An "Islamic" nation into the EU?

Well, that is interesting, with their 'proto-Iranian' background, I didn't think they thought of themselves as European. Is Georgia in the EU?

Were there any stats on where the Azerbaijanis in Iran ranked on this? (I ask because I remember reading that there are more Azerbaijanis in Iran than in Azerbaijan.)

On the other hand, last I checked it was only nominally democratic. I think that might pose a very large obstacle.

What about Albania? It's higher up on that list than a number of current EU countries and its culturally Muslim. Unlike Azerbaijan it's geographically part of Europe and shares that continent's history.

Turkey is a "Muslim" nation. To be called "Islamic" it has to claim to follow Islamic law, but as we know, Turkey has a secular government. That makes it more suitable to become part of the EU.

There's always North Cyprus.

I was also going to say Albania was a more likely option.

The difference between Albania and largely ethnic Albanian Kosovo is interesting.

Were there any stats on where the Azerbaijanis in Iran ranked on this? (I ask because I remember reading that there are more Azerbaijanis in Iran than in Azerbaijan.)

there are way more azeries in iran (azerbaijan's independence a function of russian annexations on the margins of qajar iran). i assume they're pretty religious compared to former soviet azeris.

The difference between Albania and largely ethnic Albanian Kosovo is interesting.

kosovo has a much smaller traditionally christian population than albania proper. additionally ethnic conflict has a tendency of exacerbating religious identities.

Hmm, I didn't know this, but they even have geography on their side... at least if I look at the map here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copenhagen_criteria they seem to be half European and half Asian, compared to only 3% European for Turkey...

As for religion, Bosnia and Herzegovina have a slight majority of muslims (45%) and is a potential candidate. So would Kosovo if all EU countries recognized it as a country. Both are probably more likely to become the first muslim majority country in the EU than Turkey is...

"What about Albania? It's higher up on that list than a number of current EU countries and its culturally Muslim."

Actually Albanians are pretty atheists. As for 'culturally,' Albanians used to be all Catholics.

Regarding Turkey: it will overpower Europe through high birthrates (look at stats) and replace France and Germany as an EU superpower. Turkey already has a million strong army, so Germany, France and Italy are worried about losing their influence in EU. It makes perfect sense: High population, strong army, great location and a different culture (let's be honest!) all mean that Turkey will never get in EU.

Of course being a secular Muslim doesn't mean one stays that way, a few years of Saudi trained imam preachings and you have an army of Jihadists.

Russia would shit a brick if Azerbaijan wanted to join the EU!
Seriously, it would be very bad...

btw to correct my fellow albanian "agim" there and all NORTHERN albanians who belive that albanians didnt not use to be all catholics,that is not true!!! the southern albanian use to and are still ORTHODOX to this day.... due to the separation of our nation into roman and bysantine empire.

Albania has been mentioned as a Muslim country, and although it is officially such, in reality Islam plays a very small part of its everyday life. Living there for eight years I found that in the cities Islam was largely ignored, with maybe a slightly higher involvement in the country areas. Historically though, Albania is a Christian country, which is why Islam does not have a strong footing.

Azerbaijan FTW! I did a lot of research on this country when I was studying horticulture. Fascinating place. I don't see it happening though somehow.

Soviet satellite nations range from 74% (Czech) to 18% (Rumania).

Actually, to corrent Pete Hodghe in saying that Albania is "officially" a Muslim country, Albania is offically a secular country. there is no official religion, and down to its daily life Albanian families are religionally mixed: I myself am an atheist, my mom a catholic christian, my dad a muslim and my wife and her family an orthodox christian. lol

Azerbaidjan is too damn far. Same for Armenia, Georgia, Israel, or Lebanon.

The reason why Turkey does not belong in the EU is that, despite the presence of a completely Europeanised elite, its population is predominantly Middle-Eastern. Deep culture matter much more than nominal "religion" here (cf. undoubtedly European Albania and Bosnia).

This can actually be measured objectively by comparing the respective trajectories of migrants from Eastern Europe (Roms aside), Northern Africa, and Turkey in European countries. The Turks occupy a position much more similar to that of Northern Africans (hereditary separation and ghettoisation) than Eastern Europeans (who essentially blend in seamlessly within a generation).

Eventually the EU will almost certainly include Albania and ex-Yougoslavia. By that time the process will be essentially complete. The only true question marks are Ukraine and Belarus, who will have to choose between uniting with Western Europe, or with their Russian cousins.

Albania is not a Muslim country. Saudi Arabia is a muslim country. The statistics used for the country are from almost 40 years ago. I would say only half of the population is Muslim. Many Albanian immigrants in Greece have converted over to Christian Orthodox. There are also many people who are Atheist. This is why you cannot call a country Muslim when half of the population does not follow Islam.

I think most of you Euros have a one-dimensional understanding of Turks - Siege of Vienna jargon. I categorically reject claims that they are incapable of fitting well into Euro society. Why? I give the combined 1.5M or so Turks that live in Australia and the US as proof. Well adjusted, highly westernized yet Muslim and respectful of their mixed and eastern heritage. I've always thought that Aussies and Yanks are less patronizing than Euros due to the younger age of these nations in comparison to European identity. Blaming Turks is an easy way out for Euros looking for a truly uniting cause used to help strengthen a supposedly homogenous Euro Identity â yeah right!. Itâs cheap and not well researched. Prosperity is the key (but Europe always wants more for itself) as well as loosening the desire of immigrants to hold on so tightly to their homelands â I guess that vast distance between Turkey and Australia also helps wane extreme patriotism which was born out of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire. Turks and Muslims have to learn about moderation in every aspect of life including nationalistic pride and religion. Cheers. Go Blues!

"Historically though, Albania is a Christian country, which is why Islam does not have a strong footing."
Peter Hodge, are you serious?
How can any country which is predominantly Muslim (practiced or not) be a Christian country in which Islam does not have strong footing?

You should say Albania WAS a Christian country historically but has not been for centureis now.

EU is a club in which only a few get privileges and call the shots. So why would anyone rush to join?

Peggy...

I assume you've lived in Albania and that's why you have a clue what you're talking about?

@Ment

Peggy is so anti Albanians in general, so don't be surprised when Peggy says negative thinks about Albanians who by the way Peggy is Serbian but uses an English name so people would take her more seriously. I know this cos she comments on every possible article that is on the internet and it's about Albanians.

Cheers

"the southern albanian use to and are still ORTHODOX to this day.... due to the separation of our nation into roman and bysantine empire."

True, it's a long story but Catholics fleeing to the South had a choice: convert to Islam or Orthodoxy. Since the Orthodox Church was under Turkish rule it was not seen as a threat like the Catholic one. That's a fact.

Studying the Albanian language it has been shown by Noel Malcolm that Albanians got their Christianity by Latins. But anyway, all were Christians before and as late as 1650 about 90% were still Christians until Turks turned the oppression switch way to the right.

Maybe in 20-30 years it will change again since most people know that their ancestors were Christians not so long ago.

Doug: I agree.

Toto: As regards "ghettoization" and a trajectory of Turkish immigrants supposedly typical of middle easterners: Italians in Germany (who migrated under similar conditions as the Turks) have very similar trajectories.

Razib's list shows that the trait "percent of irreligious citizens" is highly variable among current EU member states. It would be farcical (to my mind) and certainly unfair to use this criterion (and a necessarily arbitrary cutoff point gerrymandered to exclude Turkey and include all current members) to judge Turkey's compatibility with supposed EU norms. It would also be illegitimate (and probably outright illegal seen from a European court of justice perspective), as one supposed "European value" is freedom of religion, which includes freedom to be religious if one chooses to be so.

agim dont speak on behaf of all albanians.... there is big difference in culture, religeon and language between southern albanians and northern (GEG and TOSK) before 6th century there was no such thing as othodox or catholic. so by your theories catholic albanians were a bigger threat to ottomans then orthodox were?? hehe. nje gje te dish ti se GEGET jane 10% katolik dhe 90% muslim dhe TOSKET jane 50%/50%.

I just dont understand who cares what religion we have. main thing is to be united for the commen couse and that's our enemy our religion its the twohead eagle red black...

I just dont understand who cares what religion we have. main thing is to be united for the commen couse and that's our enemy our religion its the twohead eagle red black...

Hello, all, thanx for the topic on ''Albania'' whoever travels or has been to Albania, realize that if u want to hit a kebab shop, it is likely to eat pork kebab, cos most of them use pork meat! haha, Albania is not an muslim nation,who has been in school is atheist, catholic or orthodox, some peasants will answer they are muslims if they were asked, in the coming years islam will wash away from our soil and go back the way it came from, then Albanians will choose what suits them best! i am Albanian, am catholic, i have nothing against no religion, but i dnt like to hear Albanian and muslim! islam was forced into the albanian race,we want europe, not iran or pakistan! kosovo can chose their own destiny now, as i saw they're were ranked close to turkey, shout out to all nice ppl..

Yeah.

We have different language
Different culture
Different folk costumes
Different folk songs

Were unique. How can you call us Muslim?!! It doesnt make sense.