no idea what the procedure would be, but could we assume then that gay couples married outside israel, can now, upon return , be registered as married within israeli vital statistics and ohter registries? while this recognition seems at odds with israel's own gay marriage laws, perhaps it is a step closer to having ssm legistlated.
This seems to be in line with other Israeli legal precedents on recognizing marriages from other countries. I was told by an Israeli couple who came to the US to get married that they did so because they wanted a secular, civil marriage. They said that Israel does not have civil marriage, the only ones performed their are traditional religious ones. Furthermore, if two people of different faiths want to marry, they have to get permission from the governing bodies of both faiths (I think that would be Israel's two chief rabbis, both conservative types, in the case of Judaism). However: Israel does recognize civil marriages made in other countries, even if they don't conform to religious rules. The couple I spoke to said it is pretty common for liberal Israelis to get married elsewhere.
This latest ruling by the courts is in much the same vein. The continuing double standard on religious marriages suggests that it will be a long time before same-sex marriages can be performed in Israel. Changing the country's laws would be up to government, where religious conservatives have large influence. However, the conservatives don't have the same control over the courts -- hence these decisions on international recognition of marriage.
I don't know what would happen if the courts ordered government to change Israel's laws. Obviously, it would take someone who knows about the Israeli legal system (not me) to tell you if the courts would or could do such a thing. One thing I know is that Israel doesn't have a constitution (this lack is due in significant part to conflict between religious interests and the standards of the "western" world that Israel aspires to be seen as part of). So this makes it unclear what the basis for decisions on same-sex marriage would be.
Considering the original kibbutzniks were avowedly secular, the current state of affairs regarding church and state in Israel must have a great many of them spinning in their graves. It's part of Israel's problem -- they seek to emulate the southern kingdom of Judah in its piety, but the cosmopolitan northern kingdom seems to be a better model in terms of freedom and prosperity.
Omri and Ahab really weren't that bad, they just weren't committed to the cause...
As Vasha said, this only applies to civil marriage performed in other countries. Rabbinical law forbids not only gay marriage, but also some straight marriages - for example, between a man whose family name is Cohen and a divorced woman. These other straight marriages have to my knowledge always been recognized by the state.
A more sweeping ruling, which invalidates the law saying only religious marriages may be performed in Israel, is impossible under the current framework. Israeli law explicitly gives religious authorities widespread powers, especially in the domain of marriage and divorce; and there is no constitution for the courts to use as basis to invalidate codified basic laws.
no idea what the procedure would be, but could we assume then that gay couples married outside israel, can now, upon return , be registered as married within israeli vital statistics and ohter registries? while this recognition seems at odds with israel's own gay marriage laws, perhaps it is a step closer to having ssm legistlated.
This seems to be in line with other Israeli legal precedents on recognizing marriages from other countries. I was told by an Israeli couple who came to the US to get married that they did so because they wanted a secular, civil marriage. They said that Israel does not have civil marriage, the only ones performed their are traditional religious ones. Furthermore, if two people of different faiths want to marry, they have to get permission from the governing bodies of both faiths (I think that would be Israel's two chief rabbis, both conservative types, in the case of Judaism). However: Israel does recognize civil marriages made in other countries, even if they don't conform to religious rules. The couple I spoke to said it is pretty common for liberal Israelis to get married elsewhere.
This latest ruling by the courts is in much the same vein. The continuing double standard on religious marriages suggests that it will be a long time before same-sex marriages can be performed in Israel. Changing the country's laws would be up to government, where religious conservatives have large influence. However, the conservatives don't have the same control over the courts -- hence these decisions on international recognition of marriage.
I don't know what would happen if the courts ordered government to change Israel's laws. Obviously, it would take someone who knows about the Israeli legal system (not me) to tell you if the courts would or could do such a thing. One thing I know is that Israel doesn't have a constitution (this lack is due in significant part to conflict between religious interests and the standards of the "western" world that Israel aspires to be seen as part of). So this makes it unclear what the basis for decisions on same-sex marriage would be.
Vasha, thank you for this clarification.
GrrlScientist needs help. Rally the troops. Are there any Sciencebloggers who are either A) in the mental health field or B) in New York City?
Considering the original kibbutzniks were avowedly secular, the current state of affairs regarding church and state in Israel must have a great many of them spinning in their graves. It's part of Israel's problem -- they seek to emulate the southern kingdom of Judah in its piety, but the cosmopolitan northern kingdom seems to be a better model in terms of freedom and prosperity.
Omri and Ahab really weren't that bad, they just weren't committed to the cause...
As Vasha said, this only applies to civil marriage performed in other countries. Rabbinical law forbids not only gay marriage, but also some straight marriages - for example, between a man whose family name is Cohen and a divorced woman. These other straight marriages have to my knowledge always been recognized by the state.
A more sweeping ruling, which invalidates the law saying only religious marriages may be performed in Israel, is impossible under the current framework. Israeli law explicitly gives religious authorities widespread powers, especially in the domain of marriage and divorce; and there is no constitution for the courts to use as basis to invalidate codified basic laws.