Scott has discovered an odd little book: The Faith Equation: One Mathematician's Journey in Christianity. Yeah, another guy finds Jesus and uses math and science after the fact to claim Christianity is the one true answer. What, you may ask, is this wonderful faith equation that leads directly to one of the Abrahamic religions?
Faith = (Mind) + (Heart)+ (Will)
Hey, who knew you could make pablum out of crap? At least now nobody needs to buy the damn book.
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To paraphrase the Snopes article on the Alabama Legislature defining pi as 3
"The Bible very clearly says in I Kings 7:23 that the alter font of Solomon's Temple was ten cubits across and thirty cubits in diameter, and that it was round in compass.
"We need to return to some absolutes in our society," he said, "the Bible does not say that the font was thirty-something cubits. Plain reading says thirty cubits. Period."
Faith = Wishful Thinking + Ignorance + Religious Indoctrination
Mind + Heart + Will?
How exactly is will separate from mind?
Anyway - according to this equation, faith is the mind being led by the emotions and wilfully believing (ie ignoring anything that says otherwise)? Sounds right to me...
Mind + Heart + Will = Will Drain Them
Faith = (Mind) + (Heart) + (Will)
= (0.01) + (0.9) + (0.09) = 1 for true believers.
wildcardjack: It might be worth noting that the snopes article is about a prank and there's no need for mathematicians to get up in arms just yet.
Though it is not completely unfounded as (according to the same snopes article) the Indiana House of Representatives tried in 1897 to redefine, through law, the value of pi.
Heh. Well, faith (among humans, anyway) does require a functioning heart, it affects the mind, and requires willpower (to rationalize away contradictory evidence, etc.). I guess it fits.
Wait, wait, I think I've gotten the true values of this equation pinned down:
[The original but inexact equation]
Faith = (Mind) + (Heart)+ (Will)
[The equation with all values properly designated]
Faith = (Ignorance) + (Emotionalism) + (Willful suspension of disbelief)
Faith = Will (to disbelieve in all rational evidence)
On Scott's site he comments about a review: "from pop psychology guru M. Scott Peck, who writes (amusingly) that Bittinger's book is "the kind of wacky genius one is lucky enough to encounter but a few occasions during his or her lifetime.""
Brilliantly ambigous comment, and not only that, it turns out Peck had been dead for a long time before the book came out!
Ignoring the entire question of units--what is, for instance, a mind measured in?--are negative values possible?
For instance, I'm cold and snarky when it comes to people not standing their rounds. When that happens, the mind's willing (both(?) positive(?): I'm thirsty!) but the heart is not kind (very negative: bloody freeloading git!). But I have faith anyways I'll get another drink, even if I have to pay for myself (in the currency of grumbles, albeit the pubs around here all seem to want hard shiny currency instead...grrr!).
Faith = hope - evidence
Must be terrible though, to make up silly calculations about faith just to prove to yourself that you're in the right.
I saw a sign outside a Methodist church the other day:
3 nails + 1 cross = 4given.
Hilariously stupid and disturbing at the same time.
Marv = (Stupid) + (Clueless) + (Dumbshit)
But that's okay! Because God just happens to be attracted to the stupid and the clueless.
(Scribbles on chalkboard)
Faith = (Mind) + (Heart) + (Will)
(Stares at it a moment...)
Umm... no... wait... looks like he forgot to carry the two right here...
(Scribbles on chalkboard again...)
... Hmm. And he must have lost this exponent somehow two systems back, too... This was raised to the jack of clubs and divided by bauxite in the line before... Let's see...
(More scribbles...)
... aaand cancel, and we have...
(Turns around chalkboard. It reads...)
Heaven = (Hot tub) + (Filled with warm jello) + (Kate Winslet)
Huh.
Hey, don't look at me like that. I'm as surprised it came to that as the rest of you.
This equation forgets the pygmies and dwarves.
Intelligence=exp(-AnneCoulter)*[Books read]^[Critical thinking]/(Shepherd!*log(beer))
What kind of math do we need to make it Kate Beckinsale?
I'm pretty sure the correct equation has to have a Σ in it with a range of Kates.
Hmmphh! Judging from my experience of being taught it at school, maths is the work of the devil!
On the other hand:
I + 7/9 + tube of decontamination gel = assimilation heaven
I hope everybody caught the typo. The equation should be:
Faith = (Heart)+ (Will) - (Mind)
I thought it was going to be 42.
What I never get is how they jump from "someone who is omnipotent must have created the universe" to "that someone is the christian omnipotent god". How do they eliminate all other religions from the logic? They never prove god is omnipotent or why there can't be two omnipotent gods. It's very poor reasoning. They want the result to be X therefore they ignore anything that means the result could be Y.
Personally I think christianity is one of the least likely religions to be true. If any of them are true, I have more stock in Wicca or Buddism. They're less judgmental and arrogant. They're also more likely to get along with other faiths and start holy wars.
I haven't seen the book yet, but I went over to its website when Scott told me about it. There's some sample material that I perused. While my expectations weren't high, it was a bit anticlimactic just the same. This is from what I posted on Scott's site when I reported back:
To say nothing of the fact that it was his partisans who wrote the documentation "proving" that they had finished the to-do list.
OK, the ONEitude of the ONE is directly proportional to the COLDitude of the ONE....
Wait, this isn't one of Strong Bad's bogus mathematical formulae?
The formula for faith is simple: Faith = Belief - Evidence
I was told that I won the Internet, but it looks like AJ Milne and I will have to fight for it.
When the sample excerpt starts talking about the amazing number of times "seven" pops up in the Bible.... we've already crossed the line from numeracy to numerology. "Wacky genius" indeed.
I'm really curious about what units we're using here. I mean, I can assume that (mind) would be I.Q., as grainy a rating as it is, but what about (heart) and (will)?
Maybe (heart) is Beats Per Minute...? B/M? And (will), jeesh, I don't know. I suggest a new quantification unit for willpower: Balls, we can call them b for short.
Well, actually, since there would be such a spread of bravery or willpower, starting at the low end of the scale with something like "mouse" and going all the way up to "The audacity!" we'll probably need to lay out bs into deciballs (dbs), which one could say is a direct reflection of how much adrenaline is in your bloodstream, and that comes back to B/M of your heart... I think I'm on to something here.
And clearly these quantities can't be added together, because they're different units of measurement. I like Ex-drone's idea of using (mind) to apply difference to the front end of the equation, but I think it should be derisory instead, and that the dbs and B/M should be multiplied by each other.
So what we end up with is (B/M*db/M)/IQ = f, and using that, we can come up with the quantification unit for Faith itself, which would be, uh...
Balls over brains.
Hmm.
And look, it works, because if you're dead, your (heart) would be 0 B/M, and you can't divide by zero, so THERE'S PROOF THAT IT WORKS.
The Triumph of the Will
Alert Darkseid! The Anti-Life Equation has been found!
He'd have to be - as an Authoritarian of the Social Dominator kind in need of henchmen/sheep. Meanwhile, the (Right Wing) Authoritarians of the mindless sheep kind would be attracted to him in return. The interesting thing is that the top-level social dominator doesn't actually have to exist in order for the rest of the authoritarians (to pretend) to follow.
Faith = (Delusion) + (Ignorance) - (Rationality)
How does this equation take Faith + 1 into account?
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e228/ladydi1975/FaithPlusOne_tn.jpg
"How exactly is will separate from mind?"
It just IS, Lee! Okay?!
"If any of them are true, I have more stock in Wicca or Buddism. They're less judgmental and arrogant. They're also more likely to get along with other faiths and start holy wars."
Neither of those qualities really say anything about the truth value of a religion. In fact, I don't see why whether religious ideas are true should have any kind of correlation with how nice or agreeable any observer happens to find them. I think it should be the opposite. The more cruel or indifferent one proposes one's god, the more likely he is to exist. We created beer, he created the candiru.
He got the equation wrong. It's actually:
Faith = Belief - Evidence
-jcr
"Will" as in Dembski?
Any religion that gets me Kate Winslet or Kate Beckinsale will receive my entire estate when I die. Let's be clear on the terms, though: They give me the hot babe NOW, and they get my money when I'm dead. None of this "rewards after I die" bullshit.
-jcr
The old rap on tent preachers and their revival ministries was that they promised "Pie in the sky by and by when you die." Marvin Bittinger has decided to go for "pi in the sky" instead.
I'm enough of a skeptic to wager that didn't happen. Any really good citations anywhere?
The main argument is simple: The Bible is full of prophecies about a messiah. Jesus fulfills those prophecies.
Except, of course, he doesn't.
The messiah was to have come from Bethlehem. Jesus was from Nazareth. The messiah was to have been rejected and killed by Jews. Jesus was rejected and killed by Romans. etc. etc.
Faith = (Mind) + (Heart)+ (Will)
Alert Darkseid! The Anti-Life Equation has been found!
Posted by: Anton Mates
yes!
my "guess" to the meaning of the terms would be
mind = thinking ability not limited to reason alone
heart = all emotions as has been said by others
will = ego, the importance of the self as a separate entity
all of the terms are subjective which is how I would characterize faith, completely subjective.
I would state the equation as
faith = [reality - (desire * delusion / ignorance)] / fear
all joking aside have there not been any real scientific studies into the nature of "faith and religion"
it does seem to exist and has done so for along time but it has changed often over time and varied to place to place.
it seems that before we can attempt to "form a rational faith" if that is not a contradiction in terms or at least counter the obvious negative effects that faith seems to be prone to it would be wise to try to find out what it is we are actually dealing with.
It happened, Ed. The measure was Indiana House Bill No. 246 in 1847. A university professor happened on the debate over 246 during a visit to the state capital and was able to warn the members they were about to make fools of themselves. (The bill would have allowed Indiana public schools to use the new and improved value of pi for free, but other states would have to pay a licensing fee!) I wrote about it in Reality is liberal (where you need to scroll down to the second part). Good references are Petr Beckmann's A History of Pi and Underwood Dudley's Mathematical Cranks.
Ed Darrell: Good call! There's more of it here, from Purdue: http://www.agecon.purdue.edu/crd/Localgov/Second%20Level%20pages/indian…
When I was a math grad student at MIT, some bible-bleater once stuck a flyer on our office door. It had a bunch of pseudo-equations accompanied by biblical quotes. One of them was "d Foreskin/d Jesus = 0" with a quote about there being no difference with respect to Jesus between circumcised and uncircumcised. I wish I remembered more of it, the whole thing was screamingly funny - unintentionally, of course.
I think we have a new book title: "The Foreskin Equation"
Faith = gullibility + indoctrination + fear
If you want flocks of faithful sheeple, keep them uneducated and scared, and preach, preach preach!
I must admit, I'm having a hard time believing that the mathematician in question is serious (or sane). It reads like something from The Onion.
"Faith = (Mind) + (Heart)+ (Will)"
SOUNDS MORE LIKE SPIRAL POWER TO ME
KICK REASON TO THE CURB AND GO BEYOND THE IMPOSSIBLE
Peace On Earth
Purity Of Essence
Oh, come on. It's just too many variables there. And look at that imaginary component (Mnd + Wl²).
I've seen this kind of math before.
Within the last 25 days I have seen a living T-Rex.
In any day you either see a T-Rex or you don't see a T-Rex, so your odds are 50-50. Now, those are your odds each day. So the chance that I haven't seen a T-Rex within the last 25 days is 33,554,431/33,554,432... that's really unlikely. Thus, I have seen a T-Rex within the last 25 days, probably several in fact.
Word = (God)^2
So, Word = -1.
The early French surrealist, Alfred Jarry, wrote an article in which he proved the God was the tangent between zero and infinity. Jarry was a founder of what we now call Theatre of the Absurd.
Jarry was tongue in cheek (he had another interesting piece: "Jesus' Crucifixion considered as an Uphill Bicycle Race") but he was a whole lot more interesting than our faithful mathematician who is absurd even without a theatre around him.
Isn't he a bit like the postmodern philosopher (was it Baudrillard?) who decided that the square root of minus one was a representation of the male penis?
That equation is trivially wrong, since faith f is a free variable. With a little bit of effort we can establish the correct model for faith.
Obviously dogmatic, rigid fundamentalism means
df/dt = 0. (1)
We also observe that fundamentalisms aggregate, and are dense (obviously). Assuming that fundamentalism attains a maximum in such clusters we have
df/dx = 0. (2)
So by (1) and (2), in these clusters we have
f(t,x) = Cmax. (3)
Naturally we expect faith to vanish outside the clusters, with little or no interaction with the real world.
Using tempered distributions as test functions is out, since fundamentalism can in no way be described as tempered. Instead we can look at the fundamental kernel of the map E of the above differential operator (P = (d/dt, d/dx) ). Left and right fundamentalism are locally much the the same, so we have existence of the fundamental solution
P(x, ∂xi)E = ∂yi , xi, yi ∈ (t,x). (4)
Since we have established denseness we have continuity, which establish the right fundamental kernel and its existence. (Obviously we have different domains for the associated maps, so xian and islamic fundamentalism are only similar in similar situations.) As P has constant coefficients we can define the kernel exactly and in a convolution scheme we finally get from (4) a solution for a distribution determined by the map
<E, P(-∂)Φ> = Φ(0), Φ ∈ Cc∞(Rn). (5)
Inserting (3) in (5) we should get dirac delta descriptions of pointlike clusters of non-interacting fundamentalism having different mass.
And that is what faith gives you.
Never underestimate the stupidity of politicians or fundamentalism, especially in combination.
AFAIU they didn't propose to change π directly, but to introduce a separate length measure where it was folded into the measure.
One would have thought that "the fact of his solutions of the trisection of the angle, duplication of the cube and quadrature of the circle having been already accepted as contributions to science" would be a clue in. But nooo ...
Maybe I have made a mistake in my choice of domain. Tatarize gives a good argument why faith is complex and when based on texts with schizophrenic deities imaginary:
(Yahve)*(El) = word = negative; Yahve = El;
⇒ gods ∈ C.
But IIRC it is easy to extend my above faith model to complex valued maps and test functions.
...the male penis?
heh.
(Squid)+(pony)*(Tomahawk missle)=????
It's funny when people who claim to have the one true answer lambast others for making the same claim...
I'm not a mathematician (and, apparently, neither is the other guy) but I wonder if there'd be some cool 3D surface plot you could make with that formula. You know, cool 3D helps your "framing"
TL:
Left and right fundamentalism are locally much the the same, so we have existence of the fundamental solution
Perhaps what is needed is the final fundamentalist solution---some sort of mandatory extended science camp whose end is genomics, rather than genocide. Ah, well I can dream, can't I?
That equation is trivially wrong, since faith f is a free variable. With a little bit of effort we can establish the correct model for faith.
Obviously dogmatic, rigid fundamentalism means
df/dt = 0. (1)
We also observe that fundamentalisms aggregate, and are dense (obviously). Assuming that fundamentalism attains a maximum in such clusters we have
df/dx = 0. (2)
So by (1) and (2), in these clusters we have
f(t,x) = Cmax. (3)
Naturally we expect faith to vanish outside the clusters, with little or no interaction with the real world.
Using tempered distributions as test functions is out, since fundamentalism can in no way be described as tempered. Instead we can look at the fundamental kernel of the map E of the above differential operator (P = (d/dt, d/dx) ). Left and right fundamentalism are locally much the the same, so we have existence of the fundamental solution
P(x, ∂xi)E = ∂yi , xi, yi ∈ (t,x). (4)
Since we have established denseness we have continuity, which establish the right fundamental kernel and its existence. (Obviously we have different domains for the associated maps, so xian and islamic fundamentalism are only similar in similar situations.) As P has constant coefficients we can define the kernel exactly and in a convolution scheme we finally get from (4) a solution for a distribution determined by the map
<E, P(-∂)Φ> = Φ(0), Φ ∈ Cc∞(Rn). (5)
Inserting (3) in (5) we should get dirac delta descriptions of pointlike clusters of non-interacting fundamentalism having different mass.
And that is what faith gives you.
Never underestimate the stupidity of politicians or fundamentalism, especially in combination.
AFAIU they didn't propose to change π directly, but to introduce a separate length measure where it was folded into the measure.
One would have thought that "the fact of his solutions of the trisection of the angle, duplication of the cube and quadrature of the circle having been already accepted as contributions to science" would be a clue in. But nooo ...
Maybe I have made a mistake in my choice of domain. Tatarize gives a good argument why faith is complex and when based on texts with schizophrenic deities imaginary:
(Yahve)*(El) = word = negative; Yahve = El;
⇒ gods ∈ C.
But IIRC it is easy to extend my above faith model to complex valued maps and test functions.