On our way to Gilead

Because every sperm is sacred.

That's really uptight. Geez, most of the (married) fundamentalists I knew used condoms (ie. the ones we knew well enough to be privy to such info). IIRC, even Tim LaHaye approved of them.

thats stupid.

I lived in Starkville Mississippi a few years ago.

when I was first married to my wife, we were having some medical difficulites that required us to use condoms for a short time.

I went to the grocery store pharmacy and asked the pharmacist about where they were. They were behind the service counter in the front of the store: next to the tobacco and lottery tickets.

I went up and asked the two high school students working the counter if they could describe the different styles and sizes for me because I couldn't read the packages from in front of the counter. it was awkward. I shouted out all their answers back to them because I couldn't believe the ridiculous situation they were putting me in.

this is so stupid, condoms should be present out on the shelves, and the pharmcist should answer questions. since when is good sexual health an immoral act?

we don't hide the toothpaste to keep people from eating too much candy!!!!

To be fair, Joe, they may have had the condoms behind the counter because they're one of the most shoplifted items. Some places keep candy, Sudafed, and tampons back there for the same reasons.

Joe,

I'm not surprised considering that Starkville will give you one night in jail for picking flowers.

I can certainly understand them not wanting items to be shoplifted, but given where I was, and the social climate there, I would be inclined to say they were there for the same reasons as the article posted.

There were many social attitudes in that town that were subtle but apparent, which is one of the many reasons I don't live there anymore. I don't know, perhaps I'm just hypersensitive.

and indeed...though I'm a Johnny Cash fan, the jail he was in isn't there anymore, but they have a new jail in its place.

Having condoms readily available might minimize the risks of some forms of human misery, and there's no form of human misery that Christianity does not want maximized. All helps make Heaven look the nicer, since your average Christian is a giant neon sign telling all who look how undesireable such a place really would be.

It wasn't until I joined the Air Force that I saw condoms on display in a store (the base exchange). Of course, that was in the 70s. In those days such things were kept out of sight ... but I don't suppose they were out of mind.

Is she talking about filling them with water and dropping them on people from the balcony? IANAL but I think that's just a misdemeanor.

"Gilead" as in the terrifying Attwood novel?
And play and very scary Opera?

Gilead is coming.

Oddly enough the "Wedge" loonies aer right in one thing - tey're aiming for 2018 aren't they?

Well ...
H. Clinton wins in 2008 and serves 2 terms.
The chritain right regroup and just win the disputed 2016 election by dubious means (sound familiar?)
Then there are a (very convenient set of internal "emergencies" (think Reichstag fire here ... ) followed by a temproary suspension of the US constitutin and martial law and BINGO!
After 2018 a nazi-soviet pact between Gilead and the islamic fundie states, until one side or the other starts "Barbarossa II" so to speak.

Europe will be paralyzed, because of christian and muslim groups demanding "respect" and - I don't even want to think about it after that ....

Well, poor America may be increasingly benighted but elsewhere in the world liberalization progresses apace. In the papers today where I am (Czech Republic) is the news that the Senate has just passed a gay civil union bill by an overwhelming majority, making it the first post-communist country (and 13th European country) to do so.

Well, poor America may be increasingly benighted but elsewhere in the world liberalization progresses apace. In the papers today where I am (Czech Republic) is the news that the Senate has just passed a gay civil union bill by an overwhelming majority, making it the first post-communist country (and 13th European country) to do so.

I disagree. Europe is slowly undergoing a wave of cultural conservatism, created mostly by ethnic tension resulting from its inability to integrate Muslim immigrants. For now it manifests itself only in xenophobia and anti-immigration agitation, but lately there's also been a resurgence of an American-style law-and-order approach to ethnic crime in France, and if there's a real riot in the future, all bets are off on Europe's political future.

"Having condoms readily available might minimize the risks of some forms of human misery, and there's no form of human misery that Christianity does not want maximized. All helps make Heaven look the nicer, since your average Christian is a giant neon sign telling all who look how undesireable such a place really would be."

Wow. I have never seen it put so perfectly.

Target pharmacist fired for refusing 'morning-after' prescription

This could be the legal test case we've all been waiting for. Does a pharmacist have a right to inflict his/her own morality on customers? What about the rights of the customer? What about the rights of the employer? Do you have any smidgen of a doubt which side the Bush/Gonzales Justice Dept. will take?

I think the most troubling thing is how did that pharmacist know he wasn't married? Or are they against married people getting it on too? ;)

Married people have no excuse: sex is for procreation. If they aren't planning to spawn a baby, they shouldn't monkey around.

There is a war on in this nation against all non-generative sex, including homosexuality, childless by choice couples, birth control, abortion, man-on-dog sex (thank you, Santorum, for burning that vision into my brain), and masturbation (Little Ricky, again, thinks that the state should control this.)

These adjuncts of lust are responsible for 9-11 and every other bad thing that is happening. It's funny that the great sky pixie isn't pissed off at the other 6 deadly sins (greed, anger, envy, and pride are all mainstays of the religious right) not to mention sloth and gluttony which are just about enshrined in the American way of life (Supersize my drive up food order, thankyewveddymulch.)

"Married people have no excuse: sex is for procreation. If they aren't planning to spawn a baby, they shouldn't monkey around."

Ah, I see. Sex is for procreation, not recreation. Why did gawd make it feel so good then? He must have known we'd want to do it all the time.
hmmmmmmm.....

;)

Alon - perhaps some of the anti-immigrant Muslim sentiment is a reaction to the conservative values of said Muslim immigrants.

Look, say you've got a nice small, secular, socially liberal country, like the Netherlands. And then you've got lots and lots of Muslim immigrants who go around assuming that all of your women are whores, want to kill all homosexuals, burn down synagogues, and outlaw alcohol and other fun stuff.

Who's the cultural conservative in that instance?

I'm not saying that racism isn't a big factor here, but one can see how a reasonable liberal person might be a bit concerned.

I'm not saying that racism isn't a big factor here, but one can see how a reasonable liberal person might be a bit concerned.

I understand why liberals are concerned; the problem is that the solutions they use by default - shouting at Muslims that they're wrong, teaching everyone the importance of European values, and restricting immigration - never work. Liberals are supposed to be pragmatic enough and with enough knowledge of history to realize that when you have an incendiary ethnic relationship, what you want to do is address the social causes of exclusion and alienation, crack down on discrimination, and encourage the formation of or integration into civil society institutions.

For example, suppose hypothetically that there's an incident in which ethnically-Arab youths get electrocuted while running from the French police, and that many young, male Arabs in France get angry and violent as a result. Suppose further that in our hypothetical case, there are large-scale riots that dwarf anything Europe has known in recent times. In such a case, some introspective people might notice the fact that the Arab-French have an unemployment rate approaching the one Germany had in the early 1930s, driving people to vote Nazi. The same introspective people might also realize that the reason Arabs riot over things like this is that the police has harassed them and discriminated against them so much that they perceive any incident involving the police to be yet another example of racism.

However, Europe being Europe, the bulk of the population would not be so introspective. Nobody would yell at the government that an unemployment rate of 30% in an ethnic minority group is a black mark on the French socio-economic system. Nobody important would demand inquiries into police racism, discrimination in employment, and discrimination in housing. Nobody in government would ask how come the ratio of Arab-to-white unemployment in the three largest Western European countries is higher than the black-to-white unemployment ratio in the USA, where blacks have been trodden on for 300 years. No; in our hypothetical situation, France would opt for the photogenic solution of deporting anyone who can be deported under French law, promising to get tough on crime, and hating les Arabes even more.

when my first wife and i were on our honeymoon, a tour through four national parks out West, we shopped in a grocery store in Utah. failing to find condoms, we asked for 'em. nope. sorry. Latter Day Saints don't use 'em.
charming.
this was the same store which later in the week featured a checkout clerk who, after cashing out some native Americans, commented "I wish those kind of folks wouldn't come in here" to my great anger. i forget what i said in reply but in retrospect, i don't think it was fierce enough.

We lived in Utah for several years. One trivial event that occurred was a visit to the grocery store, and when I paid up and got my change, I gave my son (who was about 5) a nickel to put in the gumball machine. He was thrilled. The clerk looked over and smiled avuncularly and said, "He's just as happy as a Jew, ain't he?"

What do you say to that kind of casual racism? I was speechless.

We encountered a fair amount of that attitude in Utah--not as victims of it, since we were white and had 3 kids and passed for Mormon--and it bothered me. They weren't vindictive or overtly evil about it, and often passed these stereotypes around semi-affectionately, but that Mormon monoculture fosters some amazing ignorance.

PZ, I think that in that situation, I might have said "You're just about as stupid as a Mormon, ain't you?"

-jcr

Women Sue Wal-Mart Over Morning-After Pill

Thu Feb 2, 7:15 AM ET
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BOSTON - Backed by abortion rights groups, three Massachusetts women sued Wal-Mart on Wednesday, accusing the retail giant of violating a state regulation by failing to stock emergency contraception pills in its pharmacies.
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The plaintiffs argued that state policy requires pharmacies to provide all "commonly prescribed medicines."...

Anton wrote:

I disagree. Europe is slowly undergoing a wave of cultural conservatism, created mostly by ethnic tension resulting from its inability to integrate Muslim immigrants. For now it manifests itself only in xenophobia and anti-immigration agitation, but lately there's also been a resurgence of an American-style law-and-order approach to ethnic crime in France, and if there's a real riot in the future, all bets are off on Europe's political future.

Indeed. And we have now seen the riots.

However, even as a bleeding heart liberal, I have some sympathy for Europe's supposed "inability" to integrate Muslims. I am an atheist. How dare they tell me that I have to "integrate" their hateful religious ideas, their vicious intolerance? I don't care if they are Jewish, Christian or Muslim... Their absolutism, their religious law, has no place in a real democracy. See "God is for Suckers!" blog for lots of discussion on this crucial battle between free speech and hateful oppression.