On Wednesday, in response to really bad analogy attacking the NAACP and the Black and Hispanic Congressional Caucuses, I wrote a rather lengthy post that attempted to educate the rather clueless blogger by the name of LaShawn Barber who had produced the rant about how the white nationalist teen singing duo Prussian Blue (who, according to LaShawn, are only expressing "white pride") got their name from a technique of Holocaust denial.

Well, it turns out I've been trolled. LaShawn has posted an update that's basically one big gloat:

A belated "Happy Independence Day" to all the left-leaning (and sometimes vulgar) bloggers linking to this wonderfully controversial post! From the bottom of my heart, I thank you for all the links, which have caused this blog to rise in the TTLB Ecosystem (#22 out of 50,000+ registered blogs ain't bad!).

And the traffic meter is looking good, too. I'm touched. Really. If this post has your knickers in a wad, you should read some of my earlier stuff (est. November 2003). Grab a feed, sign up for e-mail updates, and keep checking LBC because controversy is my life.

So, basically, it seems as though LaShawn was intentionally inflammatory. It even sounds as though she does it on purpose to provoke links and more traffic. I wish I had realized that before, as one of the cardinal rules of Usenet and online discussion forums (and, I suppose, blogs) is "don't feed the troll." Clearly LaShawn has no interest in learning about how Prussian Blue's name results from Holocaust denial, how they consort with white supremacist organizations, and how they are admirers of Hitler. It would seem that they were simply convenient foils for her to use to demonize the NAACP and the Congressional Black and Hispanic Caucuses by comparing them to white nationalists.

My bad. I hope you'll forgive this one last "feeding of the troll," if only for the reason that perhaps other bloggers will not fall for LaShawn's antics as I have.

Of course, it's hard for me not to be amused by some of the new friends that LaShawn has attracted with her defense of standing up for "white pride." Check out this comment, which originates from a "friend" of Prussian Blue's mother, April Gaede:

For us at this stage, everyone who is not a White nationalist is a potential enemy, and we are even careful among other White nationalists. We are always on the lookout for an "informant" who is either selling our information to local journalists who are preparing an "expose" of the local "evil Nazis" or even a government agent who is trying to involve us in a criminal conspiracy. We can't speak out in public. A letter to the editor can get one of us or even our spouse fired from a crappy corporate job, possibly resulting in divorce. The local elites don't care if this breaks up a family, or destroys their livelihood and causes great disruption in their children. They beat up on a "racist," and believe themselves quite virtuous and angelic for doing so, and are get a pat on the head and a dog biscuit from the mass media for doing so.

So yeah, you can say we are full of HATE. Who wouldn't be?

I appreciate the gestures by both Julia Gorin and La Shawn Barber to attempt to "amnesty" White nationalists. Singling us out as "the ideology of mass murder" is a form of psychological warfare. Any race will commit mass murder under the right circumstances. The White race has been a technological and scientific race -- we do things in a big way. Bach concertos, the internal combustion engine, the discovery and manipulation of microbiology, and the battlefields of the two World Wars are all of a piece.


Sure we killed the Native Americans. They would have killed us if they had better guns. They killed each other. So we are a warlike people. So are a lot of peoples out there.

At this point, you still have a choice. Whites are in a weakened state, but we don't plan to stay this way. Right now, we don't have too many friends. If things go our way, we will have NO reason to "make any deals" with anyone who is not White.

If a coalition of non-White conservatives really puts some energy into taking the "Hitler blood libel" off of White nationalists, and actually succeeds getting us an "amnesty" into mainstream politics I think you'll see that we aren't monsters. Just because we want to perpetuate our race, does not by necessity mean at the cost of others. There is a lot of anger on the White nationalist sites, for reasons I described above. We are actively marginalized, and I admit I am very angry about it, though I function just fine in society. I'm always ready to "go off" verbally on hypocritical small "w" white liberals (if it's "safe" to do so, that is, if I won't lose my job), and they retreat when they get a hint of the pent up rage and ferocity in me. I hate white liberals more than anything.

Anyway, White nationalists are quietly preparing for Peak Oil and social collapse. We believe that serious social disruption is in the offing, and our position will be improved even as society is going to hell. Or we'll all die, that's fine too.

I've spent enough time wading through this filth while "debating" Holocaust deniers, and that's exactly the sort of rhetoric white power rangers use all the time. That's the way they talk, because that's what they believe.

And that's why white power ranger groups like the National Vanguard are not the same as the NAACP, LaShawn. I hope you enjoy your new friends. If they ever come to power, I'm sure they'll treat you well.

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Hoo boy. Via The Poorman Institute and an anti-Holocaust denial mailing list that I belong to, I've learned of an analogy so breathtakingly bad that I have a hard time not blogging about it, mainly because it relates to a topic that I'm very interested in (Holocaust denial) and a related topic that…
Almost as if by design, after my post earlier today about LaShawn Barber's really bad analogy comparing the white nationalist teenage singing duo Prussian Blue's invocation of "white pride" to minority groups like the NAACP, I came across this post over on David Neiwert's blog showing what real…
Since I was still recovering from TAM9 last night and crashed on the couch at around 9 PM, I didn't have time for one of my usual logorrheic posts. I did, however, have time to take note of an update on a story I started covering six years ago. One of the greatest things about having a long running…
There are certain bloggers who can reliably be counted on to deliver the stupid. We've met several of them over the time this blog's been in existence. One such blogger, the born again Christian named LaShawn Barber, has been particularly good at it, although we've only met her a couple of times…

Hey, don't feel bad.

I thought it was an interesting posting and it had a lot of information I'd never heard before. It was a great learning experience regardless of what prompted you to write it.

There's a h/t to you at my homepage, 4th post down.

Also, did you see this related story? I'm sure they're jusy showing "race pride" as well.

And the "just kidding/lively debate" card is frequently played by rightist bloggers such as Jeff Goldstein, for example. It's a cop-out when they get caught saying what they really mean.

La Shawn obviously studied under radio shock jocks, who have learned that it's immaterial what they do, say, promote, or provoke on their shows, as long as their frequency and air times are remembered by the listening audience. Bo Duran, who propositioned a grieving widow on radio, and Opie Anthony, who sent a couple to have sex in St. Patrick's Cathedral live and on the air, are exemplars of this phenomenon. Their antics may result in FCC fines and suspensions, and sometimes firings, but they reap the reward with their next job, better air time, and substantial pay raises.

So did and do a number of fringe politicos...Abbie Hoffmann famously shouted that if Chicago gave him $100,000, he'd leave town. Chicago didn't, the riots followed, and the federal government accused Hoffmann of attempting to "extort" the city with that statemen. On the flip side, the Institute for Historical Review issued a $10,000 challenge to anyone who could prove Auschwitz really happened, and then tried to welch on the payment, claiming the offer was a "publicity gimmick." The federal courts ruled otherwise, and IHR coughed up the money and an apology.

Frank Collin, the neo-Nazi whose parents were Holocaust survivors, tried a similar trick by announcing that his band of neo-Nazis would parade through Skokie, Illinois. A wild few months of legal battles ensued, and Collin won the right to march. At the last minute, Chicago cut a deal with the faux Fuhrer...they let him parade in a city park. All 12 of them. Collin later admitted he didn't want to march in the heavily Jewish suburb anyway. He later got nailed for his Jewish roots...and pedophilia.

Sometimes the stunt is done by people with personal penknives to grind...the guy who claimed TWA Flight 800 was shot down by the US Navy. He later admitted he had no proof, and merely wanted to embarrass the US government. His vendetta against Uncle Sam was sparked by their refusal to allow him to grow marijuana on his Long Island farm. I guess he was smoking some of his crop.

La Shawn is doing the same thing. At some levels, I doubt she cares particularly about April Gaede and Prussian Blue. But she knows that these twin Nazi tots and their music are one of the more visible and bizarre (by even their standards) manifestations of neo-Nazism. They're also apparently not very talented, and from what I've read about them, they seem to be victims of psychological child abuse. But put them in the public eye and they draw ink, attention, and flies. Clever enough. She did what she set out to do.

She also gave vent to one of April Gaede's backers and friends, which illuminated how these folks think, and I read the entire screed. I left me nauseated and repulsed.

But it was highly showed the paranoia, the hatred, the apocalyptic dream-world, and the self-centeredness in which these people live. They have an exaggerated sense of their own self-importance, a wave of paranoia of and hatred for other ethnicities, and a complete misunderstanding of the world.

They have immense contempt for anyone outside of their circle, as evidenced by the sneering cracks about not providing their kids with computer games and houses with big TVs...instead sending them to karate and dance school (I guess to learn the Irish jigs the white nationalists are so fond of). Their lack of understanding of the world is seen in prattling about the "Jews' silly Hitler blood libel," which is neither libel nor silly. At least they admit that their aim is not as much to deny the Holocaust, but to remove the burden of this horrific act of history from Hitler's ledger book, and thus rehabilitate Nazism as a viable political force.

They, do, however, seem to realize the futility of doing so, in their whining about losing jobs and having families destroyed when they openly espouse the Nazi credo. Warriors should not bemoan their fate...such are the consequences of war. Marcus Aurelius and Hitler, to name two, stressed stoicism and endurance for their followers. Neo-Nazis should not whine when they are shunned, fired, sued, or ridiculed. Neo-Nazis took this road of their own choice, and have to bear that burden.

The largest motif I saw in that note was that of self-pity, and I have none for neo-Nazis. They are the authors of their own misfortunes, and have no right to complain.

"There's a h/t to you at my homepage, 4th post down.

Also, did you see this related story? I'm sure they're jusy showing "race pride" as well.

And the "just kidding/lively debate" card is frequently played by rightist bloggers such as Jeff Goldstein, for example. It's a cop-out when they get caught saying what they really mean."

Very true, NYMary...many neo-Nazis fall back on that line, particularly when giving testimony under oath at deposition or trial, being held accountable for the pain they have caused. Roger Metzger and his White Aryan Resistance testified that they spouted their stuff merely to irritate their opponents. David Irving said his screeds were merely a "lurid language" reaction to attacks on him by his opponents. Glenn Miller claimed his anti-Semitic foamings were the result of a a large number of beers.

It's interestig how neo-Nazis hide behind the banner of the First Amendment, in spouting their demands to deny life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness...not to mention that same First Jews, blacks, and other ethnicities.

Sure we killed the Native Americans. They would have killed us if they had better guns. They killed each other. So we are a warlike people. So are a lot of peoples out there.

Sadly, this part is hard to argue with. Although I don't see how recognizing that all ethnic groups can be bloody-minded treacherous violent bastards leads to the conclusion that one is better than the others, the idea that whites are *especially* evil doesn't bear scrutiny any better than the idea that blacks are especially lazy or Jews especially greedy.

I'd like to believe that peaceful coexistence between different groups of people is possible in the long term, but there seems to be an awful lot of history stacked up against that view, and a considerable amount of current events, too. There doesn't seem to be any acceptable alternative but to try it anyway, though.

Wow, how crazy is this. I'm a regular reader of both this blog and hers.

I think, partly, this is a case of both you and LaShawn having your own personal pet peeves. Yours is about holocaust denial (and the pseudoscience we know and love you for), and hers is about how society is screwing up many races by trying to "help" them the wrong way.

I don't think her post had anything to do with Holocaust denial one way or another. It probably wasn't something that occured to her (honestly, it beats me) she was just using an example to illustrate her point. Remember, it's her blog -- her articles can be about whatever she wants them to be about. A certain topic or music group or whatever might make you think of one thing... but not have the same intrinsic meaning to someone else. It doesn't mean it isn't important to them, merely that it wasn't their focus at the time.

I find it interesting that the comments here are attempting to paint LaShawn as a white supremacist or something, if I'm reading them right. That would be extremely odd... since she's black.

Her blog is mostly about race issues in America. So that was the facet she was discussing. Often she posts about how black leaders are doing more harm than good in trying to protect blacks too much. Ranting about affirmative action. That sort of thing. Maybe her choice of white supremacist group wasn't the best analogy for you. That hardly makes her a troll, any more than you're a troll for posting articles about autism quacks on your blog makes you a troll to them.

Sometimes it's hard to be passionate about something and see that other people aren't. Personally, I know a ton of people who are passionate about caring for iguanas and other lizardy pets. They go off the deep end whenever they see someone saying something incorrect about iguana care. Perhaps because some well-intentioned person happens to pass on bad, out-of-date care information and tells someone to use a hot rock for their iguana's heat source, or says iguanas eat crickets. Both are untrue, and will probably kill the iguana, so my buddies would go off the deep end trashing this person, who maybe just brought up lizards jsut to make some side point, but really aren't members of the give-every-lizard-a-hot-rock society. My point is for my friends, it may be a huge trigger issue (like yours is halocaust denial) that colors every single thing htey do, say, and read. For other people, it's just a random comment about iguanas. Not to say that people don't care about the halocaust, just like I'nm sure they want captive iguanas to live long, healthy lives, they just don't analyze every aspect of their lives against it.

Hopefully I'm making some sort of sense.

By silvermine (not verified) on 07 Jul 2006 #permalink

Silvermine, LaShawn is way smarter than that. Hers was a purposefully inflammatory post. Whether the initial aim was to increase links [I doubt it, I think that claim is just a cover for the embarrassment of the degree of response she engendered] or just to be obnoxious [my take on her attitude], there was no lack of awareness to the raw nerves she was tweaking.