party that was hosing black people down in Selma and the Democrat judges did nothing to prevent it. So, if you have an issue then vote your conscience and see if you win. I am not so happy with McCain but I am somewhere in between him and Palin. So is a huge group of Hillary supporters.

If you dont win, then its time to hang it up for four years because its going to be a rocky ride. Gays in the military was Bill Clintons first issue when he took office. I hope that if Obama gets in that he addresses the much more pressing issues out there than this one single thing.

Intolerance is not bigotry unless its done with malice. Its defined as intolerance of another persons opinion.... but we are not talking about opinions on this one. We are talking about the law... There is a big difference. But its all the same more of that political correctness that gripped the nation under Clinton. I am tired of being politically correct and this is one of those catch issues, just like abortion.

They can always just move to Massachusetts. This is one of the BIG reasons he isnt on the ticket.

And just for the record if he is elected I am going to bash him at every opportunity, every time he gets something wrong in my opinion. You know, like Revere does for pushing three weeks on McCain and Palin without addressing all of the questions about Obama.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 18 Sep 2008 #permalink

Add in above that the HE is Romney and not on the ticket. He supported UHC and gay marriage....add in the fact that he is a Mormon and it grated a few people the wrong way. I could care less myself but I do about those issues. .

By M.Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 18 Sep 2008 #permalink

Randy: I agree 100% with Phila and I'm not gay. I support civil rights for African Amerians and I'm not black. I support womens' rights and I'm not a woman. And Romney didn't support gay marriage.

WE are better than YOU... and WE control the MORAL high ground.

Make that delusional, bigoted, authoritarian, religious fanatic. As for calling yourself a conservative; No, you're just another Republican who beliefs oppose most all of the tenets of a conservative, such as your despicable hatred for gays, to the point of delegating them to second-class citizenship, and your obvious derision for anyone who has less means of support than you.

Now there you go again.... I dont hate gays Trog69...appropo. They have all the rights under the law that I do. They can go out and marry any woman or man if they are of the opposite sex. They are not second class citizens simply because you say so.

But Phila isnt going to get away with calling me or anyone else a bigot either just because we think differently about a subject. Thats pure unadulterated crap. If I am a bigot because I dont want to change the laws to give them the right to do it then so be it. But thats the thing about laws... cant change them too terribly fast. Trog that reference that WE is in reference to the Libs.....

Top Romney Flip Flops: #2. Gay Rights:

In a 1994 letter to the Log Cabin Republicans, who advocate gay rights, Romney said he was in favor of "gays and lesbians being able to serve openly and honestly" in the military. He now says it would be a mistake to interfere with the "don't ask, don't tell policy."
Source: GovWatch on 2008 campaign: "Top Ten Flip-Flops" Feb 5, 2008
----------------
I've been in a state that has gay marriage, and I recognize that the consequences of gay marriage fall far beyond just the relationship between a man and a woman. They also relate to our kids and the right of religion to be practiced freely in a society.

The status of marriage, if it's allowed among the same sex individuals in one state is going to spread to the entire nation. And that's why it's important to have a national standard for marriage. And I'm committed to making sure that we reinforce the institution of marriage in this country by insisting that all states have a right to have marriage as defined as between a man and a woman; and we don't have unelected judges saying we're going to impose same-sex marriage where it was clearly not in their state constitution.

------------------------------------------------------
My state's constitution was written by John Adams. It isn't there. I've looked. The people need to speak on this issue and make sure that marriage is preserved as between a man and a woman.
Source: 2007 GOP primary debate in Orlando, Florida Oct 21, 2007

2006: Marriage: I agree with 3000 years of recorded history
On December 14, 2006, Romney said in a National Review Online interview: "Like the vast majority of Americans, I've opposed same-sex marriage, but I've also opposed unjust discrimination against anyone, for racial or religious reasons, or for sexual preference. Americans are a tolerant, generous, and kind people. We all oppose bigotry and disparagement. But the debate over same-sex marriage is not a debate over tolerance. It is a debate about the purpose of the institution of marriage and it is a debate about activist judges who make up the law rather than interpret the law.

"I agree with 3000 years of recorded history. I believe marriage is a sacred institution between a man and a woman and I have been rock solid in my support of traditional marriage. Marriage is first and foremost about nurturing and developing children. It's unfortunate that those who choose to defend the institution of marriage are often demonized."
Source: The Man, His Values, & His Vision, p. 60 Aug 31, 2007

--------------------------------------------------------------
But be happy in knowing that I would have voted for Romney over McCain but not if he supported UHC. He was I believe the most middle of the road.

What is his position on gays in the military? What is is his position on gay marriage? I honestly dont know.

But I do want to know one thing Revere...and that is whether you think I am a bigot because I wont agree with your position?

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 18 Sep 2008 #permalink

Revere, imagine the dollar total which BIGOTED American politicians have spent this year attempting to create a second class citizenship!?! Now, imagine that money being spent on...

H5N1 Blog -- Not only H5N1 but also a financial tsunami (September 14, 2008)
http://crofsblogs.typepad.com/h5n1/2008/09/not-only-h5n1-b.html

Reader posting excerpt by Jonathon Singleton | September 18, 2008

Sandra, "We have a very volatile situation going on in America right now and those with even an ounce of common sense can see we're all hanging on by a thread..."

Indeed Sandra, how will Victoria's daughters, my neices, your family and Crofs, etc, feel...

Yes, I really wonder how we will all feel a few years from now if bird flu continues its merry way down the "VHS" evolutionary road.

And what did many Californian politicians do to protect the kids [from this unfolding global nightmare of Cecil B. DeMille proportions -- the darlings have] created "Proposition 8" and spent thousands of hours and many millions of dollars on hate and discrimination (see Yahoo News below -- thanks to my friend, Chris Bond, for sending the link to me)...

H5N1 Blog -- A promising local flu blog (updated) (September 13, 2008)

Reader posting excerpt by: Jonathon Singleton | September 15, 2008

Here we are reading words and educating ourselves on the "abstract" evolutionary concept of "protein mutation" (oseltamivir resistant H274Y)... Then I hear my healthy stepdad was hospitalized with "flu treatment complications" -- hellooooo, wha' the!?!

It just feels like all that "in far away Indonesia, etc" mutated-recombined stuff is beginning in Oz...

So, I feel a sense of dread when governments say and do nothing when scientists raise the subject of protein mutations. Mutations which will -- over time -- render antiviral drugs (weapons governments wave and point to in calming the public) pretty much useless. It's like the old Beta/VHS format debacle -- governments everywhere have invested big on "Beta" whilst the evolutionary road of influenza has gone "VHS".

The only longterm answer which makes any practical medical sense is prepandemic H5N1 vaccination in the right here and now [ -- and it's not as if these "body armour" H5 vaccines haven't been made and tested, they HAVE and are just sitting around!].

But, our federal governments -- especially the Bush administration -- have spent many millions on "Beta" and in an election year don't want to admit a major strategic public health boo boo has been made...

Yahoo News -- Pitt gives cash to support gay marriage (September 18, 2008)
http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/mp/5023781/pitt-gives-cash-support-gay-mar…

Excerpt: "Brad Pitt has donated $US100,000 ($A126,800) to fight California's November ballot initiative that would overturn the state Supreme Court decision legalising same-sex marriage...

"Trevor Neilson, Pitt's political and philanthropic adviser, told The Associated Press that Pitt was surprised that his colleagues in the entertainment industry had not donated more money to support the battle against Proposition 8.

Earlier in the week, Pitt and Angelina Jolie announced they had donated $US2 million ($A2.54 million) to help fight HIV/AIDS and tuberculosis in Ethiopia."

By Jonathon Singleton (not verified) on 18 Sep 2008 #permalink

"I am not part of the problem. I am a Republican."
"A low voter turnout is an indication of fewer people going to the polls."
"Illegitimacy is something we should talk about in terms of not having it."
"Democrats understand the importance of bondage between a mother and child."
"Welcome to President Bush, Mrs. Bush, and my fellow astronauts."
"Mars is essentially in the same orbit... Mars is somewhat the same distance from the Sun, which is very important. We have seen pictures where there are canals, we believe, and water. If there is water, that means there is oxygen. If oxygen, that means we can breathe."
"What a waste it is to lose one's mind. Or not to have a mind is being very wasteful. How true that is."
"People that are really very weird can get into sensitive positions and have tremendous impact on history."
"When I have been asked who caused the riots and the killing in L.A., my answer has been direct and simple: Who is to blame for the riots? The rioters are to blame. Who is to blame for the killings? The killers are to blame."

Every single one of these is a known or attributed Dan Quayle quote. Quayle might not have actually said all of them, but not a single one is an Al Gore quote.

I'm kind of astonished that you're that ignorant, Randy -- these quotes have been around for YEARS. Do you even bother to double-check anything, or do you just look for websites that confirm your prejudices, without particularly giving a damn about whether what they say is true or not?