If there's one thing I've learned about antivaccinationists, it's that they're all about the double standards. For instance, to them if Paul Offit makes money off of his rotavirus vaccine, he's a pharma shill, a hopelessly compromised "biostitute" (as Robert F. Kennedy Jr. called him) or "Dr. Proffit", and therefore to be dismissed on that basis alone regardless of his knowledge of science. If I happen to get a small grant from a pharmaceutical company, even though it isn't even enough to pay the full salary of a postdoctoral fellow, or receive a small amount of money for my blogging from a company that has run pharmaceutical ads then, of course, I'm hopelessly compromised. On the other hand, if someone like Andrew Wakefield accepts hundreds of thousands of dollars for "research" to find a link between vaccines and autism so that trial lawyers could sue vaccine manufacturers, they think nothing of it. If, as I described last week, Wakefield owns a company known as the Autism Media Channel and tries to shop around a reality show about "biomedical" practitioners swooping in to help parents with autistic children who are difficult to manage or even violent, that doesn't affect his objectivity. He's just campaigning for autistic children. If a journalist like Sharyl Attkisson, who is known to be tight with antivaccinationists and biomeddlers does a biased story that lies by omission, failing to reveal key information that would put the story into proper context, all in the service of a message that a mother who murdered her autistic teen did it out of love, it's all good. I could go on and on and on with innumerable examples, but you get the idea.
That's why Anne Dachel's hit piece on Matt Carey on the antivaccine crank blog Age of Autism (AoA) amused me so much. It's also why I thought it was worth blogging about, as it demonstrates very strongly the utter hypocrisy of the denizens of AoA. Dachel, as you might recall, is the "media editor" of AoA. For those of you not familiar with her, her job at AoA involves spamming the comments of stories and articles on either vaccines or autism (or both) with antivaccine screeds. It also involves posting links to stories, so that she can send AoA's flying monkey squad to dive bomb such articles with antivaccine poo. Particular favorite targets are any articles that refute antivaccine lies or support the safety of vaccines. Because that's all she seems to do, I was rather surprised to see her write an actual 1,300+ word post for AoA instead of her usual link dump designed to give marching orders to her squadrons of flying monkeys. But write it she did, entitling it IACC's Matt Carey and the November Autism Hearing.
The title of Dachel's post refers to what I referred to as a mummers' farce, and quite rightly so. It was a hearing that seemed to have been arranged by the current chair of the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, Darrell Issa (R-CA) in honor of the old chair, Dan Burton, the most antivaccine member of Congress, who fortunately retired at the end of the last Congressional term after three decades of promoting pseudoscience and quackery. Here's what upset Dachel. A few days ago, Matt Carey wrote an excellent post One year and $40,000 later and another hearing. In his post, Matt pointed out that our good old buddy, the looniest of the loons, Patrick "Tim" Bolen, reported that $40,000 had been donated the Political Action Committee (PAC) for Darryl Issa. Matt, of course, acknowledged that the source of the report was "far (far, far, far) from reliable" (which is actually quite the understatement). So he was skeptical, but one does have to remember if there might have been a quid pro quo going on, as so frequently happens in Washington politics. So Matt investigated and found evidence in public records that Darrell Issa might very well have been bought and paid for by the antivaccine movement. Or at least he's been bought, and a substantial downpayment of $40,000 has been made.
Why does Matt suspect a quid pro quo? Well, Jennifer Larson, a wealthy backer of the antivaccine group The Canary Party (just search it on this blog if you want to see how completely off base it is) issued a press release stating:
“We are thrilled that Rep. Darrell Issa will be holding a second round of vaccine hearings this fall in the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, to examine just what is happening in the VICP,” said Canary Party President Jennifer Larson. “We are eager for Congress and the American people to see just how far the program has strayed from what it was intended to be when Congress put it in place in the 1980s. It has failed families and become nothing more than a tool to protect vaccine makers and cover government malfeasance in the vaccine program, to the detriment of countless children.”
Not surprisingly, this is the same press release that announced The Canary Party's recent video, narrated by Rob Schneider, that spread misinformation about the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP). Clearly, seeing how last November's hearing went over like the proverbial lead balloon (and didn't lead to anything as awesome as Led Zeppelin), the forces lobbying for such hearings have—shall we say?—retooled their message into something that drops autism altogether, at least on the surface. Instead of trying to use these hearings to convince people that vaccines cause autism, they have apparently decided that the way to go is straight antivaccine and launch an attack on the VICP, which, as I described, actually functions quite well.
So here's what Matt said about the donations:
The donations were reported to have been made from Jennifer Larson, who is with the tiny “Canary Party”. Tax documents indicate that Ms. Larson is a large financial backer of the Canary Party. Searching for what donations Ms. Larson has made (using OpenSecrets.org, the Center for Responsive Politics) I found a total of $40,000 donations to Congressman Issa, his PAC and the Republican National Committee though Ms. Larson and her company Vibrant Technologies.
The bulk went to the Republican National Committee. I’d love to see what, if any, arrangements the RNC has to support Issa with those funds. If you think that the $10,200 given directly to ISSA and his PAC is not enough to get noticed, keep in mind that this is the 5th highest amount given to the Congressman this year
In a followup post, Yes, that $29,800 donation is going to Congressman Issa too, Matt expands on that "bulk of the donations" that went to the Republican National Committee, which totaled $29,800:
Well, I found out about the donation to the Republican National Committee. The Federal Elections Commission shows that that $29,800 donation was earmarked: JFC ATTRIB: DARRELL ISSA VICTORY FUND
Looks to this observer like those funds are going to support Congressman Issa through the “Darrell Issa Victory Fund“.
So those funds appear to be going: Straight to Darrell Issa, $40,000 worth. That sure looks like a potential conflict of interest to me. It sure looks like a potential quid pro quo, as well. If a pharmaceutical company (or Paul Offit) had donated an equivalent amount of money to a Representative, and that Representative did something like holding a hearing about, say, improving vaccination rates, you can be sure that Anne Dachel would be screaming to high bloody heaven about corruption and "buying" legislators. So what, I wonder, does she say about Matt Carey's revelations? One wonders one does.
Well, wonder no more. She starts out with some excerpts from the transcript of last year's hearing in which Rep. Bill Posey (R-FL) castigated a CDC official, badgering her over why there has never been what antivaccinationists like to call a "vaxed vs. unvaxed" study. (Actually, there have been such studies, just not of the type that antivaccinationists want.) Then she does a bit of ranting about a "CDC coverup," including an oldie but moldie, namely the old Simpsonwood conspiracy mongering that was one of the things that happened in 2005 that sucked me into devoting a major portion of this blog covering the nonsense spread by antivaccinationists. She then includes the Rob Schneider video, complete with its napalm-grade burning stupid, exulting about the November hearing that it "will shed more light on the subject of vaccine safety." (More likely it will shed more of the fetid stench of Issa's pseudoscientific flatus all over the halls of Congress.)
Then, only then, does she address Carey's criticism. And what do you think she says? She shrugs her shoulders and says, "So what?" Take a look:
Carey thinks that last year's hearing was a waste of time and he was upset that "members of Congress berated government public health employees." He charged that the upcoming hearing scheduled by Rep. Darrell Issa (R. CA) for this November was just a payback to Canary Party executive, Jennifer Larson, because she made a substantial donation to the Republican National Committee.
Come on. A $40,000 donation doesn't have that kind of influence. Darrell Issa isn't holding a pretend hearing just to make Jennifer Larson happy. The truth is, he's concerned about hundreds of thousands of disabled kids out there that no one at the CDC can reasonably explain. He came to Autism One in Chicago last May and said so.
Finally, it's almost laughable that Carey is suspicious about a mere $40,000. It pales in comparison to the dough pharma is spreading around on Capitol Hill.
She then writes:
It should also be pointed out that Darrell Issa was described by CBS in Los Angeles last month as "the richest man in Congress."
"Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) was ranked number one among The Hill's 50 Wealthiest lawmakers with an estimated net worth of at least $355 million by the end of 2012."
Issa certainly doesn't need the money. Maybe he's interested in this because there's something terribly wrong here. Industry isn't accountable---AT ALL, our health officials aren't doing their jobs and our kids are getting sicker and sicker.
Facepalm. Double facepalm, actually.
Does Dachel really think that Issa can't be influenced by campaign contributions because he's rich? If he's that rich and doesn't need the money, then why on earth would Larsen have bothered to donate to his campaign at all, given that she is not a California voter and lives in Minnesota? Out of the goodness of her heart? I don't think so, and, I daresay, neither does Dachel, unless she is even stupider than I thought. Unless Issa is using his own money to fund his campaign, that was a very silly excuse on Dachel's part. Of course, Dachel is a very silly woman.
If you go to OpenSecrets.org and look up Darrell Issa, what you will find is a list of donations to both Darrell Issa's campaign committee and PAC. As Matt pointed out, if you look at donations to Issa's leadership PAC and campaign committee combined, Vibrant Technologies is in the top five donors. Indeed, if you peruse the list of Issa's donors, you'll soon find that $10,200 is not too shabby at all, and if you include the $29,800, making a total of $40,000, Larson rapidly leaps to among the very top donors to Issa's campaign. Now, this sort of money may not be that much for a Presidential campaign and, to a lesser extent, for a Senate campaign but for a House campaign, we're talking big bucks here, which is why Larsen's contribution puts her in the top five of Issa's contributors and, if the $29,800 is included, catapults her even higher.
Yes, Ms. Dachel, that is indeed more than enough money to get Darrell Issa's attention, at least enough to show up at the Autism One Quackfest for its Congressional Panel this year. Of course, it appears that it is not enough to actually get anything substantive. It's not surprising to me that Issa might have been attracted to vaccine-autism pseudoscience through a whiff of cash. He is well known as one of the foremost science denialists in Congress right now. For example, he's an anthropogenic global climate change denialist, and he has been known to try to defund already funded grants from the NIH that he happens not to like, thus subverting the peer review process with political meddling. However, as has been pointed out, Issa is not actually a member of the Congressional Autism Caucus, nor has he sponsored or supported any relevant autism-related legislation. He doesn't care. Sure, he'll throw The Canary Party a bone every now and then as long as the campaign cash keeps coming. Just don't expect him to take any political risks for it. One wonders whether Issa, savvy political operator that he is, has taken The Canary Party to the cleaners. Dachel includes a picture of a cup with change in it and the caption "chump change" at the top of her post, as though $40,000 is "chump change." As Matt showed, that isn't chump change for House races, not by any stretch of the imagination. However, it does look likely that Issa took Larsen and The Canary Party for chumps.
Come on. A $40,000 donation doesn’t have that kind of influence. Darrell Issa isn’t holding a pretend hearing just to make Jennifer Larson happy.
When I read that, I rolled my eyes so hard I saw my brain.
I bet we could all cite instances where we are glad science is not decided by political actions and opinions. They can have all the hearings they want, and the truth will remain the same: vaccines do not cause autism. End of story.
It must be a dark and scary world to live in where you pray to a congressional hearing or a court ruling to prove you right and science wrong. There go $40,000 that could have made a nice salary to employ one more autistic. Instead, it gets tossed at a politician. Nice work, Chickanery Party.
From wikipedia: Darrell Edward Issa (/ˈaɪsə/; born November 1, 1953) is the U.S. Representative for California's 49th congressional district, serving since 2001. The district covers the northern coastal areas of San Diego County, including cities such as Oceanside, Vista, Carlsbad and Encinitas, as well as a small portion of southern Orange County. He is a member of the Republican Party.
He was formerly a CEO of Directed Electronics, a Vista, California-based manufacturer of automobile security and convenience products. The district was numbered as the 48th District during his first term and was renumbered the 49th after the 2000 Census. Since January 2011, he has served as Chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee.
Issa is a self-made millionaire with a net worth estimated at as much as $450 million, making him the second-wealthiest currently-serving member of Congress.
Looks to me like he didn't inherit his wealth. People who have earned the amount of wealth Issa has do not ignore $40,000, and although he almost certainly has a lot of accountants and financial advisers, he didn't get to be that wealthy by trusting others with their wealth.
Issa's district extends all the way up to San Clemente (http://wedrawthelines.ca.gov/downloads/meeting_handouts_082011/map_2011…), where none other than Dr. Bob Sears lives. It's a fair bet to say that Issa has also done some research of his constituency and found either (1) being anti-vaccine by way of this hearing will make him look good and get votes, and/or (2) get even better fundraising draw from his wealthier local backers--something critical when you face an election every 2 years.
No, Dachel's blowing smoke, and Matt hit the nail on the head about how skids were greased to put this hearing on the schedule.
egads--meant to use italics instead of bold (which should be reserved for coffee at this time in the morning). Sorry.
All this time I thought that Dachel just didn't understand science.
She doesn't understand politics, either.
Reading AoA gets my blood boiling with all the lies they spew out, it's really frustrating. For me, the saving grace is that outside of the people who are interested in vaccines/anti-vaccine I don't believe there is all that much interest.
I follow it and read all the blogs because I'm an epidemiologist and it interests me, but when I ask my friends and family about it, they don't really seem to know what I'm talking about. They typically respond with "that rumour years ago that vaccines cause Autism? Yah I've heard of that, but wasn't it all fake or something?"
I guess my point is that as annoying as they (AoA, anti-vaccine folk, etc) are, I don't think they are reaching as many people as I fear.
-btw- Mr Issa's wiki page is very intriguing.. perhaps he'll sue them and request its removal like Gary Null did ( which didn't work).
At any rate, I'm very disturbed by the trends I see amongst the antivaxxers, alt med et al to externalise blame ( as I noted elsewhere today):
many of these parents DO have children with severe autism and/ or other disabilities, looking for a scapegoat ( SBM, the government, journalists) isn't going to change their children's situations. The time and money spent chasing after politicos or trying to grab the spotlight on television could be better utilised by directly helping their own children ( therapy, outings, trips, gifts).
I think today Ms Stagliano uses her daughter (in a video) as a prop to demonstrate how 'damaged' she was by external forces, SBM or whatever else she dreams up. I can understand that she wants to illustrate how hard they both try ( which they do) but isn't the unspoken message really: "Look what they did to her!"
-btw- isn't the youngest the unvaccinated one?
I think that you are indeed correct in that anti-vax involves only a small number of parents HOWEVER it's the clustering of the like-minded that scares me ( see esp Swansea, Wales and Marin County).
Perhaps we'll see little enclaves of diisease-prone communities develop - the news shows can create a map that lights up hot spots so people might assiduously avoid them. THAT might be a good advert for vaccines.
I agree in that it is a very small number of parents who are anti-vax, but they are very vocal.
During last November's Congressional Oversight Committee hearing, Rep Carolyn Maloney (D-NY) made the point that she had about 50 letters to her office from parents who claimed their children's autism was caused by vaccines. Given the number of children now diagnosed with ASD, 50 is a microscopic sample of our demographic.
Perhaps we need to write a few letters, too.
Somewhat off topic, but...
Over at Jake's blog, John Best seems to have accidentally posted a screed that shows just how unbalanced Best really is. It may not be up long.
It has The protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion, paranoia, conspiracies, and charges of Congressional bribery (well, maybe a bit of truth to that last one).
Why did Jake publish John Best's comment when it says right at the top, Don't publish this?
Automatic publishing and moderating later?
Wow, there's some serious paranoia going on at Jake's blog.
@Rebecca - I also notice that Jake seems to have no problem publishing comments that say "DO NOT PUBLISH" and include John Best's phone number......
That's not very smart......
Does Dachel really think that Issa can’t be influenced by campaign contributions because he’s rich?
Apparently so. That completely eliminates any claims of Big Pharma corruption since pharmaceutical companies are already rich, so they cannot be motivated a desire to make any more money either. I'm so glad that's all cleared up.
I also noticed Dachel's claim:
Dr. Boyle may not have found time to do a vaccinated/unvaccinated study, but she sent an email to Frank DeStefano at the CDC in 2000 (2 months before Simpsonwood) where she made the clever proposal that if officials wanted to dilute the alarming correlation between the increase in mercury-containing vaccines and the dramatic rise in autism, all they had to do was add one and two year olds---children too young to have an autism diagnosis---and "presto"---no link.
Are the antivaxxers who read this too dumb to click on the link she provided, as I did, and read the email? It says (my emphasis):
Since most of the dx's are generally not picked up until the 2nd or 3rd year of life had you considered eligibility criteria of at least 18 months or 2 years??
Since the rest of the email talks about removing neonates to avoid confounders from the increased risk of developmental disorders in premature babies, it is blindingly obvious to me that Dr. Boyle was suggesting only including older infants, the very opposite of what Dachel claims. I suppose shouldn't be surprised by such blatant dishonesty any more.
I suspect that Best thought all comments to Jake's blog would be moderated. This would be in keeping with anti-vax tradition, and one of the few reasonable ideas to cross Best's mind.
Once Jake wakes up and checks the blog, I suspect the post will go down the memory hole (also in keeping with anti-vax tradition).
The comment is still up now.
I notice that Jake changed "candidate" to "student" in the comments.
@15 - Johnny
I screen capped the comment in case it does disappear down the good ol'memory hole.
Am I the only one who finds it quite telling that Best thought sending a comment to a public blog was the best way to communicate privately when e-mail does not function? The idea of a blog not being heavily moderated must be a terribly foreign idea.
... I guess it should come as no suprising seeing how these people always assume that Orac will not post their comment and/or ban them when they post here.
@15 - Johnny
I screen capped the comment in case it does disappear down the good ol'memory hole.
Am I the only one who finds it quite telling that Best thought sending a comment to a public blog was the best way to communicate privately when e-mail does not function? The idea of a blog not being heavily moderated must be a terribly foreign idea.
... I guess it should come as no suprising seeing how these people always assume that Orac will not post their comment and/or ban them when they post here.
Might it be possible an MD to get a last minute invitation to a congressional hearing? “Our” MD should not have a significant web presence but still be knowledgeable in the tactics of the specific pseudo science the hearing involves.
Issa is well known for a lot of things:
@Johnny - Jake's site is moderated....so he would have had to approve that post, as-is.
Who can forget the Dachelbot's interview with Brian Hooker, where he brags that the Geiers introduced him to Andrew Wakefield. He also brags that Wakefield and he "wined and dined" Congressmen and their wives...multiple times...months before the November, 2012 sham Autism Hearing was announced.
"...My initial thanks go to Dr. Mark Geier and David Geier, who strategically linked me up with a friend of theirs, who in turn has become my good friend as well. Through the work of this individual, Dr. Andrew Wakefield and I were invited to meet with Rep. Darrell Issa, Rep. Vern Buchanan and their wives in early May, 2012 to discuss malfeasance in the CDC regarding autism and vaccines. Andy discussed the MMR vaccine and the vaccine schedule. I talked specifically about thimerosal and the cover-up of CDC data that affirm a causal relationship between thimerosal and neurodevelopmental disorders including autism. Rep. Issa was concerned regarding the CDC information and stated that this was the type of government misconduct that his committee (Oversight and Government Reform) specifically addressed.
I was in DC for a National Science Foundation function later the same month and had the opportunity to meet with Reps. Issa and Buchanan again, this time with Rep. Dan Burton. Rep. Issa affirmed his commitment to hold a hearing at that time. Rep. Burton detailed his valiant efforts to get the CDC and large pharma to remove mercury from vaccines and indicated that they wouldn’t listen to him.
I’ve worked very diligently since May with the Oversight committee staff to convey what I had found via the FOIA and to get additional information from CDC relevant to thimerosal. Along the way, I gained the support of Barry and Dolly Segal, through Focus Autism and they have become pivotal to this entire effort. In addition, I received a very significant amount of assistance from Dawn Loughborough, Bob Krakow, Bobbie Manning and Louise Habakus. They are all amazing sources of insight and have advised me throughout the process. I also need to acknowledge my friends at EBCALA, especially Louis Conte, Rolf Hazlehurst, Becky Estepp and Kevin Barry, who have been working with the committee staff very effectively regarding NVICP reform.
I was able to meet with the Oversight committee staff several times between May and November, up to the day before the hearing, to discuss the pertinent details. I also was corresponding with Beth Clay from SafeMinds who was working very diligently on the issue as well. When the committee staff finally indicated the participants in the panel, I was disappointed because there was only one participating organization (Safeminds) that included the relationship of vaccines (specifically thimerosal) to autism causation within their mission. The rest of the panel would either avoid the issue or deny any causal relationship. Given the importance of autism causation, this was just not a balanced panel...."
Darell Issa bought and paid for by the Geiers, by Wakefield and by Jennifer Larson.
Jake’s site is moderated….so he would have had to approve that post, as-is.
Well, Best's post has been moderated out of existence at this time. Tradition, ya know?
I suspect that the first post for each user at Jake's blog is held until Jake approves it, then all future post from that user post automatically, as does our host on this blog. Best likely had his first held up, didn't know he would then be on the whitelist, and thought Jake would intercept.
I did get a screen grab and text copy while it was up.
@Johnny - you'd think the DO NOT PUBLISH in the first line would have caught someone's attention, don't you think.....
But everyone got Best's phone number, right?
Interesting that Jake is buddies with someone who loudly states that people with Asperger's don't have autism: http://arineeman.blogspot.com/
Interesting that Jake is buddies with someone who loudly states that people with Asperger’s don’t have autism:
Well yeah but John hates vaccines and Jake hates vaccines and they cause the autisticooties so it's all good.
The John Best comment has now disappeared with a remark that people that have been previously approved don't get moderated. John B must have not been aware of his illustrious status.
$40,000 seems a bit low for a Congress critter. Are they responsible for Issa's care and feeding too?
It's $40,000 for a 2h appearance, sounds about right.
Only two hours? I thought the Canary party was going to take him home with them.
"We are thrilled that Rep. Darrell Issa will be holding a...round of... hearings"
Anyone who can say that with a straight face needs to be institutionalized.
Ugh. I went over to Jake's blog and did some reading and read some of the comments. I not only lost brain cells, but I need to go bleach my brain to recover from the stupidity of the commenters.
Only two hours? I thought the Canary party was going to take him home with them.
Prolly costs a lot more to get in bed with him.
Come on. A $40,000 donation doesn’t have that kind of influence.
Dachel seems to be arguing that Issa is easily bought.
Yeah--I'd charge way more to get in bed with Issa. Doubt he could afford me.
$40,000 seems a bit low for a Congress critter.
As is all too common, the scandal-within-a-scandal is that the price is so low.
#3, Chris Hickie, September 18, 2013
Issa’s district extends all the way up to San Clemente (http://wedrawthelines.ca.gov/downloads/meeting_handouts_082011/map_2011…), where none other than Dr. Bob Sears lives. It’s a fair bet to say that Issa has also done some research of his constituency and found either (1) being anti-vaccine by way of this hearing will make him look good and get votes, and/or (2) get even better fundraising draw from his wealthier local backers–something critical when you face an election every 2 years.
Dr Hickie (see, I got your name right this time), the district map you point to is old. The more recent map, linked to from Wikipedia, shows the 49th running up to San Juan Capistrano, where Patrick "Tim" Bolen ('s mailbox) lives. The map isn't clear, and Bolen doesn't publicize the location, but the district may also include that portion of Cleveland National Forest where Bolen pitches his tent.
I don't know where Bob Sears lives, but his office is in the Capistrano Beach section of Dana Point, right across the street (Camino de los Mares) from San Clemente. The rest of the Sears Family Woo Emporium is in San Clemente, however, a few blocks up the street. Dana Point is also in the 49th, so that's just a minor glitch, caught by a guy who lived in SClem for over twenty years.
There's also a big pharmawootical company or two in San Clemente, for what it's worth.
IOW, not only does Issa's constituency include Sears and his woo-peddling family, but also Bolen. Ain't it all fun...
re the November hearing
It should be hilarious in light of recent antics concerning Blaxill, Larson & Co, Jake, Hooker, Bolen etc etc.
Better even than last year's 'mummers' farce'? I cherish the anxious hope that it will!
I also notice that Jake seems to have no problem publishing comments that say “DO NOT PUBLISH” and include John Best’s phone number……
I anticipate that the upcoming "Vaccines" hearing will be pure comedy gold...a regular 4 ring circus with a full complement of clowns.
So John Best is an anti-semite. Now there's a surprise.
So John Best is an anti-semite. Now there’s a surprise
And a Free Energy and Tesla crank as well - about as surprising as Issa being a AGW denialist and having a shady past.
Narad, that is priceless!
Two weeks ago on his blog, Best wrote about how he sent a letter to Mr Putin because Russia removed the thimerisol which turns children into "autistic Zombies". He tells us how to contact Vladimir ourselves.
That entry should have also gone down fthe memory hole but didn't.
Spurred on by my colleague above, I took a peek at Bolen's site and found a new article ( "Treachery") on the awful fix that autism leadership has landed itself into of late-
he mentions Jake's impetus, as well as his own, towards finding a solution but he then focuses upon problem creators rather than problem solvers, setting his sights upon Barry Segal, who sent for him, entertained him and provided him with an expensive dinner- not his usual fare, I suppose.
Am I still banned for telling the truth? Do I need to worry that one of you might learn how to dial a phone? Didn't your allies at Age of Autism advise you not to mention my name?
Behold, a wild chew-toy appears..
Oh, my. This should be fun.
Truth. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Don't worry John - we receive transcripts of your phone calls from the FBI, as part of the regular "Pharma-Shill" care package....
Here's an opportunity for some of you to do something useful instead of abusing babies. http://autismfraud.blogspot.com/2013/09/sign-new-declaration-of-indepen…
Wow - that's Grade A Crazy there John.....good luck with that.
The People hereby terminate the employment of every elected and appointed official in our Federal Government with all monies and benefits due cancelled.
I think this might be my favorite part.
Very good, we see that Adam G might be able to grasp reality. He's probably being facetious but we can't hear his voice to know for sure. Anyhow, he wrote the right words so that's a step in the right direction for anyone from this pack of liars.
10. The People hereby ban the practice of injecting any form of mercury into people and animals with vaccines.
11. The People hereby ban the use of fluoride in drinking water.
12. The People hereby order instruction in all high schools on the history of the Rothschild family, the banking family who tried to enslave the United States via the Federal Reserve.
13. The People hereby order instruction in all high schools on “The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion”, a plan written by the Rothschild family to enslave all of the inhabitants of Earth.
You forgot to mention Colonel Sanders putting an addictive chemical in his chicken that makes you crave it fortnightly, SMARTASS!!
He’s probably being facetious
I hope nobody believes that I actually support any of that utter nonsense.
Thank you, Edith. The nice part about reclaiming our freedom is the fact that we won't have a corrupt government who will have to hire liars to support their propaganda. Then, you too can enjoy your life without writing inhumane garbage to try to convince people to poison their babies. You'll sleep better at night when that sordid chapter in your life is behind you. Thanks for your input.
Mr. Best is spreading his manure on The Poxes blog:
Cripes, does he think we are allied with AoA?
Sorry. Not sure how Best managed to get through the filters. I've fixed that. However, I'm in a perverse mood. I might actually approve some of his comments as long as he doesn't get too crazy (or if he gets so crazy that his comment will be highly entertaining to my readers).
Adam G, When we seize the TV networks from Rothschild, we'll be able to help you learn the real history of the USA and your ignorance will be cured, free of charge. Isn't that great!
we won’t have a corrupt government who will have to hire liars to support their propaganda
12. The People hereby order instruction in all high schools on the history of the Rothschild family...
No, there certainly won't be any propaganda in Best's new America...
Well Mr. Best, as a non-American I'm afraid I can't help you fight your battle. I am forced to live under the tyranny of a government that insists on providing me with publicly funded healthcare (including the eeeveeel vaccines), and thereby denies me the freedom to catch preventable viral infections, spend days in bed feeling dreadful and unable to perform my work or family responsibilities, and never experience the joy of spreading the misery around by infecting others.
How I've survived under the jackboot of healthcare fascism is a testament to the resilience of the human spirit.
Sorry. Not sure how Best managed to get through the filters. I’ve fixed that. However, I’m in a perverse mood. I might actually approve some of his comments as long as he doesn’t get too crazy (or if he gets so crazy that his comment will be highly entertaining to my readers).
Please Do, I was looking forward to hearing about how the Illuminati caused autism.
The Illuminati is actually just a scary word for the Rothschild family but it does entice some people to read the material. Rothschild's agents at the NY Times and UPI sent Kirby and Olmsted to infiltrate groups of sane parents who were trying to cure their children of autism. Then Kirby went on TV to misrepresent the facts about thimerosal and Olmsted helped Kathleen Seidel's character assassination of Mark Geier sound semi-legitimate to functionally illiterate people who believed her lies. Of course, it's more involved than just that so you should probably read the original post a couple of times so you understand it. You can ask questions there since Orac has noted that he's going to censor the truth and will probably ban me again. For some strange reason, he has always been afraid of me.
Here’s an opportunity for some of you to do something useful instead of abusing babies.
Perhaps you'd care to explain the "something useful" part involved in clicking a button on a "petition" with no recipient that is hosted on a site that can't even muster having something appear under "Sponsored Links," aside from giving you a list of names to gaze at.
Anyway, one might sense a bit of frustration brewing with the essentially universal lack of interest in this now stale "Declaration" from last May:
Will you claim your freedom or are you going to keep taking crap from the maggots who infest Washington, D.C.? We can overthrow these criminal bankers and lawyers by the end of the week if we want to. There is something seriously wrong with you if you can look at this and then won't bother signing it.
But, you know, John Best Jr. is not an anti-semite or anything.
Narad, Decent people can only try to educate the brainwashed fools who won't oppose our corrupt government. If we manage to defeat these domestic enemies, we'll be able to help you construct more intelligent replies to this matter than "uh-huh". When we remove the fluoride from your drinking water, the murder of your brain cells will abate and we will help you emerge from your stupor so you can see what freedom really is. This is about all of us uniting to improve our country and I hope you will support that effort.
Lilady: He's definitely confused us with his regular crowd. Unless 'abuse' is a new synonym for help.
JB: Go back to your adoring crowd of baby killers. I'm sure you're still crowing over Alex.
As a Brit I get a little confused by American politics, but I thought John Best's parody was hilarious, especially the part about “The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion” which everyone knows was proven to be a forgery nearly a century ago.
It's a shame John missed out the stuff about the evil government doing a deal with aliens over Roswell, the UN detention camps, the controlled demolition of the Twin Towers, HIV being developed in a laboratory to wipe out blacks and gays, and Obama being a Kenyan goat-herder who was smuggled into America by communists intent on taking everyone's guns away. Perhaps all that would have made the joke too obvious.
I swear, I swear, I** did not summon him from the dark abyss- wherein all hope is abandoned by those who enter within- by simultaneously reciting his name thrice whilst gazing into a mirror backwards and burning a black candle.
** It seems that he appeared after my comments.
Why do things like that ALWAYS happen to me?
Since we know that Rep Issa was already bribed to pretend he was too stupid to understand what was going on with vaccines, we can see that these anti-vaccination critters bribed him a little more to give themselves credibility with the "dumbed down" autism parents who follow them. This makes it easier for controlled opposition groups like the Canary Party to sell out those parents.
As you can see, Best is amusing me right now; so I'm letting his comments through. For now. That could easily change when he takes his inevitable turn to the truly vile, the same sorts of behavior for he was originally banned so long ago. Trust me, it won't take much, and he's on automatic moderate.
Denice Walter . . . thank you for the summons! You must have got my psychic call for a need to laugh. Leave him on for a few more . . . I just made popcorn. *giggles* this is my first John Best experience.
This is about all of us uniting to improve our country and I hope you will support that effort.
You failed to answer the question. Would you like me to type more slowly?
John Best @ 64:
Yada, yada, yada,...Blah, blah, blah,...For some strange reason, he has always been afraid of me.
While Mr. Best is here, perhaps he would be willing to explain why he thinks the US and other governments all over the world would want to poison people with mercury and fluoride. What advantage is there to this and to creating an epidemic of autism? Surely the New World Order want a healthy labor force to keep the wealthy elite in the lifestyles to which they have become accustomed, not one either sick or autistic that isn't as productive.
Rothschild’s agents at the NY Times and UPI sent Kirby and Olmsted to infiltrate groups of sane parents who were trying to cure their children of autism. Then Kirby went on TV to misrepresent the facts about thimerosal and Olmsted helped Kathleen Seidel’s character assassination of Mark Geier sound semi-legitimate to functionally illiterate people who believed her lies. Of course, it’s more involved than just that so you should probably read the original post a couple of times so you understand it.
Where do the reverse vampires come into it?
What now? Links just go back here?
Krebiozen, The obvious advantage to making people extra stupid is to cause them to keep choosing between democrats and republicans so Rothschild can have those bribed liars in place to help him rob all of us through the IRS and his bogus banking scams. Wealthy MDs and Merck scientists would benefit greatly by not having to pay any taxes at all. If Congress issued our money, instead of Rothschild, there would be no more debt as all loans would be interest-free. The government could spend whatever they need on social programs, infrastructure and "entitlements" just by printing the cash and nobody would have to pay anything back. That's the way is was before 1913.
As this freedom from theft by bankers would lower everyone's greed, Pharma companies could be taught to actually invent drugs that benefit society instead of selling useless junk that masks symptoms and doesn't cure anything.
Autism was just some unfortunate collateral damage in the process of "dumbing down" the public with mercury. Then they had to cover it up and play games that weren't part of the original plan. The Georgia Guidestones tell us that they want a global population of 500 million. That's no "conspiracy theory". Making people stupid with mercury to kill brain cells and fluoride to make them docile makes it easier for them to reduce the population. The masses are too docile to fight back. But, they are "smart" enough to argue with each other in places like this which prevents them from addressing the real problems. I know that all of you secretly want to sign the new Declaration of Independence to have a better life for yourselves. But, you're committed to destroying babies' lives instead. Maybe some of you will wake up. I'm here to help you understand the big picture even though I know most of you are too deep into the quagmire to see the other side.
Ah, the stars must all be in alignment that I get to read John Best without having to slime my computer by visiting his website.
John: tell us how you get fluoride out of water. I grew up in an area where the NATURAL water (artisan wells, etc) had high fluoride levels. In fact so high, the water companies used to *remove* fluoride from water to keep the levels at minimum.
I love conspiracy nuts. They are so much fun to read. And JB has just improved over the years. It takes longer for the crazy to come out.
And I believe that there is a full moon tonight...
IIRC, a wise person** remarked here several months ago that the antivax/ autism groups arrayed themselves neatly into 3 categories that varied in regard to their degree of reality orientation ( some, little, least).
We are currently being entertained by a denizen of the most outre*** of those groups.
** verily, the Great Dark Lord of Journalism himself.
*** probably also Jake and Tim reside there.
Ah, the stars must all be in alignment that I get to read John Best....
Oh wow. Take back my joke. Pure evil.
@Scared Momma: as long as you don't take John seriously, he's not that evil. Personally, I think of him as a small, very yappy dog. Lots of noise, no real danger. He takes himself very seriously. Just don't visit his blog often if you value brain cells.
@ MI Dawn, thanks for the heads up, I don't have many brain cells left, so I will avoid his site. ;) I was just referring to Narad's 'Savage' link, about this Best person's sick obsession with attacking LB/RB writers' daughter.
@ Scared Momma: Did you notice how Best claims he makes money by handicapping horse races at Belmont and Aqueduct Raceways...yet his blog claims that he is a financial advisor?
Apparently Mr Best has failed to learn about the Flynn Effect....
Apparently Mr. Best also has failed to learn about the Dunning-Kruger Effect... or much of anything else. I skimmed his 'declaration', and wished I hadn't, it was so vile.
@lilady . . . ok, really. Obviously this person has something very wrong with them, many examples, but who admits to making money off of horses then the same breath is a financial advisor?! People give out way too much information these days lol I honestly don't know how you stand up to them lilady. These are not sane people, 'some, little or least', I couldn't do what you do day after day!
@ Denice Walter . . . new idea for a book. I have only been reading comments here for a few months, but isn't it amazing how people's personalities show through their comments? You could capture each of them and weave a tale. Lilady, paladin, of course . . . you yourself could be the witty narrator. Just a thought :)
I'll say this, mr. best's idiocy will provide me some good material to show my coworkers, as a prefect example of conspiracy theory mongering and the mindset of a anti-vaxxer.
At least by showing them examples of their mindset, I've convinced many of them, as well as the hospital that I volunteer at, that the anti-vax side is deluded and ultimately dangerous.
Ummm, I got a content warning trying to find his blog. Wow.
#78 Reverse vampires? What do they do, spit up blood onto you?
#80 " I know that all of you secretly want to sign the new Declaration of Independence to have a better life for yourselves."
Great shades of DJT!
Do all crazy... er... sorry. Do all differently-sane people think this way?
Hey Orac, Thanks for having me. Maybe I'll check back again some day. Maybe not.
Can I haz some popcorn pretty please?
Ah, the stars must all be in alignment
And when the stars are right
He locks the door behind the door behind the door...
The Georgia Guidestones tell us that they want a global population of 500 million. That’s no “conspiracy theory”
I'm guessing that these are marginally less authentic than the Kensington Runestone.
I keep trying to read John Best's comments, but am constantly distracted by the droning "Sleep! Sleep! Sleep!" coming from the speakers I can only see when I put on my special sunglasses...
"The government could spend whatever they need on social programs, infrastructure and “entitlements” just by printing the cash and nobody would have to pay anything back. That’s the way is was before 1913."
No, it wasn't. This was the way that German handled itself after WWI and the way Zimbabwe is doing it now. The result? A devaluation. You had to use millions of German marks to buy a loaf of bread. You have to use millions of Zimbabwean dollars for, say, a home. Though, Zimbabwe does keep changing the denomination of their dollar. Maybe our Congress can do the same if they keep printing money with no value to it, like you suggest?
I know that all of you secretly want to sign the new Declaration of Independence to have a better life for yourselves.
Great shades of DJT!
Do all crazy… er… sorry. Do all differently-sane people think this way?
If you-know-who ever returns, I for one will take great pleasure in linking him to this and letting him figure out that this is how sane his "I know you actually agree with me even if you can't admit it!" riff makes him sound...
Obviously, John never met a crazy he didn't like.
@ Scared Momma:
I again thank you for your kind words.
But you see, if I wrote books then I wouldn''t have time to expose unseemly alt med/ woo to the light of day in a hopefully entertaining manner. I also counsel people, manage investments, play tennis and take care of two slightly off-kilter gentlemen and a very large, demanding cat.
And now, hot off the wire:
( @ TMR) Lisa Goes , the Rev, champions a Ms Gianelloni whose blog 'educates' readers about what really caused recent measles outbreaks- it appears that this post had 200K views and hundreds of comments- many of them in opposition and obviously written by pharma shills posing as concerned parents. She links to the post.
Goes, as you'll remember, is amongst the AoA/ TMR regulars who "assisted" Alex prior to his untimely death.
Some people can't take a hint, huh.
And Mike Adams ( @ Natural News) has been blathering on interminably about TED talks and science.
Shills and Minions:
I have never felt so left out. Honestly, I spend half my time on this dreary backwater listening to the likes of the Rothschilds, Windsors, Grimaldis, Sauds, etc. argue about who is the most evil and exactly which family is the biggest "sellout." The Rothschilds always insist that it's them. Well, this Best character is only going to make them more impossible to deal with.
Well, what about me? What am I, chopped flenk already? I spend endless orbital cycles being as evil as possible, our vats churn out vast quantities of stupefying vaccines. My medical minions jab and poke your soft, mewling hatchlings, pushing needles into their soft, creamy flesh for maximum pain. My fleet of airliners spray chemtrails like our MonkeyMist™ soporific daily. I do all this and not one mention?
I am one unhappy Overlord, shills and minions, one unhappy Overlord . . .
Lord Draconis Zeneca, VH7ihL
Forward Mavoon of the Great Fleet, Pharmaca Magna of Terra, Babysitter of the Illuminati
Glaxxon PharmaCOM Terrabase: Villefranche sur mer
That's an interesting question.
If you look at the written productions of SMI people there are often hallmarks like idiosyncratic language use, neologisms, fixed ideas, loose/ distant associations, reification of abstractions, mystic/ quasi- religious themes etc. but one of the most important features commonly noted is a lack of concern for the needs of the audience- it's more like a recital rather tnan an interchange of ideas.
You'll notice a similar feature in woo/ alt med wherein the writer often assumes a particularly cloying omniscient stance solemnly "informing" the audience about the Truth- no questions entertained- delivered *ex cathedra* as if "I am I and I know all. Deal with it."
Similarly, alt med dismisses external evidence like data and research as "flawed" or "tampered with" because outside material cannot shake a firmly held, emotionally-laden belief that may form the foundations of personal identity as well as of career choice. Nothing you can say could convince many of them ( see anti-vaxxers ).
While I'm not saying that altie beliefs are the same as SMI, I think that both reflect thought based more on internal needs and idiosyncratic meanings than on external perceptions, evidence and meanings arrived at by social consensus.
Most people learn to shape and allign their own personal internal reality with that of the world and other people.
I can't resist responding to this from JB:
Pharma companies could be taught to actually invent drugs that benefit society instead of selling useless junk that masks symptoms and doesn’t cure anything.
Drug companies are already doing their best to to invent drugs that benefit society, since these are the products that sell. No drug company wants a safety (or efficacy) scandal about their product that costs them billions, they want their products to be safe and effective so doctors will prescribe them instead of their competitors' products.
Big Pharma conspiracy nuts always make the mistake of thinking Big Pharma is a single entity. It isn't, it's a collection of thousands of companies who would cut each other's throats to get ahead in the market.
If a drug company invented a drug that cured breast cancer, for example, they could make a killing on the market and put their competitors out of business. Having worked in biomedical sciences for decades, and having been involved in numerous drug trials, I have never seen any hint that the sort of conspiracy JB describes exists.
Autism was just some unfortunate collateral damage in the process of “dumbing down” the public with mercury. Then they had to cover it up and play games that weren’t part of the original plan.
Except we know beyond any reasonable doubt that mercury doesn't cause autism. In any case, mercury would be an extremely ineffective way of dumbing down the public, since mercury poisoning has a large number of other symptoms, many of which are very obvious. It would be almost as useless for this purpose as fluoride, which doesn't have the sedative effects I have seen ascribed to it (presumably people are confusing it with bromide)*.
I can think of a dozen chemicals that would be more effective if the NWO really did want to poison 'the masses' like this, and that would be tasteless, odorless and much harder to detect. Sadly, it seems to me that large portions of 'the masses' are already quite dumb enough, and need no help from chemicals.
* The symptoms of mercury poisoning include emotional lability, the 'madness' that it is well-known to cause. Fluoride poisoning has peripheral nervous system effects but no reported CNS effects, though acutely it can chelate calcium, leading to hypocalcemia, which can affect the CNS, as can death from heart block, I suppose.
“The government could spend whatever they need on social programs, infrastructure and “entitlements” just by printing the cash and nobody would have to pay anything back. That’s the way is was before 1913.”
Ask Jefferson Davis how well that worked for him.
Hmmmm.....printing unlimited amounts of money without any backing....yeah, that's worked really well in the past (read about the Weimar Republic, the CSA, or Argentina).
Someone has no idea how economies or currency systems work...
Aren't conspiracy cranks like this Best chap usually all about the full-reserve banking and the gold standard?
I've seen reports that claim baking soda, possibly mixed with other stuff, can cure cancer. If true, would this be likely to cause distress to doctors who chop off breasts for profit? Would they tell the truth if it meant an end to their income?
I don't see any other disingenuous comments that are worth replying to.
Interestingly enough, alt media woo-meisters ( Adams, Null) also advocate a return to the gold standard amongst other retro-chic economic measures. Both advised that followers put money into precious metals in the wake of the financial crisis and take their money out of banks and the market- Null features Gerald Celente's prognostications whilst Mikey has shown the work of one Porter Stansberry.
Yes, THAT Porter Stansberry.
If people had followed the advise these loons delivered in 2009, they'd have lost their shirts..
had followed the ADVICE
I’ve seen reports that claim baking soda, possibly mixed with other stuff, can cure cancer.
Then please do me a huge favour and apply this "cure" to yourself if/when diagnosed with cancer and report back.
You know, reasoning with John Best is like reasoning with a doll on batteries. the doll always output the same sentences.
I just posted on this article about Dr. Bob Sears.
Yeah, I "mentioned" Dr. Bob's deliberately unvaccinated patient who was identified as the "index patient" responsible for the 2008 San Diego Measles outbreak.
Well, I give JB credit for one thing, he pointed me towards something I'd never heard of before, the Georgia Guidestones. And come to think of it, I guess I can give him credit for a second thing: Whoever it is whose ideas for a perfect world are written on that monument, I really don't want to live under a government run by them. The principles are both too specific (why 500,000,000? why that number specifically?) and too vague (truth, beauty, love, great, but who gets to define what does and doesn't qualify?)
Of course, if JB can't figure out that money is only worth what you can trade it for, and merely printing more bills won't give the government any more buying power, I'm not suprised he hasn't asked himself, "If the Georgia Guidestones were set up by the New World Order, how come they never even got finished? What exactly is there to fear from a conspiracy that can't even manage to follow through on a monument?"
I’ve seen reports that claim baking soda, possibly mixed with other stuff, can cure cancer
I've seen reports that there's a bridge in Brooklyn for sale, too.
Not surprisingly, JB dismisses as "disingenuous" the comments pointing out that there is not one single historical instance of a government staying solvent by printing unlimited amounts of currency. His grasp of economics is as profound as his understanding of chemistry, epidemiology and history, obviously.
The lunatic doth protest too much, methinks.
What must it be like to pretend as hard as John Best does? I can't think of another reason for why he insists that everyone else is lying about their views. Projection, etc.; Denice? Am I on to something?
You have to use millions of Zimbabwean dollars for, say, a home.
It's vastly worse than that. A million Zimbabwean dollars would not even buy you lunch. They finally "solved" the problem by officially discontinuing their own currence and permitting the use of foreign currency, in particular the US dollar, which is relatively stable. They are actually not the only country to have used that strategy, though it has some weaknesses; chief among them is that although they can import enough US dollars to meet demand, they can't import coinage, so making change is a curious enterprise.
Shay @ #106:
Darn it, you beat me to the punch!
And I'm glad to see that there's more than one American Civil War buff on this website. Greetings from Dixie!
The key to economics is controlling the issuance of the money. Now, all money is issued as a debt to Rothschild. After you watch The Money Masters by Bill Still, you'll understand how you're all being robbed. The Fed violates article 1, section 8 which states that Congress shall have the power to coin (issue) money. Note that it doesn't say that Congress can give this power to the Rothschild family so they can rob us. Feel free to continue with the character assassination if you like. If you don't like being robbed though, remember that I came here to help you, and decent people too. Pharma whores and their victims need to unite against the banks for now. Then, we can go back to beating on each other after the bankers stop robbing all of us, or you could start acting like humans.
his treatment should not be used for more than three weeks at a time. During the first week no more than two TEAspoons a day of baking soda should be taken orally. During the second and third week no more than one TEAspoon a day of baking soda should be taken orally. Only under the care of a medical practitioner should these maximum internal doses be exceeded.
For skin cancers and other external cancers (inlcuding a rectal enema), where the baking soda solution comes into direct contact with the cancer, this restriction does not apply.
Cancers are fungi? Whiskey Tango Foxtrot...
I guess you could say that- seeing projection as an unconscious, emotional self protective mechanism but...
perhaps many of those who employ it are limited in social cognition and cannot imagine any other person's mind- or MO- as functioning in any other way than in how their own does.
e.g. if a woo-meister only looks to profit margins and calls pharma or SBM "money hungry"- is it projection to protect a fragile ego or a mis-understanding of how people generally operate in the world- i.e. not every one is the same or solely motivated by profit?
Possibly is it a way to call others out before they say the same about you? A sort of disruptive camouflage, maybe?
I don’t see any other disingenuous comments that are worth replying to.
Thus doth one apprehend precſiſely the ſort of Mettle demand'd of he that dare, thro' Petition of none leß than Thin-air Itſself, deliver forth a Writ compelling Uſufruct of the long-occulted Boſom of Liberty. Should Ethan Allen been so gifted by Providence, Ticonderoga would have marched rather to him.
I know that all of you secretly want to sign the new Declaration of Independence to have a better life for yourselves.
You still haven't explained how that works. Moreover, why should it be your New Declaration? I mean, that's not exactly how it worked with the original. Maybe somebody else has a better one.
A man sometimes starts up a patriot, only by disseminating discontent, and propagating reports of secret influence, of dangerous counsels, of violated rights, and encroaching usurpation. This practice is no certain note of patriotism. To instigate the populace with rage beyond the provocation, is to suspend publick happiness, if not to destroy it. He is no lover of his country, that unnecessarily disturbs its peace.—Dr. Johnson
I’ve seen reports that claim baking soda, possibly mixed with other stuff, can cure cancer. If true, would this be likely to cause distress to doctors who chop off breasts for profit? Would they tell the truth if it meant an end to their income?
If that were true, which sadly it isn't, drug companies would be battling to find out exactly what dose and what "other stuff" to mix it with to have its maximum effect before their competitors did.
Those in the know would be using it to treat themselves and their loved ones. Doctors who use it, like Simoncini, would have left a trail of cured cancer patients across Europe and would now be sporting a Nobel prize. Instead he left a trail of corpses across Europe, was convicted of homicide, disbarred from practicing medicine and was last heard of working with a UFO hunter in Mexico.
Perhaps we should club together and have the truth about vaccines, conventional medicine and galloping inflation carved on a rock, and then JB would be compelled to believe it.
What exactly is there to fear from a conspiracy that can’t even manage to follow through on a monument?
It's an odd conspiracy that pays stone-masons to carve its objectives on whopping great slabs of stone for maximum publicity.
Krebozien: It's a nice idea, but I don't think it'd work.
The government could spend whatever they need on social programs, infrastructure and “entitlements” just by printing the cash and nobody would have to pay anything back. That’s the way is was before 1913.
Before 1913 (I assume he means before income tax), the government's only sources of revenue were customs duties and the so-called "Internal Revenue"—taxes on alcohol and tobacco. They were only allowed to print as much money as they took in. There were numerous business slowdowns due to shortness of the money supply. They covered the shortfall by selling off the western 2/3 of the country—the undivided patrimony of the American people—to the robber barons for pennies an acre.
Once they determined there was no gold on it, they would sell it off at a small profit—that's how we wound up with all these mostly unoccupied square states, each with two senators and two more electoral votes than their population would entitle them to. That's why we're a failed state today.
In 1913, the federal government finally got a source of revenue that allowed them to print enough money to cover the needs of business. You'd expect "business" to be grateful, but no—if it were up to them, all the government's sources of revenue would be eliminated. How they figure their money would be worth anything after that, I don't know, but expecting sanity from the right wing has been proven a fool's errand long before now.
And oh yes: between 1865 and at least the Panic of '93, the government's sole monetary goal was to maximize deflation, so that the war loans "business" made to the federal government in inflated Civil War dollars would be paid back in progressively more valuable dollars.
Interestingly enough, alt media woo-meisters ( Adams, Null) also advocate a return to the gold standard amongst other retro-chic economic measures. Both advised that followers put money into precious metals in the wake of the financial crisis and take their money out of banks and the market
We had one of those goldbuggers pop up in NZ headlines a few weeks ago because he no longer had the money to pay the mortgage on his NZ property (despite selling books titled "Protecting Yourself in the Coming Depression"). He turns out to be a staunch libertarian, storming out in a huff because the NZ govt. was not subsidising his business activities, and taking the opportunity to condemn the idiots in charge.
@ herr doktor:
It seems that selling these "surviving the oncoming crash/ depression/ economic meltdown/ environmental disaster/ police state/ societal collapse/ gang warfare/ mass starvation/ armageddon/ ragnarok" ( choose one) is all the rage. tons of this on the alt media I survey.
Here's the irony: these woo-meisters often lecture that stress causes various illnesses ( therefore learn to meditate- "here's my helpful guide") HOWEVER they continuously ramp up fear and needlessly scare people into attending their lectures, buying their tapes or books and going to retreats that do PRECISELY that- cause more stress and worry.
Then, I guess they could always sell you supplements and juicers to repair the damage.
AND they say SBM manufactures illness!
@HDB - thank you for sharing that heartwarming story. I always enjoy tales of Randroid douchebags falling victim to their own hubris. I note that like most of his ilk, Mr. Davidson believes that his success was all his own doing and his failure was other people's fault. NZ is well rid of him.
Mr. Davidson believes that his success was all his own doing and his failure was other people’s fault.
I liked the part where he explained that he was welching on his creditors and not paying his employees because it is too hard to make money in NZ. Since he has no intention of paying any taxes on money he makes, it was not clear why anyone else should care.
It’s a nice idea, but I don’t think it’d work.
But how is a self-respecting conspiracy nut to decide which mysterious rock inscriptions (or 19th century documents) to take seriously? I suppose the only way is to trust your preconceptions, prejudices and the dogma you have been fed by Alex Jones et al. Whatever you do, don't think for yourself!
No no no! Not rock inscriptions but pristine, stainless steel tablets laser inscribed with letters that appear somewhat alien-ish ( or perhaps like runes) but which somehow can be read by 21st Century quasi-literate quasi-English speakers.
And maybe a prophet or prophetess or two to go with them.
Don't at me, I'm already booked until 2020.
Don't LOOK at me.
Don’t LOOK at me.
Ah, such is life when the brain is much faster than the fingers. I also have the same problem.
OK, at least I found some criticism here which is a lot more than I can say for the morons from Age of Autism. Since the new DoI is perfect in every respect, I know that you all see that and will help reclaim our freedom. Thanks for your support.
Not rock inscriptions but pristine, stainless steel tablets laser inscribed with letters that appear somewhat alien-ish ( or perhaps like runes) but which somehow can be read by 21st Century quasi-literate quasi-English speakers.
A modern version of the Mormons? Far too imaginative for the conspiracy folks methinks. I was referring to the Georgia Guidestones on which JB thinks the Illuminati (accidentally?) revealed their secret plans for world domination.
However, that reminds me of a tale a Mormon ex-colleague and friend told me. Apparently when they become priests and are sewn into their underwear, they attend a ceremony dressed entirely in white - white suit, white tie, white shoes etc.. At my friend's inauguration, one of the other guys had a serious nosebleed. You can imagine the mess...
By the way, my friend was on a serious spiritual quest for years, and then came across the Mormons and has apparently been blissfully content ever since. It seems extremely weird to me, but if it makes him happy, who am I to argue? I have a soft spot for the Mormons, what with the golden tablets, angels and Jesus living in America, it makes the religion I was raised in look extremely dull (it was the Church of England, so that's not difficult I admit).
Also, when the South Park guys took the p!ss out of them by putting on The Book of Mormon, instead of sending in the lawyers, as the Scientologists would undoubtedly have done, they put advertisements for the religion in the show's program. Classy.
or you could start acting like humans.
Don't be insulting.
John Best, let me tell you a joke.
A guy comes home from work and says "What's for dinner?"
His wife says "Oh, I bought a pizza for each of us at the store and cooked it according to the directions. Do you want yours cut into four slices, or eight?"
He says "Four, of course! I'd never be able to eat eight!"
Do you understand why this joke is funny? Do you understand how silly it is for the man to think cutting the pizza into a different number of slices changes how much pizza there is?
Okay, now consider this. You're telling us that if the government doesn't have enough buying power to pay for all the social programs it should have, it should just print more money.
How does printing more money to represent the government's buying power change the government's buying power? Hint: it doesn't.
I think we need more trolls.
Are we sure this is the real John Best? I mean, the touting of this new "DoI" is really funny and I was ROTFL while I was reading the "new DoI". We all know he doesn't have a humerous bone in his body, so this must not be him.
Speaking of trolls, what became of the Most eGREGious One?
One thing I always wonder about these conspiracy theorists. Why do they post under their real names? If they really believe that they are exposing some malevolent organization, why are they giving the organization exactly the information they need to eliminate them?
Are we sure this is the real John Best?
I have the same suspicion. There's not enough foam at the lips on this one.
Denice,don't poke the bear.
Hey guys. Show a little *respect* for JB, a former Presidential and Senate candidate:
I think Mr Best really needs to read a good, basic history of the Confederacy. Because that's exactly the kind of road to nowhere we'd be heading down should the US adopt his poor excuse for a "DoI".
And seriously, that man needs medical attention. He sounds like a schizophrenic to me.
@ Lucario: You haven't heard about JB's many creepy crawly activities. He's lower than pond scum and vicious as well. Just ignore him and he will go away.
Krebiozen, The secrets for world domination are spelled out in "The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion".
Antaeus, When money is created as a means of exchange rather than as debt, there is no debt. I hope that's not too complicated for you. If you evolve through reading to understand the issue, you may then try to grasp a society where no money is needed at all. Of course, we understand that it will be a slow process to allow those trapped by monetary slavery to slowly accept this part of our evolution.
^ That's because I generally don't go to that sort of website - it just makes me want to trash my room in anger and brood with revenge fantasies (not good).
So, lilady, what all has Mr. Best engaged in that is of negative moral character?
Lucario: I am hesitant to put up any more information about JB, because it is so vile. Just ignore him.
Lucario, I wrote the truth. Some people equate that with lack of character. These people sometimes claim that heads is tails and then reveal that they're in need of some restraint. The right thing to do is to love them and offer help.
Lucario: Since when has Florida been sane?
It always comes down to "It's the JOOOOOOOOOS" with these people. Why is that?
Well then, is there a link to a (reasonably sane) website where I can learn more about this fellow's breaches of moral character? This fellow's vile convictions must be exposed to the light for all to see.
If you ignore people like that, they won't go away. History is the judge of that.
@Lucario - I think a Google search will bring up a number of his older posts.....anyone that believes that "the Elders of Zion" is a factual document is already so far down the rabbit hole, but Mr. Best has gone probably further than most crazies - I don't think there is a single conspiracy theory has hasn't met & made part of his hysteria.....
John Best's greatest hits,
This is very old now, and he's gotten worse since then, but it will give you a flavor of the man.
Even if all current debts were wiped out and we started afresh, so that all transactions started as "exchange" rather than "debt" - and even assuming we passed draconian laws forbidding any sort of exchange where the good, service, or currency representing such was not profferred immediately at the time of the transaction, as allowing any such delay would create debt...
... the government still can't make buying power magically appear from nowhere, just by printing money. That's because markets adjust themselves to conditions. If people found out "Oh, the government has just doubled the amount of money in circulation; instead of 1 billion in currency out there, there's now 2 billion," everyone would just say "oh, well, whatever I have to sell, I'd better start asking twice the price for it!" They'd have to, because everyone else would be asking twice the price for what they were selling. The only way such a thing wouldn't happen is if you mandated some sort of government control of trade, actively forbidding anyone from charging what the market will bear.
That's your idea of perfect government, JB? One that maintains draconian control over all of its citizens' economic transactions? Somehow I don't think it is.
... I should have read the link to JB's Greatest Hits before replying.
Krebiozen, The secrets for world domination are spelled out in “The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion”.
That document was exposed as a forgery almost 100 years ago. The evidence that it is a forgery is overwhelming. Only someone so brainwashed by anti-Semitic dogma that they are incapable of independent thought on the subject (Adolf Hitler for example) would take it for a real historic document. Why would I take anyone who believes that BS seriously? Particularly when that same person has demonstrably delusional ideas about the effects of mercury and fluoride poisoning?
Also, when the Government prints money, which is a currency of exchange in JB's utopia, what precisely are they exchanging for it?
The Protocols were confirmed to be legitimate 100 years ago by Army intelligence. Everyone who has read them since that time also confirms them as legitimate. I know that people here are under contract to disavow the truth so it would be foolish to argue with those people while they're "in character".
The true value in our money is our labor. That won't change. The greed that was foisted upon all of us by bankers will gradually wane and we'll be able to love each other instead of grubbing for dollars. When that evolutionary certainty comes to pass, money will have no meaning and it will not be needed or wanted by anyone. The thing about our labor that will change is that useless professions related to profiteering will vanish and those people will be able to engage in pursuits that benefit society. That will put propaganda wizards out of work too and they will be able to re-enter the realm of humanity with forgiveness for their greed induced poor choices. Love to all.
It sounds like JB is a dyed-in-the-wool communist, doesn't it?
In the past few years, I've witnessed what occurs when alt med and pseudo-economics mate and bring forth issue: and it hasn't been pretty. ( see Natural News, PRN- who have featured Stansberry and Celente, respectively).
At heart, alt med/ antivax and pseudo-economics both provide people, who feel that they have been grievously shortchanged by life while others have been rewarded, easy answers and an external source on which to cast blame, the accursed powers-that-be as well as a means of remediation- either legal, legislative or revolutionary.
On the economic front, alt med folk have managed to tie in the theme of pharmatocracy wherein the government, SBM and pharma corporations are intimately co-mingled and equally guilty enablers. If you listen to/ read altie health shows/ sites you're liable to hear political rhetoric as well ( see also TMR, the Canary Party).
It should be noted that our faux economists have newsletters for sale which promote their theories and give investment advice . Stansberry has already been neatly eviscerated ( see Brian Deer) and Celente has been brought to sceptics' attention here and elsewhere, by... uh... well, me.
These guys make money by scaring people into buying their advice: at the depths of the Great Recession, Celente advised followers ( via PRN and his own Trends Journal) to get out of the market and banks. He told people to put their money into precious metals or rural land because things would get even worse. Can you imagine if a person took their investments out of stocks, bonds and banks and put it entirely into silver and gold? Or farmland?
They would have lost out. I did the precise opposite and have recovered all of my losses and have made even more money since March, 2009. Don't believe me, google some charts.
Yet he is predicting major calamities and economic armegeddons that are on the way and total collapse " within 24 months"- which he has been saying repetitiously for several years now. This message is also frequently heard on alt media woo-casting where food shortages, food contamination and societal breakdown are worked into the mix: then they sell you seeds, 40-day emergency meals, water filtration systems and educational material ( see NN and PRN).
Forecasting the end of Big Business and Big Government is actually a rather big business on its own.
Another comment left by JB on Jake's blog, yesterday:
John Best on September 21, 2013 at 3:15 pm said:
Jake, Do you know that all of the “debate” about autism is a trap? It causes all of us to waste our time arguing with each other instead of addressing our 100% corrupt Congress. If we had any honest members of Congress, this would’ve been over years ago. I think we did have two honest members but they’re retired now. None of the other scumbags will ever tell the truth so it’s up to the people to throw them all out and take back our freedom.
Yes, it’s useful to expose liars like Olmsted and Kirby but that’s also part of the trap. Where do you turn for leadership after you enlighten their victims? Is anyone else in the autism community acknowledging the DUTY that Thomas Jefferson gave us to “throw off such government”? Does anyone in the autism community understand the big picture of how all of our freedoms have been usurped? Do they understand that our Freedom of Speech was abolished by TV? Do they know that we have to unite the whole country to seize the TV networks from the bankers who own them so we can tell everyone the truth? Do any autism parents know how easy it is to do this if they can wrest themselves away from the control of the liars who lead them?
Our Declaration of Independence does not tell us that taking back control of our corrupt government is an option that we can exercise if we feel like it. It tells us that doing so is our right as Americans. More important, it tells that we have that DUTY. That’s our job as citizens of this once free country.
As long as parents listen to liars who never tell them these things, they are being led to lose. That’s what controlled opposition leaders do. They lie all the time, every word out of their mouths. They can tell you the truth about autism while lying like Hell by not telling you how to solve the problem. The solution lies in obeying Thomas Jefferson, the only man who ever defeated the Rothschild family. For those who might not know, the Rothschild family bought the USA in 1913 by blackmailing Woodrow Wilson and paying the blackmail for him of $40,000 to force Wilson to sign the Federal Reserve Act. Thee Fed than enslaved everyone in the USA with debt and bribed every member of Congress to keep their mouths shut. If you don’t believe this, you need to ask questions and do some reading. In the meantime, you can reclaim our lost freedom by promoting this and causing everyone to unite for freedom simply by signing their names.
It’s just that simple and every controlled opposition leader will oppose this. That’s one way to tell they’re liars. If they won’t help promote freedom, they’re the enemy.
A lawsuit against JB. I don't know if the lawsuit has been settled, but JB is judgement "execution-proof", because he has not assets and is probably unemployed/unemployable.
Jake, Do you know that all of the “debate” about autism is a trap?
I don't know why he bothers to qualify this. Given that Best is demonstrably unequipped even to simulate debating, I'd think the form of exchange would represent a "trap" in and of itself.
A lawsuit against JB. I don’t know if the lawsuit has been settled....
I certainly hope not, regardless of the fact that Best was on the receiving end. That's a preposterous excuse for a libel suit.
Both woo and economic catatrophising require conspiracy theories in order to explain why this brilliance, not to mention the revealed Truth, is not accepted by the mainstream or by experts ( SBM, realistic economists).
Here's another way to look at it:
these mythologists know little and their audiences know less thus they can pull the wool over followers' eyes by using conspiracies to mask their own LACK of expertise as they drag out their varous cargo cults. Often I hear unfeasible economics proselytised to adoring listeners who haven't an inkling that they're being told fictions.
But this is the Age of Information, you tell me, can't listeners/ readers just look things up? Right, but pseudo-scientists have that covered by prepping their audience to believe that experts can't be trusted, the government lies and the media is bought and paid for by entrenched interests.
Sometimes I think that the general audience that follows this dreck might actually be smarter than some of the purveyors of said dreck but are forbidden to question it.
My own remedy is this message:
your altie gurus tell you to question everyone else's motives, why don't you question their own?
They might tell you that they're in it because they're humanitarians, educators and suchlike.. if you believe that experts, the government and the media are all intractibly corrupt WHAT MAKES THESE GUYS ANY DIFFERENT?
Why trust them? Because they tell you they're above suspicion: anyone can say that. If the entire world runs by conspiracy to bilk others what exempts them?
Voluntarily dismissed, claiming "that matter has been settled" [sic], October 26.
I ran the "confirmed by Army Intelligence 100 years ago" past my other sister (the one who actually was, y'know, in Army Intelligence, not the one who was in the Navy. Yes, my mother had the recruiters on speed-dial. I have six brothers and sisters. If we wanted to go to college, Uncle Sugar was going to have to pay for it) and she was flabbergasted..
"There are still people out there who believe that ****?" was the gist of her response.
#167 Actually, one minor correction--farmland is selling for historically high prices in at least a few places, so anyone investing in that could potentially have done very well indeed.
Depending on location and quality of the land.
Sure, in specific locales. Some cities have done really well too. Gold and silver did appear to be going through the roof... for a while.
However the markets recovered and the streets are not filled with freedom fighting citizens against the forces of fascism ( western governments) in the streets and gangs haven't yet taken over suburbia which reels in a massive food shortage. And China's actions haven't devalued western currencies yet.
Perhaps in "24 months".
Can you explain why the housing investment sector is so cheap?
I mean, I have a condo which is building near the entrance of my street and base price for a 3 and a half is 165 000$ with over 1500$ / year condo fees while I have found out on remax USA that a similar condo is 69 500$ with 414$ of condo fees.
Another comment left by JB on Jake’s blog, yesterday:
I had always thought Jake was misguided, but otherwise a more or less bright lad. But it will be interesting to see how Jake responds to Best.
If Jake embraces Best and his crazy, he will find himself further marginalized, and if he disassociates himself from Best, Best will turn on him. Jake can't ignore Best, because Best won't go away on his own. Best will keep bringing the crazy to Jake's blog, because that's what he does. Jakes blog will be filled Best brain droppings, and Jake will loose what small readership he has. Jake will have to embrace the crazy (either outright or by default), or be a target of it.
Real estate prices are all about location**, more than about material, size or design. If it's located in a central city where business is thriving, it's going to be expensive or if it has a great view or is at in resort area, the same.
Large cities are notorious for wild prices. NY and London are quite insane. In your case, I imagine that you compared a good area in a city ( in Quebec) with a poorer area in a city or town ( US). If you compared similar condos in NY city, you would find something quite startling. Similarly any large city that is not in the throes of a financial or other crisis.
You don't want to know what 800 sq ft cost around here. Or a tiny house. Or what rent is.
** actually it's :LOCATION! LOCATION! LOCATION!!!!!
Just for Alain:
I searched for " 3 room condo NYC" and was directed to the Oodle Market place:
prices varied - 179K USD can buy a place in a poor or bad area, 450 K- 800K in nicer areas and 1 million plus( and 5, 6 million) for exclusive areas.
I'm under NDA and this may be for a job in computer but it may be safe to say that it isn't California or NYC though I may also end up in silicon valley someday.
As an addendum, I will be able to disclose the place next year.
#176 Big locales, though--I'd attribute a lot of it to the escalating corn prices, but there've been *incredibly* high land prices in the Midwest. I guess that's a specific locale, but it's still a pretty big one.
If you can grow corn on it, it's worth a lot of money right now. I don't know how long that'll last now that ethanol is being made from cellulose and sugar beets, but we'll see, I guess.
Of course- however you're being realistic
whereas Celente and Null are predicting the end of the cities and suburbs - thus smart people will get out and grow their own crops, use barter instead of money etc.
Adams adds that all should learn how to use guns to protect their families and goods and learn how to stitch up wounds when the battles begin.
It's survivalist propaganda with a product list ( see Natural News Store/ Gary Null.com )
Grow your own crops? Most farmers don't do that anymore either, and would probably find the idea just as strange as city people.
Farmers grow corn and soybeans, usually. Or whatever couple of crops grow well in the region. Not many farms have a couple of cows, a couple of pigs, turkeys and chickens anymore.
It's just more of that "return to the good old days" schtick we always see from these guys, except when you recognize that subsistence farming wasn't really that good. The "good old days" when people weren't educated past the eighth grade and farmers pulled their kids out of school every year at harvest time to help. "Good."
I sometimes wonder about the psychology of the post-apocalyptic survival fantasy. I loved it as a child, having read 'The Day of the Triffids' (killer plants) and 'The Chrysalids' (nuclear holocaust), and watched 'Survivors' (man-made plague) - I even had a little survival kit in a tobacco tin: home-made tinder, matches coated in wax to make them waterproof etc..
The same fantasy is clearly just as popular today, with a host of reality TV shows on the subject, from Bear Grylls' various TV shows (stranded in the wilderness) to 'Doomsday Castle'* (End of Days), as well as fictional offerings like 'The Walking Dead' (zombie apocalypse) and 'Revolution' (technology that stops electricity working).
It's as if we have a sort of love-hate co-dependent relationship with technology, loving what we can do with it, but hating our dependence on it and always wanting to prove we could do without it if we really wanted.
Adams et al. have clearly tapped into this fantasy, and injected a good dose of naturalism into it for good measure. Fear of deadly chemicals, disease and death combined with a hefty dose of nostalgia for a Golden Age that never existed and a generous pinch of Noble Savage is a powerful combination. It's almost a shame it has such unfortunate side effects, when the rubber hits the road and people discover first hand that vaccines and antibiotics really are some of the best things that humanity has ever developed, not the worst.
* I watched an episode of this recently, for a laugh, and wasn't disappointed. It documents the efforts of a survivalist nut to finish building a fortress he has been working on for decades. It is intended to defend him and his family from the hordes of hungry, angry, well-armed people he is expecting to attack it come the End of Days which is, as always, imminent. He is also training his somewhat intellectually challenged adult children in essential survivalist skills, such as shooting things and building drawbridges. Bonkers, but moderately entertaining too.
Peter Dickinson was scarily prophetic:
Herr Doktor: Not with that last name! Cohn is obviously part of the conspiracy.
Interesting question -- for JB does serving in the Army trump being Jewish, or does being Jewish trump everything?
This merit quoting:
It’s as if we have a sort of love-hate co-dependent relationship with technology, loving what we can do with it, but hating our dependence on it and always wanting to prove we could do without it if we really wanted.
Adams et al. have clearly tapped into this fantasy, and injected a good dose of naturalism into it for good measure. Fear of deadly chemicals, disease and death combined with a hefty dose of nostalgia for a Golden Age that never existed and a generous pinch of Noble Savage is a powerful combination. It’s almost a shame it has such unfortunate side effects, when the rubber hits the road and people discover first hand that vaccines and antibiotics really are some of the best things that humanity has ever developed, not the worst.
I don't work that way but I had 2 serious roadblocks growing up. The first being an inability to handwrite without pain in my upper body, especially shoulder pain; this is why I set out to investigate using a computer and then, when I learn about a technology (such as computer) I master it to the point that it's a complete slave to me. When I hit a roadblock to accomplish a particular task, I always end up overcoming it and now, my next target is to reprogram an android phone with my custom made operating system and environment. This will keep me busy for the next 2 years and will come in handy for my future jobs.
Neuroscience was that way too. Many years ago (nearly a decade), I was commenting under my own name (Alain) right here on scienceblogs but I made a very severe mistake (really a brown paper bag moment) in a comment and this was particularly during a period where I was harassed constantly so I ended up not visiting scienceblogs for a while and then, only a single blog (RI). It took me a while to comment again under the pseudonym autistic lurker. In any case, I ended up mastering neuroscience based only on 2 courses but the best description there is is that I can squeeze the citrus out of 2 courses with a 23 tons press and now, I have a much better handle on neuroscience.
It's probably my ego who's responsible for all this.
Oh, and after the custom cell phone. My next task will be to simulate a mouse brain in my garage with the biological databases found in NIH website using hardware such as a 4096 node cluster of parallella v20 board (they're now at v4) but I'll need to finish a pair of bachelors (CS and Bio) first. Probably as a retirement project.
I think that survivalists want to believe that THEY will be amongst the lucky few who manage to survive. The woo-meisters ( and their economic forecasting counterparts) are right there to sell them information and products to ensure that outcome.
A few years ago, I chanced upon McCarthy's book, "The Road", which is disturbing but probably has a few, good realistic details ( two survivors seek out canned goods): it left me with an uncomfortable feeling that he was feeding unrealistic hopes and dreams and inadvertently helping to line opportunists' pockets.
Perhaps religious accounts of the End Times might really be poetic expressions that provide a hopeful outlook in times of trouble of a lesser degree ( if we are to believe historians, the Christian version *really* is about the difficulties the early church faced- not a cosmological event). Many myths recount the End across cultures.
So maybe these survivalist fantasies are just metaphors for reality: bad things happen, people get sick, wars erupt, natural disasters occur and people die. At any rate, those I survey know how to hook up into ANY type of fantasy system and turn a profit on others' worries and fears- whether they be about cancer, aging, galloping inflation or societal collapse.- they got it covered.
'Lord of the Flies' had a huge impact on me as a pre-teen. I am not sure I want to 'survive' with these crazy people on earth. Funny isn't it, how the preppers are SO smart, they will survive, yet every single day they are wasting the lives they have now, worrying about the future.
And I just have to say, how amazing is it that a blog post about $40k to a congressman ends up dissecting the psychology of doomsday preppers. Love it.
Do try to stay on topic, guys !!!
The Dachelbot posted two snide off-topic comments at Emily Willingham on the Forbes blog.
And...the bot actually mentioned Sharyl Attkisson and the upcoming vaccines hearing, which gave me the opportunity to post back at her (Expand All Comments)
@ Scared Momma: Stick around. Sometimes when Old Blinky Box is in sleep mode, the foodies come out to play.
(Just mention Lutefisk and you're sure to get a response)
Do try to stay on topic, guys !!!
Better forget it for me:
happy birthday to me,
happy birthday to me,
happy birthday to me :)
back to coding...
Thanks you very much lilady :)
Lutefisk is for amateurs. Surstrømningsfilet is where it's at.
I watched a film adaptation of 'The Road' not long ago, and a more depressing post-apocalyptic vision is hard to imagine. Almost all living things were destroyed, so an Adams-style utopia wasn't possible, only desperate scrounging for leftover pre-apocalyptic foods, though there was a happy(ish) ending, as I recall.
I take your point, though I'm not sure dissecting the psychological drives of these people is ever truly off-topic. One way or another they all tap into this fear and distrust of technology and into a longing for a Golden Age when all our immune systems were rendered fighting fit by childhood rites of passage in the form of contagious diseases.
Perhaps if we truly understand the metaphors that underpin their beliefs, we can combat their propaganda and misinformation more effectively.
@Krebiozen, It is all related. I am here on this blog to learn how to combat fallacies and also to understand how they start. I was raised on nature and science, yet somehow my father has turned prepper and my mother holistic. What happens? As for those in 'power' what motivates them? Can't be all money. Has to be some sort of sadistic side to it as well. I have learned so much from you amazing people, I appreciate the 'off-topic' discussions.
@lilady, good for you for calling out Dachelbot
@Alain, Happy Birthday!
Krebiozen is correct ( as usual): Luria studied how the minds of mnemonists worked, we can do that with woo-meisters and anti-vaxxers. As a matter of fact, I think that we already ARE doing that.
( altho' I do make a distinction in that we are assuming that they actually believe this stuff and that it isn't all ad copy. My own bet would be on partial belief plus grandstanding for their audience/ customers. Commenters may be a more accurate gauge of beliefs- if they have nothing to sell)
Take MIke Adams :
today he and Alex Jones reiterate the challenge they made to Piers Morgan on internet radio to be injected with 1000 vaccines ( listed) for a million dollars.
This responds to Dr Offit's famous quote- which they get wrong.
Seriously. No sane medical professional would be a party to this farce. No television network would go along and Morgan is probably too savvy to agree to any of their scenarios understanding that it is only publicity for them. And who would want to enable loons?
@ TMR, another peek inside the mind of anti-vaxxers as presented by a TM's daughter ( Professor, who is a (( shudder)) psychologist, adopted a girl with ADHD and PANDAS) who writes about her condition in a manner that makes me surmise that she has been tutored in anti-vax/ biomed lore. I won't write specifically about her, because after all, she is a child but you can read about the interesting notions her TM has instilled in her.
Joyeux anniversaire, Alain.
Darwy, I'll see your Surstrømningsfilet and raise you a Balut.
DW: Oh, this ought to be good. How old is that poor girl? I hope she escapes soon.
I don't know... if you open a can of surstrømningsfilet inside a building, you can clear the building.
Since it's fermented (rotting) fish in a can, it's under pressure - if you don't open it properly, it will spray on you and your clothes.
If it does, burn them. The stench never comes out.
I think she's about 14 or so.
Isn't that the right age for rebelling against parents?... oh wait, Mom is already a revolutionary so she'd have to go SB
On a more serious note: what she writes illustrates what she's been told- it almost sounds as if she thinks of herself as being "taken over" by a bad personality or some other psycho-babblish nonsenical notion.
Children take in what parents say about them and the ingredients go into their eventual image of themselves. The mother is a freaking psychologist for g-d's sake..
Another TM reported a boy saying he was "broken" IIRC.
if you open a can of surstrømningsfilet inside a building, you can clear the building.
I'm sure it would go well in a salad with durian.
Happy Birthday, Alain.
@herr doktor bimler - durian is a fine fruit if you need a tactical weapon.
DW: I started at twelve. Frankly, I get some of what she was saying; I was prone to rages as a kid, and even broke a clock one time. Being that out of control is scary. Managing ADD/ADHD is hard too, but thankfully, I had parents and teachers on my side.
This girl has no one and that's sad. It also makes managing ADD/ADHD so much harder, since my worst episodes were always caused by stress.
On that note is PANDAs real? It sounds like RAD, which was made up solely so some people could profit from dangerous and abusive therapies and so adoptive parents could have an easy out.
@Scared Momma, Denice Walter, and MI Dawn,
Thanks you very much for the birthday wishes.
AFAIK, both PANDAS and PANS are only hypotheses at this point in time. Perhaps Dr Chris ( or another doctor) could enlighten us.
HOWEVER due to how the girl's mother's (Professor) remarks in the comments, I might suspect that this may have been diagnosed w/o benefit of a physician : she didn't want to go to a doctor because she KNEW how bad the treatment was AND the girl was already over-treated w/ antibiotics at birth etc. So I would take it all with a grain of salt ( actually, more like a teaspoon).
I was upset by how the girl described her feelings as being another person "PANDAS Trinity" vs herself,"Trinity" ( -btw- her name is Jasmine I think)- she communicates about herself as a character in a story in the post. Why? Isn't a simple 'I" more economical? I hope it's just being creative and teenage.
At any rate, the TMs like to involve their children as mini-proselytisers it seems.
I suspect Rep. Issa cannot be bought, at least so cheaply. He can, though, be rented at reasonable rates...
DW: Yeah, I imagine 'Prof' diagnosed it herself, which is worrying. I wouldn't trust Prof with a goldfish, let alone diagnostic powers.
As for the narration, I imagine that Trinity, like myself was thoroughly briefed on internet protocol, including going to any length to keep one's real name off the 'net. As for the PANDAs Trinity device, I imagine it's partly her mother's way of parenting and a way of trying to keep her parent's love at any cost.
I'm sure Prof mentioned net caaaution in a cursory fashion HOWEVER she ( and other TMs) plaster their kids' photos, videos, names, loci- all over the net. In fact, I am familiar with the girl by name because Prof has written about her so often and has had her on woo tv when she and another TM were interviewed. ( it's posted @ TMR)
I suppose maternal celebrity trumps children's anonymity any time, n'est-ce pas?
-btw- most TMs also use their real names as well as 'nyms.
Lilady: The second one. I know the first one is real; heck one of those was on the lam for a week in Washington. He was restored to the zoo with a minimum of pandamonium.
DW: Ugh. Is there no bottom for these people? Why do they exploit their children like that?
A friend of mine has a nephew who was diagnosed with PANDAS. The young man (mid teens) has been ASD all his life. However, after an apparent mild illness, he developed severe OCD symptoms, and other problems. The family did a lot of testing before he was diagnosed with PANDAS, and the teen has greatly improved - back to his "normal" ASD self, without all the other problems he was exhibiting.
His family accepts his ASD and he has worked very hard all his life to function in society. The PANDAS was a setback, but with treatment he is better. He still has ASD but the severe symptoms that came on so suddenly have gone. I believe (though I'd need to verify this) that he is also now off the antibiotics, although he was on them for several months. If he's not off them, he will be soon, as the family was given a specific length of time he'd be treated, not an indefinite amount of time.
So...PANDAS may be real...in a very small population.