Palin comparison, I: reproductive rights

Not many people know much about John McCain's new running mate, Sarah Palin, first term Governor of Alaska (in office 20 months). Not even John McCain knows that much about her. He only met her twice before deciding she was worthy of being his running mate. So let's take a look at her record, as best we can with someone with as meager a history as she has. We'll do it a piece at a time, starting with the qualification most talked about, her stridently (almost) absolute anti-choice stance. She is more rigid and ideological than even consistent anti-choice McCain, who is willing to entertain the idea of abortion in the case of rape, incest or to save the life of the mother. Palin doesn't consider either rape or incest sufficient reason to end an unwanted pregnancy (in the case of rape or incest, "unwanted pregnancy" seems like a euphemism).

In answering a questionnaire for gubernatorial candidates in 2006, here's how she answered the question,

Complete the sentence by checking the applicable phrases (you can check more than one).
Abortion should be:
  • Banned throughout entire pregnancy.
  • Legal to save the life of the mother.
  • Legal in case of rape and incest.
  • Legal if the baby is handicapped.
  • Legal if the baby has a genetic defect.
  • Legal in the first trimester.
  • Legal in the second trimester.
  • Legal in the third trimester.

Sarah Palin's answer: I am pro-life. With the exception of a doctor's determination that the mother's life would end if the pregnancy continued. I believe that no matter what mistakes we make as a society, we cannot condone ending an innocent's life.>(Eagle Forum)

Not even for rape? Palin feels free to choose for her daughter should the daughter become pregnant by rape or incest:

The candidates were pressed on their stances on abortion and were even asked what they would do if their own daughters were raped and became pregnant.

Palin said she would support abortion only if the mother's life was in danger. When it came to her daughter, she said, "I would choose life."

Both Knowles and Halcro are pro-choice. Halcro said the government needs to stay out of life-or-death issues.

Knowles, responding to the scenario involving his daughter, said he would counsel her and talk to her, but it would be her decision. "I would love her and support her no matter what decision she made," he said. (Anchorage Daily News)

The Republican platform is consistent with Palin's position. No exceptions.

But everyone knew how extreme Palin was on this issue. We'll see she not only wants to get into a woman's uterus, but also into our bedrooms. That's a future installment of Palin comparison.

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The mother's life??? Damn, I was originally reading the coverage on that as the mother's "health". She's hard core this Governor Palin. Except, her own daughter apparently got to make a "decision". Now why would an ardent proponent of parental consent make a statement about her daughter's "decision" to carry to term?

BikeMonkey-- You beat me to it! I was outraged as soon as I read that quote of Palin saying how proud she is of her daughter's "decision" to carry her baby to term. In a Palin-ocracy the daughter would have no choice (and I would question how much choice she had in reality.) How can she actually say that? Say that you will support your daughter throughout the pregnancy or that you're proud of the way she's handling it, but don't you DARE say you're proud of her decision--the very one you're trying to take away.

Has she said she would try and impose her beliefs on others. Thats really the key. And as VP or even President, we know thats not possible anyways. After all, choice still exists after the Bush reign of terror. I doubt Palin will change the status quo.

If you had an exception for rape BTW, the number of reported "rapes" would increase dramatically. When asked why they did not report it earlier, they would just say they were too embarassed. Impossible to prove otherwise.

One (of the many) problems with "the mother's life" exception as I understand it is that by the time whatever problem (infection, etc.) has progressed to the point that it threatens her life, it may be too late for terminating her pregnancy to save it.

BikeMonkey: because, silly. Forcing your seventeen-year-old daughter to carry a pregnancy to term if she doesn't want to sounds cruel.

(Which it is. Which is only what us pro-choice types have been saying all along.)

Are you insane pft? I mean aside from the Veep casting a tiebreaking vote in the Senate, we have some oldie liberals on the SCOTUS. Another vote or two and goodbye RoeVWade my friend. Of course perhaps that's what you want...

If you had an exception for rape BTW, the number of reported "rapes" would increase dramatically. When asked why they did not report it earlier, they would just say they were too embarassed. Impossible to prove otherwise.

Otherwise how do we read this? WTF does this have to do with anything? I mean, you do raise a good point about the flagrant hypocrisy of the anti-choicer who carves out an exception for rape but beyond that?

By BikeMonkey (not verified) on 02 Sep 2008 #permalink

If I were standing for public office, I would not answer such a "questionnaire for gubernatorial candidates".

The problem of abortion is complicated by the definition of human life. Choose your own definition.
Life begins at:
(1) conception,
(2) after first trimester,
(3) when the fetus can live without life support.
(4) whatever.

The only law necessary here is that against murder.

And lets see Obama has a known terrorist that bombed the the Pentagon as one of his best friends and contributors... He even sits on the board of directors of his "foundation. We could also remove the references to "God Damn the US" by his pastor and overlook that too. Barry has 173 days as a Senator under his belt. But thats the thing about perspective, if the media doesnt cover it then its not news. They tell us what is news.

In reference to the above I believe this is a family matter and to his credit so does Obama when it comes to young Palin. Me, I want to know that if McCain drops over dead that the person who takes over can handle the job. At least she has had a job before as both mayor and governor and she looks a good deal better than Barack does. I think that chief of the administrative branch of any state trumps just about any Senator for sure. If we want to bring families into this both Bidens brother and son are being sued for MILLIONS for defrauding investors in a hedge fund. Now that far trumps any baby that is going to be born. It affects so many millions of people for young Palin to be having a baby. If she were 18 and freshly married no one would bat an eye. At least the dad in this case isnt baling out as Baracks did. Bidens family matters will be around for at least another five years. But thats if you bring family into it.

As for Palin she also enjoys an 83% favorable rating by the people of Alaska. So, this is nothing more than an exercise in the old battle about abortion? I am not sure what this one is about. By inference are you saying that she is pro choice and a conservative? I would buy that but I think she is far more qualified as governor to be VEEP than Barack is for president.

Would it likely instill a conservative bent onto the administrative practices of the government if elected? Probably. But thats not about the uterus of one young Palin, thats about all of the US.Will it overturn Roe V Wade? Supremes rarely overturn the rulings of other Supreme Courts. They might modify it so I think that abortion where it was legal would be safe and would give the states the right to decide if it was legal or not in their states. The original and most important one in any state is self determination, not imposition. So New York, California, Pennsylvania, Nevada, Oregon and Washington state would certainly vote for it to be legal.

I am against abortion but if we have to have it IMO then it has to be safe, clean and not so much with parental consent. If they are of the age to get pregnant and have half a brain to go with their uterus they should be able to make that decision on their own. Personally, I dont like the idea of a bunch of men getting together and deciding what women are going to do with their bodies. Thats the reason you vote the ballot box.

This is going to be a horse race. When that phone rings at 3 a.m. and it will ring the sonuvabitch on the other end had better have the right answers come Jan 20th, 09 else we are going to be in deep shit. To me Palin being pregnant isnt the issue, the issue is whether we might be at war by that time with Russia.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 02 Sep 2008 #permalink

Randy; LOL time two. He has a known terrorist as one of his best friends? Really? And the foundation that is you latest email from the RNC? LOL. Obama runs a huge campaign for longer than she was in office and she has more executive experience? LOL. She has defended us from the Russians and commands the National Guard? LOL. I didn't raise any issues about the young Palin. I want the Palins of this world to stay out of our bedrooms and the uteri of our women. What her daughter does and how either handle their own pregnancies is none of my business and I didn't raise it. Deliberately. As for abortion being safe and legal, if it's not legal it won't be safe and I remember well when it wasn't legal and certainly wasn't safe.

But don't tire yourself on this one, Randy. I've got lots more to come. Enjoy.

Randy, Randy, Randy (& I'm not talking about the young Miss Palin) how could you be afraid of war with Russia?

I thought that Saint Ronald Reagan achieved his sainthood because he destroyed the Russian threat, at least thats what neocons have been saying for twenty years.

Are you saying Saint Ronald is a fraud?

bar, what ever your personal beliefs as to when a human life starts, scientifically the idea that it "starts" at conception is fatally flawed and cannot be correct.

If a fertilized egg is a person, then are identical twins two people or one person? When did the fertilized egg go from being one person to being two people? When it first divided? Every fertilized egg divides for a first time into two totipotent cells. Is that now two people in every case?

Similarly two fertilized eggs can combine and form a single person. There are human beings that are alive now that are mosaic that is they consist of the daughter cells from two separate fertilized eggs. Is such a mosaic person two people or one person? If a mosaic person is one person, when did the person who comprised one of the fertilized eggs that didn't become a person "die"?

If totipotent stem cells and embryos can be created from somatic cells, then each and every human cell is morally equivalent to a fertilized egg.

If a definition of when human life begins cannot address the complexity of the reality of the actual science involved, then it should not be the moral basis for law.

Okay Rob, the Rus didnt take Afghanistan with a wussie in as President either. Georgia is a bit far for our navy to do much about so well, you can call Putin and ask them to give it back. He might listen to you. Different day and who was in charge then. Now we might get to see it happen again.

As for Obamas ties to William Ayers... Its on USNWR's radar and he should explain his ties to this guy.... He does you know sit on the board of that foundation. Revere do you support terrorists? I think not but I certainly do want Obama to explain this and the location of his mothers uterus at the time of his birth rather than whether she should have aborted him.

Dont ask Pat Buchanan about that last one. Even he might have changed his mind on if he knew what he does now about Obama.

This is an election but either everything is up for discussion or its not. I dont think that the USNWR is the RNC homepage old friend. Nor do I think that the fate of abortion should be brought up in the same post about some poor 17 year olds problem. Abortion is legal in Alaska. She chose not to do it. End of story on that.

William Ayers…

February 26, 2008

'Everything was absolutely ideal on the day I bombed the Pentagon."

This excerpt from William Ayers' memoir appeared in the New York Times on the morning of Sept. 11, 2001 -- a few hours before Al Qaeda terrorists crashed hijacked planes into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Ayers, once a leader in the Weather Underground -- the group that declared "war" on the U.S. government in 1970 -- told the Times, "I don't regret setting bombs" and "I feel we didn't do enough."

Ayers recently reappeared in the news because reported Friday that Barack Obama has loose ties to him. Ayers, now a professor of education at the University of Illinois at Chicago, is apparently a left-wing institution in Chicago's Hyde Park neighborhood, and Obama visited Ayers' home as a rite of passage when launching his political career in the mid-1990s. The two also served on the board of the charitable Woods Fund of Chicago, which gave money to Northwestern University Law School's Children and Family Justice Center, where Ayers' wife (and former Weather Underground compatriot) Bernardine Dohrn is the director.

Sounds like a confession to me... Dont think that a daughter having a baby is as important as a guy who cant even produce a valid birth certificate to ensure he is a legal citizen. There is absolutely nothing so far that shows he was born in Hawaii as he asserts. Cant produce a valid birth certificate and he wont open that part of his records up. Now a lawsuit has been filed by a Democrat challenging his citizenship. Likely a Hillary supporter. But the bottom line is that indeed there are far bigger things that the Palin paternity and whether abortion should be legal or illegal.

There is a Democrat Congress... Not much chance that even with a challenge to Roe V. Wade that it would last more than 30 seconds before Pelosi and Reid took their majority to ensure it was legal. Even if it wasnt it is perfectly legal in Canada and most of the EU. Little road trip is all.

Whether you understand it or not Revere, the Guard and Reserves are now full on front line troops. The governors of each state command those troops and frankly with 700 people in Iraq and thats not counting the Air Guard and Reserves I would say that yes she has had a pretty good role as a State CIC. Her own son has reported now and is heading in and thats more than half that the libs here could say. She also convinced a huge margin of the state to vote for her and tanked her own Republican power base. Some say the Ted Stevens thing is linked to what she gave the feds. So morality and legality are issues too.

Its my opinion of course but if Obama is elected we are going to be in deep trouble and fast. He has proposed hundreds of billions in cuts to the military and thats at a time when the Russians are spending their asses off. Abortion isnt going to be an issue on election day I believe.

It will be just as legal 5 years from now as it is now I would be willing to bet you regardless of who is elected.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 02 Sep 2008 #permalink

I was watching the Republican Convention this morning (Australian time) and I was struck by the thought that there was something strange about the demographics.

Whilst watching the Democratic convention I noted that when the cameras panned on the convention crowds, there were people of all ages, and races cheering together. Young, old, gay, Black, white and/or brindle, it just did not matter. Race was not an issue.

Now looking at the Republican Convention, as the cameras pan the crowd, I see well healed white middle aged people, well healed elderly white people, and very few young people. I have been watching to see how many black, or Asian people there are at the Republican Convention, I confess I have only seen one or two.

It begs the question - who would the Republicans govern for?

Sorry Rever, I was off topic.

daedelus2u: Actually I tend to favour the ancient Greek method for determining humanity. If the newborn can survive a night's exposure on Mount Olympus, then it is considered human. How it gets born (Caesar, natural, whatever) is irrelevant.

Why is incest lumped in with rape there?

I've not put a great deal of contemplation into the matter but I was always under the impression that the root reason why incest is a Bad Thing(TM) in pretty much all cultures is that prolonged inbreeding always seems to lead to poor outcomes - deformaties, increased susceptibility to various ailments etc. Basically the same reason why most "pure" dog breeds aren't particularly healthy either.

Which surely puts it into the same sort of category as "genetic defects", shouldn't it? (Assuming everyone is consenting and of consenting age etc of course.) Of course that might not make the choice for the idealogically hung up easy enough. ;)

'Palin said she would support abortion only if the mother's life was in danger. When it came to her daughter, she said, "I would choose life."'

(((SUICIDE))) -- a female who has experienced rape and/or incest FORCED by the state into carrying the fetus to full term surely would consider the LOGICAL choice of suicide!?!

So, within this context is "suicide" suicide or is it state-based murder!?!

By Jonathon Singleton (not verified) on 03 Sep 2008 #permalink

Andrew, most cases of incest resulting in pregnancy are due to repeated older male-younger female intercourse where there is significant age disparity (i.e. older brother, father or uncle) which in a non-familial circumstance might well be considered rape. Usually the female is younger than the age of consent. The circumstance as described in the Bible, where two daughters get their father drunk and get him to impregnate them only occurs in fantasy. But with males keeping the records, it is only the fantasies that get recorded.

What is interesting in the Palin daughter case is that it was instantly announced that the two are getting married. It would seem that the only criteria the Palin family had for their new son-in-law was that he got their daughter pregnant. They should get married now, before the election because the wealthy right wing Christians will give them good presents. If McCain/Palin lose in November, they will get nothing.

From staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said.

No matter how many times Kruger's sources burn him, he keeps going back for more.

Next we'll be hearing about how Palin "hates earmarks." Phila is NOT a court. I prefer to defer to that rather than anyone who has an agenda... That would include me and especially you.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 03 Sep 2008 #permalink

Randy: What does a Court have to do with this? Phila nailed you. Admit it, although your contention has been refuted so many times already it appears you don't pay attention to facts, so what good would a Court do? There is no dispute here. It's like the silly terrorist "best friend" claim, for which there is no foundation. You are just repeating vicious smears. These aren't differences of opinion. Man up, Randy. You were wrong. Very, very wrong.


" I think she is far more qualified as governor to be VEEP than Barack is for president."

Sorry there-but I disagree 2000% for 2000 +reasons

God help us if McCain etc retake the WH.

Talk about a "(Mc)Caine Mutinty!!!!

Phila didnt "nail" anyone Revere. The court has taken up the suit and for that you have to have evidence. Sorry but most people follow the law. Man up? Whats that? Taking cheap shots from a blog at someone who has been in the light for less than a week such as Palin... ILK? ??? Most of the time I collect all the facts before I pass judgment. How many times has Obama had the chance to release his original birth certificate? Any time he wants too he could you know and they are at best cagey about it. Enough for the Dems themselves to question it. Hey, lets release Obama and Bidens Socials to the public. Lets run a credit check on Obama. Bet them student loans were in default until he became a buddy of Ayers and Risko. How about that home that he lives in. Both of these two and the Reverend to me either show the biggest stupidity on the part of someone that is an elected official or someone that just thinks they are invulnerable to the issues. The questions are starting to hit home and its all above Obamas pay grade.

As for ILK. Most of the time word ilk is meaning people of the same mindset in this reference. Cant seem to understand what your meaning is here. All that ILK in Alaska and in the Republican party is going to be voting Revere and I am sure that it wont be for Obama.

What are you going to do, vote for Obama for change, because he is black or because he is both. He hasnt said one damned thing other than he is going to cut the military, cut the spending on advanced systems and basically leave us open for a big hit. He has said he is going to negotiate with terrorists. I havent heard anything but the bell clanging for the replacement of GWB on his side of the fence and unfortunately for the Dems I think its a two camp Democrat party. I found a lot of what Hilary wanted to do valid and acceptable. All I hear out of Obama is change, change, change with no meat with the potatoes. I want to hear how this silly bastard is going to pay for all of the things he is suggesting other than by creating another welfare state.

Welfare state? Lets take a look at Louisiana where they just got thru putting in a Republican governor. They had to haul ass because of Gustav and arrived here in Memphis...35,000 of them with absolutely no money. Why? They questioned them on the news... Well, the welfare checks hadnt arrived before the storm was the answer. 35,000 New Orleans residents on welfare. One question... How long had they been on welfare....Well all my life. .

Now whats wrong with this picture? Thats an issue right there and now we gotta pony to send them poverty. So far about 1000 have elected to stay here because they can get a job. Many had never ever been out of the state, some the city. So what would Obama do about that? Create jobs with federal money...Make work programs that go back to FDR. Shit no, he is proposing that we just give it to them. .

Pro choice or Pro Life. Seems that the people Alaska say you are wrong too. And abortion is still legal there. I guess you are just too much of a woman for me. So woman up Revere. I wouldnt want someone to misunderstand me here on that but that would be denigrating to say something like that. Admit it? Bullshit... I want a clear, clean answer from a court and to all of the issues that I raised about his birth place. Good for the Democrat who filed it. See they aint all bad. I also want to know what this guys dealings with convicts, and slumlords are. I also want to know after funneling millions to his buddy Risko in housing deals from the goverment why those homes are all boarded up now. How about some real questions for a change to Obama?

AS for Phila I will just say that Phila is an attack dog and leave it at that. Zip in, attack and leave. Wont put up a fight.

Victoria-Take a look at the accomplishments for ethnic Americans that Republicans started and see how they stack up. All that the Democrats want to offer is cradle to the grave housing, food, medicines, healthcare and you can forget a job. You dont need one. This is the reason we have so many out of wedlock births to blacks.

They dont need a Daddy, they got the government. Part of which is the Republicans fault. Abortions? How about sterilizations to get welfare? Ooooh no. Its okay to send someone else the bills for fucking up. Typical of many Democrats, but not all. All the Democrats will do is soak the people who are working to get the money to support this kind of bullshit. They have started expanding this in Tennessee again and almost 45% of all blacks in this state are on some sort of welfare. Less than 1/2 of all blacks in this state have a father in the home. So why should they show up for a Republican convention? We would end the free money that they get and would require accountability for it. But the ones who have broken the mold are out there and especially in this county... You think I am bad Revere. Three of them are Veeps at Fedex and you get them into the room and they go off about the Dems typical fall back position, which is socialism. They would cut you up like Benihana's. They are very powerful men in this community and they got their jobs because they were the best qualified. Harvard, Yale X 2.

Victoria reference your suggestion about racial equality at the convention-Hit a few presidents.

Abraham Lincoln -Emancipation Proclamation
1954 Landmark desegregation by the Supreme Court
Brown vs. Board of Education
Medgar Evers/Brian De La Beckwith trial-Laughter as prosecutor
Desegregation of Little Rock High School -President Ike Eisenhower
Appointment of first black Chief of Staff of the Armed Services-Colin Powell by Bush1
appointment of first black Sec of State. Bush2

Because we elect our delegates rather than creating this superdelegate mess that knocked Hilary out of the drivers seat we send people who put their names in for delegate. Some people cant get off of work that long, so it IS an elite that goes to the Convention. Many go for one or two nights and you'll see a lot more tonight and tommorow but they work for a living. But the message is clear for people like Colin Powell who are ethic in this country, the ring is out there if you care to aspire to be something more than a 50 year old welfare recipient that gets government everything. It is there if you'll do something about your condition rather than bitch while you wait for gubbermint help after Katrina when a Dem governor sets up a President for a hit.

All that the Dems offer is social welfare and not one real outside of the social system answer. The welfare pays too good for people to get a job and all you have to do is sit about once a month or so and fill out forms to get that rent paid for, the electric bill, the food stamps, the medical. Yup, pretty easy work. The rest of the time all you have to do is hang with the homeys and jump bones and make more babies. All of course with no accountability.

Social welfare accounts for just under 1/2 of the entire state budget here.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 03 Sep 2008 #permalink

AS for Phila I will just say that Phila is an attack dog and leave it at that. Zip in, attack and leave. Wont put up a fight.

There's nothing to fight about. You want people to believe that the Obama campaign, the Hawaii Department of Health, and are all in on a massive conspiracy to falsify Obama's birth records.

Seems to me that the burden of proof is on you. And that you don't have any.

Randy: Palin commands NO National Guard troops in Iraq. You know that. You are a military person. Why are you saying what you know isn't true? And where does it say Bill Ayers is one of Obama's best friends, which is what you claimed. He barely knows Ayers. Where is your documentation? I guess for this you don't want to wait for the court. Last I heard, consorting with terrorists was illegal. As for the birth certificate issue, that is a colossal joke except that it isn't really a joke, it's a smear meant to make Obama look less Amerian, foreign, something different. It's unworthy of you. In fact, the one who was born outside the US was McCain; not that it matters. If Lincoln were alive today you would be complaining he didn't have executive experience, since Lincoln's experience was basically the same as Obama's. Except that Obama runs an operation much larger than Palin or McCain have ever run with a budget much larger than Palin has ever commanded and Obama had 18 million people vote for him, many more than voted for Palin. He won the nomination against a very tough opponent. Palin? Not so much.

But don't worry. I will be giving you much more to keep you xeroxing the RNC talking points you repeat here. There's so much, so much. Tomorrow, Palin and gay rights.

I'm not a Democrat but I vote Democrat because the Republicans are so morally bankrupt. And I want much more than help for people who need it (in your language, a welfare state). I don't want a welfare state for Big Business which is what Republicans have produced. We've had 8 years of Republicans. Not even their candidate wants to defend them. He's running from them as fast as he can while simultaneously clasped in a death grip with their policies. The Republican platform is the most extreme right wing platform in its history. It is John McCain's platform.

Republicans don't elect their delegates. They have a winner take all system so a huge number of votes for others aren't represented. And most people follow the law? Maybe ordinary people do but your party doesn't. I won't bother to run down the list. It's too long. The Republican party is a party to enrich the wealthy and screw everyone else, the most divisive political party in recent history, a party that divides one person from another, crooked, dishonest, corrupt, criminal and always hiding behind a pious religiosity and phony partriotism that is as un-Christian as any reasonable Christian could imagine and as un-American as has ever held power.

The Republican platform is a hateful, vile, malicious and coldhearted program that is un-American, undemocratic and mean spirited. So are its candidates. Meanwhile I will be telling the story of Sarah Palin as the record reveals it, a record which John McCain was too rash, too hasty, too impulsive and too cynical to bother with.

Also, here's right-wing blogger "Captain Ed" Morrissey on the announcement of Obama's birth that was found in a 1961 issue of the Honolulu Advertiser by an anti-Obama blogger who was hoping to discredit him:

Unless someone wants to argue that the Advertiser decided to participate in a conspiracy at Obamas birth in 1961 to provide false citizenship on the off-chance that an infant from a union of a Kenyan father and a teenage mother would run for President, then Id say the mystery is over.

When you're more paranoid than Morrissey, you're in pretty sorry shape.

As much as MRK's ranting irritates me, I'm sure he's harmless and law-abiding. But it's not hard to imagine people who are buying into these crackpot theories as seriously and dangerously as Timothy McVeigh bought into ZOG, or Jim D. Adkisson bought into Michael Savage's theories on the gay takeover of America.

Seems to me like a good reason to err on the side of caution. (And incidentally, I'm speaking as someone who who was equally irritated by the left-wing theory that Sarah Palin had pretended to have a baby to hide her daughter's pregnancy. If everyone on both sides would knock this shit off, I'd be a lot happier. The biggest problems with politicians are usually right out in the open.)

Shouldn't be commenting because of, well, never mind. MRK and Victoria know why but there is no one else here I'd share anything of such a personal nature with.

You are so transparent revere. You are cutting asunder Sarah Palin (SP) simply because I brought her up a post or two ago. It won't sway me nor will it anger me. You are only stroking your own ego.
Let me just say you really should get ahold of your apparent anger because it could give you a stoke or a fatal heart attack. Either that or that piece of crap car you're driving will do you in.

If you aren't "Democrat" revere then who would you like to see as the next President? And don't say Edwards, please.

Victoria, re your comment "who would the Republicans govern?"

Same people they have for the last 20+ years-more rich old white people. Now I'm white, and a bit long in the tooth, and rich in everything but money. I can't stand the current administration and the attitude that somehow they know all-what did they get an overnighted letter from The Almighty? I do not want creationism taught in public school! I want all peoples get access to healthcare, and all women assisted with any unplanned pregancies, and I'm willing to pay the taxes for that.

The Republican Party motto seems to be "I've got mine, and I'm working on getting yours too."

Lea: Not as transparent as you seem to think. I have zero recollection of your bringing up Sarah Palin or what you said about her (I'm not saying you didn't, only I don't remember that you did). I consider the idea Palin might be President a threat to public health and that is the sole reason I am posting on her. I rarely post because of comments here, not because I don't value comments but because if I did that I would continually be running from pillar to post and we want to write about what interests us or what we think is important. So, no, Lea, it had nothing to do with you. Of course it has to do with me. I wrote it. If you think it was to assuage my ego feel free. It wasn't but I don't think whether you think so or not has much bearing on the content.

Thats okay Revere, I consider Obama to be a threat to the public.

Fyi boys and girls I saw the submitted document and I believe it was on Kos and many jumped in ahead of me to state that it was very strange that the date in the lower left corner was in the 90's... A duplication without the raised AND very REQUIRED for citzenship seal. Lefty blog, not mine. Enough for a Democrat to file suit. Not a Republican.

Revere, you are mistaken about the winner take all system. We vote for a slate of delegates along with the candidate who they are committed to. Those delegates are named... here is a sample.…

You can see the at large positions are named and those at large positions have been voted on by the members of the State Republican Committee. Sorry. At least 10 other southern states do it the same way.

Now lets talk about Ayers.....…

"This is a guy who lives in my neighborhood, who's a professor of English in Chicago, who I know and who I have not received some official endorsement from. He's not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis.

"And the notion that somehow as a consequence of me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago when I was 8 years old, somehow reflects on me and my values, doesn't make much sense, George. [�.]

"So this kind of game, in which anybody who I know, regardless of how flimsy the relationship is, is somehow � somehow their ideas could be attributed to me � I think the American people are smarter than that. They're not going to suggest somehow that that is reflective of my views, because it obviously isn't."

Sounds to me like he has a bit of a credibility gap..... He goes to Ayers house and hangs with him and Bernadine Dohrn. Baracks memory is a bit cloudy on these issues when questioned about it.

Then there is the birth certificate and I think the WND covers it pretty well. Fact Checker gained a copy of the original birth certificate? Amazing since as a presidential candidate he should just pony it up to remove all doubts. If he is then fine, run Obama run. Else, he is outta there. If the court finds that Obama's mommie didnt follow correct procedures then he isnt a citizen... or a Senator for that matter. Cant plead ignorance here, its the law. Phila I would be happy if he would just sign the release order for the records that were submitted to the Bureau of Vital Statistics. If he is legal then fine. If not, then not so fine. Dont sit back and say that you are right until he proves it as he is required to do now under the law... Its a lawsuit, he is now guilty until he proves himself innocent. And I wont veil it at all. I dont want him as CIC or as President of the US.

Revere, the Alaskan ARNG commands as a unit from their HQ at the Guard bureau in Anchorage. That HQ is subordinated to an in theater command via SOCOM which is the major command located at McDill AFB. Those troops once activated are not directly under the control of the Governor. They can be recalled after I believe a 60 day notification to the President. No one has opted as any governor to do that. But to carry it a bit further. Those troops are part of the primary deployment forces of the US. They would be deployed to whatever part of Alaska in the event of an invasion that so few think would be possible that are libs and they would be under the control of the Governor until such time as the President stepped in. Those troops I also worked with in two theaters and just down the road in training 200 miles. They dont do so well in the heat of the South.

You might remember the good admiral was in charge of this and was dead against the Presidents decisions in Iraq and those of General Petraeus. He resigned. Yesterday marked a milestone by the way as the Iraqification allowed for their army and police to take control of Anbar Province. But that slips the libs here too. Anyway the end result is that

Anyway McCain was born in the Panama canal zone. He is a citizen by act of Congress.…
They did go on to put it in.

As for Lincoln Revere... I'd really appreciate being able to make my own case thanks. You made a statement that you cant back up. He aint alive and I would have liked to ask a few questions of him. First would have been about his choice of commanders.

Oh and you are right about Obama winning. Had there been an actual and introduced election result other than splitting it down the middle in Florida and Michigan then Hilary would be wearing her pant suit now. But thats Democrats for you and libs. Superdelegates... Came back to haunt them. LIkely going to go away now because its not really a superdelegate, its a superpower inside of a power. The results? A fractured Democratic party.

Gay rights and Palin....Glad this is a political blog. Of course anything we will say will offend my buddy Jonny of Oz so apologies on the front end. SP's position on gay rights and marriage are about the same as mine and I have certainly expounded on that more than once. Civil unions/marriages whatever.... Its abomination and a directed sin. I am glad I am not that way because it puts those people into the position of actually losing their lives over it in certain countries. Thats the reason I like the USA....Jon S. got the shit kicked out of him on more than one occasion and sexually mistreated. We got laws for that kind of shit here and I am for one all over it when there is a hate type crime. But its not hate to expound the beliefs of ones god if you have one. This IS a judeo-christian society and I know you bailed on religion long ago but your own acts are not ungodly by anyones definition. But when those acts become codified as a right, a law and by anyones definition abomination... somethings going to give. If they want to do their thing behind closed doors thats fine. Dont ask me to create a new right just for a class of society that isnt something like a special needs person or persons.

Yep, keep on kicking them out old friend. This is a lib blog and its like swimming with the sharks... its exciting at times. Sometimes the sharks win and sometimes the conservative pulls out a grenade and blows them the hell out of the water.

Well stated Grace.... You and I agree to disagree and vote accordingly. You always do so without making personal attacks and I appreciate that fact. Everyone can make their points without name calling beyond lib or conservative.

By M. Randolph Kruger (not verified) on 03 Sep 2008 #permalink

You are cutting asunder Sarah Palin (SP) simply because I brought her up a post or two ago

It's certainly hard to imagine any other reason for Revere to offer an opinion on what is probably the week's foremost domestic news story.

Oh, wait. No, it isn't. Never mind!