The Hungarians are miffed because the UK is trying to pin the blame on them for the recent bird flu outbreak. They think blaming Hungary for the virus is the easy way out. It isn't. What it implicates is that the vaunted biosecurity firewall for developed country poultry producers is porous. Whether it finally turns out that the virus came from Hungary or not, the possibility is there. We checked to see what the US industry had to say on their website, http://www.avianinfluenzainfo.com/:
Asian bird flu is H5N1 highly pathogenic avian influenza (AI) - a disease of birds that has occurred overseas but has never been detected in North America. The U.S. poultry industry is working with our partners in government to guard commercial poultry flocks. Asian avian influenza is not easily caught or transmitted by humans. No one knows if it will ever become a "human to human" disease that could form the basis for an outbreak of human influenza. The programs that are now in place will keep AI out of our food supply and limit the chance that it may become more dangerous to humans.Through an array of biosecurity measures, wild bird testing, and testing of commercial flocks by industry and government, we aim to keep it out of our flocks, eradicate it if it occurs, and assure the safety of the food supply.
Multiple "Firewalls" in Place to Assure U.S. Food Safety
What follows is a list of measures -- Biosecurity, prevention , monitoring, surveillance, testing, response plans, etc. -- to demonstrate the industry is on top of things.
It is clear what the talking points are. We don't have "Asian" avian influenza in the US. That's foreign, nasty stuff and we don't allow it here. The industry is working with government to make sure nothing happens. Trust them. If it becomes human to human you won't have to worry about chickens. You'll have to worry about your neighbor (undoubtedly true). Meanwhile, they are keeping it out of the food chain and out of their flocks with excellent biosecurity and if it ever does get into their flocks, not to worry, if the poultry is properly prepared you can't get sick from eating it.
This script works just as well for the UK as for the US. Or rather, it did until ten days ago.
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Dr. Killian at the H5N1 blog posted this story at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6352351.stm
We are elucidated here as to how the Hungary toose virus might have gotten into the live bird sheds in Suffolk (Mr. Matthews surely knew this all along)
"What's the connection between the outbreak at the goose farm in Szentes in Hungary, to the Bernard Matthews' plant 160 miles away in Sarvar?
It appears that a single abattoir in Hungary was handling both the geese that were infected with H5N1 and the turkeys destined for Suffolk. The abattoir would have been swilled out and disinfected once the geese were killed but it's very easy for the virus to have been passed on to the turkeys. One feather or a single piece of skin the size of a breadcrumb from one of the infected geese can contain 100,000 viruses, which can kill 100,000 birds.
How did the virus get from Hungary to Suffolk?
We need to know how well the abattoir in Hungary was disinfected after the infected geese were slaughtered, whether separate units were used or were they shared? These are all factors that come into it. Once the dead turkeys were packed on to lorries for transportation to England they would have been kept cold, stabilising the virus. "
But along with all the information in the article is this strangely worded deceptive end note
"Can you get bird flu from eating turkey?
One hundred percent not. Even if you ate raw turkey you still probably wouldn't be infected, the risk is so minuscule. That's because this is a bird virus that does not like humans but also because most people would cook a turkey and maintain high standards of hygiene - washing their hands and using clean work surfaces. "
Hmm haven't we been told that eating raw poultry is exactly how many of the 3rd world victims got the virus???? A miniscule risk is not 100% no risk either now is it? Probably wouldn't get it is not the same as 100% not get it? And while people are washing their hands and using clean work surfaces they never absentmindly brush their face or have some bit of blood escape their little biosecure work surface. Sure the risk is low, but it is not zero.
K.: I saw the BBC FAQ and decided not to use it for the reason you indicated at the end. It is a reasonable summary of where the controversy is at the moment but not where it will finally end up. So I decided to do my usual wait and see. Crof and Orange at thecominginfluenzapandemic.com are good sources for continuing events and are usually more timely than I am.
As I recall, you've implicated the practices now used in poultry farming, slaughtering, and marketing as likely means for passing this disease around and now, in the Independent article on this particular outbreak, the reporter seems to be saying this is the case. I get the impression that mass marketing means there is a great deal of commingling of certain cuts of meat or poultry, so isolation becomes harder to carry out. Or perhaps a more accurate way of putting it is that there is disincentive at work.
I have a simple question: the hungarian turkeys were "partially processed".. what exactly does that mean? They killed them, defeathered them, guttted them, and then took them to the UK to cut them up into smaller pieces?
Whay not "process" them completely at one location? Perhaps it's those famous English butchers.....
Limestone, I can't find the link right now, but basically the point of sending partially processed poultry from Hungary to the UK is to be able to sell it as UK poultry. I don't know how big the loophole is - ie how much processing has to be done in the UK to make it UK meat. I bet it ain't much. Sort of like the Made In the USA clothes that might have nothing more than a tag sewn on in the US. I would guess you are right - having killed them in Hungary they would have to defeather then and gut them there - so I guess cutting in pieces is what is left, unless the loophole allows them to cut them up in Hungary and just package them in the UK? Sort of like a soap opera unfolding isn't it.
Even if you ate raw turkey you still probably wouldn't be infected, the risk is so minuscule. That's because this is a bird virus that does not like humans but also because most people would cook a turkey
Ah. So eating raw turkey would be safe -- because cooked turkey is safe. It's all become clear to me now. I regret my former confusion.
I suppose that we should not be surprised to see arguments containing a glaringly obvious non sequitur be aired in a perfectly serious tone. I'll say one thing about the steady decline in standards of education: it certainly makes it easier to get away with baldfacedly dishonest PR.
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marquer: It's even worse. That was the BBC Q&A.
K: "soap opera unfolding isn't it". Like that analogy.
What mystifies me is how people can really believe that any government entity will protect them from the virus. We're being told they are, but to put ones faith in them, to me, is murderous thinking.
It's becoming increasingly obvious, that people continue to embrace and want a welfare lifestyle. That very few will take actual responsibility for their very lives.
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Not trying to sell anything, go to the link below and click on their bird flu information. It's a California company.
Avian Influenza A (H5N1) Virus)
What we know about Bird Flu:
http://www.sheltons.com/index.html
A poll on a small non-birdflu website today asks the question, 'what do you think has been the mortality rate among people who have caught H5N1 bird flu?' Of the 26 answers thus far, 13 thought it was less than 10%, and 3 thought it was over 90%.
People who are not flu watchers really have no clue what's up.
It will probably turn out that the virus was in the dirty lorries used for transport, not the abattoir or processing plants. We keep overlooking the obvious!
There are certainly a lot of euphemisms in the meat packing business. I've also been pondering the meaning of "partially processed". You knew there had to be some sort of regulatory loophole that encouraged the cross-continent movement of poultry in its most perishable state. I wonder if those trucks went through the Chunnel?
Lisa-Kind of like the bird watchers that DEFRA hired in the UK to do the surveillance of birds. They found absolutely nothing because either they were paid to find nothing or they went out on an all expense paid bird watching vacation because not one sample came back positive for even LPAI. That worked right up until they started showing up in peoples back yards.
This is my favorite from the current crop. If you are not from the UK DoH is the Department of Health this is the Government dept. that wrote our pandemic plan and this is from one of their spokesmen.
A spokesperson for the DoH told Farmers Weekly that the risk of infection was so low that only those incredibly close to the infected birds were at risk. Even then you would have to be drinking infected blood or eating infected faeces to be at risk, said the spokesperson.
From the recent Effectmeasure post on Campylobacter & Salmonella.
CDC estimates about 1 million cases a year and 100 deaths
If this is the case for cross contamination or undercooking in poultry in the US is it reasonable to assume the risks during poultry preparation are negligible?
Re my previous DoH quote, were I Indonsian or Egyptian I would be insulted by the inferance. As a UK citizen I am insulted by the spinners implied view of my intelligence.
Off the topic of biosecurity but in the category of bird flu, the February edition of Life Extension Magazine has an interesting article about the relationship betweeen Vitamin D levels and susceptibility to influenza. It's at:
http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2007/feb2007_report_vitamind_01.htm
I'm not a health professional but when I'm curious as to what to do about a health problem the first place I look is the LEF treatment protocols.
In 12/05 William Falloon, co-founder of LEF, sent a letter to LEF members about strategies for treating avian flu. It has been reproduced at http://www.birdflu.com/lef.htm (a for-profit site with affiliate links).
Actually that should have been "Faloon," with one "l."
He'd be a great person to head the FDA - or whichever Federal healthcare agency is the most powerful. The articles he writes for Life Extension Magazine show a deep concern for peoples' welfare, a tremendous depth of knowledge on medical issues, and an unflinching willingness to stand up to the greed of the pharmaceutical industry and the people in medicine and government who shill for it.
I define greed as a desire to get what we want through actions towards others that we wouldn't want taken towards us.